Let's get some more Mileven positivity up in here! What do you love most about Mileven?

I'll go first:

I love how cute and sweet they are together, how protective they are of each other, and how much they care about each other. Their love is just so beautiful and they are such important people in each other's lives. Since season 1, they've had a unique connection. Mike took her in, gave her someplace safe to stay, and showed her kindness. They just have such an amazing, wholesome, and moving story throughout the show. That's what I love about them. <3

Fr 💀

rewatching season one really makes me see how will's right, mike is the heart.

he's the one who insisted to look for will to hopper.

he's the one who convinced lucas, and dustin by proxy, to ignore the adults and look for will.

he is the one who brings up the fact that el is scared and hurt while lucas and dustin are yelling.

all these examples are within ep 1 and the first fourty seconds of episode two. mike was always the heart. he just lost his way after outside expectations. at the end of the day, he is the care and love and protection of the group.

of course mike is going to date el even if it doesn't make him happy. of course he's going to conform to ideals of the outside world. all he wants are for his friends to be happy, so he'll conform to the expectations of what the outside world says he should want, what his friends think he wants, what el wants. fuck, even what he thinks will wants, since the painting. he is the perfect victim for comphet, because it was never about him. it was always about his friends.

it’s been a year, mike. (MAJOR BYLER REVELATION INCOMING---MUST READ)

mike and will constantly saying "a year" or "all year" when talking about the time since the move when it's only been six months keeps me up at night

i saw people talking about how they say a year when it was only 6 months because they’re idiots in love and are being dramatic. as cute as that is, i didn’t really buy it until RIGHT NOW. i just saw it as a cute headcanon, but now i see that the writers could be enabling you to make this realization by use of subtext.

allow me to explain

^ these are the three times they say it

at first i thought the writers may have just used year because that’s less confusing for the audience because 1 year time jumps have been used before in stranger things and are super popular in books/movies/tv shows. BUT, it clicked for me that that doesn’t make sense. the timeline in stranger things has always been acknowledged. throughout s1 we hear the amount of time will has been missing several times (as far as i remember). in s2, mike counted the days el had been gone. he called her every night for 353 days. when el and hopper argue in s2, el uses specific numbers to tell us how long she’s really been with him. in s3 hopper specifically says ‘6 long months’ when talking about how long he’s been dealing with mike (lol). that's the same amount of time between s3 & s4, yet mike and will don't say 6 months, they say year. there’s a date at the start of every season. and in s4, el says this in her letter to mike. 

185 days = 6 months (almost on the dot)

the writers have specifically told us how long it’s been since they moved, down to the amount of days. and it’s 6 months, not a year. this makes it very hard for me to write off mike and will saying ‘year’ as just the writers slipping up. also in el’s letter, she says this:

this is INSANE. 

mike and will are saying the wrong amount of time. the writers aren’t stupid, they know how much time has passed since season 3. THEY WROTE IT. i’m a writer as well, and i know how much time is passing between what im writing because I CREATED IT. IT CAME FROM MY BRAIN. and like i said, the stranger things writers have proven to be very keen on dates and time. all of this happening in the same season is not a slip up, its on purpose. stranger things 4 had a 30 million dollar budget PER EPISODE. do the math--that’s 270 MILLION DOLLARS. and yes, i know they supposedly forgot will’s birthday, but that’s different. his birthday is a date that was mentioned one time and served no purpose aside from creating emotional tension in that one scene. none of their birthdays are important to the plot, hell, will’s is the only one mentioned in the show and it wasn’t even on his birthday. one date that was mentioned one time and never brought up again is NOT the same as continuous attention given to timelines/time jumps over the course of all four seasons. and some fans theorize that they’re lying about forgetting his birthday anyway. either way, its not the same.  

so....the writers want us to know that emotions can make time speed up or slow down....and that el’s week has felt very fast because of her emotions....and then show us mike and will SPECIFICALLY deviating from the timeline established in the SECOND LINE OF EPISODE ONE “yeah, but you knew she was having problems for months and didn’t tell me.” “its been six months, mike.”, or “it’s been months, mike.” or not even including that line at all, or “the past couple months have been weird” would’ve worked and stayed in check with the timeline we’ve already established. but when writing those scenes, they chose to say year. which is flat out wrong and way off from the actual time they’ve been apart. 

and what did el say makes time speed up or slow down? emotions? oh, okay got it 

the first two times mike and will say it’s been a year are in the same scene: the rink o mania fight. emotions are high. they’re in a pretty serious fight. its not about something dumb, it’s about their ten year friendship and how they’ve grown apart. their friendship is VERY important to both of them. (remember when mike said asking will to be his friend is the best thing he’s ever done?) the third time it’s said is when mike is opening up to will in episode 4. it’s a very emotional scene. mike is being honest and vulnerable with his feelings. in this conversation he apologizes and admits that will didn’t deserve how mike had been treating him, which mike never does to anyone else. he admits his relationship with will is different and home isn’t the same without him, and that he feels like he lost will and wants to be best friends again. 

and the obvious: emotions making time speed up or slow down doesn’t just apply to in the heat of the moment occasions. (in theory) mike and will are in love. the six months they’ve been separated felt like a year to them because of their emotions, just like el said in the letter. and mind you, will is canonically in love with mike, yet they’re both acting the same way about this. it’s not just will. it makes sense for six months to feel like a year to will because of his emotions, because he is in love with mike, right? well, mike feels the exact same way. this isnt even about the characters as people. narratively speaking, mike and will both doing this doesn’t make sense if it’s unrequited. one way writers show how characters aren’t on the same page about something, a relationship for instance, is whether they’re on the same emotional page about different plot points. something major and emotional happens to all the characters---now we watch how they react to it. and i don’t mean small disagreements & such, characters are allowed to feel differently about things. i mainly mean when whatever happened is painful and important to one or more of the characters. for example, steve and nancy. steve and nancy didn’t feel the same about barb, barb’s parents, and everything that happened in general. steve wanted to keep on like nothing happened while nancy was literally eaten up with grief, guilt, and trauma. jonathan was the one who was on the same page as her and made her feel better about carrying that baggage around all the time. they understood each other. and who was nancy in love with? jonathan. narratively, that makes perfect sense and even further sways the audience into understanding they’re in love.

so...what? the emotions that made mike and will’s six months apart feel like a year to them is....friendship? not a fucking chance. mike and el are a couple, and according to mileven fans, they’re the main couple of the show who are in love and are going to be an endgame couple. why save this incredibly romantic coded trope for will and mike, the best platonic bros? idk, you tell me. and the fact that the line about emotions came from someone in the love triangle?? and it was said to someone else in the love triangle?? not a coincidence.

edit: someone reblogged and pointed out how el said 185 in her letter to mike that we SEE him reading. there is no reason for him not to know how long it's been. so either he isn't paying attention to a damn thing el says in her letters or he is just extremely in love with will

another edit: i keep seeing reblogs of people saying they're probably referring to the time since mike and el started dating, which i used to think too. but the context when mike and will say a year makes it hard for me to believe.

"but you knew she was having trouble for like a year and you didn't tell me"

here mike is specifically talking about el's bullying problem which has only been going on since the byers have been gone and she enrolled in school. what he's talking about is something very strictly related to the time since they moved, and it's been six months, not a year.

"you called maybe a couple times. it's been a year, mike. meanwhile el has like a book of letters from you."

will is again, very specifically talking about something that strictly happened between the time since the byers left and the start of s4. he's saying how crazy it is that it's been a whole year and mike has barely called. but it hasn't been a year, it's only been six months.

"the last year has been weird, you know? and you know, max and lucas and dustin, they're great, they're great, it's just..it's hawkins it's not the same without you. and i feel like maybe i was worrying too much about el...i don't know maybe i feel like i lost you or something."

this one i will cut some slack, i think he could be talking about literally the last year, as in since the beginning of 1985. but immediately after he starts saying how home hasn't been the same without will (and separates his relationship with will as being different than his relationship with max dustin and lucas and even el), something specific to the time since they byers have been gone, six months, not a year:

in conclusion: mike and will referring to their time apart as a year when it’s only been six months is not a mishap on the writer’s part. they go out of their way to make sure you know exactly how much time has passed, down to the number of days, and they put this much attention on time in every season. and in the same season mike and will do this, there is a line in the SECOND LINE OF THE OPENING SCENE OF THE SEASON about emotions making time go by faster or slower.

byler is going to be a s5 surprise, but its not coming out of nowhere. there’s piles of subtext in every single season---enough that when you look back, it all makes sense. small details like this aren’t outlandish because this is without a doubt the length writers will go to keep something hidden, and in byler’s case and many other tv show plots case, to keep something a surprise. and for christ’s sake, WATCH THE SHOW! the amount of attention to even the TINIEST details in stranger things is insane. they put so much thought into everything---not just ships, and not just byler. idk how many times the writers are going to have to say details matter and that there are no coincidences until people believe them. 

anyways, byler is endgame. thanks for reading :) 

byler shippers 🤝 mileven shippers 🤝 jancy shippers 🤝 stancy shippers 🤝 steddie shippers 🤝 ronance shippers 🤝 elmax shippers 🤝 lumax shippers 🤝 multi shippers 🤝 the universe

loving jopper

"but they've been building up mileven for 4 seasons!" my brother in christ. el got attached to mike cause he was the first guy her age that she met after she ran away and el was the first girl who showed any signs of any kind of interest in mike and mike felt like he had to have a girlfriend or he wouldn't be "normal". hell, even ted knows mike has zero interest in girls (”our son with a girl?” ), mileven was so forced it's crazy. they were kids who kissed a WEEK after they met because they felt like they had to, at least mike did cause el didn't even understand what the fuck love is. she didn't even have time to understand herself before understanding relationships with mileven being so rushed. it was not love at first sight, mike was ready to send her back where she came from right after she took them to will. mike's life DID NOT start the day he met her in the woods, he was there to find will in the first place. and when they found "will's" body? he literally almost spat in her face screaming ”what is wrong with you?”. and now when they're older, they still don't work. they don't understand each other, they're not giving each other what they deserve, they're making each other feel like they're in a room with no exit. mileven is toxic as a couple and they're SO much better as friends. i rest my case

No but like El will be happy about Byler. Like actually happy, not just okay with it. It's not just her who doesn't "get" Mike and his nerdiness and need to be the hero, it's also Mike who doesn't understand the depths of El's humanity despite being a "superhero" and all of the trauma she deals with and has yet to work through. Her uniquely feminine experience and all of the challenges and milestones that come alongside maturing as a young woman, which is something that Max understands perfectly well, and this is the reason why El has begun to prioritize her friendship with Max over her relationship with Mike. El knows in her heart that she and Mike are already doomed romantically, I just think she was in denial about it until Mike's monologue. The only fear both El and Mike have now is that the absence of romance from their relationship means there won't be a relationship period i.e. they are destined to lose each other. For El, knowing and understanding that Mike is gay and in love with someone else and literally CAN'T be with her romantically will be the biggest signifier that they were never going to be able to hold onto that romance in the first place. Now they can work on being friends. If anything it's Will who's going to struggle to be with Mike in light of the guilt he will feel from "stealing" Mike from El, and I wouldn't be surprised if El is going to be the one to ultimately push Will towards Mike and encourage the two of them to be together.

idk what you guys are talking about, giving your best friend that you’re in love with relationship advice and then crying in the car right next to them afterwards IS flawless representation

If Mileven and Stancy have 1000 haters, Max and Billy are two of them. If Mileven and Stancy have 100 haters, Max and Billy are two of them. If Mileven and Stancy have 2 haters, they are Max and Billy. If Mileven and Stancy have 0 haters, that means that Max and Billy are dead.

Ok, since you were friendly with bylers, I want to actually know your own interpretation from some scenes that we as bylers sometimes use as bylers proofs, but mileven ones.

*I am just asking this on anon because the last time I tried to be friendly with a mileven off anon and just ask something, I received a wave of hate from a lot of milevens on my asks*

Ok, your thoughts about:

Mike claiming that his relationship with El is love at first sight, when the duffers made clear that they don't believe in it and they made fun of that trope with Argyle and Eden (while Mike is really annoyed by it behind them)

What do you think about the difference between mileven break up scene and byler rain fight, with Will being devastated and El hanging out and being really happy with Max after. Why do you think they decided to joke about it even when all other couples that broke up had been taken serious, like stancy.

About the fact that they made Max assure El that Mike would be at her door crying for forgiveness and at the same episode Mike goes to Will's door instead to scream "I'm sorry" and actually accepting that what he said to Will was wrong instead of blaming other as he did to El ("Max corrupting her" instead of understanding that she is mad because he lied).

Are you satisfied with the fact that the duffers used Will's feelings to save Mike and Els relationship?

The fact that El NEVER once said something that she likes about Mike or complimented him or tried to know what he likes or his interests, what leads to Mike to think that to her, he is just a random nerd and she is going to leave him for whatever reason (his words before Will's speech to him)

The fact that for some reason, Mike hides from Will what's the real problem in their relationship and says to Will that he need to say something but if he said "that thing" he would lose El, even tho he just needs to say "ily" and there is no reason to believe he is going to lose her, since she asked him for it.

Why do you think Mike acted the way he did with Will at the airport if it's confirmed that Mike don't know and don't even suspects that Will is gay nor in love with him?

What do you think about the writers choice to have a focus on Els memories with Max with Max saying "there is more to life than stupid boys" right after the monologue and El and Mike aren't talking after what's suppose to save their their relationship problems.

There are more things I would like to ad but those ones I really want to know what you think. I'm asking you this because you look like you are going to awser seriously without being bitter about it. Also, if you want to know bylers thoughts about all of this, let me know, I would explain to you our interpretation of it.

(I'm sorry you've gotten hate from people, that sucks.)

1) I don't know if it was actually love at first sight, I think Mike just said that because he was trying to say anything to save El. I do think he truly loves her, but he fell in love with her more gradually throughout season 1, not at first sight. And in hindsight, sometimes when you really love someone, it feels like it was immediately when you met them even if it wasn't. So Mike might have just felt like he loved her immediately and said it that way in a high pressure situation, that doesn't mean it's completely accurate to what actually happened, memories can be unreliable too. And the Duffers say lots of things, and sometimes they are inconsistent. That happens, they're human. Also, where's the proof that they said this? I think you're probably talking about that tweet with "wrong answers only", but how do you know the Duffers wrote it and not a different employee who believes differently than them? And I don't think Argyle and Eden were making fun of the trope, they hooked up. Even if it was meant to make fun of the trope, that doesn't make it untrue for Mileven. But like I said before, I do think he was being hyperbolic.

2) I think it was because they were more making fun of Mike specifically than Mileven/their relationship. And S3 was playing on the summer blockbuster sort of thing, so it was kind of different than the other seasons. And the rain fight was probably from Will's perspective, and so it was trying to portray how he was feeling. Mike was caught off guard by El dumping him and probably didn't really believe it at first, but Will believed everything Mike said and took it to heart. So I think that's the difference. Additionally, the Mileven breakup wasn't meant to be serious because they just got back together later that season, and still obviously liked each other while broken up, wanting to get back together. The break up wasn't serious because it wasn't supposed to be taken seriously, they still acted like a couple and loved each other, and they got back together pretty quickly.

3) Again, because the break up wasn't serious, they both knew they would get back together. And Mike did apologize to El and tell her the truth later, he was just scared because Hopper literally threatened him. What was he supposed to do when a grown man threatened him? And of course Mike went after Will because he was visibly upset. El ran off giggling with Max, and Mike was surprised and confused about what was happening, so he needed some time to process it and vent to his friends. The urgency in the scenes are completely different. Mike could tell he really hurt Will, but El was fine, so why would he run after her? They were different circumstances, so I don't think it's really fair to compare them.

4) Yeah, I think it makes sense for the time period. He substituted El's name in place of his to be able to get out his feelings without outing himself. He doesn't know how people might react to finding out about his sexuality, it's the 80s, the height of the AIDS epidemic, he's scared. He just needed to get closure somehow, knowing Mike will never feel the same way about him, in a way that didn't possibly risk his safety. And *Will* didn't fix their relationship, he didn't know what Mike was going to say to El, he just tried to boost his confidence a bit. Everything Mike said to El was his own feelings, and repairing what happened in the Mileven fight earlier that season. Will had no idea what the problem between them was, so he couldn't have directly fixed it, and he didn't, he just helped a tiny bit, like any friend would. So yeah, I think the way it was written makes complete sense.

5) I think when we see them in the show they have a lot going on dealing with all the Upsidedown plot related issues, is there really a good moment for her to start listing everything she likes about him? They're going through literal hell, so of course they aren't just spending time complimenting each other. She said she loves him, he should know that without being given a list of her favourite qualities about him.

6) Mike was scared of losing El, and maybe worried if he said the problem out loud, that would make it feel more real. Will isn't entitled to any information that Mike isn't comfortable sharing with him, and they had drifted apart a lot since S3. Mike is just a 15 year old boy, not all of his decisions necessarily make perfect sense, he wasn't comfortable telling anyone, he struggles to express his feelings.

7) Because they hadn't seen each other in so long, and barely kept in touch. It would be pretty awkward seeing an old friend again after months of trying to call them and not having them reach out. Will could have called Mike, but he didn't, so they drifted apart. Their connection is just a lot weaker than it used to be because of all the things they've been dealing with. Being awkward around a friend you haven't had contact with for a long time is completely normal.

8) That scene was about Max and El specifically, so of course it focused on them. And that line was about how platonic relationships are just as important as romantic ones, they don't have to be mutually exclusive, El can have both kinds, and both are important. Romantic relationships aren't better than friendships, they're equally as valuable, both kinds of love matter and can make El's powers stronger. And Mike and El were talking a little after, he was the only person she talked to at all, so clearly she feels safe to open up to him after all the traumatic stuff she just went through.

So those are my thoughts and interpretations, I don't think any of those events in the show proves anything about Byler.

"you're basically saying disabled people can't be in relationships!! you're ableist!!!" no i'm not you dumb fuck i'm saying a girl who's been a LAB RAT and ISOLATED FROM SOCIETY since she was born until she was TWELVE shouldn't be thrown into a lifelong relationship with a kid she just met a WEEK after she escaped from the lab when she could BARELY SPEAK and didn't know what a the word "FRIEND" MEANT

torn between the knowledge that the endgame couples don’t say i love you and the desperate need for will to hear mike say he loves him outright after so many years of pining.

will could not make it any more obvious come on michael get your head in the game

Capcut template bc I have no life😽!!

stranger things fandom: *headcanons characters as members of the lgbtq+ community*

comments: but 😥 you cant make them all gay 😍🏳️‍🌈😘 its the 80s 😄😳

stranger things fandom: okay. modern au.

comments: BUT- BUT- BUT-