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kagekitsuneoflight · 1 year

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It’s kinda funny that Jason is, in every sense of the word, the most normal Robin. Unironically, there wasn’t anything uniquely special about him before he was Robin. He was a street kid. His dad was a goon (which makes sense for Gotham. It’s a goon breeding ground) and his adoptive mom was a girl who fell in love with the bad boy, got disowned by her upper middle class parents and adopted her boyfriend’s infant son. Even his biological mother isn’t anything special! She was just a doctor who ended up becoming corrupt.

Jason Todd was no circus kid who could do an impossible signature trick. He wasn’t being scouted by some evil hidden organization.

He wasn’t the rich boy genius who lived next door.

He’s not the son of a supervillain (as lame as cluemaster is, he still *counts*).

He’s not the secret son of Bruce Wayne.

And he’s not a metahuman, nor did he led a whole organization of teens to fight when Batman couldn’t.

He’s the most regular boy to ever enter become a hero in Gotham. He wanted to do good things for the sake of doing good. He grew up poor with regular parents, where bad things happened to them. The kinds of things that could happen to *any* person living in Gotham.

There is nothing about him, pre-Robin and as Robin, that makes him Not Like Regular Kids.

His dad was a goon (who, depending on the run, was either killed by Two-Face OR. Just sent to prison and killed in prison! Which makes his backstory even PLAINER-) and his mother was a drug addict with cancer. Jason ends up homeless, and almost steals the bat mobile tires. The only thing that makes him stand out from any other tragedy befallen kid in Gotham is the fact he was bold enough to do that, get Batman’s attention, and continue to be bold enough to go against a crime lord (who was apparently his grandmother, the most interesting person in his family, but since she’s almost never brought up, she’s likely no more significant than a one-issue villain in the crime lord power hierarchy). Batman realized that Jason wasn’t going to really stop, and honestly he kinda grew on him, so he decided to adopt Jason, and eventually allow him to become Robin.

There just isn’t anything amazingly special about his backstory. The few moments where something could have been done to make it more interesting (like his biological mother) but ended up taking the most boring option. You can’t do much of anything now to enhance his past without upsetting much more well established canon, and not without making people wonder “well if his grandmother was such a big name in crime, why hasn’t she been brought up before?”

Jason Todd was a wonderful Robin (providing that he actually has a writer who likes him). He has a golden heart, he’s the voice of reason. He’s everything that a Robin needs to be for Batman. But compared to everyone else, he was nothing special. In a way, his lack of Not Like Regular Kids makes him stand out in a much more subtle way.

As if someone asked the question “Do I need to be someone special to be Robin?” And the answer was “You don’t need to be someone special, you just need to be brave, like Jason Todd was.”

#jason todd #robin jason todd #seriously they could have made anyone his biological mom. to add drama. to add spice #but they instead said ‘well. he’s a simple kid’#everyone else is some delicacy food at a dinner table. and Jason? Jason is like. tomato soup.#HOWEVER. i will NOT forgive the disregard of making Jason stand out from his siblings more.#everyone has a specific niche that they noticeably can excel #or like. a very specific villain is like ‘YOU. i want to train YOU to be MY sidekick.’#or or. the backstory alone is enough to make them stand out.#Jason gets uh. crime? he’s good at killing people.#which isn’t even consistently his Thing by the way since no one knows where to put him on the hero to villain scale #if only there was something he could have that no one else does!#\*i stare long and hard at the All Caste and Magic*#shut up kage #edit: I’m so!! CLUEMASTER. ITS CLUEMASTER.

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disniq · 9 months

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heyyy it's the tropes jason anon again back at it with a new question! what quotes from the comic books would you say describe jason & his philosophy well? thank you so, so much for helping me out ❤

Hi again Anon!

Full disclosure here; I don't think Jason has been written consistently enough over the years to necessarily have one set, inarguable philosophy. But I do think there are certain themes that carry through.

So;

Red Hood: Lost Days #3

This is, notably, the first time Jason kills. (I'm not including Garzonas, which is debatable, or the Cheer incident, which is a retcon) He finds out his hand-to-hand teacher has a barn full of drugged children about to be sex trafficked. The cops and politicians are in on it, making lawful justice extremely unlikely, but taking out one man takes out the system. Jason crosses that line for the first time because nobody else is there to stop it, and this is the most practical route.

He does not see it as "murder" because he feels it was deserved.

Red Hood: Lost Days #4

After that line has been crossed - as Talia points out here - a pattern emerges. It's notable that Jason does not kill all his dubiously skilled teachers, only the ones he deems the worst of the worst - people deliberately and repeatedly harming everyday people, especially children.

Jason reiterates this in his famous utrh speech. He's not talking about killing every rogue, every criminal. He's talking about killing the worst of the worst, the people who can finagle their way out of the system, the people the system fails to catch.

Under the Red Hood

It would be remiss of me not to include that one time Jason killed a nazi. Good for her dot gif.

To Jason, these people are beyond the regular means of justice, so he provides his own. He stops them from hurting anybody else.

This is not an exclusively post-resurrection opinion of his, either. Jason expressed similar thoughts during his Robin run.

Batman #422 (thank you @benbamboozled 😘)

This woman, Judy, baited her sister's murderer into attacking her too and then slits his throat. She's unrepentant, and Jason agrees with her decision. (Bruce, for the record, gives a speech on how "nobody is above the law" which is. An interesting stance for an illegally operating vigilante to take lmao)

It makes sense to me that Jason, as someone who has seen the system fail repeatedly (both as a civilian and as a hero), would have those kinds of doubts. The system doesn't always work. The system often fails the most vulnerable people.

When Bruce was failed by the Gotham justice system, he became his own extra-judicial system. When Jason is failed by both the justice system *and* Bruce's own vigilante system? Why wouldn't he do the same.

Unfortunately, this thread is mostly dropped for a while with the wave of writers who either actively hate Jason and try to make him capital E Evil or who are playing shameless self insert with him, but there are two more recent panels that I want to include too;

Task Force Z #12

So, in TFZ, Jason pushes who he thinks is Bane off a roof for killing Alfred. It... is not actually Bane, but instead the brainwashed former corpse of Gotham re-reanimated via comicbook science and. You know what, it doesn't matter. What does matter is that Jason regrets killing Gotham because he didn't deserve it, but reiterates that he will kill the real Bane if he gets a chance.

Jason sees killing as something he can do that others can't, that others maybe *shouldn't* have to do.

The Joker: The Man Who Stopped Laughing #8

And finally, I adore this little beat in JTMWSL. This is something Jason thinks about. He's not just some brute that doesn't understand that "killing is bad". He thinks about it, reads theory about it. He sees that between the black and white, there are many, many shades of gray.

He understands that people who don't kill with their own hands aren't necessarily good people - like these cops here, gleefully waiting for him to be killed in prison. And that the people who *do* get their hands dirty aren't necessarily the bad guys - like poor Judy.

And I think he probably varies where he places himself on that scale at any given moment.

#I'm sorry anon none of these are strictly speaking quotes but this is what I've got lol #jason todd #asked and answered #long post #my meta

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celaenaeiln · 3 months

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is the dickbabs romantic relationship always as bad as in Tom Taylor’s run or is it actually enjoyable in other runs? i want to read more of dick’s og nightwing run but ik dickbabs is a recurring thing and i strongly dislike what i’ve seen of it in modern comics (absolutely no offense to anyone who ships it!!)

also sort of related, but have dick and babs really been BFFs since grade school or is that new canon? i remember the initial new 52 run referencing him and babs as on and off but nothing about being childhood besties.

finally- what would you consider to be key dick grayson runs?

Surprisingly Dickbabs is pretty nice to read in other runs. I know this sounds weird coming from someone who hates Dickbabs as a ship but really it's only bad like 85% of the time and the majority of that is because of the Batgirl comics. Batgirl comics treat Dick like shit and it's a losing tossup whether he's treated well in Oracle related comics.

But to get to your point, Dickbabs in Nightwing (1996) was originally pretty good. Tom Taylor's run of Nightwing is the weird one because in every other run you have Dick + relationships whereas in Taylor's you have relationships + Dick. That being said, I highly, highly recommend reading the og one. At one point it does get toxic but Barbara leaves almost immediately after that and aside from that the ship was pretty nice for the most part.

Dick and Barbara have NOT been BFFS since childhood or whatever and this gets on my nerves that Tom Taylor and Hope Larson did that. This is one of the problems I have with the Dickbabs ship. Writers who write them love changing the story to erase Dick's friendships with the Titans. They literally love to pretend Wally, Donna, Roy, and Garth don't exist. BARBARA IS NOT HIS CHILDHOOD BEST FRIEND!! They literally keep deaging her and for what?? First she was like two decades older than him, then she's five years older than him, and now she's the same age?? Just let her be older! Barbara being the same age as Dick makes no sense because it takes away her maturity to turn her into this childish, selfish character she has no business being. She's not even enjoyable when she's deaged this far. I'm still on the she's 5 to 6 years older than Dick canon timeline and there is no way she was childhood besties with him.

The way I picture Dick and Barbara's relationship is this:

youtube

DC should've just let it at this, this was peak Dick and Barbara relationship.

Very narrow starting out list but some must read Dick Grayson runs are:

Nightwing (1996) - If you don't feel like reading anything else just read this

Nightwing (2016) - Really good up until Tom Taylor's run

Batman: Gotham Knights - pretty good and lots of cute Tim and Dick!

Titans (1999) - This is a must read if you're not interested in the original Teen Titans comics

Outsiders (2003) - Love him so much in this

JLA/Titans - Important for understanding his relationships with Titans and Batman

Nightwing (2011)

Justice League (2011) Issue #25 and Forever Evil - Same arc

Batman: Prelude to the Wedding: Nightwing vs. Hush

Robin era

Batman - One Bad Day: Mr. Freeze - If you want to skip the medal ages but still want to know what Dick was like as Robin, this comic is all you need to understand his character and personality and beliefs.

Batman Chronicles: The Gauntlet - Dick's gauntlet test!

Robin: Year One - For fun :)

Dick!Bats era

Batman: Battle for the Cowl - To get into Dick's batman

Batman (1940) Issues #682 to #713 - Batman Dick. Incredible. Dick was such a good batman and so fun to read.

Batman and Robin (2009) - Dick and Dami!

Batman: Streets of Gotham - Also Dick and Dami <3

Justice League of America (2006) Issues #41 to #60- Dick leading his own JLA team as Batman! SO FUN!!

Detective Comics (1937) Issue #864 to #881 - Honestly Batman Dick was so good I can't tell if I like Dick more as Nightwing or Batman. Obviously it's better for his mental health if he's nightwing but he just did such a great job as Batman.

Spy era

Grayson - YESSSS. Just everything about this.

Batman and Robin Eternal - It was really good up until near the end but then it got better again

Dark Crisis - Definitely, without a doubt, no question

Additional: The ones above are focused on him but if you finish reading this then Tim's Robin (1993) Comic is a fantastic one. He doesn't appear in every single issue but he appears a lot and it's a lot of Dick and Tim characterization. Also Teen Titans (2003) for more Dick and Titans relationships.

#dick grayson #nightwing #barbara gordon #batgirl #cl anon asks #cl asks #thanks for the ask!

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gatorbites-imagines · 1 year

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do you think you can do a yandere Jason todd x male reader x Yandere Dick Grayson if you want to that is your a great writer :)

Yandere Jason Todd x male reader x Yandere Dick Grayson

Headcanons

(i couldnt find a gif of just Jason and Dick, so have this one)

So, Jason and Dick are both yandere for the same person here, who’s got powers, cuz duh, I always make the reader a hero or meta. Readers related to Reverse flash, cuz hes one of my crazy meow meows.

I kinda went a little all over the place in the story with this, but I love the idea of speedster powers.

- You were called Mach 10, or that was your alter egos name anyways. In the beginning they had called you reverse kid flash since you were to Thawne what Wally was to Barry, except your relationship with Thawne was a lot more confusing.

- You weren’t sure where you even started, what year you were from, or what reality for that matter, and neither was Thawne. But he saw you had his exact powers, looked like him, at least a little, so he took you under his wing and brought you with him.

- Thawne is in no way a good person, whatsoever, but he didn’t force you to follow his path. You didn’t have a reason for what you did like Thawne, but part of you liked the feeling of your powers and how strong you were, so you also did crime, though not to the same scale as your father figure.

- This didn’t mean you were all evil though. You saw yourself as greyer or rather a darker grey. You helped when people were in mortal danger, sometimes, and you always helped if the world was in danger or similar.

- You could even be convinced to work alongside the flashes, though they were wary of you in the beginning, until you all actually got closer, and you became allies with the likes of Wally or Bart, though they weren’t the biggest fans of your villainy, they knew they couldn’t stop you for the most part.

- And as long as you weren’t actually hurting people, or you only were hurting actually evil people, they could look past it in a similar way to the league looking past the outlaws and their behavior. Of course, you’d killed innocent people too, you weren’t without flaws, but they didn’t have to know that.

- The first time you used your powers to your full potential and jumped through and altered time, or jumped to different dimensions, Thawne was so proud and the two of you went out for ice cream to celebrate.

- This new world was very similar to your own, and the league of this world must have felt the ripple in the speedforce or reality itself, as the ice cream shop you and Thawne were sitting in soon had a couple of heroes outside.

- Your father figure rolled his eyes so hard you couldn’t help but giggle, and you two kept on eating your treat as this dimensions Flash cautiously made his way inside, seemingly recognizing Thawne at the very least, though you gave you some wary looks.

- As the two men talked you ended up speeding outside to get some air, and since you grew extremely bored listening to them discuss why you were here, what you wanted, etc. etc. You flashed past the other heroes outside and decided to check out the different cities this dimension had to offer.

- As the heroes panicked, Thawne just waved his hand and told them you were fine since you didn’t have a bloodlust like he did, and you were more like a dog hyped up on the speedforce checking out a new patch of grass.

- Of course none of them trusted Thawne, but its not like anyone but Barry could really keep up with you, and as Thawne left saying you’d leave when you were done, they decided to keep an eye on you instead.

- One thing led to another, and you ended up in Gotham, sitting on the edge of a rooftop watching the gloomy city go about their life. Every now and then you’d catch some people glancing up at you, as your bright yellow suit stood out very brightly across the dark city.

- Your suit was very similar to Thawnes, though you had added your own quirks to it, and the suit had more black mixed with some red patterns, though it was clear your inspiration was from Reverse Flash and not Flash.

- It was when you were debating on ransacking a store for all their snacks that you noticed this dimensions Red Hood fighting a large number of enemies. He was limping and was struggling to keep up, so you could under assume he had been at this for a while.

- Shrugging you decided to help, since Red Hood was the only bat you got along with in your universe. With a crackle of black and red lightning, you flashed on over and took out the enemies with ease.

- You had to hold back from not killing them since you knew the bat wouldn’t be very happy about that, and you remembered Red Hood from your universe didn’t kill as much anymore.

- Turning around you watched as Red Hood collapsed to his knee with a pained groan, blood vividly pouring down his torso and onto the rooftop.

- Jason had no idea who you were or where you came from, but he was too messed up from his fight to do much as you walked over and picked him up like he weighed nothing. Then you sped somewhere else, one of his safehouses that seemed to be the same as the one in your original dimension, and you patched him out.

- He passed out from blood loss, but when he woke up again you were still there, sitting on his couch watching tv like you owned the place. Seeing as he was awake you went and checked up on him, making sure he wasn’t dying or anything.

- That’s when Jason finally demanded to know who the hell you were, or how you knew about his safehouse. You just laugh and reach up to push you cowl off, introducing yourself as Mach 10, and saying you were just a visitor from a different dimension.

- Jason would never admit it but the moment he saw your face the seeds of obsession were sown, and as you stuck around for the rest of the day you two started talking and found out you had a lot in common.

- And when you didn’t judge him for his violent ways and he learned you resorted to violence and murder as well, he felt some kind of kinship with you, only deepening the already brewing obsession and love.

- You end up figuring out the Red Hood of this world never stopped using real bullets, he just kills less than before, but still puts and end to the lives of the worse kinds of people.

- After that, much to Batman’s annoyance, you stuck around Gotham, though you mainly stuck around Crime Alley. You started to become Red Hoods terrifying yellow shadow. There were rumors you were some kind of opposite to Signal, but they people saw your use of speed, and it became obvious you weren’t a bat.

- You had never been one much for boundaries, so when Jasons obsession grew over time and he started to touch you like grabbing you, holding your hand or carrying you around you just let him, knowing you could snap him in half if you needed too.

- You weren’t the best influence as your own moral compass wasn’t the best, but Crime Alley had never been more safe for the innocent, and you started to actually gather admirers amongst the civilian population.

- Jason never spoke of how jealous or sick it made him feel to see people cheer for you or take your hand to thank you for saving them. But people never got too far in their hero worship, as you always did something the normal population found terrifying, placing you right back in the untouchable category.

- But seeing you use the speedforce to rip apart someones atoms or watch you vibrate at a frequency that allowed you to control people, it made people back away and only admire and fear you from a distance.

- But for Jason it only made you more attractive, and watching you vibrate or as sparks of lightning shot off your body, it only made Jason feel hot under the collar. His obsession with you grew to the point where he would neglect his duties as the Red Hood if you weren’t going out as well, so he could spend more time with you.

- Before you arrived Jason had kept up some kind of contact with the batfam since he was lonely or might need support at times, but now that you were there he pretty much stopped all contact as you were all he needed.

- This worried the bats, but not enough for most of them to do anything about it, except for Dick who decided he needed to get to the bottom of this. So he went to Crime Alley to check on Jason and you.

- When Dick first met you he couldn’t help but notice how bright and carefree you were, like the weight of the world meant absolutely nothing to you, and looking at you and your powers that might be the truth.

- But he also couldn’t help but notice how Jason seemed to tense up as he shook your hand, or how his younger brothers hand seemed to be twitching for his gun whenever Dick got a little too close to you.

- Dick hadn’t ever really been the most mentally stable person, especially in this new dimension he seemed even more unstable in a sense, as he grew interested in you and seemed to ignore the obvious danger that Jason was to him.

- In the beginning it was just a curious interest for Dick, but like Jason the moment he saw your face the first time without your cowl, his heart stuttered, and his face went red, and he felt like he had to have you.

- Like with Jason you did very little to disapprove of his behavior, letting Dick hug you whenever he wanted, or leaving the trackers you knew they both placed on you, knowing your lightning would break them at some point.

- Dick went out of his way to learn all your interests, and buying you more gifts than you knew what to do with, he might even use his connection to the league to get you speedster based gear that you could use.

- Jasons jealousy became worse as he clung to you, his eyes pretty much always a constant bright green as pit rage burned in his chest as he watched Dick try to charm you and steal you from him.

- Up until they point Jason hadn’t made a move on you romantically, but when he saw Dick bring you a brand new herosuit, one that when you put it on hugged your body even more than the last one, he decided enough was enough.

- It was especially the way Dick seemed to look all over your body in your new suit, or how Dicks hands wandered over your body to “check out that the suit fit” and how he knew Dick kept pictures and recordings of you.

- Jason hoped Dicks interest would disappear when he watched you mind control someone to kill their entire family and then themselves, as multiple members of the family were innocent or children.

- But to Jasons extreme annoyance, Dick only seemed to get more interested or feel more drawn to you. Jason was happy you didn’t pay much attention to other people, or else you might have noticed how Dick was aching for you like a cat in heat as he watched you rip out someone’s lungs using the speedforce.

- They both knew they couldn’t keep you locked up, they couldn’t even threaten you as you were so much more powerful than them, and you weren’t dumb enough to manipulate.

- No matter how many plans Jason cooked up, he couldn’t figure out a way to keep you as his and his alone, until one night it just became too much.

- A woman you had just saved from a criminal pressed up against you, hands rubbing your chest as she told you she could thank you in the best way, but before you could laugh in her face, Jason had shot her.

- As you turned to look at him in confusion Jason crowded close to you, ripping of his helmet to grab your face and force his lips onto yours. You could easily have broken both his arms, but you didn’t find Jason annoying to be around, so you kissed him back.

- Jason was over the moon as you kissed him back, his legs growing weak as he started moaning and whimpering against your lips, his knees completely giving out as your tongues clashed, resulting in you having to hold him up.

- What you both didn’t realize was that Dick had been following you, and had seen the kiss which was enough to snap what little bit of sanity he had left as possessiveness burned so brightly in his chest.

- He followed you both back to Jasons place where he confronted you two as you got inside, and you were just confused as the two bats started fighting both physically and with words. But when their fighting got a little too extreme you pulled them apart.

- Dick ended up grabbing you and pulling you close so he could kiss you too, forcing his tongue between your lips as you could taste blood from where Jason must have busted his lip. Jason yelled in rage and tried to fling himself at Dick again, but you just grabbed him and held him against your side.

- Where Jason had grown weak in his knees and almost soft at the kisses, Dick seemed to grow controlling, the grip he had on you growing tight to the point it would have hurt a normal person.

- When the kiss started to feel like you were being devoured by some animal you forced Dick to step back, wiping your mouth with the back of your hand as you told him to control the slobbering.

- Both Dick and Jason still fought a lot for you, but they also knew they’d have to kill one another to get the other to leave, but you liked them both as a person, so they put up with each other’s presence.

- They even started sharing the pictures or videos they had, or their collection of stolen items they had taken from you, where dicks most prized possession was your last suit, and Jasons was the original clothes you had been wearing underneath the suit when you first arrived.

- Dick grew more violent during his patrols as he became almost illusioned by his possessive obsession to you, that he couldn’t let these criminals walk around as they’d want to take you from him or would taint you. This resulted in Dick also cutting most contact with the batfam and the league, as he and Jason were too busy worshipping your very existence.

- They were both extremely clingy, both inside and outside of suits, and they loved to buy you things or to always be touching you. And though they hated your powers at times since they could never get the upper hand, they both loved how strong you were, or how cruel you were to criminals or just anybody that got in your way.

- But one day came that you were growing bored of this dimension, and though you did care for Jason and Dick, you wanted to be on your way and even return to your original dimension.

- You weren’t a good person, and since you’d never officially put a name on what you were with the two bats, you just packed up what few things you needed on a rare day neither of them were there, put on your suit, left a note, and left using the speedforce.

- When Dick and Jason realize you left, they both in their delusional minds think there must have been some reason you left, that maybe Thawne forced you or something happened in your original universe.

- You were the only thing keeping them a little stable, so with you gone they both pretty much lose it and hurt and kill anybody in their way to get you back, which ends up with them finding some gear or machine that uses the speedforce.

- They somehow had something of yours that is connected to you or your presence in the speedforce that means they can zero the machine in on you, and take them to you. So with the league in shambles around them, they abandon their original Dimension and step into your original dimension, on their search for you so they can stand by you once more.

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damianbugs · 4 months

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Hi!! First I just wanted to say your fics have been an inspo for me to write my own fics and I enjoy them immensely. Second, I’ve been wandering something and I want to ask something about how Jason Todd is portrayed after his death.

I don’t really understand why so many just kind of lie? Or exasperate who Jason Todd is and isn’t. Like the Cass and Bruce scene in front of Jason’s grave, or that scene in Gotham Knights where Alfred tells Bruce “Jason was determined to disobey him.” I know out of universe it just has to do with the mischaracterization of Jason but I’m having a hard time on finding an in universe explanation. Is it out of guilt? Out of misplaced love? It’s confusing me a bit

first of all, thank you!! i'm so glad i could inspire you that is truly the highest complement i could receive <3

secondly, this is a really interesting discussion! you're right about how in a meta way it's the deeply routed classism in jasons writing, as well as many writers (example: grant morrison) just really hating jason for some reason and doing everything they can to make him absolutely insufferable. not even in a cool evil villain way, but in an embarrassment point and laugh kind of way.

for the purpose of this discussion lets (with much difficulty) ignore the writers predispositions and implications and just focus entirely on what this means for the characters. it's good you mention the cass and bruce at jason's grave scene, because i think that example alone is a good way to deconstruct some of character's (for this post: bruce's) perspective of jason's death.

to summarise before dumping a billion paragraphs developing the point; let's not dance around it and accept that much of people's understanding of jason's death falls into the victim blaming variety, but in such way that the characters don't seem to realise that's how they perceive him, which is almost worse than them purposely retelling it in such a way. as well as that, aside from this indenial misunderstanding of jason, i think this shows the sort of flaws the other characters have.

Detective Comics #790

at first glance this seems like a really touching and emotional moment where bruce is sharing his grief with cass (especially when the entirety of #790 is about bruce struggling to do just that), but then you really read it and you're like what the fuck... why are we standing in front of this kids grave slagging him off? not only are we hearing all of bruce's regrets about how he raised jason as opposed to his son's actual death, but we are dragging steph into this too.

to bruce, jason's death is an accumulation of everything he let the boy get away with finally reaching it's tipping point. that jason's ambition to "prove something" lead to his seemingly inevitable demise.

now i do think it's important to note that WE (the readers) know jason died saving sheila. that despite being beaten, betrayed and left for dead, he tried to save someone and paid the price for it. no one else knows that, because the two people that did are dead. as a result, bruce is left with the facts that;

prior to his death, jason was acting uncharacteristically (<- important point) violent and aggressive towards himself, borderline passively suicidal. bruce himself acknowledges this.

that jason ran away from home in search of someone who may or may not be his mother. this is because losing his parents is a hurt jason has still not healed from and a topic bruce has handled badly in the past (example: willis todd). jason does not trust bruce enough to tell him about this.

once they find his mother, jason is instructed to not get involved in the joker related problem. to the extent of bruces knowledge, jason reveals himself as robin, and decides to get involved despite the instruction not to. either because he again, didn't trust bruce to believe he would handle it, or that jason was trying to prove something to bruce, to sheila, or to himself.

sheila dies, jason dies and bruce is the only one alive from the tragedy with only half the story.

All of this can be found in A Death In The Family, but I don't feel comfortable sharing panels of it given where the story takes place right now.

bruce spends the next few years blaming himself at any given point, but the blame is misplaced. bruce feels as though HIS negligence of JASON'S personality and HIS allowance of JASON'S freedom as robin is what allowed JASON to go and die. instead of seeing what he knows to be true about jason (his empathy, his kindness, his grief and loneliness) bruce can now only see how his allowance of all these things played a part in JASON disobeying him (whether maliciously or not) and dying.

in short, bruce is projecting big time onto his dead kid.

bruce is, as per usual, coping with loss by antagonising it. he did the same with babs, with steph and later on with damian. for a character like batman, who upon failing immediately turns these losses into lessons (for himself and all those forced to comply), it's the only way he seems to 'move on'. if he can understand that jason died because of all the things bruce let him do wrong, then he can convince himself that the guilt he feels for it is necessary. that jasons death is on him and that it mattered.

unfortunately, in order to do that, bruce is indenial about what he LITERALLY KNOWS ABOUT JASON! it's not like he was an absent father to jason in the slightest. but hey, if he can vitiate jason's enthusiasm to help people as jason's impulsiveness to fight (two things that can be true but not in accordance to the context he describes them in), then the blame is on jason for being brash, and on bruce for being lenient.

he shoots jason in the foot and himself in the knee to keep them both down. because, well, jason's dead anyway, and bruce unfortunately isn't. this is the closest thing they'll get to sharing the truth bruce knows he's missing and he knows it's his fault for favouring the mission of his son — so at the expense of jason, bruce lets them both be the lesson to learn from.

it is why jason is used as a cautionary tale, and why bruce is so unstable on allowing people (especially children) into his life emotionally. the second robin is a lesson for any young vigilante eager to join the mission, and batman's part in the death is a lesson for bruce wayne to... be even more emotionally untrustworthy? instructions unclear.

the final part of the grave scene is also important, because bruce is admitting that he is not so different to jason. that "for some of us [Bruce and Cass] there is no turning back". he is projecting these flaws about jason not only because that's the only way he can cope with jason's death, but he is projecting these flaws because regardless of what actually happened, he (and cass) are destined to meet the same fate. jason died for a multitude of reason that bruce may or may not have caused knowingly, and these reasons only exist because bruce knows them to be true in himself and anyone else damaged enough to find themselves on his side of the blurry line.

so, now looking a bit less zoomed in, i think it's unfortunate that jason's time as robin is often perversed by the people who should know better (bruce & alfred), and while it is bad writing on jason's character, it is great writing to show the flaws in the characters around him.

especially how it shows that grief is not always something that can become healed. bruce's guilt about his parents death amounts to something hopeful (batman), but his guilt about jason's death makes bruce cruel and childish.

tldr: no one knows the true story, so they compensate from what they do know — but by doing so they project and misinform existing characteristics of jason in order to compartmentalise the gravity of his tragic death. bruce is unable to cope normally and everyone is forced to follow the same fate, because batman's lessons are rarely wrong, even if they cause ten other problems and misunderstandings to understand.

#did this answer anything idk its exam season who even am i #dc meta #bruce wayne #jason todd #character study #saki anons #saki comic talks #put me in a box with bruce wayne and i will eat his brain #sorry idk where that came from erm

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disillusioneddanny · 9 months

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DP x DC Fic Recs

A list of DPxDC fics that don't have the following tropes:

Danny gets adopted by the Waynes

Danny is rejected by his parents for being Phantom.

The lovely @spite-sapphic-starlight started a really wonderful list that you can read here

But lets just show a little more love for the fics that don't fit those tropes.

also disclaimer: this is not any hate to those tropes, i love them dearly and have written quite a few of them myself. but apparently that's all DPxDC seems to be known for so we should take some time to highlight some truly amazing fics.

Born to Make History by Halfagone and Nightshiftshenanigans

It's a Jason Todd/ Danny Fenton Figure Skating AU with a no powers AU and it's absolutely beautiful.

I’m Falling for you (Now we’re both Falling) by Milaley, ziazippy5379

Danny is a paramedic who moves to Gotham because he wants to help people and the pay for paramedics is good. He meets former police officer Dick Grayson who spoiler happens to be his soulmate. Danny's parents struggle with the fact that they are the reason he's a halfa but they don't reject him.

A Second Life by Die_Erlkonigin6083

Danny is reincarnated and wakes up to find himself a little boy who is the clone of Dick Grayson who decides to raise his clone as his son. This isn't really an adoption AU since Danny was created as a clone and he didn't run away from the Fentons, I can't really share more without spoiling the entire premise :3 but it's very good and is a good play on the Danny is a Wayne trope.

Fall Before You Fly by DisillusionedDanny, GuardianofDawn

Danny decides to go on vacation and explore the different universes, he goes to the DC universe and joins a circus and becomes an escapologist and meets Dick who wants to learn how he's so good at what he does.

Schrodinger's Danny by Die_Erlkonigin6083

The Fentons were never Danny's parents in this AU and he became a halfa in a completely different way. Danny is the twin brother of Damian and flees into the ghost zone letting everyone think he's dead. He's younger in this AU and honestly it's such a cool take on the DemonTwin trope.

Forget the Christmas Spirit (Run Away With Me) by halfagone (milkywxy)

Danny and Damian meet in Paris right before Christmas. They fall in love on the trip and Danny decides to spend Christmas with the Waynes instead of going back to his own family where his parents make Christmas an entire thing each year.

We Lit a Match by GuardianofDawn

Danny has a gift that lets him see if people around him are going to die. He learns that he's the reason his family dies and runs away before that happens. He finds himself getting adopted by one Lex Luthor.

No bad parents Fentons, Danny runs away to keep them safe

Not adopted by a Wayne, it's Lex Luthor

it's a fun flip on both of those tropes.

Shovel Talk by SummersSixEcho

Danny and Tim go on a roadtrip for Tim to meet Danny's parents. Established relationship Tim/Danny

It's a very wonderful take on Good Parents Jack and Maddie Fenton and it's just a lovely story altogether.

Eat the Acid by DisillusionedDanny

Danny meets Conner Kent and falls head over heels in love with him. They discover that Vlad and Lex have teamed up to make the ultimate clone warrior. With the help of the Fentons and some unlikely friends they bring the clone back to Fentonworks so that they can raise their baby together away from Lex and Vlad.

These are just a few examples of fics that don't fall into those two tropes, they are all absolutely amazing and wonderful and the writers put a lot of work into these pieces of art. There are so many other fics that fall into these categories, I just don't have the time or space to add every single one but please don't act like all of DPxDC falls under the idea that Danny runs away to gotham to escape his evil scientist parents and gets adopted by the Waynes, that's a very small part of what this fandom does. It's a lovely part but it's not all that the DPxDC fandom is.

#DPxDC #DPxDC Fic Recs #Fic Recs #Danny Phantom #Batman #DC Universe

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nopejustnoped · 7 months

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with the recent gotham war stuff (and other events where bruce does or say shit like that to jason) there‘s always people who are like "but jason kills and he did [insert jason action from 15 years ago that no writer has looked back on] so its not like its not deserved" etc and like… that jason from before rebirth doesnt exist anymore 😭😭 he has not been written as a villain in a long time. [unfortunately] he is a corny anti hero who barely does anything to deserve the 'anti' part and he likes to wear that ugly outfit idk. He doesnt rly kill, he doesnt use guns. Hes nothing.

Hes been written to work with batman for such a long time now barely doing anything evil n then we are forced to see bruce torture him every week and here comes twitter user batmansdicksucker to say he had it coming like ?/€-€/€/€/€

I WISH he deserved it.

#jason todd #red hood #u cant give them this antagonistic dynamic when jason is working closely with them #batfamily

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era-the-witchy-birdkid · 1 year

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DP X DC Prompt/Idea

Long time writer for the DC fandom (mostly Batman specifically Tim Drake joins the batfam early AUs and Titans Tower AU) on Archive, Danny Fenton also known as Astroboy2025, decides three days after his ‘Accident’ to create a Jason wakes up a Halfa in his coffin fic. He only does this to help himself process his emotions after well lets be honest his death and revival. And later once the ghost attacks pick up and he picks up the mantle of a hero as a way to covertly get advice/figure out on how to fight ghosts better by transplanting all his ghosts into Gotham for Fic!Jason to fight.

Danny wasn’t expecting much to come from this, he wasn’t expecting the fic to blow up in popularity for ‘creative storylines’ and ‘unique original villains with a ghostly flare to go against the ghostly Robin now named Phantom’ it was just a vent fic with a bit of wishful thinking on his part with Ghost!Jason and Bruce's relationship being so close (He ends up writing Jason getting hugs and affirmations that Bruce still loves despite all the ghost stuff that happening now whenever his Parents go on a tirade about how all ghosts are evil and need to be ripped apart molecule by molecule)

He definitely wasn't expecting his fans to find out about the real Phantom and figure out his identity from there. (Blame Penelope Spectra she had a history unlike the others in his rogues gallery with a bloody trail across America of sharply increase Suicide rates in more isolated smaller cites/large towns that was being tracked by Redditers that had hard stopped in Amity park just a few days before he dropped the chapter of Jason facing her himself)

While the Amity Park tourism to see a IRL Hero in action, and the Anti-Ecto acts Riots, as they would later be called, made by DC fans throwing a fit about the threat to the world’s first superhero were the lesser consequence in the grand scheme of things. Finding his fan Discord was a trip and a half especially since Tucker had to hack into it into the first place because his fans we're extremely protective of his secret ID and reinforced the server a crapton to be stronger then most banks.

While Sam was insisting on this being a horrible Idea and he should try to dissuade his thousands of fans from the truth of his Identy. Danny was just chill with it after the brief panic. And the Fan Discord was super helpful for getting Advce with! while the jokes that he was Batman Adoption bait was annoying the group was amazing for ideas on how to train his powers and advice on how to better fight ghosts. the Discord even make a Power list for him so he wouldn’t forget a power because he wasn’t training it. plus the comfort they gave after Circus Gothica was A+ even with the jokes about how the Batfam curse of clown trauma, despite matching the look as a human batman isn’t real so as much as his fans joke about him being the prefect Bat bait that will not happen.

To bad after a particularly nasty ghost hate rant in front of him in ghost form while being shot at by his parents that before the server would spawn 3 chapters of Family fluff in his fic, was whatched angrily by a fan who in a fit of annoyed rage said these words. “I really wish batman WAS real, then maybe you could be safe in your home for once”

unfortunately Desiree was out and about and heard the wish granted she had no idea who Batman was so went to read the DC comics after that. Good news the DC universe is so messed up as is that Desiree decided no twisting was necessary she’d just to bring everything to life. Bad news all the supervillains now exist along side the now existing superheros and Desiree is now Kaiju sized and now way to powerful for Danny to deal with alone...

At least the now real Batfam are taking their sudden existence well? and are willing to help Danny stop the Mad Genie dispite the risk that they would pop into nonexistence (with the entire city of Gotham and the other cities, villains, and heroes made real by Desiree’s power) if she’s stopped

#dp x dc #dc x dp

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