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felikatze · 4 months

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THE ISLANDER EUPHRASIE THEORY: THE CRACK HEADCANON THAT RUINED ME FOREVER

HI. you might know me as the kingphie divorce guy. or as the guy who wrote the 6k ludonarrative essay. Today i am going to introduce to YOU @the-bitter-ocean's fantabulous ISLANDER EUPHRASIE THEORY!!!

DISCLAIMER

This post contains SPOILERS for ALL of In Stars and Time. INCLUDING THE ACT 6 SECRET!!

You have been warned.

ALSO!!!!

The original headcanon/theory is VERY MUCH Ocean's fantastic work! I am merely rehashing all the arguments for it that have been laid out across various chats into one cohesive thing people can look at. Also citations! Who doesn't love those.

WHAT IS IT?

Well, it's quite simple. It's the theory that Euphrasie, love of my life and Head Housemaiden of Dormont, is from the forgotten island, same as Siffrin and the King.

(Yes, this is why divorce AU exists.)

WHY DO YOU EVEN BELIEVE THIS?

Quite a lot of reasons, actually.

It's really funny

Let us begin with: the basics.

SUPERFLOUS AESTHETIC DETAIL

HAIR COLOR

This is Euphrasie. She's very pretty. I love her.

You might notice several things about her, like her fantabulous white hair.

Well. What other characters have white hair?

You have guessed correctly. The ONLY OTHER white haired characters with actual artwork are Siffrin and the King, both from The Island The World Forgot. Thus we can assume that it's a typical hair color for islanders. Makes it stand out very much that Euphie also has it.

(What about the beautiful one- sh sh sh he's blonde. He's blonde.) (Well, actually, considering that they are the only one who acknowledges that Vaugardians are also weird, what if he's from the island as well? Checkmate atheists.)

EYELASHES

Correct. Eyelashes.

Going back to our portrait of Euphie, she is drawn with precisely three eyelashes. Why is this notable? Because Siffrin and Loop are.

So much so, that being drawn with three eyelashes, is specifically an element of foreshadowing to Loop's true identity.

(squints at character portraits) literally no characters besides Siffrin, Loop, and Euphrasie have eyelashes? Oh my god. What? Nobody has eyelashes? What the fuck? (okay, some moments later: Mirabelle has eyelashes in some battle artwork, but these three are the only ones specifically with eyelashes in dialogue portraits, which is still incredibly odd.)

SPEAKING HABITS

Hey, so, you know when you talk to people in Dormont, a lot of the NPCS will have a nametag that just says "[something] One" right? Daydreaming One, Castle-Loving One, Beautiful One?

And I've seen people wonder, are these titles? Nicknames?

And I bring you this: Siffrin addresses these people with these epithets in his head, because they have no fucking clue what anyone's name is.

So Siffrin just naturally lapses into this style of nicknaming strangers.

Which two other people also do.

Bright one... ...... Do you remember? Traveling one! Are you done talking with your companions? Yes, wonderful, wonderful!

Funny little tidbit that these three characters all speak alike isn't it :)

Okay. With aesthetics out of the way, let's move onto the next tier of this iceberg:

THE MECHANICS OF FORGETTING AND BEING FORGOTTEN

I realize in the process of writing that we must outline the nature of the curse. What gets forgotten and what gets to stay?

The particularity that's important to us right now is: what people get forgotten?

All evidence points toward this: an entire person is only forgotten if they were physically present on the island when it vanished.

I'm pulling up two example cases to prove it: Siffrin and the Daydreaming One.

The thing with Siffrin is: we know he witnessed the exact moment the island vanished. And, very notably, Siffrin was in a boat.

You can get the dialogue that proves this only in ACT 2 in a secret room most people don't find on their first playthroughs, which is both very funny and very evil. Here's the dialogue.

Siffrin: "I ran away from home once!" [...] Siffrin: "And so I took our boat! Got to the beach, rowed away from the shore a bit. I was going to come back right away, I just wanted to scare my parents a bit!" [...]

Siffrin: "I started to row back towards the shore... And then, I... I... ..." Isabeau: ... Sif? Siffrin: (Woah! What?) "Um, yes?" Isabeau: Um... You were telling us how you ran away from home? Siffrin: "I... was?" Odile: You... Were. Bonnie: DID YOU FORGET WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT WHILE TALKING ABOUT IT?!?

Siffrin is from the island, but was not physically present when it disappeared. This resulted in Siffrin forgetting their entire identity, including given name and spoken/written language.

Additionally, this is confirmed via Word of God to be the exact moment the island disappeared, so here's proof I'm not reading into it:

Shoutout to bibliomaniac's insane google spreadsheet for the easily searchable screenshot. god bless. Brinny, ily.

On the other hand, with the Daydreaming One, we have proof of a person who is not originally from the island, but was physically on it at the time of disappearance.

Siffrin: "Don't you have a sister?" Daydreaming One: I... I don't? I just said I'm an only child, silly!

(For her to forget someone like her sister, so easily... Her sister must've traveled to...)

Secondly, we know that remnants of the island were not completely forgotten immediately.

Memory faded gradually, starting with the ability to still speak and think about it with accompanying headaches, until it ramped up in intensity and everything is simply gone.

The Sparkling Diary in the library is more or less proof. Memory of the island was gone, but... people still remembered that they forgot something. People still knew what they were talking about, (an island north of Vaugarde), just without the specifics.

"Urgh. Also, Dad noticed no one can say the name of the island north of here anymore?" "I tried to say it yesterday and I got like the WEIRDEST headache for HOURS."

And Odile also remarks the following

Odile: We also know that people could remember that country clearly, before.

This will be relevant later. Moving on.

CONTRIVANCES

THE HOUSE'S OBSERVATORY

SO. The House of Change of Dormont has this funny little room on the third floor. It's an observatory. To look at stars with. When entering this room for the first time, Mirabelle says this:

Mirabelle: What...? Was there a room like this in the House? Y-yeah, I remember! Someone was working here... Studying... They looked like... ... Um... Sorry, I can't remember.

This reveals to us several things:

This room is innate to the House, and not brought here by the King's weird redecorating

Someone from the House was using it for study

All memory of who or what was studying and being studied was erased alongside the island's existence

Of course we can say, "yo, what if Euphrasie was using this room and just forgot?" but that is. a headcanon. I ADMIT! It is a stipulation

However, I find the general presence of the Island written all over the House incredibly interesting.

Inside the Observatory, there's a pile of papers with messy handwriting. You can't read these in until ACT 4. Even in ACT 4, you can't read them. But you do learn what's written on them.

(A pile of papers.) (It looks like someone was trying to write your country's name.)

Inside the observatory is also a globe. Upon repeated interaction in... act 4, i think, you get this:

(You see a spot on the globe where the paint has started wearing out, like someone kept dragging their finger on it.) (You drag your finger there too.) (Erased. You almost want to look for lightless paint.)

BOOKS

During the various quests to discover the truth of the loops, you run into a lot of books, written in the forgotten language. Now, Dormont is not close to the island. Dormont is not close to the coast.

Bambouche is. That's why Bonnie has heard about the island before and knows it was a big deal - they lived really close to it.

Bonnie (and then1): I think, I think my village was really close to it!!! My sister said it was all everyone could talk about for weeks!!! Mirabelle (anxious1): That's so frightening... I'm glad that whatever happened, she didn't get caught up in it!

As we can see in this map, Dormont is in the southern half of the country, and very centrally at that, meaning it has basically maximum distance from all waters and ports. So why does this landlocked small town have so many books in this language?

These aren't just dry books, either. In Dormont's library, there's actually a translated version of volume 2 of The Cursing of Chateau Castle.

(You take the book out again.) (You can read its title, now...) (Your heart is beating, badump, badump, badump.) (It's...) (... A translated copy of "The Cursing of Château Castle", issue #2.) (You start laughing.)

CONCLUSION OF THIS SECTION

Islanders lived in Dormont. Maybe even multiple! We've established that whoever is in Dormont when it vanished would not simply disapper, instead

they forgot where they're from.

One day, the islanders in Dormont could no longer remember being anywhere but Dormont. Being anything but Vaugardian. The observatory fell into disuse, as the person studying there gradually forgot what they used it for, even as they desparately tried to hold onto it, boring holes into the globe, and scribbling its name over and over until its unintelligible.

And, in all likelihood, eventually that knowledge was just gone forever. They simply became part of Dormont, none the wiser to their own history.

Books slipped into cracks. Rooms fell into disuse. Nobody remembered to clean out the remnants.

Now. The real cinch of this.

Why, in particular, do I think Euphrasie is one of them?

Answer me this, then.

How does Euphie know what Wish Craft is?

1. How could she read it?

Euphrasie knew specifically that Wish Craft exists, when all books on it are written in a language nobody can read.

The book in the storage room? The diary in the room behind the star door? The book in the secret library? None of them are legible.

There are no legible records of Wish Craft.

2. What about the Favor Tree?

Euphrasie knew specifically that Wish Craft is related to the Favor Tree. It's also a Vaugardian practice to make requests of the Favor Tree, but they're just that - requests. Nobody thinks they actually have power.

Only Euphrasie does. She thinks it's the key to defeating the King.

(This is... A list of people who wished to save Vaugarde!!!) (You look around her desk, trying to find out more.) (Why would she record the people who wished to save Vaugarde?) (... There!!!) (It's a little notebook, jammed between random boring paperwork...) (In it, the Head Housemaiden talks about Wish Craft... How in the days before the King attacked, she noticed everyone was wishing to the Favor Tree for the same thing:) (To save Vaugarde.) (And she started wondering if this wish could be the key to the King's defeat, somehow...) (So the Head Housemaiden knew about Wish Craft!!!)

Except, when Isabeau talks about it...

Isabeau: Well, it's just a random big tree. But when you're a believer of the House of Change, the biggest tree in a certain place is called a Favor Tree! It's like, it’s the tree with the most power, so you can ask it things? As a favor?

He struggles a little to explain it. Almost, as though the tradition came from some other culture, imported into Vaugarde, and no one can definetely remember where it came from.

To note, here, is that the Favor Tree is hugely associated with Loop, and wishes in general. Wishing on a Favor Tree is such a hugely powerful ritual when executed correctly, that it caused the entire timeloops.

And I'm not even gonna break out citations to prove that Wish Craft is associated with the island. Come on. You know that. You played the game. It's required to beat the game.

If you haven't beaten the game, what the fuck are you doing here. Go back and play it, baka.

3. Something's breaking, failing, rotting

At the end of ACT 4, when Siffrin confronts Euphrasie about her knowledge of Wish Craft, Euphrasie is distinctly aware of this: the people of Vaugarde are wishing wrong.

It's true. All of Vaugarde wished to the Favor Tree, wished for us to be saved. We wished for a savior. A way for us to win against the King. And Wish Craft gave us the means to do it, didn't it? Made sure it'd work? [...] But... But something went wrong, didn't it? Something goes wrong, every time!!! [...] The only answer I can find... Is it's because we did it wrong. I don't know what happened But we must've done it wrong!!! None of us in Vaugarde knew the exact ritual, but-- But we must have done it so wrong, it broke, and it doesn't answer to us at all anymore!!! [...] I don't know, I don't know, I don't know!!!

There's only one person who knew how to make a Wish correctly. And he made it by sheer instinct. Something they could not place even if they tried. Just... a forgotten ritual, dredged back up by muscle memory. Something he's probably been doing since he's a little kid, something that's so backed into their habits they use Wish Craft to carve figurines out of wood.

To end, I leave you with this. Dialogue you get when you try to talk to Euphrasie again, before you talked to everybody else.

If you talk to me... REALLY talk to me... It's all over. What "it" is, I have no idea... I know... I can feel that... I couldn't change whatever comes next, even if I wanted to. But I know it is the will of the Change God. Or, no, perhaps... The will of something even bigger... ... Something will end, once you talk to me.

There is a way for Euphrasie to know all of this. To know Wish Craft exists, to be aware she's doing it wrong, but not knowing, remembering quite enough to get it right.

If she knew it all beforehand already.

#Feli speaks #in stars and time #isat spoilers #isat #euphrasie isat #head housemaiden #ALL THE TAGS. I NEED PEOPLE TO LOOK AT THIS. PLEASE. IT'S 1:30 IN THE MORNING.#i spent two hours on this i think

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staliaqueen · 2 months

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I rewatched The Avatar and the Fire Lord a few days ago, and god, what a good episode. Revealing that Zuko is a descendant of both Sozin and Roku was a genius move (and that's not even getting into the Zuko/Aang parallels of it all). But there's something the show doesn't seem to think of, and that I haven't seen anyone in the fandom discuss either �� the fact that Zuko isn't the only one descendant from both these men. Azula is, too.

The conclusion of this story that Iroh presents to Zuko at the end of the episode is that he alone — because of his lineage from both men the war was started from — is uniquely capable of cleansing the sins of his family and the fire nation and bringing peace to the world. But, the thing is, there's two sides of this conflict, and therefor two sides to its legacy. The external and the personal. The legacy of the external is the war, but the legacy of the personal is the sibling rivalries that kept repeating through generations of the royal family.

Though Roku and Sozin were not actually related, they were childhood friends as close as siblings and fucking shared a birthday, so the symbolism works. We know very little about Azulon's childhood or if he even had any direct sibling rivalries like this at all, but from what I can find on his wiki page, we know that Sozin favoured him over "other family" (I'm assuming his siblings). What we know very well, however, is what happened in the next generation between Iroh and Ozai. We know Azulon favoured Iroh over Ozai, and that this likely is the initial source of their hatred for each other, which resulted in perhaps the worst sibling rivalry of them all (what with the indirect patricide and throne stealing).

Then we go on to Zuko and Azula, whose upbringing kept going in the same patterns, but the key difference is them being the first ones to both be descendant from the men who started it all. If Zuko having this lineage makes him uniquely capable of ending the cycle of war in his country and restoring balance to the world, shouldn't that mean that both he and Azula having this lineage makes them uniquely capable of ending the cycle of brutal sibling rivalries and restoring balance to their family?

This conclusion I've presented seems to fit perfectly with the lesson Aang draws from the same story as well:

"Roku was just as much Fire Nation as Sozin was, right? If anything, their story proves that anyone's capable of great good and great evil. Everyone, even the Fire Lord and the Fire Nation, have to be treated like they're worth giving a chance."

I know this is supposed to be foreshadowing to Aang refusing to kill Ozai later, but I can't help but think it's even more applicable to fourteen year old Azula. It's really so ironic that the show runners thought Azula deserved what she got when their own show seems to be telling them that Zuko mending his relationship with her is what he ultimately should've done.

But, then again... that does sort of make her the perfect tragedy.

#meta #azula #princess azula #zuko #prince zuko #zuko x azula #avatar the last airbender #atla #avatar meta #avatar the last airbender meta #atla meta #uncle iroh #fire lord ozai #fire lord azulon #fire lord sozin #avatar roku #i LOVE tragic siblings have i mentioned this before?#also can't wait for this either to get 0 notes or invite a bunch of brain dead angry replies #it's pretty much either or for me in this fandom

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great-axepectations · 1 year

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Imagine you watch these family friendly minecraft youtubers. Not necessarily for children, but it's wholesome entertainment for all ages. Then they say "hey, we're going to start a quick little hardcore series! Three lives and you're out!" And you think "ok yeah this sounds fun, I'll watch it."

And it is silly goofy funtimes! The first death is hilarious, and it's still the good clean fun you're used to. As it goes on, the dynamics between characters are getting interesting and more people are losing lives but it's still lighthearted fun.

AND THEN SUDDENLY IT'S GAME OF THRONES

Loyalty is sworn through blood oaths. Armies are assembled. There are epic large-scale battles. People are dying off for real and it's actually really impactful. One of them is roleplaying his grief so convincingly that his friends think something is wrong irl. There are deep, heart-wrenching betrayals that players are actually devastated by. None of this is scripted, by the way. All of the character arcs, narrative foils, and foreshadowing was completely organic and by accident.

AND THEN THE ENDING

So you know at the end of the first Hunger Games book where the two who have been together from the beginning have won, and the megalomaniacal evil game runners expect them to kill each other, but they find a way out of it? Instead of the game runners demanding they kill each other, it's the ghosts of all of their dead friends and enemies screaming for their blood. And instead of finding a way out of it, the last two go back to the burned-out remains of their home and reluctantly punch each other to death. And the whole time they're laughing and crying and apologizing to each other, and the winner is immediately so overcome with grief that he throws himself off a cliff to his death.

AND THEN THEY ALL GO BACK TO MAKING THEIR WHOLESOME FAMILY-FRIENDLY MINECRAFT CONTENT

LIKE SORRY I'M SUPPOSED TO BE NORMAL AFTER THAT???

#I wrote this because I heard some people didn't watch 3rd life live so I wanted to sum up the experience #or to explain it to a complete outsider #3rd life smp #3rd life #trafficblr

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prince-kallisto · 8 months

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Vil, Meleanor, and the Virgin Mary: Crowley’s Obsession

I haven’t seen anyone talk about this, but it’s driving me insane: Vil and Meleanor’s design parallel each other SO MUCH that it’s not even funny. In fact, I think Vil is foreshadowing EVERYTHING about Meleanor’s fate and Crowley’s plans.

I know I’m just coping lol, but I think I finally figured out why Crowley is so obsessed with the Fairest Queen and Pomefiore if he was Levan. Here me out: Vil is the representation of Meleanor.

Vil’s Overblot form is what immediately caught my attention. The way his cape connects to his hands, the night sky on his cape, the corset and the gems. The way the edges of his dress looks like old, torn paper, like history long since forgotten. Not to mention how he has claws like Crowley and is wearing Crowley’s same exact shade of blue. Just…this entire silhouette with the sleeves and crown matches Meleanor more than Malleus’s Overblot does. Strange how both Vil and Meleanor are associated with stars, when Crowley has a lot of star designs on the curtains in his office.

In his dorm uniform, look how the gloves and the lace has a similar design as Meleanor’s. Not to mention how in this vignette, Vil is like a “Queen reborn” with “two knights” at his side. Hm?? Like Meleanor with Lilia and Baul, perhaps?

Something I’ve always found strange is how much Crowley dotes on Vil. In both his history and flight lessons, Vil comments a lot on Crowley when a Special Lesson is triggered. Doesn’t it feel…almost uncomfortable??? Vil feeling “eyes” on him specifically when Crowley is there. And there isn’t clarification if Vil is speaking to Yuu or Crowley, but when he says “I’m just fine,” it makes me wonder if Crowley was asking Vil how he was doing.

This isn’t just limited to the lessons. Although Crowley played a less significant role in Book 5 than I thought he would, doesn’t he sound very affectionate when he says this?? “What I’ve always taken you for”…he holds great pride in Vil and how represents the history and beauty of Pomefiore. Crowley has NEVER shown this much of a bias towards any student before. Only Vil.

I can hear some of you asking: Why in the world would Crowley/Levan care so much about Vil if MALLEUS and DIASOMNIA exists? Here’s the thing: Vil simply represents more of who Meleanor was as an evil, proud princess.

He is proud, he is beautiful, he truly understands the power of his beauty, how to make people submit to him with harsh truths. He has a certain charm and pride in his accomplishments that Malleus doesn’t.

But what REALLY got me was the religious symbolism in Vil’s Overblot form. @pianostarinwonderland made a really amazing post on the resemblances Vil has to the Virgin Mary and the Lady of Sorrows.

The Lady of Sorrows is another “form” of the Virgin Mary- which ironically enough, is depicted with SEVEN swords piercing her HEART. Sometimes she is depicted with only one sword- more on that later. The Virgin Mary is considered to be the holiest of saints- a figure of worship. She is also considered to be the “god-bearer.” Her death is referred to as the Dormition of the Mother of God, Aka the “falling asleep of the god-bearer.”

And back to the swords in her heart, the seven swords represent the Seven Sorrows, but the singular sword represents the Prophecy of Simeon.

The prophecy of Simeon said something like Mary’s child would be the RISE and FALL of many in Israel, and that a sword would pierce through Mary’s heart too, as an allusion to the crucifixion. Because Mary would suffer alongside her son, the one curse of motherhood. Stars are also significant in Christian mythology, like the star of Bethlehem to guide the wise men to the birthplace of Mary’s child. Another significant “star” is the Morning Star, Aka Lucifer. The Morning Star title is based off Venus, whose Greek name means “the light bringer” or “the DAWN bringer.”

If all of these things I’m saying reminds you about the imagery in TWST, I feel like this is purposeful! Lets back up and go over each of these points and how it relates to TWST (I am not religious, so if any of this is inaccurate, please let me know!)

Crowley in the opening seems to worship his “benefactor,” and I’ve been theorizing that it’s Meleanor whose trapped in the Dark Mirror. She is quite literally a figure of worship to him- the holiest of saints. And with Meleanor being the mother of Malleus, who is one of the most powerful mages in the world, doesn’t it sound similar to be a “god-bearer?”

The swords through her heart not only sounds like a connection to Meleanor’s death, but to Maleficent’s too. The sword of truth piercing her heart- but not only that, Vil’s Overblot crown LITERALLY has the design of a singular sword piercing through a heart. Yes, its a representation of the Evil Queen demanding Snow Whites heart, but why is Vil’s design combined with the Virgin Mary of all figures??

I bolded “prophecy” because I think Levan is heavily connected to prophetic powers, but doesn’t this prophecy sound A LOT like Meleanor’s blessing on Malleus? Malleus would be the benevolent star to the Fae, and an evil star to humankind. Like the Star of Bethlehem for the Fae, and the Morning Star for humans…and the Morning Star is heavily connected to the DAWN. Dawn Knight? Silver???

It doesn’t help that Dragon Fae seem to be ostracized by humans for their horns. Maleficent in Sleeping Beauty though, refers to her powers as “powers of Hell,” heavily leaning toward his demon like design.

Meleanor suffered to protect Malleus. She gave him up and fought an entire army to better his chances of survival because she loved him so much. And if Meleanor is trapped in the mirror and will be brought back to “life,” all of this suffering stemmed from the fact she sacrificed herself for Malleus.

SNDJDHSJSJDJD STOP IT TWST WHY DOES THIS ALL FIT TOGETHER SO WELL????? YANAAAAA HELP

But do you see what I mean on how I think Vil is slyly foreshadowing EVERYTHING? Not only that, but look at his Overblot design again. At his waist, there are sharp crystal-looking objects surrounding him. I think these represent broken mirror shards. This, combined with all the coffin imagery at NRC, Epel’s Unique Magic, and Malleus’s making everyone fall asleep like Aurora or Snow White…

Perhaps Meleanor really is trapped in the mirror, put in a death-like sleep…but one day she will be freed, like Aurora or Snow White with the power of true loves kiss. Until then, Vil is the closest representation of her to Crowley. Someone who understands the power of beauty to make others submit, someone to worship.

#twst vil schoenheit #twst vil #vil schoenheit #twst overblot #twst meleanor draconia #twst meleanor #Meleanor draconia #twst Crowley #dire Crowley #twst levan #Twst levan draconia #twst dire Crowley #twst theory #twisted wonderland #KallistoPost #crowley is levan theory

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salteytakesonmanga · 9 months

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Your explanation about retconing made me think Oda's way of writing is exactly what bring people to think he has every single thing planed down from the start, even if he didn't.

The story has been going on for 20 years, and Oda himself has admitedly had ideas along the way that he added. But the fact he's still able to connect every new idea instead of having to retcon things is what makes one piece feel so perfectly planned and tied.

Anon, you innocently sent me this ask to share your thoughts and unknowingly triggered one of my rants. I’m sorry/thank you.

Anon is referring to this post.

Oda is just a good writer! He is good at the craft of writing! Even if you don’t like the story (I’m assuming you do, but for people who don’t…) it’s just WELL WRITTEN. People really aren’t used to seeing good writing anymore, to seeing tropes deployed effectively and having plot lines actually connect. This isn’t just me being cranky and old, it’s just truth. People are talking about this in film, TV, books… One Piece has been around so long that it comes from a generation of storytelling that is vastly different from our modern media landscape.

I think people are burned out on the way modern storytelling never delivers (looking at you, JJ Abrams) or constantly jerks people around to elicit a reaction, all for the sake of nabbing that viral moment. When they see Oda deploy a trope or a storytelling device they’re immediately suspicious and fearful that it’ll turn into another unsatisfying gotcha. They rush to look for proof that it’s either all part of a detailed master plan, or it’s just a cheap trick to sell more issues.

In both cases, people are looking for a reason to be LESS INVESTED in the story. If he has a master plan, they don’t need to get worried or excited because it’s all heading to some inevitable conclusion that’s been clearly telegraphed and once you’ve cracked the code then you can already tell what the ending will be, so you don’t actually have to care. If he’s winging it, then the story is just a sequence of loosely connected meaningless scenes whose only purpose is to get you hype about a plot leading nowhere, so you don’t actually have to care.

And it breaks my fucking heart.

When it comes to One Piece, so many people are insistent that One Piece is EITHER 100% planned in advance down to every minute detail, or Oda is completely winging the whole thing. But the real answer is somewhere in between, in some muddy grey area that people find really unsatisfying. They want one clear answer that they can hold up as “The Right One,” but life is not made up of black and white answers.

Honestly it makes me really sad that people can read ALL THIS - pirates are evil except actually pirates are good and the Marines are evil except the Marines are trying to protect civilians by keeping countries stable so that's good except the rulers are evil tyrants so that's bad except when they’re not and then they’re good but only sometimes and… - and what they come away with from it is, “Okay but what’s the RIGHT answer.”

The thing that makes One Piece feel like it’s so cohesive despite Oda constantly changing his mind and making shit up is that he has a very strong and clear idea about what’s actually important to the story and what’s flexible. Because he has that as a guide, he can add the Shichibukai and change Vivi from a villain to a princess and make up who Ace’s parent is without diluting what he wants to say.

That’s what it MEANS to be a writer. Foreshadowing isn’t “boring,” it’s good writing. A plot twist you didn’t see isn’t “cheap,” it’s good writing. Fleshing out a backstory isn’t “reconning,” it’s good writing.

#anon ask #asked and answered #saltey takes on one piece #sorry to bombard y'all with these walls of text #saltey says #<- is the tag to block if you don't want to see them

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rowanwithaz · 10 days

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The dumb anti BKDK/DKBK arguments:

I've seen a lot of people kinda making fun of bkdk/dkbk antis' takes on their dynamic/relationship. But,I think there's also an underlining issue with the mischaracterization of the story,characters,and Hori as a writer himself.

Katsuki/bullying

One of the biggest arguments used against bkdk/dkbk is this one panel.

Which,this scene isn't as deep as people want to believe it is. Well,it IS,but just not on Katsuki's end (I'll elaborate on this in the Izuku section). This scene isn't about Katsuki being an awful person,it's about what Izuku endures as a quirkless person. Don't get me wrong: Katsuki was an absolute asshole in this. But,he's also a fourteen year old egotistical brat. His age obviously doesn't cover for what he's done,but it doesn't make him an evil monster who wishes to abuse and victimize Izuku whenever he possibly can. That's just not true.

(Important side note: it says several times that this is the furthest Katsuki has ever gone with his bullying with Izuku. His friends even comment on Katsuki going too far. So I really don't get why the antis try to claim this is consist behaviour for Katsuki,when it clearly isn't. This doesn't make what he did OKAY though,that's not what I'm saying at all. This scene just gets blown out of proportion most of the time)

Also,let's not forget about the hypocrisy this scene brings. Many antis will say that bkdk/dkbk can't be romantic and it's toxic because Katsuki told Izuku to "kys",but here's the thing; they're the same people who argue they're strictly platonic. It makes no sense. If this relationship was actually as toxic and abusive as they say it is,then they couldn't be friends. Antis use this scene for disproving the romantic interpretation of the two,but then completely ignore it when it's not relevant to their narrative.

Now,Katsuki's ignored development! I've seem a couple antis claim that Katsuki's apology scene was a self pity speech and it was all about him. Which is...SO FUCKING WRONG? I can understand if you've read the first lines of the apology and thought, "Oh,he's just thinking about himself," if you were just really dense and had no context of the earlier events leading up to this apology and stopped reading after a page that is. It's probably one of the most stupid takes I've seen on Katsuki and Hori's writing.

In these panels Katsuki is talking about his feelings,yes. And this is important! Izuku deserves an explanation to Katsuki's bullying,Izuku deserves to hear how Katsuki actually feels. But,right after,he turns it around to talk about Izuku. This sequence of events is extremely important to what Katsuki (Hori) is trying to convey. The truth. I know a people wanted this to be about Izuku being a helpless victim,but that just isn't true to either of their characters,especially Izuku's. And these words are backed up by actions. Over. And over again. Katsuki said he was going to be there for Izuku?

(Note: I'm aware a couple of this manga panels aren't the official translations! And that's because the official translations are very DIFFERENT from what Katsuki is actually saying in those scenes)

He's there. And that's kinda something I feel people forget when thinking of Katsuki's apology. He's already been reconnecting and making it up to Izuku.

Katsuki has gone through so much development over the course of mha,and it's astonishing that people still use the first page of this manga to view Katsuki and the whole story. Of course Katsuki is going to feel incompleted and lazily written when all you focus on is the very first chapter of the manga. Foreshadowing and growth exist,let's not forget that.

Izuku the victim

This is something that definitely annoys me when I see people hating on bkdk/dkbk. Most of the time the antis hate Katsuki so much that they victimize Izuku as much as they possibly fucking can.

Was Izuku bullied? Yes! Was he mistreated? Yes!

But that doesn't make him a helpless victim who doesn't see himself as anything. Izuku does have a sense of self worth. That's just the truth. It always pisses me off when people bring up the "take a swine dive off the roof of the building," line and say if Izuku didn't get OFA he would had committed suicide. Honestly,I think when Izuku starts devaluating himself is when he receives OFA.

For example,when Katsuki backs Izuku into a wall telling him he can't get into U.A,

Izuku says "there's no harm in trying",Izuku thinks he can get into U.A,even without a quirk. He believes,deep down,he can be a quirkless hero. Until he's told otherwise from All Might,then doesn't believe in himself even more when he has OFA.

(In the anime,or just the dub,Izuku says something along the lines of, "they changed that rule!" To Katsuki when we says he can't get into U.A without a quirk,which further proves this point)

And about the, "take a swine dive off the roof" page, this doesn't effect Izuku as much as people say it did. Even in the moment. Izuku wasn't distraught,Izuku didn't go into a deep depression over it,he was pissed.

That is a look of anger. Now,why was Izuku angry? Because he didn't believe this. He knew what Katsuki was saying was just BS. In this scene he calls Katsuki an idiot,then he thinks about his mom. This scene was deep,because it was about Izuku's trauma with his mother and discovering when he was quirkless. This scene was,as I've said,to show what Izuku endures as a qurikless kid and to segway into his backstory.

As for Izuku's self worth,we also see through these pages of him being upset with his mother,he still has hope he can be a hero. He still wishes to become a hero,still acknowledging that he's quirkless,he still believes he can be.

because he doesn't let people hold him back. Because he's stubborn as fuck (a character trait people often forget Izuku has). So I really don't get why people try to paint Izuku as this kid who leaves his self Image in the hands of others,he knows he's not useless.

And when I say Izuku devaluates himself,I don't mean Izuku sees himself as useless. Izuku sees himself as a vessel for OFA from that point on and takes the responsiblity/burden of it. He dehumanized himself because of OFA,not because of the bullying he faced.

(I'm not saying this didn't hurt Izuku in anyway! It did. But I feel Izuku wasn't as effected by it as people think he is,it wasn't something Izuku saw as worth it. He knew what he wanted to be at the end of the day,and stuck the finger to everyone else.)

I hate it when people say Izuku is a basic character,then don't actually know the first thing about him.

Can't be cannon because it's shonen

This argument I can get! But,there are a couple of reasons this is still a dumb argument.

First of all,we're usually talking about shipping. So this doesn't necessarily apply to fan work,which they do for some odd reason.

Second of all,MHA is pretty lgbtq+ positive. With Toga being bi/pan,and they're being several trans characters,and let's not forget about characters like Mineta who is pretty heavily hinted to be bisexual.

And I feel Horikoshi is using the romantic shonen formula,just not in the way they thought he would...

Katsuki is very love interest coded.

With Katsuki being the one the villains (not just villains,people in general) go after to or to get a rise out of Izuku.

And,another important thing to mention when talking about shonen is Horikoshi as a writer himself.

Horikoshi is doing this for himself. He wants to enjoy what he's writing. So,if bkdk/dkbk becomes cannon? It wasn't fan pressure. He wanted to do it. If it doesn't? Same thing. And,from what I've observed,Hori REALLY likes Katsuki and Izuku.

I mean,he's done so much with these two,so many unnecessary moments,for...what? We have to remember bkdk/dkbk was seen as toxic from the fast majority of the fanbase when people starting shipping them. But,what did Hori do? He kept putting in these moments. Kept foreshadowing something...more. And in the process put down many popular ships at the time. Like,Kribaku (NOT HATING) it was seen as the healthy,fun relationship Katsuki could be in romantically. Horikoshi used this to deepen the bond between bkdk/dkbk. (And to probably to add some gay yearning angst)

and let's not forget all the unnecessary sketches he made between the two,and some of his comments on them,

(From the ultra analysis character book)

From the looks of it,Hori just enjoys these two together. Especially considering some of the new drawings/sketches he's made.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter if it's shonen or not. Horikoshi is going to do what he enjoys. And I hope he continues to do so! If mha's end doesn't result with cannon bkdk/dkbk? I couldn't care less if Horikoshi is pleased with the ending,as much as I see the cannon potential.

#greenade #dkbk #bkdk #Mha #Bnha #These are just a couple arguments I see recycled the most #deku x kacchan #dekucchan #Midoriya Izuku #Bakugou Katsuki

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