question: Is it morally wrong to lie about my AGAB online? I'm AFAB, but wearing the label of FTM or simply Trans makes me dysphoric to a level unimaginable. I cope by lying about my AGAB and saying I'm AMAB, but I've recently been thinking about the morality of doing so.
It's best not to assign morality to AGABs, anon. They're just labels after all.
Also: people online (and most people IRL) are not entitled to know what some doctor said about you when you were born. Calling yourself a male or saying you were AMAB/a cis man isn't problematic, because it's the internet and it doesn't matter. You're a male: end of story.
Even IRL trans people lie about their AGAB all the time for whatever reason (being stealth, not getting misgendered on forms, dysphoria, etc). Transfems and nonbinary people also lie about their AGAB.
Unless you're in a doctor's office/court/etc, you can say anything about your assigned sex you want! You could even say you were MTM (a trans man who feels like he's always been male in some way), refuse to talk about AGABs, or use a label like A?AB.
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AGAB4AGAB flags
AFAB4AFAB | AMAB4AFAB
AFAB4AMAB | AMAB4AMAB
This can be used regardless of orientation, pronoun, or gender. Inclusive of AGAB non-conforming people. Reminder AGABs/ASABs also represent psychosocial aspects of birth assignment, not just biologically deterministic definitions of sex, including those who self-assign as certain AGAB(s).
For example, a transmasc4transfem can be AMAB4AMAB. A hetero transfem can be AFAB4AFAB. A she4he can be AMAB4AFAB. And an intersex4intersex can be AFAB4AMAB.
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the statement “not all nonbinary people were AFAB or CAFAB, and to assume otherwise does a huge disservice to the nonbinary community” is not actually at odds with the fact that nonbinary people who WERE AFAB or CAFAB experience unique issues that deserve to be discussed. I’ve seen just as many misogynists claim that AFAB nonbinary people are all just stupid little girls with internalized misogyny, as I’ve seen shitheads imply that all nonbinary people were AFAB. just because there is intracommunity invisibility that deeply affects nonbinary people who werent AFAB, doesn’t mean that nonbinary people who WERE are silly and shouldn’t be taken seriously. the point isn’t that one group of nonbinary people has some huge amount of gender-based privilege over the other, it’s that we can have both similar and unique struggles.
I’ve seen so many people all but outright say that AFAB nonbinary people are stupid, privileged, and get treated better and it’s like… literally no????? the point of addressing the invisibility of AMAB nonbinary people isn’t to demonize and infantilize nonbinary people who were AFAB. the point of saying “nonbinary is not a synonym for feminine or androgynous” isn’t to turn around and act like nonbinary people who ARE those things are somehow bad or at fault for how we get treated. AMAB or CAMAB nonbinary people exist and are amazing and deserve to be taken seriously. AFAB or CAFAB nonbinary people are not stupid little girls who can’t know ourselves because of ~internalized misogyny~. intersex nonbinary people are not “just one or the other” or “only biologically nonbinary” they are whole, real nonbinary people. we are all part of the same community can we act like it????
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hi!!! I saw u mention agabpunk before? is there anymore info u have to elaborate on it? would it include being an agab but choosing to identify as a different agab (not just gender but AGAB bc u reject the one u had) or wanting to not have an agab or have it revealed to people? Honestly interests me so much I have a lot of feelings on it and would love to see more terms related to these concepts .. bc I want to id as a different agab and also agables and don’t want people to know or assume mine at all
OHnim sorry for asking I didn’t realize asks were closed I wasn’t trying to request anything btw
Even though coining requests are closed it's still okay to request information about something!
AGABpunk is a label I made up a couple months ago to match other labels like dyspunk or amatopunk. Basically going against social norms and radically accepting things.
It was just one word idea I came up with (along with AGABqueer, AntiGAB, AGABf*ck, etc) to describe people who reject being defined by something they were labeled as decades ago.
I've had a couple people say neoassignments/AGAB-rejecting terms could fit under AGAB non-conforming, and that's true! But I wanted a more specific term to describe the movement in general. The original ask (here) was less "I don't conform to the AMAB/AFAB binary" and more "I am intentionally going against that binary, I don't like the normalization of that binary, etc".
It's kind of like the difference between gender non-conforming and terms like genderpunk, genderf*ck, or gender piracy. They're much more active (loud? rebellious? queer, even? I don't know a good word for it).
People have been playing around with this concept for a very long time, with jokes and sayings like: "I was assigned trans at birth" "not amab or afab but a secret, new third thing" (slur warning ->) "I'm actually afag" "not amab/afab, I'm aPerson" "I wasn't amab or afab, I was a baby". I have heard all of those and more and figured that making neo terms was just the next level of that.
And here are some terms that you may be interested in anon:
-AGABless: not identifying with an AGAB.
-A?AB: viewing your AGAB as irrelevant, or not wanting to tell it to others.
-SAGAB: self-assigning your sex/gender.
-AXEAB: assigned xenogender at birth. The link goes to the archived assigned kenochoric at birth (AKAB) coining but if you scroll down you'll see AXEAB too.
Plus some terms I've made up:
-A_AB: assigned nothing at birth. When you think that you weren't really assigned a gender/sex at birth, you were just a baby that the doctor looked at and wrote things down for. After all, things like recorded weight (and name, if you're trans) also become practically irrelevant as you develop into a person.
-A[]AB (or A⬛︎AB): AGAB-redacted. Refusing to tell people who don't need to know your AGAB, and feeling like it's an invasive question. This especially goes for nonbinary people who are constantly being asked "but which one were you born as?".
-ÆAB: assigned gender/neogender/xenogender at birth. For anyone with a weird gender, or multiple of them, who wants to say that they've always been that gender in a nontraditional way. Kind of like MtM/FtF for binary trans people. The name has the "e" from gender and I combined it with the A. AAAB and AKAB can potentially fall under this.
-AGABvoid: kind of like AGABless and inspired by gendervoid. Why won't you tell people your AGAB? Why don't you have a connection to it? Because it's missing, that's why! You've somehow lost it. (This was written in a very joke-y way but feel free to actually use this term)
It could also be possible I guess to identify with multiple, conflicting, or all AGABs (panAGAB???). For example I know some intersex people will call themself both AMAB and AFAB but perisex people can also do that.
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Dysphoric intersex culture is HATING agab labels as a concept
Dysphoric culture is!
Also, being able to have a term for what people were assigned at birth can be useful at times (ex: legally) but yeah mod totally agrees with you on this one.
AMAB does not equal androgenic puberty/raised as a boy/has a penis/XY chromosomes/gets dysphoric about masculine things/etc and vice versa for AFAB people! Assuming that having a certain AGAB always means certain things is incredibly cis- and perisex-normative. All of those factors can vary depending on the person, how they were raised, if or when they transitioned, if they're intersex, what their gender is, etc. And of course for people who were born with visible intersex variations the whole binary AMAB/AFAB system doesn't really work.
Mod recently saw a post that was "the differences between AMAB and AFAB chests...." and it's just like. Inaccurate and super dysphoria-inducing. Especially for people who want to or have medically transitioned, having your body tied to your AGAB sucks.
So yes sorry for rambling but anon you are right and you should say it!
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I'm feeling kinda spicy so,
WHAT ASSIGNED GENDER AT BIRTH ISN'T;
An accurate description of bodies.
A description of bodies.
A description of Genitals/Chromosomes.
A blanket term to describe a group of body parts that always exist together when born.
Created by the trans community.
A binary.
A valid reason to exclude people (Eg. AFABs only spaces, I need advice on [insert generally female/male body thing] AF/MABs only pls!]
WHAT ASSIGNED GENDER AT BIRTH IS;
An arbitrary term based on doctors arbitrary opinions, quite often defined by a ruler to an infants genitals.
A term created by intersex communities.
A term intended to show others perceptions of them and the dissonance between perception and reality.
What gender more than 50% of people saw you and treated you as as a child.
It is great that trans people can use the term and I encourage people (especially us trans people) to. However a lot of people just use it as a way to say Female or Male while sounding LGBT inclusive and being able to claim they didn't misgender anyone.
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