i've seen a couple people in the notes of this very good post about fictional polyamory by @thebibliosphere say things along the lines of "oh, i've been doing it wrong :(" or "how do i know if i did this right??" or "i should probably give up and start over, i wrote this badly :(" and. no!!!!
(i AM seeing far MORE people say "oh, this clarified and helped me so much, i think i know how to fix issues i've been having with my own story" which. YES!!!!)
listen. if you're a monogamous person who's writing a polyamorous relationship, and you've been focusing mainly on The Triad and All Three Together All The Time as the endgame, that's literally fine. that's a perfectly acceptable and strong starting point for your plotting, imo. you do not need to give up on a story that you've started like this.
but the things discussed in the post Can and Should improve your execution!
you can keep the same plot beats and overall relationship arc 100%. polyamorous relationships are infinite in their formations, every one is unique. "basically a monogamous romance but with three people" Does exist, as a relationship type. you're not hashtag Misrepresenting (TM) poly people with it
BUT i do think it will help to read up on some poly people talking about how their relationships Differ from monogamous ones.
so i have outlined some basic important concepts about polyamory.
MORE IMPORTANTLY though, i've broken down some questions that you can answer throughout the writing process to strengthen your individual dyad relationships, your individual characterization, & your characters' individual feelings/experiences. this is a writing resource have fun
future kitkat butting in to say i spent over two hours writing this and it definitely needs a readmore. it is also NOT comprehensive. but everything should be pretty simple to follow! feel free to reblog if you find it helpful yourself or just want to reward me for how gotdan long this took KSLDKFJKDL.
i've grabbed quick links for a couple of the important concepts, some have SEO pitches in them but the info largely seems to be good. (if i missed anything Egregiously Gross on these sites i should be able to update the links with better ones later, since they're under the readmore.)
sidenote: this is NOT meant to be overwhelming, despite the length. if you can't read all of this, that's Okay. you do not need to give up on your writing.
here we go:
compersion!
compersion is a BIG thing in a lot of polyamorous relationships. it's joy derived from seeing two (or more) of your partners happy together, or joy derived from seeing your partner happy with someone else.
compersion is really important as a concept because it highlights that every individual relationship within a polycule is different -- and that that's a GOOD thing. it's sort of the inverse of jealousy.
by the "inverse of jealousy," i mean that instead of feeling left out and upset and possessive, you feel happy/joyous/content.
i can use personal experience as an example: it's a Relief for me when my partners receive joy/support/sex/romance/etc that i can't (or prefer not to) give them. and i love seeing my partners make each other laugh and be silly together.
it's 100% okay for a poly triad not to be together 100% of the time, it doesn't mean that the third member is being left out or not treated equally when two people do things alone together.
(i have individual dates with my partners all the time! PLUS larger 3-and-4-person date nights.)
if the third member DOES feel jealous or left out, then the polycule can have a conversation to figure out what needs/wants aren't being met, and solve that. this happens semi-regularly in my polycule, as it will happen in any relationship (including monogamous ones)! it's just part of being an adult, sometimes you have to talk about feelings.
metamours!
a metamour is someone who is dating your partner, but ISN'T dating you. this may not be relevant for people writing closed three-person romantic sexual triads, but it's a super helpful term to know.
the linked article also lists different types of metamour relationships with some fun phrasing i hadn't heard before. the tl;dr is: sometimes you'll be domestic cohabitation friends, sometimes you'll be buddies with your own friendship, sometimes you might not interact much outside of parties, every relationship is different.
there's no one-size-fits-all requirement for metamour relationships. sometimes polyamorous people will end up dating their metamour after a while (has happened to me), sometimes polyamorous people will break up with one partner for normal life reasons, but remain friendly metamours.
the goal of polyamory is NOT for EVERYONE to fall in love. it is 100% okay if this happens in your story, it happens in real life too! but it is also 100% okay for characters to be metamours without ever becoming "more than friends."
(sidenote: try to kill any internalized "more than" that you have when it comes to friendship. friends are just as important and special and vital as partners.)
of course there are a million ways for messiness to occur with metamours within a complex polycule, exactly like with close-knit platonic friend groups. however this post is not about that! there's enough "here's how polyamory can go wrong" stuff out there already, so i'm focusing on the positives here :)
open versus closed polyamorous relationships!
i'm struggling to find an online article that reflects my experience without directly contradicting at least SOME stuff. so i'll give a quick rundown
google has a bunch of conflicting definitions of open relationships and whether open relationships are different from polyamory. the general consensus seems to be that an open relationship prioritizes one partnership (often a marriage), but that each partner can have extraneous flings or long-term commitments (most often sexual in nature).
this is not typically how i use the term wrt polyamory. the poly concept is pretty simple. a closed polyamorous relationship is one with boundaries like a monogamous one. there are multiple partners in the polycule, but they are not interested in having anybody new join said polycule.
an open polyamorous relationship tends to be more flexible -- it just means that IF someone in the polycule develops mutual feelings for a new person, it's fine for them to become part of said polycule if they want to! the relationship/person is open to newcomers.
some groups will need to negotiate this all together, others will just go "haha, you kids have fun." just depends on the individuals!
with open AND closed polyamorous relationships, the most important thing is making sure that there's respectful communication and that everyone is on the same page. but there's no one-size-fits-all way to do that.
i wish i could give you guys a prescriptive "You Must Do It This Way" guide, but that's.... basically the opposite of what polyamory is about, HAHA.
feelings for multiple people!
i was gonna tack this on to the previous section but decided it warranted its own lil bit.
a defining feature (....i'm told?) of monogamous relationships is that a monogamous person only has feelings for One individual at a time. they only want a relationship with one individual at a time. or, if they DO have feelings for multiple people simultaneously, they're still only comfortable dating one person at a time & being exclusive with that one person.
this is perfectly fine!
the poly experience is generally different from this. but once again..... polyamorous people all have different individual perspectives on this.
for me, i have never been able to draw hard boxes around romantic vs sexual vs platonic relationships, & i love many people at once. my personal polycule lacks many strict definitions beyond "these are my chosen people, i want to forge a life with them indefinitely, whatever shape that life takes"
some poly people feel explicit romantic or sexual attraction to multiple people at once, some poly people feel almost no romantic or sexual attraction at all. i'd say that MOST poly people feel different things for different partners, which is not a bad thing!
some poly people are even monogamous-leaning -- they have just chosen one romantic partner who is themselves part of a larger polycule. (so this monogamous-leaning person has at least one metamour!)
or alternatively, they might have one romantic partner AND a qpr, or other ways of defining relationships. (this is a factor in my own polycule!)
i made this its own point because if you're writing a straightforward triad, this is unlikely to come up in the story itself -- but it's worth thinking about how your characters develop/handle feelings outside of their partnerships.
like, is this sort of a soulmateship, 'these are the only ones for me' type deal? in which they won't fall in love with anyone else, and can be fairly certain of that?
that's pretty close to typical monogamous standards but you Can make it work. just be thoughtful with it
alternatively, can you see any of these characters falling in love Again after the happily-ever-after? and how would the triad approach it, if so? what would they all need to talk about beforehand, and what feelings would everybody have about the situation?
it's worth considering these questions even if the hypothetical will never feature in your actual canon, because knowing the answers to these questions will help you understand all of the individuals & their relationship(s) MUCH better.
i've been typing this for nearly two hours and there's a lot more i COULD say because... there's just a lot to say. i'll close out with some quick questions that you can ask yourself when developing the dyad dynamics within your triad
first, take a page and create a separate section for each individual dyad. then answer these questions for every pair:
how does each pair act when alone?
how do they act differently alone compared to when they're with their third partner?
are there any elements of this dyad (romantic, sexual, financial, domestic, etc) that these two people DON'T have with the third partner?
if so, what are they?
are there any boundaries or hard limits within this dyad that aren't shared with the third partner?
if so, what are they?
partner 3 goes out of town alone for a few weeks. what are the remaining two doing in their absence?
(doesn't have to be anything special, it's just to get a sense of how the two interact on a day-by-day basis without the third there)
what is something that each partner in the dyad admires about the other -- that they DON'T necessarily see in the third partner?
what problem do These Two Specifically need to solve in the story before their relationship will work?
how is that problem DIFFERENT from the problems being solved within the other two dyads?
doing this for ALL THREE dyads is VITAL imo. that way, you develop complex and nuanced and different relationships that all have unique dynamics.
those questions should be enough to get you started, i hope
then After you've charted the differences in relationships, you can start to jot down similarities in the overarching triad. what does one person admire in Both of their partners? what are activities that all three like to do together? what are boundaries or discussions that all three share?
but the main goal is to figure out how to Differentiate each relationship!
a polycule is only as strong as the individual relationships within it. if two people are struggling with their own relationship, adding a third person won't fix that.
(UNLESS the third person is the catalyst for those two to, like, Actually Communicate And Work Their Shit Out. i just mean that the old adage of "maybe if we just add a third-" works about as well to fix a miserable non-communicative marriage as, uh, "maybe if we have a baby-")
AND FINALLY.
if you're not sure whether your poly romance reads organically to poly people, you can hire a sensitivity reader with poly experience. if you can't afford that, you can read up on polyamorous resources like a glossary of terms & articles actually written by poly people. (and stories written by poly people!)
you can also just.... ask poly people questions, if they're open to it. i like talking about polyamory and my own relationships so you're welcome to send asks if u want, i just can't guarantee i'll answer bc my energy levels fluctuate a lot and i don't always have time.
polyamorous people are in an uphill battle for positive representation right now & so the LAST thing i want to see is authors giving up on their stories bc they're worried about getting things Wrong. well-meaning and positive stories that treat this kind of love as normal, healthy, & aspirational are So So So Needed. even if you guys end up with some funky-feeling details.
seriously, if you're monogamous then you probably don't have a full idea of Just How Nasty a lot of people can get about polyamory. i wish it DIDN'T mean so much for you guys to want to write nice stories about us, but it does mean a lot. and it means a lot that you want to do it WELL.
in conclusion. this is not a prescriptive guide, it's just a way to raise questions. and also, you all are doing FINE.
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Hiya! May I ask for a fluff alphabet for Price, if you haven't done that already. Since I saw in a recent post you only do 8-9 letters at a time now (which is okay!), may I specifically ask for: A, B, C, F, G, H, N, & Q? Thank you! 💗
Hey there! Sure you can! I've been in the mood to write something for Price anyway, so this came at a good time ^^
Fluff Alphabet for Price
A ctivities - What do they like to do with their s/o? How do they spend their free time with them?
On the one hand, he really loves going out to do something with you. Something along the lines of the occasional short hike, taking care of your shared garden or even just taking a stroll through the city, taking in all the sights and finding new ones you weren’t previously aware of. Those are things he likes to do when he’s been home for a while now. However, if he’s gotten home not too long ago then he’d much rather just stay in and sleep a little bit. Will want to cuddle you or just have you be his background noise. Don’t be mad at him if he dozes off while you’re watching a movie together, he’s just extremely tired and needs that rest.
B eauty - What do they admire about their s/o? What do they think is beautiful about them?
He admires how resilient you are. Price knows that life isn’t easy, that it always makes an effort to throw one impossible thing after another at you, but you never seem to give up. No matter how rough life gets, no matter how often it knocks you down, you always get up, dust yourself off and continue to smile. Even if it really took its toll on you, you strive to make your life better. Although it may get you down when you’ve had the worst day of your life, you still won’t stay down forever. You do what you can, and that’s what Price loves about you.
C omfort - How would they help their s/o when they feel down/have a panic attack etc.?
When you’re sad he’ll give you a hug, provided you’re okay with it. He’s a very good hugger, his hugs are very comforting and warm. Afterwards he’ll put on your favorite movie or series and watch it with you. If enough time has passed and you still feel down, then he’ll cook something you really like. Although he knows he can’t make the sadness go away forever, he’ll try to temporarily cheer you up. If you need to talk, if you need some advice, he’s also your man. If you have a panic attack then he’ll try to calm you down by taking you to a location with few people. Price can talk for a while if he needs to, so he’ll ask you to focus on his voice. Might also give you a rather simple task to take your mind off of things, such as counting backwards from 100.
F ight - Would they be easy to forgive their s/o? How are they fighting?
If it’s you, then he would forgive pretty easily, as long as it’s not something too big. If you accidentally knock down a mug he likes, then he might sigh and be annoyed, but he’ll forgive you. If you cheat on him, then he won’t. He’s usually calm and collected, even while fighting. Sure, he could be aggressive towards you and snap at you, but he loves you, so he tries not to. It’s sort of obvious when he is annoyed, his sentences become much shorter and he’ll actively try to get away from you. Won’t yell at you, won’t do any erratic movements either, but if he’s too angry then he’ll simply walk away from you until he’s calmed down.
G ratitude - How grateful are they in general? Are they aware of what their s/o is doing for them?
Yes, he is aware and he is very grateful. How could he not be? You have the patience of a saint when it comes to him. He knows it’s rough to be with someone who is part of the military, he’s away more often than not, but you still decided to stay with him. You cook for him when he’s tired, you draw him a bath when he’s sore, you reassure him when he feels like you deserve better than him. You’re so much more than what he deserves, he doesn’t feel like he could ever repay you for everything you’re doing for him. He tries, though, but it’s never enough. Price could give you the universe and it wouldn’t suffice.
H onesty - Do they have secrets they hide from their s/o? Or do they share everything?
Aside from the obvious, such as military intel, he doesn’t really hide anything from you. Price doesn’t see the point in keeping secrets from you. You’re together, aren’t you? You deserve to know just about anything about him. He might not tell you everything from the get go, but once you’re close enough you can ask him about anything. You wanna know about his time as a private? Sure. How he came to be a captain? Yeah, he can talk about it. Just ask and he’ll likely tell you. But in the same vein he hopes that you trust him enough to tell him just about anything as well.
N icknames - What do they call their s/o?
He doesn’t really use very many nicknames. Just the classic ones, such as “love”, “sweetheart” and “dear”. Sometimes he feels the urge to call you “sunshine”, but he usually represses that since that’s what he’s called his soldiers before. As much as it would fit you, he tries not to bring work home. He likes to call you by your name too, though. But aside from that there’s nothing he really calls you.
Q uirk - Some random ability they have that’s beneficial in a relationship.
He can keep calm in just about any situation, so he won’t lash out on you. He has an air of authority to him, so it’s not too often that someone is being a dick to him. And that extends to you as well. Price is a well respected man, so not very many people will come up to you and demand something from you. You, too, will be respected by most people, he’ll make sure of that. Regardless of whether you’re shy and timid or loud and boisterous, no one will bad mouth you. Price can fight, he will protect you. He will also fight for your honor if he needs to. He may have self restraint most of the time, but no one should ever talk badly about his partner.
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hello hello! I hope you don't mind me dropping by but I just want to say I love your art so much, the way you draw vashwood is just so sweet and tender but can I just ramble about the way you draw Vash especially? More specifically, the way you draw his expressions when he's looking at Wolfwood???
I just LOVE the way you draw Vash's expression because the way you make him look at Wolfwood is so soft 😭😭😭. There's just something about it that's so tender, like whenever I look at Vash's expressions in your art I just think "that is genuinely someone who loves another person with all their heart" and it just mends and breaks my heart at once, you capture Vash's love for Wolfwood in ways I can't explain 👏
It's unbridled love mixed with the fear of hurting Wolfwood in their relationship. It's wanting to spill so much affection but holding back in fear of messing up. He looks at Wolfwood like he's longing for him so earnestly be it pre-relationship or even when they're already dating it's just so??? 💕💕💘💞💖💖💞💕
There's just something so tender and heart wrenching at the way Vash looks at Wolfwood in your art, it gets me really emotional and I hope you have a lovely day/night for real <33!!!
ouuuuu thank you so so much for your kind words and for taking the time to tell me this T_T !!! i'm glad my expressions for vash's longing gazes at wolfwood is well done enough to have this sort of response to it…
he's the kind of person that has to hold back in both words and touch when it comes to love, when it comes to wolfwood, but i think it's a difficult emotion to restrain, especially when wolfwood is kind enough to let it be.
ultimately, what they're allowed to have is the inevitable shared spaces during their travels, it's the other's physical presence, being next to wolfwood, being able to take him in through the way he simply exists. smelling smoke, seeing smoke, seeing the cigarette between his fingers, seeing the crosses littered across his person, the rosary snug around his neck, his scruff at his chin, messy bangs, messy hair, tired eyes, the canine that peeks when he speaks, and a voice carrying heavy words, but honest, and kind, and one vash could never get tired of hearing, like how he'd never be tired of just looking at wolfwood.
it's of gratitude, it's of sorrow, it's of grief, it's of love, praise, adoration, it's desperate and it's full of yearning. at first, it's a gaze he feels he has to be satisfied with until he's learned that he's allowed for more and at that point, when wolfwood has given him so much, how could he look at him in any other way?
in any case, i def like to make it known and parade around vash's deeeeeep deep deep feelings of love towards wolfwood, so i'm very happy to know i can express that clearly through his expression alone. i Also just love wolfwood so maybe the projection goes from the heart of the artist to the heart of the art.
i ended up collecting a few caps of his expressions just out of curiosity for myself :3 i have much to improve still, i'll keep on drawing vash's loving self until i can get the ultimate loving expression down!!
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Hello I stumbled across your profile and I just say I love your art style! I've gotta ask, how'd your develop it? And do you have any advice for someone who can't decide what they want their art to look like?
Thank you so much!
To be entirely honest, I don't feel like I truly "developed" my style. I feel a lot more like I finally let myself draw it! But I am incredibly deliberate with my work, and I do have clear tendencies and preferences... So I'll do my best to explain how I got to where I am now as an artist.
It's important to remember that "style" is something of a nebulous concept. It changes with you as you grow as a person, and most artists can work in and emulate many art styles! Art really is a form of communication with yourself, and your "style" is a reflection of the tendencies and preferences you have. My art does not look how it looked 5 years ago, and my art will look different 5 years from now too. I've changed, and my art reflects that!
(2012, 2018, 2023; two pieces I remember being incredibly proud of and considered my best work up til that point, and then my most recent piece)
What you need to do, as everyone will tell you, is study the fundamentals (anatomy, perspective, form and structure, lighting and shadow, color, and composition) so you have the proper tools to make the most informed decisions possible about your art, and so you can deliberately break or follow rules as you please for your desired effect. I know it sounds silly to learn rules if you're not gonna be following them anyways, but they help you be much more consistent and intentional! More knowledge is NEVER a bad thing to have!
However, I know it's a bit demoralizing to just be told to study fundamentals. Everyone knows you're supposed to do that, but it takes YEARS to learn, and people want their art to feel how they want it to now (which is very very very normal to want!)
So on that front, I have 2 follow up suggestions that I personally find helpful (of course, everyone is different, so it's not like this is the only way to learn! But, if it resonates with you, it might mean it will work for you too.)
1: Separate study from application
I believe this is beneficial for a few reasons:
If the goal of every piece is learning, it can become frustrating, overwhelming, and boring
It's harder to self critique when there are multiple variables to investigate. I like to study one fundamental at a time
Study (usually) works best with a large quantity of output, whereas application of knowledge (finished pieces) is often more satisfying and effective when you get to take your time
Deliberate practical application of what you've learned in a finished piece helps cement the learning in your mind, and also lets you get satisfying finished pieces with noticeable improvement after a good study session!
I've found that keeping these things separate helps me improve faster and more deliberately, and it takes a lot of the pressure off of both aspects! I'm not worried about my studies looking beautiful, they're just to learn! And I don't feel pressured to critique my finished pieces, cause they're just for fun and to make something pretty. I personally find this helps me have a much healthier relationship with my art.
When studying, copy! Copy things as best as you can, all the time. It gives you something to compare to for self critique (and of course, if you're copying someone else's work and you share the study, ALWAYS give credit, share the original, and say it was for study.) In application, don't copy: reference. Make it yours!
2: Let yourself do the things that feel "easy" or like "cheating"
This one is simpler: nothing in art is easy.
If something feels easy to you, most of the time it's not because it's actually any easier... It's because it's part of your natural tendencies and preferences! This took me forever to realize, but as long as you're actually doing some study, then you're learning. You don't need to learn All The Time. When you're doing the "application" portion, you should let yourself do whatever is actually the most fun and feels easiest! This is where your style will start to come through, and where you get to learn about yourself. Take the pressure off, and have fun!!!
The only cheating in art is theft. If you're not stealing, then it's allowed!
My whole life (and yes, still!) I'd get regular criticism about both my style and my subject matter. You will too. You'll see a thousand different styles, and a hundred different things to admire in each. Your heart will ache that you don't draw like others do.
But art is a form of communication with yourself. It's like your voice, or your accent; just something that's a part of you! It can be fun to mimic others', but when you sit to have a conversation you speak naturally. (I know some people want to and do change their voice, but this is a metaphor and metaphors aren't perfect)
Don't stress so much about what you want your art to look like, especially if you're not sure. There's a lot of value to be had in constant experimentation, I think it'd be rather boring to only draw one style the rest of my life. What I draw is what I want to see, right now, for who I am now! It's a part of me and comes naturally, if I let it!
I hope this helps!
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I started vnc way back when there was only one volume, stopped, and only restarted it last week 🙈 since then, I have reread it twice and will again, once I'm done with exams, as it has turned me insane. And since no one I know reads it, I just wanted to ask what your thoughts are on my theory that the reason not 'didn't reach out to vanitas' thus leading to his death is because of Ruthven compulsion on him? Cuzco after the 'ill never set you free'thing, I just can't see noel not reaching out tonight purpose. Your blog is a joy to read through, and I love your meta!
Hello!! Thank you so much! It's always great to see another person having fun with my favorite manga :D.
My thoughts on Vanitas's eventual death are. complicated. If we keep going down the path we're on now, I honestly suspect Vanitas's death is going to be more assisted suicide than murder. IE, Vanitas asks for Noé to kill him because it's preferable to the alternative.
Per Ruthven's compulsion, I definitely think it's going to come up, and I do like the idea of Ruthven trying to force Noé to hurt or kill Vanitas, but I don't think it's going to be how Vanitas dies. In a way, I think that would feel somewhat cheap.
Noé killing Vanitas because of his oath to Ruthven would make sense on a plot level. It's a nice, logical explanation for why Noé would kill someone he so clearly adores. I can see why it's a lot of people's theory! However, that explanation wouldn't really deliver on an emotional level. It's just not interesting for Noé's characterization.
For one thing, making Noé kill Vanitas when he's not in control of himself would strip away all of Noé's agency. With VnC's opening chapter, Mochijun sets us up so that the entire time we're reading, we're asking ourselves "but why will Noé kill him?" It's a big source of intrigue and suspense. And to me, finally resolving that suspense with "It's not his fault! He was artificially forced to!" feels like a major letdown. It adds nothing to Noé's character. It's answering that all-important "why" with "There is no reason why. He didn't actually want to." I think that would be a cop-out.
Through that denial of agency, I think this ending would also risk losing out on a lot of potential character development for Noé. The core of Noé and Louis's tragedy is that Noé desperately wanted to save Louis, but the only kind of salvation Louis wanted from him was death, and Noé couldn't give him that.
Now Noé has another person close to him that is also seeking salvation through death. If Noé kills Vanitas, but he's not in control of himself when he does, that misses out on a big opportunity. Has Noé come to understand salvation through death? Has his worldview changed since Louis made that request of him? Does he have it in him to kill a loved one if that's what they ask? If Vanitas's death is forced by Ruthven, then we're much less likely to get answers to those questions.
Personally, my favorite hope/theory for how Ruthven's order will play out is the idea that Ruthven will order Noé to hurt/stop/kill Vanitas, but Vanitas will manage to snap Noé out of it in the same way Noé broke Vanitas's self-hypnosis in the amusement park. There's nothing I love more than a gay little parallel.
I can see a scenario where Ruthven's oath is what pushes Vanitas close to death? Maybe Noé will be ordered to try to kill Vanitas, and that will set off whatever horrible chain of events pushes Vanitas to ask for death that final time. But even if Ruthven does order Noé to hurt Vanitas (which is a big if), I don't think it will be what causes the killing blow.
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