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castingmysilver · 11 months

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A Thought:

Have you ever heard the joking "welcome back to the land of the living" for someone who's been in a deep sleep?

What if it was *literal*???

Some sleepers visit the Land of the Dead -- traditional Underworld setting rather than specifically heaven/hell -- when they sleep. Possibly even with some form of ordeal required before they can wake, and/or actual risk of getting lost in there and going comatose as consequence, and the greeting being a traditional luck-ritual to welcome their souls home??? All sorts of shenanigans can ensue of course, both because of the actual threat to their safety and the likelihood of learning valuable and/or upsetting information from the Dead on the other side. Or possibly even getting mislead about Living-world facts by mischievous spirits?

It may have been done before but I honestly can't remember ever reading or even hearing about it, and I hang out with a *lot* of fantasy. The specific angle of the World of the Dead as a dreamworld-setting that can have feedback into Life for travelers between and those affected by them, where it is like, an actual culturally known phenomenon......

If someone wants to riff off this *please* feel more than welcome, just tag me so I can see if you post it on its own rather than threaded here!

Or if someone has found a fairly close version of the idea in existing media, please let me know where? I have a sneaking suspicion if it exists it's most likely to be anime/Manga.

#random #plotbunny #fantasy #katabasis #underworld journey #worlds in dream #of dreams #worldbuilding #free to a good home

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theghostshost · 3 days

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Betting Piece

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pikahlua · 16 days

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Horikoshi is attacking me personally with this chapter

#my hero academia manga spoilers #final arc spoilers #when you see these translations #you will know #the fucking underworld journey i went on to finish this

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journeytothewestresearch · 5 months

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Egypt-China Underworld Book PDF

I recently received an email about this book:

The Netherworld in Ancient Egypt and China: An Imagined Paradise (2023) by Dr. Mu-chou Poo.

It discusses the similarities between the New Kingdom Egyptian and (pre-Buddhist) Western Han Chinese underworlds. I figured it might be of interest to some of my followers, especially since the Chinese underworld appears several times in Journey to the West (1592).

The book is not supposed to be out until December, but I managed to find a PDF online. Click the link to download the PDF.

Here is the book blurb

Considering the striking similarities between the treatment of the dead and conceptions of the netherworld in ancient Egypt and China, how can we compare the two traditions? Mu-chou Poo considers this question, and provides a new perspective on archaeological materials, including tomb structures and funerary texts, by addressing them in the context of universal human problems such as death, the future of the dead, and the search for happiness in life. Poo chronologically reconstructs the emergence of the idea of the netherworld and its evolution in both ancient Egypt and ancient China. He explores the relationship between religious beliefs and social ethics in these civilizations, considers why similar social and material conditions could have produced varied expressions of the afterlife, and what such variations reveal about each culture. Poo argues that a comparison between both visions of the netherworld and their relationship to life experience gives further insight into the nature of each civilization. Through this analysis, Poo shows that thematic comparison of ancient civilizations is not only possible, but also relevant to modern society.

If you liked the digital version, please support the official release.

#journey to the west #JTTW #underworld #hell #Chinese religion #China #Egypt #Egyptian religion #Chinese mythology #Egyptian mythology #Lego Monkie Kid #Ancient China #Ancient Egypt #egyptian art #book pdf

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yonemurishiroku · 1 year

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That Nico healing in the Underworld prompt but anw Persephone wrestles a bit of the Sun from Apollo’s hand to hang it in Nico’s room so that he can have a bit of sunlight while he’s recovering.

#aka: the journey of persephone and nico's rekindling #and hermes delivers it btw #persephone (pjo)#nico di angelo #nico and persephone #there's zagreus too but i haven't thought of what to do with him yet #prince of the underworld #underworld family #pjo #hoo #percy jackson and the olympians #heroes of olympus #yone prompt #riordanverse #nico healing #nico healing in the underworld

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nightswatchdisbandmentera · 1 year

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There’s something weird I never noticed before. So in ASOS, Stannis tells Davos that he saw the upcoming battle against the Others in one of Melisandre’s fires.

The ashes were white, rising in the updraft, yet all at once it seemed as if they were falling. Snow, I thought. Then the sparks in the air seemed to circle, to become a ring of torches, and I was looking through the fire down on some high hill in a forest. The cinders had become men in black behind the torches, and there were shapes moving through the snow. For all the heat of the fire, I felt a cold so terrible I shivered, and when I did the sight was gone, the fire but a fire once again. But what I saw was real, I’d stake my kingdom on it.

- Davos IV, ASOS

The “men in black behind torches” seems to suggest Night’s Watchment who are in the process of confronting the Others (“shapes moving through the snow”). I think it’s quite interesting that there is a sort of Azor Ahai imagery with these men, as they hold burning torches.

But then as I was reading this passage, I was suddenly reminded of one of Patchface’s jingles.

“Under the sea, it snows up,” said the fool, “and the rain is dry as bone. I know, I know, oh, oh, oh.”

- Prologue, ACOK

And I got to thinking, it seems that Patchface and Stannis are seeing the same thing (snow “falling” upward). Stannis also sees snow falling downwards, which kind of evokes a cycle. We don’t really know exactly what Patchface saw since the entire section contains several broken up and vague “prophecies”.

But regarding what we do know, my initial assumption was that Patchface’s jingle was essentially about death and the rising of wights. But then I also considered that he could also be referring to Jon Snow who seemingly dies at the end of ADWD and might be resurrected in TWOW.

They found Her Grace sewing by the fire, whilst her fool danced about to music only he could hear, the cowbells on his antlers clanging. “The crow, the crow,” Patchface cried when he saw Jon. “Under the sea the crows are white as snow, I know, I know, oh, oh, oh.” Princess Shireen was curled up in a window seat, her hood drawn up to hide the worst of the greyscale that had disfigured her face.

- Jon XI, ADWD

P.S: Coincidentally, Jon would (more generally) be among the men in black presented in Stannis’ vision since he is a member of the Night’s Watch; these men are also referred to as crows.

And speaking of Jon, we know that Melisandre has received visions of Jon’s death and possible rebirth.

The flames crackled softly, and in their crackling she heard the whispered name Jon Snow. His long face floated before her, limned in tongues of red and orange, appearing and disappearing again, a shadow half-seen behind a fluttering curtain. Now he was a man, now a wolf, now a man again. But the skulls were here as well, the skulls were all around him. Melisandre had seen his danger before, had tried to warn the boy of it. Enemies all around him, daggers in the dark. He would not listen.

[…]

“What do you see, my lady?” the boy asked, softly. Skulls. A thousand skulls, and the bastard boy again. Jon Snow.

[…]

Yet now she could not even seem to find her king. I pray for a glimpse of Azor Ahai, and R’hllor shows me only Snow.

- Melisandre I, ADWD

So Mel is seeing Jon in danger, but the “now he was a man, now a wolf, now a man again” seems to suggest that he will return. She has tried to rely this information to Jon and we get a rather funny exchange, where Jon assumes that the “snow” Mel is talking about is frozen rain.

“And what of Mance? Is he lost as well? What do your fires show?”

“The same, I fear. Only snow.”

Snow. It was snowing heavily to the south, Jon knew. Only two days’ ride from here, the kingsroad was said to be impassable. Melisandre knows that too. And to the east, a savage storm was raging on the Bay of Seals. At last report, the ragtag fleet they had assembled to rescue the free folk from Hardhome still huddled at Eastwatch-by-the-Sea, confined to port by the rough seas. “You are seeing cinders dancing in the updraft.”

- Jon X, ADWD

Note: I searched “updraft” and got this definition: “an upward current of air.”

Jon thinks Mel is talking about the very literal snow moving upward(?) in the air, but she says,

“I am seeing skulls. And you. I see your face every time I look into the flames. The danger that I warned you of grows very close now.”

Not snow, but Snow.

And just a final (random) thought to wrap this all up,

“One bird croaking my name was bad enough,” said Jon, “and snow’s nothing a black brother wants to hear about.” Snow often meant death in the north.

- Jon II, ACOK

Hmmm 🤔

#asoiaf #valyrianscrolls #stannis baratheon #patchface #melisandre #jon snow #prophecy and visions in asoiaf #my stuff #Team Dragonstone: why do we keep getting visions of that bastard boy?#It’s a bit of a reach lmao but oh well #Stannis’ vision is so interesting to me because he sees the nights watch #And it seems like this is seeding for him riding north in asos #But then my headcannon is that he looked to see azor ahai #As urged by Mel - maybe she was trying to show him the vision she saw of him #Which made her think he’s the prophesied hero #And he did - only he only saw something vague in the fire #Snow ->Torches -> The nights watch -> And a hill up north #Just by unneeded two cents hehe #I also want to add that in Jon’s asos winterfell crypt dream #He journeys into the ~underworld~ carrying a flaming torch 👀

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swampysmiles · 5 months

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#swampy draws #opossum #it's all uphill from here babey #it's all tottering and cat chow up there i seen't it before i respawned in the underworld blood onsen #anywaves i doodled myself a new pfp weehoo #my art #critters #gotta put this sweet lil angel in my critters tag gotta socialize em early #can u tell i got my meds refilled yeah it's over for u c'mere #it's MY artistic journey and i'll do shitty lineart if i W

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scribefindegil · 8 months

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haunted and vexed by how non-Classical time travel is >:(

#i want to have little 1-2 sentence descriptions of the events of the other books in my fake epic in the academic introduction #and all the rest of them are easy #heist narratives are eternal #classics is full of evil sorceresses #book 5 works great as a journey to the underworld #book 7? being cursed with madness for your hubris is maybe the most Classical thing you could possibly do #book 8? the evil sorceress again plus 'died and turned into a very distinctive flower' is SUPER classical #(clone resurrection is much less so so idk if he makes it out in this version. sorry Arty.)#but then there's the goshdarned time travel #i do not know what to do about the goshdarned time travel #artemis phaulos

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nikofortuna · 7 months

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JTTW Chapter 11 Thoughts

Chapter Eleven for the @journeythroughjourneytothewest Reading Group!

The Underworld actually holds trials! Something we haven’t quite seen with Heaven so far, which makes me side eye them once more.

An explanation present in another translation that I found quite useful is what the Three Tribunes actually are. Or Three Orders as they are called in the J.F. Jenner translation. They are the Human Order, the Underworld Order and the Water Order. Interesting to see that ‘Water’ gets to be its own thing, though after short deliberation it does make sense given how many oceans and other bodies of water there are on the planet.

I really need to read Romance of the Three Kingdoms sometime, for some context as to why Li Shimin’s brothers seem to have beef with him. Well, extended context because the German translation explains this trivia bit! Li Shimin actually killed his brothers during a coup and forced his father to surrender the throne to him. So yeah, it’s understandable that they would be upset upon seeing him again.

Judge Cui messing with official documents like this is a bit eh. While it is kind of nice of him to go through with this favour for a friend, it is concerning how easily he did this.

It also brings up questions of how strict these “fate” things are. Heaven seems to insist they are extremely important and their every order needs to be followed for thing to function, but the Underworld seems to see it a bit more lenient.

Revisiting the situation with the dragon’s execution, was him being punished that harshly because of this pre-written fate which is essentially a prophecy? Or at least was that why specifically Wei Zheng was called in to execute him? If it is so that’s… well it’s really odd. How much of this is actually deserved fate and how much is downright fabricated by Heaven?

On a lighter note deities really seem to like their fruit! That’s pretty cute!

Picking up on a bit of translation detail I checked the Chinese original, as always with Google Translate, when I read “Griffin” and indeed it is not really a griffin as such, it just said demon/monster.

And repeating myself once more, whenever you see the colour green or blue mentioned, you can be almost certain that what is means is verdant.

The Tang Emperor coming back to live after three days specifically is pretty funny when you have context of different religions where similar things happened.

Liu Quan comes across as quite the self-centred idiot. He was far too willing to leave his children and for what? Because his wife couldn’t care for them anymore? That’s a big reason why he shouldn’t have thrown away his life! His children needed him most in that very situation!

Though his wife Li Cuilian wasn’t all that much better either. One little argument pushes her over the edge like that? Seriously? Either something was very wrong to begin with or there were additional important details which weren’t mentioned in the text.

It would be somewhat more believable if she got really drunk after the argument or something similar leading to her making an impulse decision to take her life just to spite her husband for that argument. She was seemingly quite restricted within the household, but it couldn’t have been an actually abusive environment or both of them wouldn’t have reconciled when they met again. At least there was no mention of them genuinely resenting each other or breaking up or something.

In the end they both got lucky that the Kings of the Underworld are such good guys and did all the work to get them back into the world of the living so they could get their full lifetimes.

At this point I mainly feel sorry for the children having to go through all this emotion turmoil because of their parents.

I’m starting to squint at the amount of women not being treated very kindly by the narrative and getting fridged under such nonsensical circumstances. And that is aside from the less than stellar treatment on display, which was considered normal back then. While it needs to be kept in mind that things were very different back when this story was written, overlooking this kind of stuff just because of that wouldn’t be right either.

Not the happiest note to end on, but an important one nonetheless.

#xiyouji #journey to the west #jttw #Tang Emperor #Liu Quan and Li Cuilian #squinting at Heaven again #Underworld is pretty nice though #questionable writing of women #jttw reading group #jttw book club

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milkaloloart · 2 years

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“La ultima puerta. Nivel 9”/ “The last door. Level 9” This piece is part of my show THE WALK HOME II at @cactusgallery check it out! Link in bio #thewalkhome #cactusgallery #chicunamictlán #mictlán #mesoamerica #mitologia #azteca #mexicanart #mesoamerican #mythology #aztec #neomexicanismos #artemexicano #mictlantecuhtli #soul #journey #afterlife #underworld #ancientgods #lifeanddeath #contemporaryart #figurativeart #surrealart #latinamericanart #latinaartist #womanartist #mexicomagico #folksurrealism #dayofthedead #diademuertos https://www.instagram.com/p/Cjb4IDXjKCp/?igshid=NGJjMDIxMWI=

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luxaofhesperides · 9 months

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Wait a second... hang on im making connections....

Katabasis is a descent into the underworld done by heroes of greek/roman epics. A crucial moment in the hero's journey often to seek guidance from the dead or to attempt at bringing someone back. Nostoi is a homecoming, a narrative specifically abt returning home.

Gregor falling into the underland (unintentional) and bringing his father back to the overland, spending the entire time just trying to get home. The prophecy doesnt really matter to him, he just wants to get his dad and go home.

And he does! But he chooses to go back down over and over again, going to a place full of wonder and danger and war and becoming a hero, losing his way home even tho he finds his way back to the overland in the end. The underland being so connected with death that when he chooses it and the people within in, he struggles to live in the overland (and struggles to live at all without ares).

Im barely coherent im just thinking abt the influence of these narrative devices in this series.

#look. w all the names being greek or roman in origin i fully believe that collins had some other elements in this series #maybe intentional maybe not. maybe just influence from greek epics shes familiar with but still #idek where im going w this. just thinking abt gregor as being modeled after those heroes but in a reverse way almost #its always a journey into the underland. its always a struggle to get home. he loses more than he gains down there.#hes a hero down there while greek heroes are out of place in the underworld. facing their mortality and their dead loved ones #while gregor in the underland has to face all the survivors. the dead are gone and he is stuck w the living until he loses even them #by going back to the overland. much to think abt.#tuc #the underland chronicles

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dorothygale123 · 2 months

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TONIGHT, WE DINE IN HELL!!!

But seriously, we're taking about the underworld today.

The Chinese, Japanese, and Korean underworlds are very similar as they all draw upon the same Buddhist ideas. King Yama also shows up in JttW, when Wukong id kidnapped to the underworld (called the diyu in Chinese) and removes his name from the ledgers of the dead. For those who want a closer look at the Japanese underworld, Jigoku, I highly recommend Hozuki no Retetsu, an anime about an oni beauracrat as its both informative and hilarious. For those that don't feel like it or need a refresher, here's the quick and dirty.

The underworld is ruled by 10 Kings, with one of them being the big guy in charge. He has a few names: King Yan, King Yama, and King Enma being a few. Sometimes the word 'great' is added to the start of his name to signify that he's the head honcho. You may know him as the big red guy from Dragon Ball who checks in the dead, or the father of Koenma from Yu Yu Hakusho. He also shows up with his pesse in season 4 of Lego Monkie Kid (they're the shady guys that stand in a circle menacingly), though he isn't named. He's not that hard to find, really.

The other 9 kings, in comparison, are less common, which is a shame. See, each of the 10 kings has an important role to play when judging a soul, weeding out all but the worst of the worst for the 10th king. King Yama help the 5th trial, right in the middle. The first king is basically there to sort out all the really good people. If you're such a good person that you don't have that many sins to be judged, he can give you the fast pass to reincarnation. If you do have a lot of sins, though (which, let's be honest, is most of us), you keep moving through the courts as the different kings weigh your sins according to their specialty.

The hearings for each soul happen 7 days after death, with each subsequent trial being held 7 days after the last for the first 7 trials. The 8th trial occurs 100 days after death, the 9th after a year, and the 10th and final trial is held after 3 years. During each trial, the king in charge will take into account any prayers or offerings given in the deceased person's honor to possibly lighten the sentence, so proper funerary rights on these specific dates are very important. After all the trials are done and you've been punished according to your sins, you are finally allowed to reincarnate.

I really tried to get more information on each specific king, but there isn't much I could find in English. If anyone knows more, please tell me! I'm so curious!!!

Sh*tpost Masterlist

#mythology sh*tposting #chinese mythology #lmk #sun wukong #journey to the west #mythology #jttw #king yama #king enma #king yan #the underworld #diyu #jigoku #the 10 kings #buddhist beliefs #lego monkie kid

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journeytothewestresearch · 6 months

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Ten Kings of Hell

Those who have read Journey to the West (1592) will know that the Ten Kings of hell appear in chapter three. This is when Monkey's soul is dragged to the underworld, and after causing trouble, he crosses his name out (as well as those of all monkeys) from the ledgers in hell.

Here is a book PDF that discusses the 9th/10th-century scripture that first introduced the Ten Kings.

https://journeytothewestresearch.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Stephen-Teiser-The-Scripture-on-the-Ten-Kings-and-the-Making-of-Purgatory-in-Medieval-Chinese-Buddhism-1994.pdf

#Ten Kings #Ten Judges #Buddhist hell #purgatory #Buddhism #journey to the west #sun wukong #monkey king #book pdf #hell #underworld #Chinese hell #Chinese underworld #lego monkie kid #LMK #JTTW

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blowingoffsteam2 · 2 years

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“Darkness becomes light, light falls into darkness”

I know it’s on the nose but I love this tagline for ddd. It’s Sora and Riku’s journey summed up right there. But it’s not just about ddd, this is their whole relationship. Yin and yang are never static, they are always chasing each other, changing into each other . That is why in the symbol, light contains a seed of darkness and darkness contains a seed of light.

#soriku #I mean it’s literally right there on the cover art too #Darkness becomes light #Riku rising #light falls into darkness #Sora falling #and surprise surprise who is the literal light in kh3 #HMMMM #and Sora has yet to really deal with his own darkness #but there’s no doubt he will #kh4 is his journey into the underworld #into his own darkness

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imminent-danger-came · 8 months

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In the Samadhi Fire ritual flashbacks and the brief vision of Macaque and Monkey King's final fight, SWK lacks the circlet. Do you think this is an intentional plot element, memory being fallible, or a straight-up animation error?

The 3x04 flashback of SWK and Macaque's fight lacking a circlet could easily be fallible memory or bias, but either way it's definitely intentional. The 3x10 Samadhi Fire flashback on the other hand is an unbiased account of what sealing the fire had looked like, so without a doubt we can trust everything we see there!

Honestly, at this point I wouldn't be surprised if there were in fact 2 SWK V Macaque fights: one during jttw where Tang Sanzang encouraged Wukong to spare Macaque (Like the great monk had done with LBD—that or Wukong is just straight up unwilling to finish Macaque off), and another fight post-jttw where it's Wukong alone without the influence of the pilgrims. But that's just me throwing stuff out there.

#but then you gotta think about where Wukong is in his character development #When it comes down to it why was he willing to kill Macaque in any scenario #Like Macaque buddy what were you doing #Like lmk Wukong even sealed DBK away #So for Macaque to be removed from the mortal plane...like what is going on with that #Hmmm but I guess DBK was sent to the underworld too. ''Flesh. Bone—I return to the realm of the living!''#Girl I actually have no idea what is happening in this show #''Every choice has consequences—for someone'' hello Macaque seriously what were you doing #Come on man we seriously do need answers #''The old you would have leveled this whole mountain range to stop me!''#So. What version of Wukong. During jttw? Post jttw? Is the time post sealing DBK something that changed him? Or was it the journey?#lmk #lego monkie kid #asks #lmk SWK #lmk Macaque #lmk theory

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darkobssessions · 10 months

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Self Love Altar & Dedication to Hecate

👁🕸🕷🐦‍⬛🪺🍂❤️‍🔥❤️🌹🥀

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