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absolutebl · 11 months

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Genuine Question: Given how much people hate problematic topics in BL eg: kp, mame, love syndrome, etc. why is everyone so damn excited about Only Friends? Like we know nothing about the show. It's GMMTV so how sexy is it going to get? you know, like it's GMMTV. I like the cast as much as anyone and particularly FirstKhao but I don't see this 'sexiness' everyone is going so crazy over? Is it some bts thing like I know the director is jojo and he's gay. Is that why everyone so excited? Is it because we just haven't gotten anything really brilliant this year that gets the whole BL fandom together and that's why people are hoping this will, is that what's going on? I like everyone involved well enough but 'sexy', 'crazy', 'problematic', 'high heat'... I don't get it.

Only Friends & Jojo

Genuine answer.

Okay so this question got me invested enough to get off the phone, over to the laptop, and onto hotel wifi, which means typos rather than dictation homophones, but there it is.

I guess what I am saying it...

mistakes will be made

From the tenor of your question methinks you have not watched Friend Zone? It's a 2 part series. Mostly messy hets but...

Also a TON of broad spectrum queer rep (lesbian, bi, ace, demi). Real queers, not sanitized for straight consumption.

Because yeah, GMMTV will get messy and go into higher heat levels in a late night way (not in a KP way).

But actually what has most people excited about Only Friends is it being sourced in this man:

Jojo Tichakorn Phukhaotong

Jojo is a screenwriter (originals) and director, openly gay, multifaceted and a little experimental, naturally talented (on the job trained - he's an archaeologist originally), and he is behind:

The Warp Effect, Friend Zone and MOST importantly (IMHO)...

3 Will Be Free

There are others too, but for the purposes of this post, those are the 3 that count. I think of him a little as the GMMTV director version of Ohm's acting.

Jojo specializes in:

ensemble pieces,

good chemistry (NOT necessarily high heat, so by this I mean actor chemistry with each other all around - couples, cast, team, production)

working with and finding actors within GMMTV's stable who work well together (even if that means busting up a pair),

a queer lens,

queer rep,

and often very messy story (as in he is not invested in the traditional beats of a romance, let alone a BL).

AND he can shoot action (this is a specific skill set for directors and it's NOT easy),

thus he will shoot his sex/intimacy & COMEDY scenes as if they WERE action sequences.

This makes his stuff particularly exciting to watch. It's dynamic, there's a lot of movement, the eye is caught and dragged places. He doesn't use dirty/peekaboo framing or central aperture or manga style (not with INTENT the way trained directors do). In fact he does none of those things I harp on about because I like the romance stuff.

He's not being clever with us. He's being honest, but still applying skill. His stuff not quite raw, but also not really directed. You can tell he gives his actors a script, throws them together and then instructs them to just BE THOSE CHARACTERS. He has a light touch, he trusts them. He's not fussy or nit-picky. He's not doing a million takes to get that sene exactly how he envisions it. His ensemble pieces are just that, group projects.

His eye is wide, even for intimacy, by which I mean: he controls and watches for multiple actors at once when there are a lot of them on screen together, without them feeling stiff.

His style is quite organic but not too gritty.

Struggling to understand what I mean?

For example, watch a Jojo "group of friends chatting" scene where everyone is just standing around then watch the same thing in, say, SCOY. You'll see what I mean. SCOY is also a very queer ensemble piece, but it will feel quite stiff, unnatural, and "planned" (staged) by comparison.

For the giffers out there you might notice that Jojo's stuff is particularly difficult to gif cleanly? This is why.

I find him an exciting director. I didn't cover him in my directors overview because at the time he hadn't done much BL (and frankly, he still hasn't). It's not his focus.

I think Only Friends is actually not likely to be very BL. Queer = yes, BL = NO. He won't hit the tropes and there is no reason to assume it will end happily for all couples (if any). That's not Jojo's point of view.

He doesn't play our game. As a result, some of those excited by the idea of this show (or excited the general enthusiasm & anticipation around it), may be doomed to disappointment.

It's one of the reasons you don't see me getting excited about it.

I'm a fan of specifically the fluffy side of BL, this will NOT be that. And I can appreciate a director without necessarily liking the stories he tells.

I am industry enough to acknowledge Jojo's skill (and I LOVE 3 Will Be Free - just not as a BL), but I don't always like his narratives. No matter how good he is, his stuff is not why I personally watch Thai BL.

It's GMMTV, so how sexy is it going to get?

Again, see Friend Zone. GMMTV has a late night pantheon, mostly for het, but they will get salacious. Lots of cheating and terrible decisions. There will be no archetypes. Characters will exist in grey areas, even the "good" characters. There will be no paladins in this show. No seme/uke.

To answer this frankly?

Only Friends will get soap opera or telenovella sexy but no more. So we will be in Midnight Chicken territory, not Bed Friends.

I think the words being bandied about:

'sexy', 'crazy', 'problematic', 'high heat'

are used here on tumblr (and in fandom) as an attempt to articulate expectations set up by Jojo's style.

Most viewers only react emotionally to the tenor of a director with this set of skills. That's fine, that's what the production company wants: A visceral emotional reaction.

But I hope I've managed to clarify from a film-critic perspective what's bringing this sensation about?

But ALSO seeing a bunch of, essentially, lower heat pure BL pairs, have to push themselves into messy queer spaces? (Notice GMMTV only let the more established actors into this one? No JoongDunk, no GeminiFourth)

This is probably really what everyone is excited about.

They are gonna see their favorites cheat, sleep around, be gay (not BL gay, but actual gay). Some are legitimately excited about this, some are shipper excited, and the BL-stans who don't know Jojo are doomed to disappointment.

I'm mostly excited by how messy this is gonna make the fandom.

Su su na.

(source)

#only friends the series #forthcoming bl #watch ABL eat crow #bl director #bl film ciritc #bl analysis #industry insider #messy gay #bl fandom #upcoming bl #2023 bl #khaotung thanawat #firstkhao #GMMTV #friend zone 2 #3 Will Be Free #The Warp Effect #Jojo Tichakorn Phukhaotong

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boysborntodie · 8 months

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Expanding on this post, it's intriguing how SE Hinton sets up Johnny as so pitiful, having constantly been beaten down by life and having awful circumstances (he has abusive parents, he's been attacked by Socs, he's very small and looks younger than he is, he has a shy and reserved personality which makes him more of a target to people, he's POC-coded no matter what SE Hinton says).

But Johnny despises being seen as pitiful. He dislikes being called a pet, seen as younger than he is and generally being infantilized, not only by others but also in the gang.

(The rest of this post is pure speculation below the cut)

There's this image of Johnny, as someone pitiful, to the point it feels like he's made to be pitied, like his being is centred around it. And due to this, he is reduced to his abuse and suffering, and isn't seen for all his other aspects and as someone above his trauma. And this seems to be something not only done by others but even by the gang at times.

The gang obviously genuinely care for him. They love him and it upsets them how Johnny specifically is treated because that's *their* Johnny and they're all super fond of him, because he's just genuinely so good. But the fact is... His hard life does make them pity them and in a way differently from others. Everyone in the gang has had a hard life but Johnny's different both because he doesn't have a proper escape from his home life and how much abuse he faces. And he's also an easy target to others looking for someone to hurt.

And with the others, they're tougher in the more traditional way. They can and do stand up for themselves when they can, they can fight, they generally have this presence where most people wouldn't mess with them. Johnny's not all that. He's small and shy and has a lack of self-assurance. So they do feel sorry for him and act differently with him. Like when Two-Bit immediately jumps to his defense and says 'You don't talk to *Johnny* like that', implying that if Ponyboy had insulted someone else it wouldn't have been that big of a deal.

Johnny's said to be everyone's kid brother and the gang pet, to the point even Ponyboy sees him this way to some extent. This is a rather infantilized and sanitized image of him. But I think, while Johnny has his insecurities, he knows that he's not the image others have created for him of a poor, helpless victim who's too good for the shit that happens to him. It strips him of his nuance and it doesn't fit him. For example, Pony says Johnny wouldn't say boo to a goose, implying Johnny wouldn't be able to hurt anyone. But Johnny can and did. His attack on Bob wasn't just centred around defending Pony: Bob was someone who had rattled Johnny to his core and he wouldn't allow him to ever again do that.

I think Johnny also has these thoughts that he doesn't contribute to gang, that his company is enough of an exchange for the gang caring about him. He doesn't see things that he does as valuable even though the gang think that. It's stated that he listens to everyone's problems and helps out everyone. When Two-Bit says that the gang couldn't get along without him, he meant it.

But Johnny doesn't see that see those things as strength, at least not for him. And that's one of the reasons he admires snd latched onto Dally, who he sees as the epitome of strength, not only because of how tough and strong he is but also with the way he conducts himself and the way he has these values that he doesn't compromise.

#the outsiders #johnny cade #se hinton #this is probably the messiest post of all time and i haven't even got my thoughts straight on here but oh well

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rushingheadlong · 2 years

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I’ve been sitting on this post for a couple months now but since it’s Pride I figured, fuck it, if there’s ever going to be a time to call this out it’s now.

There’s a lot of covert homophobia in this fandom but one thing I’ve seen start to cross the line into overt homophobia is how some people talk about Freddie’s experiences going out to his clubs (aka gay clubs).

Up front I want to acknowledge that, yes, Freddie absolutely had bad experiences while out at clubs and I have no interest in trying to argue that everyone he associated with from c. 1977-1985 was a saint. But that’s the thing right there: Any issues Freddie had when he went out were with the people that he was with, NOT the places where he went.

I’ve seen too many posts and comments that heavily imply, if not outright state, that Freddie’s problem was that he was going out clubbing at all, and that if he had just stayed away from clubs he would have been happier and better off for it. That Freddie going out to clubs was one of the worst decisions he made, and that it isn’t something the fandom should be “celebrating” in any way.

The problem with that is that Freddie wasn’t going to random clubs. He was going to gay clubs, at a time when those clubs were the safest and easiest way for him to interact with the queer community. Saying that Freddie’s problem was that he was going to these clubs at all, rather than critiquing the people he was with or the actions he took there, is to say that you don’t think Freddie was capable of interacting with his own community.

Are you starting to see how this line of discussion can very quickly become very homophobic?

Even if people do bring up Freddie going to gay clubs, there’s often an unspoken pressure to leave it just at that and to ignore the sexual aspect of things. But you cannot separate the sex from the clubs. The overwhelming majority of the clubs that Freddie frequented were specifically Leather clubs, often with dress codes and membership requirements. Many of these places had sex rooms, dungeons, and/or live kink performances, and we have recorded accounts of Freddie taking men from these clubs back to his hotel.

I’m not saying that this fandom needs to start having explicit discussions of Freddie’s sex life at every turn, but going to the opposite extreme and ignoring the very real ways in which we know that Freddie expressed his sexuality is just homophobic. Sanitizing Freddie’s reasons for going to clubs and his experiences once there isn’t protecting his legacy, it’s actively erasing his queerness and his sexuality.

I also want to point out that this isn’t a matter of geography. The Leather clubs in Munich, like the Ochsengarten, were the same type of establishment as places like The Anvil and The Mineshaft in NYC. You can’t celebrate Freddie and his New York Daughters going out on the town and then turn around and criticize the places he was going in Munich. And none of that is even touching on the fact that the moment you become critical of all gay bars you become critical of everyone who went to those places... which includes basically all of the most important people in Freddie’s life.

Even David Minns at his most critical of Freddie only talks about who he was with and not where he was spending his time. Because the fact of the matter is that gay clubs provided safe places for queer people of all stripes to explore themselves and their sexualities at a time when doing so publicly literally would have resulted in you being arrested.

Gay clubs aren’t dens of sin and iniquity any more than straight clubs are. Implying otherwise, and especially implying that Freddie was wrong for going to these places, will always, ALWAYS be a blatant act of homophobia.

#long post //#text #freddie #ramblings #I literally typed up the first draft of this post in mid-December so if you think this is about you it's probably not #but also if you think this is about you maybe take a hard look at how you've been talking about these things yeah?

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seeminglyseph · 10 days

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sometimes it's very, very funny watching or watching people react to exorcism movies because like. a) rarely are they actually made by people connected to the Catholic Church so they act like being Catholic is some sort of magical power instead of like... a shitty religion you just... can either be a part of or raised in and you can just study it normally and therefore have normal amounts of information about it because it's like. not even an obscure religion. it's just contradictory because there are so many different factions and also like. there was a phase where everyone got really uncool about mysticism so even though there's a tone of rituals and stuff a history of sacrifice and blood and stuff there was also a modernization period where there was like "okay, everyone get really cool so they stop killing us. and we stop killing us. shut up about the blood sacrifice. We're not locking ladies in walls anymore. Shut up. Shut the fuck up. Shut up. How much of our genocides can we erase from history? Everyone else was doing it. It seemed cool at the time. Fuck." So between the sanitizing of their image, mass censorship, the splitting of the church, and the extended reach of history, really shitty research, and Catholics pulling from non-Bible Specific books for their Canon, a lot of people get confused. And Exorcism movies are like. A breeding ground for the *funniest* opinions, especially from people who in some way claim some form of expertise.

The Pope's Exorcist busting out Saint Benedict's Medal and people acting like it's this like Exorcism tool when like. Catholics wear medallions. Saint Benedict's has a cross with multiple prayers worked into it and is often included in the rosary and therefore is I guess worn by people in the line of exorcism because it's protection against evil. Lotta people will pick they're favourite patron saint for whatever is their main struggle, because they feel that saint is like... the most likely to field their prayers. Most Catholics have some kind of token of Saint Christopher in their car, since he's the patron saint of transportation. (my mom does, and says a prayer to him on long journeys. they literally make Saint Christopher medallions that clip onto your car's like. sun visor? shade.. thing. I now no longer remember what those little flap things are called. shit.)

I like. Am not Catholic anymore. I do not like The Church, I am aware of *many* atrocities committed in the name of Catholicism. like. you will not find me advocating *for* Catholicism, that guilt complex fucked me up and I live in Canada where the Catholic Church extended its cultural genocide to the Indigenous people here too. (Because, to be clear, I believe many of the European Indigenous Cultures were also kinda genocided honestly??? Like. I'm not gonna play martyr or shit, Holy Roman Empire was a long time ago and history is very very long. But, there is kind of a Borg situation that went around destroying original cultures and instituting its own to 'civilize people' and then expanding to new people and 'civilizing' those people. This is an inane thought process than never ends and helps no one and serves only be a game of blame pushing when the real goal should be like. actual actionable solutions. I only bring it up just to point out like. I think The Church as a whole, in particular Catholicism as one of the oldest bodies of the Christian Faith as an organized religion, has been an active force in colonizing and causing harm to and erasing the recognizable identity of people all over the world. And the Americas being so recent and obvious and in some ways reparable should be like. Yes, a story of shame, because there are things that will never be fixed, however. Now as we look and see the crimes that have been committed and are tempted to say 'the same crimes have been committed everywhere' we can instead be inspired to like. Not do that. Realize where our cultures were erased and stop that from happening. Like. I know that's kinda... overly optimistic and soft. Maybe it's annoying and savior complex-y. I don't know what action is wanted for me to take beyond listening actively and learning from the people more informed and affected by the issues... but. I mean. I guess if I can have nothing else in common with folks, I can have 'my cultural identity was wiped away by Catholicism' which is definitely traumatic, even if mine happened historically a long time ago.)

I lost the thread of this. I guess. it was gonna be funny and then I started thinking too much. Sorry. I don't really wanna cut this exposed nerve of a thought off, so it's just under a cut instead... it's intended as empathy, but it's probably just me having terrible social skills due to the isolation. My brain's been giving me weird thoughts lately. it's a lot.

#my life #pointless navel gazing

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beardedhandstoadshark · 1 year

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people are so attached to their individuality that they can't stand the idea of someone liking something you like. like hey did you ever consider they got into it because you were into it and they wanted to bond? do you agree?

Ah, Idk. Thats a bit situational, maybe?

(…the tldr‘a in the tags. This one got a bit long ^^;)

I mean, in general, yeah. There’s absolutely people out there who have to be the only one to like something, almost like some form of ego trip to put themselves above others, or invisible claim of ownership they can’t stand to share paired with egoism ("how dare they copy mE when I did it first!!“)

Same goes for the gatekeepers who see it as a room full of people who’re chill, but then someone bursts in also wanting to be a part of it and starts parading out and demanding changes so it fits them better without actually reading the room. When in reality they’re just adding another room onto the building. Though in this case it’s less "I wanna be special“ and more "you’re being annoying“.

But then there’s also stuff like, once people find out a cool thing exists and more flock to it, other parties smell money to be made which leads to the og thing being kinda "sanitized“ to appeal to mass markets, erasing everything that made it interesting in the process. So there could be this fear that whoever joins could be the one to tip the scales, I guess.

However, the thing about this whole "I‘m not like other girls“type thinking is that…it’s, as far as I can tell, mostly done by, well, girls. Kids from somewhere in elementary up to middle (and maybe the edges of high) school. Who start out getting told all their life "you‘re a girl, you HAVE to like pink and only play with dolls because girls are like that“ only to then drop into "you’re a girl, you HAVE to [act this way, dress in that, stop doing whatever made you happy before because it’s cringe, cover up, don’t cover too much, be cute, be kind, be silent, be objectified] or whatever adjectives fit any other group you could switch "girl“ out for here.

And if you’re told all your life that you HAVE to like certain things because you HAVE to fit in and you HAVE to be like everyone else, for no reason you could ever control and no say in it yourself? You either internalize it, or start hating the very thought of being like anyone else.

(I mean it’s of course still. Literally immature. And hopefully something most people learn to do grow out of? Especially since you do get more control over your own life once you’re an adult but like. …this ask was probably specifically only about the ego trippers in the first place, in which case. Yeah. They could maybe chill a bit.)

#another anon ask #tldr yea in general but maybe there’s a reason they’re like that #speaking of points that could take a sentence and instead take too many paragraphs-#this one oof

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phoenixyfriend · 3 years

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Anakin and the Jedi Babies: A Child's Ink

Context: Anakin and the Jedi Babies, chrono

WARNINGS: underage characters get tattoos/piercings

Word Count: 5680 Rating: T Ships: primarily Gen (Disaster Lineage + Shmi), offscreen JangoShmi, past Obitine, past Anidala ----

Ylliben Skywalker is known as a preternaturally calm and quiet child, serious and pensive.

He jokes. He roughhouses. He is as responsive to tickle attacks and shoulder rides and warm hugs as any other child.

But he is Jetii'Manda, not just Mando'ade, and that fact is impossible to forget.

This is a child that can read before he can speak, a child who can talk at length about 'grassroots antiestablishment propaganda and its influence on rural sociological development' before he can say the words without a lisp. This is a child who looks a man in the eye and tells him to check over his blaster one last time, or it will explode in his hand only minutes into the next engagement. This is a child who is not only willing, but capable of discussing the plausible ramifications of Duke Adonai Kryze's latest decrees with Jaster Mereel himself, while still in possession of all his baby teeth.

(His father is not worried by this. Upset, sometimes, pained and tired, but not worried.)

(His sister only laughs.)

It is, as a result, not as surprising as it could be, when a six-year-old wanders his way into Na-Tsuyon's parlor and asks her what the risks of getting a tattoo at his age are.

"I'm not having that conversation with you unless your parent is here," she says. A few of the other artists crane their heads in her direction, but she waves them off.

"I'm not trying to get it right this moment," Ben protests. "I'm just gathering information. He said that was fine."

"Still need your parent here here," she tells him.

He leaves for about ten minutes, and then comes back with a tall, gangling figure in tow.

"I hear this isn't the place for unaccompanied minors," Knight Skywalker jokes.

(She has heard him called a General. She does not know which war he fought. Nobody does.)

(They no longer ask.)

"Well, he is young," she says, brushing her tentacles back over a shoulder. "I don't let anyone under human-fourteen get tattooed without a parent on hand, and giving preliminary information to anyone under twelve is... generally not worth it, shall we say."

Skywalker smiles, oddly amused in the way he always is when someone points out his children need supervision. "Glad to hear it. Are you the Na-Tsuyon whose name is on the door?"

"I am," she says. "And you're Knight Skywalker."

He's pleased at that. She can feel it in the chemical receptors of her head tails, and wonders. "Yep. So, do we jump right into the discussion or do you need me to sign something, or..."

"No, it's enough that you're here," she assures him. "Now, the main reasons we discourage tattoos for younger sentients is the distortion factor. While the level of pain is much lower than it would have been several millennia ago, and we have the technology to remove ink from below the skin, a tattoo before your body stops growing will distort as you grow and your skin stretches. You would need to come in yearly for touch-ups, to remove the sections that have moved out of place, and fill in where the ink is no longer settled."

"That makes sense," Ylliben says. He looks up at his father, and then back to her. "You'd be able to tell me if any of my choices would be... bad for a Mandalorian, yes?"

"I would," she confirms. She glances up at Knight Skywalker. "I don't suppose you have any history of getting tattoos?"

"No," he says. "I'm from Tatooine, so..."

Different connotations to the very act of it, for him.

She ducks her head in a nod. "I understand. Generally it's easier if the parent has experience in the process, but it's far from mandatory. You're willing to work with the distortion maintenance?"

"Yes'm," Ylliben says, and his father shrugs and gestures, as if the word of a six-year-old is thus law.

"I'll walk you through the details of the process, including the care, relevant allergies, and so on. I don't suppose you have anything in mind already?" she asks.

"I do," he says. He doesn't tell her what it is, yet.

Anakin Skywalker stays there the entire time, and they make an appointment for later in the week.

----

"My buir isn't my only father," Ylliben says quietly, when it comes time to get details on what he's getting tattooed. "I had another father before him. A Jedi. He died, to protect me, and a lot of other people. So, um..."

He shoves a picture to her, the symbol of the Jedi, plain and simple. She looks at him.

"In red," he says, shifting on his feet, looking up at his father and then back down at the page. "For, um, to honor a parent."

"Your first father was a Jedi?" she asks, gentle as she can.

"Mm-hm," Ylliben says. "He died, um... he saved buir from slavery, too, a long time ago. Both my dads were Jedi, and I'm going to be one, too, and so is Sokanth. It's--it's about where I come from, and--"

"You don't have to justify it if you don't want to," Na-Tsuyon tells him, reaching out to place one hand on his. It's very warm and dry, in her opinion, but she finds that most humans are. Mandalorians are some 80% human, or near human.

Nautolan Mandalorians aren't unheard of, but she's a rare one.

Ben sucks in a breath, and says, "I want it up here, on my right shoulder, like a pauldron."

Na-Tsuyon nods, and looks up to Skywalker. "You'll have to sign some papers to approve it, Master Jedi. You approve of the design?"

Skywalker hesitates, and then goes to one knee in front of his son, and speaks so quietly she can only hear "--remind you of the generator complex?"

Whatever Ben's answer is, it's too quiet for her to catch. It satisfies Skywalker, though, and he stands. "Alright, let's see this paperwork."

----

When Ylliben comes in again, a year later to get his slightly-twisting tattoo fixed, it's with Miss Shmi in tow. Na-Tsuyon greets the middle Skywalker, for all that she's still not entirely sure how to address the girl. "I heard you've been attending the university at Sundari. Some kind of engineering?"

"Mechanical, yes," Shmi says, oddly soft. "I'm going to spend another year to specialize in vehicular engineering. I'd like to design starships, since I already know how to fix them."

"A worthy goal," Na-Tsuyon says, as she leads them over to one of the stations and starts sanitizing Ylliben's inked shoulder. She doesn't entirely see why a university education is needed for something that, in her opinion, an apprenticeship could more thoroughly cover. It certainly worked well enough Na-Tsuyon herself. "You're on vacation, then?"

"I am," Shmi confirms. "It's... unfortunate that Anakin couldn't be here a the same time, but we'll see each other in a few days."

Ylliben fidgets for a bit as his jedi symbol is fixed, and then finally asks, "Ori'vod can approve new tattoos, right?"

"Sokanth, no. Shmi..." Na-Tsuyon looks up at her. "I have no idea if you're listed as his legal guardian anywhere, and I'd need proof of that."

"Secondary to Anakin," Shmi confirms. "Ben would like this to be a surprise for Ani."

Ben pulls out a sheet, with a careful design on it, and presses it into Na-Tsuyon's lap when she lifts the tattoo gun and he's not at risk of ruining his own ink. It's simpler than the Jedi symbol, though it's two colors instead of one.

"It's the Open Circle Fleet," Ben says, shy in a way she's given to understand he usually isn't. She thinks his shyer moments may be connected to admitting to emotion, something that he's tying quite closely to his choice of Tattoos. "I thought, um, since I'm already--already honoring one buir, then, er..."

"The Open Circle Fleet was under the command of my brother's Jedi Master," Shmi explains, one hand on Ben's. "And I am given to understand that the symbol was designed as a subtle nod, of sorts, to the two of them as a team. Ben's looking to honor Anakin as he has his first father."

Ben looks down at his lap, and doesn't meet Na-Tsuyon's eyes.

"Bring me proof of guardianship," she tells them. "And I'll make sure you get it finished early enough that the bacta comes off before Knight Skywalker makes it home."

She holds true to her word, and talks her way into being there to see the reunion and reveal.

The emotions that cross Skywalker's face are complicated and unexpected in ways that she can't identify.

Then it's all too simple, because he starts crying on little Ylliben in the middle of the hangar.

----

It doesn't take a full year for Ylliben to come in for another set. It's only five months, maybe six. He has a sketch again, a geometric design of something she doesn't recognize, but still pings as familiar for some reason.

"It needs to be the right shade of blue," he tells her, serious as anything. Knight Skwyalker is right next to him, smiling all soft and indulgent, and maybe a little sad. "It's for Soka."

Oh. This is based on her facial markings, then. Or... what they will be, maybe. This doesn't look quite like what she's seen on the girl, but everyone knows little Ben is more touched by visions than his father and sister.

Na-Tsuyon thinks she knows where this is going. "The same blue as her montrals and lekku?"

Ben shakes his head. "No, 501st blue."

Or not.

"It's close, but a little darker and more saturated," Skywalker offers, and shrugs when she looks his way. "It's a long story, but the 501st was the legion I led before I arrived at Mandalore. It had a specific shade of blue assigned for armor paint, so legions could easily identify each other in the field."

That's... odd. She doesn't ask for more detail, though. It's not her business. "Where do you want this one?"

Ben shows her his left forearm and frames a section about two-thirds the length of it, along the outer side. Like a vambrace.

She has a feeling all these symbols will be on his armor, once he's old enough for it.

"Let's go through my inks and see which one will work best," she says, and does not comment on the rest.

----

When Ylliben comes in again, a few months before his next touch-up appointment, he doesn't have an image on hand. His father is trailing him again, and Na-Tsuyon has a guess.

"Time for Shmi?" she asks.

Ben ducks his head, flushing and not meeting Na-Tsuyon's eyes. "Yes'm."

"I thought as much," she says, and smiles at Skywalker. "General."

"Don't start."

"There have been oh so many rumors flying since the last Jedi run-in, you know."

"I don't care," he grouses, dropping into a seat. "Hells, a man takes emergency command for one battle, and it's all anyone can talk about."

"You ended a civil war, sir."

Ben giggles into his hands as Skywalker groans and slaps a hand over his eyes.

"No respect," the man complains. "Ben, be nice to me, I'm your dad."

"Nuh-uh," Ben says. "I know all the most embarrassing secrets."

"A cruel child," Skywalker accuses. "Ruthless."

"You're the one raising me," Ben says, swinging his legs back and forth. He's got plastoid training vambraces, now, and greaves that clink against the legs of the chair.

"Somehow, yes." Skywalker sighs, with great drama and all such things. He drags himself up to sitting. "Anyway. Moving on."

"Do you have something in mind already?" Na-Tsuyon asks.

"Binary suns," Ben says. "Just two overlapping circles, coin-sized, one bigger than the other, in sunset colors. In a gradient, with a sort of... flare to it? Halo? The... oh! The stellar corona. Buir knows the colors better."

"I want to see what you have to work with before I sketch out the design," Skywalker says. "But yeah, sort of pink and yellow and peachy."

"I can do almost any color," Na-Tsuyon promises. "Especially on fair human skin like Ylliben's. I won't have a problem getting those to show up the way I would on myself."

Na-Tsuyon is a color most would call 'aquamarine.' She's a light shade between blue and green, and much as she likes her skin, it's an absolute pain to make red and orange show up.

She can do it.

It's just annoying.

Ben asks for this one to be on the inside of the left forearm, high and opposite to the widest point of the mark for Sokanth.

----

"Can I see your fonts?"

Ben's alone, for the moment, but Na-Tsuyon knows that when he makes his decision, his father or Shmi will approve it without question. It's no harm to let him browse.

"Basic, Mando'a, or Huttese alphabet?" she asks. "Or something more esoteric?"

"Mando'a, please."

He's eight years old, now. He's still far younger than most of her clients, but she's long gotten used to him. Even when he's acting like a child, there's something to it that doesn't quite sit right. 'Born middle-aged,' a few of the other civilians on base had joked.

She wasn't sure if she thought it was just a joke, these days.

Na-Tsuyon passes her fonts book to the boy, and settles back in her chair for a long afternoon of running numbers. He, meanwhile, goes to sit in the lobby, legs still not long enough to reach the floor, paging through with unwavering, unsettling gravitas.

Half an hour, and then Ben returns.

He points to a font. "This one."

"What's it going to say?"

"Vode An," he tells her, as serious as can be. "In black, over my heart. It's important."

"It's a fairly common phrase," she notes idly. "Should be quick."

She doesn't expect much of a response, and certainly not the one she gets.

"It was different for them," Ben mutters, not looking at her. She sees him twisting the toes of one shoe into the floor. "It was... it was different. I can't talk about it. They were brothers, actually brothers, and they had--they had nothing, they were basically slaves, but--"

"You don't have to talk about it," Na-Tsuyon assures him, a hand on his. "You don't have to explain it to me. If it means something to you, that's all that matters. I just need you to be sure."

"And buir to sign the paperwork," Ben quips, smiling at her. She notices that several teeth are missing. It's cute. "You need that too."

"That too," she agrees.

When Skywalker shows up, he hears what it is that Ben would like, and makes a few suggestions for a border--a gear that sounded too much like the Republic's symbol for a Mando'a phrase, a building on stilts from a city she's never heard of on a planet that rings no bells, a human genetic strand for reasons she can't imagine--most of which are soundly ignored, until Skywalker sketched out a stylized ship of... some sort.

"Venator," Skywalker says, and taps the image. "Nobody will know it except us, but it'll mean something to you, for them."

Ben looks at it for a long moment, and then takes the scrap of flimsi with Mando'a on it and lays it overtop the center of the sketch.

He stares at it for a few long moments, and then nods sharply and pushes it to Na-Tsuyon. "This, please."

He's such a polite child.

It makes it easier to ignore the more confusing parts of his presence in her parlor.

----

"Hi!"

Sokanth Skywalker is in her shop.

That's new.

"Hello," Na-Tsuyon says. "I didn't know you were thinking of getting ink."

"I'm not," she says, hopping up on a stool across the counter. She holds out a hand, and Na-Tsuyon clasps it with bemusement. "But you guys do piercings too, right?"

"We do," she confirms. "You're... ten?"

"Yep!" Sokanth chirps, kicking her legs back and forth. "Is that old enough to get these without permission, or should I ask my dad to come by?"

"At least twelve for piercings without in-person, signed approval from a parent or guardian," Na-Tsuyon says. "Though if you're anything like your brother, I don't imagine that'll be a problem for you."

Sokanth grins at her, bright and a little wild. "Nose, bottom lip, eyebrow. I don't know the actual terms, but I know what I want. Which do you suggest getting first?"

"I'd say nostril," Na-Tsuyon tells her. Most species even vaguely humanoid kick off with the ears, but that's not exactly an option for a togruta. "Let me get a chart and you can figure out what type of piercing you want, and what kind of hoop or stud. I don't actually do the piercings myself, though. Comm the General if you want this done today, though."

"Thank you~!"

----

Nostril, labret, and a horizontal brow, the piercer notes down at the end of the latest Skywalker visit. Na-Tsuyon wonders if the brow piercing will look strange with Soka's markings, and then doesn't think on it further.

----

Ylliben, almost nine, is silent as he gets the touch-up.

His father isn't here. Neither is Shmi. It's pre-approved, signed permission and all, but it's still odd that neither of Ben's adults is here.

Sokanth is, but she's almost as quiet as Ben is.

Na-Tsuyon has heard the rumors, but she's not going to say anything. She's not. It's not her business.

"Ben," Soka speaks up, towards the end of the appointment. "Ask her the thing."

Ben shakes his head. "No way."

"She knows more about tattoos and how important they are than anyone!" Soka urges. "Ask her!"

"Do you want to wait for your father?" Na-Tsuyon suggests.

"No!" both immediately yelp.

She pauses, glad the needle hadn't been to skin, and levels a look at Ben. He flushes and settles down, mumbling an apology for jerking as he had. She goes back to fixing the stretch of the binary suns tattoo.

Soka shifts in her seat, watching them intently.

"Shmi's upset with buir," Ben suddenly says. He doesn't meet Na-Tsuyon's eyes. "I'm... I don't know if you heard what's going on."

"I do my best to avoid rumors," she says, keeping her voice as neutral as she can. "I did hear that the Mand'alor is about to have a grandchild, and something about an upcoming wedding. That much has been announced officially."

"Dad freaked out," Soka says, legs kicking back and forth. "He's happy for her, and he's fine with Jango being the other parent, but it kicked off a... philosophical crisis? Ben, what do you think?"

"Metaphysical, maybe," Ben mumbles. "Definitely existential."

"And he told Shmi some stuff and now she's hurt that he didn't tell her before and it's all a mess," Soka finishes. "So, uh, we don't... want either of them involved. Until. Um. Until that's settled."

Na-Tsuyon bites back any deeper questions she might have. "Alright. I won't pry. What did you want to know from me?"

"I had a plan for what I was going to get next," Ben says, staring at the fold of fabric over his sister's knees in lieu of something more pertinent. "A peace lily, on the inside of my wrist, for..."

"You don't have to tell me," she reminds him.

Ben bites his lip, and closes his eyes, and breathes in deep. Neither of the girls comment.

"She was important," Ben finally says. "In the big memories. But she doesn't... she's not... she isn't here. And Jango is. And he's marrying Shmi, and they're having a baby, so I should put a mark down for him first, right?"

"He's gonna be Mand'alor, too," Soka adds.

"He is," Na-Tsuyon says, as neutral as she can.

"He's joining the family," Ben says, his gaze fixed on the floor in front of him. "And there's going to be a baby, and that's. That's important."

"There's no order that you have to get things in," Na-Tsuyon assures him, squeezing his shoulder in a light gesture of support. "You've prioritized family so far, so I think it would make sense to get a mark for the coming cousin, at least. Unless... is the lily for your birth mother?"

Ben's face twists, uncomfortable for some reason she can't begin to guess at.

"No," Ben says.

"Skyguy's Jedi Master did almost marry her when they were younger," Soka explains. She glances at Na-Tsuyon and then away and at the wall. "They had a whole dramatic 'forbidden romance' thing going on, 'cause Jedi aren't supposed to get married. She died before Ben came into the picture, though."

It's a neat enough explanation.

It feels fake, but much of what the Skywalkers say about their pasts does.

She's sure it's true in some way. In some perspective. From... from a certain point of view, maybe.

"Alright, then," Na-Tsuyon dismisses. "All things aside, I would suggest adjusting your order of tattoo acquisition, but there's no particular requirement by Mandalorian standards. Your choices are rarely anything that intersects with set traditions, nor do you have a historic clan or house that comes with mandates of the sort. It seems that you're leaning towards prioritizing something for the new additions to your family, though; you've made it clear that these things are important to you, and I think you should pursue it if you're comfortable with it."

Ben nods, eyes somewhere far off.

"It'll make him flustered," Soka pushes, kicking lightly at her brother's ankle. "Jan-Jan's still worried you don't like him anymore."

"He is not," Ben huffs. "He's just scared of buir."

"Nah, your opinion matters too," Soka argues. "And you've been avoiding everyone 'cuz Skyguy freaked out and Shmi's upset, so Jango's worried you're mad at him about the baby happening. If you get a tattoo about him, he might actually cry."

"Is that why you want me to take that route?"

"Not the only one," Soka says, utterly guileless. She blinks at him, bright and innocent. "But I definitely do want to see the future Mand'alor crying because you made it obvious he's family now. It'll be funny."

Ben sighs, very clearly being dramatic about it. "Soka, I'm not going to pick a tattoo based on what you think will be funny."

"Imagine his face, though."

Na-Tsuyon doesn't comment at the expressions Ben makes as he very clearly does exactly that.

"Well, kriff," Ben sighs, and Soka giggles at the swear. "I'll have to get a tattoo for Jango, then."

----

Ben is already nine by the time he comes in with his father to actually get the tattoo for Jango's addition to the family. The choice he makes isn't particularly imaginative, but it'll suit well enough. A mythosaur skull, the symbol of the Haat Mando'ade, in a grey the same shade as beskar.

There actually are traditions to this one, specific adjustments to the framing and stylization meant to indicate how one fits into the faction, but also how one is associated with the Mand'alor. Ben is family, and close family, but not related by blood, nor adopted directly by the Mand'alor, rather a relative through the riduur be alor.

Na-Tsuyon explains each element and adjustment in detail, lets them process and agree, until she's taking a needle to Ben's skin once more.

"Will you be getting one for the coming child as well?" Na-Tsuyon asks while shading in a curve of bone.

"Not yet," Ben tells her, quiet and oddly contemplating. "I need to meet them, first. Figure out who they are."

"Sensible," she agrees. There's the usual oddity in his phrasing, and she ignores it as ever. "Did you tell Fett that you were getting this?"

"No, it's intended as a surprise," Ben says, watching her work.

She can almost feel the coming question.

It does not come from the human she expects.

"Do you know any Mando tattoo artists in Little Keldabe?" the General asks, voice low.

She finishes the line she's on, lifts the needle away from skin, and turns to him. "You're leaving for Coruscant?"

"Not yet," Skywalker says. He meets her eyes evenly. "But... soon. The time's coming. A year, maybe two. The Force will let us know when the time is right."

"Uh-huh," Na-Tsuyon acknowledges this. She does not comment further. The Force is not her wheelhouse. If they think it wants them back on Coruscant, with the Temple, then that's what they believe.

"These are Mando work," Skywalker continues, almost painfully earnest, "and I'd like to ensure whoever maintains them until Ben stops growing knows the right way to handle Mando art."

It's really not that different from a standard tattoo artist, but she's a little charmed anyway. Enchanted, almost. The man really does care.

"I can get you some names and addresses next time you stop by," she promises him. "It's been a few years since I checked in on their work, and I'll need to look them over before I make any recommendations."

He smiles at her, relieved in a manner she finds appallingly open for a Jedi like himself.

Ben mimics his father.

----

She gets to attend the wedding, months later.

The food is very, very good.

(Ben waits until the reception to show off his new tattoo, and the future Mand'alor does, in fact, cry.)

(So does Shmi.)

(So does their eight-week-old daughter, but that's probably unrelated to the tattoo.)

----

"Do you think getting a belly button ring would be good?"

Na-Tsuyon doesn't lift her head from her paperwork when Sokanth poses the question to the piercer. She's in for the horizontal brow bar, this time, and the labret is going to be somewhere a few months down the line.

"That's really up to you," the piercer says. His name is Hujnak, and he's a Devaronian that's been working here since Na-Tsuyon opened up the place. She loves him dearly, but he stole the last piece of cake and for that he will have no help with difficult customers for the next fortnight.

Or until she gets bored.

"I'm leaning towards 'no,' but I'm not sure," Soka muses. "I like the idea of it, but I feel like it might get snagged on things more easily. Plus, it's going to be a point of higher damage and pressure if I get a gut punch. It's one of the parts of my body I'm never really going to armor up, you know?"

They do know. There have been screaming matches about all the Jedi's refusal to wear enough armor on many occasions. The Jedi prioritize their agility to such a degree that armorweave is more reasonable than actual armor, in their opinion. This is an opinion that Fett and Mereel both take issue with.

At great volume.

(Shmi has vambraces, a gorget, and greaves, Na-Tsuyon knows. Some of it was exchanged at the wedding. Shmi doesn't wear much armor, certainly less than even the children. Shmi, crucially, isn't a warrior or otherwise planning to see battle.)

"Then I would say it may be best to hold off."

"Phooey," Soka says, though she doesn't seem particularly upset. "Ben's gonna be cooler than me forever, then."

"You think tattoos are cooler than piercings?" Hujnak challenges. "I'm offended."

"He can just get more," Soka protests. "Without it looking weird or getting dangerous, I mean."

Hujnak hums, noncommittal. "And you're worried about being cooler than the younger brother you have told me is, and I quote, the biggest nerd ever?"

"Well, yeah," Sokanth scoffs. "He's gonna start acting older than me as soon as he thinks he can get away with it. I gotta have something to hold over his head, you know?"

"Seeing as you are the older sibling..."

"Ehhhh..."

Nope.

Not paying attention.

----

"These are House Kryze colors."

Ylliben's breath hitches.

He is ten. He doesn't seem ready to provide answers. She turns to the father instead.

"Will that be a problem?" the general asks, calm and even.

"Yes," she says, and Ben slumps. She continues, because this is her job, and for a reason. "Unless you have a ready justification for when House Kryze asks, yes, it will be a problem. If it were a landscape or an animal, it wouldn't matter, but the pairing of the colors and the peace lily is an explicit statement of loyalty to Adonai and his heir, Satine. Unless you've suddenly decided to adjust your political stance to total pacifism instead of your Jedi approach, or have another reason to take on House Kryze colors, I'd warn against it at all, and would refuse to perform the work myself."

Ylliben's eyes are fixed somewhere behind her, and shining wetly.

"Okay," the general says. "Ben, do you have any other pallettes in mind?

"These were her colors," Ben whispers, and then he swallows thickly. "I just..."

"Simplify," Skywalker suggests. He fiddles with a necklace half-hidden in his Jedi layers; the japor one is visible, but a dull gold glint is all Na-Tsuyon can see of the other before it's tucked away again. "She'd understand, yeah? There's political ramifications. Dangerous ones, especially to you."

Interesting thing to say about a woman who, by Soka's earlier statements, died well before Ben was born.

They could at least try to stop dropping hints about their oddities. She doesn't want to know more.

"Lilac," Ben finally decides. "And... pale silver. With a filigree pattern in the shading?"

"I can do that," Na-Tsuyon promises.

She does not ask further.

----

"We're moving to Coruscant in a month."

Na-Tsuyon's head snaps up, head tails jolting almost painfully with the movement.

Sokanth is getting her labret, finally. She's gossiping as Hujnak prepares the tools, as usual, and Na-Tsuyon tries to ignore it when they Skywalkers do that, she does, but...

"You're leaving," she repeats, feeling oddly blank.

"Um... yeah?" Soka answers. She scratches at one stubby montral. "We've talked about it before. I thought you knew."

"I didn't realize it was so soon," Na-Tsuyon defends. She's more upset than she should be. "I thought you'd be waiting until the little princess was older."

Sokanth blinks at her, slow and... not judging, no. Evaluating, maybe.

"I'm almost thirteen," she says, slow and deliberate and heavy. "And Ben's eleven. There's no hard age limit for becoming a padawan, but I'm getting into the peak years for getting chosen, and I've been living here instead of in the Temple. I haven't had years to impress a potential Master like the others. That might not matter; sometimes a Master sees their future student and just knows, but... I need to have other Jedi to spar with, not just Skyguy and Ben. And Ben's visions are getting stronger, and Dad was never that good with his own in the first place, so he's worried about being able to help at all. We could stay longer, but..."

She trails off, and shrugs, and the weighted air disappears. "It's not the same thing as a verd'goten, at all, but it's about the same age, you know? I should be in the Temple for it."

"What would a verd'goten equivalent be?" Hujnak prompts, when Na-Tsuyon fails to find her words. "Being an adult and equal member and all such things?"

"Knighthood," Soka answers immediately. "Dad got knighted when he was twenty, but that's really young, usually. His master was knighted at twenty-five, which was a bit late, but apparently there was a whole dramatic thing going on there that Dad never got all the details about."

"Becoming a Padawan is a sign that your teachers see you as someone that is ready to take on the responsibilities of a Jedi, yes?" Hujnak asks. "That you may not be ready to go out on your own, but that you're old enough to understand your oaths and choose how to follow them, and to protect others?"

Sokanth considers this, and then nods. "Yeah, I guess it's similar to using the verd'goten to gauge if someone's ready to swear the Resol'nare, that way. Still not moving out, and just about entering an apprenticeship, but enough of an adult to make the choice of how to change the world."

"I think most cultures have something like that around the same age," Hujnak comments. "Some do it a bit later in the teens, but it's usually around your age that most... well, most cultures who age at the 'human standard' rate--"

Na-Tsuyon can't help the reflexive snort of derision. Neither can Soka. Hujnak, the closest to human in the room and yet still very much not, smiles like this is exactly what he intended.

"--most who age at that rate do have it somewhere in that eleven-to-seventeen range, I'd think."

Soka shrugs. "Yeah, well. Still gotta go to the Temple for it, you know?"

"Are you going to take the verd'goten at all?" Na-Tsuyon asks, suddenly a little desperate to keep the Skywalkers here, with Mandalore and all its people, just a fraction of a moment longer.

"I don't think so," Soka muses. "I've been thinking about it, but I should probably talk about it with Jango, yeah?"

"Yeah," Na-Tsuyon says, and feels like she's swallowing down around rocks.

----

As it turns out, the timing is very deliberate. Three weeks later, Jaster transfers the title of Mand'alor to his son.

(Though Na-Tsuyon does not know this, twenty-six is older than Jango was when he lost the title, once upon another life.)

There is a week of festivity. There is food, and drink, and dancing. Some people get married. Some people make announcements of impending births. Some people reveal songs they composed in preparation for this very day.

For a week, Mandalore celebrates a new king.

Then, the Jedi and his children leave.

(Ben gives Na-Tsuyon a hug before he goes.)

(She tries to understand why she feels like she's losing something when he does.)

#Obi Wan Kenobi #Anakin Skywalker #Ahsoka Tano #Shmi Skywalker #JangoShmi #Jango Fett #Disaster Lineage #star wars #time travel #de aging #mandalore #mandalorian culture #phoenix posts #Anakin and the Jedi Babies #tattoos #original characters #outsider pov #this is part one of three I think #it's two in the diddly darn morning and I am going to bed

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nerdygaymormon · 3 years

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uhhhh david have you gotten the liahona yet bc idk how to feel about an article i found in there yesterday. it was pretty comforting and basic, but did use ssa the whole time. BUT the youth one was pretty crappy, it used ssa to the max and gave no real hope, was pretty bland and annoying about oh itll be find just believe and jesus and get hatecrimed <3 i would like to hear your thoughts on it, its the first time ive seen any queer topics in church magazines

Thanks for bringing these to my attention.

"Same-sex attraction" (SSA) is the preferred term of Church leaders. They say it's a way of not making it your identity, that this isn't part of who I am but rather is something I'm dealing with. In other words, people "have" same-sex attraction, not that they "are" gay or lesbian or bi.

There have been a few leaks from behind-the-scenes where the apostles say they use "same-sex attraction" because it's the term that people like least. People like it less that same-gender attraction or gay/lesbian. SSA includes the word "sex" and I guess the idea is it gets people to think of sexual acts and feel queasy.

SSA is the term normally used in Church magazines because they follow the lead of the First Presidency and apostles.

There's 3 items in the Church magazines this month about queer people! That's a lot for one month.

————————————————————

The first is a bishop talking about how to understand and include LGBT people at church. After becoming bishop, 3 sets of parents contacted him distressed that their child is gay or transgender (I note that the parents used "gay." He also mentions contacting someone who 'identifies as gay").

His first recommendation is to follow the living apostles. (which explains why the bishop uses "SSA" even though everyone else around him used "gay"). It's a good idea for a local leader to find what the current leaders are saying because it's changed. He also says to read the Church's websites titled “Same-Sex Attraction” and “Transgender.” He provides two lovely quotes from those pages about diversity at church and being loving to people who are different.

His second recommendation is to not be afraid to talk to people who identify as gay, but instead try to have love for them and then let the Spirit guide you in what to say. We're just people, it shouldn't be scary to talk to us, that shows how different he thinks we are from the other people he interacts with in his ward.

The bishop's third suggestion is to speak to people who are familiar with LGBT "issues," share your testimony, and apologize for hurtful things you say. His list of people to contact for help understanding was a little disheartening because he starts with his stake leaders, ward leaders, other bishops, and so on, actual queer people were the last people on his list.

He continues by saying to pull aside members who are saying homophobic or transphobic things and give them some personal guidance, don't share private information that a member shares with the bishop, and just because someone has these "attractions" doesn't mean they're acting on them, and if they aren't "acting" on them then you can let them have a calling.

I have a few comments about the last few things. If no one corrects the homophobic/transphobic comments in public but instead privately suggests the person do better, every one who heard those comments thinks they stand unchallenged. The atmosphere created by the comments is unchanged. Especially if the bishop was present to hear those words, if they go uncontested then people think this is what is acceptable.

You'd think bishops know not to share private information a member shares with them. I've been around long enough to know that when a bishop is unsure what to do, he starts contacting his network (stake presidency, other bishops) asking for advice. Some bishops are discreet when doing this and others name the individuals.

While it seems basic, I recently had a counselor in a bishopric who didn't think gay people could get a temple recommend, that there's a zero-tolerance policy. That is an attitude that is outdated by a couple of decades, but it shows that people need to learn that simply existing as a gay or trans person doesn't automatically mean we are committing great sins.

I do find it interesting there appears to have been quite a few queer individuals in his ward, at least 4 or 5, and reading between the lines it seems they all stopped attending.

The bishop's heart is in the right place. I get he's following the Church leaders and that limits some of what he can do for queer people in his ward. I think his perspective primarily is of making the parents feel more welcome in the ward and not ostracized for having queer kids.

————————————————————

The second article in the Liahona is written by a person with same-sex attraction and his work to overcome the shame he felt.

It's a much better article than the one written by the bishop. This person shares about the shame they felt at having gay feelings and working with a therapist to overcome that shame. He shares 3 lessons that helped him with this process.

1) God and Jesus love and accept him as he is. This is a message that doesn't often get conveyed to queer members and it's important they know this.

2) The Atonement of Jesus Christ offers healing. At first he was wanting the Atonement to cure him of being gay, but instead it helped him be healed of the shame he felt. I hear so many members who think the Atonement can change us from gay to straight, and that's not true. I'm glad he made this distinction. Our Heavenly Parents don't view being gay or trans as something that needs to be cured. I wish that message was taught more openly in the Church.

3) Build deeper connections and show compassion. Loneliness and feeling like you don't belong at church are two of the most troubling aspects an LGBTQ+ person has to deal with if they are active in the LDS Church. Developing close friendships will help with that. Also, queer people tend to be more compassionate than the average person and I believe it's because of the experiences we had to deal with of living in a heteronormative world that isn't made for us.

He includes a few useful tips at the end on how to engage with queer people.

All in all, a much better story than the one written by the bishop. He shared part of how it feels to be a gay member of this church, the idea that he should be ashamed for who he is, that being gay isn’t a burden, that he doesn't fit in.

I appreciated he said this is part of his layers of identity and at the core of his identity is that we're children of heavenly parents. That's more nuanced than the apostles who reject being gay has anything to do with identity and our only identity should be a child of God.

————————————————————

The final story is from For the Strength of Youth. This piece seems like it's written by a queer person, but it's anonymous and given as general advice to show that people with same-sex attraction belong at church.

This article makes 3 main points. The first is that God loves you. That's true, although accompanying quotes to back up this principle aren't specifically about queer people.

The second point is "you belong." All sorts of people attend church, and God is no respecter of persons. Then they have a quote from Elder L. Whitney Clayton that people with same-sex attraction are welcome to come to church. To me, he's an odd choice to give this message as he led the Church's fight in California on Prop 8 to make gay marriage illegal again. Words aren't enough. Saying I'm welcome is not the same as making a welcoming climate.

The third point is that God will help you. They include a quote from Laura F. who experiences same-sex attraction. She writes about prayer, scripture study, temple and church attendance. However, she also says she doesn't know what her life will look like in 20 years, she seems to be leaving open the possibility her journey with God will lead her to romance and out of the church. I thought that was very honest and important.

————————————————————

I found it noteworthy that nowhere in these 3 articles does it say being alone and celibate is good and what God wants.

I appreciate the idea that we can make our local congregations less homophobic/transphobic. The suggestions from the bishops shows that the bar is pretty low and it doesn't take much to make an improvement from how things are now.

The voices of the two gay members was important, what they shared was useful but nuanced, didn't make commitments to staying in the church long-term or testify that what the church requires is what God wants for them.

Even so, it's clear the publisher is very careful. They use "same-sex attraction" so often, I think readers would be surprised the preferred term of most same-sex attracted people would be gay, bi or lesbian. While they addressed some things, like homophobic/transphobic comments, feeling shame & not fitting in, I think they largely skated past the things that make queer people decide that this church isn't for them.

There's a part of me that says I'm glad we're having this conversation in the Church magazines, but another part that says this is too sanitized and doesn't get at the heart of things. These are very hopeful messages that make it seem that queer people could easily choose to stay in church if a few adjustments were made and if they only understood God loves them, which avoids the "doctrine" that excludes queer people from the highest blessings and joys and makes us essentially second-class citizens in the kingdom of God, at least according to our church.

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sanstropfremir · 3 years

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I’d love your thoughts on BTS and their current image and music if you have them and aren’t afraid of the mindless internet hoards.

Personally, I liked a lot of their older stuff, but haven’t liked anything since I think the Fake Love promotions 3+ years ago. They’d started losing their personality and soul before that album cycle, but it feels like the sanitization of their image and artistry really kicked into hyperdrive after that. Now most of what they do seems like a sterile money grab driven by the Hybe hive mind which is a shame.

ok alrighty (cracks knuckles) let's get into it.

now that i've fully given myself a headache watching the majority of the bts videography, here are three points i'm going to cover:

performative character and the lack thereof

interesting aesthetics and the lack thereof, and

the inevitable cracking of perfection

ready, set, let's begin.

idol music is very clearly definited by spectacle based aesthetics. and it's had that structure for its entire existence. so i gotta hand it to hybe for this one, because they managed to revolutionize being utterly fucking average. the triumph of bts is that they're just some guys and they look like just some guys. hybe found a niche in the system and then gamed that system to the tune of one of the largest musical acts in the world. they're not marketing bts as a romantic parasocial relationship, they're marketing them as your friends. and that is just as insidious to lonely kids as a run of the mill romantic fantasy. but that's not what i'm here to talk about today.

there's a pattern i find very interesting with bts mvs and that is that i don't remember anything about them. specifically, i don't remember the stuff that's happening IN the video; not the styling, not the setpieces, if i didn't know the members i doubt i would remember them either. what i DO remember, is how expensive the production is, and specific shots. i couldn't tell you what a single member was wearing, but i sure as hell remember that first upward angle shot of jungkook and the rusted park ride in spring day. or every single time they do that birdseye shot of jin in like every video. honestly as far as i'm aware jin has only ever worn a loose fitting beige longsleeve shirt.

it took bts a long time to establish any kind of consistent visual character. and the character they did establish.... i don't know if you can call a family-friendly-style clean aesthetic 'character'. they debuted as a hip hop group to little (comparative) success, and then made a switch to doing an early version of where they're currently at right now. if you've seen any of the mvs, you know that this is a pretty significant visual change. i don't think it is inherently a bad change, since the visual branding for hiphop based groups always tips over into iffy terrritory, but it is dramatic enough and early enough that it doesn't strike me as a natural evolution. concept switch ups are common, but they usually work because the members have established a bit of character for themselves, used their performance abilities and presence to fit into a niche in the group. the idol mould is perfect for showcasing the performers; that's its function. the groups that are the most fun to watch are the ones with stage presence, the ones who know how to perform, who can act all the parts they need to play. and bts? 4/7 actual performers on a good day. in my personal opinion it's 2/7.

i'm gonna expand on what i said about jimin here (this is technically the first part of this series), because it does apply to the rest of the group on the whole:

and i think here is where we see the main crux of the difference between taemin and jimin as performers: taemin has both an artistic and an idol persona. we know and understand him to do solo work that has a separate artistic meaning to just him being an idol. even though this performance was pre-move, i would still say this applies, because he's hot off press your number, where he's acting in a story based mv. jimin on the other hand just has his idol persona. he's not known for creating the same kind of storytelling that taemin is.

bts has been very insistent on the image of the group as a single unit. despite having the size of fanbase and the revenue that would make any official solo debut a massive success, none of them have done any substantial solo work. this isn't artistically a problem, and i think it's very admirable of them to be so dedicated to the image and the legacy of the group, when that can be an uncommon trait in the industry. i do however, think it starts to become an issue when we want to discuss what the artistic visions and images of groups are. shinee taemin and solo taemin have two distinct artistic representations, and taemin himself will attest to that. it's the same with all the shinee members that have solo careers, and the same with other groups. jackson, bambam, yugyeom, and jaebeom's solo work is all very different from got7. yixing's solo work is very different from exo's. even the subunits within exo all have their own character (cbx and sc). kpop groups all ostensibly are trained under the same system, so why the disparity with bts? mostly, it's their brand of "authenticity." it's impossible to perform authentically, by the nature of performance as a medium it is unnatural, and tragically, not everyone is naturally interesting, or suited to performing: that's why the performing arts even exist in the first place. it required painstaking training to be good at performing; it is a complex set of skills and those skills are not learnt by "being authentic." being an idol is not just the singing, dancing, rapping; that's only half the work. you need to be able to act to be a compelling performer. pulling your true self and emotions out on stage every night is a fast track to burnout and psychological issues, there's plenty of evidence. the only member of bts of whom i can say for some certainty has a persona and a stage presence is jhope/hoseok, a) because he's kept up a very specific brand in the solo work that he has done, and b) he has actual dance training, not just kpop dance training. the rest of them may have the kpop dance and the kpop vocal training, but what they do not have is the ability to market themselves as compelling performers on stage. taehyung is the only other member i would hesitantly give a semblance of persona and ability to, but i think he stumbled onto that mostly by accident. and if all the pieces don't each have a distinctive colour, how can the whole machine be visually interesting?

bts may never have been able to establish an aesthetic brand, but what they did establish is an intellectual one. if you talk to a fan, the schtick they give is that "it's about the lyrics." as noble as having an intellectual or cerebral message is, what does that look like? how do you portray intellectual on stage, on film? what about intellectual is interesting to watch? cerebral, by it's literal nature as a descriptor, is very difficult to communicate in visual language because it is internal. to successfully communicate cerebrality and intellect in a short form medium like music videos requires a deft hand with metaphor that can elude even an experienced designer. and honestly? i don't know whether to applaud hybe's visual team for being the most successful subtle contemporary designers i've every seen, or to decry them as worst kpop designers i've ever seen. maybe both. regardless, i don't think they're able to cross the gap.

there are exactly four mvs where i actually remember the content of the mv and not the frame it sits in, and those are dna, idol, the singularity comeback trailer with taehyung, and war of hormone. and of an eight year career......that's not very many. these four mvs have at least an inkling of interesting spectacle and character, but even then, it's still a stretch. there is absolutely nothing to write home about in the styling for dna, other than it's well colour matched. I don't even know if I should include singularity because it involves none of the other members. idol is probably their most interesting mv because it actually has alternative styling and varies (at least a little bit) from the standard hybe boom crane shot-that-shows-off-how-we-can-afford-big-studio-spaces-and-locations. the company and the group would be loathe to admit it, but war of hormone is a well designed and interesting mv for the time it was made, with a well crafted gimmick and some actual showing of character from the members. it was the start of a potential that they squashed quite quickly because it wasn't picking up in the hiphop-group-saturated market of 2014. but the rest of their mvs? remarkably uninspired styling. like it's truly impressive how boring the styling is. and like i've said, that is the triumph in their aesthetics: they all look like normal dudes (if you had professional skin + makeup techs looking after them for the last 8 years).

all of this is a carefully crafted image that's tailored to hooking an audience, especially an international one. the mvs are boring in the relative scale of kpop, but they're just different enough from a western pop mv to catch attention. and once you do sink a hook, there's a direct clickfunnel of content that bills itself on these men being "authentic" and "self-producing," which is a huge draw to international fans, because people are racist and believe that the kpop industry is a factory that produces idols like clones, where none of them know how to do anything other than sing and dance and all the music is just handed to them by companies. and they have SO much content that there's no way a new fan can get to it all in a timely manner, so they'll never have to engage with any other kpop artists' work if they don't actively seek it out. but that's another essay for another time.

that brings us to current day, in which at least the last five bts releases have been in the same aesthetic vein of positive, sanitized, and pristine. i said it in one of my txt responses and i will say it again here: money scrubs the humanity from the aesthetic of living. minimalism is for rich white people. hybe and bts may have pivoted their style and brand directly into the lane of mass appeal, but when you pair that with the amount of money funding them, there's a cognitive dissonance between the message and the aesthetics in which it's portrayed. some people do like the clean cut looks, and i won't say that they don't work, but as you've likely gleaned from this response, it isn't my style and if you've been around and reading my writing for longer you'll know that my tastes runs much closer to the messy and the weird, so very little about any of bts' visuals have appeal to me. i do find the contradiction of applying the appeal of radical relatability with the aesthetics of expansive (and expensive) minimalism interesting; it's an extremely fine line that hybe is walking and eventually they are going to tip over, the porcelain mask will not hold forever. maintaining the all ages aesthetic is going to be difficult now that all of them are grown ass men. with other groups of this member age and generation there's very obviously been a shift to a more adult tone, and not necessarily explicitly. got7, mx, nu'est, btob, shinee, 2pm, and groups that have older members like a.c.e and sf9 have all made slow shifts in tone that are undeniably aimed at a maturing audience: they know their core fanbases are aging with them and they (the fans) are not as interested in the 'boy' in boy group. and most of them have telltale visual styles, enough so that i can distinguish a specific group's mv. the last year and change of mx mvs have a very distinctive character; got7 too, since easily as far back as if you do. i can always tell an a.c.e mv by its impeccable fashion and formic styling, and although shinee has always had a more experimental aesthetic edge, their sound and voices are unmistakable.

honestly, i can't predict what bts is going to do in the future, but i personally don't believe they can keep up their clean aesthetic indefinitely without some fallout. part of the fun of following bands is watching them grow musically, and the last couple of years of bts haven't felt like growth. there are fans that have already started realizing it, and there's likely to be more soon.

---

the third part is here, which is a short followup about some of bts' industry influence.

#this is long one dear readers #a very long one #strap in #i've sat on this for probably a week now in the hopes my brain can make some interesting connections but honestly?#not a lot about bts is interesting in comparision to the rest of the kpop industry #personally i am of the opinion that lyrics do not matter in idol music and i am not interested in them in the slightest #and bts videos ARE extremely bland visually #unless you like looking at expensive production. whatever floats your boat i guess #they make a lot of sense as an entry kpop group but once you get actually into the industry there is SO much happening #which i talk about in the third part a little bit #this is way too long i am so sorry anon and everyone else who has been asking about this topic #im not entirely sure it's coherent at this point but whatever. its out there now #i wanted this to be under 1k and that emphatically did not happen #it is double that. why am i like this #875 #kpop questions #kpop analysis #group analysis #text #answers

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suits-of-woe · 3 years

Text

can you do a gay two gentlemen of verona?

(aka the post where i try to find some emotional coherence in the worst line in the canon)

well. can you do a gay two gentlemen of verona?

a. yes

b. but should you?

honestly, i'm really not sure. this play is bad. really, really bad. i assume most people reading this post know how it ends, but let's just be crystal clear: (cw rape) proteus, one of our supposed romantic heroes, tries to rape silvia after she rejects his advances. valentine stops him, but after proteus apologizes, valentine, our other hero and silvia's love interest, offers to give silvia to the man who just tried to rape her in an act of friendship.

so no, i don't think this interpretation (or any interpretation) can make that moment okay. even if it somehow could, it's just one moment, and misogyny is baked into almost every part of this play. and no, i absolutely do not mean to suggest that interpreting characters as gay can be used to excuse any of this, or that gayness is somehow an explanation for violent misogyny.

that said, we live in a world where this play exists. people talk about it and write about it and perform it fairly frequently, and since that's not changing any time soon, i do think it can be worthwhile to see what we can do with it. my interest is not in sanitizing anything but in creating some emotional coherence out of something that just feels nonsensical at first glance.

phew. so. can you do a gay two gentlemen of verona? does it actually make the play more compelling? i think it could.

you really don't have to look that far for homoeroticism in this play. i mean jesus, the first line is valentine calling proteus "my loving proteus." we get shit like this, which feels like it's just begging to be played as tender unrequited love:

PRO: [...] If ever danger do environ thee, Commend thy grievance to my holy prayers, For I will be thy beadsman, Valentine.

VAL: And on a love-book pray for my success?

PRO: Upon some book I love I'll pray for thee.

individual lines aside, the whole first scene is just...a lot. proteus has clearly been begging valentine not to leave and trying to delay their parting as long as possible. valentine makes it very clear that he wants proteus with him and he wouldn't be leaving without him if it weren't for the fact that proteus is in love. it's all just very...yeah.

so here's the interpretation i think works best: proteus and valentine are in love. they have been for a long time. valentine is aware of it. proteus isn't. he's deep, deep in denial, fixating on julia to avoid the feelings that are harder to acknowledge. and valentine's decided it's finally time to stop waiting around and let go.

so valentine goes to milan. he starts to move on. he finds genuine love with silvia (valentine is definitely bi in this interpretation), and maybe she's not proteus and he's not quite over the situation, but they're good for each other and they're happy. at least, until proteus shows up.

and proteus takes one look at valentine and silvia together and hates it. he's instantly very, very upset by that relationship, even if he can't quite put his finger on why. there's even a line where he wonders if his fixation on silvia is specifically because of the way valentine talks about her:

Is it mine, or Valentine's praise, Her true perfection, or my false transgression, That makes me reasonless to reason thus?

but it's because he loves silvia. obviously. that's the source of that jealousy. no need to investigate that any further.

and valentine is too easily falling back into old habits. we get shit like this from him:

Forgive me that I do not dream on thee, Because thou see'st me dote upon my love.

forgive me that i do not dream on thee? hello?????

meanwhile, proteus is having his own crisis. mostly about how he's betraying both julia and valentine through this, and hm, isn't it weird how those betrayals feel like the exact same thing? i mean

To leave my Julia, shall I be forsworn; To love fair Silvia, shall I be forsworn; To wrong my friend, I shall be much forsworn

the exact

Julia I lose and Valentine I lose: If I keep them, I needs must lose myself; If I lose them, thus find I by their loss For Valentine myself, for Julia Silvia.

same

I will forget that Julia is alive, Remembering that my love to her is dead; And Valentine I'll hold an enemy, Aiming at Silvia as a sweeter friend.

THING???

then we get to the part of the play that i think needs the least interpretation, because it's basically just the same. proteus is still proteus and proteus is still awful to everyone around him, just this time with the added context of all those layers of denial. valentine is still devastated to leave silvia, because he does love her, and she's the first positive force in his life in so long, and he was just starting to try to move on.

side note: ymmv with regards to silvia, she doesn't have to be in the know for this interpretation to work, but i think it works better if valentine has confided in her about proteus, at least if we want a chance at an ending that doesn't feel like pure tragedy. she knows what he's going through, knows proteus isn't good for him, and is trying to help him get past that. i think it could make the way she berates proteus for betraying valentine extra compelling, because she knows how desperately valentine cares for this man who didn't think twice before ruining his life.

and then we get to. the scene. proteus, at this point, is desperate and volatile in his obsession with control. he's convinced himself that if he just has silvia, that will be it, and he'll finally be happy. and thank god, thank god valentine is there to stop him. but valentine is also seeing his friend for the first time in a long time, and he still has this weak spot that never fully went away, and even with the absolute horror of the situation, proteus is there and proteus is apologizing and there's still a part of valentine that wants so desperately to forgive him.

Then I am paid; And once again I do receive thee honest. Who by repentance is not satisfied Is nor of heaven nor earth, for these are pleased. By penitence the Eternal's wrath's appeased: And, that my love may appear plain and free, All that was mine in Silvia I give thee.

this line can't not be appalling, but this is the only way i can see it making sense to me. it's not an actual offer, it's more just a recognition of how desperate valentine is in this moment, how much he hates himself for still caring after everything. this line spat out through angry tears, as in "fine, fine, take her if you really want her so badly, if she's really the one you care about, because for me it's always been you, so fine, take her if you really just want to take everything from me."

as for the ending, i really don't know. maybe there's a long moment when valentine and proteus hug, or almost kiss, or even just stare at each other, and maybe it seems like proteus finally gets what he's been denying the entire time.

and then proteus' page faints. the moment is broken. and then it all comes out, and face to face with julia, proteus slides right back into that comfortable denial.

i think you could maybe make the valentine/silvia ending work, if you set it up well enough. if she understands what he's been going through the whole time and is willing to forgive him, to try to move on and heal from this man who's hurt them both so much. it's messy and upsetting but maybe it's enough.

on the other hand, though, i don't know how you could preserve that emotional coherence without cutting at least some of the lines from this mess of an ending. i really don't know how you make proteus and julia getting together again anything other than horrifying. maybe you cut that part. maybe you lean into the horror. maybe- WHAT'S THIS? IT'S CRAB WITH A STEEL CHAIR

all that to say, i don't think this (or anything) can really "fix" two gentlemen of verona. and if i'm conveniently disregarding a lot of lines in favour of finding a story that i hate a bit less, well, here we are. but i do think this version could potentially make something compelling out of shakespeare's greatest trainwreck.

#two gentlemen of verona #shakespeare #it's almost 2am and this post is LONG #i've been threatening to subject the internet to this for over a year but max finally gave me an audience for it #sorry for not posting about good plays #and sorry for a billion disclaimers but i want to make it abundantly clear that i am not excusing or condoning *gestures to everything*#rape //#mine #queue stars keep not their motion in one sphere

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greaterawarness · 3 years

Text

Brothers ch. 1 The Farm Life For Me

(This is a story based on if the Clone Wars ended on Geonosis during the first battle. There is no age acceleration so each clone ages normally. This follows Fives and his brothers as they try to find their place in the galaxy.)

It seemed like the war ended as quickly as it began. At first glance the Clone Wars appeared to be set up to be fought over the span of years. Instead, it died with Count Dooku on Geonosis. Before being beheaded by the Chosen One and his Jedi Master, he revealed the true Sith Lord to be Chancellor Palpatine. The Jedi lost many of their own in the battle against the Sith but in the end the Jedi were triumphant. The galaxy shared a collective sigh knowing there could be peace once more. That is until a question was asked by the Senator from Naboo. What will become of the clones now that the war has ended? Everyone looked to the Jedi for the answer. Afterall it was a Jedi who requested for the clone army. That question would divide the Jedi Temple and shake it to its very core.

Half of the Jedi believed that having a clone army to begin with was wrong and that they should take responsibility for the clones. The other half claim the Jedi should have no further dealings with the clone army. Even with the war ending so quickly they could sense the attachments the Jedi had with their clone commanders. They suggested the Senate take responsibility instead. A civil war broke out between both the Jedi and the clone army. Most clones went along with their own Jedi General when deciding on which side to fight in. Some clones defected all together and disappeared deciding that no one will ever have power over their lives again.

In the aftermath of the civil war the Jedi that fought for the clones left the Temple for good. With the Jedi numbers dwindled down so low it felt like a shadow was cast over the Temple. The people lost faith in the Jedi after that. With the Jedi seen as incompetent this left the Senate to decide the fate of the clones. Most clones who fought in the war were given a small payment to start a life. Most went on the become bounty hunters or mercenaries. Others who were unable to adapt to civilian life became homeless and forgotten. And then there were the clones that hadn’t yet grown from adolescence. The Senate chose to put the young clones in foster care and in orphanages in hopes they would live a normal life.

***

Fives trips over a rock and manages to land in what he hoped was just mud. After a groan and whiff of the sludge he gags. Definitely not mud. A laugh pulls his attention to his brother.

“Should’ve named you clutz!” Hevy snorts with his laughs shaking the bundle of wheat above his shoulder. Fives climbs to his feat while trying to shake the manure off. Hevy grabs another bundle of wheat and starts walking back towards the barn. Fives carefully picks up two bundles for himself and follows after his brother, being more careful where he stepped this time. When he reaches the barn, his other brothers are already done with their chores.

“Oof!” Cutup winces while pinching his nose. “Someone go rolling around in shit again?”

“Shut up Cutup.” Fives throws his bundles on the pile they’ve created from working all day. Echo hands him a towel.

“I’d hose off before coming back inside if I were you.” Echo says after taking a few steps away from him. Fives starts for the hose before leaning over and rubbing his shoulder against Cutup making sure to spread the manure on his shirt. Fives dashes for the hose before Cutup can catch him. While Fives tries to wash to filth off, he notices a ship leaving the planets atmosphere. He stares after the ship even when it’s out of sight. Fives still remembers life on Kamino. He and his batchmates were young when the war ended but he still remembered what it was like to be trained as a soldier. You live and die for the Republic! Is what they told them. He remembers staying up late to clean the training blasters with his brothers.

“I’m going to be an ARC Trooper one day!” Hevy had said so eagerly.

“Oh yeah? After what I saw today, I don’t think you’ll be fit enough to mop the training rooms floor!” Cutup had laughed.

“I just want to see all the different planets out there.” Echo had added. “Worlds not just made of water and clean pristine buildings. Can you imagine?”

It may be odd, but they were excited for battle. Battle meant leaving Kamino. It meant doing something worth doing. Now look at them. They’ve been working on this farm ever since the war ended. Fives can’t complain though. They had it good compared to what some clones got stuck with. Not everyone was happy about military trained soldiers being let loose into civilization.

“Fives, dinner!” Droidbait calls from the kitchen window. Fives finishes up and heads inside. The smell of stew and the soft glow of candles made the small house feel warm. Cutup and Hevy set the table while Droidbait and Echo finished preparing dinner. Fives starts for the table when a frail hand lands on his shoulder.

“Go on and wash up. I’ll make them wait for ya.” 99 says with a soft smile. 99 is a clone just like them. Except he didn’t come out normal. His back is hunched, and he walks with a limp. Unfit for battle the Kaminoans put 99 to work in sanitation. But he always looked after the younger cadets. Their batch especially. When the war ended 99 was the only who had any real talents that could move on to civilian work. He decided to take their batch in and has raised them since they were boys.

“Thanks, 99.” Fives says before heading for the one bathroom. He showered quickly but scrubbed at his skin being sure to wash all the manure off. When he’s dried off and dressed, he walks back to the main room to find everyone waiting on him. He takes his seat beside Echo.

“Alright everyone, dig in!” 99 says. The house is filled with the sounds of slurping and chewing.

“I got word that the seeds for next harvest came in. Do you want us to pick it up tonight?” Hevy asks. Cutup reaches for the bread on Droidbait’s plate before Droidbait stabs his fork at Cutup’s hand.

“No, that can wait till tomorrow.” 99 says before eating a spoonful.

“We can’t pick it up tomorrow. The post office will be closed and won’t open again for another week.” Echo says while getting another bowl of stew. 99 leans back in his chair thinking.

“I suppose you should go tonight. One of you has to stay here and help do the dishes though.” 99 says while waving his spoon at them.

“Rancor, Jedi, blaster for it?” Hevy asks. Droidbait ends up losing to all four of them and gets stuck with the dishes.

“You have the worst luck, mate.” Cutup nudges him once everyone’s done eating. They pull on their coats and boots preparing for the long walk to town. 99 hands Hevy a pouch of credits.

“Now, don’t forget to tip the postman.” 99 says as they begin walking out the door. “And don’t go down into the canyon!”

“Don’t worry 99!” Fives calls back while they walk down their long drive. Hevy leads the group while Echo messes with his datapad and Cutup hums a song to himself. Fives can’t keep his eyes from looking up at the stars. The sun is setting and it’s easier to make out the starships. While watching one ship go lightspeed he walks right into Hevy’s back.

“Looks like we’re going the long way boys.” Hevy says while staring at the destroyed bridge. They start for the path leading down into the canyon.

“99 specifically said not…” Echo starts before Cutup gives him a shove.

“We know what 99 said. Don’t worry. I’ll hold your hand if you’re scared.” Cutup grins. Echo only walks ahead of him. “You think they did that just because of us?”

“We’re not the only ones living on this side of the bridge, Cutup.” Fives says as they walk deeper into the canyon.

“True but we are the only ones who can’t afford a speeder. Most people can just fly over the canyon.” Echo says not bothering to look up from his datapad.

“Hey, cut the chatter! I thought I heard something.” Hevy says stopping again. They look out at the dark canyon. The sound of air whooshing echoes around them.

“What is that?” Fives asks.

“Don’t forget about those giant eels.” Hevy warns. Fives rolls his eyes.

“Yeah, I’ve never seen one…” Fives starts but stops when a loud growl turns his blood cold. Cutup screams as a giant blur knocks him off the ledge.

“Cutup!” Fives yells. Cutup lands on what he hopes is soft dirt.

“What the hell was that?” Hevy yells.

“Uh, that was an eel.” Echo says plainly. “Now that’s why 99 has the rule not to go down in the canyon.”

“We have to get Cutup!” Fives says before they start running down the path. When they reach Cutup, Fives lowers his ear to his chest. “He’s alive!”

“Good, we have to get him back home.” Hevy starts while helping Fives pull the unconscious Cutup off the canyon floor.

“Great,” Fives grumbles. “Can’t wait to explain this to 99.”

Fives carries Cutup on his back with Hevy in the front and Echo keeping watch at the rear. Cutup gives a groan.

“Hevy, I think Cutup needs a doctor.” Fives says. Hevy stops and stares at him worriedly.

“I think you’re right.” He says after a pause. Hevy starts walking towards the path leading out of the canyon towards town. While walking Fives begins to get an uneasy feeling. He glances over at Echo who seems to feel the same. He starts to say something to Hevy when movement ahead stops them. A group of trandoshans walk out from behind the large boulders scattered about the canyon floor. A short yellow trandoshan walks out appearing to be the leader.

“You thought you could get away from us huh?” he asks as his goons surround them.

“What are you talking about?” Hevy asks. They stand closer together.

“You can’t think I’m that stupid?” The trandoshan snorts. “You think you can take your helmets and armor off and think I’ll fall for this act?”

“Again, what are you talking about?” Fives yells. He stares at the blasters pointed at them. His heart rings in his ears. He struggles to remember what little training he had from Kamino.

“You’ve got the wrong clones!” Hevy yells with his arms outstretched to try and shield Fives and Echo as much as possible.

“Oh, I think we do.” The trandoshan laughs to himself. Fives feels his legs go limp when they raise their blasters. They were going to die.

“Ready, aim, fi—” the trandoshan starts before a canister falls on his head. He winces making his men hesitate. They watch the leader bend down to examine the silver cylinder. “Huh?”

Electricity bursts from one end stunning the leader just as a Mandalorian swings from a wire taking out one of the goons pointing a blaster at Fives and his brothers. Three more Mandalorians drop from the sky firing at the trandoshans. One lands in front of Fives and his brothers shooting with two blaster pistols.

“Take cover!” he yells over his shoulder. Hevy shoves Fives and the Echo towards a boulder. Fives carefully puts Cutup down before popping his head out from the side along with Hevy and Echo to watch the Mandalorians kick the trandoshan asses.

Blaster fire lights up the dark canyon. The first Mando is a solid hitter. His shots hit their mark and when two trandoshans charge at him he’s able to subdue them with ease. The second is quick on his feet and is hard to keep up with. He moves so fast that one trandoshan didn’t even notice the Mando tying a wire around his wrist before it was to late. The Mando shoots into the air with his jetpack stringing the trandoshan with him. He knocks him into the side of the canyon before cutting him loose when he is above the canyon mouth. The third Mando is loud and liked a fight. He throws grenades and fires relentlessly before ultimately getting bored and charging right into a trandoshan and throwing him at one of his buddies. They were all impressive, but nothing compared to the last one. The last one stood calm and confident in front of a group of five trandoshans. He drew his two blasters and hit each of their weapons but leaving the trandoshans unscathed. He moved his left foot back before motioning for them to come at him.

Fives leaned forward completely entranced by the Mando’s fighting skills. The trandoshans let out loud roars before charging. The Mando dodged each of their attacks with small simple movements. He was making taking down five trandoshans at once look easy. When he did start to hit back, he hit back hard. Hevy, Fives, and Echo all winced and went “Ooo!” in sync while watching the Mando break limbs and give punches so hard teeth flew. While he was occupied with his five, Fives notices a stray trandoshan creeping up behind him from the dark. Fives feels his body freeze. A blaster that one of the trandoshans dropped wasn’t to far from him. He stares from the blaster to the sneaking trandoshan.

Move Fives!

He swallows, mustering his courage before starting to step towards the dropped blaster, but not before Hevy runs past him making him freeze again. Hevy grabs the blaster and fires at the trandoshan. The Mando looks back at him before delivering the final blow to the last trandoshan left.

“Report.” He says. The three other Mandalorians walk up to him.

“Hardcase may have lost a few of his last remaining braincells but other then that we’re unscathed.” One says making another Mando start walking towards him before the last one grabs his collar keeping him still.

“Good.” The one that seems to be the leader says. He starts to turn towards Hevy when rumbling shakes the ground. A giant eel shoots out from one of their holes. Fives feels his body freeze up again. In a split second the Mando leader draws one of his blasters and fires a single shot taking the eel down.

“Nice shot.” Hevy says while watching the Mando kneel down to inspect the beast. Fives and Echo slowly walk out from their hiding place. The other Mandos lift their helmets up showing their faces for the first time.

“You’re all clones!” Echo says shocked. The Mando clones grin at each other while the leader stands rubbing the blue blood of the eel between his fingers.

“The names Rex,” The leader Mando says as he takes his helmet off. He has short blonde dyed hair. He was an older clone. Probably actually fought in the war. He walks over and places the hand covered in blue eel blood on Echo’s chest leaving a blue handprint. “Sorry to get you boys mixed up in all this.”

“Are you kidding? This was the most action we’ve ever seen!” Hevy says gesturing to the bodies of the trandoshans.

“That’s a good thing.” The clone with the Republic symbol tattooed on the side of his head says.

“Speak for yourself.” The one next to him chuckles making the last clone with detailed tattoos around his head roll his eyes.

“Are you boys alright?” Rex asks. Fives dashes to Cutup’s side remembering his wounded brother.

“Cutup!” He says checking to make sure he was still alive. One of the Mando clones walks over and sets a bag down next to him.

“Easy, kid. I was a medic in the war.” The clone says. Fives gets out of his way so he can treat Cutup.

“So, what are your names?” Rex asks while they wait.

“I’m Hevy. We call him Fives, and this is Echo.” Hevy says gesturing to each of them. Rex gives a small smile.

“I’m surprised to see a whole batch of you this far out in the system.” He says.

“We got lucky.” Echo shrugs. “We have another brother, Droidbait. But he’s back at the house.”

“Droidbait? You must really hate him.” The clone with the Republic tattoo snorts.

“This is Jesse and Hardcase. Our medic is Kix.” Rex says moving the subject right along. When Kix stands Fives, Echo, and Hevy hold their breath.

“He’ll be fine. No serious injuries. Just needs so rest but he’ll be sore for a couple of days.” Kix explains. Fives and his brothers share a sigh of relief.

“You boys need help getting home?” Rex asks while crossing his arms.

“We got it from here.” Hevy says. Fives starts to pull Cutup on his back again. Hardcase and Jesse walk towards the stunned trandoshan leader.

“Then we’ll be off.” Rex says before putting his helmet back on. This close Fives can make out jaig eyes drawn on the helmet. Once Hardcase and Jesse have a hold of the stunned trandoshan they shoot up out of the canyon on their jetpacks.

They stare after them for a long time before finally starting home. Adrenaline was running through their veins. They couldn’t believe what they just witnessed. When they get back to the farm, they burst through the door startling 99 and Droidbait.

“What’s going on? What happened to Cutup?” 99 asks as Fives sets his brother down on the couch. They tell them everything.

By the time their done talking about the clone Mandos they watch 99 stare at the floor in deep thought. Fives exchanges a look with Echo.

“Are you boys… happy here?” 99 asks throwing them off guard.

“Of course, 99!” Echo says but even as he says it, they all knew it was a lie. It wasn’t that they weren’t grateful for 99 taking them in, it was more of a longing to see more. Do more. 99 looks over at the unconscious Cutup and pats his leg.

“You were bred for war after all. I can’t expect you to be happy with a life of farming.” He sighs. Fives felt a weird pang of guilt. 99 stands and shuffles towards his room. They all exchange looks with each other before 99 returns with a large pouch.

“What’s this?” Hevy asks when 99 hands it to him.

“Credits.” 99 grunts when he takes his seat on the couch across from them.

“99, this is a lot of credits! How did you…?” Fives trails off.

“Call it a trust fund. I knew one day you would all want to leave the farm to start a life for yourself. Like all kids when they grow up. I can see it in each of your eyes. It’s time to go and find what type of life you want to live.” 99 starts. “Seeing those clones in action… it called to you. I know it did because it did to me too all those years ago. Except… well I wasn’t really cut out to be a fighter. You boys are lucky enough to have a choice. I want to make sure you have a chance to make that choice.”

“99…” Hevy starts but stops when 99 holds up a hand.

“Go to Coruscant. A lot of clones chose to stay there after the war. There you might be able to find a clan of your own.” He says giving them smiles. “And if you ever decide that that’s not the life for you then I’ll be here with open arms!”

“99, how can we repay you?” Hevy asks.

“You already have.” 99 says. All at once Fives, Hevy, Echo, and Droidbait leap forward to wrap their arms around 99. 99 lets out a laugh and pats their back. “Go on and get some sleep. You’ll have a lot to tell Cutup when he wakes up in the morning.”

Fives, Echo, Droidbait, and Hevy wouldn’t sleep that night. Each would lie awake staring out their window up at the stars imagining what their life would be like. In a way it was like their life was just starting.

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libsterslobsters · 3 years

Text

The Wanton Song

Summary: How do you broach the topic of sex with the 90-something super soldier you've found yourself dating? That's the reader's question. Luckily, she and Bucky are no strangers to awkward conversations...

Pairings: Bucky Barnes x fem!enhanced! Reader

(Reader can see bits and pieces of the future in visions and understands all languages)

Warnings: SMUT, tiny bit of angst, lotsa fluff, maybe some past dub!con if you squint

Author's note: Wow... here I am posting smut on the internet. Never thought that would happen. Tmi, but I'm married, so I have a good amount of sex 🙀 and I actually had a great first time, but some people don't, and that's what I tried to represent. That, and CONSENT!!!! Consent is sexy, y'all. Safe, sane and consensual all day every day.

As always, the reader's name isn't stated so that you can read as a self insert, but I've written so much at this point that I refer to the Reader as Violet in my own mind.

*************************************************

Life has been going swimmingly these past few months. Better than ever before in fact, or at the very least, better than in a long time. She’s still a fugitive, living life looking over her shoulder, but now she has a steady job, a steady paycheck, and oh yeah, a steady boyfriend. Those three things have never aligned for her before (especially the last one). Overall, she’s pretty happy. But, because she’s her, there’s still a question niggling at the back of her mind.

The transition from “you’re my only friend” to “we’re together now” went smoothly, helped in part by the fact that Barnes had been at that particular juncture the whole time. From the outside looking in, the only major changes have been the addition of those three simple but very key words and an upping the anti in the cuddles department.

Speaking of cuddles, that’s a very mild term for what’s going on these days. It starts out innocent enough. The usual location is on the couch at one or the other’s apartment. There hadn’t been much distance between them since that first time where they ended up talking more than watching the movie playing from her laptop, but now, the space is nonexistent. As a general rule, within the first ten minutes, her legs somehow end up over his lap or in some way intertwined with is. The intention is always to pay attention to what’s on the screen but, well, when you’re that close, it would be rude not to snuggle up. And, when the other person looks that damn kissable, it would truly be insulting not to take the plunge.

Now, considering the angle, one of them has to lean in. Otherwise, it would be awkward. That generally determines who, somewhere from two to ten minutes later, is on top of who. Of course hands wander, and even though it’s understood that the word “no” can be employed at any time and immediately obeyed (not to mention the copious amounts of “Is this okay”’s being asked), she can’t remember a time either of them have said it.

If she had to attach a term to what comes next, it would be ‘dry humping.’ And then… nothing. It always ends far too soon, leaving her flustered and with her heart racing. At first she thought it was because he simply didn’t want her, but, well, there’s certain physical signs that point to that not being the problem. Her next guess was that he’s simply being respectful. Well, as sweet as that is, she’s ready to get on with it. She’s only human after all, and as such, has needs. Sure, she could take care of them herself, but if she had to guess, he’s experiencing those needs too, and from what she’s heard, it’s more fun to take care of it together.

The only issue: how the hell do you bring something like this up, especially when the person you’re bringing it up with grew up in a much more repressed era than you did? She’s been debating it for the past week, and despite having multiple visions, none of them have given her that key insight into what to do.

Finally, she decides to just say it. They’ve made a point to be honest with each other, and it’s probably best to get it out of the way. They’re adults, after all. They can have this discussion. She’s going to come straight out with it.

“Hey, can I ask you something? It’s kind of personal, and maybe a little uncomfortable.”

“Sure, Doll.” The response is immediate. “Fire away.”

Glancing up to make sure they’re not at a pivotal scene in tonight’s movie (they have a system; at his place, watch something he grew up with, at hers, something made literally anytime after 1945), she spits out the whole sentence in one breathless go. “Are we ever going to have sex?”

It feels like a branding iron where his arm is still wrapped around her shoulder. Still, it’s comforting. At least he’s not moving away.

“I gotta admit, that’s not the question I was expecting. What brought this on?”

She shrugs, carefully keeping her eyes trained on the wall behind his head instead of on him.

“Nothing in particular. Just…” is there a delicate way to put this? “...I think things are going well between us, and sometimes when we’re together… I’ve noticed that there’s a physical response.” She’s really hoping that’ll suffice, because she can’t think of a good way to say “I can feel that you’re hard when you’re on top of me”.

“Oh.”

Apparently, her meaning is indeed clear enough, because he removes his arm from her shoulders. She’s about to apologize (all the while mentally berating herself) when his hand closes over hers.

“I’m sorry about that, Doll. I’ll try to stay calmer.” Wait, that’s not- “It’s just an issue guys have. Don’t think it means you have to do anything that you don’t want to, because I would never-”

“I know you wouldn’t.” Without thinking, she cuts him off. “And I want to.” It feels like she’s sitting in a sauna, she’s so flustered from this conversation. “But only if you do, and I understand if you didn’t-”

“No.” It’s abrupt, cutting her off. A definite answer that leaves no room for questioning. “No, I do. I just-” He clears his throat. “-I didn’t want to bring it up, in case we weren’t on the same page. “ This seems to be a recurring theme, so far. “And it’s not a must. If you change your mind-”

It’s pure instinct. There’s no thought involved as she closes the gap between them, this time with her on top, and presses her lips against his. The response is immediate and enthusiastic. She considers just going on, not putting a stop to things, but realization hits that, although overall she’s ready for this to happen, she’s not ready for it to happen tonight. There’s still things she needs to take care of. Most importantly, protection.

So, gasping for breath, she pulls away. “I’m calling for a rain check, but if after that, you still think I’ll change my mind-” she pushes back her hair and forces herself to take a deep breath. “-then you may just be beyond help, Barnes.” If the chuckle is anything to judge from, she’s made her point.

_________________________________________________________________________________

Wow. Bucky thinks to himself as he exits out of the browser tab on his phone. That’s enough internet for one day. Too much, actually. He knows that it’s the information superhighway, but good god, no one needs THAT much information. He really needs to be more specific with what he googles… or less… or just not at all.

He’d never admit it (and really, who the hell is gonna ask him anyway), but he spent the last hour looking up how to have sex. He’s engaged in the act before, yeah, but it was seventy years ago. Plus, it used to be this huge taboo thing that you suspected was going on behind closed doors, but no one (not even the married couples) owned up to it. If you were ever found out, there were severe consequences. As a man, he didn’t have to worry as much, but if whoever the woman was had her dirty laundry aired… oh boy. She’d be a pariah, a “scarlet woman”, unfit for marriage or to even give the time of day. That led to limited encounters, and, well, it just seemed smart to brush up on what information is out there. As it turns out, people have written a lot about the fine art of love making. Unfortunately for him, most of it is absolute garbage. Some of the positions he just read about (because at that point, the article was like a train wreck; he badly wanted to look away, but he couldn’t) don’t even sound possible, much less pleasurable. He’s all for society being freer, but good grief!

He’s halfway through a bottle of straight vodka (it won’t have any effect, but he’s hoping maybe the alcohol will travel to his brain and sanitize his eyeballs from most of the shit he just read) when his phone rings. Great. He’s always happy to talk to her, but right now… wow. It’s gonna take him some time to recover, so he hopes she doesn’t need him to say much.

“Hey, Doll.”

“I am so fucking pissed off right now.” That sounds promising.

“At what?”

“The city of Bucharest, my apartment, the landlord, whoever the fuck did the plumbing in this building! God!” She’s clearly out of breath, so it takes a minute before she can speak again. “I’m sorry, Buck. It’s just that I came home from work, and one of my neighbors told me the entire sixth floor is under a good inch, inch and a half of water.” Wait-

“How-”

“I don’t know. Busted pipe. It’s leaked down onto the fifth floor, so I’ve got about fifty other pissed off people for company.”

“Jesus.”

She chuckles harshly. “Yeah, we could use him right about now to perform a miracle. This is a shit show, and I haven’t even told you the best part.”

“So the spontaneous flood wasn’t the highlight of your day?”

“I fucking wish! So, naturally, I tried to call the landlord, along with basically everyone else. Get this: since it’s after five o’clock on a Friday, he’s not gonna do anything. Told us collectively to suck it up! And of course, when there’s a leak, they have to cut the power…” He’s starting to see a pattern here.

She sighs. “I really needed to get that off my chest. How are you?” Still slightly weirded out by the information overload, but feeling a little more steady now that he’s got a good catastrophe to concentrate on. However, that’s probably not the best answer to go with.

“Better than you are.”

“What, the sky isn’t falling where you are?” He chuckles.

“No, it’s right where it’s supposed to be.” Which reminds him… “But since it seems like you’re short a functional home, why don’t you just stay here until they sort things out?” He’s got a couch that, while it doesn’t have anything on an actual bed, he can manage to sleep on for the next few nights. Or maybe they can share his bed. He shakes his head. That thought needs to be put to the side, even if it’s meant in the most innocent way possible. Of course, in case she decides to cash in that rain check…

“Yes. I mean, that would be great, if you’re sure.”

“I’m sure.” Actually, he can’t think of a better way to spend the weekend. The plan was to meet up either Saturday or Sunday, possibly both, so this isn’t that far out of the ordinary.

“Okay, but just a warning: They’re not letting us go up to our floor in case there’s been electrical damage as well-” That’s smart. If the pipes are in that bad of condition, who knows what the wiring looks like. “-so all I have is my purse, backpack, and what I wore to work. No toothbrush or pajamas, or anything like that.”

“That’s alright. All you have to bring is yourself.” He’ll have to look, but he’s pretty sure he has something in his closet that’ll work okay for her until she gets the all clear to go into her apartment. Plus, there’s a laundry mat just around the corner, not to mention a pharmacy.

“Thank you. I really appreciate it.”

“Not a problem.” He glances at his bedside clock. Five thirty-four. It takes roughly half an hour to get across the city by bus, so… “I’ll see you around six fifteen?”

“See you then.”

As soon as the line goes dead, he springs into action. First thing’s first: make sure there’s no dirty clothes, old dishes, or trash laying around. That takes all of five minutes. He should probably check that he does indeed have something she can wear so they won’t have to fumble around later. Tshirts are pretty universal and… yes, he has a few pajama bottoms that have a drawstring waist. How much time does he have left? The phone screen lights up, giving him his answer. Twenty-seven minutes. More than enough time to run around the corner and pick up a few things.

His intention is to buy the basics: spare toothbrush, deodorant, hairbrush, maybe a different shampoo than his three-in-one body wash (it’s convenient for him, but she might prefer something designated for hair specifically). But, well, there’s quite a few aisles, and he gets sucked in. Does he need to buy razors, or is that rude, like he thinks she’s hairy? What about aspirin? How often do most people get headaches? He honestly can’t remember.

By the time he realizes that he really needs to get a move on, his basket is full and he has no idea what aisle he’s on. Desperately, he looks around, and his eyes land on… huh. So they just have them out in the open these days. Last time he was in the market for that, he had to beg a married friend to make the purchase for him. He briefly wonders if he’ll need to produce proof of marriage or something similar, but pushes the thought to the side. It’s the 2000s. He can probably just go up to the register and pay, and no one will give him a second look. But there’s just one problem: which brand? He should google… suddenly remembering his adventure from earlier today, he decides to just go with his gut and pick one. There. Now, he needs to pay and get the fuck out of here because there’s only ten minutes left, and he’d rather not have these out in the open, in case she thinks that’s the reason he’s asked her to stay over. If it happens, great. If not… well, he’s made it for the past seventy years. What’s a few more?

___________________________________________________________________________________

She was still pretty shaken up when she arrived at his apartment, carrying her backpack and purse, slightly damp from the drizzle of rain now covering the city. But immediately receiving a long hug, being instructed to make herself at home, and hearing the offer to take a shower so she could warm up did a lot to restore her good mood.

It was one of the sweetest thing she’s ever experienced in a lifetime where most people have showed her their worst, going into that bathroom and finding a new toothbrush, stick of deodorant, nail clippers, hairbrush, and even shampoo. That and Barnes bashfully informing her that, “I’ll stay in the living room until you’re done. Take your time.” She almost suggested that he just join her in an attempt to broach the subject they left off on two nights ago, but thought better of it. She’s just started to strip when a knock comes from the other side of the wall.

“Sorry. I just remembered that I forgot to give you a change of clothes. Can I leave them outside the door?” A smile forms on her face.

“Sure. Go ahead.” No one’s given this much thought to her comfort or boundaries before. Yet another reason she knows this is the right decision.

She doesn’t stay in the shower for long, just enough time to wash and stop shivering. After toweling off and brushing out her hair, she cracks open the door. Sure enough, a worn but clean tshirt and pair of pajama bottoms are waiting for her. The familiar scent of the laundry detergent he uses envelopes her as she dresses and, at long last, leaves the safety of the bathroom.

True to his word, he’s still sitting on the couch, thumbing through a book she gave him some months back (he’s missed so many feats of literature that have made their way into pop culture; today’s choice is The Hobbit because, while it was out before everything happened to him, he’s never read it) when she emerges. Just in case he’s so absorbed that he hasn’t heard her, she repeats his gesture from earlier and knocks softly on the wall.

“Hey. I’m out. You can have your apartment back.”

“Hey.” That smile always makes her feel slightly unsteady on her feet. “Find everything okay?”

“I did.” She settles into the place next to him. “Thank you, by the way. You didn’t have to go out and get supplies.”

“I know.” He nods, hand closing around hers. “But I wanted to make sure you had whatever you needed.”

They chat for a while about their days, discuss what they should do with the weekend ahead, even throw out ideas for dinner. The entire time, she’s trying to figure out the best way to bring up that she’d really like to finish what they started the other night. However, by the time he’s left to grab some sort of takeout, she’s still no closer to an answer.

Fortunately, their dates usually follow a pattern. Food, a movie, and then the not-so-innocent cuddles. This time, he’s on top of her when she feels the tell-tale sign that he’s as fired up as she is, so she suggests,

“Do want to maybe move to somewhere more comfortable?” His already dilated pupils grow even larger, and he nods.

“Yeah. That sounds like a plan.” She waits for him to roll off of her and head towards the bedroom before she grabs her purse and, digging around inside, grabs one of the foil packages she bought after their last date.

It’s only once she closes the door behind her, shutting them into an enclosed space with a bed (not to mention it’s pretty damn clear what both of their intentions are), that nerves get the better of her. He takes a step towards her, and she leans up to kiss him, but he ducks his head out of the way.

“You’re shaking.” His hand ghosts over her arm, making it obvious that, by comparison, she’s practically vibrating on the spot.

“Sorry.” She chuckles nervously. “It’ll pass.”

“It’s alright.” As he says it, he meets her eyes. “We can stop. Nothing has to happen.”

“I know.” She nods, swallowing hard. “But I want it to.” Their lips briefly meet before he pulls away again.

“Let me ask you, just before we get started, is this-” He stops short, eyes darting from her face to the wall and back again. “...have you… before?” Oh. “Not that it matters, not to me, I just wanted to know so that-”

“I have.” She nods, feeling heat rise to her cheeks. “Once. I was eighteen, and-” It was awful. She’d been seeing the guy for a few months and he kept whining about her not putting out, so she decided to get it over with. He went in dry without any warning, and when she asked him to stop, give her a second to adjust, he told her he couldn’t. She was bleeding and in pain for days afterwards, and to top it off, when her period was late, she thought that, even though he’d pulled out, she was pregnant. That turned out not to be the case, but it, along with the fact that she usually doesn’t stay in one place for very long, has put a damper on her ever wanting to do that again. Except for now. “-it wasn’t a great experience.”

“I’m sorry.” On instinct, she searches for the judgment in his face, the disgust. It’s nowhere to be found, only genuine sympathy. “I’ll do my best to make sure this time is better. That is, if you’re still up to it.”

“I am.” Not waiting for a reply, she wraps her arms around him and starts trailing kisses up his neck towards his ear. “I am. I trust you.” She hears his breath catch, but before she can comment, he’s hoisted her up and is carrying her in the direction of the bed.

As he sets her down, she pulls him on top of her, letting her hands wander over his sides, up his back. After a few moments, she feels his fingers move from her hips to toy with the hem of her… his.. shirt.

“Is this okay? Can I take this off?” She starts to nod, but remembers just in time that he’s so close, they’d butt heads.

“Please.” She expected to feel exposed once she was at least partially undressed, but instead she feels… adored. His eyes are roaming over her newly exposed skin, though his hands have respectfully returned to her waist. In a moment of confidence, she reaches behind her and unhooks her bra. There. Now she’s completely shirtless.

“You’re so beautiful.” The flush from her cheeks is spreading down her neck, but she still smiles.

“Care to make things even?” It’s brief, but she catches the look of hesitation.

“Sure.” Before she can offer to do it, he shrugs his shirt over his head, revealing to her, for the first time, the entirity of his metal arm. She must look for a moment too long, because with a shrug, he informs her, “I can put my shirt back on. No big deal. I know there’s some scarring…” That’s not going to fly. She needs to reassure him, make him feel as desired as he’s made her feel.

“Or if you want to stop-” She stands and, after briefly making eye contact, places a kiss on the most prominent scar.

“Don’t you dare think that way for a second.” They’re flush against each other, chest to bare chest. “Not for one.” Slowly, she slides her hands from his shoulders down to his waist, hesitating just over the button. “Is this okay?” Another shakey breath.

“Yes.”

Going forward, it’s much less awkward. The rest of their clothing is shed, and soon they’re back to their previous position; on the bed, with him on top of her. She feels his fingertips brush the inside of her thigh and gasps.

“May I touch you?” She nods.

“You’d better.”

It’s gentle, more of him feeling her out than anything else. Still, she can’t help but think this is infinitely better already than last time around. Suddenly, he pulls his hand away, and it takes all her effort not to whine at the loss of contact. Before she can ask if something’s wrong, does he want to stop, he’s flat on his stomach, head between her legs.

“Tell me if you need me to stop.”

“What-” Her breath catches as it becomes infinitely clear what he’s doing.

Again, she’s expecting pain when, after several minutes he eases a finger into her, but at this point, she’s so wet that there’s absolutely no difficulty.

“Are you okay?” She nods.

“Don’t stop.”

The process is agonizingly slow, he’s so intent on his task. When, finally, he pulls away, she’s so close that she can almost taste it.

“Do you still want to-”

“If you don’t stop asking me that, I’m gonna slap you.” It’s a joke, and she thinks he knows it, but just to be sure, she siezes his hand (the metal one, which is usually cold but has now warmed from being held close against her body. “I’m ready, so long as you want this too.”

“I do. You wouldn’t believe how much.” Yeah, she thinks she would. “Just give me a second.” Perfect timing. He rolls off of her, which gives her the opening she needs to grab the packet she managed to hide under the pillow while he was… otherwise distracted. When he returns from digging inside the wardrobe, she holds it up, only to realize-

“Oh.” He’s got one as well. “Seems like we both came prepared.”

He chuckles. “Just in case, although that wasn’t why I asked you to stay.”

“I know.” She nods and pats the space next to her. “Not why I said yes either, although I can’t say I’m disappointed.”

He returns to the bed and drops his packet onto the nightstand. “Save this one for later?”

“Definitely.”

There is a bit of discomfort once he starts to push inside her, but it’s not painful. Just… overwhelming. Slightly embarassed she asks,

“Can you wait a second? Please?”

“Of course. Are you alright?” She shifts her hips slightly, making them both groan.

“Fine. You can move now.”

She may have only done this once before, and she has no idea what his experience consists of, but as she hits her peak mere seconds before he does, gently coaxed over the edge, she can’t help but think some things are better the second time around.

“I love you.” It’s whispered against her neck as, once she cleans up and returns to bed, she settles herself against him.

“I love you too.”

___________________________________________________________________________________

The first thing he thinks when he realizes that he’s not alone in bed is that HYDRA’s found him. He’s being activated. His eyes shoot open although apart from that he doesn’t move a muscle, and that’s when he recognizes the person next to him. It’s her. She’s here.

The events of last night come back to him all at once, and he feels a smile forming on his face. It’s been a while, and in any case, it would be wrong to run a comparison, but what they shared, the pure intimacy of it both physically and mentally was incredible. Maybe he should feel a sense of shame. That’s what he was taught growing up. But instead he feels… peaceful.

That is, until her eyelids flutter and she rolls over, shifting the covers so that he gets a good view of her still naked body, and with it, the bruises on her thighs and hips. Bruises unmistakably left by his fingers. Dammit. He’s done the last thing he ever wanted to do: he’s hurt her.

“Good morning, sleepy head.” She yawns, the teasing words muffled. “It seems like we overslept.”

His mouth goes dry, and all he can manage to choke out is a simple, “Yeah.”

She frowns, sitting up slightly, and lets out a small groan. “You alright there, Bucky? You look a little off.” The late morning light only serves to highlight more marks he’s left, this time on her shoulders, neck, and breasts. Stubble burn. Hickeys. Why the hell was he so rough? At the time, he thought he was being gentle, but obviously he’s just as much of a monster as Bucky Barnes as he is once the Winter Soldier takes over.

She’s still staring at him, brow furrowing in concern.

“Fine.” He clears his throat and begins to sit up. “Stay here. I’ll make you a cup of tea, maybe some oatmeal.”

“Alright. Don’t be gone too long.”

Her words follow him out of the room, and into the kitchen. Fuck. He should’ve known better.

Maybe once upon a time, he was a decent man, one who could be with a woman like her and not do her a disservice. But now, it’s clear that he falls short in every way. In an act that was supposed to be pure pleasure, a way of communicating how much they mean to each other, he’s hurt her.

“I trust you.” The words from last night ring in his ears. He shouldn’t have let her. It’s pretty damn obvious that, even at the best of times, he can’t be trusted.

“Tell me what’s going on.” Even with his enhanced senses, he still jumps in surprise as the unexpected words come from behind him. He turns around slowly, not wanting to startle her. She’s standing there, clad in only one of his shirts, arms crossed over her chest (now bearing his marks), staring him down.

“Nothing.” He shakes his head.

“Bullshit. I had a vision of you staring off into space, and here you are, jumpy as a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs.” At another time, her choice in phrases would make him chuckle, but right now, he can’t muster it.

“Last night-” Her eyes widen, but she stays silent. “I hurt you.”

“No, you didn’t. Not at all.”

“I did.”

She frowns. “Bucky, I think I’d know if you’d hurt me, and I’m telling you, I’m fine.”

“Doll, look at yourself!” He reaches out to take her arm, but immediately freezes. “Go in the bathroom and take off your shirt. Take a good look in the mirror and then tell me I didn’t hurt you.”

“Alright.” Her jaw clenches, and she marches off in the direction of the bathroom. A deep sickness gnaws at the pit of his stomach and, completely worn out, he sinks into a kitchen chair.

Not thirty seconds pass before she walks back into the room, this time completely undressed.

“Tell me you’re not talking about a few love bites.”

“And bruises! You may not have noticed, but they’re in the exact shape of my fingertips.”

“Oh my god!” She shakes her head. “It’s a sex injury. A minor one at that! If you didn’t heal so damn fast, you’d probably have nail marks all over your back!”

“That’s not the same thing.”

“How is it not the same thing?”

“I’m a monster! And you’re not.”

She takes a determined step towards him, and he leans as far back as the chair will allow.

“Bucky, you are not a monster, and I am not afraid of you.”

“Then you’re stupid.” He hates himself for his sharp words, but she needs to take this seriously. Underestimating how dark, how evil he can be, is a mistake. A deadly one.

“Hey!”

“Don’t you get it?” Without any input from his brain, he stands. “They could find me, and with a few words, I could stare you dead in the eyes as I murdered you! If you were my mission, I wouldn’t even hesitate, and you’d be dead before your body hit the floor!” Her mouth falls open, but she immediately closes it again. “This isn’t something that can be worked through with some patience and a positive attitude! I could kill you!”

“So could a million other things!” Her voice rises in volume, and before he can contain it-

“But they’re not in the bed sleeping next to you!” He’s shouting at her. God. Everyone is right. He’s beyond saving.

A few tense seconds pass before she looks up at him, a steely look in her eyes.

“Look, I get it. I know what you could do to me.” As she speaks, she pulls out a chair and sits. “But I could also get run over when I cross the road, or the room could fill with carbon monoxide while I sleep. I could have an aneurysm and drop before anyone knows what’s happening.”

He opens his mouth to tell her the likelihood of any of those things happening is far lower than the chance that he’ll hurt her, this time in a major way, but she holds up a hand, silencing him.

“I’m gonna be cautious, but I’m also not going to live my life in fear that the ceiling is going to collapse or nuclear war is going to strike, or that someone is gonna turn up and say the magic words that make you go cuckoo for cocoa puffs-” What? “-and I just realized you’re too old for that reference.”

“That’s another thing-” He’s about to remind her exactly how big their age gap is, that although he’s physically close to her age, chronologically, he’s closer to the age of her great grandfather, but she lets out a sudden groan of frustration, and that makes him bite his tongue.

“Oh, fuck off, Barnes! If you’re about to start in on how you’re too old for me, then I’m not gonna wait for you to go full Winter Soldier before I kick your ass!” Out of all things, that’s what snaps him out of it, makes him feel like maybe, just maybe, there’s still a chance they can make the best of things.

Smirking, he asks her,

“You think you could kick my ass? Really?” It must be the breaking point for her too, because she snickers.

“Of course. It’s the little bitches you have to watch out for.” That’s it, he’s laughing, nearly doubled over, and from the looks of things, she’s in much the same state.

“You’re something else, you know that?” He asks between stilted breaths.

“I think we both fit in that category, Pal.” Her smile fades, but only slightly. “Bucky, if you really want me to go, if that’s what’ll give you peace, then I’ll do it, but I meant what I said. I trust you.” Never. He’ll never want her to go, he’s sure of it. Well then, that only leaves one option.

“I know what we’re doing today.” It’s an abrupt segue, but it’s the only thing he could come up with on short notice.

“And what’s that?” The microwave dings, reminding him that he needs to stir the oatmeal, and he pushes past her.

“Sit down and have your tea. You’re going to need all your energy if I’m gonna show you how to use a gun.” If she’s staying, then at least he can teach her how to defend herself beyond the basics she already knows.

“So I guess this means you’re keeping me around for a little while longer?” It’s spoken like a joke, but he turns to her, meeting her eyes to drive the point home.

“Yeah, Doll. As long as you want me."

#marvel #captain america #the winter soldier #bucky fanfic #fanfiction #bucky barnes x ofc #bucky x reader #bucky barnes x y/n #bucky barnes #pre civil war

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maddogofshimano · 3 years

Text

Kiryu (Final Fight) Character Story

Spoilers for Yakuza 1

I wasn’t sure what I expected out of this one, but it sure wasn’t this, given the card it’s attached to is.....

Yeah.

Remember how in the Rikiya event Kiryu kept saying things that were wildly easy to misconstrue? Yeah, he’s gonna do a bunch of that.

Summary: Set right after the events of Y1, Kiryu is attempting to make ends meet, but he’s struggling with reintegrating into civilian life.

So this starts off with Kiryu, as requested by the store’s manager, attempting to be a cashier, but the customers just keep running away at the sight of him. The manager comes back and decides okay, this job is clearly not working for Kiryu, let’s put him in the back, and sends him to work in the kitchen.

The kitchen staff are immediately scared of him. The manager says not to worry, he’s ex-yakuza! This worries the staff even more.

Kiryu: That meat knife (Tl note: slang usually used about daggers) looks like it cuts well. Be careful not to cut your fingers (Tl note: slang for chopping off a pinky) Staff: Dagger???? Chop a pinky off???? Kiryu: Ooh, this is a good dagger (Tl note: even more slang, closer to shiv). It'll be great for slicing it open and pulling all the organs out. Staff: Shiv?? Rip out guts???? Kiryu: (Why's he seem so confused? Doesn't he know you have to gut the fish?) Kiryu: Am I doing something that's not how you normally do it? Staff: N-N-Not normal at all! I can't work here! <runs out the door> I can't work if he tries to rip out all my guts!! Manager: ...Kiryu why the hell are you going to rip his guts out?!?! Kiryu: ...I was talking about the fish............... Manager: I see... Kiryu, you're kind of bad at talking.........

The manager decides to give Kiryu a job SO SIMPLE there’s no way he could possibly screw it up, he just needs to go to the store across the street and check on something, it should take 10 minutes tops.

Kiryu comes back 3 hours later because a lady was being harassed and he had to fight off a whole gang. Oops. He gets fired and takes a moment to be sad in the park and eat the bento Haruka made him for dinner

<part 2> Next up Kiryu has a job handing out pocket tissues! Unfortunately, he’s got the same problem as before, everyone keeps running away from him! He decides he’s going to act more cutely, so that people are less afraid.

“Here, take this~”

“Kyaaa!?”

His next tactic is to try being quieter. There’s a cut here where presumably Kiryu went through multiple more iterations of refinements such as speaking more politely until finally after an hour, he gets one lady to take a tissue pack. Success!

(...I see. So the trick was to present the tissues firmly.)

Which would mean Kiryu’s initial method was shouting “Take this!!” at random people and not even presenting the tissues. Now that Kiryu’s finally gotten the hang of this, a bunch of ex-Shimano goons jump him because they’re mad that Shimano’s dead and blame Kiryu for it. They fight, Kiryu wins, but gets fired for getting into fist fights on the clock. Ouch.

Back to having sad bento dinner at the park, Kiryu decides that he’ll find a new job, and he’ll keep it this time! He’s Haruka’s parent, after all. He decides he’ll enter the cleaning industry, specifically the sanitation workers that clean up the streets.

Kiryu is working alongside another guy to clean the park, and he’s thankful this job doesn’t require much talking since he’s not very good at that. Some goon starts chucking garbage all over the spot Kiryu just cleaned and he’s mad but won’t do anything about it since he can’t afford to lose this job too.

They all get done with their work and leave only to come back and find the park absolutely wrecked, the goons have spray painted on everything, it will take forever to clean this and there’s going to be an inspection today! The other cleaners are distraught and Kiryu wants nothing more than to punch them but he’s still holding himself back.

He tells the other workers that he’s just going to talk to these goons. He tries to and the goons make fun of Kiryu for being a garbage man and being old and asks him what he’s gonna do about them making a mess?

“I’m sorry, Haruka. I’m not qualified to be your parent.”

He then beats the daylights out of the goons and makes them spend all day cleaning up the graffiti and makes them swear not to do it again.

The head of the district’s sanitation department shows up and says he heard what Kiryu did here, and while he’s personally impressed, Kiryu did break a lot of rules and will have to be fired. Kiryu says he understands and is just sorry for causing a disturbance.

However, all the other sanitation workers come forward and say that he can’t fire Kiryu! Kiryu protected all of them! If Kiryu is fired, every single one of them will quit in protest! The boss decides that okay, since there were extenuating circumstances, Kiryu can keep his job. Kiryu is touched and says “I’ve lived my life as a good-for-nothing until now... Even still, there’s a place for me.”

He goes back to the park to eat his dinner and finds that the bento Haruka made him is a little bigger than usual. “Heh. Haruka’s a smart one.”

<END>

As a side note you see those sanitation workers everywhere in Japan, even heavy drinking and red light spots are remarkably clean for the amount of bodily fluids that hit the street every night.

I think it’s really cool that that’s what Kiryu’s job was between 1 and 2 and it’s not mocked or looked down on. What exactly his income was during that time is something that has been asked in interviews before and they’ve always said it was a secret that would be revealed later, and so we finally got our answer!

This is also an unusual character story because Kiryu never changes his sprite to match the one in the actual card art. I kept wondering when he was going to rip off his shirt or have a flashback, but it never happened.

#rggo #ryu ga gotoku #ryu ga gotoku online #yakuza #Kiryu

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rosemary-is-in-pesterquest · 3 years

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ooh! I have thoughts on Eridan!

okay so, to me, Eridan ties into this thing that homestuck has going on with a lot of its more morally grey characters... the question of how responsible young people are for their negative qualities and actions, and where the age threshold for personal responsibility is.

the characters in homestuck all straddle this line between being young enough to consider them victims of the forces that influence them, while also old enough to understand what they're doing and how it affects others... especially because a lot of these kids come off as really smart for their age, and very precocious. we've all been through phases in our lives that make us cringe, not because we're ashamed of something harmless, but because we recognize that we had absorbed something harmful, and took longer than we wish we had to unlearn it. it could be as simple as being kind of a jerk in a misguided attempt to seem cool, or as dramatic as actually hurting someone in an attempt to remedy one's own insecurities by putting down others to seem better by comparison... but how far can you push that before people aren't willing to forgive? before people abandon the notion that better guidance and more appropriate role models could reform someone? and it's especially interesting when you consider how old homestuck's core audience might've been when they first encountered this story, and how it affected their perception of the characters if they saw them as peers, rather than as children from an adult's perspective.

so to talk about Eridan, I wanna frame this in terms of his classpect, because it actually goes a long way towards contextualizing his behavior. Eridan is a prince of hope, meaning that he destroys hope or uses hope to destroy... and this can be seen in practically every conversation he has. if Eridan is contacting someone, it is because he expects something of them. advice, or consolation, or a solution to a problem he's having... it's always something. when he contacts Kanaya, he wants her to auspistize between him and Vriska. when he contacts Feferi, he wants her to give him encouragement, and maybe date him when he asks. and in every case, the way he demands these things by being rude, whiny, or self pitying, makes people reluctant or unwilling to give him what he expects. he destroys what he hopes to obtain.

it goes deeper than that though. Eridan has absorbed this ideology of sea dweller superiority from living on Alternia... and he actually takes it way farther than it even makes sense to. the aristocracy on Alternia use the lower class for all sorts of menial work that they feel entitled not to have to do themselves. they might have the ability to freely cull individual low bloods for any reason, but eradicating all land dwelling trolls would leave a lot of unpleasant yet necessary tasks with no one to do them. I don't think Eridan actually wants to live in a reality where sea dwellers have to pick up the slack of doing things like sanitation work, or construction or something... but another concept that is heavily tied to the hope aspect is delusion. Eridan is exaggerating. he's trying to agree with Alternia's ruthless class structure so hard that it's actually kind of absurd. but Feferi calls him on that... she says she thinks that he self sabotages on purpose. because he knows, at least in some capacity, that the consequences of getting what he "wants" would actually be really uncomfortable to live with.

so not only is Eridan's goal to destroy... it is also a false goal that he constantly undermines. and all of his waffling between grandstanding and self pity destroys his romantic prospects, which are what he actually seems to want the most.

if you look at the way Eridan pursues relationships, he actually makes a lot of logical sense, but not a lot of emotional sense. he's idealized the act of perfectly filling the relationship requirements of each quadrant. he wants Feferi to be his matesprit, which is purely based on the fact that she's high enough on the hemospectrum to be an appropriate match in terms of status. he wants Vriska to be his kismesis, and Kanaya to be their auspistice, and there are hints that Karkat might've been someone he was considering for moiraillegience, though it wasn't emphasized as much. and there you go! his goal is specific, but it's based more on ideals than on the actual needs and feelings of the people involved, and it's totally self centered... he always wants them to cater to his own needs. the reason why he gets as nihilistic as he does on the meteor, is because all of his endeavors to achieve these relationships are falling through. he feels like he has no hope of mending his existing connections, because he still only sees them in terms of people either giving him, or not giving him, what he wants. but the rest of their race is dead. as the last twelve trolls in existence, they only have each other as romantic options. and as Eridan gets more and more desperate, he gets more and more demanding, which is the exact quality that drives everyone away from him to begin with, and it culminates in him having a "if I can't have what I want then nobody can have any of their hopes either" meltdown.

to backtrack a bit, I wanna reconsider questions such as, when is a kid old enough to be held responsible for their own negative qualities? like... when are you comfortable with ceasing to blame environmental factors? when are they just a bad person? is it after they've refused a certain number of chances to make better choices? when do they reach an age, or level of bad behavior, that makes you think they can't be helped to reform from these negative qualities? where does an adult lose their patience for the idea that a kid is just a victim of their upbringing?

obviously Feferi is Eridan's peer, but these are basically the questions she grapples with when she talks to Eridan. it's like growing up next door to a kid whose parents have some aggressively wrong-headed political stances. as you grow, that kid might mirror their parents' way of thinking... and by the time the two of you are in your teens, it's hard to ignore how much of a jerk that kid is becoming. but you've seen them at every step of their development. you know where it comes from. maybe theirs is the dominant political belief in the community, even if your own parents aren't like that. maybe you wonder if you would've agreed with them if you grew up under their circumstances. you've felt the pressure, but you haven't lived in it like they have, and maybe if they just had the chance to grow up under different conditions, they wouldn't be this way. and you are aware that you could be an influence on them... maybe they need you to help them see another perspective. you always got along so well as kids. when did things even change? and that's kind of where I imagine Feferi is at when we're introduced to her and Eridan. it's a crossroads between believing that you might still matter enough to them to change their outlook, and the persistence of their ingrained beliefs. it's tiring to do that kind of work, over a long period of time, to minimal results. when is the appropriate time to give up? in this way, Feferi's own hopes for Eridan fade over time. she says at one point that she was mainly acting as his moirail so he wouldn't try to underfeed her lusus and kill the land dwellers that way. she's not sure how serious he is, and she can't take that risk. deep down, I'm pretty sure Eridan knew he was never actually going to commit a genocide... but his need to grandstand, and legitimate belief in his caste superiority, had convinced Feferi enough that she still felt obligated to manage him as though he was a real threat.

these characters are thirteen years old. they're right at the edge of childhood and adolescence... right at the age where children aren't quite so innocent. they want to assert themselves. they aren't mature, so there's a lot of responsibility that they still shouldn't be trusted with yet, but they've become aware enough to feel like that's demeaning, and to want to be taken seriously. in an effort to make people acknowledge them without looking down on them, they'll try just about anything. they don't have the experience to know what they're doing yet, so it doesn't always work in their favor, and that's frustrating. you can see bits and pieces of this in homestuck's characters. like with the way they try to paint themselves as an authority on something, or shit talk each other in order to emphasize their own strengths. it's a really interesting theme, because homestuck pushes some of these young characters really far in terms of how bad the things they've done can be, or how much their lived experiences have taught them that what they're doing is acceptable. they can be really self aware in some ways, and come off as really childish in others. it's hard to know what you'd do about them in real life... and your answer changes depending on your own age and perspective. it's a really cool gray area to poke around in, and homestuck is excellent at it.

wtf I like Eridan now

#when you think about it a lot eridan really was just a misguided 13 yr old

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janiedean · 3 years

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i find it funny that all the arguments against sansan or sanrion is about the age gap being problematic and then people ship her with jaime who's OLDER THAN TYRION and i think also older than sandor OR they'll ship her with jon who she grew up considering a brother and is actually a cousin making it incestuous. oh and when the books start theon is like 18-19 years old while sansa is like 11 i think? but yes, tell me more about why your sansa ships are superior to sansan or sanrion LOL. oh also let's not forget the ~pure~ ship of sansaery where margaery basically pretends to be friends with sansa and acts nice for her own advantage which is easy to do since she's lonely in king's landing but drops her th emoment it gets convenient, not to mention pretty much framing her from joff's murder which like sure, sansa escaped cuz LF had it planned but if not she would've been killed then :) a very healthy dynamic indeed. they really don't want to admit that they only care to ship sansa with canonically hot guys and their real problem with sansan and sanrion is both sandor and tyrion are supposed to be ugly and physically quite the opposite of the prince charming she's looking for (but they are more prince-like in character) and ignore that her whole arc is learning to look beyond appearances and names and superficial stories.

I mean other than confirming you that jaime's older than sandor bc jaime has seven years on tyrion who's three-four years younger than sandor and sandor's like 29 in agot... he's older than both of them and I'd like to add willas tyrell to the list of people that are seen as better options.... and he's also older than both sandor and tyrion, I... can't disagree with anything here because like we don't even wanna touch my beef with sans*ery but it's for the same reasons as you said and at the end of it I also can't disagree with the last paragraph because that's... like... the point of the narrative like sansa is obv ending up with someone who doesn't look hot for standards but is actually good on the inside which both of them fit the standard for, and again while I think sandor's it for obv reasons if sanrion was endgame I wouldn't be complaining (ngl I was hoping lowkey for them to get the show bc it was obvious sansan wasn't gonna be a show thing so might as well have a 50/50 split even though I guess having the show wouldn't have been that great in retrospective BUT ANYWAY) yeah what you said about the whole arc and again like... sansa/jaime is top five most hated ships for me too bc it's doubly ignoring that sansa and jaime have LI that aren't standard attractive so I'm not even touching that but yeah like

sorry but when it comes to problematic ships again there is literally nothing in asoiaf that's not somehow problematic - again the most wholesome thing in there is sam/gilly and I reiterate gilly has a baby because her father raped her and her own mother was the same so................. like no one has any leg to stand on when it comes to MY SHIP IS WHOLESOME bc no ship in here is 100% wholesome or has characters who are themselves 100% wholesome so the fixation about how these two ships are specifically bad is suspicious like really really sus

also I'd like again to point out for the umpteenth time that while there are things that I really don't vibe with (and in this fandom esp I can't do incest ships) I don't go around judging ppl for being into unhealthy dynamics or being like EW IT'S INCEST BAD because honestly I have better to do with my life, but my problem is people going like AH MY SHIP IS MORALLY BETTER THAN YOURS when it's a badwrong/ish dynamic and trying to sanitize it - like own up to it no one is gonna judge in this damned fandom and if they do good luck being coherent and don't go at other people like 'ah yeah mine is better than yours because it's so much more wholesome' X°D

also like... again there's limits and limits - I can absolutely get why someone would not like sansan or sanrion because they do have problematic elements like if someone reads blackwater and feels uncomfortable ofc I'm not gonna tell them WELL YOU HAVE TO ACCEPT IT, if they blacklist sansan and they don't come at me telling me I'm a pervert then all good? but like to do the comparison I can't get over how in the show sansa told theon she'd do to him what ramsay did all over again after he didn't help her when she didn't even tell him WELL WE SHOULD RUN AWAY TOGETHER just help me run away because for me that is like... I can't ship it when the show narrative never asked sansa to be accountable, I won't ever go to a the*nsa shipper telling them EW HOW CAN YOU LIKE IT WHEN THAT IS A THING because... the way I can like sansan with its problematic elements or secondarily like sanrion with its problematic elements (nvm that the superior tyrion ship is tyrion/bronn anyway) they can like th*onsa with its problematic elements? but just don't go around harping at ppl because everyone has their limit to something and it can be glaringly obvious or not (I mean if I tell you that th*ramsay isnt my cup of tea anyone could understand why seeing the background, or idk for me brienne/hyle hunt is a way bigger nope than brienne/tormund ever could have been but a lot of ppl in jb fandom feel the contrary which is absolutely fine again I can't stand the idea of b. with someone who bet on taking her virginity because of personal reasons even if he realized he was wrong but for others the way they wrote brienne/tormund in the show was uncomfortable to that degree and so on) and as long as you behave like an adult... then who cares what you ship

meanwhile instead there's the... fixation on those two esp within the context you mentioned and honestly I'm kinda tired of the 'gross old dudes' rhetoric thrown at them when neither of them is old or gross and they both are abuse victims with trauma never mind the ableism in spades (that one more glaringly at tyrion for obvious reasons and on tumblr I wish it wasn't like......... 80% of the general fandom but people dismissing sandor's shitty coping methods as HE'S A VIOLENT DRUNK when like..... he's the only one who's actually not violent with her sansa and he has thirty years' worth of ptsd on him are also a peach) like... can you please realize the implications of what you're saying please and thank you

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stomp-that-ho-regard · 3 years

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I typically don’t do asks (I've only ever gotten a few), but a recent one got my gears turning and I wanted to reply.

(This is a secondary blog, so I can’t answer asks in the usual way.)

Your post about the retcon is so fucking good, I wish every critter saw it and actually thought about how shitty it was done, but then their belief in the cast and show would probably start cracking.

Thank you for liking the retcon post. I’ve seen various people in the tags thank me for making that post and have said that it’s helped them ‘feel less insane’. None of us are insane. We are not delusional. We didn’t experience a mass hallucination. These things happened, and they’ve been thoroughly documented. Hundreds of hours of material over the course of three years.

The people who should read that post won’t ever see it because I have all those assholes blocked lol. If they did manage to find it somehow, I know they would just mock it, as they’re wont to do with any of our criticisms. They’re so far up CR’s ass, they’ve convinced themselves that a retcon didn’t happen. Even shoving the literal definition of the word in their faces wouldn’t wake them up.

It's just so fucking weird to see how the group is acting now, and I'm pretty sure we're never gonna get a Laura&Marisha episode picture and a TM episode with those 2 for the rest of the campaign. It feels like when a non-canon wlw ship gets big on a TV show and suddenly the actresses can't be seen or interact with each other anymore🙄 it's the same fucking pattern and like you, I thought I wouldn't have to deal with this on a d&d show.

I specifically want to address the “It feels like when a non-canon wlw ship gets big on a TV show and suddenly the actresses can't be seen or interact with each other anymore” because I’ve thought about that pattern too. (Not so much with Marisha/Laura ‘cause them being on TM together is already a rare combo. If they don’t appear much or at all going forward, I don’t think it’s because of this, though it really wouldn’t surprise me. But, I have been thinking about that specific pattern in regard to their characters.)

I can make a comparison between this situation and what happened with the show A/gent Carter and the way the ship Cart/inelli was handled.

I know that might sound weird, but stay with me here lol...

I want to make it clear that I’m not comparing the relationships at all. Cart/inelli did not have nearly the same amount of build-up and depth as Beaujester, (or quite frankly, their level of possibility.) What I am comparing is the creators over-the-top reactions to these characters being shipped so hard and the extreme measures they went to in order to ‘remedy’ that.

The ship included P/eggy Carter and A/ngie Martinelli. The show was set in New York. Angie was a waitress (who wanted to be an actress/be on Broadway) at the diner that Peggy frequented. They ended up talking quite a bit and became fairly close. That ended up kind of becoming the core relationship in the entire first season, and LOTS of people started shipping it.

At the time, no one was calling us crazy or delusional. At most it was, “This is ABC! They’re not gonna pair her with a woman!” and of course the obligatory “But Peggy’s not gay!”. But no one was calling us names or being generally cruel. And anyone who tried it was ignored because everyone else drowned them out. The ship became extremely popular on Tumblr and Twitter. Both actresses were very positive and supportive. They regularly liked/retweeted romantic Cart/inelli fanart on Twitter. Even one of the female writers on the show got behind it too. It was asked about frequently at conventions and no one booed or rolled their eyes. The questions were never dismissed or made into a joke. (Honestly, this was one of the better overall fandom experiences I’ve had on here.)

And all of us were super excited for S2. Not just because of all the support, but because they had ended S1 with Peggy and Angie moving in together. Peggy had purchased, either it was a really fancy apartment or house (my memory is fuzzy on this), and she literally asked Angie to stay with her. Needless to say, that fueled the flames even more.

But despite the actresses and at least one writer being on board, between S1 and S2, something shifted.

Clearly, the showrunner and/or the execs, took a look at all of this and deemed it a ‘problem’. When S2 finally came around, suddenly everything was different. Instead of both of them living together in New York, instead of it being an organic (I’m beginning to hate that word) continuation from where they left off, Peggy decided to move to Los Angeles to do work for some agency out there or something, and Angie stayed in New York. It’s never explained why. It’s never explained why a woman who so badly wanted to be an actress would NOT want to go to LA, where Hollywood is. LA was never mentioned in S1. There were no hints that Peggy might want to fly out to the West Coast at some point. She seemed perfectly happy in NY, basically setting up house with Angie.

And they didn’t even ease into the change. They just got rid of the character. The actress was bummed about it and Cart/inelli fans tried to put pressure on the showrunner/writers to bring Angie back, which the actress completely supported, but even that fell on deaf ears. So, Angie was simply no longer an entity on that show. Conveniently removed. All the excitement we had was crushed. And of course, the second that Peggy got out to LA, she suddenly had a very obvious male love interest. What a surprise.

The showrunner/writers were not subtle about what they thought about our ship and us. They made the most extreme, nonsensical writing decision in order to permanently separate these two characters. Because, hey, that’s the only way to get the shippers to STOP, right?

This was what I was reminded of when I started seeing the turn that post-hiatus CR was taking. It ended up being a weird combination of kneejerk erasure (BJ) and heavy-handed overcompensation (BY).

But of course, CR is not a TV show, it’s D&D. And they can’t force one of their PCs to just disappear, so what do they have to resort to? Not interacting.

We all know how severely neutered Beau and Jester’s general relationship has become. It’s clear to me that both Marisha and Laura felt they had to do that. They had to suddenly have their characters stay away from each other as much as possible so they could prioritize Fjord and Yasha, and speed-run into romances with them. They started acting as if either of them giving the other one ounce of affectionate attention (like they had been doing so often and so naturally before), would be breaking some sort of hidden ‘relationship code’. Almost like if they ever hugged again, the studio would go down in flames.

The very obvious fact that they went to these lengths, to me, proves two things...

One, it proves the retcon even more, because you can tell that the way they behaved with each other DID in fact change. The frequency of interactions and the way those interactions would play out. Whenever they interact now, it seems like they’re trying to keep it as short, thin, and almost comedic (to the point of goofiness, and not in a good way) as possible. Their engagement seems half-assed and dull. The sounds of their voices, their facial expressions... completely sanitized. Even all the physicality they had is gone; the touches, the hugs, the cuddling. Every single aspect is different and they absolutely did that intentionally. This had to happen because they needed to dupe the viewers into believing that despite overall interest waning, their threadbare connections to Fjord and Yasha are more important, and were always more important then their connection to each other, that we all watched them steadily build. (And watched them pick up steam from about ep70 onwards.)

And two, that whole intentional decision to cut themselves off from each other, proves to me that their interactions pre-hiatus were indeed tinged with ‘something extra’, that was more than just friendship. They both recognized it and that’s why they pulled back so hard. That’s why soft touches and hugs and cuddling are no longer ‘allowed’. That’s why quiet, heartfelt conversations are no longer ‘allowed’. Because if there was absolutely nothing there, if they didn’t see/feel any romantic chemistry simmering underneath, and it was all just platonic BFF stuff, why would they suppress their behavior so drastically?

I think that all of this really does cement what I said in my retcon post: That there are disingenuous patterns being used here that I’ve seen far too often in media. In A/gent Carter, it was a character separation, in CR it was a character dynamic separation. Both done on purpose, to make the shippers shut up, and to push a different plot.

One is scripted, the other is unscripted, but the situations feel disgustingly similar, don’t they?

#op #ask #long post #i feel like i'm just retreading old ground here #still cathartic though

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