#Bruce is not trusted by his son and this causes issues | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

keenzinemugstudent · 6 months

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Superman x Witch black reader ft Superboy! Our Future part 2!

The league finds out about what's going on and you get to know Conner a bit

//In the batcave//

"What the hell do you mean Superman and Y/H/N had a kid?!"

Aquaman yelled starring at at Bruce, Diana looks shocked and Victor just looked confused not that we could blame them Connor just stands there awkwardly.

"It's just as I said Arthur... Superman and Y/H/n have a son."

"From the future?!"

"Yes." Bruce says his tone annoyed Arthur let's out a laugh still not believing it.

"I mean I can see the resemblance but it's still hard too believe." Victor say in disbelief looking between Clark and Connor.

"It is quite shocking. Barry do you have something to do with this?" Diana turned to look at Barry who just shook his head.

"Nope! nope don't look at me I am just as surprised as everyone else in this room right now!" Barry says hands in the air. Superman just let out a tired sigh looking over at Conner who was trying not to look his way, this was obviously too much for the poor boy.

"How did Y/n took it?" Diana asks worried about her friends health.

"She's in the guest room she kind of fainted."

"She fainted?! Haha wish I could have been there to see that." Arthur kept making fun of the situation making Clark glare at him which got him to stop but still had a smirk on his face, Diana spoke again.

"Well what do you suggest Batman?"

"Until we find out what was the cause of Superboy being brought here until that he needs lay low out of sight."

"Which I'm guessing Superman and and Y/h/n will have something to do with that?"

"Of course."

"I think I better go check on her."

Conner speeds out the room going to check on you.

"Soooo does that mean Y/n is no longer up for grabs?"

Victor gives Arthur a irritated look.

"We just met the future child of two the strongest beings on earth and THAT'S what you're worried about right now?" Arthur just shrugged his shoulders.

"Hey! I was just asking my brothers been asking about her for months! Man this is going break his heart and I can't wait to see it!" Victor just shooks his head.

"You got issues man."

When you woke up you saw that you were in the guest room the door opens and walks in Alfred holding a cup of tea.

"I thought it would be best to bring you some tea miss Y/n to help calm your nerves."

You gave him a grateful smile taking the tea you loved Alfred he always knew that tea calmed your nerves which tasted great by the way.

"Thank you Alfred I definitely needed it."

"Of course ma'am, and if it is alright with you there is a great waiting outside the door."

You looked at him confused than you saw Conner peaking around the corner giving you a small wave.

"Hi..."

"Hey."

"I'll leave you too alone call me if you need anything miss Y/n." Alfred gives you a bow before walking out the door leaving you and Superboy alone together. And man was it awkward! Neither of you spoke he just stood there looking anywhere but your face and you just stared at him still trying to understand what to say to him? I mean what the hell am I supposed to say?! Thankfully he spoke with a nervous chuckle.

"I'm sorry this is just so weird."

"Tell me about it I mean it's not every day you meet a kid that claims to be your son. And from the future no less."

Kon-el walks over to sit in the chair next to you he really was a cute kid now that you got a better look at him he had your eyes, mouth and nose but everything else was definitely Clark.

"I know this is a lot to process right now and trust me I would not be here if it meant that I could be possibly messing up the timelines by revealing who i am but..."

He looks at the bed with a frowns.

"I had no choice."

"Well your here now we can't change that Kon-el."

You gently put your hand on top of his causing him to look up at you face to see a smile.

"So obviously I can't can't keep calling you by your Kryptonian name you mind telling me what your earth name is sweetie?" He looka up at you with a smile.

"Conner, Conner Kent."

"Conner Kent? Well than it's nice to meet you Conner."

You hold out your hand for him to shake but he just smiles ignoring your stretched out hand giving you a hug again but this time you were well prepared and hugged him back. It was odd but you already felt like you had to protect him even your magic knew that this child needs you it was hard to explain but it was a nice feeling.

"Ah your awake."

We turn to see Clark standing in the door way I feel my face get warm and look at the bed sheets Conner glances at me and has a small grin in his face.

"How are you feeling?"

"huh? Oh me? I'm good never been better!" Why in the hell were you stuttering?! He gives you a smile making your face get even more warm ugh this is ridiculous!

"Well that's good now that your up we can discuss what to do with Connor."

Great this already feels like a custody battle.

"Okay so what were you thinking?"

"I was thinking that maybe he stays with me? I know you have a roommate who isn't really found of men in the apartment." That made Conner turn his head at you confused.

"Oh no you don't have to worry about that I kicked them out they were bringing too much negative energy so I now have a spare room."

"So you'll be fine with me living with you?"

"Duh! Beside I could use the company especially with my future son!" You grin messing with his dark hair he gets flustered as Superman gives a low chuckle behind his hand, Conner moves away from you fixing his hair a pout on his face he was to cute.

"Alright alright can we go now? I really don't want to have Batman pointing a gun at me again."

That made me stare at him in horror.

"He held you at gun point!?!"

"Don't worry Conner he did something similar too me."

This time you looked at them both with horror already feeling your magic flare up in anger.

Bruce wants to keep testing your fucking patiences! I better not see his face for a while or it's sight!!

(In the batcave Batman let's out a sneeze Alfred gives him a box of tissues)

I finally was able to finish part 2 thank god I had to rewrite this multiple times cause I was trying to make it just right so I hope I did okay now to part 3 I don't know if I want it be with Superman/Clark to talk to Lois and try to figure out where they stand in their relationship now that Conner is a thing or have him talk to Martha and try to understand his feelings about you now that he knows he doesn't have a future with Lois hehe I love drama

Here's part 1

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fantastic-nonsense · 1 year

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yeah I'm just going to swing a bat at the hornet's nest and wade into the discourse: Tim and Damian were canonically mutually jealous of each other during the pre-reboot era for (ironically) pretty similar reasons, and getting mad about WFA acknowledging it is an indication that you care more about defending your fave than you do about actually understanding what happened and how they've both grown beyond it since then. Is the Tim-Damian conflict in WFA the same as it is in canon? No. Does it have a solid, factual basis in Tim and Damian's canon issues? Yes.

Tim was jealous of Damian principally for two reasons. One, as a brand new adoptee, he felt incredibly insecure about his place in the Wayne family; Damian's demands to be treated with respect because he's Batman's biological son and his constant insults of Tim because Tim isn't hit Tim hard because of it. Tim feels like he's had to work incredibly hard to earn Bruce's love and respect while Damian gets it by default (which....lots to unpack there, but moving on), and the hurt that this causes combined with Damian's arrogant and cruel dismissal of Tim as a member of the family simply because he's not biologically related influences Tim's continued negative opinion of Damian. The dinosaur incident also doesn't help matters. Thus, he's resentful that Damian was (from his perspective) immediately accepted into the family despite his behavior towards them and hurt because he feels like his own place in the family is being denied by the newcomer.

Two, after losing so much and so many people and finally achieving a tiny bit of equilibrium in his life when Bruce adopts him, Damian shows up and, in his mind, more or less replaces him as the center of everyone's attention. This isn't really Damian's fault (his upbringing, trauma, and learned behaviors make him an incredibly difficult child who needs a lot of time, care, and attention from the adults around him), but Tim is right in that the second Damian shows up, he gets somewhat de-prioritized and trusted to handle himself in a time period where he's emotionally vulnerable and desperately craving positive attention and validation from his "new" family.

These feelings get touched on in multiple issues, particularly Batman & Son and Red Robin #1:

"What about us?" /// "If he is my son-even if he's not-he deserves some love and respect." "So let him earn it, like everyone else." -Batman #657 (Batman and Son)

"How can you let him wear that costume, Dick? What earth are we on that you choose him over me?" /// "Sorry, Drake. You're still part of the team--maybe the Batgirl costume is available." [Tim punches Damian in the face] "My name is Tim Wayne!" -Red Robin #1

Are Bruce and Dick actually choosing Damian over Tim? No, they're not. Dick is actually explicitly trying to express that he loves, respects, and trusts Tim (both as a person and as a competent vigilante) by calling Tim his "equal" and giving Damian the Robin mantle. But Tim is insecure and hurting and grieving throughout this entire period in his life, and he isn't thinking the most rationally about the situation. This is a moment that very reasonably feels like a betrayal to Tim, who sees it as Dick taking away the one stable thing he has left in the aftermath of Bruce dying, and then Damian walks into the room and implicitly denies him a place in the family. He feels replacable and unneeded, and his jealousy and resentment of Damian throughout this period are ultimately less about Damian personally (any personal dislike of Damian he has is largely due to other issues) and more about his own emotional instability and the insecurity he feels as an adoptee.

Meanwhile, Damian was jealous of Tim for the exact same reasons that he's jealous of Cass in Gates of Gotham: Bruce and Dick's easy trust in and respect of Tim, both as a person and as a vigilante, and the fact that Bruce chose Tim to be part of his family and never chose Damian (even though Bruce accepted him anyway). He views Tim as a threat and rival for his father's affections, and to that end his constant insults towards Tim tend to lean in two directions: undermining his place in the family and undermining his competence as a vigilante. Both types of insults are the direct outgrowth of Damian's own insecurities about his place in the family.

Damian has a notable and recurring desire to feel useful, competent, and accepted within the Batfam. It's explicitly what Damian wants most in this era: to be accepted and for his skills to be recognized. Dick even comments on it during the Hit List arc: "he practically bleeds a need to be accepted." In many ways, Damian thinks that if he’s not succeeding at proving his competency and usefulness, he’s failing at proving he’s worthy to stay in Gotham, and his consistent prickliness towards other people is often a front to cover up his insecurities about these things. This crops up pre-reboot literally as early as Batman and Son:

"But she's not there now, is she? Because she wants something from Great Britain in exchange for the life of the Prime Minister's wife and I think I know what it is." "It's Gibraltar! She wants the garrison at Gibraltar! See? I can be useful!" -Batman & Son (2006)

And as late as Gates of Gotham, when he gets angry and snappy at Cass because she pulled him away from disabling the bomb at Elliot Tower (in his mind, undermining his competence as a vigilante) and promptly starts insulting her behind her back:

"Cassandra's not useless." "No. She's spineless, naive, and fragile. And I don't trust her." "You don't trust anyone..." "And your eagerness to trust makes you weak." "Well, deny it all you want...but I think we both know the only real reason you don't like her...is that she's just one more person your father picked over you." -Gates of Gotham #3

It's also explicitly noted during the infamous Red Robin Hit List arc, where Damian talks about how "it isn't fair" that Tim still doesn't trust him despite all of the work he's put in to change his thoughts, behavior, and tactics from how he was taught in the League. He lashes out at Tim during "The Hit List" because he'd finally gained some measure of trust and respect from Dick and some personal equilibrium in his life...and then Tim comes swooping back into Gotham after having gained the respect of Damian's grandfather and proceeds to unearth the surprise revelation that Bruce (the father who rejected Damian) respected Tim enough to hand over (nominal) control of Wayne Enterprises to him, poach on his quality time with Dick, and continue to distrust Damian despite his very real struggles to change.

You feel a lot for Damian during the Reborn era because you can chart a direct path between the hurt he feels at being seemingly rejected by the one person he'd desperately wanted approval from for years–Bruce–and the ways in which he lashes out at Dick, Tim, Alfred, etc when suddenly not too long after that incident Bruce is dead and he's stuck with this group of people who clearly and obviously don't like or trust him. He's constantly trying to prove himself as worthy of being there and, very reasonably, gets frustrated and hurt and angry when his efforts are met with continued distrust and hostility.

Tim's continued lack of trust (which Tim has for good but genuinely misguided reasons!) feeds into Damian's resentment and jealousy of him; this is especially true given that Tim is consistently portrayed as competent, trusted, and deeply loved by basically every other member of the Batfam–particularly by Dick and later Bruce, the two people whose opinions Damian values most–during this time period. So yeah: Damian is jealous of Tim too, and his behavior towards Tim is largely indicative of that plus his frustration at Tim's continued distrust of him. His methods of dealing with that hurt (cutting Tim's line and trying to fight him afterwards) are absolutely unacceptable and are treated as such, but they come from a totally understandable place.

Luckily "The Hit List" is basically THE lowest point for Tim and Damian’s relationship. It starts improving immediately after this; multiple writers showcase a definite shift in Tim and Damian’s dynamic after that point, and by the time we get to Gates of Gotham (the last time they interact pre-reboot), we were getting scenes like this:

Gates of Gotham #3

They were absolutely still prickly and kinda rude towards each other (and I wouldn’t necessarily say they liked each other), but they had very clearly grown, were on much better terms, and were able to trust each other while working and fighting together. They've both individually matured and grown enough to the point where they're able to start moving on from that initial period of distrust and jealousy and move forward into a new era (and then we get the reboot, but that's a different discussion for another day).

tl;dr: Yes, Tim was jealous of Damian. Yes, Damian was jealous of Tim. Those are both objective facts that canon addressed and dealt with in a variety of different ways throughout the pre-reboot era. Tim and Damian are jealous and resentful of each other largely because they're two traumatized kids who feel deeply insecure about their place in the family and the utility of their skills in a time of immense personal upheaval. Neither of them are totally right; neither are totally wrong. Both of them act terribly towards each other because of it, and I refuse to let people blame the entirety of this conflict on one of them or pretend like their mutual jealousy of each other didn't exist and didn't contribute to their behavior.

#this is not my full tim-damian post because their relationship is (again) COMPLICATED AF #but I figured I'd address at least this portion of it #tim drake #damian wayne #tim drake meta #damian wayne meta #dc comics #wayne family adventures #wfa spoilers #canon vs fanon

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therapy-ghost · 1 year

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Hello are your request open? :D

This is my first time, can we have a headcanon about the batfamily having reader as like a therapist friend/sister?. That's all, thakyou for reading :D

Hi, yes, my request are always open, and here is you request; hope you like it.

Jason:

Jason needs this the second most of the group

He likes that he can easily talked to you about his problems and that you always have an opinion that helps.

eventually he will end up opening up about the Joker incedent; by prepaired for him to cry in confort and trust of you.

Tim:

you are less of a therapy friend that a sleep scheduel to him

mainly just helps take the stress of his chest and helps him sleep better.

he's been taking it down on coffee but not the work; but your getting there.

Cassandra:

She's a very tough person with alot of family dynamic issues.

She needs help, constantly working herself hard; you can help her relax for a bit.

it helps her get into the station of 'taking a chill pill' once in a while.

Damian:

Hell, this guy needs alot of help

between the matter of being the son and grandson to the Al ghul family and the son of the biggest name in Gotham, along with the fact that he is Robin and needs to help people; its alont for a boy his age.

But having you around to tell him that he is already doing aenough while he tries to do better is really good for him.

Dick:

He doesnt need as much as the rest, but sometimes he feels like he has failed people; specifically his parents.

But having you there to help him feeling like he is doing the right thing is setteling to him.

his sessions are like a once a month think where he feels like an emotional turn

Bruce:

Bruce is top of the list for trauma; between watching his parents die 5 inches away from him, having the safety of gotham on his shoulders, Jason dying, dealing with the justice league and even having to deal with his own family sometimes, its alot.

Having you to rant to is good, cause you listen and help.

Bruce hasnt felt to releaved in a while that someone cares for his problems and it there to help with them.

Thanks for requesting: if anyone has anything I do on my request rules as an idea, please dont hesitate to tell me and ill start working on it as soon at i can.

#Batfamily #Batfamily x reader #Batman x reader #bruce wayne x reader #Jason todd x reader #Red hood x reader #Dick grayson x reader #Nightwing x reader #Cassandra cain x reader #Orphan x reader #Tim drake x reader #Red robin x reader #Damian wayne x reader #Robin x reader

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evilwickedme · 1 year

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Top 10 worst Bruce dad moments?

So here's the thing. I'm not actually like. That well versed in the comics yet? Again like. Only been here for about six months. But I'll do my best anyway

10. Firing Dick

HE FIRED DICK FROM BEING ROBIN. THE NICKNAME HIS MOTHER GAVE HIM. THEN GAVE SAID NICKNAME TO ANOTHER CHILD. WHAT THE FUCK.

9. Steph as Robin

Honestly everything about this is a mess. I've only read a few pages from this arc but Tim quitting being Robin was a really difficult decision and Bruce's response was to give the job to Tim's sort-of-ex girlfriend and then treat her like crap. I believe it's canonically cause she reminded him too much of Jason, but that might just be the fandom's reading of the subtext; either way, if the shoe fits...

8. Telling Damian if he was there, Alfred wouldn't have died

What the FUCK, Bruce, that is your SON. COMFORT HIM FOR THE LOSS OF HIS GRANDFATHER

7. Robin!Tim in general

Listen intentional or not Tim is written as a character that has very much internalized needing to be useful being more important than anything else. His parents simply prioritize work over him point blank - his dad doesn't even remember his birthday, for God's sake - and Bruce simply like. Does not help with this. If anything he takes advantage of it. Tim needs to be loved unconditionally, like, STAT, like, that would fix 70% of his identity issues kinda STAT, and I'm not sure he's ever felt that with Bruce

6. Free space: any time he's hit one of his children that I don't know about

I once reblogged a post that detailed every time he hit Dick but that's long gone into the ether now, I can't find it. Anyway there's no excuse to hit your child. Don't fucking do it. They shouldn't hit you, either, doesn't make it ok for you to do if they've done it fyi. Batman can do non violent solutions, we know this, so fucking use those on your children.

5. Reviving the joker

I believe Dick isn't necessarily mad about not having murdered a man basically in cold blood, but I am. What the fuck, Bruce. You tried to kill him twice, you really wanna tell me you don't understand the urge and NEED to kill him??? And then you BRING HIM BACK TO LIFE??? Again. As I've said. What the FUCK

4. Killing Dick and sending him off to Spyral

Actually Dick shouldn't ever forgive Bruce for anything he's ever done to him ever. Have you seen the panels where they have this argument? His family GRIEVES him and for what!!!! For WHAT

(I understand Grayson itself is actually great I wouldn't know I haven't read it. Doesn't make what Bruce did okay tho. I'm also not sure I trust the positive reviews it's written by Tim Seeley and Tom King like......)

3. RHatO Rebirth #25

Penguin didn't fucking die. He didn't get shot in the face with a real bullet. You don't beat your son half to death to the point where he needs to be RESCUED from you - actually no need to qualify that sentence with the intended "over something that didn't actually happen", you simply don't beat your son half to death, should be a no brainer and YET

2. UTRH end scene

Heartbreaking. We all know at this point. Batarang to the throat. Chooses the Joker over Jason. It's enough to make a fully grown (25 next month) man (eh) cry (I mean. Yeah)

1. INTENTIONALLY TRIGGERING JASON

See here for the ask where I talked about this (and which is presumably the ask that led to this anon). Taking Jason to Ethiopia with no warning when he's cooperating anyway just to intentionally trigger him in order to try to get Damian back to life when you never did anything like that for Jason? Holy fucking shit, you know? Just betrayal after betrayal after betrayal

Anyway I'm sure this list is missing some major moments and I'd love to know what I forgot about or, more likely, simply don't know about! I love a well written good dad!Bruce fic but lbr that's just not what he's like in canon. Calling him a mixed bag as a father figure is an understatement

#batfam #batman #bruce wayne #jason todd #dick grayson #tim drake #stephanie brown #damian wayne #utrh #rhato #dc #gail speaks #ask #anonymous #don't ask me what the top ten good dad moments are #I'll just list Bruce trying to kill the Joker in a death in the family ten times #dc meta

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envysparkler · 1 year

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I'm curious about this Uno reverse batfamily adoption fic idea. What is it going to be about? All the batkids parents are alive and try to coparents Bruce and the robins?

The story starts when a newly minted Batman goes to a circus. He runs into a panicking baby Dick before the show starts, who claims that there's a bad man doing something to the ropes. Bruce rushes off to stop him, gets lightly stabbed, and decides to buy Haly's Circus so this kind of thing doesn't happen again.

The Grayson family happily adopt him. No amount of persuading will convince Dick Grayson that Bruce is not his new older brother. Alfred is happy to have more people looking out for Bruce. Bruce is defeated and resignedly accepts his new parental figures, since it appears that Haly's Circus is going to stay in Gotham.

[you can insert subplot about court of owls here or not.]

Bruce Wayne is in Crime Alley on the anniversary of his parents' death. He gets mugged, which causes a flashback and a panic attack, and a kind passerby coaches him through it while her son scowls at him the whole time. Catherine Todd invites him up for a cup of tea and Bruce meets her husband. He can see where Jason gets the scowl from. Willis gives back Bruce's wallet and keys without saying where he got them from. The car's tires, however, are a lost cause.

[honestly the dramatic tension here from Batman running into Willis as one of Two-Face's lackeys would be delicious. also feat Willis finally revealing Catherine's medical issues which of course leads to Bruce paying for treatment and Jason starting to trust him.]

This Batman has no Robin. This does not stop little Timmy's fascination with nighttime photography, which Janet encourages. Children need to spend time outside, she can brag about her baby's talent, and honestly all the traveling means she's up at odd hours when she's in Gotham anyway. But all that Bat-watching gets Janet thinking and she figures out that Bruce is Batman in a couple of months. Tim is his mother's son, after all. Janet, previously very annoyed with Brucie Wayne, now realizes the whole thing is an act, and is very amused. She can use this to troll Gotham's snooty high society and get a good laugh out of those stuffy galas. Jack is always game to go along with a good joke.

[The Drakes, frequent visitors to the circus ever since little Dick Grayson picked up baby Timmy and proclaimed that he'd do a special flip just for him, find out that the Graysons also know Bruce. They meet the Todds on another trip. If Bruce knew that there were three different sets of Gotham parents conspiring about him, he'd probably flee permanently to the Watchtower.]

Talia...well, it would be a bit awkward for Talia to adopt Bruce. But you don't have to change much to have Ra's be the kind of father that's obsessed with that One Boyfriend you brought for dinner five years ago and won't stop asking when he's coming back.

[Why, yes, Ra's does join the monthly meetings of the Bruce Wayne Protection Squad. If only to weigh in on the "who should Bruce date" debate. They're going to be his future in-law after all.]

Batman runs into David Cain and Lady Shiva on two separate missions, both of which end in injuries for Bruce, but a little girl sticks bandaids with colorful print on him so he guesses it's okay. Her parents have split custody of Cass and now apparently Bruce too, if the way they grouse at him about the proper way to take on assassins is any indication.

Batman ends up in the hospital and Crystal Brown is the nurse that's assigned to his care. The only thing that stops a delirious Batman from trying to get out of bed is Stephanie Brown's detailed stories. Some time later, Cluemaster kidnaps Batman--not to unmask his identity, but to interrogate him on his postoperative care because his wife and daughter were worrying.

Gordon's already pretty much adopted him, so nothing has to change there.

Bonus: Bruce is a fantastic babysitter. He's attentive and careful. Also, all the kids think he's super cool because he's Batman, which is very flattering. And whenever one of them starts making noises about joining him in fighting crime, he can drop them back off at their parents.

#envy answers #fic ideas #batfam #reverse uno adoption #bruce is adopted by all the parents #kidnapping #mugging #panic attacks #stabbing #unconventional adoption

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aalghul · 2 years

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It’s so interesting to me that even while Bruce made it clear to Jason that he believed Jason had killed Garzonas, he never punished Jason for it; Jason remained Robin. When Jason was finally benched, it was because Jason’s actions in other cases made Bruce and Alfred worry about his own safety (not necessarily the safety of the people he was being “too aggressive” against). (The safety of those people wasn’t even a concern because the first issue of DITF had Bruce say he was proud of Jason for killing Two-Face.) They were worried specifically because they thought that type of recklessness was out of character for Jason, and almost certainly caused by him finally feeling safe enough to grieve. I think (or I want to believe) that part of why Bruce didn’t outright accuse Jason of killing Felipe (even if he basically did it) and then strip him of Robin is because he did have faith in him, above it all. However, I also think that Bruce knowing that Jason could have, but then not punishing him for it, instead giving him the freedom to understand it on his own could say a lot. He knows that Jason has a sense of justice that’s been built on his own hardships since…well, birth. But he trusts that Jason can be different and understand why they don’t kill; so much so that he doesn’t even say any of that.

What I’m trying to say is that Bruce has been believing in Jason since day 1, since before some would argue Jason even needed that (since we don’t actually know if he killed Felipe). So why in God’s name would Winick have Bruce deliberate over whether he should save his son from potential death or not? In the same storyline that he has Bruce slit Jason’s throat (which, along with the explosion, was meant to actually kill him off) to save his killer? The same story that has Bruce kill his son to avoid being complicit in the murder of an animal? And he was so confused over the decision to save or not save his son that even Alfred realized Bruce was, for once, utterly lost.

(What I really hated was that Jason knew Bruce had contemplated not helping him. Jason understood Bruce would come, but he also knew that Bruce would actually have to think over it.)

Then, going forward, we have more and more writers have Bruce write Jason off as some lost cause. Not only does it clash with Batman’s whole “everyone deserves the opportunity to be better” thing, but it directly contradicts how Bruce treated Jason the first time he thought he had murdered someone. it’s infuriating.

#i have acrylics again so if I have typos…mind your own business #and that's also the reason this isnt as long as i wanted it to be sorryyy i need to stop getting acrylics i hate how useless i am with them #jason todd #bruce wayne #red hood

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roobylavender · 7 months

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had talia not been character assassinated do you think she and bruce should have gotten back together?

no. i hate to use the word "phase" bc that would seem to diminish the importance of what's between them, which is something that will always persist esp as their continued dedication to the same causes and their respect for each other remains. but i do think realistically bruce should be a phase in talia's life. at least in terms of consummated romances specifically. i do love the idea of them remaining allies, close friends, and co-parents, but i think allowing talia to walk away from ra's and bruce in the first place has to stand for something in the long term. before talia went her own way i think it was easier to imagine a potential future where she ended up with bruce bc it felt like the desirable option. she was in this very debilitating position where she had little to no freedom to act on her own desires and goals, the embodiment of which was none other than bruce. so when you frame her situation pre-tower of babel, obv wanting to be with bruce was appealing. he was as much the love of her life as he was a means of escape and freedom and talia having the scope to then act on her own desires. i think that's what subsequently makes dc #750 (or is it #570. i never get the numbers straight and i'm too lazy to check) a really clever issue, actually, bc it acknowledges that and the fact that bruce once again setting her free bc of his love for her actually gives her the courage to step out on her own where she never has before. the fact that she has the option to go back to gotham with bruce and presumably have everything she's ever wanted with him, but she leaves it anyway, is a really huge deal. it's a statement. she loves him, but not more than she loves herself. and sure, what talia puts herself through during lex corp era certainly begs the question of whether her version of loving herself is really viable or in any way healthy, and i would love to see bruce help her recognize that she's not alone and that she doesn't have to do it alone to prove that she's capable. all of this i agree with. but i don't think that really means she and bruce have to fall back on their once-imagined dream of playing house. even if talia did find methods of going about her work that were mentally healthier i don't really know what'd be in it for her to play house with bruce in gotham. bc that is what it would have to be, for their relationship to work in any way. bruce will never leave gotham and son of the demon didn't need to explore that issue bc it was never going to get there but trust that corny as the line about naming the baby thomas or martha was it was reflective of a reality: gotham is bruce's entire life. no matter where he goes, no matter what he does, no matter who he works with, in the end he will always belong to gotham. and i simply do not think that would ever work for talia bc there is so much more she is capable of. while her vision is aligned with bruce's her scope of access and ability is entirely distinct of his own and there is so much more that she can do aside from relegate herself to gotham (hence why lex corp as an arc makes so much sense, bc it capitalizes on that scope). and yeah every superhero couple is kinda crazy and they have teleportation and shit but idk i don't think it's really a relationship for each party to go on long missions with ill-defined parameters that give them the worst sleep schedules known to man and occasionally they share a bed. it really isn't. and that's something that bruce and talia have to live with. their duty is always going to come first even though they both have a passion for civilian life. for talia to be in a relationship again she would have to stop having the liberty of being able to go wherever the work carries her and for bruce to be in a relationship again he would have to have the equivalent of a robin-wife. neither of these things is ever going to happen. so

#outbox #i realize this sounds somewhat hypocritical bc then it's like. but what about damian! wouldn't the same apply to him!#and idk i don't think it would. your kid is different from your lover #obv i imagine talia would try to be around for damian as much as possible #but as i've discussed a lot of times even that i think would be tricky for her. she was willing to say she lost her baby #bc she thought if she didn't the world would lose batman #she's like. craaaaazy dedicated to her work so yeah i do think she'd try to coparent with whatever capacity she could #and her love would be genuine and overflowing etc etc #but at the end of the day she's not going to settle in gotham solely for the purpose of raising him #or for the purpose of appeasing bruce's notions of pathetic puppy dog romance #her liberty is too impt to her #ironically enough this is funny to talk about in context of that batman & robin panel from yesterday bc like #had they not character assassinated her that's really how it might've gone. at least imo #like it's a shame they had to resort to all of these racist and orientalist tropes about her being an abusive mother #to somehow justify why bruce should be the resident parent instead #when you literally could've just followed the thread of talia valuing her independence #versus bruce being desperate for any remaining semblance of normal civilian life like it's an oxygen tank and he's losing air #not only would that have been realistic it would also have carried nuance and allowed insight into bruce and talia's psyches #and more than anything. it would have been funny #but i DIGRESS. tldr yes talia would coparent but even that would be with certain limitations #i think she's the kind of person / mom who like. leaves her love everywhere but can't necessarily stand where she leaves it. yknow #like i could even bring jason into this #i really do think she'd do everything in her power to try to get jason to break from the red hood persona and heal etc #and she'd have immense affection for him #but she's not going to sit and play house and babysit him once she's free and once she knows he's free too #she's very big on personal accountability #so she'd check up on him and the love would be there but like. the bigger picture would always interfere #anywayyyy. thank you for the question i love to ramble about this stuff LOL

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ayamari-no-goshi · 2 years

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Chasing Shadows (7)

AO3 -> first, last, next

Fandoms: Danny Phantom (DP) / DC universe

Summary: THIS IS A CROSSOVER. As Bruce Wayne begins to slowly recover from the loss of his son, two separate mysteries open up old wounds. Who is the unknown leaving clues hinting at a return to Gotham, and who is the phantom pretending to be his lost son? Is it just a coincidence they’re active in Gotham at the same time? Or are they connected?

Warnings: rated T for violence, mentions of death, and questionable mental health

Parings: none

Notes: originally uploaded to AO3. Cross-posted to tumblr

“Batman!”

Bruce glanced to his left to see Phantom rushing towards him moving through the tight alley as if there was no debris or criminals with weapons before silently coming to a stop. Unlike the other times he’d seen the meta, the boy had seemingly paid no attention to his surroundings. He also kept to his right while trying to keep his hands still. Definitely nervous, but why?

“Phantom.” He greeted as he punched another one of the low-level grunts still trying to fight him. With his associations with Red Hood now well documented, Bruce was teetering on going back to his original plan of capturing him. But he hadn’t harmed anyone and had even helped Stephanie escape Black Mask. Whatever his goals, he hadn’t strayed from attempting to help them. “To what do I owe this pleasure?”

“Did nothing come through on the comms? Don’t answer that. That can be saved for later.” The teen shook his head before letting someone with a bat harmlessly pass through him. The criminal in question dropped the weapon and fled in fear. “We need to go!” His voice was becoming frantic.

Pressing a finger to his comm as he knocked out another gang member, he attempted to reach Barbara, but he heard nothing on the other end. Not only was it strange, but it was also worrying. “Explain,” he instructed the teen, who had started dodging gang members.

“Spoiler is in trouble. You need to go to her.”

“What happened?”

“She’s injured. We need to go, now!” There was desperation in his voice he hadn’t heard before. Unless he was acting, Phantom believed the injury was severe enough that Stephanie couldn’t handle it herself. “Hood’s trying to help, but he doesn’t think he has what he needs to properly treat her.”

“The Red Hood is there? And you just left her with him?” Dodging another blow, he threw a bola towards the three that were approaching Phantom. The teen let it harmlessly pass through him and tie around two of the criminals. The third tried to grab Phantom, but unlike every other time he’d seen the boy interact with the various criminals and rogues of Gotham, he jumped out of the way before punching the guy. It was a move achingly familiar.

“She’s a lot safer with him than she was with Black Mask.” Insult colored his voice. They really needed to find out the reason why Phantom was so loyal to Red Hood, especially after he came to them about Hush. Whatever issue that caused that temporary break in trust between them had seemingly been resolved. “But are you seriously going to continue messing around with these idiots?”

If Stephanie was in trouble like Phantom stated, he needed to finish this and get moving. However, there was a distinctive possibility he would be led into a trap. He needed more information.

“You’ve got to be kidding me! You’re seriously going to finish this first? Right. Guess I have to do something drastic.” As he said that, the air around them seemed to cool until the breaths of everyone, save for Phantom became visible. The strange glow around him intensified as his appearance seemed to blur. The gang members, many of whom had already become uneasy by the teen’s presence, slowed their assault. Bruce caught the barest hint of a smile before the teen let himself fall into the ground.

The gang members immediately began to back away, some muttering about spirits and ghosts. That wasn’t too surprising as many of the criminals of Gotham were superstitious. Yet, he wasn’t sure exactly what Phantom was planning.

Seconds later, Phantom appeared behind one of the lieutenants and reached his arm through the man to grab his gun and pull it harmlessly through the man. Once it was out of the man, he held it up as if he was presenting the end of a trick before putting it on the ground. The man who experienced it, grabbed at his chest to make sure he was whole before fleeing an abject horror. The others, having witnessed it, also fled.

Satisfied with himself, he gave a slight nod before turning back to Bruce. “Now that that’s done, follow me. I need to get you to Spoiler.”

“Give me the coordinates.”

At the request, the meta seemed to blankly stare at him for a moment. “If you’re going to follow, why…? Wait, you don’t trust me? Unreal.” He shook his head and gave him the location and which room Stephanie was supposedly in. “Just don’t attack Hood on sight.” He vanished from sight.

As he began his trek, he attempted to radio the others. There was still silence from Barbara, but Tim, Cass, Dick, and Selena all checked in. Everyone, save for Dick, who’d been grazed by a bullet, were unharmed. Stephanie was also suspiciously silent which lent credence to what Phantom said, but it could also mean she was captured. Still uncertain whether or not he was walking into a trap, he requested Tim to meet up with him and for either Dick or Cass to check on Barbara. Selena agreed to check on Dr. Thompson and let her know that he might be bringing someone.

The building he found himself entering was a three-story office building near one of the railyards. Judging by its appearance, it hadn’t been used for clear work for years. As he located an unlocked window, Tim reached his side. Upon entering the building, he sent Tim to clear the upper floors as he made his way to where Phantom stated Stephanie could be found.

Entering the basement, he found the Red Hood kneeling in front of Stephanie, who appeared to be sitting unrestrained on a chair. Instead of listening to his desire to attack the man, Bruce took another moment to examine the scene in front of him.

The former Robin was gripping her pants as if she was in pain. Her left sleeve had been rolled up, and a make-shift splint had been placed on it. Her left pant leg was also rolled up, and it appeared Red Hood was finishing tying bandages to it. Bloody gauze and an open medical kit rested beside his boot. Whatever happened, it was unlikely Hood was the cause.

Steph’s head snapped up when she noticed him. “B, you came.” Although she tried to sound strong, her voice held notes of pain and relief. “Black Mask got the better of me. He got away. I’m sorry.”

When she shifted, Hood gently smacked her uninjured leg. “Stay put. That leg needs proper attention. Standing on it isn’t going to do you any favors.” Even through the modulator, concern could be heard in his voice. Hood then stood and turned slightly to better face him. Though his face was hidden, Bruce could see the tension in his shoulders and how his fists balled. He wasn’t happy to see him.

Briefly, Bruce noted that the man’s jacket sleeves were rolled up, exposing his forearms. There were no signs of the strange green marks from Dick’s video. They were unlikely to be tattoos then.

“Move away from her.” Although he knew a confrontation was going to happen with the man eventually, it wasn’t currently the time. Not waiting for the other man to make a move, he rushed forward and knelt to check on her. “What happened?”

“She just told you, Black Mask,” Hood responded before Stephanie could. Even through the modulator, Bruce could hear the anger in his voice. “I sent Phantom to fetch you at least fifteen minutes ago.” he hissed causing his modulator to make a strange crackling sound.

Electing to ignore Red Hood’s words, Bruce focused on Stephanie. Other than her wrist and leg, her injuries appeared minor, just bruises and cuts. The way her arm was splinted suggested either a bad sprain or a possible break. As for her leg, Bruce wasn’t entirely certain of the damage. There was evidence of gauze hidden under the expertly done bandages with some bloodied gauze on the floor near her feet. As he finished his checks, Tim radioed he’d cleared the other floors and would be joining them momentarily.

“Word of advice, Batman,” Hood warned as Bruce stood. “Sionis is dead set on killing anyone who gets in his way. If you want to keep these little birds alive, keep them off the streets.”

“Don’t worry about us. We’ll be able to handle anything.”

At the sound of Tim’s voice, Hood turned to find the boy standing in the doorway. Both of them seemed to stare at each other for a moment before Hood turned to face Bruce. The man’s fists tightened, and if Bruce wasn’t mistaken, green markings were beginning to form on what was visible of his skin. “How many children are you going to brainwash into being your good little soldiers.” He turned back to Tim and gestured at Stephanie. “Black Mask shot her in the leg before deciding he wanted to finish the torture session I interrupted the other day. Between what he was planning to do and the apparent lack of care Batman,” Hood’s modulator seemed to crackle as he hissed the title, “gave about checking in on her, there’s a good chance she would have been dead before anyone came to check on her.” His gaze seemed to return to Bruce. “Did you learn anything from your first dead bird?”

“You don’t have the right to speak of him,” Bruce warned as he stood and protectively hovered in front of Stephanie. The more Bruce and the others interacted with him, the more it seemed he was acting as an avenger for Jason.

Even through the helmet, it seemed as if Hood rolled his eyes. “Your priorities are skewed. Spoiler is injured and in need of medical attention, and you want to pick a fight. You had a chance to prove me wrong and choose the kids over fighting a crimi... Hmm?” He paused mid-word. If Bruce wasn’t mistaken, he was listening to someone speaking on a comm. “He what? Shit. Stay put. I’m on my way.”

Without another word to Bruce or the two teens in the room, Hood turned and seemed to harmlessly pass through the wall and vanished. Bruce immediately went over to the spot to check for evidence of a hologram or some type of cloaking, but he touched solid brick. It was still possible there was some sort of cloaking that ended when Hood passed through the opening and closed the entrance. However, the action reminded Bruce too much of Phantom’s powers for his liking.

“Robin…” he couldn’t finish his thought as a loud booming sound seemed to rock the entire building. An explosion, but where? It felt like it was within the city limits, but not close enough to do damage to the building they were in. Was that why Hood left? Had someone, possibly Phantom, tipped him off? That was likely, but for now, he needed to find out the specifics.

“Oracle, come in. Oracle.” The only answer he received was static. That was concerning. He needed to get to the Clocktower. Turning, he found Tim slowing helping Stephanie off the chair. “Robin, get Spoiler back to the cave. Make sure to tell Agent A to call Agent L while you’re on your way.”

“Don’t worry about me. I’ll be able to get back on my own.” Steph tried to put on a brave face, but it was ruined when she jostled her injured leg. “You’re going to need backup.”

“Between myself, Nightwing, Catwoman, and our other allies in the city, I’ll be fine.” He let his voice soften to try to convey he wanted her to worry about her injuries instead of him. Was this lack of concern for herself what Hood meant when he called her and Tim soldiers? He would have to ponder that later. “Robin, I might need you to be my eyes in the city if Oracle is out of commission. If you learn anything, let me know immediately.”

“Gotcha!”

As Bruce rushed from the building, he hoped Tim would listen and take Spoiler to the Cave. The last thing he needed at the moment would be the two of them getting involved in a situation that could result in Stephanie’s injuries worsening.

Using a grapple to take to the air of Gotham, he tried reaching Oracle again. When she once again didn’t answer, he tried Dick. His son’s answer was brief, but at least it confirmed he was alive, even if he requested assistance at the Clocktower.

As he came closer to the building, he found smoke slowly dissipating both in the air and the streets. As he cleared another building, he nearly missing the timing with his grapple. The Clocktower was gone. The remains of it were blackened and scattered on the streets below. Had it been destroyed by one of the rogues of Gotham? Or had Barbara caused the detonation? There was too much he didn’t know.

Getting closer, he could hear the sounds of a battle. Moving around to the side where the entrance of the Clocktower was, he found Dick, Selena, and Dick’s acquaintance, Tarantula, fighting what they had dubbed ‘Scarebeast’. The Penguin once dosed the Scarecrow with something, they were still trying to determine if it was a variant of Langstrom’s serum or something else, turning him into a hulking monster. They had hoped it had been a one-time thing, but the effects of it apparently still lingered. This was problematic as instead of needing some form of container for his fear toxin, in this form, he was able to secrete it from his body. He was also much stronger than normal and deceptively fast. They had to be extra careful as a result.

Seeing an opening, he threw one of his exploding batarangs at the creature, allowing the others to fall back and regroup. There were already noticeable burn marks on his body suggesting he’d been caught up in the explosion of the Clocktower. Good, that meant he was already injured and possibly weakened. If they kept hitting him from a safe distance, they should be able to wear him out enough for him to collapse.

The problem was Selena was more of a melee fighter and had no desire to stay back. Tarantula also wasn’t interested in fighting from a far. That left Bruce and Dick to monitor for signs of fear toxin release and alert the others.

…

Dick hated how long the battle with Scarebeast was taking. They needed to find Barbara. She had been in the Clocktower before it exploded, and with her line going dead, he wasn’t sure if she had been in the building or not. But due to the criminal’s transformation, his strength and endurance without had exponentially increased without affecting his intelligence making the fight that much harder.

There was also the concern on whether or not the Clocktower would collapse. He could hear the unsettling creaks and groans of the building as the damaged supports reached their limits. Sure, they were currently outside, but they were fighting at its base. Over the years, Dick learned just how dangerous being too close to a collapsing building could be.

At one point, Tarantula got a little too close, giving Scarebeast an opening. However, a black and white blur appeared at her side right before the attack seemed to harmlessly pass through her. Phantom had arrived. Instead of thanking the kid, Tarantula immediately scooted away from him. The woman was a former FBI agent, but Phantom’s presence seemed to deeply unsettle her.

The teen’s presence also seemed to bother Scarebeast as he immediately tried to attack him. When the attack and the next three didn’t connect, Scarebeast seemed to give Phantom a curious look. According to Bruce, Phantom’s first properly documented appearance was during a fight with Scarecrow. While the criminal had heard Phantom speak before, they weren’t sure if he ever laid eyes on him prior to this instance.

“Phantom, fall back!” Bruce shouted as Scarebeast began releasing toxin. Phantom was an unknown when it came to its effects, and on top of that, he was a meta which automatically made him harder to subdue if he got affected by it.

The warning was too late. As the teen stumbles as the toxin began to take effect, he couldn’t get out of the way of the next attack. But it never hit. A shot rang out, and the Scarebest shrieked in rage as he cradled his arm. A few more shots rang out, hitting near the man’s feet, causing him to back away as Phantom fell backwards and shivered.

Quickly glancing behind him, he noted a glint off a red helmet. The Red Hood was watching.

“Don’t come near me!” Phantom yelled as he scrambled to his feet and backed away. The temperature in the immediate area dropped, causing Dick to involuntarily shiver as his breath misted. “I’m sorry I didn’t listen. Please!” He raised his arms as if he was shielding himself. “Don’t give me to that monster! I don’t… I don’t want to die again!” His voice cracked as spikes of ice began sprouting from the ground around him and quickly spread in an uneven circle around him.

Scarebeast chuckled, a strange and unsettling sound worsened by the rustling of the straw on him, before attempting to strike Phantom again. As another shot rang out, hitting him once again in the arm, ice began in casing his feet. Bruce used the moment to use an exploding batarang. Before the smoke cleared, Dick used the distraction to activate the electricity on his escrima sticks before rushing to Scarebeast’s back and tasing him. It seemed to finally do the trick as he slumped and slowly began shrinking in size.

Dick barely had time to move as the ice around Phantom increased. The one thing he didn’t want to do was risk getting trapped, especially when he was nursing an injury on his leg. Even if it was just a graze, bullet wounds hurt, and after everything that happened in the last couple days, he was exhausted.

“You don’t happen to have the antidote on you?” he asked as he retreated to Bruce’s side while trying to ignore the increasing frequency of the groans from the Clocktower’s supports. “And since when could he manipulate ice?”

“It seems to be a spontaneous evolution of his powers,” Bruce replied as he pulled out a vial from his utility belt.

“Are you crazy?” Tarantula snapped at him. “The building isn’t going to last for much longer.”

“You can leave.” The hint of anger in Bruce’s voice caught her off guard. “Right now, Phantom is a danger to himself and everyone else due to the fear toxin. We don’t know the extent of this new ability.”

Bruce ignored her and gave him a slight not. Most other people wouldn’t understand what that meant, but Dick had been Bruce’s partner for years. He wanted him to distract Phantom so he could sneak up and use the antidote. Thankfully, the teen seemed to have the frozen in fear type and hadn’t move too much from his spot in the middle of the ice. Thankfully, the giant spikes of ice had stopped forming, but frost was still spreading across the ground. If this continued, there was a real possibility he could freeze the entire square and accidentally harm someone in the process.

“I hate to say it, but I think she’s right,” Selena grabbed Bruce’s arm preventing him from running forward. “The boy can pass through objects, right? He should be fine, but we won’t if we don’t get out of the way.”

He was about to retort and explain that he refused to let another young hero die, but his words were cut off as someone ran in between him and Bruce. “Hold that for me,” the person called as he threw a helmet into his hands and swiped the antidote from Bruce. Glancing down, Dick realized that he was holding a familiar red helmet.

“Ah hell,” he muttered to himself as he and Bruce ran after Red Hood. As they followed, Phantom responded to them by causing more ice spikes to shoot out towards them.

Hood surprised Dick by showing off his athletics. He dodged around the ice spikes with little trouble which continue to push forward. The strange thing was Hood’s movements were familiar, and it wasn’t just him who believed that. Tim had rigorously reviewed the footage from his first encounter with Hood when he was impersonating Jason and mentioned he saw similarities. Though Bruce surprisingly brushed it off, Dick couldn’t. He was certain he helped train this man.

When he was just a few yards away, Hood slowed his pace and gently called out to Phantom. The teen recognized him, even through the toxin-induced hallucinations.

“Stay back! They’ll catch you too!” he called out as more ice shot out towards Bruce. The fear in his voice made Dick’s heart break, but what was he seeing? Who was going to catch him? While they needed this to end as quickly as possible, sometimes the hallucinations gave hints about the past. He hated that he wanted to hear more.

“No one’s gonna catch me. We’ll get out of this together.”

“Hood… no, you’re not him! You’re working with them!” Crap. Did Phantom see the antidote? But instead of the spikes, ice started forming on Hood’s jacket.

“You need to pull back!” Dick shouted as he dodged more ice. “You won’t be able to help him if you get frozen solid.”

Ignoring him, Hood closed the gap and knelt in front of Phantom. Ice continued to race across the material of his closes and an unsettling blue tint was starting to become noticeable on his visible skin. “It’s alright, Dove. Listen to my voice and close your eyes. You can feel my presence, right?” What did that mean? Could Phantom sense all of them?

“I… yes.”

Taking the temporary distraction, Hood quickly scooped the teen into a hug. Not liking the movement, Phantom screamed as walls of ice began forming. Hood used the distraction to inject the antidote into his arm and continued to hold onto him while it took effect. As Phantom went limp, the tension from Hood’s shoulders lessened. “I told you to stay away from the criminals.” An unidentifiable emotion filled his voice. It definitely wasn’t anger, but it wasn’t pity either.

“Huh…?” Dick was surprised to hear Phantom’s voice. Even with the antidote, it usually took at least a few minutes before it took full effect. “J…Err… Hood? What happened?” He glanced over the man’s shoulder towards him and Bruce. “You’re covered in ice! Did… did I do that?”

“Don’t worry about it.” Hood stood and helped Phantom stand.

“But I could have killed you!”

“The cold isn’t a bad way to go. You don’t feel a thing. Much better than explosions or fire.” That statement was too matter of fact for Dick’s liking. “We need to get you out of here. Nightwing, I’d appreciate if you gave me my helmet back.” When Hood glanced back towards him, Dick dropped the thing.

He knew that face. Sure, he was older, but he couldn’t forget him. Especially since his image frequently haunted his dreams, screaming for help. Sure, he’d seen the footage of the battle in the cemetery, but this was different. He wasn’t looking at him through a lens. This was real, but there was no way it was possible. “Jason.”

====

Notes:

It was the War Games arc where Stephanie was shot and "died." As you can see, I've made the executive decision not to do that this time.

Scarebeast is a thing. Apparently the Penguin hired Scarecrow as something of a body guard during As the Crow Flies and injected him with something that turned him into a monstrous creature. Apparently the effects were dormant after that story line until he got caught up in the explosion at the Clocktower during the War Games arc. A weird thing about this transformation is that he can release fear toxin from his body instead of needing a delivery device. I'm honestly surprised he hasn't shown up more.

#danny phantom #dcxdp #dp x dc #dpxdc #dc x dp #danny phantom au #dp au #dp crossover #danny phantom crossover #Chasing Shadows #odyssey au

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wesavegotham · 1 year

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Why do so many people act like Damian fans don't have the right to be upset with DC's treatment of Damian just because he has a "major role in Batman vs Robin and Lazarus Planet"?

The "major role" is being the one who caused a global disaster to happen for no reason, waiting four comic issues to be freed by the actual and only protagonist Batman and then desperately trying to fix the disaster he caused by making a huge sacrifice in the end.

Like, this isn't a story where DC is trying to convince you how cool and capable Damian is. Or if it is supposed to be that it does a poor job if you really look at the story. At best you can read parts of Batman vs Robin as Damian being almost as good as Bruce in some areas, but at the end of the day Bruce is still a better fighter (if he's not already injured from fighting four other Robins) and a better strategist. The best Damian can do is think like Bruce, but he can't outwit him. He can't beat him in a fair fight. So...thanks for that DC, literally no sane person thought Damian was better than Batman at anything in the first place.

Even the scene in Lazarus Planet where Bruce tells the characters to listen to what Damian has to say isn't really suited to serve as an example of Damian's skills. The characters he's talking to don't listen to him until Batman tells them to. They trust Damian because Bruce decides to put his trust in his son and they trust Bruce's judgement. They don't naturally trust in Damian's knowledge or leadership skills. Bruce deciding to trust Damian is nice, don't get me wrong, but it also highlights that Damian only has power in this situation because Bruce decides to grant Damian this power while he himself is too injured to lead.

#damian wayne #bruce wayne

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endmylifelad · 1 year

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Head canon Sunday!

Dick addition!

Heavy whump ahead 😬

Like not for the faint of heart

Dead dove: do not eat level

Quietly dies and tries not to cry every time Roy and Kori come by or ask for Jason instead of him.

Resents Jason for dating his ex’s.

Hates him for dating Roy not even a week after they broke up after telling him why he broke up with arou. He ended their three year relationship due to Roy cheating, lying, going behind his back, and continuing doing drugs after he promised he’d quit and go to rehab and Roy became cruel and even hit him

Hates him for dating Kori just to spite him

Due to experiences with Bruce, Dick will put himself in front of his siblings as a shield. To protect them from Bruce should he lash out suddenly. Only Bruce knows and sees it but doesn’t understand it

Resents that he has to be the glue in the family and do everything to keep them all together and be together

Damian is his son, not Bruce’s. There is no debate about it and those who say otherwise will face his wrath and a punch to the face

Has threatened Bruce that he would take his siblings away if he so much as raised his voice at them

Volunteers at animal shelters and works at doggy daycares for therapy

Doesn’t trust therapists due to one breaking their vow of complete confidentiality and telling things to Bruce - they weren’t life threatening at all and had no cause for it - the other for near sexual assault

Major body image issues - he despises how he looks and has broken a few mirrors after staring for too long. Body dysmorphic

Two times he has gone home and absolutely broke down for the same reason and feeling utterly betrayed by those he cares most. His siblings and best friends sexualizes him and he didn’t know till his friends got drunk and Tim got hit by some toxin on patrol

Has hypoglycemia

Golden boy? Bitch instilled a new and deep level of fear into all of Gothams rouges who to this day fear the hell outta him. Original members of the JLA had no clue a sweet tiny 13 year old in a leotard could be the most dangerous thing and scarier than Batman. Dude was an unhinged feral dirtbag.

Joey was his bi awakening

Still has the ring he was going to propose to Kori with

Some days he resents Bruce for taking him in

At least once or twice a month he will visit his parents grave and will just talk about mundane things, lay down and sleep, read, talks about his Damian, cries about how much he misses them and wishes he was with them and wants to be held and have his mom call him her little Robin again

Resents the other robins for taking his name and colors without a care or asking him at all about it

When Jason is asleep, Dick will watch him and touch him to reassure himself that Jason is in fact alive and here and breathing, regardless of what he’s done and how he truly feels about him

Resents Alfred for not saying anything or stepping in and always taking Bruce’s side - Dick understands his undovoted loyalty but doesn’t understand why he lets Bruce get away with certain things and doesn’t help others due to his actions. Blindsided loyalty

Struggles with SID

Struggles with PTSD

His happy bubbly persona is a complete scam

Ready to beat the shit outta everyone

Goes to Slade when things get rough, too hard, too much. They may be enemies, and neither understand it, but he does

Wants love but is too scared of it

Man crushes on those he knows 100% he shouldn’t, but it just fuels more to the fire of wanting them

Best drinking buddy is Midnighter

More to come but here you go

Happy Easter! 🐣🐰🐇

#text post #dick grayson #idk if you can tell yet #but Dick Grayson is my favorite person #character #whatever #I love him so much #the therapist thing?#personal experience #headcanon #I’m sorry #I’m cruel #dick grayson stan #heavy whump #be warned #not for the faint of heart

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jasontoddenthusiastt · 9 months

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no because i read the first like, four chapters of the outlaws webtoon and was immediately like "haha, no?? why is jay acting like bruce never thought of him as his son? why does this author have it out for b so bad?". i'm glad to know i made the right choice if it just got worse

I could understand the ‘wow, I guess I never really found a family with Bruce if this is just always how it’s going to be with him’ mindset, especially if Bruce was being particularly cruel with him.

[ Batman and Robin #20 (2011) ]

He can be cruel. Exploring Jason’s thought process, how he resolves this in his mind and comes to forgive Bruce again and again is something they could have at least touched on. Instead, they not only did nothing new to move the disagreement forward, but they also muddied it further, in a bad way. If they want to complicate (or worse, attempt to resolve) Jason and Bruce’s decades long conflict, that should be a separate comic entirely.

They could have just had Jason cut Bruce off completely (even if temporarily) with the set-up they had, but they did nothing with it (even though they could have avoided the mess they made if they took this route).

Bruce again does something unforgivable to Jason (but now his friends get fucked over too), only for there to be a half-assed make-up conversation that didn’t really address the real issue, and then there’s no further mention of it. Bruce put the outlaws in a simulation for months without their knowledge, and the conversation Bruce had with Jason later wasn’t even about this. Screw Artemis and Bizarro, I guess. They’re expendable because the core conflict is actually about Jason and Bruce.

I wouldn’t say the bad Brucie moments are too ooc based on how he is in canon. The abuse, and him being big on mass surveillance/never trusting anyone while being the one to repeatedly betray other people’s trust. It’s just all the other characters being so tolerant/accepting of his actions is kinda funny, it’s almost like they’re NPCs lol. But also again why are Bruce’s trust issues which cause a strain on his relationship with Jason a main theme in the outlaws book lmao

Ultimately what this webtoon did was take every irritating plot from Jason’s canon appearances, amplified them tenfold, and mixed in even more unresolved plotholes and horrible mis characterizations.

#if I complained about how ooc Jason was in this this post would be 7 pages long #i mean just the Jason almost killing two face as robin incident alone was framed in such an incorrect way #i just accepted the fact that the author has a poor understanding of Jason’s character and that’s fine because this isn’t canon #look. imo the outlaws work best as a fun adventures type story #the outlaws stuff has no reason to mix with Jason and Bruce’s ongoing disagreement on their moral stances.#attempting to mix the two was a very weird and bad idea??#especially when they very evidently had no idea how to deal with the aftermath of it #i mean Artemis just lovingly told Jason to go and try to apologize to Bruce #after he practically studied her under a microscope for three months #you know this woman is on par with Diana Prince right? 💀#and why did they have Biz talking backwards again 💀 it only makes the confusing plot even more dizzy #there’s just too much wrong with this one lol #asks

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scotianostra · 2 years

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July 18th 1290 saw the Treaty of Birgham whereby Edward I guaranteed survival of Scotland “separate, apart and free without subjection to the English nation”.

That went well eh!

You have to remember though that is was Scots who invited Edward I to get involved in the succession crisis, Edward was considered a legal expert and had helped other foreign countries in the past with similar struggles - he could be trusted. He was also the Great-Uncle of Margaret, Maid of Norway, and Brother in Law to Alexander III so it wasn’t as if he was a stranger to the Scots court. This was a treaty put together by the Scottish Guardians and the envoys of Edward I agreeing a future marriage with Margaret, Maid of Norway and Edwards son. The document is very detailed and shows the safeguards that were put in place to preserve Scotland’s independence. Simply put, the treaty promised the following, that Edward I would respect the borders between England and Scotland and each country would remain separate, no parliament governing Scotland would be held in England. Scottish laws, customs, rights and freedoms would be preserved. The Scottish church would remain free from interference from the English church.

It is because Edward agreed to these demands that many historians do not believe he had any serious desire to pursue his claims of overlordship of Scotland at this time. However, other historians point out that at the same time as agreeing the treaty, Edward also chose to seize the Isle of Man from Scotland and he insisted the Bishop of Durham help run Scotland in the name of Margaret.

In September 1290, tragedy again befell Scotland. Margaret died on her way from Norway to Orkney. The exact cause of her death is not known, although it is likely that she caught pneumonia on the sea voyage and failed to recover. Once again the threat of civil war materialised. Fearful of the ambitions of Bruce, Bishop Fraser of St Andrews, one of the six Guardians, wrote to Edward I, begging him to intercede. A further letter, from seven Scottish earls, written during the winter of 1290 and 1291, called for Edward’s help.

Edward agreed to judge between the 13 claimants for the vacant Scottish crown. For the most part the Guardians were happy with this: both Balliol and Bruce believed they had the best argument, and that Edward would favour them. The others knew Edward’s reputation as an expert in the law. Few at this stage were suspicious of his motives.

Edward held court at Norham. There, he astonished the Guardians by demanding that they accept him as their feudal overlord. This was a condition he demanded before making his judgement on who would be king of Scots. Edward’s army, with him at Norham, was an intimidating sight for the Scots. However, their reply was clever: only their king could deal with such a request, and only after Edward had picked the king could the issue be dealt with.

The task of choosing the new king has come to be known as the Great Cause. Of the 13 claimants (14 if you count Edward himself), only three had a serious claim. All three were descendents of the daughters of David, Earl of Huntingdon, a descendant of David I of Scotland. In order to ensure he would be overlord of Scotland, Edward demanded that all claimants accepted this before he would pass judgement on them. All agreed, as none wished to be left out of the competition to be king.

Edward announced his decision on 17 November 1292, after 13 months of arguments and debate. In the end, John Balliol clearly had the better legal claim and was thus duly chosen to become King John of Scots. Edward’s decision has been seen as controversial. Subsequent Scottish kings put forward the idea that Bruce had the better claim, and that Edward chose Balliol only because he thought he would be easier to manipulate.

This was not the case, despite later propaganda, without Balliol we may never have had the Auld Alliance. The treaty and “The Great Cause” in general was a complicated matter, and I have to say also that John did not trust Edward, when the English King made his demand that the Scottish Nobility acknowledge him as their Overlord, Balliol was one of the last claimants who did so, it shows he wasn’t keen on this.

Part of the treaty reads………….

To all Christ’s faithful to whom the present writing shall come, William, by the grace of God bishop of St Andrews and Robert, by the grace of God bishop of Glasgow, John Comyn and James the Steward, guardians of the kingdom of Scotland and the community of the same kingdom, send greeting in the lord.

All of you shall know that, since certain obligations and instruments are made between the venerable fathers the lord Anthony [Bek], by the grace of God bishop of Durham, and R[alph Ireton], by the grace of God bishop of Carlisle, and the noble men the lords John [de Warenne], earl of Warenne, and Henry [de Lacy], earl of Lincoln, Sir W. de Vescy and Henry de Newark, dean of the church of York, special procurators and solemn ambassadors of the magnificent prince the lord Edward [I], by the grace of God king of England, on the one side, and us on the other, concerning the betrothal and marriage between the lord Edward, son and heir of the said lord king of England and our lady Margaret, daughter of Eric [II], king of Norway, concerning various articles and petitions touching the said business, we wish, grant and oblige ourselves by the present letters that, if the aforesaid instruments and obligations, ordained and made at Birgham in the colloquium held there on the first Tuesday before the feast of the Blessed Virgin Margaret, namely 15 Calends of August in the year of grace 1290 [18 July 1290], should please the said lord king of England, and he shall ratify them before the feast of the Nativity of the Blessed Virgin Mary next to come [8 September 1290] by letters patent marked with his seal and presented to us, the said instruments and obligations shall continue in force; but if they displease him, the aforesaid instruments and obligations shall be restored mutually and thenceforth altogether lose force and be entirely void of influence. Given at Birgham in the year and on the day stated above.

#Scotland #scottish #medieval history #the great cause #history

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daydreamerdrew · 19 days

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Comics read this past week:

DC Comics:

Legends of the DC Universe (1998) #10-11

These issues were published across September 1998 to October 1998, according to the Grand Comics Database. Both issues were written by Kelley Puckett. Issue #10 was penciled by Terry Dodson and inked by Kevin Nowlan. And the layouts of issue #11 were drawn by Terry Dodson, which were finished by Kevin Nowlan. This was a Batgirl story, taking place when Barbara was 18 and just at the beginning of her superhero career.

In this version of events, its portrayed that Jim Gordon could tell that Batgirl was Barbara as soon as he learned of Batgirl’s existence. In the first issue we see Barbara out fighting as Batgirl interspersed with a flashback to the senseless death of her parents, then Jim’s conflicted emotions as he drops Barbara off at college. He is both proud of and made afraid by the “fire” in her and what it could bring, and this ultimately makes him awkward with Barbara, unable to properly talk to her. Bruce as Batman approaches Barbara to tell her to stop being Batgirl, citing both the danger to her and the feeling that he owes it to Jim, but she convinces Bruce to train her instead. It’s after Barbara has started working with Bruce that Batgirl’s existence comes to Jim’s attention, and he’s horrified, but there’s no implication of him ever confronting Batman over it, just him trying and failing to bring it up with Barbara. But this doesn’t have the same amount of tension as is implied in the references to conflict between Bruce and Dick when he was around this age in other stories I read this week.

In the second issue Barbara happens to be part of a hostage situation at a bank, because it’s Gotham, and Jim rushes in alone to try to handle it, afraid of Barbara trying to do so all by herself, since he knows she’s Batgirl. He gets shot and taken prisoner, which Barbara witnesses, leading to a flashback from her perspective of Jim taking her in after her parents’ deaths. Her first attempt to handle the situation as Batgirl doesn’t go well and she is also captured. But it’s, maybe counterintuitively, while they’re imprisoned together and Jim is seeing Barbara as Batgirl up close that his fear is overpowered by his pride in her and he accepts that she is actually capable of being Batgirl, and he frees her to that she can save the day. This change of heart is expressed not through dialogue or even that much internal narration, but largely through his expressions. At the end of the story the two of them are still not seriously talking about their feelings, his about her future and for her what seeing him seriously injured dredged up, but are interacting cordially again.

Batman: Turning Points (2001) #1-5

These issues were all published November 2000, according to the Grand Comics Database. Issue #1 was written by Greg Rucka and drawn by Steve Leiber. Issue #2 was written by Ed Brubaker and drawn by Joe Giella. Issue #3 was written by Ed Brubaker, penciled by Dick Giordano, and inked by Bob Smith. Issue #4 was written by Chuck Dixon and drawn by Brent Anderson. Issue #5 was written by Greg Rucka, penciled by Paul Pope, and inked by Claude St. Auben. This miniseries was about significant moments in the relationship between Batman and Jim Gordon.

Issue #1 took place early in Bruce’s career as Batman and working relationship with Jim. At the beginning of the issue Jim's wife leaves with his son, and then there's a hostage situation at a wedding caused by a man whose wife and child just died. Jim trusts Batman to handle it, and he does, despite his inexperience. Afterwards Bruce goes to Jim's cleared out apartment to try to talk to him as a friend, which Jim rejects. Jim tells Batman, “That’s why you’re here? Because you feel sorry for me? Who do you think you are, anyway? You come to my home and you say you’re sorry to me like you’re my friend? We’re not friends. Are you married? Do you have children? Did your wife or partner or whoever walk out on you?” And after Bruce’s silence, “So don’t tell me you’re sorry. Right now I’ve got more in common with with Corbett [the hostage-taker] than I do with you. So unless you know what it’s like to lose your family, I don’t want to hear it.”

I was really surprised to see Bruce attempting to be a genuine friend in his Batman identity. My perception of him has been of him being really emotionally closed off and formal.

Issue #2 is about Jim reacting to Bruce taking Dick on as his sidekick. It has the intense title "From Generation to Generation Like Cancer." It's also drawn with an old-fashioned art style, which the rest of the issues in this miniseries weren't, and it's handled like it too, with Mr. Freeze having a goofy costume and weapon. At first Jim thinks that Batman must be “insane" for taking on a teenage partner. He believes that Bruce is putting Dick to the path to getting killed. But Bruce argues that he’s “helping him not get killed,” refers to what he’s doing as “not training him so much as I’m guiding him,” and makes an argument that wasn’t convincing to me that Dick needed an outlet for his anger, so, “I’m just trying to stop a cycle we’ve both seen too many times.”

Jim is swayed by this, and is also convinced to release one of Mr. Freeze’s captured henchmen despite not understanding the reason why. Upon seeing Batman and Robin together Jim is amazed, views them as “In a whole different world,” and then thinks, “What was I thinking? Our rules don’t apply to him. They never have,” which was shocking to me. What follows is Batman and Robin having a “conversation in the dark” with the henchman, taking the opportunity to intimidate or even torture him for information about Mr. Freeze. That was also surprising to me, both for this story that's early in Dick's career as Robin and with this art style. The information leads them to a hideout at a warehouse for large props for an old children’s show, which I assume was meant to evoke the 60s Batman show specifically.

During the following fight Mr. Freeze briefly has Dick in a perilous position, and also several police officers are killed. Counterintuitively, Batman being afraid that Dick could die and the deaths of the police officers makes Jim feel more confident in this arrangement, because he approves of Bruce and Dick's relationship and he thinks that Dick could die even if he wasn't a sidekick. It seems that the most important factor, over the evidence of Dick's skills as a fighter, is that Jim thinks having a partner is good for Batman. He ends the issue with the question: "how can I deny him what everyone wants, if I am his friend? How can I deny him a family?" The idea that he could have a family that isn't a partner to him as a superhero isn't considered. Bruce had raised the possibility that Dick could become a criminal without the outlet of being a superhero earlier, and the now fatherless families due to Mr. Freeze killing several police officers is also evoked by Jim as an example of "handing our troubles down from generation to generation." He also considers his relationship with his niece Barbara, which is made even more significant since he lost his wife and son.

This all is a striking departure from the first issue of the book where Jim did not yet consider Batman a friend, still thought of him as a strange but skilled person and wasn't caught up with the persona of the Batman, and didn't think of him as a person enough to consider that he could have lost anyone important to him. Note that in the "Prey" storyline read last this past week, it's emphasized how well Jim understands Batman including understanding the extent of his grief.

Issue #3 took place after Jason's death in the "A Death in the Family" storyline, published in 1988, and after Barbara was disabled in Batman: The Killing Joke (1988). Bruce changes his tactics, going back to being quick-acting vigilante that saves people then disappears, and doesn’t answer the Bat-Signal or otherwise work on solving mysteries. Bruce expressed admiration for Jim that he “is still here, doing his job… persevering.” He considers Jim to be the “better man” because what the Joker said to him during The Killing Joke made him doubt himself. Bruce is also worried about what will happen if he’s the one to bring in the current serial killer operating in Gotham, because it’s through being brought down by the Batman that his enemies become costumed criminals that continuously terrorize the city. In the end Bruce and Jim are affirmed in their friendship and mutual support for one another. Also, Jim tells Batman, “I’m sorry, too… about your son,” referring to Robin’s death. Batman says, “He wasn’t my son… Not really,” to which Jim says, “The hell he wasn’t.” It’s surprising to me that Bruce trying to downplay that relationship and not acknowledge Jason as his son isn’t responded to more negatively.

Issue #4 took place during the 1993-1994 storyline "Knightfall," which I haven't read, in which Bane breaks Bruce's back and then in the aftermath Bruce adopts a more aggressive way of dealing with criminals. Throughout the story there is an emphasis on that Jim thought he understood Batman, and he struggles with whether he's misjudged him and if he's one of Gotham's "psychotics and misfits," thinking that if that's the case, "Then it's my job to stop him. To make up for covering for him all these years." Tim Drake appears as Robin briefly, responding to the Bat-Signal when Bruce won't. Jim questions him about if Batman is all right, but Tim defers by only saying that he's physically fine, which frustrates Jim. I was struck by that it doesn't occur to Jim to be concerned for Robin's safety with Batman, even though there's a scene where Jim is worried about Batman breaking into his office to hurt him. The story doesn't end with a resolution where Bruce changes or Jim is reassured.

Issue #5 called back to the story of issue #1, with the character that held up the church wedding coming back and prompting Bruce and Jim to reflect on their friendship since then. Jim emphasizes how both of their lives are “marked by tragedies,” and says, “You told me that everyone needs a friend. You’ve been mine. I hope to god that I’ve been yours.”

Batman: Ego (2000)

This 62-page graphic novel was published in August 2000, according to the Grand Comics Database. It was written and drawn by Darwyn Cooke.

At the beginning of this book, discussing the Joker’s latest crime, Bruce thinks, “What horrifies me most- is that I seem to be getting used to it. The pain. The death. Not numb, but used to it. Like each new atrocity is the echo of a pistol fired long ago- in the depths of a dry well.” This reminded me of some of the language used in the “Shaman” storyline across Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight (1989) #1-5, which suggested that Bruce was fated to be Batman because of what he experienced as a child, that he’s marked and it’s visible in his eyes. The last two panels that that bit of narration was placed over were Batman’s narrowed eyes as he looks at the Joker’s crime scene, and then child-Bruce’s horrified, wide open ones as he sees the gunman shoot his parents.

This book depicted Batman as this other figure that lived within Bruce since he was a child, and as a being that could be in conflict with him. It reminded me of Bruce Wainright from Batman: Creature of the Night (2018), whose Batman was in essence an imaginary friend come to life, a guardian angel that took the form of Batman because of that Bruce’s fixation on the to-him fictional character. Though the idea of Bruce Wayne being mentally ill is invoked very early in Batman: Ego, with presentiment flashbacks to Dr. Hugo Strange saying Batman had “both schizophrenia and a split personality” and Gotham City’s mayor calling him a “total headcase” early on. (The Hugo Strange quote actually comes from the "Prey" story arc, read later this past week.)

What incites the conflict between Bruce and Batman is that Bruce wants to quit being Batman, then the sticking point in their argument becomes that Batman wants to be able to kill criminals. Batman threatens, “If you denounce me- if you try to jam me back into your subconscious, then I promise I will torment you until the day we die! I promise you’ll wake up screaming every night of your pitiful life!” Batman brings up Harvey Dent, the lawyer and friend of Bruce turned villain Two-Face, and says, “Harvey was in a position where his secret self could act freely. Harvey’s condition ensured he couldn’t be held accountable for anything Two-Face did.” He says, “although we share a host body, I suggest we admit that we are separate entities,” and proposes that Bruce go on being Bruce Wayne, but “step aside” when Batman is needed. Bruce believes he is necessary to ‘temper’ Batman’s wrath, but is also unwilling to kill Batman, and so ultimately they continue on as they were before.

Nightwing (1996) #133-137

These issues were published across June 2007 to October 2007, according to the DC Wiki. All were written by Marv Wolfman. Issues #133-134 were penciled by Jamal Igle and inked by Keith Champagne. And issues #135-137 were penciled by Joe Bosco and inked by Alex Da Silva Soare. This story, titled “321 Days,” did take place in the present day of the Nightwing book, but it was heavily based around, and flashed back to, events of the period of time that Dick moved out from Wayne Manor for several months when he was 16 going on 17.

In their argument, flashed back to in issue #134, Dick says, “When we started this you were open and encouraging. You were like my father… But these last few years… All you’ve been doing is trying to control me.” Bruce tells Dick, “If I found you today instead of then, I would never bring you into the fold,” which is what prompts Dick to move out. Struggling to make ends meet on his own, Dick meets Eddie, and his right-hand woman Lui. Eddie tells a group of young people, “You’re being put down like you’re still nine ‘cause as much as they say they love you- You getting older means they’re getting older.” He assures the group, “Unlike your parents, unlike other adults, I’m not afraid of being replaced.” In issue #135 we see that Dick formed a romantic and sexual relationship with Lui, and the Eddie began training Dick (much like Bruce would have) and told him things like, “Good. Really good. But I’ll make you better. Maybe, someday, even better than me.”

Still in issue #135, Dick grows uncomfortable with the worsening criminal activity Eddie is involving the gang in and considers calling Bruce, but changes his mind, saying, “What am I doing? I left to prove I’m grown up. I can’t just call daddy.” Lui proposes to Dick that he help the gang rob Bruce Wayne with his access to him, but Dick can’t accept that they were “using” him and that he was just a “passkey” to them, until he finds out that Lui and Eddie are sleeping together, which is devastating for him. At this point Dick goes back to Bruce and they take down the gang as Batman and Robin, after which their relationship is repaired. Bruce says he can’t treat Dick as an equal because, “I’m older. Smarter. I can still take you in a fight. But I will respect you… as an adult. […] Maybe it just took a while for me to see it.”

Dick is deeply distressed about Lui coming back into his life 10 years later. Though outwardly he acts cordially, his internal narration over the 4 pages of their conversation in issue #133 reads: “Don’t trust her. Don’t trust her. Don’t trust her. Don’t trust her. She looks the same, smells the same. Don’t let her in. She’ll crush you, just like before. Smells like Jasmine, always did. Don’t do it. I want to believe her. Believe in her. Trust her. Jasmine. I can’t trust her. Don’t trust her. Jasmine and sweat. The memory is still strong. Dick Grayson loved her. Robin busted her. I can’t trust her. I shouldn’t. Jasmine and sweat. She still smells the same.”

Dick’s former relationships with Barbara Gordon and Starfire are invoked several times throughout the story. Dick questions in issue #134, “Is she why I’ve never been able to commit? Why it’s easy for me to say ‘I love you…’ But not ‘I need you’? as images of Dick and Kory appear behind him, and then of Lui fighting Robin. In issue #136 he thinks, again with Barbara and Kory appearing behind him for part of the narration, “After her… Couldn’t let myself trust… Couldn’t let myself believe… Couldn’t let myself get close. To anyone. I’m so tired of that. I want… I want… Just don’t know if I’ll ever be able to have.” In issue #137, after Lui has been seriously injured in a fight and Dick rushed her to the hospital, he thinks, “Damn you all. Once bitten. Twice shy,” and Barbara and Kory’s reflections in the glass briefly overtake his own.

In issue #137 Dick gives the speech that the title of the story comes from, telling the new Vigilante something he’s never been able to tell the people he’s actually close to before. He describes that after Lui, “I spent most of the next year pretending nothing had happened.” He says that, “Day one was the day I learned the truth.” Then, “when things looked their worst… 321 days later everything changed again.” I haven’t actually read The New Teen Titans (1980) before, so I’m not sure exactly which event from that this is referring to. Barbara and Kory are again depicted behind Dick, and he says, “Only, I had never confronted what was wrong. So I screwed up what I had… And then, later on, I screwed up again.”

Also, Dick running away from Bruce and joining up with a criminal gang that targeted young people reminded me of a similar thing happening in Robin: Year One (2000), though that was a bit different in that it happened very early in Dick’s career as Robin.

Nightwing (1996) Annual #2

This issue was published in April 2007, according to the DC Wiki. It was written by Marc Andreyko, penciled by Joe Bennet, and inked by Jack Jadson. I read this because it's included in the same trade that collects the "321 Days" storyline, so I thought it might be relevant. This issue was about Dick and Barbara Gordon’s relationship over the years, leading up to their present day state in the aftermath of the Infinite Crisis event.

I liked how Bruce hung over their relationship in the story. Early on Barbara sternly tells Dick to get back in bed because he’s recovering from injuries, and he tells her that her “glare” was “like you channeled Batman there.” She tells him, “Maybe you bring that out in people,” to which he says, “Ouch. Now you sound like him.” In the flashback to their first date when they were still Batman and Robin he’s fretting out they skipped patrol. He dramatically says, “Bruce is gonna kill us.” She says, “Kill you, not me. I don’t live with him,” but also, “He’ll never know we skipped patrol.” But Dick thinks, “Yeah, he will. He knows everything.”

Dick tries to confess the extent of his feelings for her back then, saying, “I’m a big boy now,” and, “I love you, Babs- as a friend, as a partner- and I’d like to believe I could love you as a…” but he doesn’t learn until the present day that she heard him. Barbara explains, “You should be grateful I did that. You had so much going on. The Titans had reformed again. And you and Bruce… Remember how tense things were then? You were so angry, you were rejecting all things Batman.”

As part of Dick’s recovery, we see a scene of Barbara being encouraging and a scene of her speaking to him harshly to motivate him. After the harsh scene, Dick realizes that the spikes he pushed himself in order to not impale himself on were only “foam rubber,” and comments, “Bruce would’ve used real iron.” Barbara says, “You’d like that, wouldn’t you? But I’m not Bruce. And I’m not here to reinforce your guilty conscious.” Apparently, not risking seriously hurting him during training but still speaking harshly to him is a step up.

When a call from Bruce interrupts their conversation, Dick thinks, “It all leads back to him, doesn’t it?” Dick tells him that Barbara is acting “like a drill sergeant, but that’s what I needed.” Bruce very bluntly drops on Dick that he’s going on a long trip with Tim and wants Dick to come as well, that “I’d like my family with me.” Dick doesn’t even get a chance to respond before Bruce says, “I need a final decision by Friday,” and leaves. And then Barbara ends up leaving to ensure Dick goes with Bruce, telling him in a letter, “We both know you have to go with Bruce. Not because of him, but because of you.”

Of relevance to the “321 Days” story is that Barbara refers to that Dick lost his virginity to Starfire. He asks, “Who said I was a virgin,” and she responds, “Please. The whole ‘I-know-you-better-than-you-do’ thing?” Dick doesn’t correct her, just says, “Right.” (Though, to be fair, “321 Days” was published just a bit after this.)

Also, it was strange to follow up reading that story about Dick being affected by an early sexual manipulation, to the scene in this story where Dick sleeps with Barbara after he gets engaged to Kory, but doesn’t reveal that he’s engaged until the next morning, seriously hurting Barbara. That scene primarily highlights Barbara’s perspective; I don’t really understand what was meant for Dick to be thinking there.

Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight (1989) #11-15

These issues were published across September 1990 to January 1991 according to the Grand Comics Database. All were written by Doug Moench, penciled by Paul Gulacy, and inked by Terry Austin. This was the “Prey” storyline, featuring Dr. Hugo Strange as the primary villain.

This is immediately one of my favorite Batman stories that I’ve ever read; it worked really well for me. I read this simply because it was the next arc in Legends of the Dark Knight, but it paired well with Batman: Turning Points and Batman: Ego, considering the focus on Bruce’s mental state and relationship with Jim Gordon.

In the first issue Jim, Gotham’s mayor, and psychiatrist Hugo Strange appear on a live talk show together to discuss the Batman. Bruce justifies watching to Alfred by saying it’s “free analysis,” but as Strange talks he gets deeply distressed and self-harms by squeezing his glass so hard it shatters and cuts his hand, then continues watching as Alfred tends to his wound. Strange says that Batman is “extremely obsessed- and he craves individual power, indicating a paranoid mistrust of others.” Strange says that he’s, “Obsessed with the night, with darkness. Perhaps obsessed with vengeance,” and pinpoints that it all leads back to a singular trauma that happened during the night. And, regarding that he’s a “rogue who acts alone,” Strange says, “He does not wish to share his victories and accomplishments, yet he insists on remaining anonymous. You see-? He craves fame, wants to be a star, but not as himself- only as the fictional construct, ‘The Batman.’ And, referring to that he uses “the iconography of a hideous, filthy night-creature,” Strange believes that Batman’s motives aren’t “utilitarian” and instead “he exults in the dark power of this terrifying apparition.”

Bruce is comforted when Jim defends him, thinking, “Gordon knows. Gordon understands.” But when the mayor surprises Jim with the announcement that there’s going to be a new “vigilante task force” to take down the Batman, and Jim’s going to lead it, Bruce is distressed again. He thinks, “No. Not him. Not Gordon. Not the only one who understands.” Later, wondering if what Strange said about him being too obsessed and needing to work alone is true, Bruce thinks, “What would it take… for me to trust someone? And who could I trust?” Meanwhile, since Strange is going to consult on the task force, Jim is worried about him being able to figure out Batman’s secret identity. But later, when Strange requests the files on every mugging and murder from the last 5 years, he thinks, “At least he’s underestimated the extent of the Batman’s obsession- a lifetime obsession. He’s also underestimated the time necessary to prepare. In a mere five years, no man could become what the Batman is.” He agrees that Strange will be given the files, “but nothing of my suspicions.”

Strange, it turns out, is deeply disturbed and jealous of Batman. He imagines being like him would feel “omnipotent.” It’s a frustration that he can understand the Batman only psychologically, and he wants to know what it would feel like physically to be Batman. He also hates women, saying in issue #14, “You’re all alike! No man’s ever good enough for you,” as he hits the mayor’s daughter, who he had kidnapped after she spoke positively about Batman. He, in his delusional way, interpreted her support of him as her specifically being attracted to Batman, as opposed to him.

There’s a scene in issue #14 where Bruce is drugged, Alfred tries to help him, and then Bruce hits him before fleeing to the Batcave because he feels safe there. We see in issue #15 that Bruce stays there for several days, comfortable in the dark, and initially refuses to eat even though Alfred was bringing him food. This was the first moment I’ve read that’s made me sympathetic to Alfred’s position and appreciate his loyalty to Bruce. I don’t find him making fun of Bruce for being absurd endearing at all. And I believe his cold parenting holds some responsibility for how Bruce turned out. But this made me appreciate that Bruce is stronger than Alfred, and that Alfred continues to care for Bruce even though Bruce doesn’t always make it easy.

Also, referring back to Jim’s sentiment in Turning Points #2 that “our rules don’t apply to him,” which was about Batman taking on a teenage sidekick, it seems relevant that, prompting by the discussion of Batman’s role is a vigilante and his own inability to disobey the mayor, Jim thinks in the first issue, “in the end, if I’m not above the law… is he? And if he isn’t… Then what is he?”

#comics read this past week #my posts

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