#when people try to start discourse about sam
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i adore sam for making fcg just fully, tits out (wheels out?) pro-deities in c3 -- it is so fucking funny
all three campaigns we've had even the sorta "pro-deities" (and tbh I find the idea of "pro-deities" and "anti-deities" in cr discourse to be so stupidly black-and-white but for the sake of a tumblr post, sure) characters to have some hangups -- like vax goes with the raven queen but it's obviously this unbelievably heart breaking thing where he has to leave his family behind
or jester creates her own god
fjord with ukutoa (ukutoa) and the wildmother -- even cad isn't so preachy with the wildmother!
so what does sam do for campaign 3?
like the incredible wrecking ball that he often is he just decides -- yeah fuck it. FCG thinks the gods are great and can do no wrong and no he cannot be swayed by other arguments
it's so good
and it is so funny
#critical role#c3#bells hells#sam riegel#when people try to start discourse about sam#i'm always like#you guys know he loves the story right?#and he loves the rest of the players?#he just likes making characters that push everyone else into difficult conversations or choices#that;s#good#that's a good thing#yall are just dumb
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placing my hands out placatingly, asking everyone to please be cool and not reignite og!elias burnt out gifted kid discourse. okay? okay. I think this is setting up some more sam and gwen parallels. from mag 193, we know that elias bouchard (original flavor) was told from a young age that he was smart but lazy, he was squandering his advantages, and he was wrong to envy other children because they were meaningless and he was better. he seemed to internalize this to some extent, because by the time he was in his early twenties he had no friends and no family and no real life, just the certainty that he was destined to deserve better.
I think it is reasonable to assume that gwen received similar messaging during her childhood, as she seems to be treating the OIAR the same way elias treated artefact storage (as a stepping stone job to a bigger career waiting for her up the ladder), and she takes a lot of offence when she feels disrespected. from magp 03, we know she's reticent to tell her friends that she's still working this same job, especially because the friend's party she was going to was to celebrate making partner at a law firm.
from this episode, we know that sam was declared "gifted" as a child and his parents rigorously enrolled him in every program they could find, and it started going down hill when the magnus institute rejected him (did they reject him outright or was he there for a bit and then kicked out? what he said to celia doesn't quite fit his earlier statements, but moving on). he has a lot of pent up and fixated feelings about not being chosen by them, he didn't get into oxford, he just missed the highest grades, and he's reticent to tell his parents that he's working this job, especially because he used to be at a law firm.
we know the bouchards are a wealthy and influential family, and as sam speaks with a south asian accent I think it's safe to assume that his family immigrated. of course, there's a massive amount of variation in the socioeconomic statuses of south asian immigrant families in the UK, and I don't know enough about how british gifted kids programs work to know if sam having been in a bunch of them would imply anything about his parents' disposable income, but nonetheless I still think their different backgrounds potentially say a lot about how they handle these feelings of not meeting the high standards that were expected of / promised to them. gwen is fighting to be on the same level of social status and power as her peers, and sam probably felt like he was he had opportunities for upward mobility in this brand new place but kept failing them. it's causing both of them to be very active characters, they are the two people pushing the story forward the most by far, but the ways in which they are active diverge greatly.
gwen, until recently, had felt like she was unfairly stagnating, like she was "not most people" and was cut out for better, and being constantly barred from climbing the ladder made her both resentful of lena and extremely paranoid / insecure about her own worth. now that she's starting to crack it into the "real work," it's obviously taking a great toll on her, but she doesn't want to back out, she wants to prove herself and take what's rightfully hers and not show herself to be unfit for real power. her actions appear to be guided by an ethos that her life hasn't been wasted yet, she still has time to make good, she just needs to ignore that weakness masquerading as a conscience, please god don't let her fail.
sam feels like he's made mistake after mistake after mistake and led himself to his own desperate state where he only just managed to avoid destitution because his ex was kind enough to hook him up with an emergency job that is actively destroying his physical and emotional health, and he has pinned all this frustration on trying to figure out what the magnus institute was all about and why it didn't choose him. like gwen, great things were expected of him, but unlike her he doesn't seem to still be striving for them, that dried up when he had a breakdown at his last job. now he just wants to figure it out and make sense of it, as if solving the mystery will let him fix it and undo all that time and un-waste his promised potential. his actions seem to be guided by an ethos that, even though he's already screwed everything right up, solving the ghosts that haunt his life will some how lessen their burden and maybe, just maybe, give him closure on the Flaw That Doomed Him and allow him to move past it without dragging it still forward.
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Sam, how did you find your therapist and build such a good working relationship? Every attempt I’ve made at therapy seems to fizzle out after a few months… and no therapist has ever understood the RSD aspect of my ADHD, which makes it all feel a little worse every time I try.
I mean, I think really we're still building it -- I haven't had her more than a couple of months and functionally it's been an every-two-weeks situation most of the time because we keep having to move/cancel. I don't know that I can really speak intelligently to building a relationship with a therapist because this is the first time I've ever done it where I was an adult and in control. As for finding one...
Chicago has a group called Clarity Clinic, which is like a WeWork for mental health professionals -- they offer scheduling, billing, and IT/office space to local people who I think are mostly independent operators otherwise. They have a directory that is highly filterable, so I found my psychiatrist there by filtering to stuff like Adult ADHD and medication management. He's great, but he didn't want to be my therapist and I didn't want him to. When I decided on therapy, I asked him if he knew anyone he could recommend, since he knew what my deal was in terms of personality, behavior, etc.
So he gave me a couple of names of fellow Clarity Clinic folks and I had a look on the website and chose the one that sounded like she'd get on best with me. I think I struck it lucky to be honest -- she's young (compared to me) and has ADHD, and she's very familiar with disability discourse, spoon theory, etc, even fandom to an extent. If I were to go looking today I might look more at therapists who specialize in twice-exceptional individuals, but she's good enough with what I'm aiming at that I don't want to change.
So the best advice I have is if you're being treated for other stuff by someone you trust I'd ask them, but also look for someone experienced with adult ADHD, and I'd look for someone on the younger side who's more likely to be understanding of neurodivergent needs. (I also recommend filtering to queer-friendly therapists if you can; I didn't necessarily need that but it means they're likely to be generally accepting and probably have more liberal politics. With the caveat that in shady places like BetterHealth, "LGBTQIA" counselors are sometimes homophobic creeps with an axe to grind.)
Building the relationship has taken proactivity on my part -- ensuring that I always have an appointment on the books (we book out about six weeks in advance now, because we know one of us will likely need to cancel/rebook at times), making sure that I have either an aim for treatment or at least something to talk about, etc. I think in your case probably having a list of things you want to deal with, so that you can check some boxes up top, might help.
I would definitely open with "I have ADHD and I need help with [aspects of that]; I also have RSD and I need to work with someone who respects that diagnosis and understands how to help with it." I went into mine saying "I have ADHD and I'm also struggling with some really big emotion, so I'm looking for help with those, but also like...I'm not really sure what therapy can offer. I've had some bad experiences in the past but they were all when I was a child, so I'm trying to explore some options." Her reaction was a combination of sympathy and a discussion of the kinds of things we might work on, which helped a great deal.
But yeah, I think it starts with establishing right from the jump what you want and need, and then spending time making sure that you both stay on top of that until you find a rhythm. We're still finding our rhythm, but it's getting easier as I'm learning to be clearer about what I want and more comfortable with being a participant instead of someone therapy just happens to.
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Setting all other discourse about fiction and reality aside, I really love and appreciate how book-readers have decided that SOME little fake guys are actually extremely Real(tm). Like, even in the same BOOK, there will be fictional characters where the reader agrees that the author made a series of conscious and unconscious choices about this character, and there will in the same book be a little guy who absolutely DID exist and DID sentiently do these things.
Okay you need some examples. Most of you will understand Sam Vimes/Terry Pratchett. Everyone understands intellectually that Pratchett was a writer moving his little puppets around (except that Vimes is real, actually.) Pratchett could write Vimes doing ANYTHING and readers would believe it. When you see footlong discourse about Vimes it’s always presented as if he’s a Man who Chose To Do those Things, never a well-worn literary mechanism. People respect him: Sam vimes arrested a dragon - No he didn’t!! Man’s not real! Pratchett could’ve made him do anything! By some apotheosis Sam Vimes is a real little guy.
The character who is the most real is Stephen Maturin, who is much more Real but too obscure to start with. Stephen is the most character ever. He is Irish-Catalan active in 7 different anarchist separatist movements and also serves the British empire also. He is a horrible little scientist doctor surgeon spy, he is VERY dirty, addicted to 3 drugs, plays the cello, has broken every bone, and is smelly also. He has a sloth. He is the predecessor of all “put them in a jar with a twig” blorbos, but unlike YOUR degraded blorbos, he is real, actually. Look at how I write about him. He is our son Stephen who speaks every language. At no point do we accredit Patrick O’B for coming up with any of this hard work, let alone do we accuse him of making Stephen unbelievable or inaccurate. He is a real horrid little man.
With the possible exception of Paddington Bear, who is very polite, most Meta-Real entities are consistently horrid little men. This quality (plus the fact that ACD looms SO VISIBLY and distractingly over his shoulder) may be why Sherlock Holmes is beloved but unreal. He is horrid and detailed, but not little?
As you can see, I am trying to characterise the qualities of these entities, and whether there is a spectrum of reality. Jesus, for example, feels somewhat real, with cloudy edges possibly due to translation artefacts. Gilgamesh might be, ditto. Ishmael is NOT. Lizzie Bennett is a funny one (also a rare real female) because she is not at all real, but you could 100% encounter her ghost. Do you see what I mean here.
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I have some half-formed thoughts about the Sam / Dean autonomy discourse that I wanted to share and hear your thoughts on.
I agree that Sam is certainly not the only character who experiences loss of autonomy. I think reclamation of autonomy is the central narrative throughout the entire series (Team Free Will, anyone?). However, I think that the narrative arcs of each character with respect to autonomy are very different. I think that Sam's overall narrative arc is about manipulation, while Dean's is about objectification.
While Sam experiences repeated manipulations by demons, starting of course with Azazel's blood, the visions, and continuing from his childhood throughout season 4 with demons possessing the people in his life and Meg and Ruby etc., he is always treated as a person. Azazel wants him because he admires his stubbornness, strength, and intelligence. Sam would be his second in command. The demons are manipulating him, but they are giving him choices and their goal isn't to remove his personhood, it's to lead him back into hunting and revenge and make sure he develops the skills to be a good leader of hell.
When the angels finally appear in the story and we learn that Sam is Lucifer's perfect vessel, we again see that Sam is treated as a person. The angels see him as an abomination, but moreso they see him as a mirror to Lucifer, who up to that point is the ultimate example of free will and autonomy to angels. Lucifer represents individualism and is himself a manipulator. The angels see and treat Sam through that lens; he is his own person, and they believe he will make the choice of saying yes to Lucifer because of the kind of person he is. Continuing past season 5, other major narratives for Sam are about loss of autonomy through manipulation, namely his possession by Gadreel.
Compare this to Dean, who we see being repeatedly objectified throughout the course of his narrative. From very early on, we see many characters, including Dean and Sam himself, view and refer to Dean as a weapon, a tool, an animal (not to mention the numerous examples of sexual objectification by humans and monsters alike). He is a "blunt instrument" who exists to be used by the people around him - his dad, his brother, angels. He exists to take care of Sam (to raise him so that Sam can fulfill his own purpose) and save people at the expense of himself, because he is not a person, he is an object. This is especially clear when it comes to the angel arc; the angels don't view him the same way as they view Sam. Dean is "the Michael Sword", "the sword of Michael". This is the most objectified way we have ever heard an angel refer to a human vessel. It's most comparable to how demons refer to their vessels as "meat suits". Since angels require consent to enter a vessel, I think that there is still a certain degree of personification to at least the angels' use of the term "vessel". Dean doesn't even get that. To the angels, Dean is not even a vessel; he is a sword. A weapon. An object.
The angels are particularly annoyed at Dean's refusal to play along with the apocalypse because they view him as an object; the fact that Dean is behaving as though he is a person is totally counter to their perception of what he is and how he should be acting. This theme of objectification carries past season 5, particularly with the Mark of Cain. Magnus views Dean as an object and wants to keep him in his collection in the first episode where we see the MoC affecting Dean, and the MoC ultimately makes Dean into a weapon. In fact, it's the ultimate cumulation of how Dean has been treated since his father first put a .22 in his hands at 6 years old and said that the child trying to get his father's love and attention had a "killer instinct".
Anyway. Like I said, some half-formed thoughts. And I'm curious to hear your take.
I think this is very well expressed. To be quite honest, I've been trying to respond to this all day, but I am having trouble picking one train of thought without immediately thinking of 7 other bunny trails of thought. There is something about the entire "autonomy discourse" (or multiple somethings) that leaves me very bothered in a way I haven't been able to put my finger on, perhaps partly because the topic is so broad, and contains so many little intricacies, but I also think it's something about the framing? I'm happy to share some thoughts as soon as I can refocus and figure out how to unpack some of what I'm thinking, but I also think what you've written here deserve a chance to be absorbed on it's own without any additional commentary from me. ❤️
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Grabbing these tags by @deanwinchesterpregnant from this post to expand.
Because yes, this is a very important part! Sam says it, too!
And while there ARE Sam haters that will say "Sam doesn't know how much Dean sacrificed!" and mean it as a JUDGEMENT and omg wooby!Dean; there are also people like me, who started writing s1 Sam POVs to understand him better, and suddenly connected him to my little brother like, 'OH. Sam doesn't KNOW. How COULD he know??😭' and it's not a judgment of his character or his love for Dean! And he's not stupid! They're both just kids who have yet to work through their own shit enough to realize they don't know EVERYTHING about each other, despite their shared history. It's part of why Sam says in In My Time of Dying that they were "just starting to be brothers again."
Obviously it's a necessary part of s1 to give us, the viewer, expositional glimpses into Sam and Dean's inner workings. But the way they each react to certain new revelations about each other are still canon even if there are Doylist reasons.
It's canon that Sam didn't know Dean carried him out of the fire. It's canon that Dean has felt responsible for Sam almost being eaten by a shtriga since he was 9/10 years old, and it's canon that Sam never even knew that happened. It's canon that the memory of Mary was so coveted by Dean and John that Sam has virtually no connection to her; no stories and no echoes of her in the way they live other than the infamous Winchester Surprise.
It's canon that Sam doesn't really have any happy holiday memories, and Dean does. It's canon that their perspective on the same shared holidays is completely different. It's canon that Dean stole Christmas decorations and presents for Sam and apparently none for himself. And it's canon that Sam realized Dean did that for him and gave him his only present. And it's canon that remembering that made grown-up Sam want to give Dean Christmas even though it meant admitting something hurtful to himself. (John not showing up for Christmas/Dean's last Christmas)
If you put yourself in Sam's shoes--- a kid left alone for most of his formative years; unable to put down roots and make friends; whose best friend, the only one who could even try to understand him, is his good little soldier brother--- it's easier to understand why Sam felt lonely and became a much more introspective person. Because he was literally stuck with just his thoughts and anxieties and the TV for days at a time. When you think about how sick he must've been about it, every time Dean and John would leave. Waiting for that next phone call. Biting his fingernails when the call was late. Wanting to be invited to prove yourself, but also because if you're THERE at least you KNOW what happens.
But then, too, if you can put yourself in Dean's place: it's not necessarily something a kid or young adult can fully appreciate--- especially a somewhat emotionally immature young adult--- that their little sibling is a completely autonomous person with their own inner life. They don't just pause when you leave their sight. Dean throws himself into the hunt, and isn't thinking about how much Sam is worrying about them. He's thinking, "Sam is safe, so I can focus on backing Dad up."
It sounds selfish, but it's simply a fact of the maturing brain that it takes some time to comprehend someone else's existence outside of you as a real thing and not just a vague concept.
So, to touch on another aspect that gets discoursed:
There ARE a lot of things about Dean's parentification that Sam doesn't know at first, but he has always known about it to SOME degree. He had his own perspective on it, and for sure I wouldn't say that Sam thought of Dean as his parent. Dean has definitely always been his older and somewhat overbearing big brother. But who do you think Sam took his problems to? Who threatens to rip his bully's lungs out in After School Special? Who remembers what fucking play Sam did in drama?
And a short related aside--- thinking about how Sam was surprised about the things of his John had in storage. His surprise that John kept an eye on him at Stanford. And relating these things that changed Sam's understanding of his father, to the way his understanding of Dean shifted with each revelation of what Dean had done for him. And despite everything Sam ALREADY knew, his adult brain and life experiences gave him new perspective on things.
This maybe is a little rambley, but oh well. What was I saying...
Oh yeah. So sometimes people get upset about Dean being given like. More praise than he deserves or something, by having those "you practically raised me" lines and things. As if it's a retcon. But it's really not.
It's Sam growing up, and his brain constantly taking in new information and reshaping his understanding. It's Sam seeing how much Dean blames himself for things that weren't his fault, and wanting Dean to see the good he's done. It's Sam being able to see Dean's heart underneath his codependent or selfish decisions, and reaching out. It's Sam trying to remind Dean he can lean on Sam, too.
I've gone off on a tangent and made myself tear up lol. I don't remember where I wanted to end up anymore. Somewhere in the ether there's another rant about how Dean has a harder time allowing himself the introspection on his perception of Sam, and how this leads to Sam having to do a lot of the leading on the emotional maturity of their relationship, and how hard this is when the person you're leading still sees you as their kid, in whatever capacity.
But ultimately, of COURSE Sam does as much for Dean. Of course Sam has agency in this and isn't Dean's baby that had a pampered childhood vs Dean's horrible one. Sam and Dean acknowledging the actual circumstances of their childhood dynamic doesn't have to be a Samgirls vs Deangirls fucking situation lol.
#me.txt#my replies#sam n dean commentary#Dean's parentification#parentified!dean#fandom discourse#peer review#related posts#sam winchester commentary#dean winchester commentary
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Simp (Part 5) | Wilbur Soot
A/N: I don’t know what to put here so hope you guys enjoy this part.
Summary: The internet goes crazy over rumors about you and Wilbur.
Pairing(s): CC!Wilbur Soot x gender neutral!reader, CC!Wilbur Soot x actor!reader.
Warning(s): None.
italics for tweets, bold for article.
my masterlist :))
~~
It didn't take long before fans started noticing. You rarely interacted online except with the people you know and the occasional fans here and there. So, when they noticed the interaction with Tommy and Wilbur, their reaction was to talk about it and chimed in. A few hundreds turned into a few thousands once screenshots of yours and Wilbur tweets crossed to the other social media platform. Both of your fans beginning to freak out and expressed their opinions.
Some were happy.
OH MY GOD Y/N AND WILBUR???
my comfort streamer and favorite actor? yes please
Some were perplexed.
ngl this is an odd pairing yall
huh who would’ve thought
Some were hateful.
bruhhh he’s a white guy playing minecraft for a living
y/n is a shit actor wilbur
This was still manageable for you. It was only discourse amongst the people that chose to care. It was contained in its own little bubble. No articles, no intrusive questions about your personal life when they were suppose to ask work-related questions, no paparazzi waiting by your house or a place that you frequent to, trying to capture photos of your reactions or videos of you slipping up. No one had bothered you. Though, they will eventually.
Eventually was sooner than you thought. Usually it’ll take a few days before the media starts speculating and theorizing, but this time the vultures—that’s what you and Sam called the media and the paparazzis—worked particularly fast cause the moment one of them got ahold of this “hot news”, others did too and that’s when the last bit of privacy you have left will be trespassed for the sake of click–worthy headlines.
It started out small. A post from an Instagram account focusing on celebrities gossip and tea, screenshots of your tweets and Wilbur’s alongside a few commenters occupied the slides. Then, a buzzfeed article with a photo of yourself from a red carpet event a couple of years ago.
y/n l/n came back from social media hiatus and fans think they’re shooting their shot with this Minecraft YouTuber.
In the next couple of hours, after you said goodbye to the cast and crew and left the set, the rumors grew in numbers. Multiple news outlets coming up with their own distinct headlines, making up fake sources claiming to be close to you and saying you were looking for love—that’s true but you never said it out loud to anyone. You haven’t even left the city yet and already you were overwhelmed with it all. Not too mention the emails you’ll be receiving from your publicist.
“So much for peace and quiet.”
~~
On the other side of the Atlantic Ocean, Wilbur stood tall between two teenage girls, smiling with his hands behind his back as the girls’ mother took pictures of the trio. He was on his way home after a practice session with the band when they called him and asked for a picture. He agreed, of course because he was glad to meet some his viewers and partly because they were really polite and not at all weird like some encounters he had in the past.
When the mother and daughters said their thanks and left, Wilbur’s phone buzzed inside his pocket. He fished it out, continuing his path home and frowned when the name of his agent was on the screen. It must’ve been an important for him to call out of nowhere. That, or he probably sent another Roblox gift card to his business email by mistake again—God, he still hasn’t forgotten that.
Wilbur pressed the answer button and lift the phone to his ear. “Hello.”
“Hey, Wil. Are you busy right now?”
“Just on my home actually. Something’s wrong?”
It was silence for a couple of seconds. “Nothing’s wrong, per se.”
Wilbur frowned. “I’m feeling a ‘but’ coming. What is it?”
“I’m just going to cut to the point here, Wil. I’ve gotten an unreasonably amount of emails from various news site wanting to talk to you about y/n l/n.”
“What?!” Wilbur yelled, pausing in his tracks.
“Apparently the Internet thinks that they’re interested in you, romantically. And you know how it is with celebrities, the media are always trying to find out about their private life and whatnot.”
“W–wait, wait, hold on.“ He paused, trying to wrap his head around it all. “They think I’m—”
He couldn’t finish even his sentence cause of how outlandish the situation was. Him, and you, together, romantically. It was mental.
“It appears so.”
“Holy fuck.”
#simp#wilbur soot#wilbur x reader#wilbur soot x reader#wilbur soot x you#wilbur x you#wilbur mcyt#mcyt x reader#cc!wilbur
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disclaimer: I love ted lasso but this season fully cemented the large underlying issue I have with this show, namely its relationship problems
- sam and rebecca: I feel like there was tons of discourse when this was happening so I won't rehash it but i personally don't like how the show tried to push the narrative that there wasn't an issue with the relationship by talking about some of the glaring issues with it (age, power dynamics, etc.) within the show and attempting to counter them. I personally was against this relationship and the stress I felt this season every time they shared a loaded look took ten years off my life
jane and coach beard: red flags galore. I naively thought the show was going in a direction pre s3 where coach beard would have a storyline about getting out of this abusive relationship and was looking forward to this topic being addressed and done respectfully. I quickly realized this season that this was not the case when ted made a comment about how jane and beard's baggage fit together. I feel like this is a case of two "quirky" characters being in a relationship with red flags that are soothed over by just being like "these two people are weirdos, of course their relationship would seem weird/different" instead of just recognizing it for what it is: abusive
- jack and keeley: this was honestly the tipping point. I initially loved that they were making keeley canonly wlw (and yes, I know it can seem regressive to need a relationship for a sexuality to be "canon" but the references in earlier seasons did give me a vibe of straight humor where girls joke about experimenting in the past but it not being meant to mean anything more. maybe I am wrong to think this but given the state of media even today, sue me) and jack and keeley did have great chemistry right away. I have no problem in discussing toxic relationships, even in queer relationships, but the show irked me by having relationships such as sam/rebecca and jane/coach beard being supported by the show while the 1 wlw couple be the one where the red flags are discussed, brought up, and certified by the show by having them break up and show jack's true colors in the aftermath. to say it rubbed me the wrong way would be saying it lightly and the nicest way possible
- michelle and the therapist: yes i forgot his name. it's dr. something or whatever. the detail of ted having an aversion to therapy because his marriage counselor seemed to be against him when he went with his wife only to reveal that they started dating is just outwardly disgusting. the finale to even have him not even try to be invested in the game for michelle and henry's sakes and then have him sitting further away on his phone makes me wonder why are they even together. she doesn't seem that into it and it seemed to only be used as a plot device to show ted growing by being open and honest to his ex wife about his feelings and to be a driving force in having him feel left out of his son's life. why were they still together in the end is a mystery but I guess not shocking
#ted lasso#ted lasso spoilers#mackenzie speaks#sorry for the long post and i wasnt going to do this but alas#i could have gotten more into it but it was already becoming an essay#im also tired of people not being happy being chalked up to tedbecca not happening like no#this show does have its issues dont minimize how people feel#jamie and his dad isnt romantic so its not included but it is one of my major issues with the show#also not included dr sharon and the rando only because i am jumping to conclusions by assuming it was potentially a sports team member of a#team she was working for and before you judge me can you honestly blame me for thinking that
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Shipper tag game
I was tagged by @dual-domination :DDD thanks!
What ship were you completely obsessed with when you were a teenager, but now you don't care about anymore?
Okay so this whole tag game is gonna be interesting, bc i'm not actually that much of a shipper. I don't really care about shipping for the shipping itself, if that makes sense. I care about the characters and their dynamic, and ships can be interesting for what the characters may or may not bring to each other. Anyway, that was all meant to preface that I don't remember if I really strongly shipped anything when I was a teenager... At the very least I don't think there's one I don't care about anymore. Most of the things I shipped as a teen would have been tolkien ships, and I still carry a great fondness for those even if I'm not an active creator in that fandom atm.
2. Which ship would you consider your first one?
As said above, likely something Tolkien-related?? Maybe Glorestor? I remember reading fics about them but I don't remember actively shipping them. Perhaps Finarfin/Eärwen, that is the earliest ship I remember caring about in a way that I might consider shippy??
3. Your first fanfic was about which couple?
Neither the first fanfic I ever attempted to write (sth about Legolas that I wrote with pen on paper when I was like 10) nor the first serious unfinished attempt (about Thranduil taking up the crown in the aftermath of his father's death) nor the first one I ever published (The Last Son, a character study about Finarfin) are about couples at all... My first one that is about a couple though is Broken, about Turgon and Elenwë, but that is not 'shippy' at all.
4. Do you remember the first couple you saw fanart of?
In Tolkien fandom circles, that will probably have been sth like Gigolas or maybe Glorestor, but I don't remember. The first I have active memory of is Angbang :D
5. Have you ever gotten into ship discourse?
No. I try to stay far away from that...
6. Did you use to have any NOTP or have one currently?
Maybe? There's definitely ships I don't care about, even ones that the rest of the fandom is all about, but there's very few ships I actively avoid. The only thing I actively filter out of my AO3 searches atm is anything that ships Ye Zun and Shen Wei together. That's just not for me... But that is what we have the exclude tags button for, so others can enjoy what they enjoy and you can too :) I also avoid the Pingxie tag like the plague, bc I've seen one too many people in the fandom have bad opinions, but I wouldn't call them a NOTP. It's more a 'missing a third party (namely Pangzi)' kinda deal for me xD
7. Who were the couple in the last fanfic you read?
My mind immediately went to Weilan, but then I remembered that actually it's Zhubai <3 Both are a very likely answer to this question at any given moment.
8. Currently, do you have any OTPs?
See above! Weilan for sure, and definitely also Zhubai (and the extended polycule in the whole of and i will make a silence for you, for which I am eternally grateful to mumble and Sam) <333
9. Is there any couple that, to this day, you are extremely mad about not getting together?
No. As I said before, I'm not really a shipper. I don't consume media in that way. The story is the story, I don't see a reason to get mad about it. If you're unhappy with canon, you throw it in the trash and start writing AU fanfiction. It's not that deep.
10. Is there any ship you used to dislike but now you think they are kind of interesting?
Nah.
11. Do you have any ship that, in the past, would've been considered normal but now you would be cancelled over?
Idk, I suppose some people these days would cancel me over my RPF ships? I've also read a lot of Tolkien fanfic back in the day with ships that the modern purity-police would probably like to put me on a stake over (Celegorm/Curufin(/Finrod), maybe Silverfisting (when we still had the collective guts to call it that) and such.) Look, I was there for all the Yuri On Ice ship wars (that I didn't participate in, mind you), don't @ me with your anti bullshit. Fiction is fiction. Reality is reality. Go touch some grass.
12. What is your favorite crack ship?
I don't think I have one. Crack is not my fanfic genre.
13. What is the couple you read the most fanfics about?
Weilan probably ranks high by now, as does Zhubai. I've read a lot of Silverfisting and Curufin/Finrod in my day. I've read everything that was in the Finarfin/Eärwen tag up until a couple years ago, but that is a rarepair (even though it's canon... that's what you get when your OTP are only mentioned by name 3 times in the whole entire book). Xiyao and Nielan and 3zun are probably high on the list as well. I don't know who wins it, bc I only started keeping track of my reading habits with bookmarks in the past couple years so I have almost no data about the amount of fic I read before my Guardian days.
14. What do most of your ships usually have in common?
Uuhm, often there's something potentially fucked up about the dynamic. Some friction. A certain level of codependency or otherwise unhealthy attachment is interesting to me (how do they work through that? can they?). Most important though is just the deep affection they have for each other. I'm really big on like, choice and consent and free will. When characters could've chosen to part, and it might have even been easier for them to try and let go, but they decide the pain is worth it and they want to work on themselves and the relationship to make it work? When they love each other so much it dwarfs all else, but they still make the active choice to be vulnerable and share that love? That's my jam :)
15. What you absolutely hate in a ship?
Why do we have to end on a negative :(((( hhhm, okay i guess the lack of the above. I hate the soulmate trope with a passion, because so often it erases the element of choice from a relationship. "These characters were meant to be together" okay that's cute but do they want to be? I dislike it when a ship is written in such a way (either by the canon author or by fans) that it takes away the agency from the characters. I'm all for characters living for each other, but there must be meaning behind it. It can't just be fate. It has to be choice. For that matter, when a fandom collectively decides one ship is the way to go and all else is wrong and sucks, that is when I jump ship, because that ship is sinking.
Thanks again for tagging me, this was fun!
Tagging: @pangzi @lucientelrunya @programmedradly @the-marron @lunarriviera @scaredysap @mjsakurea @elenothar @lynne-monstr @aredhel-of-doylkien @thedaughterofshadows if you want to <3
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As a child, growing up in my Diaspora Household, full of Brown Bodies, I would often lift a handful of smelly spices to my nose to smell how good they smelled. Damn, these were some stinky fuckers!
“Yummy,” I would think in my beautiful and lilting native language, “there’s no way that Wh*te People would ever make fun of me in an elementary school lunchroom for this.”
How wrong I was.
20 years later, I have hunted down each one of the children who once were sort of mean to me about the food I ate and summarily executed them.
If this sounds familiar, it means you’ve been reading a very specific genre of online writing: the South Asian smelly lunchbox essay. A prime example of these popped up recently: this Eater piece from last week.
These pieces almost always begin with some sort of personal anecdote about the author’s childhood. The author is shamelessly mocked by their cruel, racist white classmates. Crying, they dump their lunch into the school rubbish bin (garbage can for all you Americans) and implore their parents to pack them Dunkaroos or Lunchables or some other disgusting branded pre-packaged thing.
As these young Brown Bodies get older, they notice that the same white people who may have made fun of them at one point learn to enjoy Indian food. This unleashes a tidal wave of fury within their Brown Body — This is my culture, how Dare You — and, seeing red, they put pen to computer to type out some incoherent mess about how they’ve been personally wronged. This gets run in some food magazine and is effusively praised on Twitter for being a great encapsulation of everyone else’s rage
I've seen this sort of discourse a few times, and it's striking to me how similar it is to an attitude I encountered on 4chan's Videogames board, /v/ in like 2014-16
White nerdy male comic book/videogames fans on 4chan would claim to have been horribly bullied specifically for liking comic books and videogames when they were kids. That they were socially ostracised and, basically, oppressed, for being weird nerds in a way not dissimilar to any other oppressed minority (which (if true) I don't entirely disagree with.)
And then some time around 2012, The Avengers makes a lot of money and The Big Bang Theory gets popular and Mainstream Society (who they map on to a sort of... nonspecific Archetypical Spirit of the-type-of-people-who-would-have-bullied-them-personally-in-school; the Chads and Staceys of the world) starts getting into comic book movies and videogames. Everyone and their mum is watching the new Starwars Sequel and pretending like they were a big star wars fan the whole time (ignoring that the original star wars films were some of the most widely popular mainstream movies ever made ever, but anyway...)
And there's a sudden sense of rage that these people - the Sort Of People Who Would Have bullied them in school for liking Star Wars (or whatever) suddenly like Star Wars (or whatever), and suddenly act as though they weren't bullying them as a kid 30 years ago for liking star wars (which they probably weren't, since they aren't the same specific individuals, but importantly they are, to the /v/ user, the Sort Of Person That Would Have).
It's as if they waived their right to like star wars (or whatever) as soon as they made fun of it 30 years ago (assuming they did, which they individually might have, but might not have, which doesn't matter). There's a sense that they, as an identity group, *own* [X Nerd Property], it's theirs, and you're taking it from them if you try and interact with it yourself if they don't permit you to, a permission you must earn through their respect or your group membership.
They had their chance but squandered it. It's as if Star Wars (or whatever) is unwilling to forgive them for their disrespect. That these people (not really any individuals in particular, rather an abstract Class of people) are hypocrites for not having the same preferences they did when they were children. And the punishment for this hypocrisy is the poetic justice of not being able to enjoy the newest okay-ish movie.
It's a very strange kind of resentment that seems to be calling out to a call to action to make everything worse out of spite; the Platonic Chads and Staceys of the world not liking Star Wars doesn't, like... that doesn't fix any of this. The impulse is not an impulse to Fix. It's purely a destructive impulse to Spite.
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FCG, Personhood, Romance, Aromanticism and how I feel about it.
I am Asexual/Aromantic, very much so. I enjoy fictional romance (and Erotica!) but in real life feel no attraction to people on the basis of romantic and sexual appeal.
a few sessions ago my therapist asked me if I really have no interest in a romantic relationship. it was an awkward conversation and I didn't know exactly how to explain that I just don't see myself initiating one - if it happens during the course of my life then it happens - I'm not averse to romance (I am kind of averse to sex, I guess) but I just don't... desire it as much as people around me seem to? (or at all honestly)
and I believe my therapist didn't really understand it, she questioned my lack of desire for that kind of thing and wondered if it's because I have certain preconceived ideas on how that kind of thing works.
(no hate to my therapist please, she had questions based on things I said regarding relationships in general and did not discount my Asexuality/Aromanticism at any point.)
Life without romantic relationships is so often portrayed as sad, meaningless, even less important. Being alone is bad. Not having a "Special person" is bad.
now let's talk FCG.
I did not HC FCG as Asexual/Aromatic at any point. Aspec robots are... well, a very common representation. so much so that when asked during a character design course to draw an unhuman representation of myself - I drew a robot. it's a problem.
FCG was nevertheless excluded from shipping discourse because of their nature as an Aeormaton, a non organic being. Fandom pretty much played into the exact thing that makes up FCG's main internal conflict - not considering himself to be a person, not considering himself important, having a soul, having a purpose that goes beyond his programming, willing to sacrifice themselves at any point for people the DO consider important and worthy of personhood.
Now, FCG and FRIDA being in a relationship has upset a lot of people's perception of this character. it's so surprising that THEY, of ALL PEOPLE in this group, got the first kiss, the first explicit romance.
the robots romancing each other has caught so many people off guard, and turned so many eyes to this character that up until now more or less served as a "supporting" character in other character's romantic narratives. (and even now I see posts trying to figure out what this means for THEIR ship. eh.)
and I find that to be kind of sad.
Had FRIDA not happened, had FCG not been romanced for the entirety of the campaign... would people still continue treating them like that? have all of constant reaffirmations of their personhood changed none of it, made them a viable shipping option for any of their "Organic" teammates?
are they going to become a viable shipping option now that they have been shown to have the capacity for romance? are people going to start treating them as their own person rather than support for others?
....
I love Sam. I love LoveLetters (I am genuinely not functioning because of how cute it is.) But I am fearing that FCG's conflict with his personhood will be resolved now that they figured out that they can have romantic feelings. it feels quite simplistic and I truly hope it will not be the case. FCG is a person because that's what he's always been. Romance or no romance - he would've been a person regardless.
and you know, I hope that this understanding does become a part of his journey. I hope it's something he and Ashton can talk about when they meet again (Especially since Taliesin played an AroAce character last campaign), I hope this is a part of FCG 's journey.
#Fresh Cut Grass#FCG#fcg critical role#critical role spoilers#critical role#C3E55#my thoughts#Romantic Robots
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Not only is Cas + Dean + honey unfluffy, it can be downright angsty. I think that Dean, like fandom, could latch onto this one known interest Cas has, and while he'd hate being reminded of Honey Cas he'd totally try to "bribe" Cas with bee-related gifts. Dean is always interested in things that make Cas more reachable, touchable, and human. Cas, who may not even remember what happened when he was dealing with Sam's Hell memories, could easily think Dean is just taking him to a beeswax candle store because Dean likes doing human things together. It would be deliciously hurtful and unsustainable--maybe one day Dean thinks Cas is watching a bee (in fact, Cas is thinking about Dean's eye crinkles) and freaks out and after the yelling and stomping is over, they start to figure things out, but it takes a while.
I don't want to tell you not to have fun with this concept if you want.
But if you're asking for my opinion I'm going to give it, because, again, I want to keep the anti-bee discourse going. And I have to say that I disagree with you.
A large part of my objection to the bee trope is not just that it's bad characterization for Cas, but that it's also incredibly out of character for Dean to play a part in it.
Like it's not just a question of being reminded of how Cas was at that time. I think the end of s7 was such a negative experience that Dean would outright reject conceptualizing honey-Cas as a component part of Cas at all.
I could go on about "Nobody cares that you're broken, Cas, now clean up your mess". There's layers to that line (including guilt and projection on Dean's part, but also just plain anger and frustration) but this is not the post to get into that. Right now, I'm just raising it because that is the sentiment people unintentionally call back to every time they use the bee trope. That is how Dean felt about honey-Cas. So no, I don't think it's at all believable that Dean would do anything that invokes Cas' behaviour from those episodes.
(And yes, there was the "I'd rather have you" speech and Dean starting to be willing to take Cas as he is. But almost immediately after that, Dean and Cas get sucked into Purgatory and separated, so Dean never has to follow through. When he meets Cas again, Cas is "better" and Dean gets to make a clean break with honey-Cas and leave it in the past. Which he does.)
I agree that Dean is interested in bringing Cas down-to-earth, but whenever he does, it's on his terms. Dean shows Cas his own favourite movies, he makes him a mix-tape of his own favourite songs, he invites him to hang out at diners that he likes, he encourages behaviour (like flirting with waitresses) that Dean considers fundamental to his own specific experience. For Dean, making Cas human means making him relatable to his own life. It's something that I really enjoy because on the one hand, there's a kind of narrowness to it, Dean doesn't really have a curiosity about the kind of semi-human that Cas could become on his own terms. On the other hand, it's Dean sharing pieces of himself with Cas. It's Dean making Cas more his own, in a way. (also, as we know from the mix-tape, Dean is not generally in the habit of giving gifts to Cas. The mix-tape is an exception.)
That all being said, I would be glad if I started seeing the bee trope being used as a source of angst instead of as some fluffy thing. (but I'd be even happier if it was excised from the fandom entirely)
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Something that really weirds me out is how hostile some people are about those who decide to interpret Frodo and Sam as romantic.
Like, no, I don't care what the author "meant" to say. He is dead, and buried, may he rest in peace. And if you care so much, he advocated for the freedom of the readers to interpret his work however they want in the foreword. Did you read the foreword??
I will be projecting my own trauma onto Frodo anyway. And I have never been to war, and hopefully never will be. Yet I find comfort and understanding in his story, because I too have been through hell, I too have done horrible things, and horrible things have been done to me. They look, in reality, nothing like what Frodo went through, and yet the journey resonated with me in a way that few others have. When I thought no one else would ever quite "get it", because no one else had been through it, I found a story that said "I get it, I know what it is like, and it's alright".
If you read Sam and Frodo as a friendship, that is totally valid! I support that reading. That is good. That is, most likely, what the author intended. The kind of bond you can only develop under very specific circumstances. That is valuable. That is good.
Some people will choose to read it as a queerplatonic relationship, because even as a platonic bond it does defy our societies expectations of what a platonic relationship is. And that is a great reading too! And I love it!
I choose to read them as romantic. Not because they call each other dear, or because they love each other, or hold hands or even kiss. Which would just by itself enough for most people to assume romance. But for me it's not about that. It's about the fairytale tropes, and the narrative parallels, and all the little details that I can't quite explain otherwise. Call me close minded, if you want. I think it's reasonable enough. I think it gets enough support of the text to stand by itself. And I am not the one who is getting angry about other people's takes online. But what does make me angry is their hostility, the fact that they get offended so bad if you so much bring the idea of it. They dismiss it instantly. Like you just said something sacrilegious. Unthinkable. Like it somehow "lessens" the impact of their story, which it very much does not. Almost as if they thought homosexuality was wrong, or less valuable than a Heterosexual Bond™ between two Heterosexual Men™.
What I am trying to say is. Can we chill. Can we accept the fact that multiple different things can be true at the same time to different people and that when it comes to literary analysis we can't claim to have the ultimate truth on any piece of media. Can we accept that. Because doing otherwise seems rather childish to me. Bro I am just trying to have fun over here you are the one leaving the angry comments on wholesome posts.
And don't get me wrong, I am not against debate. But when the simple mention of a different view makes you outrage, on a topic that is completly harmless and separated from any material, real-world issues, then I think you have a problem.
Sorry for the rant, I am just a little tired of people on ceirtain platforms reacting negatively at the sole mention of this subject. It makes me kinda sad, really. I promise I won't start any "discourse" again, I do a great effort to stay as far away from it as I can. Take this more as a take on the whole landscape of fandom and media discussion online.
#idk what to tag this as#naru speaks#samfro#maybe?#sam and frodo#lgbtq#fandom things#not using the broader lotr tag too afraid to spark something
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SHIPPER TAG GAME
I was tagged by @lurkingshan, thank you very much (´꒳`)♡ My memory is not the best so some of these are going to be a little challenging lol but let’s try!
1. What ship were you completely obsessed with when you were a teenager, but now you don't care anymore?
I don’t know how to “not care” about things I once loved I’m afraid lol. But ships that consumed my life that I now don’t think about very often and am more “what a good surprise to see you here, I still like you" than "oh you are back to consume my life for the next two to fifteen months" are most of the things I watched when I was younger: Logan/Max from Dark Angel, Sam/Jack and Daniel/Jack from Stargate:SG1, Jim/Blair from The Sentinel, Piper/Leo from Charmed, Tim/Tony and Gibbs/Tony from NCIS, etc...
2. Which ship would you consider your first one?
Hmmm… I think the first time I felt emotionally invested in two characters ending up together – in a “watching religiously and asking my mom to tape the wedding episode because we would be traveling on the day it was to be diffused” kind of way – is Fran Fine and Maxwell Sheffield from The Nanny.
We knew they were end game, but STILL!
3. Your first fanfic belonged to which couple?
Oh, good question… I came into fandom via manga and while they were not the ones I shipped the hardest (I was a hardcore Gaara/Lee fan ♡♡♡), I think the first fics I read were NaruSasu and/or Kakashi/Iruka – on personal fan websites.
The first shipping fic I wrote hmmm… I think it actually was some Kakashi/Iruka? I tumbled into fandom really fast once I found it so it’s a bit of a blur lol but yeah, pretty sure it was something Naruto related.
4. Do you remember the first couple you saw a fanart over?
… Not really, but probably either something from One Piece (Zorro/Luffy or Zorro/Sanji) or Neon Genesis Evangelion – those two were the very first manga I read (circa 2002), and I vaguely remember checking them on Google Image for my favorite hobby: “collecting images from the internet that I would then organize carefully in the computer’s little folders” so I must have found some cute stuffs that I didn’t even realize were shipping…
5. Did you ever get into ship discourse?
No. While I generally have strong opinions about stuff, I am pretty non confrontational and I’m here for a good time, not to fight with people, so I avoid it. I’ve seen stuffs that I’m glad I didn’t poke with a ten feet pole. On top of that, I am a huge believer and practitioner of “shipping one character with more than one person (in a polycule or not)” so ship wars have never made much sense to me. Even in qL, even when I really adore the endgame couple(s), I often like thinking of the options, the what-if, etc. so fighting about that does not sound appealing lol
6. Did you used to have any no-otp or have it currently?
Talking about my very first fandoms, I never wanted Sakura with either Naruto nor Sasuke lol I loved her, but hated the idea of either options. Still not sold on it tbh. I also really hated the idea of Hermione with either of the other two lsdfj same reason, I loved her so much, and I loved that they were friends!
I have ships I am uninterested in but I always feel like notp is a little stronger than that, so I don’t think I have any currently.
7. Who were the couple in the last fanfic you read?
Oof, okay, life does come back full circle lol I binged the One Piece Live Action at the start of the month, so the last fics I’ve read since were all Zorro/Luffy.
8. Currently, do you have any OTPs?
DO I EVER?? I have OTP that have been in my heart since I’m 10. And, I mean, by virtue of watching so much QL I have an OTP in every couple I watch get together for 8 to 12 episodes, I’m a big, mushy romantic. Also I will daydream about ships from about anything I watch so…But! My current OTP, the one that owns my heart, that gets me to literally squeal in delight, makes me gasp and cry and twirl my hair while kicking my feet is Nomoto and Kasuga from She loves to cook and she loves to eat!
I love them sooooo much it’d be ridiculous if I had any sort of dignity about that kind of things (I don’t) (*´▽`*)
9. Is there any couple that, to this day, you are extremely mad about not getting together?
Ok you know what? I rewatched some episodes with my mom over my christmas break so I will say yes, Jack O’Neil and Samantha Carter in Stargate:SG1. Yeah, yeah I don’t care that he is her commanding officer and blablabla.
After all this teasing, damn, we could have gotten a little something something when the team finally breaks alright?
10. Is there any ship you used to dislike but now you think they are kind of interesting?
I can’t really think of anything right now to be honest… I feel like anything I’d feel strongly enough to remember I would still dislike now, though, to be frank.
11. Do you have any ship that, in the past, was considered normal but now you would be canceled over?
I guess? I mean, I came to fandom and to QL via yaoi – wich I started reading around 2005, so you can imagine the amount of “problematic” content I enjoyed. Age gaps (I was a HUGE fan of Naono Bohra who like those a lot), power imbalance, dub-con (one of the first yaoi translated in France was Gravitation), and so on and so forth.
12. What was your favorite crack ship?
I can’t answer that one, mainly because I used to have so many of them (I still do, don’t look at me). I got into superheros comics when I was something like 18 and I did RP with a friend where looking back, it seems like our main game was to pair everyone no matter how silly it might have been. I guess in those, I still have a fondness for everything we did that crossed the DC/Marvel divide. We also played a lot with those random ship generators? They gave you two characters and you tried to find a way to make it work. I still like those!
13. Who is the couple you read more fanfics of?
Across all of time?? I… have no idea… like really none. Recently, it’s probably any variations of 3zuns from The Untamed, but for the early years I could not say.
14. What most of your ships usually have in common?
The love I have for them (*¯︶¯*)
Joke aside, I’m not sure? I’m a simple creature, I’m easily swayed, if there is something compelling in the dynamic, I will be interested. I like them sweet but I also have pretty toxic ships, so I think the main thing for me is that there is something interesting going on that makes me want to root for them and/or think about them and how they work together.
15. What do you absolutely hate in a ship?
I need to believe there is a way for them to genuinely love each other. But sometimes, ~the vibes~ just feel rancid to me and I can’t get into it, I can’t explain more than that ^^”
I'll tag, if you feel so inclined: @benkaaoi @troubled-mind @bengiyo @gillianthecat @iguessitsjustme and @heretherebedork
#ok that was a fun trip down memory lane lol#so much shonen manga in my first fandom years#then I tumbled into yaoi and here we are#tag games
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My first intro was really long and flourished so I'm trying another one...
Niwolah, she/her, adult
speaks French, English, LSFB
writes as much as brain makes it possible
may be AuDHD (undiagnosed)
likes reading, listening to music, singing, dancing
very neutral; shares others' opinions but won't do more
BUT is 100% proship (ship and let ship but also let people enjoy things and purity culture)
I said my blog was a melting pot. It really is. So don't be mean if you don't like my taste. It's mine and I'm not judging yours. It's not my fault I like cilantro and you don't.
Anyway.
I reblog everything, be it animals, nature, discourses (fandom related or not), cute/funny posts, things that resonate with me, and I try to tag accordingly. Key word: try.
My fandoms, AO3, and tags are listed after the cut because it's starting to get long.
I'm not immune to shipping culture so...
911 (Buddie)
BBC Sherlock (Johnlock)
Community (JeffDean)
How to train your dragon (Toothcup, Hicctooth)
Scrubs (JDox)
Supernatural (SamDean in every forms*)
Twoset Violin
TVXQ!
Teen Wolf (Sterek)
I try to tag the important characters/persons in addition of the fandom as well.
All my stories are here. (There's even the very firsts I wrote back then, when I was still at school, in French... You can ignore them, they're only there for posterity reason, I guess.)
Fandom tags are linked above but my most used other ones are:
#Niwolah tries to write for sneak peeks and behind the scene on my WIPs
#Niwolah wrote that for the links of my finished stories
#writer problems if you write and want to relate
#writing resources is self-explanatory
#scenery for nature pictures, often skies and trees
#animals for... well, animals
#art for paintings, drawing, songs, etc., fanart as well, even though they're tagged accordingly
#Niwolah's playlist shows you the songs I have in my head
* About Supernatural, I tag #sam and dean for canon, #weirdcest when they're weirdly obsessed with each other, #gencest when it's slightly less obsessive, which is almost never, #weecest when they're too young to be involved with each other and #wincest when they're not anymore. So block the tag you need to.
You can slide in my DMs or email me at [email protected].
I think I said everything. Just- remember: don't like, don't engage.
#introduction#911 on abc#buddie#sherlock bbc#johnlock#nbc community#jeffdean#httyd#httyd rtte#toothcup#hicctooth#scrubs#jdox#spn#sam and dean#gencest#weecest#weirdcest#wincest#twosetviolin#breddy#tvxq!#homin#teen wolf#sterek#ao3#ao3 writer#ship and let ship#about Niwolah
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I understand what you’re trying to do with quality control, but it is starting to feel weird when you clearly have characters who a significant minority are voting up as queer and you’re questioning if the characters are queer enough.
I know that characters and people are two different cases, and I can quietly remove myself here, but I’m having a lot of fun when I’m not being ambushed with more arbitrary standards about what queer can and can’t look like, so I wanted to try an ask first.
I understand not wanting a character who isn’t explicitly queer to win, but it’s honestly upsetting to have my dash keep being interrupted with rules lawyering about what counts as queer and what doesn’t. Do you think you could maybe make note of the possible issues and just discuss them together if they win instead of discussing it every time another character turns up “questionable”? I’m otherwise really enjoying your tournament
I mean that is what I’m trying to do? Like there’s only two characters so far (out of 204 in the competition) who have been brought up after the polls went live, and like … four total posts I’ve made about it tops? Five, I guess, including this one. One asking for clarification on the question being asked in the first place, one kind of agreeing to that because again I haven’t read, and then one for each character saying it’s just something we will come back to as needed because there was some push back and I don’t really want to debate it before it’s even an actual issue as I can’t do anything during the first round anyway since it's already up. I don’t want the people pointing it out to feel ignored and for it to evolve into a discourse in the notes because it goes unaddressed. So I answered them on the second character same as the first to say let’s come back to this if it progresses past round one.
I’m questioning not if they’re “queer enough” though. We've got a wide variety of character from all over the gender/sexuality/romantic orientation spectrum. I'm not trying to gatekeep what counts as queerness. But when I do ask for quality control I am asking if it’s even canon at all that they are queer inside the text of the book. Not 'queer enough', just are they queer in canon, point blank. The rules did state canon is a requirement, but I can’t read every book submitted to check that. Sometimes I’ll know things aren’t correct, like in the ship tournament someone submitted Sam/Frodo (which is an example of what I mean. It’s not that they “aren’t queer enough” it’s that they just straight up are not stated to be queer, as much as we as fans might enjoy the idea that they are and there might be some subtext we can take from their devotion, it’s not in the pages so it does not count), but if I don’t know I have to pitch it towards you guys. And I let A Lot of characters in, so I won’t know a lot of them. For these two characters in particular I can’t make a judgement call on my own as I haven’t read the book, which is why it's getting talked about. (Although again, as I said, I'm really not trying to debate their eligibility at this time. If they win it'll be something to bring up before round two, but as of now we aren't debating it) I put up a list ahead of the polls of the characters submitted that I had already thinned out a bit with characters I knew didn't qualify and passed the question off to my followers to try and get all of that out of the way before the actual competition starts to avoid things like this, (because as you said, now that the competition is started people are voting for them, because people like these characters, so it's obviously not ideal for a debate to be breaking out now after it's up about their eligibility in the competition) but the polls are obvi getting more attention than a long list so I’m getting some new questions now.
I want everyone to be having fun, and i'm sorry if this is detracting from that for you, but again when it's characters I don't know that people are bringing up I have to actually ask about it or else it doesn't really seem fair
#although as it currently stands#both characters are currently losing their respective polls#so i'm not even sure how much of an issue this will actually be#and i'm trying to keep it minimal by not debating until we know#because i don't want to flood anyone's dash with it#but if you're still worried about it#and don't want to just unfollow#i use the tag#op speaks#whenever i talk#so you can filter that#it won't impact the polls themselves or the propaganda because those aren't me talking#also sorry if this is a bit disjointed#my internet died partway through answering it#long post
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