#i love it and i love its world i love everything about wtnv and i wanna be able to enjoy it without like. making me completely nonfunctional
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i fucking love lubelles goal of being to explain everything and ruin the joy and wonder of what makes up the damn show. feels like a backhanded acknowledgment of old nv criticism (and honestly criscsim in sci-fi and fiction these days) where people used to say “okay but whats the point, whats the plot, why does the weird stuff happen with no consequence, i dont like that its not linear, how come this happens, theres no continuity wah” Baby it was never about the plot its never been about a plot its been about the magic and joy of fucking sitting there and listening to another world for 30 minutes from a man whose just has got a lot on his plate and has two braincells. Its commentary its jazz its free form fucking word poetry that sometimes stabs you in the gut. If thats not your cup of tea then thats completely and utterly fine but that doesnt automatically define it as bad. i know i joke a lot about them having no continuity but i dont care! Id listen to anything wtnv makes bc theyre playing in the space and breathing life into new stories and changing things because they want to and each episode feels like a weird thinkpiece on whatever’s going on in our world. Not everything needs an explanation or a grander purpose sometimes its just there for the joy of writing sometimes a story can be built from talking about everything but the thing that its talking about just how cecil palmer is defined by the people around him and we are never given a description of the guy. giving explanation destroys the beauty and wonder and dont u fucking get why i fucking LOVE LUBELLE and what this arc is doing and commenting on because above all else wtnv has been commentary even in the places its stumbled and failed dont u freaking see.. question why you’re asking what the point of something is question why you care so much about numbers and things lining up and working out perfectly. people are ugly and emotional and small towns are weird and stuff gets rehashed there over and over and over again dont you see the layers? Dont you see the fucking romance in a man who praises science above all else refusing to explain something to his husband to keep the magic alive? No No? In your quest to find the answer did you forget about the joy of the question?
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A Short Piece On Cal and the Quote That Broke My Heart. (Ep 1-108 Spoilers) (CW for queer trauma)
The only context you will need is that Cecil's brother comes to visit him and in the process Cecil enters into another reality closer to ours in terms of ideology.
Up until Cal, you've spent over 100 episode with Cecil Palmer. You hear him be unapologetically himself. You hear him unapologetically fall in love and finally unapologetically get married to that man.
Welcome to Nightvale is what I would describe as an idealistic queer society. This does not mean the society in itself is 'Idealistic'. That's hardly how I would describe the horrors that sweep Nightvale on the frequent. No, what I mean is that this is a world, or at the least a town, where queer isn't even in its people's vocabulary. At no point does WTNV ever use the word 'Gay'. People fall in love and people exist as themselves without needing to explain. That is an idealistic queer society.
And then you reach episode 108, Cal. I first listened to nightvale a couple years back. In fact I believe I have only listened to this episode once. And one quote from it has stuck with me ever since. Not because it was particularly dramatic, mind you. In fact, what hit me about it was the complete opposite. Because Welcome to Nightvale broke my heart with an internal monologue that is almost mundane to us queer listeners.
Cecil anecdotes about a conversation he has with his brother in this other reality where his brother asks him if he has a girlfriend yet and Cecil recounts thinking this:
"In my life with Cal, I had never told him I would never have a girlfriend. In Night Vale, no one cared either way, but I felt like Cal would have. In this other reality, I was single, so I only said “No.” "
After over a hundred episodes of escapist queer joy, you hear Cecil, a man who has lived his life being able to just exist, feel shame. A deep seated shame conditioned into every queer person. Every time you are told things are getting better when you complain that things are still bad. Every time you are made to feel like you are unworthy of love or only worthy of suffering. No matter how confident. That trauma. That deep deep shame remains.
It is a systemic shame not found in these idealistic societies.
It's a reality check of an episode, that although intentional or not, lets you feel everything you've been conditioned to suppress. I cried for Cecil and I cried for myself. Because realising how much this character I loved didn't deserve to feel that way about who he was made it hit me how much I, as a queer person, also do not deserve to feel that way. My empathy for him reflected back upon myself and I was heartbroken.
My heart broke for a character's suffering that is just my everyday reality.
In my opinion it's one thing for a piece of media to show you your suffering; it's a whole other thing for it to make you truly feel like you don't deserve it.
#wtnv#wtnv cecil#media analysis#queer#welcome to night vale#cecil palmer#welcome to nightvale is such a beautiful weird and sad show sometimes#gaytventhusing
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i started writing this in the tags on bulk's post but i got pretty off topic so i'm just gonna put it here.
whenever theres a conflict in night vale, i like think about whats going on in the real world. finknor are really really good at satirizing very real and heavy issues and somehow finding ways to bring out the beauty and awe and community that can exist no matter how bleak things seem- it’s a huge part of what i love about wtnv.
this arc and janet specifically is so interesting to me because of exactly this.
i think part of why we're so obsessed with lubelle as a villain is bc we KNOW she's the villain. we can see her disrupting the town and using her language and “logical explanations” to get rid of things she doesn't like- to get rid of that which makes her uncomfortable. its satisfying for us to hear cecil call for the town to shut her out! its satisfying to hear of the town storming her campus, confronting her and calling her out as being in the wrong! its satisfying to know that, by the end of this season, things will be resolved in some way that leaves us feeling hopeful. that things might look different, that dynamics might change and characters will have changed, but that there is some sort of resolution coming.
it’s also heartbreaking (though very fun from strictly a storytelling perspective) to see that the efforts cecil and the town have made so far aren’t working. it’s heartbreaking to hear cecil be at such a loss as to what he can do, to try to avoid violence for carlos’ sake, to feel hopeless. to watch him put his trust and hope in someone who is promising freedom from janet's tyranny only for that to be shattered.
sometimes i wish i could go grab a pitchfork and storm on the people who are trying to explain away the existence of people i love. i would be lying if i said i didn’t sometimes feel at a loss as to what i can do- as to what authority figures i can trust, where i can put my hope. sometimes i want to yell on public radio for everyone to shut out the hateful, hurtful people in power. sometimes i feel paralyzed like i imagine carlos has in this arc. i don’t know that there will be a neat resolution to everything going on in the world right now, but i am trying to remember that there ARE people taking action. that there are people trying to make the world a better place, who want good for everyone around them. that there ARE people marching and yelling for change. that there IS beauty and awe and good and community no matter how bleak things feel. idk. i might be projecting too much here but also isn’t that what art and story is all about? just… i love this narrative bc its fun and exciting, but also bc it is such a brilliant mirror being held up to world rn. and now im gonna go back to hoping cecil is kidnapped and so so sad and scared and hoping that steve carlsburg will use his hope and love of his community and unique knowledge and perspective to save the day. or carlos or whatever. sorry im so insane ab this little podcast.
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i'm asking you abt your version of hamlet but you have to ask me about wtnv ghosts OR kris dreemurr, deal?
for this, i will ask you about both.
(it got too long i hid it under the read more)
ANYWAYS i had a breakthrough like. ten minutes ago cause i was thinking about how i'd put a spin on hamlet. cause i was talking w my director for romeo & juliet a while back and he said how important it is in shakespeare to have something that makes your production just a little special a little unique so people will keep coming to see it. if it's the same plays over and over presented w the same contexts and worlds and everything, no one will want to see it. (i mean i would but i'm. uh. abnormal). and i've been agonizing over what my spin on hamlet would be, were i to direct it (an idea which has taken control of my brain and will not let me go. this has become my dream in life and i'm literally an actor not a director). point is i found it.
i was thinking about Shitty College Kids hamlet and then i was suddenly struck w the passing thought of crime family. and then it kept coming back. and i think i might be a genius. hear me out:
hamlet's family, the royal family of denmark, is actually a crime family. gertrude may be the one who technically runs the show but really she's a mob wife she doesn't exactly make use of her power, instead letting her husband do it. her husband claudius, who has hamlet sr. killed and then marries his sister in law (the kind of wild bullshit i can imagine happening in a mafia movie, of which i have watched none (but will for research)) so he can take control of the family business. it adds a darker, grittier level to basically everything in the play; taking them from high society – royalty, even – to a shady crime family, and fits perfectly with my vision of the play: i crave violence in hamlet, and i think he deserves some blood and gore. its enrichment for him. with a modern take we can give him a gun to kill polonius with, shooting him through something more significant than a curtain (i wouldn't do a mirror obviously but hamlet (2009) i fucking love you for that) and the stakes are all heightened when bullets get involved. plus it really pushes the whole bit where hamlet is sent off to england (and would, i guess, be someone else's territory?), because in this everyone would know he was going to his death. there would be no naivety, no shock horror when he says he was sent to his doom, just people standing by and watching as this kid is sentenced to death. 5.2 is a knife fight, quick and dirty and scrappy – none of the class of a rapier duel – and it raises the stakes a lot. there are rules and regulations in swordfighting, not so much in a rage fueled knife fight. hamlet, in the end, stabs his uncle with either his or laertes' blade but im thinking his. there is no poison it is just a brutal, bloody slaughter. it gives me the darkness and violence i've been hungering for but were harder to push for in the context of a castle, of high society. they still have the power, the influence, but they're taken to a place where i can have all the grit my heart desires without it feeling out of place.
it also makes relationships between characters so much more interesting. hamlet, for example, is still a scholar, a highly emotional college kid who talks in flowery prose and has a passion for theater, but now he's supposed to be inheriting the Family Business and not a kingdom, where all his gayboy bullshit wouldn't be very out of place. it pushes him further as an outsider, as someone that people would turn against, would throw to the wolves. who does that make horatio? hamlet's friend from school, maybe tangentially related to the family but only really through hamlet? how about ophelia? daughter of the councilor to the 'king', is she actually someone that they would want hamlet to marry? and what to make of laertes, who seems to abandon denmark for france? he comes back and is almost instantly accepted back into the inner circle despite having requested leave and happily departed, is claudius gunning for him to take hamlet's place as next in line? rosencrantz and guildenstern? clearly hamlet's friends from within the business they're also at his university, did they follow him there or did they all happen to find themselves in the same place? we're there greased palms to get them in? what about hamlet? and gertrude! the family line ascends through her, it must or claudius wouldn't need to marry her to get the power, but she shows no real desire to exercise it, even when her son is in danger. what's her deal, what's her story? she must have one, she's a fascinating person.
tl;dr the version of hamlet i've been craving is apparently a mob boss au. and you know what? it's awesome.
also. consider the costuming opportunities. they are infinite, and they are fabulous.
i have so many more thoughts but sadly it is 3am and they will not all form properly so i will leave it at this
#cecil rambles#ask tag#go-to-the-mirror#dalek s01e06#i have so many thoughts about hamlet why has it become my goal in life to direct this show.#IM NOT A DIRECTOR#IM AN ACORT!!!#WHAT IS WRONG WITH ME!!!#hamlet#anyways i have to watch so many mob movies now i guess. cause i'm dedicated and shit.#this is so heavily inspired by my production of r&j but no one will ever know that cause tiny fucking local theater or whatever.#shoutout to olivier (that director) you're amazing and i love you forever
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5 ,7 and 10 for the ask game please))
5. TV show of the year? hmmmm, which to pick, which to pick. I guess I'll pick The Sandman(thats a close call tho)mostly because of Hob. im not sure why, but its a relatively common theme in stories to show why you dont want immortality, that the world will one day break you, as you watch as one by one everything and everyone youve ever loved crumbles around you. I suppose if I really stretch, I can understand where this came from, but for a kid trying thyre best to find a reason to stay alive, its not really the best lesson. and then seeing Hob say no, fuck it, there will always be beauty in the world to discover, and new, wonderful things to learn, and there is always a reason to live. idk, it meant alot to me.
7. Favorite actor of the year? Mason Alexander Park(desire in sandman), or Vico Ortiz(jim from ofmd). they are both such fun interesting people, and seeing nonbinary characters in shows I love means a lot to me, and since I want to go into some sort of film seeing them succeed is really encouraging
10. Something that made you cry this year? other than the ever present crushing weight of being alive? podcasts. in a genral note, I have cried soooo many times listening to wtnv, tma, and malevolent, but the most interest time was when I went to the wtnv live show in Boston this past summer. I started crying before the show even started. It was my first time to a big city, and I was already exited to see so many different people. as people started to file into the theater I started to notice that I felt safe. I was on my own, but I didnt feel lonely. and maybe it seems a stupid thing to cry about, but everyone in that theater was brought together by a common love, and that love was apparent. everyone was different, each dressed in their own unique way, and yet no one was out of place, including me. As someone whos always been at least a little out of place and lonely, that night meant a lot to me, and i started silently crying as the lights dimmed.
#i am so so sorry if this sounds really dramatic#i am tired and i have a candle burning which immediately activates dramatic me#also you picked really good questions#ask<3
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get to know me
tagged by @petrowriting :) thank uuu
Share your wallpaper:
its a stalagmite pillar formation from the hall of giants in carlsbad caverns
The last song you listened to: Lovely Creature by Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds (highly rec Murder Ballads btw)
Currently reading: Salt: A world history by Mark Kurlansky (phenomenally writer, digestible history is a kink i have actually)
Last movie: Bottle Rocket (1996)
Craving: limoncello ice cream & nicotine
What are you wearing right now: boxers n a waxwork records tshirt
How tall are you: 5’3 (short king fr)
Piercings: my earlobes and both nostrils
Tattoos: two on my forearms that go together (wtnv my beloved) and one on the nape of my neck
Glasses? Contacts?: glasses but i suck at actually wearing them so
Last drink: water (hungover blues)
Last show: Spoils of Babylon at my friends apartment
Last thing you ate: everything bagel
Favorite color: deep red but always battling with forest green
Current obsession: …yall know but a sweaty dog man and his manipulative male wife
Unrelated obsession: caves!! I go caving every summer also geology in general but i could talk about karsts and speleothems for literal hours and i have before
Any pets: two minor demons (cats)
Do you have a crush on anyone?: obligated to say my partner (normal angel who hates any and all horror/gore) here but also mads mikkelsen ughhh
Favorite fictional character: this is so excruciating how could i pick will graham
The last place you traveled: the ozarks (for caves)
tagging @brainrot-palace @titsgraham @dreamed-itself-waking @somewhere-in-the-trees @hannibalwills @sneaky-rat-in-disguise @bloodyrawsweet (feel free to opt of of this but know ily and also to my other mutuals who i didn’t wanna double tag ily2, think abt u constantly etc etc)
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okay so my constant derealisation is a reasonably effective coping mechanism so you know, I'm glad to have it in that way, but on the other hand it makes listening to wtnv like. The Worst Thing I Could Possibly Do To My Mental Health which fucking sucks bcus I LOVE it
#i listened to the first 70 odd episode a couple years ago but it fucking decimates me every time ive tried since#:( i want to listen to it again but the way its written is exactly the most effective way to send me into the worst brainzone#i love it and i love its world i love everything about wtnv and i wanna be able to enjoy it without like. making me completely nonfunctional#for the day :(#mine
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sayer relisten thots, s2
this came out from 2014-2015 and it really feels like it
which is to say, reminds me of that time when wtnv was the biggest audio drama, and the gateway pod of most ppl, and u could hear a lot of its influence in other pods, and a lot of pods were recommended by comparing them to night vale, "this pod is like wtnv but x"
lol i remember getting recommended sayer and wolf 359 around that time by ppl describing them as "wtnv but in space" cuz they're both horror adjacent kinda and had an audio broadcast framing device
i dont think that's applicable to wolf, and I don't think wtnv was a direct inspiration for sayer, but there are a lot of parallels, and i think both were inspired by the twilight zones
but yeah, both of these shows have a lot of comedy segments like, the weird vaguely threatening station announcements, the recreational activities that feel like mind game traps, the absurd nonsense statements from authority figures
and also the approach to horror by taking a normal mundane thing and then making it really fucked up
the disappearing reappearing door crisis feels very wtnv to me
and also the story structure and pacing reminds me of wtnv, like how, early eps would offhandedly mention bits about the wider world, and then eps later in the season would focus directly on them
and how, the eps are generally standalone but as the season goes on, the eps start to have more direct continuity with each other and the main plot progresses
im just pointing it out cuz it makes me nostalgic for that time i was first getting into this medium
lol i first tried getting into sayer sometime in 2017, but i couldn't make it far cuz i found sayer's voice too relaxing and i kept zoning out and falling asleep. only got into it in 2020 cuz i saw good smut of it and i had became more of a monster fucker then and got more out of it
i only realize now that this season had some sort of ARG thing with the weird distorted audios in the ending of some eps, if any of y'all can explain what became of it, i'd really like to know!
on that note, there were like,,, 3 episodes that had a more obtuse style and had a subplot of a scientist and their assistant maybe?? getting into office politics drama,, i think the characters were named after patrons, like i remember a guy named caufield, i assume it's related to the ARG
i also wonder if that dirt scientist that was sabotaged and buried in his lab is related to that, sayer implies that there's a wider plot there but i couldn't tell if that ever got a follow-up
on that note, the q and a mentioned a crossover with a lovecraftian actual play pod from the same network, did that ever come up in the sayer feed? or is that the thing with the staircase of leng cult that summoned the tall man
on that note, im noticing now more that aerolith is just,,, so badly run as a company and reminds me of those tech bros that think technology can fix everything while just creating more needless problems
like, aerolith wanted better automatic doors and they ended up summoning indescribable horrors from another reality, like wow good job on that one y'all
also, assuming the one off resident characters are a representative sample size, typhon has an absurd death rate
that's just really funny to me in the wider context of the world cuz sayer keeps complaining about how expensive it is to train new recruits and ship em to typhon but when they get there, they're treated as expendable
which implies a large percentage of aerolith's budget goes to just shipping new ppl to typhon probably
i love that, when sayer has to do a human voice, it comes out sounding like dr young, and he sounds like an absolute rat of a man <3
all the sayer/young interactions are so funny with the foreknowledge of what went down in s5
idk it feels like exes that are coworkers
also i really love sayer in this cuz its delusions of being the peak of efficiency and productivity is shattered in every episode by virtue of an ep having to have at least a 20 minute run time when sayer just really needed to say 2 sentences
like that ep where it was telling a scientist that he was getting brainwiped cuz he acted like a hero and aerolith can't have that. and sayer just needed to have a 20 minute monologue about the follies of man and emotion and earth or whatever
also i love how sayer's so bitchy and defensive when ppl try to be friendly with it like
a resident could be like "hey sayer, i noticed that the board ignored your research, how do you feel about that." and sayer is all like "um actually, i'm beyond human emotions i don't get angry fuck you and fuck your species stop projecting"
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since we have vaguely mentioned nightvale presents. i started catching up and relistening to nightvale and. its so much better.... sometimes a gay horror romcom can also be satire about government and the state of the world, as a treat. specifically talking about "without government we would never have schools or roads of municipal utilities or helpful pandemics or black vans that roam out neighborhoods at night" like. ok cecil thank you for saying that in 2013 i now understand everything
EXACTLY I will die on the hill of how good nightvale is when it gets shoved into the cringe corner of the early 2010s
Like even as a horror it stands up because there were just some really effective moments that made me🧍♀️except spiritually because I was driving most of the time I listened. It was always the offhand moments too that were the creepiest because they always managed to catch you off guard without changing the entire pace of the show because that’s just how it is.
also I have like a 10k+ note post circulating literally about this, but Cecil and Carlos were the motherfucking 👏 blueprint 👏 for lgbt characters in podcasts and it was especially important when it came out at that time. I’ve seen a lot of people point out how they thought Cecil was joking the first time he mentioned being attracted to Carlos because that’s just what they expected to happen but no! they let us eat for once and on the first episode too. literally insane when people talk about lgbt podcast characters and dont listen to wtnv like respect your elders!!
I would love to go back to it someday because I got very far in the story before I fizzled out but I have promised to myself I will restart one day because of how impactful it was when I first listened.
#asks#disarray#I even went to a liveshow right before miss rona picked up in the us and it was sooo fun
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Sleep heavily and know that I am here with you now. The past is gone, and cannot harm you anymore. And while the future is fast coming for you, it always flinches first and settles in as the gentle present. This now, this us? We can cope with that. We can do this together. You and I, drowsily, but comfortably
Re-Listening to and trying to catch up on WTNV now that I'm coming up on 25 has been an experience. Commentary under the cut, please read.
When I first started listening to WTNV, I was 15, just coming into my queer identity. I knew I wasn't straight, had been dating my now fiance for a few years, but I had been so intentionally disconnected from LGBT+ communities and only could exist in circles that were actively hostile to me. As I started coming into my gender identity, realizing that I couldn't lie to myself anymore and pretend not to be trans, I felt so incredibly, isolatedly othered.
Then I got into Welcome To Night Vale. Right out of the gate, Cecil fell in love with Carlos, and I felt for the first time in my life, like I wasn't alone. That somewhere out there, there was a friendly desert community, full of people just like me, who loved and supported each other.
This was in 2012, same sex marriage wasn't legal in the US yet and I had started counting my pennies to fly to another country to one day marry the love of my life, something that was "just the way things were" then. I stayed up so many nights listening to a world I was told that just didn't exist- not for the monsters and unreal happenings, but because a gay man not only was open about his love, but beloved by his community. I had been raised as a fundamentalist, isolated and told the world would hate me for what I was, I would suffer and die like a tragedy. But Welcome To Night Vale gave me a hope, a refuge from the hatred my grandparents (who raised me) tried to instill into me from the second I realized that I wasn't cishet.
Night Vale connected me with other people like me. Outcasts, "weirdos", people who didn't fit into the society I had been raised up to believe I would need to make myself smaller to find my place in. I learned that our stories don't need to end in tragedy, that we have hope and vibrance and life and history together. That we had a future together. And suddenly, I found myself having room to flourish, to grow and breathe. I found my home, and I found that in a way, Night Vale was real in our hearts. Not universally, but it was my in- the way baby Melons conceptualized a world that, despite its horrors natural and unnatural, didn't see me and my love, my identity, as one of those horrors.
It's been nine years since then. Cycling through labels and identities, until I've settled comfortably here. I'm bi, I'm a trans man, I'm GNC, polyamorous, queer. I've moved states away from the people who would rather see me in the ground than proud of who I am. I live with my partners, our cats who do not float, in our little slice of the world. The world is full of horrors, and wonder, and most of all, love. And listening to Welcome To Night Vale the other night, washing dishes and taking in the last few weeks before my 25th birthday (a personal, extremely significant milestone), I felt like I was coming home.
I'm a different person than I was when I first listened to Welcome To Night Vale. I'm not a child anymore. But that child only grew up into the man I am now because of Night Vale, because of its safe and strange community, and its connection to the community I found myself in.
This is a long ramble mostly to say, it's good to be home. Despite everything, I'm glad I can still come home.
#Welcome To Night Vale#WTNV#queer#transgender#trans#furry art#furry#safe fur work#lgbt#painted shading#simplebackground
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I got into WTNV because of your cute fanarts and I wasn't expecting a funny story filled with existential dread and clever satire
So I wanted to say thank you! It's the perfect podcast and I love it so much yesterday I fell asleep while listening to it. When I woke up I was so confused lol
Anyway, what's your favorite thing about it?
First off, thank you! I’m so glad to connect with people about it even after all these years!
Sorry to get lengthy — but my favorite thing about the show is that it was what I needed as a kid to even be able to consider having the conversation with myself about my identity. About things I had felt and known but didn’t give words to. That was it’s power.
For context, google lgbtq+ timelines in 2012. A few major things were gay marriage was illegal in 2012 in the US— it wouldn’t become legal until 2015. It only just became illegal to discriminate on basis of sexuality and gender identity. You could only just legally serve openly in the US military. Being transgender only stopping being considered a mental illness in 2012. Keep in mind many of these milestones were state by state and with exceptions— Etc. etc.
The internet wasn’t what it is today— no men in make up making wonderful beauty tutorials, no openly gay singers cracking hilarious jokes on twitter and kissing at the grammys, etc. Zachary Qunito came out in 2009 and has spoken about how it effected his acting career. Chaz Bono’s transition was publicly mocked, ridiculed, and made a spectacle. There were kids in my grade that were bullied so bad for being gay/queer that we had to have half assed and uneducated seminars about it so teachers could turn a blind eye on the slurs in the hallway. Being called gay was a popular insult that held a lot of weight. Gay was a whispered word, a dirty word, lesbian felt like a brand when my brother called me it as a kid because I guess I said Peggy Carter was beautiful with a little too much feeling while Captain America was shirtless on screen. Mind you I live in a blue state. (mind you this still all happens today)
Welcome to Night Vale was the first thing I ever consumed as a kid where an openly gay person was the main character. I remember thinking ”Oh that’s it? And now onto the weather?” when I listened to it with my cousins in their basement. It felt like a secret— like a code — “oh you listen to wtnv? i love cecil” and because podcasts weren’t what they are today — it almost kind of was?
It was the first piece of media where a person being gay was not the focus of the story— there was no coming out, there was no internal struggle, there was no traumatizing outing scene, no monologue about being gay, no external questioning, nothing. Cecil Palmer was a well spoken, humorous, unsettling, radio host with flaws and extreme passions and he was unapologetically gay. in the very first episode. And not only that— his love interest loved him back. No one died. No one made fun of him for it, no one questioned him.
I kept expecting the other shoe to drop, and it never did.
I love wtnv, even through its flaws (because no one piece of media can be everything, because nothing can be everything, and representation doesn’t exist in a bubble) because it allowed me to question what I already knew about myself with such an assuredness and kindness I had never before been afforded, and to imagine a world where I can be who I am and tell people about it like I’m telling them about what I had for lunch and no one bats an eye. That sometimes the gorgeous person that walks in the door is not out of reach, and not an impossibility, because out there, and everywhere, there are people like me and its okay to assume they are, it isn’t stupid or naive or wrong.
And suddenly! I was googling! I was reading! I was talking to people online about Night Vale, and those conversations turned into conversations of queerness, and identity, and what proper representation should look like across the board, not just in queerness. How queerness, and the idea of it being a spectrum, is a mindset that should be applied in every area of life— delving into the gray area.
Not to get Sappy, but that is my favorite thing about Welcome to Night Vale, and it always will be. It was a home for me because of its people, of its community, because no matter how ridiculous and ironic things felt, how invasive and hurtful the people who are suppose to protect us made us feel, how much you might feel like a monster— there was a small desert community where the sun was hot, the moon was beautiful and mysterious lights passed over our heads as we all pretended to sleep.
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Podcast Rec Sunday
Happy Podcast Recommendation Sunday from us here at The Vanishing Act!
1) Believer: A relatively new addition to the audio drama community, Believer tells the story of Lara Campbell, a faux-psychic that goes looking for her ex, Rose, who has gone missing in a small town where there’s definitely something...off. This show hooked us from the excellent first ten minutes (there’s some fantastic show-not-tell work done in our protagonist’s intro that we don’t want to ruin for you) and the introduction of Soda Pop, played by truly the best dog voice actor in the biz. There’s a little bit of everything for conspiracy-lovers, cryptid fans, and ghost hunters to be found here, as well as some relationship-based subplots and moments of great humor. The music is eerie and sad and spooky and feels sort of suspended in time the way the music in Lore can feel, and gives it a kinda WTNV vibe we really enjoy. Find them @believerpod
2) King Falls Am: This is a show that we fell in love with towards the beginning of our audio drama journey, one that is beloved for very good reason. They also just reached 100 episodes so if you’re worried about running out of back catalog, you’re set for awhile (we find it’s best binged in 10-20 episode bursts at a time). The show consists primarily of the broadcasts of a small-town radio station where spooky stuff tends to happen (I know, spooky things? In a PODCAST?!). Despite the promise of spookiness, it also has a real warmth for its characters, well-crafted comedy, and some fantastic worldbuilding. We got into it because the premise sounded similar to other stuff we were enjoying at the time, but it ended up having a really unique vibe of its own with lovable characters and a super vivid world it’s very easy to get immersed in. Find them @kingfallsam
3) We Fix Space Junk: Moving on from spooky small towns, here’s a space sitcom for your listening pleasure! Look, even if this wasn’t one of the tightest, most well-designed shows out there (it is), or if it didn’t have a banging theme song (it does), or if the acting wasn’t committed, specific, and excellently directed (they are), the writing alone would be enough to recommend this show. This is an old-school sci-fi comedy a la Douglas Adams and it. is. lovely. We love odd couple bickering! We love reluctant fugitives who become part of a team because they have no other choice! We love saying fuck capitalism and the debt system (but in, like, a fun way)! We love AIs and cyborgs! Also episodes are roughly 10-20 minutes long so they’re lovely little bite-sized bits of wonderful space adventures. Also maybe weird note, but Kilner’s voice is so so soothing, it’s just nice to listen to. Find them @wefixspacejunk
4) Arden: Do you like true crime? Do you like odd couples who bicker but slowly grow on each other? Hilarious fake advertisements? Shakespeare references? Genuinely intriguing mysteries? Oh boy this is the show for you! The show is about the search for answers about the disappearance of a young starlet named Julie Capsom (star of a movie called Jane Austen Fight Club which like, fucking genius I want to watch this film NOW) and two women who take on the search. This show is so ambitious and innovative and paced so incredibly well--it’s not just a straightforward take or a spoof of the true crime/investigative podcast form, it’s a genuinely good mystery with compelling characters and some really funny moments that never been out of line with the more serious aspects. They have a new season coming out now so it’s a perfect time to get caught up! (Also genuinely, those ads? Amazing. Aural emojis are a true fave.) Find them @ardenpodcast.
As always, if you love any of these pods or fall in love with them because of this post, PLEASE leave a review! We’ll be leaving reviews for all of them today as part of #AudioDramSunday. And if you have any recommendations of podcasts, send them out way, we’d love to listen!
Happy listening!
#podcast recommendation#podcast recommendations#podcast#we fix space junk#king falls am#arden podcast#believer podcast#arden pod#audio drama#believer#new podcast
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are there any other podcasts youd recommend? im caught up on critical role & magnus archives and want more good fiction thats not rigidly hetero
as always ill shamelessly plug my gay podcast artificial ghost radio, but its not fiction based - these ones are! these are just from my personal library but theres plenty out there, but im mainly putting down ones you’d like based off CR and TMA
The Penumbra Podcast (sci-fi, fantasy)
There are two main universes with many different linear story arcs within each: Juno Steel and the Second Citadel. Juno Steel is a neo-noir set on Mars and focuses on Juno Steel, a private eye. If you like being sad, being gay and doing crimes, its for you. The Second Citadel is a fantasy setting following several different knights, trackers, scientists, and monsters and their experiences living in a not-so accepting world. If you like being sad, being gay and high fantasy bullshit, its for you.
Wolf 359 (comedy, drama, thriller, sci-fi)
Space crew full of unlikely characters trying their best to keep their ship from falling apart with a roll of tape and hope. Includes some horror and enough found family to kick your ass in half. Very emotionally distressing, but it’s the best in its genre - you can’t find a better space podcast that gets you like Wolf 359 does.
The Bright Sessions (sci-fi, drama, slice of life)
A therapist records parts of her sessions with super-powered people, helping them deal with mental illness, sexuality, and other problems while also helping with controlling their powers through mindfulness. It’s a super engaging and emotional podcast, and I only started it recently!
EOS 10 (comedy, medical drama, sci-fi)
Another set in the future, another set in space. The podcast follows Ryan Dalias as he begins working as a doctor on a big-ass space hub, while also helping their head surgeon get sober. Oh, also there’s space pirates, bounty hunters, dimension and time travel, and evil organisations trying to fuck up Ryan’s day at every turn
Welcome to Night Vale (comedy, horror)
A classic! My first podcast! It’s all a broadcast of a radio host (Cecil) in a small desert community somewhere in America that is full of the strange, cryptic and supernatural. It all reads more like poetry than prose in times - people die but they get better. Its almost like if a town actually existed like how a deranged conspiracy theorist thinks it does; all their theories are correct.
Alice Isn’t Dead (thriller, horror, drama)
My favorite of the night vale presents podcasts; a woman quits her job to become a truck driver looking for her missing wife, who she assumed had died. Similarly to WTNV, it sounds very poetic and beautiful at times, but it is horrific, and terrifying, and beautiful. I can’t describe it any more or it’d spoil the whole thing.
Within the Wires (drama, sci-fi, dystopia)
Yes, half of these are night vale presents podcasts. Within the Wires has a few seasons now that are all different stories within the same universe; a society/world reformed after a big calamity/war that is supposed to be perfect, but the podcast follows the stories of those that can’t exist within the system (I’m being vague because everything is a spoiler). The first season is formatted like relaxation/meditation tapes found in an institution, the second is a series of guided museum tours. I highly recommend it if you like vague endings, being sad, but love being gay even more.
The Orbiting Human Circus of The Air (drama, comedy, magical but in a Christmas miracle way not in a Harry Potter way)
So the guy that wrote Hedwig and the Angry Inch and the lead singer/songwriter for the Music Tapes made a podcast set in turn of the century France about a janitor that dreams of being a radio host, but is painfully clumsy and awkward. The podcast features his dialogues as well as excerpts of the radio show The Orbiting Human Circus of The Air that is being broadcasted in a ballroom at the top of the Eiffel tower, where the janitor also works. It’s cheesy, its over the top, its theatrical, and its VERY holiday appropriate this month!
King Falls AM (comedy, sci-fi, found family)
I know we talk about found family a lot in this bitch but the two AM radio hosts in this podcast say “you’re like a brother to me, i love you” in almost every episode. It’s set in a small town, two people doing a radio show together and dealing with the weird people that live in King Falls. Ben is a local and Sammy just moved there, so he has trouble adjusting to the ghosts, werewolves and aliens.
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Love Simon AU - Christmas Special
Read on Ao3!
Merry Christmas to my lovely @softanxiouspatton!! This is my little gift for you, sadly I can't do much else, so I hope you can enjoy this thoroughly, love you 💜
Wtnv taglist: @softanxiouspatton @suffering-is-my-comfort-zone @pushussmollworld @mylifeisadeceit
Word Count: 1,829
Characters: Cecil, Carlos (and a little cameo 👀)
Pairing(s): Cecilos
Warning(s): This is just pure fluff for once
Summary: Simple snowy evening around town for two teens that only wanted hot chocolate and instead got each other flustered every five minutes. Oh, also they're waiting for Christmas to come, sure.
A/N: Please be aware that this is a spinoff from an AU I still have to write. The AU is going to be set in the Love, Simon universe and here Cecil is blind and Carlos is nonbinary (he goes by both masculine and neutral pronouns so if you see me abruptly changing them in the narration it's normal). Other than that this is very very simple and I just wanted to try to do something with this universe since I can't work on the bigger project yet, the events all take place after the ending. (Don't worry no spoilers)
✾
❝And the hair on my neck was rising
A feeling new and surprising
But it wasn't the sound that made my heart pound
No, it was because I found her hand is in mine❞
« Come on! »
« Are you sure this is a good idea? »
« Just trust me, Cecil. »
Carlos was leading his boyfriend by the hand, both of them covered from head to toe in the warmest clothes they owned. Puffs of air left their breaths as they spoke.
« Alright. » Cecil tightened the grip as Carlos notified him of any step or obstacle he had to be mindful of.
They got to the ice rink, placed momentarily in the middle of the town's plaza and paid to get a pair of skates each. After making sure they were tight enough, Carlos climbed onto the rink, ready to help the other up.
« There's a step. »
Cecil heaved a foot, but not high enough to place it on the ice. « Aw. »
« Are the skates too heavy? » Carlos teased.
« Maybe. » there was the hint of a grin on the other's lips.
« Hold on. »
As if it were the most usual thing to do, he gripped at the edge of the rink with one hand to steady himself, while he wrapped an arm around Cecil's waist to lift him up.
« Guess you're very strong. » was everything a particularly flustered boy could comment after being dragged dangerously close by his partner.
Carlos simply giggled.
There were many attempts from the scientist to make the other build confidence and not keep a hand on the rink.
« It's only ice, Cecil. » he repeated over and over. « It's solidified water. »
« I know that. Still unreliable. »
« It's like the ground, but the only difference is that it's ... slippery? »
« That was very scientific of you. »
« It was my latest discovery. » Carlos played along with a faked seriousness. « Will you now let me hold both of your hands? »
« Five more minutes, mom. »
When hopelessness washed over him, Carlos noticed something around them, something that had to do with water but not the ground. With the sky, on the other hand, it did. And it was raining down on them. He gasped as realization struck him.
He removed the other's glove from the hand he had been holding, ignoring the confused sentences. Then, he held Cecil's arm outward, as if he were trying to make him catch what was falling from above.
« Is ... Is it snowing? » a small smile ghosted over his lips.
« Can you feel the snowflakes? »
« Yeah. » the smile grew wider and he instinctively cupped his hands, forgetting about his fear of falling face-first on the ice.
Carlos found the scene endearing, his boyfriend looked determined to gather as much snow as he could, though it melted as soon as it reached his palms, little white spots turned into transparent drops in milliseconds.
« You're adorable. » he gave voice to his thoughts, taking this time both Cecil's hands and tugging forward while he skated backwards.
Cecil almost didn't even realize they were moving around the rink together. And they didn't fall once! Despite maybe one pretty dangerous moment.
They were walking around town again, hands never leaving each other, while looking for the nearest café to get some warm drink.
« Was it so bad? »
« It was terrible. » Cecil commented, then he leaned on the other. « I loved it. »
Carlos placed a kiss on top of his head before walking toward the coffee shop.
Once inside, they got to their seats and waited for their orders to arrive. The snow hadn't gotten any stronger, but was still not determined to stop.
The two were conversing as they had never done anything else in their lives, reaching the topic of the town's Christmas market around the centre.
« Oh, before I forget. » Carlos dug into their bag, taking out a pair of tickets and placing them on the table.
Cecil reached and felt two identical pieces of paper. « What are those for? »
His fingertips trailed over the surface of a ticket. He found braille.
« A science museum? »
« They're a gift. » Cecil looked confused. « It's very advanced and they have reproductions of exposed objects you can touch if you can't see. There are also art museums that are starting to do that, we can go there too if you'd like and if you don't then it's fine, I can- »
« Carlos. » a hand was placed on theirs. « You know I'd gladly listen to you go off about science for the rest of eternity. » his voice grew impossibly softer. « I'd go anywhere with you. »
Carlos didn't even have the chance to respond as another voice flew over them.
« That's about the gayest thing I've ever heard. »
Maureen herself was standing next to their table, a wide grin spread across her face, while Cecil hid behind his hands.
« And you're the one I've ever seen. Wouldn't you agree, Michelle? » loving, darling, sweet and genius Carlos to save the day.
That was an effective way of flustering both of them, whose faces were subtly heating up. Maureen tugged at the girl she was holding hands with, motioning for them to move away.
« Tell your dog I said hi! » Cecil called after her, amused, he did not need any kind of sight to know she didn't even turn to him.
« Whatever. » he heard afterwards, as the steps' sound grew quieter and more distant.
The only other interruption was the waiter placing the cups of hot chocolate in front of the two. After that, silence as they waited for the drink to cool down.
« Actually, » Cecil took a small USB out of his jacket's pocket. « I made something for you, too. » he held his hand out, flash drive right in front of the other's face.
Carlos lit up, despite having no clue of the contents of the USB. « You didn't have to. » they murmured fondly. The thought alone of the gift made him already giddy, maybe the halo of mystery it held was contributing too.
« It's nothing grand, really. » Cecil was looking down, his voice hesitating for a moment. « Remember I have that microphone on my room's desk? » the other nodded. « I used it to tell a story. I pretended I was talking to the citizens of an imaginary town, tried to narrate their lives. So I decided to put you into it too and make ... an original gift, I suppose? »
His partner was smiling so wide they weren't able to respond: Cecil was already about to continue, say that maybe it was kind of weird he had done that.
« This is the best thing I've ever heard! » Carlos encouraged instead. « I'm happy you put me in the story, really. Thank you, Cecil, I'm sure I'll love it. » they promised, reaching for his hand for the billionth time that day, as if Cecil weren't able to practically feel their loving gaze on him.
« I've always wanted to be a radio host cause my voice is one of the only things I'm mostly sure of. » he explained, his eyes falling back to the surface of the table, as a tired flower would bow its head under the weight of the rain.
He felt his hand being held tighter, a suggestion for him to continue.
« So, uncertain of what surrounded me, I made up universes in my mind where the weirdest events made sense. » it was like he was keeping something in his thoughts, something he had wanted to let out for the longest time but hadn't been able to. Deprived of the right time and chance.
« But, » he began, looking oddly right into Carlos's eyes. « But now, thanks to you, I think I can be sure of the outside world too. »
Saying that they melted on the spot was an understatement. Saying that their brain had malfunctioned and short-circuited was part of the truth.
If they could just lean in ... if they could just lean in and place a hundred, a thousand and then another hundred kisses over the boy's face.
« I can't say anything else except I'm honored to be in your life. » so what Carlos did, instead of all that, was pull one of Cecil's hands and place a quick but gentle kiss on top of it. « And you have no idea how grateful I am for you. »
After a couple more of "stop, you will make me cry, I have a reputation", they made it out and back into the centre of town, Christmas lights hanging from all possible locations and houses around them. The quantity would have been enough to shut all the town's electricity at once.
They simply walked around, admired places and wished to buy all the candy they could find without having the possibility to do it.
Reminiscing was mostly what they did, though. Even without telling each other, a place, a sound, a simple memory connected to a song. But when the ferris wheel came into Carlos's sight, words had to be definitely brought up.
They just stood there, without unlinking their arms.
« Hey, look, » they said, pointing upwards at the big lit-up construction moving slowly under the night sky.
« Yeah sure, I can see your point. » Cecil retorted in that tone that sounded obviously sarcastic but also not quite.
Damned slang and the English language.
« Gosh, sorry, I was distracted- »
« By the blinding lights? »
« Cecil, please- » they couldn't contain their laughter any longer.
« Oh, you're amused now, I see. »
« No, you don't. »
Even louder laughter spread out in the semi-quiet road they were walking on.
« I just saw the ferris wheel. »
« Oh. »
« The same blue and white lights. I can barely distinguish people from the cabins from down here. » they focused on the structure, while their senses ignored Cecil shifting and placing himself in front of them.
His hands traveled up to their shoulders until they reached their cheeks. Carlos didn't really mind as they kept talking, it happened that Cecil did that out of the blue, sometimes there was no reason at all.
Despite that, this time, there was.
Cecil surged up slowly, placing a soft kiss on their lips while Carlos's words faded away. He then hugged them as tight as his strength permitted.
« I love you. » he whispered, burying his face in their chest.
« That's one of the only two things I know. » Carlos was quick to return the embrace, bathing in the essence of the moment. « I love you too. »
#cecilos#cecil palmer#wtnv carlos#carlos the scientist#wtnv#welcome to night vale#fanfiction#wtnv maureen#wtnv michelle#purp's writings
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ok this is gonna be word salad and extremely nonlinear but hear me out. i read a fic where cecil from wtnv shows up at the magnus institute and jon attempts to take his statement but he and the beholding just end up being super confused because cecil isn’t scared of any of the horrors he describes. and it just made me think. like. idk. i have said before that we, as people, as the inventors of organized religion, make gods. we give gods their power with our belief. and the entities are just fear gods, right? so theoretically, if you aren’t scared of them, they have no power. even the avatars who chose to serve their entity behave like they still fear it, with like, say, the whole creation of the institute as a near literal shrine thing. the entities are manifestations of concepts that are a natural and eternal part of the world, but because of...something, they go beyond the “normal” level of fear a person has for whatever it is? idk like okay. i am scared of the dark. i am scared of spiders. i am scared of gore and wide open spaces and closed spaces. i am scared of abandonment and being watched. etc etc i am scared of every single fear. significantly scared. and i have always considered myself easily spooked. but for some reason tma doesn’t scare me. at all. which was honestly a shock and i’ve been speculating why my apparent fear tolerance is insanely higher than i thought? and i was like well i literally have two anxiety disorders, to be a functioning person i force myself to do things that scare me every single moment of my life. and to do that i had to both accept and separate myself from my fear. it exists, but it doesn’t control me. and then there’s that post about the inherent romanticism of the entities because yeah there IS something enthralling about all of them. i have been saying things like “i want to be MORE than myself” for years. avatars have that energy. and it’s all a fantastic only tangentially related analysis of the human relationship to fear and power and i don’t quite know what it means but i need to talk about it. something about being both scared of something and loving something. but back to the point (what is the point) well there’s the essay i wrote a couple weeks ago, which included the argument that ultimately we as individuals can determine what we care about in our lives, that we aren’t beholden to the vast wide reaching events of the world—at least, not in the sense that the little things don’t matter. we can’t escape the big forces that shape us but we CAN choose what to do with what we’re given. fear is an inescapable constant but it’s also what you make of it. i’ve seen a post that says something like “jon copes with becoming a eldritch fear monster by doubling down on caring about people” and like. YEAH THAT’S IT. THAT’S THE POINT. you can do that. not to drag good omens into this but it’s about the CHOICE it’s about the ABILITY TO CHOOSE as an ESSENTIAL FACET OF HUMANITY it’s about holding onto that humanity in the face of whatever the fuck is trying to tell you something different it’s about all of us turning tma into a comedy its about the sheer number of love stories that just forced themself into being because LOVE IS SO IMPORTANT AND HUMAN it’s about cecil being HAPPY surrounded by terrors every day. and i KNOW tma won’t have a happy ending and that’s FINE because it’s still reinforced ideas of human nature that are essential to creating our own happy endings in our own lives amongst our own fears and just. you are nothing. you are alone. you are just meat. you are insignificant in a vast universe. you will never know everything. you will die and your body will be returned to the earth and eaten by worms. you will spend your existence in an endless search for the impossible. you can never be sure you are in complete control. but you are human and you are HERE and you can love and you can choose and THAT is how you win
#*clenches fist* IT’S ALL CONNECTED#AND IT ALL COMES BACK TO MY ESSENTIAL MESSAGE OF HOPE AND HUMANITY#rambles#long post#tma#i’m so sorry for how long and incoherent this is but i needed to say it!
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(so this is super long and mainly about WTNV because that’s the part I understand, or... at least have spent a lot of time thinking about, but there’s definitely a heavy component of comparison between the two series in this)
@vildflower said: I’ve been thinking how wtnv and tma approach similar concepts of vaguely otherworldly entities who are only somewhat connected to the universe that they seem to operate in vs. the universe that they seem to exist in
so this is all super interesting stuff thank u!!!! I just needed to get to the computer to go over it properly bc tbh it deserves it
vildflower said: like,, tma has the whole concept of rituals and avatars whereas wtnv could arguably have. a hierarchy? like when you think about it;; huntokar, the distant prince, the woman from italy, even the great golden hand, are ancient and possibly the closest to ‘gods,’ who dont interact w nightvale often but either have vested interest in it or are able to interact w it more easily due to number of reasons as compared to, like, the rest of the world?
Part of the reason I listened to The Magnus Archives in the first place was because I’d heard hints of the connection between belief (fear specifically, as it happened) and reality, and the tangible effects that this connection has. I have pretty much always interpreted Night Vale along similar lines, but now having listened to TMA... I don’t feel like the execution is all that similar?
While the lines are super fun to draw, WTNV doesn’t have such clear divisions or, well... I guess TMA didn’t, either, but I don’t think WTNV does have such clear organizational structure?
I think the/a key difference between WTNV and TMA is that not all of the entities of Night Vale necessarily tie back into an overarching force, or at least... the same overarching force. Which you go into, but that’s just such a core aspect of TMA that it at least feels pretty distinct.
And the gods of Night Vale, I think, all have a much clearer and even more “relatable” sentience than the Powers. The gods have trouble communicating with other people, in various ways, but they also, say, express regret or ask for coffee when they do communicate.
vildflower said: and then theres the smiling god who could be said to be in a category of his own, or even perhaps in the same category as cecil- the way the smiling god’s existence seems to be in direct connection to desert bluffs/the joyous congregation and cecil seems to ‘depend’ on nightvale and its residents. or maybe it would be more accurate to equate station management and the smiling god, both finding ways to communicate w their respective towns through 'avatars’: cecil & kevin.
Yeah! If being a “Voice” means anything, I do think it would be related to these gods... I guess it would’ve been Huntokar, once, for Cecil. (And now, well... I don’t know. But if bloodstone worship is just happening, that’s a lot of undirected faith, and I feel like it needs to go somewhere... or to something.) And yup, for Kevin, it would be the Smiling God.
However, one thing I’m hoping we’ll see from this arc is addressing the fact that what the Joyous Congregation THINKS is the Smiling God is apparently really different from what it actually is. Even some of the church elders - the actual pastor - believed that it was the centipede, and this would seem to indicate that’s not true.
I mean, if nothing else It Devours! was pretty clear about the fact that the centipede was just an animal, so I don’t see it or anything like it having plotted or directed someone to exploit people’s brains for labor in the future
So I wouldn’t put the Smiling God in the same category as Cecil, or even Kevin, but I think Cecil and Kevin occupy the same category like you said...
For what it’s worth, I’ve always thought of Cecil more like an “oracle” (even before Alice Isn’t Dead!!) - giving advice or answering questions, kind of a guide, if in a sort of opaque or enigmatic way, whether he wants to be or not. And then Kevin is more like a prophet - offering a vision of how things should be, giving commandments, etc, regardless of what people might ask for or what would help them.
vildflower said: continuing this heirarchy the next lower tier would perhaps be city council and the librarians which have pretty fixed, smaller areas of direct interaction w nightvalians. there’s also the spire! which sounds quite similar to the spiral, i think….
I think that’s a good example of how it’s different... “Barks” sounded like the kind of thing that could have been related to the Spiral, that sort of distortion. But the purpose was different - the Spire wanted to bargain, and from the sound of it it’s a lot more open about its demands (iirc: Night Valian “Thanksgiving” involves going out to thank the Spire for its “mercy”). It’s also a known destination.
People in Night Vale know what it is to them. They may not know what it is exactly, but they do know the role it plays in their community. So while it absolutely fits into the structure of Night Vale, I don’t think it’s that similar beyond some (admittedly major) aesthetic elements?
All of those forces in Night Vale, the librarians and the council etc, while indeed forces and while they definitely relate to the human citizens in weird ways... they’re still citizens.
The Powers are TIED to the world of TMA, but an explicit part of it is that they’re fundamentally alien to it, too, and basically need to be forced in.
vildflower said: but yeah,, hope you don’t mind the long rant rip aksk but at this point I’m pretty sure one could draw up a list of some 15 nightvale entities too lmao
(fdsdgh no you don’t need to apologize, I loved it and I’ve been thinking about this kind of thing a lot anyway too!!)
vildflower said: HOW COULD I FORGET! the glow cloud interacts w an even smaller group of people (the PTA) than the city council + angels!! I’d say they’re actually at the lowest rung cause they seemed to only be interested in josie; maybe their attachment to them in turn lead to be attached to nightvale even after she died?
actually the Glow Cloud works w/ the school board and seems to end up in conflict w/ the PTA and I only remember this because I was checking on it for something recently oops.
ALSO THE ANGELS... YEAH THAT’S NEAT because!! they’re the only part of this that has an explicit connection to belief in canon!!
“They are all named Erika with a K. All angels are equal to all other angels. They share all memories and all physical sensations. They experience everything simultaneously. Their minds are overwhelmed with enlightenment and pain.
“They have no centralized leadership, but they do have committees, lots of committees. These committees do not have titles nor objectives. The committees simply emerge as needed...
“Angels have no bodies, only visual projections of winged, barely humanoid forms. These forms are dreamed up by those who see and acknowledge them, and may vary based on the viewer.
“The secret hierarchy of angels is an ethereal mass of feelings and thoughts made manifest by necessity. They’re only individual beings because we imagine them so, but they are collectively beings.”
But I think, yeah... Night Vale is, at its core, a community. And the worldbuilding of WTNV reflects that, even to the extent that belief is involved. I mean, really, the world does run on “belief” it’s just not a supernatural thing... We believe in the necessity of our social structures, so we create and act on them.
And that’s what happens in Night Vale, it’s just that in Night Vale, a divine Glow Cloud runs the school board and the librarians will eat you. All the “forces” that we expect are there. Even though they’re strange (to us, at least), it’s all centered around the maintenance of a community. TMA has a much larger scope.
theres that whispering forest too and omg the desert otherworld, and the black star in ‘a story about you’ & other episodes; entities that manifest more as locations than sentient beings?
So yes!! Night Vale as a place is definitely a gathering point for the weird. I think of Hiram’s favorite memory in this context, too - Hiram was happy in Night Vale because he could just live, for a while, anyway. Or at least, when people were upset, they weren’t upset by his nature as a five-headed dragon (who cares, right?) but because of what he did)
It does have a clear structure, but it’s not the same kind that the Powers operate under - WTNV (depending on interpretation, and none of it is canon tbh, as much as I love it) and TMA are both very different explorations of the connection between belief and reality.
Like the Whispering Forest is... well, apparently it’s its own town now. But it was sort of the local weird forest; it was... a citizen, maybe. In the way, indeed, that the Glow Cloud still is! It just wants to live (and grow. and expand) and Night Vale is a place it can do that.
The Desert Otherworld seems to be connected to the Smiling God, although we don’t know much about how or why or if it’s always been that way. Dana saw some things, though, like when she almost forgot herself in the image of a triangle (iirc), not to mention the rumbling and whatever’s up with the Mudstone Abyss... And then it does have its connection to Night Vale, too, through the Dog Park... There’s a LOT going on w/ the Otherworld; that’s basically its own post dsfdgfdg
And the dark planet lit by no sun is like. I admit I’ve never thought of it in the same light as the other things before! So I’d want to do that before going into it but that raises some SUPER interesting possibilities and if you have more thoughts I’d love to hear them! It definitely merits that further consideration.
So in summary: TMA has rituals and avatars, and WTNV has community. I think.
#welcome to night vale#wtnv#the magnus archives#wtnv spoilers#tma spoilers#spoilers#kevin //#smiling god //
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