#super interested to see where the Evil Foreigners thing goes seeing as it seems to be a specific plot thing and not an overarching theme
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so. the school for good and evil movie..
I have thoughts
Forwarning: this was done using googles speech to text and then edited and not every name is spelled right, forgive me. Spoilers for the original trilogy of The School for Good and Evil. All three books
also this is 12152 words. I go through the entire first book
TLDR: i didn't like it, the screenwriters seemed to have a fundamental misunderstanding of the book and the queer subtext and the characters;
Thoughts on The School For Good and Evil movie
Forwarning: this was done using googles speech to text and not every name is spelled right, forgive me. Spoilers for the original trilogy of The School for Good and Evil. All three books.
The opening of the movie is in itself not horrific. We do not see much of the town or the people and Stephan is set up quite terribly with Honora already being in the house with the boys. That is bad. Sophie is introduced without her selfish flare of taking hours to pretty herself which leaves the beginning hits about her being evil out of the world. Agatha is in turn shown to be way nicer than she is. Her mother is largely the same however Agatha does not ONCE come off as possibly evil based on the stereotypes people hold. .
The town is quite shallow, we don't get much of the fear in it, the elders are not present, Radley is there but not well? The book is given time to tell us about the kidnappings, and the rules of them even, but this is just nothing. By making it feel more like Rafal chose Sophie it removes the need for readers and why he was searching for them. Gavaldon specifically is not given the established rules that it has in the book.
So then we get to the school the act of taking them to the school itself was poorly written in my opinion the book is very well written because you have Sophie being so eager to go that she does her little things; she writes a letter she puts cookies out she makes herself so pretty and THEN she goes to sleep. So then you have them leaving and they leave and they're taken into the woods largely in the same fashion you have the shadow that comes and grabs them and then you have the the the the bird that takes them up and over wasn't a super fan of the school for evils moat it felt very plane where where is in the book it it's quite it's disgusting I mean it's gross its horrific I would not want to be dropped in slime that's f****** terrible so she dropped in there and I think the wolves are ruined a bit because they're described as being quite rough with her and that doesn't happen. Of Course, Hort is Hort In This Moment he is he's him however he's also not him he's very much not how I imagined him take imagine with a grain of salt I have aphantasia but he's just not a stereotypical villain, we’ll put it that way the actor is still an attractive guy and I think that giving a pale skinny guy with long long hair does nothing, in this case, he just he's not - the costuming and the makeup are not quite right, we’ll put it that way. Agatha waking up I think is it's pretty book accurate so I'm okay with it.
I do think not having the princesses wake up at the same time as her was an interesting choice if not just to speed up the scene, which I don't have too much of an issue with but it does make it feel wrong, not too bad, it just feels weird. All the princesses themselves feel very book accurate to me I enjoy them quite a bit except for Beatrix who is massacred what do you mean she tries to hit on hard at the end no lies she would not, not even shaved head book two Beatrix would hit on Hort yet here we are. The removal of a lot of the elements that make the schools feel foreign felt bad to me. They completely take out the flower ground which I think was to like keep exposition to a low but also it was a signal of worse to come.
The coven feels terrible to me, not going to lie, they boil them down. Hester is not near as terrifying as she is described in the books she always felt very reminiscent of a friend I had in Middle School who was an extremely tall goth metal rocker, terrifying, beat someone up for me once and this version of Hester is very shallow. Anadil has nothing. Anadil has not given a single vibe in this entire thing her character is nothing in the movie, The Rats are never discussed they are never shown they're never used, she's nothing. Dot is also nothing. Dot does nothing. Not only Is her Casting something I wasn't super happy with from the beginning - I loved her growing up because she felt very much like finally a decent plus-size character that I enjoyed as someone who is plus-sized and who she was just Unapologetic in a way that the movie fails to use because the actor that was cast for her was just not the vibe. I also hate that Lesso likes her that feels counterintuitive.
Movie Sophie is shown to have very little drive to actually reunite with Agatha through the movie. I mean you have on page 54 in the book they are literally trying to like grab each other so heavily that they have to be pulled away from each other and I think that that's also a consequence of the introduction of the characters themselves. It is very much shallow, it's just shallow, like their friendship is there I believe that they’re friends but not in a good deed kind of way. Not in a “oh God you're the only person who's ever been nice to me” kind of way. I also think that getting rid of the inclusion of like Nevermore and Nemesis is terrible and the way that they did use nemeses made them inherently useless because at that point there was no buildup to Agatha and Sophie being anything regarding Tedros and love and shit.
All right, so then we get to page 72, in which Agatha is in the gallery of good. This feels very shallow in the movie and simply a way to like shove Rafal and the stupid blood magic in there - Speaking of which, I hate how much he's included in the movie. He is not that heavy of a presence in the book and that's what makes him terrifying in this (book one) book and then in the World Without Prince's later on when you realize like f*** he didn't die and then in the f****** third book The Last Ever After when you get to that point where he's like are terrifying teenager with teenage hormones and you just lose all of that by including him as heavily as they do. but this interaction specifically between Dovey and Lesso pissed me off in the movie their interaction is ruined by the inclusion of the Schoolmaster because the Schoolmaster is no longer a terrifying force in this moment he is just some oldish guy who is there and telling them “oh don't worry don't worry no worries needed” no that's not it! there should be fear here! These two women have been in this position for years and years and years and years we know that Lessohas been there for at the very least I'm going to say 15 years because I don't know if her son has an official age that is mentioned in the third book but I have always assumed that he is somewhere around 16 or 18 because that feels like a very that guy's older he's a legitimate threat to me as far as Sophie goes. Dovey has been there probably since she retired I'm going to assume that Cinderella was one of the last stories that she had much interaction and Ella is old as f*** in the last book but yet you're not getting any of like the fear that is described as to how the Readers are going to ruin things because Lesso is turned into a cartoon villain.
Now we get to the orientation in the theater help I didn't despise this but I don't like the Castor and Pollux are not in the movie I think that they add quite a bit to light the vibe of the school where when I first read it I was like “huh so one of them's good one of them is evil but they're brothers” that means something for me, it didn't like hint anything towards the Schoolmaster it hinted more towards like the very dichotomy of Good and Evil and what is good and what is evil which is what the book is ultimately addressing that's beside the point.
In the movie you have the introduction and the wolves do nothing, the fairies do nothing. The boys come in and they do a fight which I'm so fine with because I think that that adds a good bit to like what is good in this world; “is good when boys pretty is good when boys fight good?” no it's not and that's the point. That is why you have everything else happened in the book because this is the starting point where we need to address this is where we meet King Arthur's child who is so severely f***** up that he thinks that this is what good is he looks at Beatrix and says “I have to fall in love with you because I have to be better than my father did.” We don’t get that in the movie. Agatha is not near as disgusted in this moment in the movie as she is in the book and I don't know how I feel about that. Because while I think that they wrote her being a little bit more bantery with Tedros for a reason (and the reason is that the screenwriting was incompetent in my opinion) but it was just not good there was no scraping for the Nevers to get all “We're going to f****** beat you this time we're going to get you this time you're all going to die by our hands this time”. There was none of that in this moment.
I think what didn't help was just like Sophie wasn't desperate in this moment. She was not desperate in this moment and that desperation is something that sets up why she does what she does later on and, it's like yeah, she sees the pretty boy in the movie, she sees the pretty boy she sees the Prince, but also she never really liked talked about in the town in the beginning how badly she wanted a prince, she never really talked about how badly she needed to be whisked away by a handsome man from the life that she's in and it just it falls kind of flat, especially when at that moment you lose Pollux and Castor where is Castor is being a dick and giving like the gentle exposition of what happens when you fail you get turned into an animal a tree or something that gets pissed on by a dog. You get none of that, none of that is present, and it just feels very icky. That's the word for it.
In this moment, you also lose the line Sophie remembered Bane’s scared face on the wall and you lose that moment of exposition of Sophie understanding what the f*** happens to people from their town that get brought here. You get no mention of Bane or Garrick and you don't get them later on either. They are not included. There is no talent show so they're not included, there is nothing there, no moment of Agatha showing how truly good she is.
And you also miss out on like this very heavy moment of anger between the two schools, you miss out on Castor losing control and yelling that good is cheating you miss out on Hester being passionate that evil hasn't wanted two hundred years you miss out on those things and it feels bad.
Because of the lack of Pollux and Castor and the changing of Lesso and Dovey into their position, at this moment, you really aren't getting a sense of how the school is run and besides that, half the teachers are gone, you don't get a lot of the teachers, Lesso takes Sheeba's position later on which is a choice, it's a bad choice. Sophie also never once in the movie panics over her clothes which means that the scene in which the scene after the Doom room when she comes in in her fancy new dress made out of her uniform means nothing to me. It would mean something if she had had that moment of like “oh my God this to dress, this dumpy black disgusting dress that I have to wear” she never got that, she is not once set up is like the selfish princess that she is in this book ever she's just not that.
Agatha has a little bit of that moment but not even Agatha has that moment, the clothes she’s wearing in her introduction and in the scene in which she is taken, she is wearing plain clothes. Not like “I hate my body” clothing and I know I hate my body clothing I'm trans. I know that Vibe of dumpy black sweatshirts and shoes that make you unconceived to other people. I understand that Vibe and you want to know what, they didn't give Agatha that f****** vibe. They never once take Agatha's character and understand her as someone who genuinely hates themselves because of what they been told. She does not experience that. She barely glaresat the boys who say burn the witch. The one time that she is legitimately threatened with something, They Break The Rules. Because of that Sophie does a thing, Sophie f****** defends. By giving Sophie that moment of Defense in the beginning it not only trips up the rules it trips up the entire storyline because Sophie doesn't really ever have that moment. It is always Agatha coming in and having those moments in which she tells people off and she does it very carefully because she doesn't know what has happened to people in the past it is very clear in the book that she does not find out what happened to other women who were suspected of being witches until the third book in which Callis tells her.
They completely remove the halfway Bridge which I don't like. I think the halfway Bridge was a very wonderful way of giving you hints that Agatha was the good one because of those interactions with her subconscious essentially. Agatha is forced to confront what is in her in those moments she does not fully confront that until later in the makeover scene but she is forced to confront those fears. Movie Agatha is not once forced to confront any of the fears that she has because it seems that she does not have any fears. Her Devotion to Sophie is unreasonable in the movie there is no okay that's a Reason there is the only time they show how they met was when they were tiny little baby children. While I don't think this is a terrible introduction in the movie considering we learn in the third book that Stephen always had a small affinity for Agatha when she was a child because of the circumstances, it still feels very shallow, that's the only way I can put it, like you have the whole first few chapters where it's just like they're just bantering but they're doing it in like a fun way but in a way that you kind of question whether or not they're actually friends because in those first few chapters it does feel like Sophie's treating Agatha like a pet. I understand why they wouldn't want to convey those vibes in the movie However by not conveying those vibes it does seem like Agatha has no mind of her own but not in the way that the book presents where she's so afraid of not having a friend that she's willing to die in order to get Sophie back it feels more like we’re told they’re friends so they’re friends.
So movie-wise we go straight from theater of tales to the Schoolmaster introduction I hate the school Master introduction. By making the schoolmaster's tower as accessible as they made it via the invisible stairs et le Indiana Jones they take away your next hint that Agatha is the good one. You do not see the moment between her and the Stymph and you also skip over Sader, you skip over Sader and you want to know what you do when you skip over Sader? Not only do you skip over a pivotal character in this book you skip over another pivotal character in the second one that they tried to set up really hard at the end of the movie and failed miserably at. And you skip out on the person who ultimately “kills” the Schoolmaster in order to achieve a girl boss moment that already existed in the book where Sophie and Agatha have their moment of Agatha literally choosing her best friend over her prince and then immediately getting snapped away but did that happen? No, it didn't happen.
Also by skipping over the inclusion of the bridge and Agatha having to sneak into the school you miss out on Agatha's entire identity crisis in the exhibition of evil in which she says I was meant to be here all along and then she panics and essentially is like “holy s*** I was meant to be here all along”. I mean she sees all of these things that she was surrounded with growing up because her mother was a school for evil student and she feels at home which it is so understandable as to why she would feel at home in that moment, but then we know that that's not true there's a difference between liking vibes and being evil. And even that statement doesn't line up with the whole message of the book because the point is what is good and what is evil. I also hate that they took the gargoyle scene and gave it to a Cupid I understand probably what they were going for there because they weren't doing henchman they were like well s*** we got to use Grimm somehow let's use it like this instead of her being up on the school for evil, she’ll be up on the school for good. I think it's idiotic and a shallow understanding of Grimm. I guess she no longer has the Mad Dash to get to Sophie because instead of bursting into a room, she's almost stabbed, that's nothing the book describes her literally falling almost to her Doom, barely escaping, and finally, Finding Sophie only to stumble in on a hilarious situation in which the coven is in shock over Sophie and Sophie's action of flooding the floor in order to do her makeup and Agatha is immediately like put down for being in whatever Panic that she is in by Sophie and her roommates immediately say “oh s*** sophie's right we want you want you so badly”. and that was a Vibe because this is one of this is another time in which we see Agatha say there's no way in hell I'm leaving you that we don't see in the book because Sophie goes so willingly in the movie with Agatha to go see the Schoolmaster.
Professor Manley is there, I think he is actually decent in the movie, I think that scene because it's so true to book it comes off in the same way I still don't think Hort is threatening enough will put it that way because he's not exactly like threatening in the book however there is a difference between like skinny the emo boy and big hulking guy grabbing you and shoving your face into a potion The Vibes are different in ways that don't work with how the ideas of evil=ugly work. Hort being as loud as he is in the movie ruins the scene just a little bit because he's loud initially he says “Me!” with enthusiasm but then he almost tries to like comfort her not in an awkward way but in like a whispery way which he has multiple times through this book were he is a very caring character, I think that is something that completes him in the question of what is good and what is evil because Hort really hasn't come off as evil. he's a lil mischievous, his dad's a little bit f***** up, but like he doesn't come off as the son of Captain Hook, he wears froggy pajamas his dad gave him, he’s just as soft and someone who like actually wants to help Sophie and in the movie he just comes off as like hyped up teen incel? Maybe I don't know if that's the best wording whatever it's what's coming to brain.
I don't hate the movies rendition of Professor Anemone but I also don't love her I think that the casting was decent. I think what ruins her later on for me is the combining of Anemone and Uma. (EDIT: I said the wrong names. This is what I get for speaking instead of just typing it all out. DOVEY takes Uma's place. My issues remain the same.) Uma is a very particular character that was set up to be used later on (I assume at least it feels that way on rereads) where she is so ready to get the f*** out of the school and get her life going that she rescues Agatha and Tedros in the third book and she does great in the third book which is why her being replaced with Anemone in the Wish Fish scene feels bad.
I guess it's just the stupid attitude that they give Anemone, in the movie is very counterproductive to the beautification scene because it comes off as like they read this scene and they came off with like beauty standards bad when it's more so at least in my opinion it's more so that like good is f***** this is what good has been reduced to. And by reducing it to this it's bad but the way they handled the scene in the movie it genuinely just feels like haha yeah makeup sucks we don't need to smile for boys which is like Baseline teenage feminism that just feels so shallow. and I say this as a butch lesbian who paints facial hair on everyday. (EDIT: Anemone is actually decently book accurate. Dovey is on the fence. I continue to mix them up, dyslexia curses me)
Again no Castor and Pollux, no henchmen training which means we've completely cut out the Golden Goose and replaced the Golden Goose with in spirit the scene with Rafal and the swarm. By getting rid of the Golden Goose scene you miss out on yet another moment of “those things only like Evers” you miss out on those vibes which means you're missing out on another kind of like twisty turny bit of “is Sophie actually evil oh is Sophie maybe good-o is Agatha really good oh is Agatha actually evil”. So you miss out on that and you missed out specifically on the scene where instead of Rafal being the one to say “hi yeah that's the girl, the pure evil girl” it is a being that literally sacrifices itself to show how evil Sophie is.
After henchman training we get curses and death traps Which is Lesso’s class, I love the scene as it follows the Golden Goose scene I think it is a wonderful scene that actually f****** introduces the idea of a nemesis that the movie doesn't really ever introduced it just drops into our laps and says you know this is right? right? You also miss out on some of Lesso antagonizing Sophie directly because they wanted to make her a cartoon villain instead of like a legitimately terrifying villain.
Now we have the wish fishing which is an amazing scene within itself and honestly not the most terrible scene in the movie I do however this is Gregor was unneeded. Gregor was not needed, the screenwriting was shit so they felt like they needed a way to shovel in all this Exposition they completely forgot to use. Because they cut more of the scenes before this you miss the whole paragraph on 127 in which Tedros is trying to be nice, he's trying to be good, he's trying so hard to be good, and then he remembers what his father said to him which is “the best villains make you doubt” and that is something that gives us a hint towards what might happen with him and Agatha and what might happen between him and Sophie because he's kind of a f****** dumbass he's a little bit of an idiot he's a cute idiot so he's lucky in that fact but he's still an idiot and that's why Sophie is able to trick him so easily, later on, every time she does it.
So now we have the introduction of Princess Uma I adore her I think she is wonderful and it is important that she's described as far too young to be a teacher which tells you at that moment she shouldn't be here she shouldn't be here. None of the other Fairy Tale people are here, so why is she here? If she's here then why isn't Cinderella here teaching beautification? We know why cuz Uma got f***** over that's why. It is Uma's line specifically that if you are not good enough to be a princess then you should be honored to die for one that's a little size a little bit of what's Happening as far as the transformation goes. Agatha then remembers all the stuffed animals that she saw in the gallery for good and that is another reality shaker. All of the girls one by one go up and they wish for their princes, fine and dandy exactly what I'd expect. Uma then encourages Beatrix to go after Tedros we don't get that with Anemone in the movie but with Uma it feels different. And then after that moment we finally see Uma make her own wish and she receives a suitcase, a suitcase, that becomes instantaneously more painful when you remember what her backstory is and the fact that she is far too young to be in the school. (EDIT: Dovey not Anemone >:●)
Now it's Agatha's turn. You know her wish become so muddled that that's what traps her, in the movie they make it seem like it's just that because the fish is grabbing onto her to pull itself out, I find that shallow. The last word Agatha lands on in the book is give that is far more emotionally impactful as far as how good Agatha is in her heart than just an instantaneous “we should all go home I want us all to go home”. By giving her the wish that she wants to go home in the movie Not only does not make her seem like she knows what she's doing but it ruins part of her character development. I understand why they wouldn't do a whole Stampede of animals going after her for the sake of editing and like time and money and s*** I do however think it is terrible. The inclusion of Gregor was not a terrible idea in the idea of like a “Watcher” character and what I mean by that I mean characters that allow exposition to be given to the people watching who don't know what's going on. It's notable in playwriting, it's usually the main character is that kind of the view into the new world if the world is complicated. By giving us Gregor, you gave us a very shallow emotional moment (He-Man reboot did this too and I Hated it) we're in which I've had maybe 10 minutes with this boy, 10 minutes that most of which I was focused on whether or not he was Cinderella's son, and how that would work and then he's. So Gregor dies immediately after he's introduced for the most part I'm not going to lie when I first saw him be introduced I thought maybe he was Tristan because he seemed a little out of place and Tristan was just kind of that way in the books. But no Gregor is a completely new character, a completely different guy, and by immediately using the emotional moment of the Wish Fish in which we are really told what happens to people who fail via someone that we've had 10 minutes with it feels very weird because in the very end of the book, you know, when you're at the the talent show and Agatha comes in in her gorgeous gown and she frees all the wolves and all the fairies you have already been introduced to Bane and the others, you've already been introduced to them as far as like who they were what connection Agatha and Sophie had to them, and what happened to them in the end. You've already been told all of that at that point and that is what makes that very ending moment in which everyone is freed that's what makes that so emotional. the movie fails at this.
Page 138 is where the scene takes place you have Agatha who has run so far to try and get away from the Stampede of cursed students who just want to be freed and you have her find this gargoyle who is already established I'm just going to read it.
“She opened her eyes and found the gargoyle kneeling before her so close she could see the reflection in his glowing red eyes reflections of a scared little boy.
“You want my help?” she breathed the gargoyle blanked back a few hopeful tears.”
They do not achieve that level of emotion in the movie Gregor he's not someone that I had an attachment to no matter how much they forced it and this child in the book is not someone I have an attachment to the difference is that this child is described as a scared little boy who has been cursed to be a Gargoyle on the school that cursed him forever. And Agatha manages to reverse the curse just with her own magic. You are given the description of the gargoyle melting back into being a little boy and that is when he's killed.
We are told that this child is being returned back to their original form and then immediately after he is killed. End right after because Tedros couldn't see it, Tedros couldn't see that he was turning back, and that is amazing foreshadowing of the fact that Tedros cannot tell the difference between good and evil and we did not receive that. The movie instead makes it into a “why couldn't you tell who it was” which is not the point. And Agatha is angry at that moment and I am so grateful that the only good thing they managed to do in the scene in the movie was make her punch him. Not that it paid off.
Next is chapter 9 where we have the introduction of the talents and it begins with a reminder that just because Sophie was able to talk to the Golden Goose doesn't mean s***. Hester puts it very lightly by saying “or 100% evil depends on if we believe you or if we believe the stems the robes the goose and that wave monster”. Hester then goes on to say “when you were just a snake in sheep's clothing” which is wonderful foreshadowing to what Sophie would wear later on (where the f*** was her snakeskin cloak in the movie where was it where was it where was it.) So now we get some Agatha we get some gorgeous lovely perfect Agatha in which it is the aftermath of the animal incident in the tower and she is being dragged by a wolf which is particularly menacing at this moment because as of yet we had not seen the Wolves interact with anyone but the evil students and the inclusion of the knowledge after reading that the wolves are good students makes the seem even worse because Agatha looks up with the wolf and says “I don't want to die” and the Wolf in that moment understands and says “I didn't either” and even then he still pushes her into the room. I think that is a wonderful example of the horrific things that happened in the school that the movie Never addresses. And then right after that were thrown right back into the talent she was gone this this whole scene is given to Lesso in the movie, which while I don't think that is a terrible decision I also don't think it was a good decision because it has made Lesso more of a joke than she needs to be or she is. You have the introduction of the circus of talents which in the movie is not once mentioned and honestly, makes an entire scene useless except for the fact that that is where they included Rafal saying something directly to Sophie. This is also a scene in which you see Sophie being terrible the entire time not just one time to Hester which is largely in character in the movie it's in character for her to be Bitchy because she is through this entire scene, she's terrible, however, this scene is ruined by the inclusion of Rafal. Because in the middle of this scene I had to stop and think “huh did they make it so Rafal is the one giving her all of these powers did they really do that?” the answer is yes kind of actually which is terrible. I also think the way that the Swarm behaves in the movie scene is not super fun but that's also because they wanted to make Rafal control it? Make Rafal send it? I don't know what the Vibes were I don't know what they were doing. but specifically it is the lines on page 147 “the Swarm went dead still like scolded children they whimpered obediently and fled out the window like a dark cloud”. Sophie is not given that level of control in that moment and I think that it ruins how much control she should have later on. Sophie also has immediate regret in this situation she does not call off the Swarm immediately because she is panicked in the book she is terrified of what she has just called because she's a princess and princesses are supposed to call something good they're supposed to call Birds a deer something she called a swarm of wasps, bees, Hornets - terrifying things that did almost kill Hester and she immediately tries to help Hester and that doesn't happen in the movie. Sophie is not given time in this scene to have an identity crisis and it severely Messes up her character development.
Right after this you have a meeting with Dovey which does happen in the movie however it is not done well in the movie. This scene is largely Dovey trying to fully tell Agatha if you don't shape up you're going to die like all those people and she (Agatha) asks “can I say bye to my friend at least before you kill me”. And then Dovey tells her no no no, just shape up. These lines are given to Dovey directly after the Wish Fish debacle happens which I think is a mistake because Dovey in the movie comes off as very superficial and a wobbly character at best. But this scene is something that kind of solidifies Dovey as truly an educator and someone who does want the best for her students at least. That comes in later when she gives Agatha the makeover and she explains what her role as a fairy godmother was before she came to the school. At the end of the scene, you also have “Agatha wasn't listening her eyes were still in the dead Eyed Doll bleeding feathers in the wind. The doll that looked just like her”. The movie fails to give Agatha the sense of fear that the book gives her, Tedros legitimately hates her in this book he is terrified of her he thinks she's the devil incarnate and because he is who he is all of the other princes are going to fall in line behind him. The only one I could ever imagine having anything extra to say about that would be Tristan but also Tristan is too soft-spoken to actually say anything to Tedros about it.
Next is Yuba, Yuba is not terrible in the movie but also not good I think the fact that they cut most of his content in the movie kind of takes away from it and also just like not having the classes combined and not giving Sophie and Agatha time to be together as well as fighting in the way that they do because of Tedros, it ruins all three of them. it ruins them in a very specific way that is Agatha is so insistent on getting home that she is constantly protective of Sophie but also Sophie’s being a f****** dumbass so Agatha’s not like hanging over Sophie and Tedros is being even worse and Tedros wants to kill Agatha very obviously he is preparing to kill her at the end of the last chapter so why would she want to hang around him even if her best friend has a crush on him not happening. So you have this whole scene in which half of this was given to Dovey in the Wish Fish Scene. It is the half that is very important which is “evil attack good defend evil punish good forgive evil hurt good help evil take good give evil hate good love” those are the base rules of this universe and we never see those explained to the evil students. We never see this specifically where it is distinguishing between never and ever. and by not giving us the scene we do not get any of the heavy questioning as to whether or not Sophie is evil or Agatha is good and we don't get any of that from Tedros specifically. Tedros is a very well-written character in my opinion as he wants to be so good because of what happened to his father and what his mother did and what his father did to his mother that he is terrible at being good but also he's very good at being good when it counts just like at the very end of the book where he f****s up but he tries so hard to make it right and then he continues to fuck up but he continues to try so hard to make it right which is the important part. We also miss out on just banter between the the two girls which makes it seem in the movie The like there's no reason for them to be friends outside of like the five minutes we see them in town in which Sophie would risk breaking a nail.
The ending of the class is them getting the Fairy Tale punishment and then we go into them going up to the tower. So in order to get up to the tower in the movie they just walk up a flight of stairs which for money's sake again I understand I still think it's horrendous. The tower is very elusive in the book which I think is aided by the fact that on the original covers with the two girls and the swans you don't see it and then in my copy of the book you see it (in the map extra) but you see it not connected to anything, the halfway bridge is barely close to it, there's no staircase. So in the book, they have to like you know they have to get the stymph and this bird loves Agatha, it cuddles up to her like a puppy and hates Sophie so again one of our hints that Agatha is good and just because the bird looks evil and maybe a little bit terrifying it's not an evil creature. I also am not a huge fan of the birds origin being that they were students in the movie, I think that that was very not great considering that they are built up more to just be like natural beings in the world. But even the moment of them getting on the bird is another instance of the Good vs Evil rules in which Agatha is falling in line with the good rules and Sophie is falling in line with the evil rules we don't get that in the movie. They crash land into the tower, they see the storian, I'm not a big fan of the way the story and looks in the movie I think the quill is cartoonish not terrifying, besides the point. You have the moment of Sophie walking to the pen and Agatha tackling her trying to keep her from touching it cuz they don't know what the f*** it is going to do and then the storian turns to them while I don't hate that the storian is the voice of Cate Blanchett in the movie I'm not a huge fan of personifying it in that way when it is more of an instrument than it is a being maybe that's a nitpick (all of this is nitpick). But it is at this moment that the storian starts writing their story and it is quite a terrifying moment because right before it you have the storian almost attempting to kill them before it changes it’s mind and then the Schoolmaster is revealed. This is the first time that we have seen the Schoolmaster in this entire story and he is terrifying in this moment. They they haven't seen him yet they've been so focused on the pen and almost dying because of the pen that he is there and he comes in very much reminiscent of Merlin in more serious Arthur adaptions and he's described as having a mischievous smile. And then he says “it must suspect a good ending”. Not only does this foreshadow the ending that happens in the book that he desires and the ending that he doesn't get but it just makes him feel more elusive like oh he's the guy he's the important guy he's the one who brought us here? And then they start asking him to go home. This entire interaction in the movie is played down by the fact that the school master has been introduced to us already and the Rafal is the way that he is specifically. This scene also gives us another moment of Sophie just being Sophie like she's she's complaining about how she smells in the fact that she doesn't have a groom room and nothing is right and Agatha says we'd like to go home right after he asks if they like to switch schools at which Sophie says can we can we switch schools can we please and he says no obviously.
The Schoolmaster says he could send them home but because they're afraid he'll know he can't I've always taken that as a lie because why would he want to send them home if he's been searching for readers for so long specifically as we learn later on that he went after Callis I don't think that it is possible that he Would send them home at all. After this he gives them the riddle Agatha is a little bit more active in this scene the scene ends about the same way that it doesn't the movie They leave, teh floor doesn’t disappear doesn't but they wake up in the rooms (and the movie forgets that Agatha is ALONE).
The next chapter is just some interactions that further the character relationships specifically “the only reason this happened is because you chose me you chose me you boorish brainless Thug”. I love that scene because I think it is one of the first times that we see Tedros really have like heavy faint of heart moments but in a good way it also really is telling how young he is in the scene because of how he reacts. Also Kiko had so much taken away from her in the movie Kiko was wonderful I love her so much she is so cute in the book and they really don't give her an Agatha much of a relationship in the movie. This is also when we find out that the that ever ball is in 2 weeks rather than it being the ever snow ball at Christmas assuming the school year here follows the same school year, l they got kidnapped September then they have September October November and December, 4 months to figure it out. 2 weeks to figure stuff out the movie. no.
We miss out on most of the coven versus Sophie moments which I don't think helps very much at all in the case of but the coven is.
And here we see Agatha having to learn how to dance while having a moment of just her pure devotion to Sophie coming out that we don't see in the movie.
None the gallery for good as used and we again we don't have Sader in this in the movie so we're missing out on everything that he brings to the table not only Exposition wise but also like Agatha’s character development and it leaves out Agatha learning about more things via Sader (like Garrick) this is just another moment of them realizing how f*****-up this s*** is that we don't get in the movie the movie tries very hard to play up how f***** things are but it fails because they just don't have the exposition that they should have. The gallery of good could have been done very well in the movie. But because we do not have the gallery of good or Sader we completely miss out on his painting and that painting is kind of a pivotal point in Agatha realizing that things are bigger than she thinks they are. Of course in the movie, they're not that big.
After the instruction of Sader, we have Sophie learning about the Schoolmaster and the story from Hester, Anadil, and Dot. All of them probably know a great deal because of, you know, their parents being who they are. And it's just another introduction to the fact that evil has been losing and that everyone thinks the brother that got leftover is the good brother of course probably the only person who knows it's not is Sader but he's not going to say s*** because he needs to be alive. After that is when we get pushed into Lesso’s classroom and we see her teaching about specific villains and Sophie is s*** at asking questions and this is when she gets the wart on her and right after there's lunch and then she is laughed which shows Tedros is still a child. Sophie In This Moment also steals Agatha's lunch. We don't see that in the movie even though it does actually show how kind of mean Sophie is a lot of the time we don't really ever see Sophie being like actually mean to Agatha in the movie which is upsetting.
After that is good deeds and Tedros is trying to get Agatha to tell him how she made him choose her which she didn't do anything but that's the point. she is however a little bit mean to Tedros but it still follows the rules; Tedros initiated the conversation Tedros attacked, Agatha is being rude but she is defending herself. this is also a moment in which Agatha is a little bit more upfront about what she is seen with Dovey which works better here in the sense that she hasn't seen the Schoolmaster for a long time no one knows what the f*** the Schoolmaster has going on. The movie however they talked to him all the time they talked to him all the time he addressed the f****** students. Ruined his character.
Because the school master has already been introduced we don't get this entire scene of the Deans addressing The Schoolmaster rumors that have started specifically what side he's on and Sader says they have proof I'm going to say obviously that proof is just that the storian is kind of its own being mostly and that the Schoolmaster is there to protect the storian and that's it. Then Lesso then they ask if something is actually met the guy and there's a little bit of a fight because Beatrix is a b**** and Agatha again just Defends herself, Agatha, only ever defends herself in these arguments where she is insulted and I adore that. The fight ends because Lesso is hurt by Sophie horrendously enough I love that actually.
After this Sophie is sent to the Doom room Agatha freaks the f*** out and literally begs people to save Sophie from the Doom room and this moment in the movie is not good she ends up telling like going to Tedros like “why the f****** didn’t you stop the Wolves what the f*** are you” when you look the Wolves felt very like an afterthought. Basically, there was no Agatha being legitimately concerned about Sophie because the Doom room sounds exactly like it should and what it is.
The movie Doom room there is no Beast, it is Lesso, Lesso is the one who is in the Doom room and who is hurting the students in order to get them to fall in line basically become more evil in the way that the school wants them to be and I hate it not only is that so far out of Lesso character, it is just idiotic. The inclusion of the Beast in the Doom room not only adds so much when you factor in the fact that they were probably a good student who failed. It also allows that there is some separation of how evil the professors actually are versus what they produce with their actions. Sophie is brought down to the Doom room in the movie and Lesso is just like “you need to be controlled” and cuts her hair and leaves her there. what is that? There is no moment of Sophie being like truly evil there. And while I have had many thoughts about the Doom room scene in whether or not Sophie was attacking or defending I have come to the conclusion that Sophie was attacking the Beast. The Beast does not harm her. He cuts her hair but she was never in any true Danger. The Beast cuts her hair and then tells her to get out without the weapon in his hand. and Sophie killed him.
and that is a moment of like true and Pure Evil not just because she can't forgive him but just because she attacks him in the way that she does. She kills him because he cut her hair he does not harm her in any way other than emotional probably but from what is described as he is beat some of these other children relentlessly he could have done that to her he absolutely could cut up her face, all he does is cut her hair. that is all he does and she killed him for it.
The entirety of chapter 14 is essentially taken out because it is mostly just Agatha interacting with Sader’s works and trying to figure out what the answer to the riddle is. The Riddle barely important in the movie also this is when they go on the flower ground, With Yuba they go to the Garden of Good and Evil and it's another instance of like you know Sophie being terrible.
We also see more interaction between Agatha and Sophie after Sophie's hair is cut immediately after Sophie’s hair is cut in which she's probably at the lowest that she's ever been at other than like when her mother died and seeing realizing that her father was having an affair this is probably the lowest that she's been at in a and that is not addressed in the movie there is no scene between Agatha and Sophie and which Agatha is comforting her in this moment it's not there and it just is bad.
Chapter 15 is a hint of how close the ball is coming, Sophie being a little bit selfish, the adressing of the Beast being missing, Tedros being an a****** to Agatha and Sophie, Sophie being an a****** to Dot. Then after this, it's more Yuba with the glass coffin test in which Hort picks Sophie and Tedros almost picks Agatha but Agatha panics and switches coffins that is another instance of Tedros and Agatha being kind of pushed together by true love that we don't see in the movie like there is no buildup of their relationship in the movie outside a few awkward pieces of banter. This is also when Sophie begins to realize what the f*** is happening between them.
Chapter 16 is more henchmen specifically with Grimm and you miss all that like that's just not in the movie it none of this is in the movie there are so many parts in the book words like down time where it's the meal break and they're talking and it's just not in the movie.
Because we don't have Grimm also don't have any of Grimm going after Agatha which kind of ruins the foreshadowing of what truly what they are in their souls.
Sophie tries to use love spells in order to get Tedros to like her after a few embarrassing attempts . We see none of this in the movie the movie does not ever really build up the relationship between Sophie and Tedros or Sophie and Agatha or Agatha and Tedros, and it just really doesn't build anything up.
So chapter 17 is when Sophie begins to do her makeover deals it is only she only does that after Agatha says “show him the real Sophie” that is not featured in the movie it is yet another instance of Agatha and Sophie being very close and caring for each other that we miss.
Chapter 17 in itself I think is a very important chapter to Sophie's understanding of good and evil. It is particularly just all of it and like the movie takes this interaction and by including Hester and Anadil and Dot in these in like the sped-up version of this I think that they had a complete and utter misunderstanding of why Hester and Anadil act the way that they do in the during the the never ball where they're made to look beautiful by Sophie in that moment. It just I feel like the screenwriters didn't understand what was going on here. And then after this is when everything gets unlocked it is not Dovey and Lesso doing it, it is Yuba. The lack of the Blue Woods is directly connected with the lack of of Yuba and classroom scenes and I think that the movie failed to replace a lot of the interaction that we get between characters in these classrooms scenes with anything in the movie it just doesn't happen in the movie.
Because we don't see any of like the beautification for never scenes we also don't see kind of this doubt that Tedros is having in the moment where he is going back to how his father chose his mother in which she wasn't particularly beautiful but she was the one that would get him the most and that's what was important but also she left him for an ugly motherfucker, described in book 3 as ugly, not by me. So I think that because we remove a lot of this and just a bunch of Tedros’s character development, we miss so much.
We also don't see Sophie struggling with the classes at all because most of the classroom scenes are cut. We don't see Agatha actually doing very well in her classes because most of the classroom scenes are cut. And it is cut in a bad way. All of chapter 18 is cut because they don't have any of the classroom scenes they don't have any of the Agatha helping Sophie as she’s failing classes horrifically. We also miss out on the scene in which Tedros chooses Sophie for the first time because they just didn't want to include it I guess.
We completely cut Tedros and Sophie meeting in the blue Forest as foxes which just cuts all of like Agatha's realization that maybe she is good and she likes being a princess and she likes Tedros, you missed the entire scene that goes from to 279 to 281 and I hate it. Why would you not include that scene in which it shows that Agatha is actually truly good.
After this is when you get more of like Tedros really like not realizing anything but just being with Sophie and kind of throwing the school in the chaos. This is just not something that is taken so seriously in the movie I mean they go they jump right from like this idea to saying that the trial by tale is a challenge in the movie which is so stupid. It's something that happens every year and its well-established, it happens every year in the book but they looked at it and said “oh they're using it in the book to try and show that an ever and a never can work together I guess we are changing this entire thing”. So we just we miss out on how much of a threat the trial actually is in this moment because you have two whole schools that want to kill Sophie those threats are not present in the movie. The Trial by tale is literally just Sophie and Tedros and Agatha in the Blue Woods trying to survive that's it. Agatha is not mogrified in that moment she does not have a super fun reveal like she has in the book that is like devastating and terrifying, she just there.
By removing the chapter it also removes anything that kind of makes you feel for Hort because he's he's just a little guy he's just a little guy and they really don't get all of that in the movie in the movie he really comes off more as a shallow creep than he does like a little guy whose father is dead, whose father is dead and whose father has not been buried yet and who is in charge of getting his father buried in a good grave. He's a child and they do not manage to give him anything in the movie.
Because they completely removed the whole Nemesis plot line in the movie you also miss out on this moment in which Lesso is giving her the challenge to Sophie to kill herself (herself being a kind of phantom version of herself) in which she accidentally (panicked) turns a phantom version of herself into a chicken and kills it. This is something that I have always taken as a show of The Selfish acts that Sophie tends to lean towards more than anything else. We also miss out on interaction between the teachers about just how f***** up everything is specifically talking about Garrick and Bane and what happened to them when Garrick died in the trial and just like whether or not they're going to let Sophie be in the trial which is like valid concern. The professors are painfully aware that they ( the students) want to kill her this is where the Schoolmaster does have some influence on what is happening and I think this is what the screen screenwriters decided to pick up and run with because Sophie does not fail one challenge that she should be feeling she should not she should be failing all of these things and she's not. They took that and interpreted it as a Rafal is touching every single thing all the time. Which I'm not a fan of.
This is awesome moment in which we see Dovey being a little bit more than she is, in which Lesso is the grounded one and reminds them what the f*** is going to happen. Sader comes in and says that as long as the balance is intact and the teachers can agree that the balance is intact Sophie will compete and Lesso basically comes to the conclusion that “well hopefully she dies terribly and no one will ever do it again”.
and this is where I get to say that I hate the movie version of Lesso, I think making her devoted to the Schoolmaster was a mistake considering that the Schoolmaster forced her to abandon her child I think that giving her the storyline of they basically make her in to Evelyn Sader sucks because it removes like a level of control that Lesso has in the first book and completely ruined her character from here on out.
This is another instance of Agatha and Kiko being friends that has missed out on with the page 303 “any a boy can choose to be alone if he wants a girl ends up alone she might as well be dead” we don't get that interaction but we're also not getting near as much of Sophie needing Agatha in the movie as we do in the book The lead-up to the trial in the movie is basically just like sprinting to the end in the book it establishes that Sophie is still very much leaning on Agatha for support and protection the movie does not care.
Chapter 20 is another one that we just we don't get we don't get chapter 20 because we've cut the entire cockroach storyline for the sake of, I don't know bulshit, so Sophie tells Agatha what she overheard from the teachers and just how like all the s*** is going and just it's so it just is so much that we miss out on to the movie. And then we break into Tedros asking Sophie if she cheated before and she says “no I lost on purpose” and he's like “you f****** dumb ass they're going to kill you” and “you know what's done is done. just like be safe” I guess she's hoping for a kiss in that moment which you mother f***** no no. Immediately after that we we see extermination happening because of Agatha coming in as a roach and we also see that the other evil students are threatening Sophie they want to kill her during the trial. they're not included in the movie.
On page 311 we have Agatha kind of running around a little bit and she learns what a Seer is and figures out that Sader is a Seer and then Dovey confronts her about it after that it's just more interaction that we don't see between Tedros and other characters that just kind of ruined him as a complex character in the movie.
After that I mean the trial starts and Agatha is not there obviously because she's going to find a way to enter the thing in order to help Sophie trial by tell starts it is far more terrifying just because it is not just the three in the Blue Forest it is all of them in the blue forest and all of them want to f****** kill Sophie, all of them want to kill Sophie, so Sophie is trying to figure out where to go and then Agatha tells her what to do so they just they get through she gets through everything it's like some really terrifying Moments. I mean page 326 with the scarecrow's which has been reimagined into like some kind of stupid Reaper is terrifying and we just don't get that we don't get that. so Agatha is continuing to watch over Sophie as a bird not a person and everyone is trying to kill them everyone, everyone is trying to kill them they're trying so hard and then we hit page 334 and we see that Tedros is heavily under attack and Agatha tells Sophie to go to him and Sophie says “when the sun comes up” and it jumps into Hester threatening Tedros and Tedros rationalizing why Sophie isn't there with “she knows I'm safe to otherwise she'd be here to fight with me” he is obviously not safe in this moment Hester has a massive terrifying demon that is going to kill him and it really does like heavily try and kill him he barely manages to not be impaled by all of these various demon body parts Sophie does not once try and help him so what happens is Tedros almost gets stabbed and Agatha un-mogrifies and saves him and when Sophie turns back into a human all she can say is “I need clothes”. The movie fails to address this scene properly because it builds up their relationship is something huge but also the students in the movie Never interact with it. there is no;
“they did it!”
“they won!”
“Sophie and Tedros won!”
Bodies burst into the glen. Panicked, Agatha lit up her finger and her dove flew away just as the students flooded into view-
“ever and never!” shouted one
“witch and Prince!” shot of another
“all hail Sophie and Ted-”
The forest went quiet.
From a tree Agatha looked down at the unchosen Evers and Nevers surged in, then the Fallen competitors healed and cleaned by magic - all froze as they took in the scene.
Sophie cowering behind a bush. Tedros glaring down her eyes on fire.
And they knew there would never be peace.
Evers and Nevers shifted apart, enemies eternal.
Neither side could hear the laughter from the tower, half shadowed, lording over them all.
We did not get that scene in the movie and by not giving us that scene The relationship has no weight in the movie.
We do not get anything with the Nemesis, anything with Lady Lesso freaking out, we don't get Agatha's makeover we don't get the interaction between Agatha and Tedros post-trial except for like one or two things that take place in like the very last few chapters. We don't get to see the symptoms forming we don't get to see any of the attacks that are happening on the school for good. WE DO GET SHITTY BLOOD MAGIC THOUGH BECAUSE RAFAL HAD TO BE A MORE PRESENT VILLIAN. We don't get the circus and we don't get Agatha’ s Talent, we don’t get the students realizing how fucked they are, we don't get the the never we don't get Hester being like “it's done that wins”. By missing out on all of those things were missing out on like some heavy s*** with Agatha and her character development and her understanding of what she is and who she is and why she is the way that she is and Sophie just comes in and the ever ball and the never ball pretty much starts instantaneously in like kind of a shity way where they don't actually have a ball they just like enter the ever ball and get made pretty and Tedros gets like a few scars on his face and suddenly he's a terrible ugly in horrendous and no one would ever want to look at him.
We don't get chapter 29 with Agatha in the glass coffin we just don't get we don't get any of this like begging between Agatha and the nevers, Agatha and Sophie, or Agatha and Tedros. We don’t get any of Tedros trying to be a prince, basically we don't get any of this we just jumped right to Sophie being in the tower and the Schoolmaster being young and beautiful at his willy nilly choice. We don't get the scene between the Schoolmaster and Sophie and which Sophie says “but you're good and I'm evil” we don't get Grimm kind of pushing anything towards each other, we don't get Agatha desperately trying to get up to her, betraying the trust of her prince to do so. We get the kiss in the movie but the kiss is not built up to be like this hyper important thing that is happening in the story like it is in the book which is why the line line from 481;
“‘A kiss…’ the Schoolmaster whispered, ‘a kiss for never after.’”
It's so impactful in the moment because up until now we have heard so much about not so much but we've heard a decent deal about Never After to understand that like the villains who get that s*** high rank high rank. and also the kiss is terrifying in the book I mean he is withering away as he is kissing her and the minute that Sophie realizes that he is not beautiful, that he is pure and true evil, Agatha pulls her out of that Tower and they drop into the lake and then the Schoolmaster tries to kill so kill Agatha end it is not the storian itself trying to kill them for interacting it is the school Master holding the storian going to kill Agatha.
Sophie's sacrifices herself and this is one of the few times that we see Sophie actually break the rules in a way that can make you question whether or not she was evil (this is used in book two HEAVILY). The school Master is then confronted by Sader who allows the good brother to take over him and then they fight and he kills Rafal and then everything kind of like snaps off and the teachers are released everyone is realizing what has happened.
the line on 486 is specifical; “in front of them the children gathered around Sophie dying and Agatha's arms.” Which I think is a very impactful see specifically because of the words the children that is a reminder as to how young students are in that moment and then Agatha is holding Sophie and Sophie is dying and Agatha kisses Sophie and Sophie is brought back to life and in that moment everyone else understands what this is this is true love's kiss because the idea that true love's kiss is only ever prince and princess is something that can be challenged in the story.
However the movie takes the scene and decides that after this the schools can be United that their the schools are so perfectly fine now everything's fine everything's gorgeous everything's pretty there wasn't a massive battle there wasnt a lot of people that got hurt and it's not a choice for Agatha and Sophie to go through the portal they are just Zapped home that's it.
Agatha is the one who realizes what is happening and she says wait because she knows what she is found there and she is now being forced to abandon it because she, in the goodness of her heart, wanted to save her friend. That ending scene is quite reminiscent of Princess Uma that we are given in the third book in which she abandoned her prince and I think that the reality of what Agatha is done is apparent in the ending of the first book and in the next book but it becomes even worse when you are given the third book and you read Uma’s backstory.
So I didn't really like the movie I thought that there were some good bits some Salvage bits, but for the most part I really didn't enjoy it but I didn't hate the casting for the most part but I also didn't love it with certain characters, not like Hunger Games style hatred but more like there are plenty of plus-size actors they could have gone for. And the fact that they didn't was idiotic. Yeah I don't know it it was a movie I thought that it felt really bad just because we were missing a lot of like the obvious Exposition and the character development in the character interaction that happens in the books in favor of whatever the f*** they were trying to do. girlboss moment at the end where I get the kills the Schoolmaster was Terrible. It felt extremely patronising similar to like Marvel girlboss all the women Stand Together moment. but you know the movie didn't really understand how the books were subverting a lot of like the heteronormative society Vibes probably because the books were written by a gay man and the movies the movie was just bad the movies Vibes were bad
goodbye.
EDIT: The antisemitism in the movie is VILE. The books never once describe Sophie as anything other than an old hag. Reference pages:
Book One: 444, 461, 465, 469
Book Two: 422, 423
#the school for good and evil#tsfgae#sfgae#school for good and evil#school for good and evil movie#I hated it#the school for good and evil movie
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I think we should start a protection squad (although they don’t need it because they can protect themselves) for Sun Wukong and Guanyin
“Begone monkie kid fandom trying to down grade these really interesting characters with interesting personality’s and backstory ( the both of them like seriously Guanyin backstory is so cool) to a villain wile trying to justify your angsty backstory (that are no where near as cool as monkey who fights gods and Person who has 1000 arms and heads to help people in need) for the actual villain”
So who wants to join
Me:*raises my hand*
Ps: sorry if I got Guanyin backstory wrong am not an expert on it.
Haha okay so some critiques on the jttw & associated media western fandom & fandom in general coming up, so please skip this upcoming text wall if you don't want to encounter my undoubtedly ~devastating~ words (i.e. don't like don't read as people love to say, & if I have to be inundated with images of my notp every time I go into the sun wukong tag then I imagine people can be chill with me expressing my opinions & giving people fair warning that I WILL be critiquing common fandom trends, but no need for you to see that if you don’t want to. Cool? Cool.)
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PFFFFFTTT oh man there are many times when I feel like signing up for such a protection squad...when it comes to the current western jttw & Sun Wukong fandom I do feel like I'm often swinging at a rapid pace between "well it's fandom & people are allowed to make the stories they want" & "I am once again begging my fellow monkie kid enthusiasts (& sometimes creators) to do more research into the og classic/show it more respect so you can avoid any potentially offensive/off-the-mark misunderstandings of the status & cultural context of the characters in their country of origin (I promise it's super interesting & I can provide you with links to free pdf copies of the entire Yu translation, i.e. the best one ever created, so feel free to ask!) & maybe also stop constantly stripping away all the nuance of Sun Wukong's character for the sake of either making him an entire asshole so your little meow meow can look completely innocent in comparison and/or making the monkey king's entire life & character revolve around said meow meow."
Like I get that fandom's supposed to be a kind of anything-goes environment, but one thing that honestly seems to be true of a lot of fandoms--and the western one for Sun Wukong & co. is certainly not immune from this--is that there often seems to be a kind of monoculturalization at work in what stories are created & what character interpretations are made popular. Across a multitude of fandoms, you frequently see basically nothing but the exact same tropes being made popular & even being insisted on for the canonical work (especially hasty redemption arcs & enemies to lovers these days), the exact same one-dimensional character types that characters from an original work keep getting shoved into, the exact same story beats, etc. And I get it to an extent, as fandom is generally a space where people just make art and fic for fun & without thinking too hard about it & without any pressure.
This seems to, however, often unfortunately lead to the mentality that it’s your god-given right to do literally whatever you want with literally any cultural figure without even the slightest bit of thought put into their cultural, historical, and even religious context, even (and sometimes especially) when it comes to figures that are really important in a culture outside your own. For such figures--even if you first encounter them in a children’s cartoon--you should be a little more careful with what you do with them than you would with your usual Saturday morning line-up. It of course has to be acknowledged that there exists a whole pile of absolutely ridiculous & cursed pieces of media that are based on Journey to the West & that were produced in mainland China, but for your own education if nothing else I consider it good practice for those of us (myself certainly included) who aren’t part of the culture that produced JTTW to put more thought into how we might want to portray these characters so that at the very least (to pull some things I’ve seen from the jttw western fandom) we’re not turning a goddess of mercy into an evil figure for the sake of Angst(TM), or relegating other important literary figures into the positions of offensive stereotypes, or making broad claims about the source text & original characterizations of various figures that are blatantly untrue, or mocking heavenly deities because of what’s actually your misunderstanding of how immortality works according to Daoist beliefs. Yet while a lot of this is often due to people not even trying to understand the context these figures are coming from, I do want to acknowledge that the journey (lol reference) to understand even a fraction of the original cultural context can be a daunting one, especially since, as I’ve mentioned before, it can be really hard & even next to impossible to find good, accessible, & legitimate explanations in English of how, for example, the relationship between Sun Wukong and the Six-Eared Macaque is commonly interpreted in China & according to the Buddhist beliefs that define the original work.
That is to say, I do think it’s an unfortunate, if unavoidable, part of any introduction of an original text into a culture foreign to its own for there to be sometimes a significant amount of misinterpretation, mistranslations, and false assumptions. There is, however, a big difference between learning from your honest mistakes, & doubling down on them while dismissing all criticism of your misinterpretation into that abstract category of “fandom drama.” The latter attitude is kind of shitty at best and horrifically entitled at worst.
Plus, as I’ve discovered, there is a great deal of interest and joy to be drawn from keeping yourself open to learning aspects of these texts & figures that you weren’t aware of! I can say from my own experience that I’ve always really enjoyed & appreciated it when individuals on this site who come from a Chinese background--and who know much more about the cultural context of JTTW than me--have taken the time to explain its various aspects. It often leaves me feeling like woooooaaaahhhhhHHH!!!! as to how amazingly full of nuanced meaning JTTW is like dang no wonder it’s one of China’s Four Great Classical Novels.
And I guess that right there is the heart of a lot of my own personal frustration and disappointment with the ways that fandoms often approach a literary work or other piece of media...like don’t get me wrong, a lot of the original works a fandom may grow around are just straight-up goofy & everyone’s aware of it & has fun with it, yet the trend of approaching what are often nuanced and multi-layered works in terms of how well they fit and/or can be shoved into pretty cliche ideas of Redemption Arc or Enemies to Lovers or Hero Actually Bad, Villain Actually Good etc...well, it just seems to cheapen and even erase even the possibility of understanding the wonderful complexity or even endearing simplicity that made these works so beloved in the first place. Again, I feel like I need to make it clear that I’m not saying fandom should be a space where people are constantly trying to one-up each other with their hot takes in literary analysis, but it would be nice and even beneficial to allow room for commentary that strives to approach these works in a multi-faceted way, analysis & interpretations that go against the popular fandom beliefs, & criticism of the work or even of fandom trends (yes it is in fact possible to legitimately love something but still be critical of its aspects) instead of immediately attacking people who try to engage in such as just being haters who don’t want anyone to have fun ever (X_X).
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Anyway, I know I didn’t cover even half of the stuff you brought up in the first place anon, but I don’t want any interested parties to this post to suffer too long through my text wall lol. I was asked to try my hand at illustrating Guanyin, but as with you I’m nowhere near as informed as I should be about her, so I want to do more research on her history and religious importance before I attempt a portrait. I’ll try my best, and do plan to pair that illustration with my own outsider’s attempt to summarize her character. From what little I do know I am in full agreement that her backstory is so incredibly amazing...just the fact that she literally eschewed the bliss of Nirvana to help all beings reach it, and even split herself into pieces in the attempt to do so (with Buddha granting her eleven heads and a thousand arms as a result)...man, I can see why she’s such a beloved & respected deity.
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As for what western fandom commonly does with everyone’s favorite god-fighting primate...I can talk about this at length if there’s interest, but for this post I’ll just say that I guess one lesson from all of this is that for all the centuries that have passed since Journey to the West was first completed, literally no one drawing inspiration from the original tale in the west (lol) has come even slightly close to being able to equal or even capture half the extent of the nuance, complexity, religious, historical, and cultural aspects, and humor that define Wu Cheng'en's story of an overpowered monkey who defied even Buddha.
So thank the heavens we'll always have the original.
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Essential Avengers: Avengers #236: “I Want to Be an Avenger!”
October, 1983
Spider-Man -- An Avenger -- ?
Y’know, march of time and all that but this doesn’t seem as surprising as it once did.
Not much to say about this cover. It doesn’t have a lot to say about the issue other than ‘SPIDER-MAN INSIDE’ but boy does it say it.
But, oh, the logo changed and its snazzy! I quite like it!
So recent going-onses for the Avengers. Thor and Iron Man quit the team for personal business. Hawkeye broke his leg and is on medical forced-to-leave. Scarlet Witch and Vision were called in as reservists and Vision immediately got damaged by a crossover and has been in a robot-coma ever since. Starfox joined the team.
But in more positive news, they totally kicked the Wizard’s ass last issue and it cheered everyone up.
So the issue starts on a lazy summer day.
Scarlet Witch is on monitor duty, scanning for any ‘this looks like a job for the Avengers’ type calls. And multi-tasking by also thinking of her tubed husband.
Captain America takes his turn standing watch over the comatose synthezoid.
And for some reason, Cap leaning on the tube like that cracks me up.
Starfox spends his downtime trying to hit on Wasp.
His pickup line is so bad.
Wasp finds it charming in its misapprehension although it could also be the sexy beams Starfox emits from his brain.
And She-Hulk is taking a bath in a large barrel in the Avengers’ rec center, which they have. Maybe its the super hot bath?
She(-Hulk)’s also multi-tasking by looking up apartment listings while she soaks but finds that everything on the NY listings is either too small or too ritzy.
It be like that sometimes.
Jarvis comes into the rec center barrel bath area with iced tea for She-Hulk, trying to politely avert his eyes. But the intruder alarm goes off and she(-Hulk) tells Jarvis to hand her a towel and runs off to his flusterment.
Between Tigra and She-Hulk, I think poor Jarvis is getting overwhelmed with rad ladies on the Avengers.
The Avengers assemble in the main foyer and found that someone just barged in the front door and disabled the security tentacles with some sort of odd, artificial webbing.
Who could it be?
Who could possibly break into Avengers Mansion under the mistaken impression that its actually a cool way to impress them while asking for a job, showing that he’s learned nothing in years?
Could it be the person who expressed interest in joining in the previous issue? And who is also on the cover of this issue??
Yes.
Honestly, though, what an amazing splash page!
Also, spectacular and no-adjective.
Spider-Man knows how to make an impression.
Not a good one, certainly. But the Avengers aren’t going to forget the time he was casually chilling above the dining table.
And Pete isn’t going to forget it either. He’s going to wake up in a cold sweat years later still mortified at himself.
I also love it when the title of the issue is something someone said but since it has to be emphasized to make it clear its the title, they suddenly start yelling in the middle of a conversation.
She-Hulk has no patience for Spider-Man’s nonsense and grabs him off his web hammock to yell at him for barging in.
Spider-Man: “Well, I’m not exactly uninvited! Your buddy Thor asked me to join the club just a few months ago. Sure, I’m a little slow in replying, but I’ve had a busy season!”
And then he snarks about She-Hulk just wearing a towel because Spider-Man loves low hanging fruit.
SURELY, Spidey knows that offers usually expire, right? A few months ago is forever in comic time and Thor himself isn’t even on the Avengers right now.
I guess, in fairness, he has his reasons.
Besides his usual perpetual poverty liking the sound of a thousand bucks a week.
As he later muses to himself, Black Cat has been hospitalized because she tried to help him and he feels obligated to pay for her not-cheap medical bills. And he’s already quit grad school to spend more time earning but his freelance paychecks are nothing compared to an Avengers salary.
He’s being an incredibly presumptuous dick... but for a good cause.
And its just like Spidey that he has a good reason for being a jerk that he’d never mention leaving everyone to think he’s just a rude goofus.
What a shame.
Anyway, back at the present, Spider-Man asks where he enlists but Cap tells them that unfortunately their roster is full up. The sixth spot is being held open for Hawkeye when his leg stops being broken (and you think he was moany about being sidelined while his leg was broken, imagine him learning that he was replaced, eesh).
Cap does suggest that Spider-Man could join Starfox in the trainee program but Spidey throws a fit.
Spider-Man: “Trainee program?!? Hey, I’m Spider-Man, remember? I was sticking to walls when you guys were still looking for a clubhouse. I’m no green rookie!”
Starfox: “Green -- ? I take offense at your tone, Spider-Man!”
She-Hulk: “There’s nothing wrong with being green.”
Pffft.
As an actual rookie who is physically green, She-Hulk doesn’t care for that phrase, maybe.
She-Hulk and Starfox possibly beating up or more likely being embarrassed by Spider “will punk the entire X-Men in the not too distant future” Man is interrupted by a priority alert that goes ARROOOOOOOO
... Is it the Nixon alarm?
Why haven’t the Avengers fought Nixon’s head on a war mech yet??
Spider-Man offers to give them a hand if their priorities are being alerted but with this particular alarm, Wasp decides its best if they stick to the rules.
And then She-Hulk chases Spidey out by throwing a chair at him.
Spider-Man: Well, that was certainly a wash-out! Maybe I shouldn’t have come on as such a wise guy... Maybe I should have come to the door all humble and contrite. Nah, they wouldn’t have believed it was me!
.... Hah.
But he sees the third-floor of Avenger’s mansion opening up to launch the Quinjet and fount of good decision making that he is, he decides to jump onto the Quinjet as it launches.
Spider-Man: Whew! This baby is really starting to pick up speed! I feel like I’m in a wind tunnel. My sticky fingers can hold onto just about anything under normal circumstances... boy, I wish these were normal circumstances! I wonder if this was such a good idea.
No, Pete, it wasn’t.
But your inner monologues do add a bit more joy to this issue so I forgive you.
Inside the Quinjet, She-Hulk notes that the controls handled a bit sluggish right after take-off but eh whatever the problem disappeared after they went supersonic.
Huh. I wonder if Pete is ok.
Anyway, Captain America, She-Hulk, and Starfox are headed towards Project Pegasus.
Since it hasn’t come up in Avengers yet, Project Pegasus is a government research facility that seeks out new types and sources of energy. And Cap helped organize their security force back in Marvel Two-in-One #42.
The priority alert wasn’t the highest priority. Just a code-five, indicating a low-grade emergency. But it didn’t come with any details so Cap is vexed.
Three Avengers should be enough for a code-five but problems at Project Pegasus tend to balloon into worse problems.
You wouldn’t think a research facility would attract so much negative attention but as Cap points out, there’s a lot of people who have a vested interested in making sure energy stays scarce, expensive, and presumably non-renewable.
And considering that the oil companies like Roxxon are EVEN MORE BLATANTLY EVIL in the Marvel U, yeah, uh, bad shit is going to occur.
Also, Project Pegasus doubles as a place to jail supervillains so their powers can be studied.
So, yeah, Pegasus having a priority alert probably means a headache.
So these three Avengers are going in but Wasp and Scarlet Witch are on stand-by just in case.
The visit to the super secure research station goes off to a bad start when guards rush the Quinjet when it lands because a foreign object was detected on the undercarriage.
Of course it’s Spider-Man.
But before he can be arrested for breaking into a secure facility, his spider-sense buzzed.
It’d be a bit confusing if it wasn’t buzzing before though. He has a bunch of rattled guards pointing guns at him right after some unexplained emergency has happened.
That doesn’t set off the Peter Tingle at all??
Anyway, since the buzz is pretty intense, he figures that its warning him of something “a lot more dangerous than the lecture Cap’s going to give me!”
Hah!
He doesn’t manage to warn anyone before a tremor knocks (almost) everyone off their feet with a THROOM
Spider-Man is still standing because he loves Elton John forewarned is forewarned and he can stick to things. And to his surprise, Cap manages to stay on his feet.
Cap: “It’s just a matter of knowing how to react and how to brace yourself, Spider-Man.”
Hah!
That’s So Cap.
Spider-Man asks if he realio trulio can’t give Cap a hand with this situation. Y’know, since his spider-sense probably will come in handy. Cap isn’t sure because of the question of security but Spider-Man has an idea there.
See, he’s been here before!
In Marvel Team-Up Annual #5 he helped save the dang place! They can ask chief of security Wendell Vaughn (who is also known as Quasar but probably not to all the people in this scene?).
Unfortunately, Vaughn quit a couple months back. Oops.
But since Cap vouches for him the guard driving them to the lower levels is like ‘eh whatever.’
The power of a Cap vouch is not to be underestimate and never to be used for evil.
They’re headed to the thermal research dome because its the last known location of new security chief O’Brien. And where he sent the alert from. AND where the recent quake came from.
That’s good multitasking.
They reach the blast doors sealing off the entire level.
Because yes, not only did O’Brien send an alert, he also sealed off the entire level and now something’s jammed the lock.
They have no idea what could be locked behind there but they do have a Spider-Man and Starfox asks him if he’s getting a bad feeling about anything.
Spider-Man isn’t getting any bad vibes, deeming it safe to go inside.
Y’know, this is an amazing way to use Spider-Sense that they could do more with. I always love it when Spidey basically exploits the sense for things other than combat dodging.
Like when trying to figure out how to turn off a device he didn’t understand in Avengers EMH, he just went around almost yanking wires until he found one that didn’t set off the ‘OH MY GOD YOU’LL DEFINITELY EXPLODE IF YOU DO THAT’ buzz.
Anyway, it being probably safe, Cap tells She-Hulk and Starfox to open the door.
Which they do, with gusto.
And a GRU-U-UNNG
Inside the ruins of the thermal research dome, a bunch of semi-conscious technicians lie about in heaps.
Some Project Pegasus security personnel fan out to do administer first aid while the Avengers look for O’Brien.
Makes sense. The nameless extras help the nameless extras so we don’t go ‘hey are the Avengers dicks for only talking to people with names?’
O’Brien is pinned under an arc of steaming rock which Cap starts chipping in half with his shield while She-Hulk, Spider-Man, and Starfox - all people who could lift that rock - just stand and watch.
Or heck, maybe its not supposed to be a random rock arc. Maybe its attached to the floor. Still though, She-Hulk, Spider-Man, and Starfox could probably break it more easily than Cap does.
Teamwork makes the dream work, guys and She-Hulk.
Spider-Man recognizes O’Brien’s green and also green Not-Iron Man armor from newspapers and realizes that he’s the Guardsman.
That just makes O’Brien sad.
Guardsman: “Aye, I am... or I was. The state this armor’s in, no one’ll ever be callin’ himself the Guardsman again! As of now, I’m just plain Michael O’Brien.”
The Michael Formerly Known as Guardsman starts to Explain It All.
He had come down to the thermal dome to watch the thermal dome researchers sink a new magma tap.
But molten rock came shooting up from the tap hole, which is a thing that’s definitely not supposed to happen.
Oh, and some molten men (but not Molten Man) climbed out of the hole and started trashing the joint.
Plain Michael O’Brien realized pretty quickly that he was the only one who could stand up to these hot men so he signaled for help, hit the evacuation alarm, and sealed off the level from the rest of the project so the problem was contained.
And then he got mobbed by the hot men and got his ass kicked. Turns out that his armor was pretty useless against lava men.
Oh, yeah, Cap recognizes them as lava men from his description.
Spider-Man: “Lava men? You have to be kidding, Cap! Lava men? I don’t believe in lava men!”
Cap: “Belay that, mister! I’ve been up against lava men -- and they’re nothing to joke about! You’d better thank your stars that they left -- !”
You might also remember that Cap has been up against lava men allllllll the way back in Avengers #5. Technically the first adventure he had with the Avengers after officially joining them.
It was also the issue where Thor stoically sank into lava without changing his expression from his default vaguely annoyed one.
Anyway, O’Brien tells the Avengers that the lava men battered their way into the maintenance section since they couldn’t escape to the rest of the facility.
It’s a real good news bad news situation because there’s no one for them to hurt in there and also its a straight shot into the nuclear research dome.
And we don’t want any kind of meltdown there.
Cap decides that this looks like a job for AVENGERS to ASSEMBLE towards. And more than the three plus special guest star they already have.
MEANWHILE, over in New Orleans at an important meeting that definitely would be bad to interrupt, Monica Rambeau (secretly the Avenger known as Captain Marvel but not the dead guy version, true believers) is applying for a small business loan.
And then she gets a bzzt on her radio watch for an Avengers emergency.
Oh no, what of her small business loan!
And also: what small business is she starting? I think I heard at one point that she ran a fishing business with her father?
But what of her small business loan!
Well, Monica agrees with her bank guy Mr. Hillbee that its an alarm watch and that its reminding her of another pressing engagement so hey is there a lot more that they have to do here?
Luckily, all that’s left is for her to sign the documents.
Phew, I’m very used to superhero stuff interrupting a superhero’s civilian life and then them angsting about it. It’s actually a relief that Monica was able to finish up at the bank before dashing off to a phone booth to take a radio watch call with Scarlet Witch.
Wanda tells Monica that they just received a call from Cap(tain America) telling them to get to Project Pegasus. Wanda tells Monica that they’re in transit now and asks if she can join them.
And then the line goes dead before Wanda can give coordinates.
Because Monica just followed the radio signal back to the Quinjet.
She apologizes that it took her so long (!!) because she had to stop at home first to pick up her costume.
Wanda marvels captainly “And I thought my brother, Pietro, was fast!”
Ha ha amazing.
I love Captain Monica Marvel’s ridiculous powerset.
She’s even talking right into their radio so she can communicate from outside the Quinjet.
Wasp, Scarlet Witch, and Captain Marvel arrive at Project Pegasus where they’re briefed of the lava men situation by some of the security staff.
Captain Marvel nyooms ahead lightspeed dash style while Wasp and Scarlet Witch lag behind by taking a high-speed railcar.
Dang, Project Pegasus is big.
I just flipped ahead pages to see how long it takes Captain Marvel to join Cap(tain America)’s group and its a bit.
I guess maybe there’s some overlapped time going on though.
Meanwhile, two technicians in research dome D-2 (called the Compound for some dang reason) ignore all the various alarms and such that have been happening because they’re super into their project. And are possibly mad scientists.
They have the intensity.
But they’re working on... Dr. Croit’s stabilizer? And apparently its vibratory pitch was changed by the tremor that happened? Unbeknowst to them, Captain Marvel just nyoomed by outside and the proximity of her energy form activates the device and the silhouette of some guy leaps out proclaiming FREE!!
Back at the Avengers side of the plot, Cap(tain America)’s group has encountered some lava men.
Spider-Man: “Hey, Cap... I take it all back! I do believe in lava men! I really do!”
Hah.
The lava men are between the Avengers and the nuclear dome so Cap starts thinking of ways to flank them so they can keep them away from it.
She-Hulk starts trying to plow a hole through their forces and... uh.... ok. Cap has Starfox just fly around and annoy the lava men because they’ve never seen a flying man before and its just freaking them out.
Really.
Cap asks Spider-Man to use his webbing to throw up some barriers in the lava men’s path.
Spider-Man: “Heck, I can do better than that, Cappy! Just a couple spritzes of webbing, and these little hotheads won’t be going anywhere for hours!”
Cap: “No, you young fool! Don’t you see what you’ve done!”
Throwing web on the lava men makes them panic because it seems like there’s a lot of stuff that they’re not familiar with and all of it alarms them. When they’re alarmed, their body temperature raises and can get up thousands of degrees.
So they just melt loose of the webbing and now they’ve learned not to be afraid of the webbing at all and they can’t use it to corral them.
Spider-Man: “Would it help if I said I’m sorry?”
Cap: “It would help if you’d follow orders! The Avengers is a team! If you want to be part of the team, act like it! Otherwise, stay out of our way!”
Yeahhhhh. I mean, most of the time. You have your fair share of idiots doing their own thing in the Avengers because all of these guys have egos you wouldn’t believe. But generally they can agree to work as a team.
And Spider-Man, of this era, isn’t much of a team player. Not like Wolverine or Batman ‘i work best alone, bub’ type of not a team player where they’re lying about not being good at teamwork because they like being surly and dour because they think it makes them more interesting. But Spider-Man mostly works alone and is used to just doing whatever he thinks the best idea is. And he has the proportionate speed and reflexes of a spider so he can do whatever he thinks the best idea is way before you can tell him its a bad idea.
That’s why Spider-Man makes so many bad decisions, because he can make them faster than good sense can catch up [citation needed].
Anyway, as he is NOW, he’s not a good fit for the Avengers.
Then again, neither was Hawkeye and they let him join. Makes ya think.
Back over at surprise man out of a box lab, the surprise man was Blackout.
He looks like he’d be an electricity themed villain but apparently his element is darkness. Annd he debuted in Nova annnd this is his second appearance?
At the end of his debut story Nova #19, Blackout was apparently sucked into the Darkforce dimension, a fate that Dr. Croit’s stabilizer had been invented to prevent.
So I guesss.... the stabilizer’s settings were altered by an earthquake and then it was powered by ambient energy from Captain Marvel zipping past and it managed to stabilize Blackout, yanking him free of the Darkforce dimension?
I guess??
As far as villain returns go, its not the most ridiculous but it is a bit contrived.
Blackout has no idea where he is and rants about how he’ll level the place if that’s what it takes to find his way out and in a more acceptable contrivance, he happens to be passing Moonstone’s cell when he says this out loud to nobody in particular and she likes the cut of his jib.
Moonstone: “Sounds like you’re a man after my own heart!”
Moonstone tells Blackout that she’s been locked up here so Project Pegasus could study her powers and that they want to use her the way they would have used Blackout but hey what if they join forces and get some comeuppance.
Blackout: I don’t know if I should trust her... But something about her voice is so reassuring.
Yeah, that’s what we call a red flag, you dingus.
Are we back to the days where some dudes will just villain because a lady bats her eyes?
Anyway, the locking mechanism is too complicated to figure out so Blackout just squeezes it until it explodes.
Um. Okay.
-checks wiki-
The wiki says he’s only supposed to have normal human strength but Blackout himself claims that his body is a living generator of black star energies.
Which apparently means he can squeeze an electronic lock to death. I dunno.
Freed from her cell, Moonstone leads Blackout to what they can do next.
Meanwhile, the Avengers are still struggling with the lava men two levels below. And the fracas has reached the corridor to the nuclear dome. Its now or never but the numbers are too overwhelming even for She-Hulk.
Spider-Man manages to leap above the fray and get forgotten in the confusion but doesn’t find that he can do much. He tries webbing the door to the nuclear dome shut but the lava men don’t even bother opening it when they can melt through.
Hmmmmm not a good showing for a guest starring so far...
When the lava men succeed in melting through the door, a blinding light shines through and the lava men kneel down and start bowing to it.
Ohhhhhh, I get it! They’re not trying to cause a meltdown! They just want to worship nuclear light!
... No? I don’t got it? Okay.
The bright light is actually Captain Marvel who took a shortcut to the nuclear dome to reach the Avengers.
And the lava men are really enamored with her, proclaiming her the lady of light foretold in legends.
Captain Marvel just kinda rolls with this and asks them whats the deal with all the rampaging and destroying.
Lava man: “We did but strike back, radiant one! Our village, deep beneath the Earth, knew peace -- until the surface men bored into our midst with their machines. We could not allow this attack to go unanswered. We only used our powers to stop the invasion!”
Wait, isn’t this the plot of the Jetsons movie?
Cap(tain America) smoothly slides in, diplomatically, to announce that then the surface people beg forgiveness and that this has all been an unfortunate misunderstanding that he pledges shall be put right.
And like how Cap’s clout got Spider-Man into this story, Cap borrows Captain Marvel’s clout to back up his diplomacy roll, saying “The Lady-of-Light will tell you that I speak the truth!”
It’s a good thing that Monica wouldn’t go mad with power.
Also, Scarlet Witch and Wasp show up, while Spider-Man snarks that they “missed the end of the movie.”
But since we can’t have pat resolutions given the subplot that was happening while the Avengers were distracted elsewhere, in the Compound, it turns out that Blackout and Moonstone have freed Electro and Rhino. And Moonstone has a Big Evil Plan.
Blackout: “Pay them back? Yes... yes, we must. But how?”
Moonstone: “In the best way possible! We’re going to bring this place to its knees -- by seizing the nuclear research dome!”
But that’s where the Avengers are! Silly villains, you’ve double booked!
Also, I wonder if the universe cosmically influenced Moonstone to get two Spider-villains involved on the one day that Spider-Man was tagging along.
I also wonder what Moonstone is thinking. She’s the ‘know when to fold ‘em’ villain.
Hmmm... Putting Electro and Blackout side by side makes Blackout look like Electro’s grumpy younger brother.
All kinds of good decisions have been made!
Follow @essential-avengers for more thoughts on villain couture. Also like and reblog so I can feel like I did a good job.
#avengers#lava men#Spider Man#Captain America#She Hulk#Starfox#the Wasp#Scarlet Witch#Captain Marvel#Monica Rambeau#essential avengers#essential marvel liveblogging
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Hey I'm sorry to ask, but do you have updates for korean dramas? I can't find the link to your old one but also maybe some newer suggestions? (It's okay if you don't!)
It’s cool, I can do a new one! These are all in the order that I watched them in!
WARNING: LONG POST AHEAD
1. Coffee Prince ( A great choice for a first k-drama)
Choi Han-gyul is the grandson of chairwoman Bang of Dong-in Foods, a company that has a thriving coffee business. He has never had a job and does not care for responsibility. Han-gyul is hung up on his first love, Han Yoo-joo, who only sees him as a friend. Go Eun-chan is a 24-year-old tomboy who is often mistaken for a guy. Her father died when she was 16 years old and since then she has taken over as the breadwinner in her family. When Han-kyul and Eun-chan meet, he, not knowing that she is a girl, decides to hire her to pretend to be his gay lover so that he can escape the blind dates arranged by his grandmother.
2. Cinderella with four knights
Eun Ha Won is a bright college student who dreams of becoming a teacher. Unfortunately, she loses her mother in a tragic accident, moves in with a cruel stepmother, and has no money for her education. One day, she helps an old man and as fate would have it, moves into a gorgeous mansion with three equally gorgeous men, who also happen to be billionaire cousins and heirs to the Kang family fortune. Between the rebel-minded loner Kang Ji Woon, playboy money machine Kang Hyun Min and the super-sweet singer Kang Seo Woo, Eun Ha Won finds herself in the middle of the hottest love quadrangle to ever befall a modern fairy tale princess. Rounding out the mansion’s chaebol lifestyle are Lee Yoon Sung, who serves as the cousins’ handsome bodyguard, and Park Hye Ji, a gorgeous girl who has her own interests in the Kang family and is not above manipulating one cousin to get closer to another.
3. Bride of the century
Taeyang Group is the largest conglomerate in South Korea. The Choi family who runs Taeyang has supposedly been under a curse for a hundred years that the first bride of the eldest son will always die. When the wealthy heiress Jang Yi-kyung disappears right before her wedding to chaebol heir Choi Kang-joo , Na Doo-rim , a lookalike impostor, is brought in to take her place. Unlike the cold and calculating Yi-kyung, Doo-rim is sweet and sunny, and Kang-joo genuinely falls in love with her. As the wedding plans progress, Kang-joo and Yi-kyung’s mothers both scheme and plot behind the scenes will the romance gets more complicated with the secret of not being the real Jang Yu-kyung.
4. Strong woman Do Bong Soon
Do Bong-soon was born with superhuman strength. Her strength is hereditary and passed along only to the women in her family. Her dream is to create a video game with herself as the main character. She desperately wants to become a delicate and elegant woman, which is the ideal type of her crush, In Guk-doo, a police officer. Thanks to her strength, she gets a job as bodyguard to rich heir Ahn Min-hyuk, the CEO of a gaming company, Ainsoft. In contrast to Guk-doo, Min-hyuk is an eccentric man who is playful, a little spoiled, has no regard for rules, and dislikes policemen. He has recently received anonymous threats and has even been stalked, leading him to hire Bong-soon as his bodyguard after seeing her beat up a bunch of men after they threatened an old man who was an elementary school bus driver. A series of kidnapping cases soon happen in Dobong-dong, the district Bong-soon lives in, and she is determined to catch the culprit, who targeted her best friend. With help and training from Min-hyuk, she manages to control her strength to use it for good causes. Min-hyuk and Bong-soon find their relationship growing into something more.
5. My secret romance
Jin-wook and Yoo-mi meet at a Gangwon-do resort and get caught up in a series of misunderstandings and accidents. Yoo-mi is there to attend her mother’s second wedding while Jin-wook is there working as a bellhop (a position given to him by his Chairman father to teach him responsibility.) Yoo-mi is charmed by Jin-wook’s sly and playful personality, and they unexpectedly spend the night together. However, Yoo-mi disappears in the morning, leaving Jin-wook feeling perplexed and insulted. Three years later, the two meet again when Yoo-mi becomes a nutritionist at the company cafeteria where Jin-wook works. It seems that once a playboy Jin-wook, has given up his carefree life and works at the company owned by his father. He has feelings for Yoo-mi and has kept her bra-pad as a memory of the night that they spent together. At first, he is strict toward her, though it is only because he is looking for reasons to be near her. He later confesses this to her and agrees to wait for her.
6. Scarlet heart ryeo ( One of my all time favourites)
During a total solar eclipse, a 25-year-old 21st-century woman, Go Ha-jin, is transported back in time to the Goryeo Dynasty. She wakes up in the year of 941 in the body of Hae Soo, among the many royal princes of the ruling Wang family. She initially falls in love with the gentle and warm-hearted 8th Prince Wang Wook, and later Wang So, the fearsome 4th Prince who hides his face behind a mask and is given the derogatory label of “wolf dog.” As the story develops, Hae Soo finds herself unwittingly caught between the rivalry and politics among the princes over the fight for the throne, an she stay alive long enough for a happy ending?
7. Falling for innocence
Min Ho is a cold-blooded corporate raider who takes no prisoners. He is a scoundrel investment banker for Gold Investment, seemingly the world’s largest financial service firm. As a cynical, self-defensive, suspicious sociopath, he wears down people with his tenacity and takes advantage of them with his delusions of grandeur. However, Min Ho has his own story of how he became evil - it was because of his uncle’s betrayal. His father was overthrown by his uncle and it caused his family to hit bottom. As Min Ho vows to get revenge, he meets Soon Jung, the daughter of his father’s former secretary who betrayed him and whom now works for his uncle. One day, he has a heart attack and is taken to a hospital. He miraculously survives his heart attack after undergoing a heart transplant. His heart is actually from Dong Wook, a young detective and Soon Jung’s fiancé who suffered from brain damage from a mysterious car accident. After receiving a new life thanks to the new heart, he is no longer the cold and callous person that he has been and undergoes a profound change to his personality, talking differently and warming up people. But he still pursues his plan to get revenge on his uncle even though his emotions get in the way at times. He gradually learns the meaning of happiness when he finds Soon Jung, whom he wants to cherish and protect. His heart becomes tender and his eyes swell with tears when as he works with her. He falls in love with her without realising it.
8. The bride of Habaek / the water god
When the narcissistic water god Ha-baek visits earth in order to find three stones powerful enough to help him claim his throne, he seeks out the help of his servant and destined bride, psychiatrist So-ah, whose family is fated to serve the water god for generations. The problem is that she has no belief in the gods and initially mistakes him for suffering from delusions. Things get even stranger when the wind god Bi-ryeom, the water goddess Mu-ra, and the semi-god Hu-ye show up to complicate things
9. Weightlifting fairy Kim Bok Joo
Kim Bok-Joo is a promising collegiate female weightlifter. Her father runs a small chicken restaurant and her uncle wants to become an actor. She has a bright personality and strong sense of justice. Kim Bok-Joo and her friends on the female weightlifting team are not popular with the guys and they don’t have boyfriends. The weightlifting team and the rhythmic gymnastic team also don’t get along at all. Meanwhile, Jung Joon-Hyung is a collegiate swimmer plagued with numerous false start disqualifications. He is 21-years-old and has a free spirit. His uncle and aunt raised him along with his cousin Jung Jae-Yi. One day on campus, Kim Bok-Joo bumps into Jung Joon-Hyung while he is riding his bicycle. Her face looks familiar to Jung Joon-Hyung. After he leaves, Kim Bok-Joo picks up a handkerchief left behind by Jung Joon-Hyung. The handkerchief is very important to him and he begins looking for it. Later, Kim Bok-Joo cleans and irons the handkerchief. She goes to the school’s swimming pool and gives back his handkerchief, but he explodes with anger when he sees that she cleaned it. Kim Bok-Joo then falls into the swimming pool and Jung Joon-Hyung jumps into the pool to save her. At that moment, Kim Bok-Joo and Jung Joon-Hyung realize where they have seen each other before. When they were both children, Kim Bok-Joo saved Jung Joon-Hyung’s life by catching him before he fell to the ground.What happens now they know each other?
10. I’m not a robot
Kim Min-kyu lives an isolated life due to a severe allergy to other people. He develops extreme rashes that rapidly spread throughout his body once he makes any form of skin contact. Jo Ji-ah is a woman who is trying to make it in life by creating her own businesses. Kim Min-kyu who owns the KM Financial company which owns Santa Maria team headed by professor Hong Baek-kyun. Professor Hong’s team has created a humanoid robot called Aji 3 which looks like his ex-girlfriend Jo Ji-ah. CEO of KM Financial, Kang Ki-young, and his father try to sell the Santa Maria team to foreign investor, Martin, who secretly knows about the Aji 3 and wants to use it as a weapon. Hong Baek-kyun sends the robot to Kim Min-kyu to convince him not to sell the team. Before Aji 3 is delivered, the robot’s body is accidentally damaged. Hong Baek-kyun approaches Jo Ji-ah, asking her to pose as the robot, giving the team time to repair Aji 3. Jo Ji-ah agrees, and impersonates the robot under the supervision of the Santa Maria team and the robot’s computer brain, can she survive without being caught out?
11. Goblin / Guardian the lonely and great
Kim Shin is a goblin and protector of souls. He is the landlord of the grim reaper, who is in charge of taking deceased souls. Wanting to end his immortal life, Shin has been looking for his human bride, the only person who can end his life. Meanwhile, Ji Eun-tak is a high school student who remains optimistic despite the tragedies and difficulties she has experienced in her life. She summons the goblin by chance, and through various encounters, ends up falling in love with him. Sunny is a chicken restaurant owner, whose beauty is undeniable, but what has she got to do with the goblin and reaper? These four characters’ lives took a series of twists and turns when they intertwined.
12. Terius behind me (Another favourite!)
Go Ae-Rin suddenly loses her husband left to take care of her two children on her own. A mysterious man, Kim Bon, that lives next door ends up getting tangled into their lives. Kim Bon is a legendary NIS agent and 3 years ago, he was involved in a failed secret operation and the woman he loved died. He has since become disconnected with the world and lives alone quietly but that soon changes as he helps his neighbor Go Ae-Rin with her children and uncover a conspiracy, which her husband became involved with all the while trying to keep his secrets by the nosy neighbours in the building.
13. 100 days my prince
Lee Yool is the Crown Prince of Joseon, a perfectionist who disregards the majority of those in the royal palace and appears to be cold and demanding, when in reality, he is lonely. He then passes the law that all women must marry before they reach the age of 28. Hong Shim is head of the first detective agency in Joseon, a strong, intelligent figure who takes on multiple jobs to support herself and her father. She is also the oldest unmarried woman in her village, and begins to look for a husband to avoid trouble from law officials. In an attempted assassination, Lee Yool develops temporary amnesia and wanders around aimlessly as a commoner with no name or identity, until he meets none other than Hong Shim, who takes him under her care. Hong Shim is then forced to marry Won Deuk to save her village from drought, due to beliefs in that era where natural disasters are a result of an unmarried woman’s misery. This drama depicts how the love story of Hong Shim, ‘Joseon’s oldest unmarried woman’ and Lee Yool, the amnesiac Crown Prince, develops over the span of 100 days.
14. My ID is Gangnam beauty
Kang Mi-rae decides to get plastic surgery after years of being bullied because of her looks. Her “rebirth” seems successful at first, but as her life at the university unfolds, her plan starts to backfire. The pressure of being a “pretty girl” begins to pressure her and, worse, those who can see through her surgery ridicule her and tag her as the “Gangnam plastic surgery monster.” The drama follows Mi-rae’s story of recovering self-esteem as she figures out what a two faced friend is and gets to know her coursemate, and former schoolmate in middle school, Do Kyung-seok
15. The secret life of my secretary
Do Min-Ik works as a director of the mobile media 1 team at T&T, he’s smart and excellent at his job however he doesn’t like to attach himself to people or his secretary. His secretary is Jung Gal-Hee, a diligent and motivated person that does whatever it takes to keep her job and feed her family. Do Min-Ik often does childish things like calling Jung Gal-Hee continually, Jung Gal-Hee carries out Do Min-Ik’s orders without complaints but though she may look soft, she hides her tough side. The tough side soon comes out as she is fired, much to Do Min-Ik’s regret he soon discovers that he’s going to need her more than ever and discovers a new side to her in the process.
16. W - Two worlds ( Really recommended!! )
A love story of two people split apart in different worlds connected by a webtoon. The series focuses on the eponymous fictional webtoon entitled W, written and illustrated by its legendary author and illustrator Oh Seong-moo. W became famous in the entire South Korea, the storyline of the webtoon W starts with the younger years of its main character Kang Chul, a handsome and intelligent boy who is also skilled in shooting. He becomes famous as he won a shooting competition during the 2004 Athens Olympics but this fame gets ruined when his entire family was killed by an unknown Murderer, and then framed for it. Another villain Han Cheol-ho handles the case to gain political popularity, pronouncing in court to impose death penalty upon Kang Chul. Nevertheless, Kang Chul was deemed innocent of the crime. Depressed over losing his family, he attempts to commit suicide over the Han River but he stops himself and chooses to move on with his life.Ten years later, Kang Chul becomes a multimillionaire, starting his “Project W” in his continuous efforts to catch the real culprit behind his family’s death; part of the project is his television broadcasting company dubbed “W,” after the initials of the interrogatives “who” and “why” (hence, the title of the webtoon). One night, he receives a suspicious phone call and gets severely injured by the same mysterious Murderer at the rooftop of his penthouse, only to be saved by a mysterious girl, none other than the authors daughter. How did she get there? Why is she there? How will they become entangled?
17. My contracted husband Mr Oh
Han Seung-Joo (Uee) is a single woman in her mid 30’s who works as a PD at a broadcasting station. She does well at her job, but is not nearly as good when it comes to housework. Han Seung-Joo has a hard time dealing with social prejudices about single women but still refuses to marry at least until an incident that occurs leading to a dramatic change in her life. She seeks to find a husband thinking it would help her situation but to get the position of a “married woman,” Han Seung-Joo marries Oh Jak-Doo as a contract husband who lives in the mountain that she just happened to own. Their marriage is not based on love, but their relationship develops romantically after several twists and turns.
18. Marriage contract ( For those who love to cry, seriously heartbreak ahead )
Kang Hye-soo is a single mother who struggles to raise her daughter while paying off her late husband’s debts. Han Ji-hoon is the son of a chaebol who seeks a contract marriage in order to save his mother, who needs a liver transplant. When Hye-soo is diagnosed with an inoperable brain tumor, she agrees to marry Ji-hoon and donate part of her liver to his mother, in exchange for enough money to provide for her daughter until she reaches adulthood. Han Ji-Hoon is driving along when Hye-Soo is almost hit saving her 7 year old daughter Eun-Seong, He rushes her to the hospital as she faints however while she is being tested the Manager of the restaurant Han Ji-Hoon owns Ho-Joon tells him might be a scam and to make sure she is really hurt. Han Ji-Hoon has Hye-Soo’s phone and receives a call from a mysterious man which turns out to be the debt collector who comes to the hospital after hearing it being said in the background. He chases Hye-Soo when she is leaving, where he almost catches her but she in the end hides in Han Ji-Hoon’s car with Eun-Seong. Han Ji-Hoon’s mother has been rushed to the hospital where they find out that if she doesn’t get a liver transplant she will die but she is way down on the list so Han Ji-Hoon decides to marry a Hye-Soo she agrees so she can pay off her debt and also make sure Eun-Seong has money to grow up on as she gets the results back from when she fainted and she has a brain tumour. Eun-Seong in the beginning doesn’t like Han Ji-Hoon but she warms up to him as the pretend relationship blossoms into something real.
BONUS
19. 200 pounds beauty
Han-Na is a very large girl with a warm heart. She also possesses an unbelievable voice. Han-Na wants to become a pop-singer, but due to her extra-large appearance, can only work as a faceless singer. She provides the vocals for a popular singer named Amy, a beautiful young lady that can’t carry a note to save her life.Han-Na is also in love with Amiys music producer, Sang-Joon, but it’s a one-sided love. One day, Han-Na is invited to Sang-Joon’s birthday party and receives a red dress from him to wear to his party. Han-Na is excited, yet scared. The dress is revealing and quite extravagant. With her very large figure, she is not sure if she can wear such an outfit. Han-Na does eventually go to the birthday party in the red dress, but is mortified when petite Amy appears in the same red dress. During the course of the birthday party, Han-Na absorbs more emotional trauma and she simply disappears for one year. Han-Na then returns as the beautiful Jenny, a beautiful stunner who decides to make it on her own in the industry but encounters her once sided love. Will she be a success? Will her feelings get in the way and can she keep the guilt of the consequences of what her change brings?
20. Takane to Hana ( Japanese )
A tv show adapted from a manga ( that I particularly loved). After her older sister refuses to go to an arranged marriage meeting with Takane Saibara, the heir to a vast business fortune, high schooler Hana Nonomura agrees to be her stand-in to save face for the family. But what happens when Hana meets Takane is an unexpected pairing of utter opposites! Although it seemed a little rushed at the end it was a nice tv show!
#k-drama#long post#coffee prince#cinderella and the four knights#bride of the century#strong woman do bong soon#my secret romance#scarlet heart ryeo#Falling for Innocence#bride of the water god#weightlifiting fairy kim bok joo#i'm not a robot#goblin#Terius behind me#100 Days My Prince#my id is gangnam beauty#the secret life of my secretary#w two worlds#my contracted husband mr oh#marriage contract#200 pound beauty#takane to hana
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Crossover Fanfic Recs
The Addams Family/Harry Potter
'Family Values' by Ishtar
Petunia Dursley discovers that taking care of two small boys is too much for her, so she passes the guardianship of Harry Potter over to a distant relative — Morticia Addams. With Harry growing up in a very different type of Family, Dumbledore desperately tries to get him back. But the Harry Potter who finally arrives at Hogwarts, along with his "cousins" Pugsley and Wednesday, will be nothing like what Dumbledore expects.
The Addams Family/Rise of the Guardians
'Nightmares for Christmas' by Neyiea
Not all children are happy that their nightmares have disappeared, and as such North finds himself receiving a very unexpected letter several days before Christmas.
Big Hero 6/The Martian
'Big Hero Martian' by althor42
There would have been no rescue for Mark, if NASA had not noticed he was still alive. Unless of course, a certain Big Hero noticed instead.
Big Hero 6/Marvel
'Magnets for Trouble' by PitViperOfDoom
Months after Callaghan's downfall, Hiro receives a surprise in the mail: a special invitation to this year's Stark Expo. With Fred for company, he leaves the protection of the city temporarily in the hands of the rest of the team and flies across the country to meet the man with twice the brains and bank account of Alistair Krei and several times the infamy.
But of course, it can't be that simple, can it? Really, after how his last expo went, he should have seen this coming.
Bleach/Free! Iwatobi Swim Club
'Teamwork for Hire' by junko
After the defeat of Aizen, Ichigo has lost his superpowers but not his skills so he's been hiring himself out to any sports team looking for a strong player. When Nagisa Hazuki approaches Ichigo to join the Iwatobi High School Swimming Club, something piques Ichigo's interest…
Bleach/Harry Potter
'Crazy=Genius' series by blackkat
Minerva McGonagall isn't about to let Harry go back to the Dursleys after his first year. She finds an alternative, and along the way, Bazzard Black finds that he might have more family left than he'd ever thought.
'Lost Boys' by glacis
After the Triwizard fiasco, Harry leaves Britain behind for a new life. Uryuu befriends Ichigo at a much younger age. Sirius escapes. Points converge and lost boys find a family. Isshin fails. So does Ryuuken. Kisuke finds a friend. Ukitake covers and cleans up. Fate changes.
'There May Be Some Collateral Damage' by metisket
Ichigo's been ordered to go undercover at a magic school to bodyguard a kid named Harry Potter, and this would be fine, except that he's about as good at bodyguarding as he is at magic. And he considers it a good day, magic‐wise, if he hasn't set anything on fire.
Bleach/Hunger Games
'Storm the World with Reckless Abandon' by SSAerial
So due to one of Urahara's failed experiments that Ichigo unluckily got a full blast of (because life hates him and trouble is attracted to him like a clingy fangirl he could do without), Ichigo ends up in a dystopian universe where people take perverse pleasure in watching kids fight to the death. Which just, no. So Panem now has to deal with a pissed of Ichigo who's determined to stop the Hunger Games and pummel Snow to the ground. And Panem doesn't have a snowball chance in hell in stopping him.
Bleach/Lord of the Rings
'Behold the Flowing Years' by Straight‐Outta‐Hobbiton
Ichigo escapes his dimension to start anew, away from the memories of death and friendships past that he can't seem to put to rest. Rohan is a beautiful country, and Théoden is a good king, but evil only grows stronger within the borders of Mordor, and Ichigo finds himself once more forced to protect those whom he has grown to love.
Bleach/Marvel
'Foreign Recruit' by SSAerial
Ichigo doesn't know where to start. He has no friends, no family, no personal attachments to the world he got dumped into. The Soul King never specified what he was supposed to do in a world where technology is ahead of its time and aliens and secret governments exist. As for the people he has to deal with… Well, it isn't like he hasn't dealt with colorful personalities before.
Bleach/Naruto
'All My Ghosts are at Rest' series by Zakad
An older Ichigo and Uryu leave Soul Society and all its problems behind to search for the near-mythical homeland of a particular Shiba ancestor. They find the Elemental Countries and one little boy who is desperate need of a family.
'Bite' by blackkat
Orochimaru and his sons crash‐land in Karakura. Soul Society is most definitely not prepared for what's coming.
'A New Home' by Rain1701
In an effort to save her life and freedom, Hitsugaya Toshiro winds up landing head‐first in the Naruto universe two months before the start of canon. Not much stays the same after that.
'Soul of Fire' by Zeionia aka Disturbed
After being betrayed by Soul Society, Ichigo and his sisters leave Karakura behind to find shelter with the remains of their grandfather's clan in the Land of Fire. Instead of the peaceful life they were hoping for, they reach Konoha just as a new danger appears to threaten the Uzumaki. Heart‐broken and tired of fighting, will Ichigo be able to protect his sisters and his new home?
Bleach/Stargate
'Stardust' by Vathara
What if some Alterans found another way to survive the Wraith? Five thousand years before the Stargate opens, contact with creatures of energy changes the way of life for an Alteran colony…
Card Captor Sakura/Harry Potter
'Cardcaptor Harry' by LunaStorm
In which both Albus Dumbledore and Clow Reed would have done well to remember that there are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in any philosophy… or predicted by the most imprecise branch of magic…
Doctor Who/Marvel
'Alien Taskforce' by TheSovereigntyofReality
Just because S.H.I.E.L.D. and the Avengers didn't listen to Tony after the Battle of New York, it doesn't mean no one did.
Downton Abbey/Marvel
'Tony Stark Meets an Extremely Unimpressed Time Traveler, or, Thomas Barrow Makes a Surprisingly Good 21st Century Butler' by Alex51324
In which Tony Stark ditches a boring party, makes an addition to the household staff, throws a much better party, and tries not to sexually harass his new butler.
Or, In which Thomas Barrow has a little trouble getting home from the pub, is generally unimpressed with many aspects of the 21st century, never thought of himself as a conservative dresser before, and may or may not be falling in lust with his new employer.
Gilmore Girls/Stargate
'Physics of the Spin' by Mhalachai
Rory Gilmore always thought she was Christopher Hayden's daughter, but things are a little more complicated than that…
Good Omens/Supernatural
'Misfire' by VivatRex
Crowley finds himself in another universe; Aziraphale goes to fetch him. In the meantime, Team Free Will has to figure out what to do with the 6,000 year old demon that won't stay in a devil's trap and keeps rooting through Dean's vinyl collection. Shenanigans ensue.
Gundam Wing/Naruto
'Worlds Apart' by Mieren
Something went horribly wrong and Duo and Naruto are in the wrong worlds. Ninja vs technology. How could this possibly go wrong?
Harry Potter/Marvel
'Behind the Shield' by GeeEs
It was a good thing the new scientist, Dr. Harry Evans, was working out so well. Because nothing else was going Fury's way. And that was before Loki made off with the Tesseract and some of his people. Maybe AU to Mortem Cantor by Kyandua.
'How Harry Failed to Conquer New York' by Impossible_Insanity
'I See The Moon' by hctiB‐notsoB
While on the run, Bruce meets a young man who speaks to the moon. He's probably not quite the sanest friend Bruce could have made, but, well… beggars can't be choosers.
'Mischief's Heir' series by mad_fairy
Mostly Harry Potter with the addition of Loki in the first parts
'Mortem Cantor' by Kyandua
After losing everything he holds dear, Harry Potter is thrust into a new world; one with Superheroes and evil Villains that make Voldemort look like a kitten. Struggling to survive in this new world - and, meanwhile, gaining the attention of S.H.I.E.L.D. - he attempts to live a NORMAL life. But, he is Harry Potter after all... what could possibly go wrong?
'On Punching Gods and Absentee Dads' by Enigmaris
Harry finds out that his dad is alive, has been the whole time. Instead of being overjoyed, Harry's disgusted. His dad left earth and abandoned his friends. Every painful thing he's ever gone through can be traced back to one man. Now Harry's got super strength he can't control and an almost unnecessary amount of magical power. His dad might be living it up with the Avengers now but not for long. With the help of his friends, Harry comes up with a plan for revenge. Get ready Avengers, Harry's out to punch a god.
'Safeguard' by esama
The Chitauri invasion launches a whole new age – for everyone.
Inuyasha/Yu Yu Hakusho
'Devoted' by Ookami‐chan
Loving someone means seeing to it that they receive nothing but the very best of care. In all things.
'Healing Soul' by Trelweny Rosephoenixwolf
Canon, IY slightly alternate ending, BG blend but more manga than anime; YYH boys' last year of school but otherwise through series, anime only.
'By Any Other Name' by Deviant Nature
Kagome's return after an unexplained, prolonged absence leaves her family with questions she refuses to answer except to assure that it's over. While she attempts to readapt to the present, Kurama is feeling the pressures of human society's expectations. But the solutions to his troubles aren't as straight‐forward as he had hoped.
Note: Unrated version is on MediaMiner.net as 'Par Tout Autre Nom'
Harry Potter/Ranma 1/2
'Harry Hibiki and the Philosopher's Stone' by USA_Tiger
On the night Voldemort attacks the Potter's home, a completely different person finds Harry before Sirius Black or Hagrid. Harry is found and adopted by Nerima's very own eternal lost boy Ryoga Hibiki! Soon Harry will be joining his classmates at Hogwarts but how will Hogwarts handle this kind of Harry? And how does it affect the prophecy, what is the 'power he knows not?
Harry Potter/Sherlock
'The Avalon Seven' by sifshadowheart
Major Non‐Canon A/U, Harry is treated for abuse and massive injuries by John Watson as a John Doe. To help solve the mystery of the battered boy John calls in his partner Sherlock — whose father has much more information about his patient than John ever thought possible. Turning to an old acquaintance, Siger Holmes contacts the Lord of the Most Ancient and Noble House of Wallace…Harry's rightful guardian.
First several chapters will be covering Pre‐Hogwarts years, story starts with Harry at age four so it'll be a while before any sort of slash or real conflict happens. Very political fic with lots of twists and turns. Because the plot‐bunnies won't leave me alone!
'Magnificent' by esama
The birth of the Ministry of Magic and his relationship with the British Government.
'Whispers in Corners' by esama
Everything started with a stumble — his new life in a new world as well as his surprisingly successful career as a medium.
Harry Potter/Sherlock/Star Trek
'Harder Choices' by sifshadowheart
Post‐Avalon Seven A/U…a.k.a. This is what happens when plot‐bunnies start mating and multiplying.
Hadrian saves Earth…at a cost
Hetalia/Naruto
'An Englishman in Konoha' by pupeez4eva
Itachi Uchiha is a strange child, who regularly converses with things no one else can see, drinks far too much tea, and has a strong and unyielding obsession with being the best big brother ever (or, in a world where England is reborn into the Naruto universe, Itachi ends up a little…different).
The Hobbit/Sherlock
'All Things Old and New' by teacup_of_doom
All around the world, people are remembering past lives. Bilbo Baggins discovers that Tookish streaks can span lifetimes — and can have unintended, hilarious, consequences.
Katekyou Hitman Reborn!/Naruto
'Force of Nature' by Ramabear (RyMagnatar)
He had died— honorably, he'd like to think, despite living as a villain and an assassin for over half a century— and that, as far as Xanxus had ever figured, would be the end of that. No heaven. No hell. Just life when you were breathing and nothingness when you stopped.
Except that it didn't, quite, turn out that way. Except he came back as the son of the kindest, sometimes saddest father in the world. In both worlds. A father that he knew, without a doubt, to be his flesh and blood. All at once, Xanxus had everything he'd wanted as a child. A home. A family. Stability. And he was going to fight like hell and beat down anyone who tried to take it from him, no matter what his age.
(In which Sakumo raises a son who speaks multiple languages from birth, all of them gibberish to the poor single father jounin, spits vulgarity with the same ease as he does his praise and burns with an unshakable determination to build himself a family that will not fall, no matter who or what is thrown against it.)
'Uchiha Kyōya' by Tsume_Yuki
In a world where Fugaku has three sons, he wishes he'd stopped at the one. There's nothing wrong with the youngest, it's just…
The middle child.
Marvel/Sherlock
'In Which Neither Coulson nor Sherlock are Dead' by TheDullYellowEye
… and John sort of joins the Avengers. While Coulson's recovering from being stabbed in the chest by a magical spear, Fury is rapidly running out of Agents willing to play babysitter for the newly founded Avengers. So he calls in Captain John Watson, late of the British Royal Army, and blogger and best friend to the infamously antisocial presumably deceased Sherlock Holmes.
Naruto/One Piece
'Lost Uzumaki' by Silver Dragonfly (lillikira)
Shanks was used to strange meetings on the various islands of the Grand Line. However, this one was unusual even for the Grand Line. A Lost Uzumaki is found and Naruto has no plans of not becoming part of his family. (A Series of Snapshots about the finding of lost family.)
Naruto/Pern
'One World's Tragedy is Another World's ...Gain?' by Foodmoon
Pern goes to hell in a handbasket. Ir'ca tries to rescue the future of dragonkind by being a thief and somehow ends up in the Land of Fire. It's probably a good thing Kakashi handed over the Hat a while back...
Naruto/Sherlock
'Deduction in Shadows' by GremlinSR
Shikaku just wanted to finish his paperwork before lunch so he could squeeze in an afternoon nap. His plans are derailed by a six year old orphan when she sneaks into his office with proof that somebody has been kidnapping the children of Konoha and covering it up.
He never does end up getting that nap.
Or: A Holmes is reborn into the ninja village Konoha. Chaos ensues
Rise of the Guardians/Marvel
'Constellations of Old' by kuroi_atropos
When the Man in the Moon recognizes Thor as a representative of Asgard, he decides to send the Guardians of Childhood to ask for help vanquishing the last of shadows, as well as a few other things he could use some help with.
'Winter Gods' by avearia
The Guardians discover that, outside of Earth, many races actually worship Jack as a God. Meanwhile, the Avengers deal with the implications that come with an almighty spirit, otherworldly religions, and the revelation that Santa is real.
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Random assorted F&WS thoughts;
First episode was kinda painfully boring. The opening action sequence was good, Torres was a cute likable character, and the stuff with Bucky was interesting drama, but the stuff with Sam and his family was excruciatingly trite. WandaVision also started off slow in the first two episodes, with almost the entire runtime being played straight and only a couple of moments where it was eerie. But there was still a lot of intrigue and a lot of stuff that you could analyze and theorize about in those episodes and a lot that did ultimately have payoff in the end. Like the heart on the calendar being the same elongated shape as the one in the animated credits in the 60s episode and the heart Vision drew on the property deed. It’s possible the stuff with Sam’s family will turn out to be important later, but I don’t really see how it could. Like, it almost seems like there might be some sort of reveal being built up with the vague way Sam and his sister argue about him going off to fight bad guys after their parents died. Like, maybe there’s something about who their parents were or the way that they died that’s supposed to be important. But IDK if that’s just me basing my expectations off a show with a completely different premise made by completely different people, or if I’m totally within my rights to expect a big twist like that because Winter Soldier and Civil War also had some pretty big plot twists too.
Going into episode 2 I had read that the showrunners likened the mini series to a long movie and it definitely feels like it. Like, they’re trying to make it feel episodic by having a conflict that plays out throughout episodes 1 and 2 that reaches some kind of resolution by the end, along with a cliffhanger leading into the next episode. But so far, it feels like it just should’ve been a movie because there’s a lot of fat that could’ve been trimmed out to fit a 2 1/2-3 hour run time.
Like, the opening scene with John Walker in the locker room: he has two conversations back-to-back with two different people, only one of whom ends up being relevant for the rest of the episode or will likely be relevant for the rest of the series. Then, right after, he has a TV interview where we get more insight into his character and background that feels way more informative than either conversation. Like, I don’t think either conversation was really necessary, it could’ve just started with him suiting up in the locker room and the going out for the interview. If you needed to establish Battlestar, he could’ve just sat with John and been part of the interview with him, and if you needed the girlfriend, John could’ve just like, waved at her or something, or the interviewer could bring her up. And like, I don’t know yet what lines are going to be really important and what’s going to be fillery flavor text. But if feels like a lot of what we learn in both conversations and the interview is redundant. For instance, the first thing John’s girlfriend says is that she used to sneak into the locker room to see him, which tells us that he went to that high school and played football there, but we already knew that from his name being on one of the lockers and then the reporter says it later in case you didn’t get that. There’s little tidbits of biographical information on John sprinkled throughout both conversations and the interview, but in the midst of all that is a lot of dialog that feels like it’s just variations of John feeling like he has a lot to live up to which could’ve been condensed into just one interview scene.
Something similar to the high school example happens at the very end of the episode too. Bucky alludes to Zemo by bringing up an incident in Siberia with someone who knows all of HYDRA’s secrets, which is already plenty of information for anybody who watched Civil War, which should be everyone watching this show. But then Falcon goes ahead and says “we’re going to see Zemo” anyway, as if we needed it spelled out. AND THEN, it cuts to Zemo in prison. Like, you could’ve either ended the episode on Sam’s line, or cut Sam’s line and ended on Zemo’s face just in case you didn’t get what Bucky was talking about and needed something to make you go “Oh yeah, that guy”. You don’t need all three, that’s just excessive.
I don’t know if Isaiah is a character from the comics or not, but I’m hoping he’s going to be important later. Like, I have to assume that the fact that they successfully made another super soldier way back in the 50s but then decades later were still struggling to recreate it and ended up with the Hulk in a botched attempt means that there’s going to be some sort of story explanation about how they lost the formula again and then got it back to create the Flag Smashers. But I also kinda wanna see Isaiah like, pop in while Sam and Bucky are getting their asses kicked and save the day.
“Flash Smashers” is a really fucking stupid name. You can’t smash a flag, it’s made of cloth. “Smashing” is something you do to hard, solid objects that break apart on impact. The only way you can “smash” a flag is if you like, froze it solid first. Like, shouldn’t they be called the “Flag Shredders” or the “Flag Burners”?
Speaking of them, they seemed kinda sympathetic and I was thinking maybe Erin Kellyman is playing the same character she did in Solo, where it seems like she’s a bad guy who’s stealing stuff for her own evil ends, but then it turns out she’s stealing from the bad guys to fight a corrupt regime. But then she pretty much outright stated that her goal is exactly what we were told it was before. She thinks that the people who “never left” should have everything and fuck an entire half of the world who don’t have jobs or homes now because of something they couldn’t control. It’s like they’re supposed to be a commentary on people who like, don’t want America taking in refugees or donating foreign aid and stuff because we have homeless and disenfranchised citizens who were already here and need resources too. But like, the whole “one world, one people” thing seems to directly contradict the idea of an “our needs vs their needs” thing and I don’t get how that has anything to do with the blip. Like, when I think about how the world changed during the blip, I think that there may have been a lot less competition for jobs and land and housing and other resources, as Thanos said there would be. But nothing in Endgame or Far From Home or anything implied that all borders dissolved and the Earth adopted a unified world government or anything, let alone that whatever structural changes the world underwent were suddenly reversed along with the snap.
I read that originally the storyline featured an airborne virus and they had to reshoot and recut the show to remove it because of COVID and that kinda makes me think that maybe Erin Kellyman’s ultimate plan, at least originally, was going to be to release a virus that would wipe out half the world population. I also read that originally the Russos had an alternate story planned for the third Captain America movie in case Disney/Marvel’s contract negotiations with Robert Downey Jr. didn’t work out. Like, if they had to completely scrap Civil War because they couldn’t use one of it’s central characters and there was no one else they could substitute for him, they were just going to make the story about “madbombs” which are bombs that essentially turn people into rage zombies. So the conflict of the movie would be that the main enemies that Cap has to fight are innocent civilians he doesn’t want to hurt. I don’t know how much work went into that concept before they ended up with the clearance to move forward with Civil War. It might’ve just been a rough outline. But if they put in the time and effort to produce an actual script and they liked it and felt good about moving forward with it if they couldn’t have their first choice, then I could definitely see them wanting to reuse some of its ideas for F&WS. So maybe originally the story was going to be about madbombs, but who knows if it’ll remain in tact and in what capacity now after COVID. Like, if madbombs were there they might be removed entirely with a different plan to wipe out half the world population. Or they might just make the madbombs like, actual bombs that make people insane with sonic vibrations or some shit (I think that’s how they worked in the comics actually), so for the story’s purposes, they’re functionally the same thing, they’re just not a virus.
#the falcon and the winter soldier#falcon and winter soldier#f&ws#spoiler#spoilers#f&ws spoilers#falcon and winter soldier spoilers#marvel#marvel comics#mcu
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What do you think about morally grey in three houses?
Hmm…
There has been several posts recently discussing this particular topic, which boiled down to “what is morally grey” and, well, this is an interesting question!
I’d say “grey” is when someone isn’t completely black or white, but has elements of both alignments.
The obvious having been stated, it makes me think about several other tropes, like the “pet the dog” trope or “morality pet”.
Does having good intentions but shit execution means you’re grey? It depends! What is the “shit execution”? Eating babies? Forgeting to put the lid on your pan full of boiling water because you were super busy to, idk, bring pregnant wife to the hospital, so when your old mom tried to add pasta to the pan she burnt herself and died?
I’d say it depends on what are your limits and what you deem acceptable or not and uh, apparently, killing people in prevention they might do something wrong isn’t black enough to dilute the pool into “too black you will need to add 5 liters of bleach to get a clearer result”…
I’ve said it before, but the purple giant deciding to snap his fingers to get rid of half of the population to save the world isn’t, to my tastes, morally grey. It’s still 50% of people dying because someone decided and they weren’t consulted.
If those 50% agreed to it though? It’s immediatly more complicated, not for them, but for the guy/woman holding the trigger - they want to die to save the world, but will you really kill them? (i think this had been adressed in Tales of the Abyss at one point).
Look at Quanism - it has both good and bad aspects.
Quan will cross a desert twice (even if the second time he kind of failed) to save and help his best friend Sigurd, because he might need help and will even accompany him during his various journeys in foreign states. Quan will defend his country (mmh) and his people against Thracian invasions. Quan’s people have Leonster’s best interests at heart.
Quan will also shit on Thracia, put outrageous prices on food exported there, act as the High King of what seems to be a federation of several sovereign kingdoms and often call Verdane people barbarians.
Was Quan a bad guy, or a good guy?
Ultimately, in FE5, Leif refuses Quanism. Given a crapton of circumstances, he finds his own doctrine (well the peninsula is united under his rule, like Quan would have wanted, but Thracians aren’t exiled or relegated to shit like Quan might have done if he had been in his son’s shiny boots).
The Hero ™ isn’t grey, or tries his hardest not to be. Sometimes he manages to do that by disgusting asspulls, sometimes he succeeds by thinking out of the box, sometimes he doesn’t and falls in the grey spectrum - where we can still ask ourselves, is he still the hero, or how does the fact that falling in the grey spectrum impacts him?
FE9 Naesala, and arguably in FE10, refuses to be called a good king or a good leader. He will prioritise his kingdom and his people first, but is perfectly aware that he is not The Hero ™ Tibarn represents. Naesala has good intentions at heart, shit execution and refuses to be called or even thought as heroic. It is heavily implied that he “atones” for the rest of his life, and is willing to be used as a punching ball by Tibarn because of what happened in Phoenicis.
Arvis might have had the best intention, he completely crossed the line. I personally don’t think he knew Manfroy and co would hunt children and go on a murder spree in the 1st gen, but, and this is what is truly fightening, I don’t know if Arvis would have stopped his association with Manfroy if he knew (maybe he would have tried to backstab him to prevent such a thing from happening, but it’s the same dilemna we had with Lyon in FE8, are you really going to work with evil forces to do something because you think you can control them? If you do, then what does that make you?)
Ultimately Arvis tries to redeem himself, by asspulling saving all children and dying by Seliph’s hands - does that make him grey if associating with Manfroy and conquering the continent turned his color spectrum to black? Or was Arvis “morally black” since the beginning?
On the other end of the spectrum, Sigurd’s invasion of Augstria (and Verdane but no one cares about barbarians) feels wrong (at least I felt so). Sigurd is even called on it by Eldingan, and FE4′s biased narrator says that during the occupation, Sigurd’s occupying forces did some shit.
Is his incompetence/reluctance/ignorance that his troops were “doing some shit” in Augstria dark enough to change his color spectrum? Can we hold the fact that he is a knight so he cannot disobey/doesn’t think about disobeying orders even if they are about subjugating a country and removing its king against him? Sigurd grows in Silesse, but then he dies :’(
But still, is Sigurd morally grey? I don’t think so. Maybe after his death he would have been, or he would have retained his knightly values, we will never know. Faced with Lewyn’s dilemna - continuing the fight that will kill many, or going home and letting many die - Sigurd doesn’t know how to answer. But this is a good thing, he might have turned into the Hero ™ who solves problems by thinking out of the box. Or he would have tried to, idk.
Sigurd isn’t loyal good, nope, he goes against orders to protect Shannan. I’d say chaotic good, but it ultimately doesn’t matter, imo, Sigurd’s pretty “morally white”.
This isn’t really on topic though, your question, and by extension the concept of morally grey is actually asking if said character is “moral” or “amoral” by your own standards!
On FE16 :
Boar!Dimitri is an interesting case. Boar!Dimitri wants and will, if Billy isn’t with him, fight until his last breath in a desperate attempt to kill Edelgard. In AM, where we see Boar!Dimitri and interact with him, it’s implied that Boar!Dimitri wants to be a boar and fight against Edel, but he will not force his former friends to join him in his quest. He tries to tell everyone off, saying “they’re too weak” or some liability, but we ultimately see it with Dedue and Rodrigue that despite his tuskers, Boar!Dimitri doesn’t want people to die for him.
Is Boar!Dimitri morally grey? He is driven by his revenge and yet, he will not do “everything” to get Edel’s head. He will not sacrifice his friends for Edel’s death (then of course comes the question “but they’re following him so if pulls a Leeroy Jenkins they will follow” which is right). Still, the fact that he prioritises his revenge and Edel over his people is pretty meh in my book especially since Rodrigue told him that they’re starving etc. Then there’s his useless cruelty dealing with Randolf which sucks. Everything taken into consideration I’d say that, imo, Dimitri’s a light shade of “morally grey”.
Claude isn’t morally grey at all. He desperatly wants to be, but imo, he reads more like Virion (and/or Innes, I totally forgot about him).
Given the dev’s interview and all, Claude will not sacrifice his friends, and puts survival as his top priority. He wants to look like a heartless schemer, ready to do anything to achieve his goals, but just like Virion, in a real life situation? Nope. Claude will escape, and find a way/lament if his friends fell because they weren’t supposed to. With the Innes comparison, I’d say Hilda might be his Gerik - he told/ordered her to get away and escape, she says fig it and stays until the end.
Claude might have been the Hero ™ who thinks out of the box, but there are no boxes in FE16…
Claude’s morally white, he has his ambitions but won’t cross his own thresholds to achieve them. Of course there’s the “it’d be nice if Rhea disappeared” at the end of VW, but, because the plot asked for it or not, Rhea dies at the end of VW. Claude doesn’t have to get rid of her, and even if she didn’t, would he truly do it or wasn’t it a Virion-boast? Would Claude kill the person who sacrificed herself twice to save them, or have her killed? I don’t know. I don’t think so.
Also, given from his Flayn’s supports and the scenes where he loses his calm, while he really wants to find answers to his questions and about the true history of Fodlan, Claude will not try to force them out of someone who’s reluctant to tell them. Yes he lost his shit with Rhea, and yet, he didn’t force her to reveal the truth, and even let her go to catch some much needed rest acknowledging she only told him a half-truth, or avoided his question.
Edel? I confess I had a very serious case of bias towards Arvis when I joined the Jugdral fandom and the “for the greater good” motto.
Allying with Thales and pals though, wait, i know I’ve said above that it wouldn’t have changed a thing about Arvis if he knew Manfroy’d hunt children - it wouldn’t have for the greater plot, but to me, Arvis would have fallen into the “morally black” pit way faster than he did. I like my Tumblr username, I like my mooks, I don’t like using them as war assets or the idea of even using them. FFS we’re using feral laguz randoms here, and even Miccy in her “i will do everything to protect Daien” didn’t use them.
She might have started a war, but shows regret for the bloodshed going as far as to lament at Dimitri’s death in CF despite the irony of that map - she knows that what she is doing is wrong, but thinks it needs to be done to build a better future. However, the “starting a war” + “Kostas in the prologue” look like Arvis in his best moments - and he is morally black - but “using beasts as backup” + “giving Emile hunting grounds” and everything about lizards and eradication sets her in the “morally black” spectrum.
Edel knows what are her limits between the “acceptable” and “not acceptable”, but for the sake of her goals, she will cross all of them. But she is no sociopath, or cruel person, she doesn’t enjoy crossing those lines and yet she feels it is compulsory to reach her goals.
i’d like to see an Arvis/Edel support convo
Rhea? I’d say grey, on the grounds of creating someone with the intent for it to be used as vessel is really creepy, but then, transmutation/alchemy/creating artificial sentient lives is creepy in itself and raises a ton of bioethical issues i’m not ready to deal with in this post because it’s already long as fuck and this is crossing beyond fandom discussion. Rhea knows that her experiments are questionable, and she’s ashamed of them but felt they were a necessity - pretty much like someone crossing their moral line and turning “morally black”.
This point is neutralised in game though, because Rhea succeeded and the side Sothis choose ultimately won the war - so yes, Fodlan needed Sothis and Rhea’s homonculi were ultimately key to bring peace/prosperity to Fodlan... IMO, it’s still questionable, even if the game rewards it.
Rhea will not cross all of her lines though, she said the church will go against anyone who targets the students and the monastery, and she means it going as far as to blow her cover twice turning into a dragon to protect the students/Billy and his pals in part 2.
Also, national bias at play, but rewritting history not to alienate thousands of supporters of the side who lost the war is pretty grey in itself. Slowing technological progress? We know the reasons, if the book in the DLC, despite Linhardt’s warnings has to be believed, since the devs said so. Is it something that would count as morally “black”? Idk, maybe? Or maybe i’ve read/watched too much sci-fi stuff where one of the most common plot point is “humanity isn’t advanced enough to know how to use this technology”. It is grey, but Rhea doesn’t fall in the “morally black” spectrum, she’s a darker shade of grey than Boar!Dimitri, for sure, but she’s still, IMO, grey.
This is not to say that Edel’s evil and Claude’s good/whatever the contrary adjective of evil is! Or to say X/Y/Z is a better character than A/B/C!
I love Arvis and Hilda (FE4!Hilda) to death, and I prefer them to Siggy and Eldie. But I also know that they’re not supposed to be liked because they were right or because what they did was the right thing, nope.
Tl;dr : Morally grey, black or white depends on who you’re talking to, and if FE16 brought us something new, it’s that not everyone thinks that doing a certain thing is evil, or, on the contrary, a good thing.
There’s no consensus on what is “good” or “wrong” which can be interpretated in all kinds of worrying (?) ways.
#anon#replies#all kinds of emblem#Jugdral#Tellius#Fodlan#even bits of Magvel#shit it's not legal theory anymore#but fandom theory??#it's interesting though#what makes someone grey?#Anonymous#morally grey this morally grey that#i used to loathe heroes who find solutions that fit with asspulls#i still do towards a certain someone wearing suspenders but i understand i'm not rational at this point#and yet heroes (tm) are the ones who can think out of the box and stop the cycle of choose between crap and shit#i love my trashy velthomers okay#FE16#Innes values his friends even if he tries to play the jerkass part#Virion will never sacrifice anyone and acknowledges that his tactics suck#worrying ways : apparently preemptive strikes aren't so morally black anymore#I love several tropes like the found family one but also the Gandalf 'run i'm holding them back' trope#Boar!Dimitri is a tsundere?
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Ghost-Spider #1 Thoughts
Since I enjoyed the Spider-Geddon aftermath issue of Ghost Spider and because seeing Spider-Gwen meet Earth 616 Jackal intrigued me I decided to check out the current story arc and...um...oh dear...
So confession. I dropped Spider-Gwen’s title after reading the issue that debuted Earth 65 Kraven. The moment I saw him with his stupid Hipster look I was like ‘Noooooooooooooooope’.
So consequently I missed out on such gems as Gwenom and other great ideas I’m sure were inspired by variant covers.
What I’m saying is I’m out of the loop and therefore any analysis I might be able to provide isn’t going to be that great because I’m literally lacking in information.
That all being said I also maintain what Stan the Man said once upon a time, every comic is someone’s first. That goes for issue #1s moreso than others!
So we come to this title.
Was it good.
From where I’m standing...no not really.
Okay so first of all the art is lovely, it really is. And the scene where George’s surprise party goes very wrong was really well paced out by the art, which sold the comedy very well!
As for other positives...um...the story remembered to address the fact that Gwen can’t just show up to Earth 616 and go to school there. The idea that Iron Man established a scholarship for extra terrestrial and extra terrestrial people fixes that problem...but it opens up a boatload of questions.
Is Gwen and fellow students from other dimensions like her stealing student places from people based in Earth 616?
Wouldn’t education standards vary wildly across dimensions? After all a lot of times when it comes to education it’s less how well you did as much as where you went (or sadly who you know). I mean I know people from my university, which was no slouch, who got great grades but were passed over for jobs by people with less impressive grades but from more prestigious universities. Is a grade from Oxford or Yale on Earth 616 worth as much on the job market as it is on Earth 65? It may well be that on Earth 65 (which we know has a different history to Earth 616 and isn’t necessarily a reflection of OUR real life world) ESU is regarded as a lesser school that’s easy to pass.
Wouldn’t the subject of allowing aliens and other dimensional people to attend schools on Earth 616 open up a HUGE political debate regarding immigration? Provided it was known to the government of course and it Tony was hiding it from them then isn’t that super unethical?
What about the potential for disease and illnesses that could be brought over from a dimension with a starkly different germ history to Earth 616?
Do Gwen’s fellow students get to know she’s a foreign student from another dimension?
Are such things REALLy so common place blasé in the 616 universe? Surely the norm is to acknowledge that aliens and such things exist but to suspend disbelief to allow life to go on as normal, but if people are just actually reacting realistically to something like this doesn’t that break down the verisimilitude of the Marvel universe?
If Gwen is attending school with the legal name of Gwen Stacy and LOOKS like Gwen Stacy wouldn’t that raise a shitton of problems for her because she looks JUST LIKE A DEAD WOMAN! I mean Gwen’s clone at least changed her name. Is ESU really not going to have records of that time one of their students was murdered on a bridge? Gwen’s death was public knowledge the Green Goblin boasted about it on TV and Ben Urich wrote a book on it!
All of which is academic because even if Gwen earns a college education on Earth 616...how is that going to help her in the long run?
Think about it, she might be taught skills and stuff that she could then use in any jobs she adopts. But having skills is sadly only half the battle when it comes to getting a job. Of equal or possibly greater value is having the PROOF you have those skills. Someone can be a brilliant self-taught nuclear engineer. But if they’ve not got a college diploma to prove it they aren’t getting a job.
How is a diploma from Earth 616 going to mean anything besides a piece of paper on Earth 65. There wouldn’t be any records proving she attended ESU and even if Gwen tells them that she earned the degree in another universe they’d only have her word for it, faking a piece of paper saying you graduated is easy! Even if they did believe her no one in authority on Earth 65 has the power to verify how legit or qualified Earth 616’s ESU is. It could be an online course for all they know. Not to mention do the residents of Earth 65 even know that travel between parallel universes is even a thing?
I’m sure a lot of 616 citizens are probably vaguely aware of that but on Earth 65 that isn’t necessarily the case because they’ve not had a long history of Skrull invasions!
It’s all just so contrived to just have Gwen situated in Earth 616 because that would boost her sales in theory.
Creatively it causes problems too.
Let’s put aside how it means subplots and supporting characters are going to have to be divided between two universes where their collision will be difficult if not impossible.
Let’s even put aside how being a public figure in Earth 65 whilst she spends a huge chunk of her time in another universe entirely puts Gwen’s Dad (who’s human and at risk from heart attacks) at HUGE risk!
What is really gained creatively from having Gwen on Earth 616 where she can interact with like 616 Peter, 616 MJ, 616 Miles?
Fanservice. Sure. I mean that’s why I’m reading this.
But creatively speaking it is just...impoverishing for everyone.
Let’s first look at this from the POV of the 616 residents.
Miles gets to potentially date Gwen more easily now. This is a bad thing. Miles is already too similar to Peter and whilst this dynamic might work in the animated movies (which are themselves an AU to the comics) in an ongoing Miles story having him literally dating a version of Spider-Man’s girlfriend is reductive. Not to mention it might be a bad idea to have him date a fellow super in general, it undermines his normalcy and relative normalcy is important to Spider-Heroes. In this case it wouldn’t even be dating a hero, it’d be dating a hero from another universe!
For Mary Jane it also undermines her normalcy too as well as undermining the weight of Gwen’s death in her life because a version of Gwen, is alive and well and capable of regularly interacting with her.
The same holds true but a thousand times more for Peter. Unless you quarantine off this series as ‘Spider-Gwen continuity’ any time Peter feels mournful over Gwen now is going to feel rather hollow because you know he is regularly chatty with Spider-Gwen and literally helped her get into the same school as him!
That’s another bad thing about the comic by the way. Isn’t being on record as helping an other dimensional version of his dead girlfriend going to seriously put the spotlight on Peter in a big way? Does he even have the clout to help her get into ESU given how he’s only recently returned there himself? And what was with the dialogue implying he works there? When did that happen? He attends school there but he’s not got a job there last I checked??????????????
Also...isn’t Peter like seriously waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too chill about Gwen? Remember how in the 1970s Clone Saga (the story this comic actively references) he was seriously shaken up when Gwen’s clone appeared? Remember when he had varying degrees of similar reactions EVERY time one of Gwen’s clones showed up, including when Spider-Gwen was impersonating one of Gwen’s clones in Clone Conspiracy?
Now he’s face to face with a living breathing version of Gwen Stacy who is arguably more real than any of those clones and he’s all smiles and meh. He doesn’t even think about it in the other titles! Like dude if Spider-Man came face to face with a living Gwen Stacy that would dwell on his mind somewhat!
Now let’s consider this from Gwen’s POV.
What does she gain from interacting on Earth 616?
Well she gets to be comparatively more normal than on her own Earth where she is a celebrity. Okay cool...couldn’t you just get to the same ends by mindwiping her identity from people on Earth 65? I mean we already did this with Peter Parker why is the integrity of Spider-Gwen’s narrative more precious?
She gets to interact with Earth 616 Jackal...which is really more interesting from the Jackal’s POV because does she even know who the hell Miles Warren is? It doesn’t seem like it based on this issue. I mean that’s why I’m reading this arc right now. Because seeing Miles Warren react to a living Gwen Stacy is an interesting idea to me. But why move the main character in this direction to do something interesting with a villain. Not even one of her own villains either, another character’s villain. Oh but Earth 65 Jackal is also doing stuff. Why is he even evil in her universe she’s not dead? Was he in love with Peter in her universe?
This basically applies to every villain and supporting character Gwen could bump into on Earth 616. Norman, Harry, Jameson, Curt Connors, Jill Stacy, etc.
The most interesting characters she could interact with from her POV are Peter and Mary Jane. But with Mary Jane you have to think the mileage doesn’t go much further than “Wow you are much nicer than my Earth’s Em Jay (who’s name has apparently changed now) who’s a total diva b-word!”.
And with Peter...well this issue already basically dispelled the drama from that. She regards him as a older friend but not a peer, not her Peter and someone she can chat to and fight crime with sometimes. That’s it really. There was more emotion and drama derived from that Conway backup story where she met the Goblin Peter back in Spider-Verse.
Meanwhile her own supporting cast and villains are very much left in the lurch. I mean the Man-Wolf is getting released on her Earth and I’m just like ‘so what she’s not even there right now!”
And like Peter and Miles this torpedoes the idea of Gwen being relatively normal. Juggling normal life problems with superhero problems flies out of the window when you are commuting between dimensions, one of which you are famously dead and the other of which you are just famous.
What else is there to talk about.
So Gwen’s costume is apparently composed of spiders but is also a symbiote...um...weird. in fairness maybe that’s addressed in older issues.
What’s weirder was the random giant rat...what was that even about?????????????
The only other positive I have to say about this issue was that at least it wasn’t as pretentious and not as obnoxiously zany as Latour’s run.
Finally...what was up with that opening page saying Gwen got her powers a few months ago??????
You telling me Gwen got her powers in high school, became famous as Spider-Gwen, Peter got crazy and turned himself into a lizard before dying, Gwen changed her world view, a campaign to capture her happened, she went to college, THEN Spider-Verse happened, THEN everything in volume 1 happened, THEN everything in Secret Wars happened, THEN everything in volume 2, Clone Conspiracy and Web Warriors happened (including the Spider Women crossover), then everything in volume 3 including Spider-Geddon happened and all this shit happened...in under a year?
What the fuck was everyone on speed or something that’s ridiculous!
I’m gonna pick up the next few issues but if they’re more of the same I hope the Jackal story wraps up sooner rather than later.
#Ghost-Spider#Spider-Gwen#Gwen Stacy#Spider-Man#Peter Parker#George Stacy#Captain Stacy#Spider-Verse#Spider-Geddon#Em Jay#the jackal#jackal#Miles Warren#Mary Jane Watson#Mary Jane Watson Parker#mj watson#mjwatsonedit
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My OC Descriptions!
Thank you so much for your positive responses, @dasjansel @corvid-moon @teeny-weeny-ducklings @technoxslayer360 @incoherentmoose and @cake-and-roses ! Since you guys asked, I made overall descriptions of my OCs and a bit of a synopsis. Sorry it's so long! I hope you enjoy it and please provide feedback!
This is a story that takes the "chosen ones" and fantasy tropes and turns them on their heads. The main character never accepts his role. The guy doesn't get the girl. There's no prophecy or guide. The populace thinks they're monsters, not heros. Their powers are explained scientifically. They have to help themselves emotionally so they can help others physically. It's just a bunch of young adults with problems getting into shenanigans, figuring out life's lessons, and maybe saving the world.
Name: Adrian
Age: 18
Height: 5'8"
Gender Identity: Male
Pronouns: He/Him
Sexuality: Bisexual (Feminine leaning)
Race: Human
Ethnicity: German/Portugese
Neurodivergent: Narcissistic Personality Disorder
Active Power: Super strength
Passive Power: Truth (Ability to see through illusions, understands foreign languages, can tell when someone is lying, etc)
Activating Emotion: Courage
Associated Color: Yellow/Gold
Associated Element: Air/Wind
Description: This rich, all-American, high school boy has had a near perfect life growing up until a burglar breaks in his home. Thankfully, he stops the villain… by tackling him through an oak door! First hailed as a hero, his social life then gets thrown into disarray as this new found strength that seems to randomly come and go ends up earning him the reputation of a destructive menace. On top of that, he starts passing out and having "visions." Doctors say he's having seizures, but these visions feel more real than his life ever has, and it's always of the same place, a magic lab where he's the experiment! His visions keep getting worse until one day he fully wakes up in the lab and escapes, but now he can't go back home!
Adrian finds out he's stuck in the world of Mythos, the parallel Earth where all of our fantastical dreams come from, and he's not happy about it! And the locals don't seem happy about him either. Just wanting to get this over with and go home, Adrian faces more ugly reality in this fantasy world than he ever did in his privileged life in our world. With no guides or prophecies and regarded as a monster, Adrian has to figure out how to find others like himself to help him save the world and go back home.
Adrian is the self-proclaimed leader of the group. He's obnoxious, self-centered, and stubborn, and completely uninterested in helping unless it benefits him somehow. You are supposed to dislike him at first. He matures and becomes much more open-minded and accepting through the journey.
Initial Motivation: To get back home
Journey: Breaking out of your bubble is more important than staying in it, others suffer in a way different from you, you cannot speak for others, use privilege to help those that don't have privilege, attraction to anyone who shows femininity or doing female-assigned tasks/behaviors (being kind, showing emotions, being vulnerable) does not make you less of a man, the greatest strength is facing the truth
Name: Iola
Age: 20
Height: 6'2"
Gender Identity: Female
Pronouns: She/Her
Sexuality: Lesbian
Race: Human
Ethnicity: Afro-Columbian
Neurodivergent: Anxiety
Active Power: Shield
Passive Power: Acceleration/Regeneration (Subconsciously heals others, requires focus if needs boost in power, ie, if someone is bleeding out. Can cause things to grow, but also age. Cannot remove poisons/curses, cannot bring people back to life, conditional)
Activating Emotion: Care
Associated Color: Pink/Orange
Associated Element: Earth/Wood
Description: Iola's life had been pretty quiet since she and her dad started a farm out in the wilderness, until a strange boy pops up who brings a whole lot of unwanted attention. She stumbles upon her own powers as she defends her home, and then sets out to find others with Adrian.
Iola is the mom of the group, both the good parts and the bad. She is kind and caring and helpful and also stressed af and sometimes pokes her nose where she's not welcome. It's suggested at first that she may be the Adrian's love interest, but, surprise! She only likes girls. She seems to have lost someone precious to her, and it's not her mom.
Initial Motivation: Believes in following destiny
Journey: Self-sacrifice is not always necessary, mediation is more important than appeasement, give without expectation of return, worthy of just existing, important to take care of self in order to take care of others, rest is a type of work and just as important as being active
Name: Emlyn
Age: 21
Height: 6'0"
Gender Identity: Androgynous
Pronouns: He/Him
Sexuality: Pansexual
Race: Human
Ethnicity: Northern Irish
Neurodivergent: Complex PTSD, Depression
Active Power: Chemical Reaction (Interaction of two or more substances that results in different substances. Can only initiate reaction, cannot control the outcome. Usually uses fire as a weapon, but can use others. Can also stop reaction in process, but cannot reverse.)
Passive Power: Psychic (Ability to sense when others are nearby, can receive symbolic messages through dreams, not prophetic)
Activating Emotion: Passion
Associated Color: Deep blood red
Associated Element: Fire
Description: Emlyn finally seems to have found a home at the inn he works at when two strangers pop up with trouble following them. He unleashes his powers to defend them, but his loved ones reject him when his secret is exposed. With nowhere else to go, he tags along with Adrian and Iola, the only people who seem to accept him how he is. However, he harbors a terrible secret that he's hellbent on taking to the grave, and it creates a division between himself and the others.
Emlyn is very quiet and reclusive. He doesn't talk much, and seems to be insistent on covering as much skin as possible at all times. He's not the angry or brooding type, but surprisingly polite and soft spoken. And surprisingly strong. However, he seems like he'll do anything to avoid using his powers, and almost seems scared of them. Adrian bullies him frequently, threatened by the fact that he's attracted to Emlyn. Emlyn doesn't seem to care, but eventually lashes out, showing a very different, vicious side.
Initial Motivation: Redemption
Journey: The past is the past, use mistakes to learn and teach, secrets create unnecessary burden, it's okay to have darkness, do not let negative emotions rule over logical decisions, take both capabilities and lack of into account, sometimes you just can't do what you want even if others can, you are not damned
Name: Liesel
Age: 82
Height: 5'0"
Gender Identity: Genderfluid
Pronouns: She/Her, He/Him, They/Them
Sexuality: Abrosexual
Race: Fairy/Changeling
Ethnicity: Jewish
Neurodivergent: Autistic
Active Power: Freedom (Ability to unlock anything, create doors/portals with conditions)
Passive Power: Choice (Can tell what someone has decided before they act on it, very useful in combat; can see what future "paths" can be taken but cannot tell outcomes)
Activating Emotion: Hope
Associated Color: Sky blue
Associated Element: Water
Description: Liesel has had to protect her people for decades, so she's more than a bit reluctant to leave with some humans to go on some adventure. When she realizes that she needs to, she goes with them, but completely mistrusts them.
Where Iola and Emlyn are more passive, Liesel is even more aggressive than Adrian. She challenges everything Adrian knows and really gets him to start looking at things differently. They develop a weird rivalry dynamic and eventually soften up with each other.
Initial Motivation: Protect her people
Journey: Evil does not originate from the same place, no group of people are all the same, there's a difference between honesty and being cruel
Name: Uri
Age: ??? (They tell a different number every time they're asked)
Height: 5'4"
Gender Identity: Agender
Pronouns: They/Them
Sexuality: Asexual
Race: Dragon
Ethnicity: Nigerian
Neurodivergent: N/A
Active Power: Light Manipulation (Can be used to make self or others invisible, create illusions, blind someone, etc. Does not actually makes things disappear/materialize, just makes it look like it.)
Passive Power: Compulsion (Redirects electrical impulses between neurons. Makes people think certain things, somewhat like intrusive thoughts. The more impulsive someone is, the easier they are to manipulate. Often accidentally shares own thoughts with others. Usually uses for persuasion among foes and to pull pranks among friends. Cannot read minds.)
Activating Emotion: Elation
Associated Color: Emerald green
Associated Element: Metal
Other: Disabled/Born without wings
Description: Uri's just minding their own business, napping on top of their treasure trove when some adventurers break in. Those same adventurers open that weird lock contraption they've been trying to open for the last two centuries. Interesting. Rather than confronting the adventurers, Uri decides to join them in hopes of making sure their treasure doesn't get destroyed, to find some more, and to enjoy some chaos along the way.
Uri is confident, charasmatic, and devilishly handsome. They only care about their treasure, but slowly finds themself caring about the others.
Initial Motivation: To protect their treasure
Journey: Self-preservation includes helping others, happiness is worth going the long way for, people have different paths to the same goal and that's okay
Name: Oriana
Age: 19
Height: 5'6"
Gender Identity: Demigirl
Pronouns: She/Her
Sexuality: Pansexual
Race: Human?
Ethnicity: Cherokee
Neurodivergent: ADHD
Active Power: Sonic/Song
Passive Power: Empath (Ability to sense motives, can literally share emotions when making physical contact, can transfer powers between people)
Activating Emotion: Love (Both romantic and platonic)
Associated Color: White/Purple
Associated Element: Spirit/Aether
Other: Intersex
Description: Oriana has been waiting at the edge of the Ancient Forest for a long time. She doesn't remember why, but she knows she needs to guide five adventurers through the massive forest that covers half the world. For some reason, she's the only one who can survive traversing it.
Oriana is sweet and kind and too naive for her own good, having never been exposed to civilization or other people before. She seems to have a mind of a child, but has the wisdom and understanding of someone who has been alive for a very long time. Emlyn develops a crush on her due to her friendly and accepting nature and eventually confides in her. Their past is far more intertwined than either of them remember, and is the answer to why this is all happening.
Initial Motivation: Because she was asked to
Journey: Evil lives in everyone, purity is non-existent, be kind to those who "don't deserve it" without allowing self to be walked on, different facets of love
#important#remember#me#write#writer#writeblr#writing#my story#ocs#ptsd#depression#anxiety#autism#adhd#narcissism#executive dysfunction#bi#bisexual#bisexuality#pan#pansexual#abrosexual#intersex#demigirl#asexual#asexuality#ace#agender#genderfluid#nonbinary
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Which Mario characters would be, as Watership Down Characters, and vice versa?
You know, I took some time to think about this one today, and I’ve got to admit, for my tastes, I can’t think of a feasible way that this works out. And it’s for a few reasons that kind of get me hung up.
Honestly, I think it comes down to at least four pretty divisive factors that keep them from being compared on an equal scale, and adds a terribly heightened challenge to it all. These would be: gender ratios (A), inconsistent characterizations (B), mismatching personalities ©, and cast prominence (D).
Obviously, it’s a lot to get into, so, I’ll include that in a portion below the cut. If you keep going, I’ll try to properly explain why it’s not just a clear-cut question to answer for this one.
A) First, gender ratios, which can be worked around based solely on personality, but still glares out big time. Watership Down has some female characters on the roster, but they tend to matter little comparatively. Hell, there are multiple characters that started as male that were later swapped to female roles in later adaptations. It’s good, and shows that the role can be played by a character, not a gender. But it’s also a reminder that the original work is dated in its viable female cast. By contrast, Mario has a nice number, and they stand out a lot better, each with unique and distinct roles, personalities, and general flavors that they add. They’re fun and dynamic, a highlight to see.
B) This actually leads into the next point, though, which would be the inconsistent characterizations. Both franchises kind of mess around with how their characters are portrayed and what they do. Sure, you get the basics well enough with the major characters: Hazel’s the brave hero leader, Mario tends to be that too. Fiver’s the timid younger brother, so is Luigi.
But it gets weirder the further down the cast list you go. Bowser’s the big bad guy, but depending on his role as the main villain or not, he can either be sympathized with, or totally evil; he’s maybe just looking for love, or has insatiable desires for conquest. Bigwig is a strong authority figure, but can either be super loyal or a part-time jerk that questions his own leader’s authority. Peach is helpless, or more powerful than she lets on. Hell, Clover took over half of Hyzenthlay’s role in the latest adaptation, and they’re far from the only instance of variable depictions in the series, further depending on the characters that are used. Overall, these changes can make them flexible to develop over time, but it makes them harder to pin down on which role defines them best.
C) And that flexibility also leads to mismatching personalities between the casts of both stories. Because Rosalina first appeared as this quiet, graceful, and yet all powerful entity, we’d picture that side to her, kind of elevating her above the usual human counterparts she’d stand beside, calling into question if she’s even human herself. But she’s later show to have simple joys and pleasures, so she’s not totally detached and above it all. This doesn’t quite equate to any particular character in Watership Down; you could try to make her on par with the Black Rabbit of Inlé, based on powers and ethereal-vibes, but Inlé is too tied with death to be a fair comparison for Rosalina.
Likewise, we have characters from Watership Down known for their stock personality types: Blackberry is the smart one, Strawberry is the big eater, and Hawkbit is the deadpan snarker. None of these particularly hit Mario characters due to their shifts in depictions. Sometimes the big eater is Bowser, sometimes it’s Luigi (yeah). Rosalina seems smart, but Yoshi and Toad have been depicted this way as well. Virtually any one of the Mario cast can fall into sarcasm and dry humor. It’s touch-and-go, but doesn’t give a solid match-up for anyone.
D) Finally, if the mentions above didn’t already make it obvious, then the issue falls to how the casts line up with first themselves, and then one another. The core cast for Mario’s main game franchise tends to fall upon Mario, Peach, Bowser, and typically Luigi to round up the rest, though sometimes he can be left out. Watership Down’s main group would likely be Hazel, Fiver, Bigwig, and General Woundwart. These are more or less the essential characters to have for there to be a story to tell for the franchises.
From there, have fun figuring out who matters and to what level. You can probably safely include higher profile picks for the major characters of each. Mario tends to favor Yoshi, some form of Toad, and generally a rotating female cast member, plus a sidekick villain or a few. Watership Down gets a way better story including the heroism from Hyzenthlay (or a female character that takes on her role for the story), and the undermining plots of whoever gets to be Woundwart’s second-in-command. That could form your secondary main characters.
But it just keeps going from there, and each character is weighted differently. Toad can be an individual and important, but also can get shafted for another more important Toad (Toadette, Toadsworth), or simply suffice as a species, not an individual. Should he be considered main or minor? Dandelion is usually lorekeeper alongside being the fastest, but both of these roles have been divided and distributed to other rabbits (Bluebell and Blackavar respectively), calling into question his prominence. Kehaar tends to always appear, but he can be written around pretty easily. Similarly, Bowser sometimes relies on the Koopalings, but they can also be missing for something close to a decade without the blink of an eye. Who matters, who doesn’t? It depends on the audience, and their interests.
…
Honestly, I even tried breaking it down for the characters on each level, and I had a list spanning past 20 characters on each side. And I wasn’t even including everyone, but just the characters that I felt were important. Trying to mix and match them was even worse, to the point where it really couldn’t be done on a really fitting level.
Going by canon interpretations for both, I think you’ve got, at best:
Mario = Hazel
Luigi = Fiver
Bowser = General Woundwart
Peach = Hyzenthlay
Yoshi = Bigwig
That’s going by a core cast, with some additions to make sure the major-most of each group gets included. It’s not great either, for several reasons, since Bigwig and Yoshi do not have comparable personalities, but are both strong. Bowser’s also got redeeming qualities to him that actually earn him some sympathy points, whereas Woundwart…well, I think writers have tried, but he’s best as irredeemable and blatantly evil.
Personally, if I were to go maybe one extra level and include Daisy for main cast on the Mario side, I’d fit her to Bigwig, and instead equate Yoshi to Dandelion, as both of the latter two are known for speed, while the former two can be tough, but also caring as well. But I don’t feel that Dandelion and Daisy are as important to their franchises, whereas one could argue a little harder for Yoshi, and Bigwig is easily important to the story.
I even tried going on my fanfic interpretations (of at least the Mario characters) to see if that would line up better, but then that just screws up where the main villain connects. Because, that would instead look like:
Mario/Luigi = Hazel/Fiver
Bowser = Bigwig
Peach? = Hyzenthlay?
??? = General Woundwart
Because, based on how I’ve written them so far, Bowser’s even less of an evil force, and more motivated based on his heart and his people. This makes no one particularly equal to Woundwart. Conversely, Peach is a lot, well…she’s hardened. If one were to go by Hyzenthlay’s depiction in the Netflix miniseries, I’d wager that’s good enough. But this splits who Hyzenthlay is, so the character doesn’t quite feel whole. Oh, and Mario tends to be leader-like, but also has weird powers and visions going on, which helps Luigi step up into his role in his absence, so…they both have shades of Hazel and Fiver’s roles.
Furthermore, I get lost in my own biased interpretations of the fanfic I’m never writing for Watership Down, so that would make going down the rabbit hole a lot more terrifying. Well, for you reading this, anyway; I’d be thrilled to keep it going and gush about personalities in my head for the WD cast, lol.
So, that’s kind of how it goes in my mind. Yes, I’m positive there’s enough flexibility to go down each list and match up characters based on as much as possible for each side of them, or by ignoring some things. Mixing some canons together, you could get:
Mario = Hazel
Luigi = Fiver
Peach = Hyzenthlay
Daisy = Bigwig
Bowser = General Woundwart
Kamek = Vervain/Orchis/Whoever the schemer to Woundwart is
Yoshi = Kehaar
Toad = Pipkin/Bluebell
Toadette = Clover
Wario = Strawberry
Waluigi = Cowslip
Bowser Jr = Campion
Rosalina = Dandelion
Here, not only do these feel weirdly off when you look further into those characters, but it doesn’t really cover them properly, nor does it pick the best from the rosters of each. Yoshi’s kind of the foreign type to the core cast, so he connects well enough with Kehaar. This, however, chooses to ignore his famous speed that aligns him best with Dandelion, which instead relates his storytelling to Rosalina, because both tell stories, but that’s where their similarities end. We also choose to ignore Yoshi’s big appetite, which would connect best to Strawberry, putting the much less important Wario up to that role.
Similarly, this also confuses the interpretations on certain Watership Down characters based on how they’re depicted, and then sort of picks a Mario character that might connect. The easier one is Woundwart’s right hand scheming little twerp, which has been both Vervain and Orchis in the tv series and miniseries respectively. They work in a role similar to Kamek, a dutiful but terrified henchman.
It gets worse, though, when we hit something like Pipkin or Bluebell, as the latter was absent from the tv series, the former from the miniseries, and though both have some childish innocence to them, neither personality ends here for either. Toad, when he’s fleshed out as a standalone character, probably could be seen as innocent and childish, but I doubt he’s alone, and also has roles that elevate his mindset, which doesn’t quite make him on that same level.
Not to mention that some just don’t outright fit (Junior to Campion), but going that far along, that’s about all that works out well enough for characters that can be argued for their prominence.
…
Bottom line would be that, while I totally love both franchises and would like to put them on a equal level for comparisons, it doesn’t do either one justice.
All the same, thank you for the interest and the ask! It was fun thinking it over.
#askecho#art-and-word-dumpsite#character comparison#watership down#super mario bros#long post#mario#luigi#bowser#hazel#fiver#bigwig#peach#woundwart#princess peach#general woundwart#these do not equate#but it was still fun
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Part One: Carried Away in A Chariot
Steve Rogers X Reader WoC, Bucky X Reader WoC
Warnings: None
A/N: This will be in three parts and was inspired by Hades & Persephone Mood board. This occurs after the snap where I optimistically believing Steve survives but how he deals with the PTSD. Half of this, like always, is inspired by @geminimoonbeamx and the other has been on my mind after the Endgame trailer.
How do you kill a god?
You rob them of love and loyalty. They will be alone and unhappy, and eternity will seem like a punishment, but it is not death.
- Hera, Queen of the Gods
Disappointment hung over him like a cloud, followed him everywhere. Before it was just his psyche that was attacked by the darkness that loomed over him, promises of death that echoed in his subconscious when he slept; images that haunted his mind when he closed his eyes.
Now he carried it like a weight, burdened on his back as he sloppily navigated through the world. He had no desires anymore.
Life had given him the gift of death. To have to breathe it everyday, bear witness to its effect without the power to change the outcomes. He felt like a ferryman, responsible for the living souls of today with the promised that he’d have to kiss them goodbye tomorrow. He was death on earth, walking in flesh form and he didn’t know how to console it
And yet he stayed.
No matter how much he fought, no matter whatever the evil was that he had to attack it was death that eluded him - not life. And when he had fixed all that had shifted wrong, turned dust back into bone and flesh, to rewind time and save the world from genocide he still remained.
And thus the disappointment lingered.
He was a walking god of the underworld.
“Perhaps you just need to get away?” Natasha had suggested one evening, walking down the cold narrow streets of New York that no longer held the same color. Now he only saw drab colors of black and blue that tarnished his eyesight, burdened his shoulders.
“Go where? I feel like I spent five years getting away. I’m tired of running. I’m tired.”
Natasha didn’t know the answer.
“Maybe you stop….stop being Captain America Steve. You don’t have to be the man that saves the world all the time.”
This time from Bucky who sat across from him in a coffee shop, the a cup of hot coffee cradling his vibranium and flesh arm as his eyes flickered around the cafe. Eight months after the snap and his friend was operating and functioning like nothing had ever occurred. Despite the explanations that Steve had to communicate with him and the others - how he and a few others had to watch his friend disappear in front of his own eyes - Bucky remembered nothing. Nor Sam or Tony or T’challa or anyone. Instead, they jumped back into their roles head first, like nothing had ever been wrong.
It made Steve snap.
“Right. So I can sit her and broad more. No thank you.”
He looks out the window at the snow, blistery and wet and painting the streets with its evidence. He hated this time of year, hated when the cold weather moved from being nostalgic and romantic and just became a nuance. It was the kind of snow that was light and consistent, black residue sticking to the roads, splashing onto the concrete sidewalks and the annoyed New Yorker’s who were stuck walking to and from their destination in the wet coldness.
Bucky sighs, Steve knows he wants to tell him something but the bell in the cafe rings again, causes the super soldier to shift his eyes over to the door - to the line where you stood. Steve doesn’t have to look behind him to know that it's you - he can faintly smell your perfume of flora above the smell of milk and coffee. Can hear the soft sounds of Tchaikovsky blare from your headphones, the sound of you pulling off your mitts.
“You should just ask her out.” Steve says lowly and Bucky ducks his head, takes a sip of his coffee.
“No way Steve.”
Steve shrugs,
“Life’s too short to - “ he stops himself, chuckles. What did it matter - Bucky wasn’t going to ask you and Steve stopped caring enough to urge his friend.
“She’d never go for it.” Bucky echoes like he always does, low morose tone and all.
Steve picks up his coffee, takes a sip.
“Your loss.”
He doesn’t understand how one can love something so strongly and yet be annoyed by it. Humanity was wearing on him. Their laughter, their remorse, their desires and their laments. Sam moved out of the tower, decided to get an apartment in uptown and Steve only decided to move in after having to deal with his co-workers for a year after the snap.
They were tiresome.
Tony may have actually lost his fucking mind. Steve wouldn’t put it past the older man - isolated in space for weeks on the verge of starvation sounded like enough to make any one human break into two and Tony was always heavily affected by his emotions. Natasha stoically operated through the world like nothing had ever occurred and for some reason that annoyed him. Wanda walked around in depressive remorse - Vision was gone and gone for good. He didn’t’ know how to tell her that it was the consequence of power - to be given a gift and robbed of loved. Bucky was so love strung over you that it was the last straw for Steve - he had to get out.
Brooklyn wasn’t his Brooklyn so he claimed Astoria with Sam like his own.
It worked out nicely for the pair of them.
He still walked the 17 blocks to the coffee shop he liked to sit at, the black coffee perfectly bitter and warm - the residents not giving him any mind. The Captain America in their mind had died when he saved the world and the man that was operating was foreign to them. He was okay with that. It gave him silence, the refuge he needed.
He does this consecutively for weeks, winter changing into spring, spring into autumn and autumn into winter. Goes through the motions, alone, a cup of coffee and pencil and pad in his possession that he never touches.
That’s before the shift.
It’s in April and it's cold outside though spring has already tried to combat the winter cold. Buds growing on trees, wind blowing dead grass away to make room for new. He sits, like he always does in the cafe, alone. His phone lights up, a few texts from Bucky and Sam - a voicemail from Natasha but it doesn’t matter. He wants to draw again, wants the breath of inspiration that allows him to see things - people and humans beyond an ash colored lens but he’s frozen.
He looks over at the ivory paper of his sketch notebook, blank minus the charcoal pencil that laid on top of it and sighs, his hands itching to pick up the drawing device but knowing it was to no avail.
The bell of the cafe door rings, his ears pick up on it and he’s rewarded with your perfume again. Jasmine, it's intoxicating and sweet but he doesn’t turn his head, doesn’t look your way. In fact, he had no idea what you looked like. Identified you only by the sweet smell of your perfume - he hadn’t cared enough to look behind him the first time that Bucky had identified you and all the times after.
You were just background noise.
Except today your smell nears him, dangerously close, until he feels the warmth of your body emanating off of you and you hesitate before you clear your throat,
“Excuse me I don’t mean to interrupt but…..would you mind sharing the table?”
He looks up at you and is greeted with the sun.
Your smile is soft, friendly and your eyes are wide and dangerous, the dark pink tinge of your lipstick a contrast to the hue of your skin, brightens it. Your hair pulled up into a bun, hands holding a book and cup of tea safely.
“Or not. Its justs…...really crowded in here and I’d much rather share a table with you than the old man who is licking his lips at me.”
He stares at you, unable to find words but nods, shifts his notebook to make room for you.
“Thank you,” you move into the seat fluidly, delicately before you place your bag near your leg. A long sliver of pink silk slips out, a sliver of a ballet shoe that you tuck back into the bag before you open your book. “Promise I won’t bother you. Just here to read for a bit.”
And you don’t. He spends the hour watching you, probably borderline ass creepy as Bucky stares out at you and you’re none the wiser, head bent over your book as you sip your tea until it's gone. Then you gather your things, thank him for sharing the table and your gone.
Despite your absence, your smell lingers and he feels something stir in him. It's not until hours later, when he’s standing on his balcony in the safety of darkness that he realizes that its longing.
And that he wants to see you again.
You don’t show up to the cafe for three days and its three days enough that tells him to let you go. That no good come from his new interest. He was a broken man and you were life. Better not to drag you down in flames.
‘Besides, Bucky was in love with you’ he tells himself but he knows that he doesn’t care about that, not really. He had started drawing again. Vivid drawings of the events of the past, dark and treacherous and life like.
“Those are kinda freaky aren’t they Steve?” Sam had noted, looking over the large super soldiers frame one evening and drinking the vivid imagery of the death of Thanos, noting the rest of the Avengers.
“It's what happened isn’t it?” Steve says lowly and Sam nods, walking away. The drawings were disturbing but at least his friend was drawing again. Sam was worried about Steve. He was different. Curt, abrasive, annoyed. Motivated by missions but not truly invested in the outcomes. He knew he was depressed - understood why. Sam understood that he had died - then come back none the wiser - and could understand that to experience the loss of friends where they couldn’t even remember may play a number on the psyche.
For Steve it was evolving into darkness.
Steve is aware Sam is worried but doesn’t comment on it. Reads all the PTSD books Sam leaves around, occasionally chats with him but pretends that everything is fine. Knows it doesn’t convince Sam but honestly doesn’t care enough to put on the facade that he should. Instead, he escapes the cages of the indoors and greets spring. The weather is bright, sunlight emerging and rain showers slowly becoming less frequent. He’s always had an infinity for Central Park but after the defeat of Thanos couldn’t stand the large, expansive area. Reminded him too much of how delicate the life balance was. Now, he liked to sit on benches for hours and watch birds emerge from their wooden sanctuaries and bunnies frolic in the budding grass - moms with babies in carriages and kids who giggle pleasantly as they run in child wonder.
When he’s done he goes to the cafe, orders his coffee, starts sketching. Shadows barely captured by light, fine details of the nightmares that haunt his mind.
“You’re drawing again,”
Your voice is sweet, your tone smooth as you ease through each syllable that slowly falls from your lips. He looks up at you, drinks in the book in hand and tea with a smile dancing on your face.
“Do you mind if I join you?”
He should say no, should leave and give you the table for yourself. But he finds himself smiling, the first time in what feels like years and it feels unfamiliar as he waves his inky hands across the table.
“Please.”
You both sit in silence, you reading ‘A Cautionary Tale for Young Vampires’ and him drawing, sipping on your beverages pleased to be in a moment where you can step away from your day to day nuances and focus on the small pleasures.
You both order three cups each, share a large coffee cake and are asked nicely by the owner to leave before you escape back into the reality of your worlds.
“It was nice seeing you again,” you say as you walk out in the fresh night air, grabbing your phone - your headphones. “Your drawings are nice. I’m glad you’ve found your….inner-voice again. So to speak”
He nods, smiles at you once more as he drinks in your frame in the waning light. The way the orange, rose and blue blend together, highlighting your silhouette, hair pulled back as your dark eyes glisten in the light. He should pull away, take this gift for what it is and be grateful for it.
But he’s hungry for you, likes the small flame you’ve ignited in his dark heart and he finds his voice to say as you turn to walk away,
“Wait!”
It takes you both off guard and you stop, raise a brow as you look at him.
“How do you feel about zoos?”
You are the light he doesn’t realize he needs. Draws your image for five days until he sees you next.
“Who’s the girl?” Sam asks one night, Natasha and Wanda peeping into Steve’s studio as he move onto another canvas - onto you. Sam’s happy that Steve’s moved on from the dark images of his nightmares, unable to face them in the safety of the light and Wanda and Natasha want to know who’s inspired this new mood.
“You like her,” Wanda says curiously, her psychic brain reading his betrayed thoughts and it's the first time he’s heard her be so positive. That is, until his brain betrays him and she reads the dark secret of you, tsks disappointedly. “I won’t tell him but you should care. He is your friend.”
“Tell who what?” Natasha asks, following the European redhead who walks away from him, her disappointment obvious.
She never shares.
Instead allows him to meet up with you at Central Park, to watch happy emotions play over your face. You find positivity in everything. From the zoo animals to the families who walk by, to the rain that falls on the both of you as he grabs your hand and pulls you to shelter to the nearest tree he can find as you both leave the zoo.
“This isn't safe.” you say, the dress you were wearing sticking to you. A little pink number that reminds him of a time where he was younger and weaker, the red floral design highlighting your frame. He doesn’t care that he boldly drinks in your nipples that were puckering from the cold or that he could see your panties paint your ass. .
He wants to remember how it feels to touch another human again.
“What isn’t?” he says instead.
“Hiding under a tree. We could get electrocuted. You should know this Captain America.” you laugh, exaggerating his title and though it annoys him he can’t help but give an off handed smile.
There’s a flash of lightning, followed by a dark grumble of thunder that shakes the earth and causes you to jump naturally into his arms, gripping his thick biceps as you turn and look around. He takes the moment to drink in your vulnerable features, the softness of your cheek, the length of your eyelashes as they kiss your cheek. Your arms are strong, reminds him of your dancing physique and the strength that your body carries. When the thunder passes, rain falling heaver you turn your face up to him. Your lips are plump from you biting them in fear and raindrops fall in disarray down your face greedily and he sighs.
Angels weeped of the inception of your beauty.
“I rebuke death it would seem so if you need safety, you’ll most likely find it in my arms.”
Its meant to be a joke but he knows he fails at the delivery - humor had never been one of his stronger characteristics. You watch him curiously, tilt your head curiously before you whisper,
“Death evades us for as long as we need to learn a lesson from living.”
He’s intrigued by your thoughts but distracted by the way your face has contorted, sadness etched in your faces beauty and he wants to bend down and kiss you while he whispers against your lips that it will be okay. Instead, you break away and look off into the distance,
“I know a bit about that. When the snap happened….I lost everyone and yet I remained. And when they returned - it was as nothing changed. My mother knew nothing that had happened to me in eight months I had learned to mourn and accept her death. She cradles me still like a child despite the fact I’ve been on my own for ten years and she still doesn’t hear the secret I whisper out into the night. That I’ve blossomed into a woman long before she left and will continue to thrive long after she’s gone.”
Your hands are warm over his arms, even through the layer of his jacket and you blink back up at him and smile,
“You didn’t need to know that. Let’s make a run for it and grab a coffee. Its three and I haven’t had my fourth cup.”
You’re gone from his embrace long before he can mourn it. He stands in wonder as he watches the way you spritely run through the rain, turning back and smiling at him, your dress dancing along your legs.
Like morning glories that raise their petals to the rays of sunlight he’s found himself drawn to you, needing your spirit to pull out his beauty.
He’s a different man. Still dark and brooding and withdrawn, but there’s something different about him. Bucky can't put his hand on it, watches his best friend operate with the same motions but there’s just something off. He was different. Gone most of the time and even when he was around he wasn’t there. Head buried in a new book or in his sketch pad or speaking lowly on the phone. Bucky’s found leftover ticket stubs to three ballets, had no idea that the romantic in Steve still lived and took him to such shows.
“I think he’s dating someone.” Natasha finally admits out loud as her, Sam and Bucky lay out on the living room floor one evening, high and watching constellations dance above them from the safety of the tower.
“Steve doesn’t date.” Bucky mumbles, eyes half closed and Sam pauses, hesitates,
“I’d normally agree with you Bucky but…...I don’t know. I caught him ordering flowers and he’s always gone and he’s always drawing her, the mystery woman. I swear I found a stub to the ballet but Steve denies it.”
“Holy shit,” Natasha sits up and looks at them. “So have I!”
“Me too.” Bucky agrees, intertwining his fingers together as he closes his eyes.
It’s Sam who nods and shakes his head,
“Not to mention, he comes home smelling like jasmines. Has to be a girl a woman that’s marked her scent on him.”
Bucky pauses, can’t move. His brain racks back to you -the first time that he saw you. Your scent that had caught his attention in the cafe he and Steve had learned to love. It was an autumn day and you were wearing a flowy skirt, a knit sweater covering your tank top. Ballet shoes slipping out of your bag, listening to Chopin and reading the menu of the coffee shop as the sun hit your face perfectly. You smiled at the elderly couple that asked if they could go before you, not hesitating at all as you offered your spot. You had briefly looked at him, smiled, before returning your eyes back to the menu.
“It’s Jasmine,” Steve had said underneath his breath, blue eyes temporarily meeting Bucky’s before returning out of the window, into the busy streets of New York. Voicing the question that was already on Bucky’s mind.
“She smells like Jasmine.”
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October 14th-October 20th, 2019 CTP Archive
The archive for the Comic Tea Party week long chat that occurred from October 14th, 2019 to October 20th, 2019. The chat focused on Lanterns of Arcadia by Beth Zyglowicz.
Featured Comment:
Chat:
RebelVampire
COMIC TEA PARTY- WEEK LONG BOOK CLUB START!
Hello and welcome everyone to Comic Tea Party’s Week Long Book Club~! This week we’ll be focusing on Lanterns of Arcadia by Beth Zyglowicz~! (http://www.lanternsofarcadia.com/)
You are free to read and comment about the comic all week at your own pace, so stop on by whenever it suits your schedule! Remember, though, that while we allow constructive criticism, our focus is to have fun and appreciate the comic. Below you will find four questions to get you started on the discussion. However, a new question will be posted and pinned everyday (between 12:01AM and 6AM PDT), so keep checking back for more! You have until October 20th to tell us all your wonderful thoughts! With that established, let’s get going on the reading and the chatting!
QUESTION 1. What has been your favorite scene in the comic so far? What specifically did you like about it?
QUESTION 2. What exactly do you think the shadow creatures were that burst out during the explosion? How are they tied in to the magic disappearing in Arcadia, and what other mishaps might they be causing? Lastly, how can they be stopped?
snuffysam
1. My favorite scene is probably the scene where Phineas is explaining all the bad things he did to the university chairs. The cold, calculated way he describes all the horrible things he did is sickening, but fascinating. Plus, the scene helps display what a scumbag the Director is, with how he claims he knew nothing about this scandal but subtly leads the conversation along to the information he wants Phineas to spill.
2. The shadow creatures are perhaps... "anti-magical" creatures of some kind? Like instead of generating magic like some other beings do (e.g. the magic fireflies), they just endlessly absorb like a black hole. And if they completely absorb a being, their memory is erased from the world? Not sure what that has to do with turning Peggy into a wolf though. Perhaps the anti-magic ghosts can release the magic they absorb and cause mischief that way? (alternatively... Peggy has always been part wolf, and it's just the lack of magic that's keeping her from hiding her true form)
RebelVampire
QUESTION 3. At the moment, who is your favorite character? What about that character earns them this favor?
QUESTION 4. Who do you think changed the Library’s pledge in Arcadia and for what reason? Is it simply discrimination, or is something else going on? In general, what do you think is the cause in Arcadia’s general hostility towards non-humans?
RebelVampire
QUESTION 5. What has been your favorite illustration in the comic so far? What specifically about it do you like?
QUESTION 6. Do you think the other shards are in danger, or will magic naturally return to normal? In what way do you think the council at the Hub will play a role in the events going forward?
SpaceTurtleArt
Author here! I'm very excited to see people's answers to these, they're all great questions. :D
Also if you have questions for me, please feel free to ask, I will do my best to answer as long as it's not spoilery.
RebelVampire
@snuffysam I really like that scene as well, even if it made me feel flabberghasted with just how non-chalant Phineas is about everything.
1) My favorite scene is probably the one after the board decides how to punish Phineas, where Avani's sponsor is throwing shade at the Director. I really kind of like how cut-throat the scene was an disconnected from how the students might be hurt. Instead, it was just all politics at that point, and it was kind of nice to see that sort of pettiness reflected. Since office politics really are a thing and makes people just as petty as you see in that scene. 2) I have to agree with @snuffysam on this. They scream anti-magic or at least things that eat magic up wherever they do go. I imagine this goes beyond just taking magic away but also extends to warping the intended function of magic. Like magic is operating with a wheel that's missing some spokes now. As for how they can be stopped, I imagine that's gonna involve creating another artificial ley line and banishing them back to where they came from. However, that will be harder than it sounds since you'd have to do it in a way that doesn't produce more of them. Alternatively, it could be they'll dissipate on their own naturally if they're just wrangled and cut off from all sources of magic. Basically starve 'em out.
3) My favorite character is Phineas. This is one of those instances where I love the villain. Like he's just...he's just so villainous. No remorse, even when caught red-handed. I can't help but appreciate that sort of ruthlessness. However, he does have that nice balance where there's a twinge of sympathy. Cause you gotta wonder how much of this twisted personality was caused by spending too much time with dear old uncle. 4) I feel like it was the Director or the Director's evil predecessor who changed the pledge. I think discrimination is involved in the reason, although I don't feel that's all of it. Cause this seems more like the sort of thing you'd do to create a legal loophole. So when you do get caught, you can say "ah ah ah, read the fine print there." So it could've been more that they wanted a way out should the worse come to pass. As for the general hostility, it's probably just from non-contact. People fear what they don't understand. So if they aren't getting an opportunity to interact with those who aren't human, of course resentment, bad rumors, and etc. will crop up. As, unfortunately, people tend to judge groups by the worst people of those groups, since people listen to more bad news than they do good news.
RebelVampire
5) I gotta go with the obvious of one of the opening pages, namely this one: http://www.lanternsofarcadia.com/comics/10/ I super duper love the composition as well as the color contrasts. I also like the shadow-y figure foreground as well and that they're so close to the bottom of the frame. It makes them feel so small and really overall expresses the direness of the situation and that there is nothing in their human powers that they can do at the moment. 6) I do think the other shards are in danger. And that while I don't think things will escalate super fast, I feel that if the issue isn't contained, the magic eaters will spread until there is no magic left. Granted, it is questionable if eating all magic means ambient magic can't return at some point. I think the council is gonna be feeding Avani and Guardian some pretty essential knowledge down the line and that the two teams will have to work together in order to solve the crisis. Cause even if they can find a way to contact each other, I feel there will be other difficulties with the council being able to act in person in Arcadia.
RebelVampire
QUESTION 7. Which characters do you enjoy seeing interact the most? What about their dynamic interests you?
QUESTION 8. Why do you think Avani’s grandfather burned research and hid information he had about artificial ley points? How does this tie into current events? Ultimately, do you think artificial ley points can actually be made safely?
RebelVampire
QUESTION 9. What sorts of art or story details have you noticed in the way the comic is crafted that you think deserves attention?
QUESTION 10. Why do you think Silas Kane was having his nephew continue research into ley points? What other information do you think he knows, and can he be stopped? Lastly, what might he have to do with other creatures disappearing in Arcadia (if anything)?
RebelVampire
7) I enjoy seeing Phineas and his uncle interact the most I think. I like this dynamic where even though Phineas is a jerk and pretty evil, you can tell his uncle is far more so. So there's this interesting dynamic where it's hard to tell how much of Phineas' personality might be different if not for his uncles influence. So to me that kind of makes all their interactions an interesting exploration of character degradation as it were. 8) Consider the director mentioned that he'd seen the shadow creatures before, I think Avani's grandfather did the exact same experiment and had the exact same results on a smaller scale. Thus noped out of, ya know, destroying the world. I mean all the pieces fit so well to make that answer seem the most likely to me. As for whether an artificial ley point can be made safely. I want to say the answer is yes, but it's a question of should you and becomes ethics. Like for example, take our world. Arguably the advances we've made our amazing. I mean here I sit, at my computer, talking to people on the other side of the earth like it's no big deal, sipping my water I don't have to worry if it's fresh or not. But all these advances have come at a cost to nature. And I kind of think ley lines fall into the same category. Where maybe you could, but is the cost of doing it worth it?
9) I've really liked the consistency of the unique words. For instance, the other sorts of areas as shards etc. Like it's not so foreign it's hard to kind of grasp what they mean by shards, but at the same time it's just got the right amount of weight and difference to add that nice in-depth fantasy feel to the world and make it feel unique. 10) I think Kane is just the type to be obsessed with progress. Like the sort of man who 100% believes the ends justifies the means. So if he has to kill half the population to advance science, then so be it. However, as director, he obviously needs to maintain his position to have access to the resources for experiments. Hence why you delegate to minions. At the very least, I think he knows 100% the consequences of what his experiments are and how to replicate at least some of the old research into ley points. But as for can he be stopped? Sure. Of course. He's not some immortal or something as far as I can tell. It's just a matter of will everyone wise up quick enough to his antics. As for the creatures disappearing, again, I definitely think it's him and it's for the sake of progress all living creatures be damned.
RebelVampire
QUESTION 11. What do you think are this particular comic’s strengths? What do you think makes this comic unique? Please elaborate.
QUESTION 12. What role do you think Isaac will have within the story given his previous involvement in the ley point experiments? Additionally, how is it that Isaac can’t seem to remember the name of his friend who died?
snuffysam
I feel like an artificial ley point can be made safely without harming nature, but... capturing magical creatures probably isn't the way to do it? Like I feel like the lesson of the story is building up to a "harmony with nature" thing, and that a new ley point can only be made by respecting all beings.
This comic's greatest strength is absolutely its worldbuilding. Like we haven't even visited many shards yet, but I can tell just from the way the world has been established that each one will be its own unique and diverse area. And that really excites me for when we do get to visit another one.
RebelVampire
QUESTION 13. What are you most looking forward to in the comic? Also, do you have any final thoughts to share overall?
QUESTION 14. What do you think will happen to Avani and Guardian once they reach Morning Glory’s place? Will Guardian be able to make a report? Further, what do you think Avani will decide to do regarding the situation in Arcadia?
RebelVampire
11) For me. the comic's main strength is the balance between fantasy and science in the world-building. I love fantasy, I really do. But sometimes the genre treats the idea of science like it's the plague and creatures don't progress. This comic has struck a great balance where sure, magic exists. But theres also ppl researching magic like they would any energy source. And I like seeing the theme of progress thrown in, as it feels like the world can grow and change just as much as the chatacters. 12) Isaac is definitely gonna be the one who tells the good guys more specifically what Phineas was doing. And I think he'll provide a much needed eyewitness account for deciding what to do. Third, I think just in general, he's gonna do all he can to set things right out of guilt. As for the memory issues, perhaps the shadow things are eating more than just magic but also the connection to magic. And that every creature is reliant on this connection. So as it erodes the connection, people forget things they were once connected with.
RebelVampire
13) I am looking forward to seeing more Phineas and for when his uncle inevitably screws him over. That's gonna be some delicious, horrifying drama that will really send Phineas in a different direction (though whether that direction is good or bad who can say). 14) I think Avani and Guardian are gonna discover they still can't make a report and dive head first into research and trying to learn all they can about ambient magic. And start trying to piece together how they can bring magic back. I think overall, though, Avani will endeavor to do all she can for Arcadia. Cause honestly, given it was her grandfather's research at the heart of this, I think she's gonna feel some familial duty to make it her responsibility to fix. At the very least, she's gonna see it through far enough to help Guardian call the proper authorities.
RebelVampire
COMIC TEA PARTY- WEEK LONG BOOK CLUB END!
Thank you everyone so much for reading and chatting about Lanterns of Arcadia this week! Please also give a special thank you to Beth Zyglowicz for volunteering the comic and creating it! If you liked Lanterns of Arcadia, make sure to continue to support it via some of the links below!
Read and Comment: http://www.lanternsofarcadia.com/
Beth’s Etsy: https://www.etsy.com/no-en/shop/SpaceTurtleStudios
Beth’s Ko-Fi: https://ko-fi.com/S6S169VT
Beth’s Twitter: https://twitter.com/spaceturtleart?lang=en
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Please ramble more about your les Mis/LOTR crossover concept! Where does each ami find themselves when they wake up, how/where/in what order do they find each other, what do they do upon finding themselves in Arda? I want to know all about this.
Friend! I'm being Very Enabled :D
(uh sorry it took me so long to answer; the last couple of weeks turned out to be A Lot, but the EXTREME WALL OF TEXT of this ramble might at least justify the delay. Consider yourself warned!)
Anyway!
Okay, as I said before, the basis of this concept is Pure Aesthetics, so any "logic" is derived from moving backwards from the result that I wanted. But! There is a sort of method to the madness, which is that the Amis are distributed to Middle-Earth in the same order as they die, spiraling outwards from the central point of somewhere-in-Rohan on the same date they die –so Prouvaire and Bahorel appear closest to each other on the 5th of June 3018 and Feuilly, Joly, Bossuet, Courfeyrac and Combeferre land in a loose circle around them a day later, increasingly further away from each other, but not super far. Grantaire and Enjolras, For Reasons, get propelled a lot further away in separate directions. But more of that later.
So! Bahorel and Prouvaire find each other pretty quickly and establish that something Extremely Weird has happened. Being themselves, they are more excited than confused or upset about the situation and immediately set about exploring this new world. In a way, out of all the Amis they are perhaps the most suited for it: Rohan with vast countryside and mountains and mysterious forests, with the oral culture that honours the poet and glorifies the warrior; the horses, the tapestries, even the shadow of some great evil they do not yet understand but can feel in every unspoken concern – it's something of a Romantic medievalist's dream, isn't it? Sure, they also hear Some Bullshit about the way this country is run and have every intention of doing something about that in the future, but for the time being they are satisfied wandering about the countryside, exchanging songs and stories and exploring that forest they have been warned away from by everyone they meet. (Yes, they totally make friends with the ents, is what I'm saying.) They don't search for the other Amis because they have no reason to assume anyone else died –as far as they know, they're busy living happily in a new Republic. They learn otherwise soon enough, however.
What exactly happens with the next four Amis at first is the part that i'm least clear about – they'd have the same kind of initial confusion about the situation and P&B, but they each know for sure that all their friends should also be dead, and would try to look for them. Probably causing some Unsettling Rumours to spread a bit further than is strictly speaking ideal, but i also want most of them to find each other reasonably quickly, because the group dynamic is more of what i'm into here (esp because Bossuet probably landed somewhere terribly unlucky, poor dude.) Other than that I'm not sure, except that I want Feuilly somewhere with Dunlendings for a little while, because I can just *see* him having Unpopular Dunlending Opinions and getting glowered at by every Rohirrim he stubbornly voices them to.
Anyway, eventually I want that group to come together and... not quite settle, but to have something like a temporary home they can share and come back to, as they figure out what to do next. A place just outside of Edoras, perhaps? The kind of community that is getting increasingly twitchy about the state of affairs in Meduseld, enough to shelter this incredibly weird but friendly and helpful bunch of strangers whom Wormtongue is oh-so-curious about and to help dispel wilder rumours about them ("look they are just foreigners okay? From, um, Lake town. Yeah, Lake town"). Of course, healers are appreciated wherever they go, and so are bards, especially when they have a whole repertoire of songs and stories no one has heard before. Bahorel and Courfeyrac probably know their way around horses, for different reasons, Feuilly also has the kind of skills that would be appreciated and Bossuet, for all his bad luck has the resiliency of a cat who always lands on his feet. And if the lot of them get a bit Sarcastic about monarchy and tend to express the kind of ideas that might get everyone involved into a lot of trouble, well. People are Not happy and they'd welcome anything that goes counter to Orthanc influence in Edoras. Bahorel and Prouvaire still go wandering sometimes, leaving with the herders taking horses to pastures, in effort to find out more about what's going on and how they can help to influence events. But mostly, the Amis stick together.
Things are a bit... tense, once the inital shock passes. There is a lot of unspoken grief between them, for the home and people that are lost to them, for the revolution that could have been, for the future they cannot quite see themselves having in this world, and in a strange way, for each other. The whole situation is just so weird they have no idea how to process it and nothing to measure it against. On top of that, there are people missing in their group: by the time all seven of them come together, it's pretty clear it's just Amis showing up in this world, not everyone who dies, and knowing that the barricade was on a brink of a collapse, it'd make sense for Grantaire and Enjolras to be there too. Still, there is a possibility that they survived, by being taken prisoner or in R's case for being missed because he was asleep – and at this point, no one can quite figure out which option they should be hoping for. Not to mention, Enjolras absence shifts the group dynamic around quite a bit and each of them finds themselves having to pick up some emotional slack – which they do, quite well, but in addition to obvious obligations of coordination and decision-making, there is stuff like Bahorel having to pick fights with Combeferre when he's stressed, so he could argue his heart out without having to hold back, or Courfeyrac and Lesgle taking extra time to attentively listen to Feuilly when he's having Dunlending Opinions. On top of that, they are still trying to find a place in this new world and there is this sense of tense expectation, of coming storm.
Grantaire though. He takes Enjolras's hand, he smiles and when he wakes up, he's in Gondor of all places, all alone and very far from everyone he ever knew. "Now why would you do this, you monster??" you might think. And the answer is, well, symmetry. Aesthetic. Enjolras finds himself alone. So Grantaire must be alone too. On top of that, there is the appeal of our guy Grantaire, just after his big moment of revelation, being put into a situation where he has to live with the full implications of it, without being able to revert back to the expectations as he might if he was surrounded by his friends. Gondor is complicated sort of place. Denethor... is not going to miss a universe-traveler landing in his backyard. Nor would he neither dismiss him out of hand or trust him fully. He knows there is a reason for this, but there is no way to figure out what it could be, no more than he can figure out Grantaire; still reeling with the exhilaration of taking a leap of faith, in some ways a transfigured man, but still with all his foibles. Including talking too much, in references that no one in this world could possibly decipher.
So what happens is, once Faramir catches on to what's happening (because no way is Faramir either going to miss an universe-traveler in his backyard) Denethor pretty much hands R over to him, like "Yeah keep an eye on him and figure out what he's on about, or at least get him to shut up." and whooo boy do i have Thoughts about this character combination. Because Grantaire would be like. Reminded of half of his friends within minutes of meeting this guy (which, ouch) but also.. those sure are some Politics he's got there. Would there be A Debate? Sooner or later, probably! Probably despite Grantaire's better judgement! When on one hand you've got someone who is very convinced of the moral righteousness of his opinions, but is also very open to discussion and very very curious and discerning about what people are not saying, and on the other hand a person who is riddled with guilt over convictions unspoken, who perhaps feels like he owes the arguments to those who are not present to speak them, who's just... not good and not being contrary and shutting up ever. It could get really interesting – not in the sense of anyone getting Converted here, but I feel like both of them would end up with lot to think about (and Grantaire would end up as part of the team going to Ithilien at Important Moment)
And that's the other point – what would Grantaire do here, other than cautiously trying to express A Conviction? Well, mostly he'd try to keep himself afloat. In a moment of irony, in this situation he'd be the only Ami to never doubt that he's not alone in this world: partly it's the context of people around him immediately deciding his presence must serve some kind of Divine Purpose – and well, surely no Divinity would pick him to fulfill some destiny and not the other Amis right? But more than that, it's the fact that he Believes, so utterly, not only in Enjolras but in all of them, to the point of just Knowing they'd never abandon him in such a place. So he waits. And hangs on. And tries his best to fight the darkness on the horizon that seems to physically fog his mind and spirit, because he told Enjolras he's one of them, he's got to at least Try, right?
Onwards to Enjolras then! Okay this is the part that I've thought through the most and (**looks back over the length of the post so far**) Cripes. Umh, I’ll try to keep it concise?
Enjolras ends up at, or very close to Rivendell: this is both a blessing and a curse. On one hand, it's as good a place as you're ever going to find if you get dropped into a different universe with no idea what happened or how anything works, and also a very good (and very Aesthetic!) place to heal both physically or mentally but on the other hand, it's very far from where everyone else ended up and no rumour reaches him. So he has no idea what to think: he certainly hopes the others are also around somewhere, but for all his soaring faith, this is not something he can control, so he tries his best to find a way forward regardless of what happens.
So he keeps trying to learn everything he can about the world he is in, mostly with the help of a chatty old hobbit who tells him all the histories and helps him figure out the writing systems (look, everyone can just magically speak Westron okay?) And as fantastical as everything seems, and sundry dark lords notwithstanding, there is a lot that is broken about this world which is perhaps not so different from the one he left behind. All the same, it's clear that fighting Sauron must take the first priority.
(This is what he keeps telling himself when he finds out about the Heir of Isildur thing. Please just take a moment to imagine his expression.)
Anyway! The actual plot of the book would catch up soon enough, the Council of Elrond happens and as the Fellowship is being composed, it would become pretty damn clear for anyone with eyes what the Divine Forces were expecting Enjolras to do here. However, that brings me to the other point of curiousity which prompted this AU, and that is Enjolras and the Ring. Because I do feel like in his own painfully pragmatic, bright-burning idealistic way he would be pretty vulnerable to the Ring's influence. Not for a lack of self-awareness, or overconfidence, or for thinking that such means could ever be justified, but from the same impulse that had him shoot Le Cabuc: he's the sin-eater, he'd take that fall to spare the others in full expectation that they'd have to overcome him and render him harmless. And the Ring being what it is, it could use any opportunity to force such a decision, making it seem like the only option available whether that is the case or not. Even so, I'd think Enjolras would be quite self-aware – and also pretty upfront – about his own vulnerabilities and oh, it'd be such an interesting conversation to have between him and Frodo and Gandalf before a decision is made. Also, bonding with the hobbits! and the rest of the fellowship! Gimli would immediately adopt him, idk it's just the Truth. Having people ask him “are you an elf?” multiple times, which he’s so confused about! Hella awkward bonding time with Aragorn! xD
Oh and then The Plot would happen but Geez, this is already horrifyingly long. If you are still reading this and haven’t been bored to tears yet I might tell you about it another time!
#Autumn answers#that LotR AU thingy#les mis notfics#ringlords and shiny rocks#wild-oats-and-cornflowers
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@morning-gloree21 replied to your post:
Okay but this sounds super interesting? :P I wanna hear more
Thanks for the interest! 😊 And it’s nothing special, really, not really much different from the movie save for some points, but I won’t object to rambling about this a bit, haha.
Characters:
Elsa: Nyo!Canada (Marguerite/Maggie – I guess that being a royal most people would call her with her full name ‘Marguerite’, but her family, ‘Maggie’)
Anna: Nyo!America (Amelia) – but, since Hell will freeze over before I write any incarnation of America younger than Canada, she’s Maggie’s half-sister, born out of a previous marriage of the Queen (with a nobleman). She doesn’t remember her father and the King (Maggie’s father) has always treated her as his own daughter, however, she’s not the first in line for the throne, even if she’s two years older than Maggie.
Kristoff: Russia (Ivan)
Hans: Prussia (Gilbert) – but, he’s not evil. I’ll explain in a moment.
There isn’t Olaf, because Maggie can’t create life, she just has a ice powers. However, Kumajiro might cover a similar role.
No Sven, either.
The role of the Trolls is covered by General Winter, who is an ancient Winter Spirit.
Arthur is Amelia and Maggie’s cousin from their mother’s side (four years older than Amelia). His mother is the royal mage, and he has inherited her powers.
Plot:
The beginning would be very similar to Frozen, with Maggie accidentally hurting Amelia while they’re playing. Arthur’s mother can’t do anything about it, so she summons this powerful winter spirit who heals Amelia and erases her memories of Maggie’s powers. The only ones who remember them are her parents, Arthur’s mother, and Arthur. General Winter also gives Maggie Kumajiro, a magical polar bear cub who can talk and won’t be hurt by her powers. Over the following years, Maggie completely isolates herself (she insists on not even seeing Arthur, even if he knows about her powers, because she’s afraid of hurting him) while Amelia carries on her normal life (she’s not as isolated and lonely as Anna was, she still has Arthur, but she does miss Maggie, and there’s the problem that she doesn’t fit well in court, with her active personality and directness, being too loud, preferring traditionally masculine activities to feminine ones... Many potential suitors are driven away by that). Then, not long before Maggie’s eighteenth birthday, the King, the Queen and Arthur’s mother die while on a journey. Maggie does attend the funeral, but after that, she once again isolates herself after making sure that Arthur will look after Amelia.
Edit: In general, Maggie isn’t as isolated as Elsa. She does appear in public at times (because... completely disappearing would just raise questions), she just doesn’t get close to anybody and ends up creating the picture of this ethereal, perfect and untouchable princess. She’s also the very picture of politeness and grace in her brief interactions with people. Many are in love with this image she has created and praise her as the perfect royal, but they don’t dare to get close and don’t realize that, aside from brief social interactions, she’s essentially relegated to her rooms. Court-life also goes on as usual, with the only exception of Maggie’s room being accessible only to her parents, Arthur’s mother and Arthur.
The coronation happens in a similar way to the movie. Amelia meets Gilbert, a foreign prince, and falls madly in love with him when he doesn't put her down for her personality but instead seems to like her, he even agrees to a sword duel and shows admiration when Amelia beats him. Amelia wants to marry Gilbert, Maggie and Arthur disagree, there’s the argument where Maggie accidentally freezes the town, and Maggie flees. Arthur stays at the castle to find a way to revert the spell, Gilbert helps to organize the town to handle the unexpected winter, and Amelia, with the help of Kumajiro, sneaks out to go after Maggie. She meets Ivan, a hunter who has always lived on his own at the outskirts of the town, (more likely, he saves her from some troubles), and convinces/coerces him to help her find Maggie. The two of them bond over the journey, and Ivan is attracted by Amelia’s strength, physical prowess, and even her direct attitude, something she has been always criticized for at court because it was ‘un-ladylike’ but Ivan prefers because it makes her less fake.
Like Elsa, Maggie has convinced herself that the kingdom is better off without her and doesn’t know that it’s still frozen. When Amelia eventually tells her, she panics and, once again, loses control of her powers, accidentally striking Amelia in the chest. Ivan immediately recognizes what’s going to happen and brings Amelia to General Winter (always aided by Kumajiro), revealing that his parents abandoned him and General Winter saved him when he was a child. They get told that Amelia can be saved by an ‘act of true love’ and head back to the city because Amelia immediately thinks about Gilbert.
This is where things start diverging for real. It turns out that Gilbert isn’t in love with Amelia (and he’s horrified by the turn of events) but pretended to because he was desperate to get close to Maggie. Gilbert’s little brother, Ludwig, had been kidnapped years before and is being held prisoner by a witch. They know the location, but any attempt to save him has always failed because nothing can match the witch’s power. Then, Gilbert heard rumours about Maggie’s powers, and he was desperate enough that he had to check. He didn’t truly mean to make Amelia fall in love with him, he just wanted to befriend her first because she seemed more approachable than Maggie. His main urgency was to check the extent of Maggie’s power, however, so, when he realized that Amelia was in love with him, he decided to clear the misconception only later and use it in the meantime – also because he was afraid of pushing Amelia (and consequently, his chance of gaining Maggie’s favour) away if he admitted he didn’t reciprocate her feelings, and he desperately needed that not to happen. He likes Amelia, but he’s not in love with her. With that plan out of the window, Arthur decides to attempt a spell that would most likely kill him, but he doesn’t care, if this would keep Amelia alive (maybe it’s something like him transferring his vital energy to her, trading his life for hers?). In spite of Arthur trying to hide it, Amelia figures out at the last minute the consequence the ritual would have on Arthur and stops him as he’s about to start (like, she uses her last strength to knock something over/burn something so the ritual can’t be completed). This basically counts as her being willing to die to keep Arthur alive, and she’s cured.
In the meantime, Ivan realizes that he has fallen in love with Amelia and, urged by Kumajiro, goes after her, while Kumajiro goes back to Maggie. Kumajiro wants to comfort Maggie, who doesn’t have any idea of how to lift the spell, but he ends up revealing what happened to Amelia (he doesn’t know she has been healed). He’s convinced that Maggie could control her magic and heal Amelia, but Maggie doesn’t have so much faith in herself. She thinks that the only way to save Amelia (and the kingdom, too) would be killing herself. (obviously, this would be elaborated on a lot better in a fic, portraying how Maggie has struggled with self-loathing since she hurt Amelia so many years ago, she thinks she’s responsible for their parents’ death because there were rumours of that journey being dictated by them needing to check something that had to do with magic…) She’s about to do that when Amelia, Arthur, Ivan and Gilbert reach her. Seeing Amelia alive and well doesn’t sway Maggie because she still cannot control her powers, so she’s afraid that she would just hurt somebody again, and there’s still the issue of the kingdom to solve. Gilbert is the one who stops Maggie from killing herself, yelling that she’s the only hope he has to save his brother. This stops her long enough to listen and let the others reach her, and Ivan then knocks her out. (Ivan is a practical man. You’re afraid this girl is going to do something drastic like harming or even killing herself? Knock her out. She can’t do anything, if she’s knocked out. What do you mean with ‘that’s not how you treat a Queen?’) He summons General Winter, and along with Kumajiro he forces/convinces him to teach Maggie how to control her powers, which he does. Maggie doesn’t magically learn control like Elsa did, but the thing is that the winter depends on her powers, even if she can’t control them. Adrenaline and fear kept her going for days, but she’s running on fumes, at that point. (Maggie’s not as all-powerful as Elsa is. I really feel like Elsa’s powers were too much.) As soon as the tension is lifted, she collapses from exhaustion and the winter stops as well, letting the kingdom return to the original climate. (so, on a darker note... yeah, killing herself would have worked as well, for the ‘perennial winter’ issue. Not for Amelia, though, as it was a different issue.) After recovering, Maggie agrees to help Gilbert and she starts learning how to control her powers instead of just hiding them.
Not long later, Francis (or Francine… I really want to use Fem!France somewhere, but I don’t know if this would be the best story) and Antonio arrive to retrieve Gilbert (it turns out that he had run away without telling anybody). They’re both nobles who were friends with Gilbert, and Antonio is married to Lavinia (Fem!Romano), the crown princess of another kingdom (next to the one ruled by Gilbert’s father). They also bring the news that Lavinia’s younger sister, Felicia (Fem!Italy), has been kidnapped as well. Maggie, Amelia, Arthur, and Ivan leave with them to save everybody. After that… I don’t really know, I haven’t thought too much about it yet, but it will turn out that the witch was kidnapping members of various royal families because she needed their blood for a spell that would make her immortal. So far, she has Ludwig, Felicia, and Sakura (Nyo!Japan), princess of an eastern kingdom, (who are trying to stage an escape on their own). The witch was the one who let the rumour about Maggie’s powers reach Gilbert in the hope of luring Maggie as well, but she had underestimated the extent of Maggie’s powers. It also turns out that Ivan is the prince of a Northern Kingdom, the first who had been kidnapped. General Winter saved him thanks to the prayers of his older sister, but Ivan lost his memory in the process.
This is all I have for now. Not as original as I had made it look like from my previous post, I apologize for this. 😅 I don’t think I’m ever going to write it, but this story was really bugging me…
#hetalia#aph america#nyo america#aph canada#nyo canada#aph england#aph russia#aph prussia#aph france#aph spain#nyo italy#nyo romano#aph germany#nyo japan#frozen au#fic idea#morning-gloree21#feyna answers#this is very long haha#but today I have a free afternoon because I'm coming down with something#and since we are going to Paris next week I'd better be careful and don't get sick for real haha
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Okay so I'm kind of reeling from that episode. 3 things: 1. Emiko being in league with the guy they were fighting this ep. 2. Lyla being forced to resign as director of ARGUS 3. Is Diaz really dead?
1. I’m not super shocked about Emiko because I think I read something about comics Emiko having like…allegiances with the Longbow Hunters? Or being an assassin like Shado? Both? I don’t know. Doing bad things. And like that’s how Oliver’s life typically goes. That being said, I like it. It gives Emiko more of a direct connection to the plot and throws more conflict into her and Oliver’s relationship beyond just “they’re really similar and therefore they fight”. So I’m interested to see where that goes. And honestly its the only aspect of Dante that’s interesting to me so far.
2. She didn’t though, did she? Diggle’s taking the fall, unless I missed something. Which I’m fine with because it pushes him back toward Team Arrow. However, if Lyla does end up losing her job, I’m thinking it will be to allow them to push more toward something along the lines of the evil Argus we saw over in Legends (although probably not exactly that). Also, I feel like the Argus hierarchy they established this season makes no sense. Lyla is hiding things from Argus but she’s in charge. And Amanda Waller can shoot down commercial planes, and assassinate people on foreign soil, and just run her Task Force X willy nilly, and no one ever asked her to step down.
3. it appears. We seem to be getting the full set up for a transition into Dante and Emiko as the main problem of the season.
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504: Secret Agent Super Dragon
Let’s move on to another oft-overlooked subset of MST3K – the Budget Bond films. These are always very bad, but often a lot of fun if you’re in the right kind of mood.
Brian Cooper is Super Dragon, pulled out of retirement to find out who’s distributing poisoned chewing gum to co-eds! Boy, if that doesn’t sound like the setup for a thrilling spy caper, nothing does! The plot seems to revolve around a Dutch student named Christine Bruder, so Cooper goes to Amsterdam looking for her. There, in between fucking his female colleagues and flirting with every woman he sees, he learns that Bruder was part of a plot to smuggle deadly drugs into the United States, hidden in fake Ming vases. An evil conspiracy is planning to dope the free world on a chemical that will cause us to violently attack one another, and then… uh, I don’t know what happens after that, but it’s probably safe to assume it’ll end in the bad guys ruling the world. That’s always the goal.
What’s with that spy movie cliché about the glamorous secret agent who sleeps with every woman he meets? Friends, enemies, co-workers, random waitresses… our suave hero loses no chance to insert Tab A into Slot B. He can’t walk down the street without having women throw themselves at him. This trope has been parodied to hell and back in everything from Austin Powers to The Million Eyes of Sumuru and it’s actually sort of weird to see it played straight, as it is here. As a PSA to my readers: never sleep with a glamorous secret agent. He probably has like nine venereal diseases.
The weirdest thing in the movie is a facet of this trope: it’s the bit where Cooper and Agent Farrell are busily smooching when a man breaks into her apartment and tries to kill them. They fight him off, and he commits suicide so they can’t question him. Cooper then throws his body out the window, turns the soundtrack back on, and the couple just pick up where they left off! Maybe it’s because I’m not a glamorous secret agent but I gotta agree with Tom Servo on this one: I don’t think I could have sex in the same room where I just watched a guy kill himself. It wouldn’t be right, you know?
I will say that this indifference towards death bothers me less here than it did in Master Ninja I, but the characters in Secret Agent Super Dragon have presumably have years of both physical training to kill and psychological coaching to deal with the consequences. Even so, just getting right back to the makeout session before the body’s even had a chance to cool seems unnecessarily callous.
The other trope I notice a lot of in Secret Agent Super Dragon is the death trap. Our hero’s life is threatened repeatedly but always in some contrived way that allows him a chance to escape. The first time he’s tied to a rail so some machine can come along and roll over his head. He gets out in the nick of time and it crushes a can of red paint instead. The second time he’s nailed into a coffin and thrown into the river. He holds his breath and inflates a flotation device. The third time, he’s trapped in a building rigged to explode. His buddy flies in with a helicopter. Why doesn’t anybody just shoot this guy? Villains that stupid don’t deserve to take over the world!
Yet another thing that stands out as remarkably dumb is the cause the charity auction is supposed to support – ‘an International Hospital for Babies with Malnutrition’. Okay, so, imagine you’re somebody whose child is starving, which probably means you’re dirt poor. Instead of sending food to you, these people expect you to bring the baby to a hospital, which may be in another country, so that they can feed the kid there. Is the complete impracticality of this supposed to be our clue that it’s a scam? The script never references that, though. Did somebody just pick a bunch of charitable-sounding words? Was it a bad translation of something that actually made sense in the original language? Are the writers just that stupid? We’ll probably never know.
Beyond that… it’s honestly really hard to say anything deeper about Secret Agent Super Dragon, because this is another movie that’s not very ambitious. It has some vague themes about drugs as the downfall of western civilization, but its characters don’t have appreciable arcs and there’s not much by way of symbolism for me to analyze. All it wants is to keep us mindlessly entertained for an hour and a half – and there’s nothing wrong with that, honestly, but Super Dragon isn’t even any good at it. Trying to watch without Joel and the bots I found myself drifting repeatedly. There’s the charming super-spy, the parade of blandly beautiful women, the evil mastermind with a vague plan to take over the world, the easily-escaped death traps… we’ve done this all before, and Super Dragon doesn’t even use the stereotypes in skillful or interesting ways.
The thing about spy movie tropes is they’re so easy to parody, and have been parodied so many times, that even somebody who doesn’t actually watch spy movies can spot them because we all absorb them through pop-culture osmosis. Playing them straight therefore runs a very serious risk of boring the audience. Of course Agent Farrell is working for the bad guys, because in a story like this, a character like her does – and of course she falls in love with Cooper and betrays her bosses for him. None of this stuff is even really foreshadowed (except that Farrell dyes her hair – can’t trust those unnatural redheads!) but we still know it’s coming because we’ve seen the same shit in fifty other movies. The bad guy wants to cleanse the world so it can be made anew? Been there. The movie wallows in misogyny but in all the same old ways, so I’ve got nothing new to say about it.
Throughout the film people talk about the ‘legendary Super Dragon’ but I don’t think we ever get a reason why Cooper’s so great. Bond films begin with a breathtaking action setpiece to show us that our hero has nifty gadgets and balls of steel – Secret Agent Super Dragon begins with Cooper playing dead by the pool. His most remarkable ability seems to be holding his breath for a really long time, and his gadgeteer, the kleptomaniacal Babyface, makes most of his gadgets out of literal toys. I think this might be a joke about the obvious miniatures some of these movies use… but I’m not sure. All I’m sure of is when that dinosaur waddled into the room I was halfway expecting it to demand the return of the Golden Ninja Warrior.
About the only place where the movie seems to accidentally brush by a real statement is in a moment that resembles a historical reference. Cooper has infiltrated a conspiracy meeting (by wearing a half-mask that leaves his rather distinctive chin fully visible) at which the Big Bad, Mr. Lamas, is delivering an expository monologue: their factory in India is in full production of the drug, which will be shipped to America in phony Ming vases and bring the world to its knees! If you’re going to talk about drugs making and breaking empires, China and India are where it happened.
In the late eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, the East India Company fostered opium addiction in China because they wanted cheap tea and because the British government had vague plans, which never came anywhere close to fruition, to add China to their empire. The opium to feed this addiction was grown in India, often by farmers who would rather have been growing actual food but owed too much money to the EIC. This all led to the Opium Wars and a lot of other unpleasantness in which the British Empire came out looking even more like assholes than they usually did. In a story about conquering the world through drug addiction, then, having the drugs created in India and slipped into something Chinese looks like a reference to history repeating itself.
It may also mean something else. Secret Agent Super Dragon is relentlessly white, set mostly in a city in northwestern Europe, where conspiracies of middle-aged white guys drink booze and decide the fate of nations. The actual work that makes this possible, however, is being done by people of colour in the east. Not only does this seem to reference how western nations use other countries as battlegrounds and bargaining chips in their own power struggles, it can also serve as a reminder of something we frequently forget: a lot of what makes our comfortable lives possible comes from other countries, made by people who could never afford to buy it. My eyeglasses, the sweater I’m wearing, and the chair I’m sitting on were all made in China. Our entire economy depends on cheap foreign labor, and I wonder sometimes how much longer that can last before the whole thing falls apart.
Is any of this the movie’s intentional theme or message? I doubt it. The historical reference seems to be just a ‘hey, look how clever we are!’ moment and the rest probably goes no deeper than ‘oh, no, our children are doing drugs!’, which has been on the verge of ending civilization since at least the thirties. Secret Agent Super Dragon is just a dumb trashy Eurospy movie, and not even a very good one. I don’t hate it, but mostly because it’s not worth that kind of effort. The MST3K treatment renders it infinitely more enjoyable, especially when Tom and Crow do Jazz.
Agent Cooper was played by actor Ray Danton, who died in 1992, a year before the episode aired. Probably all for the best. I doubt he’d have been into all those jokes about how his character is perfectly smooth.
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