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bonefall · 6 months

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⭕️Hey Bones! Is it ok if you explain and/or elaborate how Crowfeather is abusive to Breezepelt if please?⭕️

I do KNOW that crowfeather is indeed, abusive to Breezepelt, due to the fact that he emotionally and/or physically neglected him - with child neglect being known to BE a form of child abuse - and I also heard that he slashed and/or hit him within one of the books, which I believe is in the book Outcast, in chapter 16.

But I also wish people would talk and be informed about it more within the fandom, because in the parts of the fandom I’ve known portrayed Crowfeather’s neglect on Breezepelt as negative and bad, but not in a way that made me think and/or feel: “Wow, that’s pretty bad. That’s…actually abusive.” I suppose? So I hope more people will talk about it more in that type of way.

Also, please be aware that I have NOT read PoT, OoTS, etc. or barely any warrior cats books, since the majority of the information I got from the series is from the wiki and the fandom, so that probably explains why I didn’t know this part of Crowfeather’s character is as bad as it actually is until now. Also, feel free to talk about Crowfeather’s abuse on Breezepelt I haven’t mentioned and/or don’t know right now as well if you want.

I’m SO sorry that if this ask is unintentionally quite long, and feel free to make sure to take all the time you need to answer it. Thank you!

OH LET'S GOOOO

Breezepelt is both physically and emotionally abused by Crowfeather. I'm not talking about only child neglect; he is screamed at, belittled, and even once hit on-screen.

The fact that Crowfeather both neglected and abused him is very important to the canonical story of Breezepaw. There's actually a lot more to this character than people remember! Even from his first appearances he displays good qualities, a strained relationship with his father and adult clanmates, and is clearly shown to be troubled before we understand why.

As many problems as I have with the direction of Breezepelt's arc (especially Crowfeather's Trial), his setup is legitimately a praiseworthy bit of writing from Po3 which carries over into OotS. To say that Breezepelt was not abused is to completely miss two arcs worth of books SCREAMING it.

BIG POST. Glossary;

INTRO TO BREEZEPELT: The Sight and Dark River

ABUSE: Outcast, Social Alienation, the Tribe Journey.

DARK FOREST: How these factors push him towards radicalization.

For "brevity," I'm not getting into anything post-OotS. I'm just showing that Breezepelt was abused, the narrative wants you to know that he was abused, and that his status as a victim of child abuse is CENTRAL to understanding why he is training in the Dark Forest.

INTRO TO BREEZEPELT: The Sight and Dark River

Our very first introduction to Breeze is when Jaypaw walks off a cliff in the first book of Po3 and is rescued by a WindClan patrol. He's making snarky remarks, and Whitetail and Crowfeather are not happy about it. Whitetail snaps for Crow to teach his son some manners, and Crow growls for Breezepaw to be quiet.

But our proper introduction to him is at his announcement gathering, when Heatherpaw playfully introduces him as a friend,

From the offset something's not entirely right here between Breezepaw and his father. He's cut off by Heatherpaw here, but he's touchy whenever his father is involved, and we're not entirely sure why.

Throughout Book 1, he's just rude, with a notable xenophobic streak. He's a bit of a mean rival character for Lionpaw, as they're both interested in the affections of Heatherpaw and make bids to get her attention, but nothing particularly violent yet.

He participates in the beloved Kitty Olympics and gets buried in liquid dirt with Lionpaw, basically a rite of passage for any arc.

(And Nightcloud has a cute moment where she watches over them until they fall asleep)

As the books progress, the relationship between Crow and Breeze visibly deteriorates. They start from being simply tense with each other in The Sight, to the open shouting and hitting we see in Outcast.

In the very first chapter of Dark River, we learn where his behavioral issues are really coming from;

Crowfeather.

Breezepelt is getting xenophobia from his father. Occasionally he says something bigoted and his dad will agree and chime in, and those are the only positive moments they have together.

(Note: In contrast, Nightcloud explicitly pushes back against xenophobia, chiding Breezepelt for his rudeness to Lionpaw in back in The Sight, Chapter 21. The Sight is the book where a lot of "evidence" that the Evil Overbearing Woman is actually responsible for the rift between father and son but. No. She's not. Though she can be overprotective; Crow and Breeze have a bad relationship when she's not even around in Breeze's first appearance and even his Crowfeather's Trial Epiphany refutes it. Anyway this post isn't about Nightcloud.)

So he starts acting on his bigotry, accusing cats in other Clans of stealing, running really close to the border. What's interesting though, is that this is not entirely his doing. The first time we get physical trouble from Breezepaw, DUSTPELT aggressed it. Breezepaw and Harepaw were just chasing a squirrel and hadn't yet gone over the border at all.

We learn that WindClan is teaching its apprentices how to hunt in woodland, and tensions between the two Clans is starting to escalate as ThunderClan isn't entirely trusting of their intentions.

The second time, fighting breaks out over him and Harepaw actually crossing the border and catching a squirrel. WindClan is adamant that because it came from their land, it's their squirrel. So it's as if Breezepaw is modelling the aggression around him, learning how to behave from the older warriors and his father.

When he joins Heatherpaw and The Three to go find Gorsetail's kits in the tunnels, he's grouchy towards the ThunderClan cats, but very gentle with the kittens. Notably so. When Thistlekit is dangerously cold, he cuddles up next to her, and even assures Swallowkit when she's scared,

Through this entire excursion, he's the one in the comforting roles for the kittens. Breezepaw is the one who is taking time to tell the kits they'll be okay, that he'll protect them, and physically supporting them when they're weak, even when he's terrified.

And it's always contrasted to Heatherpaw who's way more 'disciplined,' as a side note. It's a detail I'm just fond of.

All this to point out,

Breezepelt displays his best qualities when he's away from the older warriors of WindClan, and he's at his worst whenever he's near Crowfeather. Even while he's essentially just a bully character for The Three to deal with. He's gruff but cooperative when it's just him and Heatherpaw interacting with The Three, but mean when there is an adult to please.

We're getting to the on-screen abuse now, but Po3 actually sets up Breezepaw's troubles and dynamics well before it's finally confirmed that he is a victim of child abuse.

ABUSE: Outcast, the Tribe Journey.

In Outcast, Breezepaw's problems have escalated into open aggression towards cats of other Clans, and is now a legitimate concern for his own safety. Yet, he's spoken over by older warriors, and reprimanded at nearly every opportunity, right in front of the warrior of another Clan.

Squilf just asked the poor kid how his training was going, and then Whitetail JUMPS to talk over him so she can complain, RIGHT in front of his face.

They can't even wait until they're alone to grumble something rude about Breezepaw, who is still just a teenager here;

They taught him already that a bit of prey that runs off their own territory still belongs to WindClan, encourage him to blow past borders in pursuit, and started a battle with ThunderClan over this. And then they're pissed off at him for being aggressive, thinking it's deserved to scold him in public.

When Onestar announces that he wants Breezepaw to go on the Tribe Journey, he's devastated by it...

Because he thinks WindClan doesn't like him, and he's right. He's gossiped about, torn into in front of a ThunderClan warrior, and even his own dad doesn't want to be around him. It's clear that Breezepaw's impulsive "codebreaking" behaviors are a desire to prove himself, and once you realize that, the way that he's being alienated is heartbreaking.

But Wait!! Hold on a minute! Where did he get a "patrol of apprentices" from to confront the dogs with, exactly?

Simple. Breezepaw CAN make friends! He actually values them a lot! So much that it's the first thing Crowfeather snaps at him over, out of frustration that his son is also being forced on this journey with him. It's an angry response to his child having emotional and physical needs, resentment that will continue all journey long.

Note that it's plural, friends. Breezepelt has multiple friends, at least one who is not Heatherpaw, and she promises to say goodbye to them.

Up next, they state over and over, Crowfeather and Breezepaw do not like each other. Crowfeather resents being around him and dealing with his rudeness, embarrassed and angry, and Breezepaw is absolutely miserable being sent on a journey to the mountains with a man who hates his guts.

The whole while, Crowfeather is brooding longingly about Feathertail, already thinking about her as soon as he kitty-kisses Nightcloud goodbye, his eyes looking somewhere distant. He makes a jab about loyalty when Breezepaw doesn't understand why they're helping the Tribe.

Breezepaw gets smacked after he's "shoved" at Purdy and acts rude to him, while the other three manage to be polite (while still having internal dialogue about how stinky he is).

Without so much as a, "cut that out," Crowfeather raises his paw and hits him. Breeze is quiet after that.

I don't give a shit how rude your teenager is being. Do not hit kids. Being throttled on the head is not okay.

In spite of the Three not liking Breezepaw, or even Crowfeather, they're constantly noting that their arguments are not normal, and that Crow is a cold, unsupportive father who digs into his kid constantly, and the only time he ever DOES "discipline" his child it's through immediately smacking him.

At one point, the apprentices get hungry, and decide to foolishly hunt in a barn that they know has dogs in it against Purdy's warnings. Once again, JUST like the first two books, Breezepaw is more friendly when Crowfeather is not around.

EVERY time he is alone with cats his own age, he's grumpy but cooperative. Even enthusiastic at times! The minute Crowfeather is in the picture, he's nasty.

Naturally, the dogs show up, but Purdy rescues them. Though Brambleclaw also chews his kids out (and i have strong opinions about bramble's parenting style for another time), Hollypaw is taken aback by the contrast of what a scolding from Brambleclaw looks like vs how Crowfeather reacts.

The narrative is desperately trying to tell you that the way Crowfeather treats his son is not normal.

And then Crowfeather is pissed off that Breezepaw is exhausted from running for his life from hungry dogs,

And he's constantly losing his shit whenever Breezepaw says something as innocuous as "dad im hungry"

Then, Breezepaw is made to watch his dad pine over the grave of a woman who died long before Crowfeather was even considering his mother for a mate. What he feels is jealousy, because he knows his own father doesn't love him anywhere near as much as he loves the memory of Feathertail.

This really goes on and on and on. The ENTIRE trip is like this, with Crowfeather treating Breezepelt poorly, giving him a smack before even verbally warning him, pushing him past his limits and blowing up on him when he asks simple questions about eating or resting.

It all comes to a head in this one exchange, towards the end. Hollypaw ends up snapping at Breezepaw for his rudeness, before having an epiphany.

It's explicit. Crowfeather's emotional abuse, his "scorn" for Breezepelt, is what is driving a wedge between him and all of his older Clanmates. Between EVERYONE in Breezepelt's life who wasn't already his friend. This awful treatment is only making him worse and worse.

Realizing this, she has more sympathy for him, but it's too late. He continues to be rude to her because he feels insulted, and her patience completely runs out. She's just a kid. They're both just kids. She's not responsible for fixing him when he's pushing everyone away at this point.

That's the end of Breezepelt in Outcast. It can't be helped anymore. Any spark of friendship they had together in the barn, or in the tunnels, is gone.

As the series progresses, Crowfeather continues to refuse any personal responsibility for the mistreatment of his son, even pinning all of Breezepelt's behavioral problems on Nightcloud. He is a cold, selfish father who only ever thinks about his own pain and reputation.

DARK FOREST: How these factors push him towards radicalization.

Everyone talks about the Attack on Poppyfrost, which happens in the first book of OotS, in oversimplified terms. YES he is going after a nun and a pregnant woman. I've never said that's not Bad.

But no one talks about "WHY", and that reason is NOT just that he desires power like so many other WC villains. Breezepelt makes his motivation very clear on the page.

Escalating to violence was about making Jayfeather feel the way that he does.

When Breezepelt says that he wants Jay to be surrounded by "lies, hatred, and things that should never have happened," he's talking about the way HE grew up, knowing his father never wanted him, and that his Clan HATES him as a result. Killing Poppyfrost is about trying to frame Jayfeather for her murder, so ThunderClan won't trust him anymore.

When Jayfeather points out the simple truth that what Breezepelt is saying doesn't make any goddamn sense, his hatred "falters." He's blaming his half-clan half-brother for his own treatment because of the reveal, but totally failed to consider that JAYFEATHER'S ALREADY GOING THROUGH IT... so his response is just this pitiful, "s-shut up, man."

Then the ghost of Brokenstar and Breezepelt bounce him back and forth between them like a beach ball for a bit until Honeyfern's spirit shows up.

Breezepelt's childhood abuse and social alienation was a hook that the Dark Forest latched onto, to reel him in. His anger at his half-brother is so obviously misplaced that its absurdity was something Jayfeather pointed out.

We soon learn that it's the Dark Forest who's planting that ridiculous idea in his head;

The narration is SCREAMING, "The Dark Forest is validating the anger he feels towards his father, and redirecting it towards The Three." He's described as 'kitlike,' Tigerstar's eyes are compared to a hypnotizing snake.

This prose could not make it more obvious if it drove to your house, beat you with it, and then spoon fed you the point while you were hospitalized.

At the end of this scene, Tigerstar sends Hawkfrost to recruit Ivypaw. This scene where Breezepelt is being lovebombed, and the command to start grooming Ivypaw, ARE LINKED. That was a choice.

A VERY GOOD choice! Again, as many issues as I have with OotS, its handling of indoctrination is unironically fantastic, and it owes a good amount of that to the outstanding setup of Breezepelt that was done back in Po3. And that setup doesn't work if Crowfeather was merely distant.

Breezepelt was abused by his father, both verbally and physically. It drove him to be more aggressive to prove himself, modeling the battle culture around him. The adults of WindClan judged him based off Crowfeather's responses, shunning and belittling the 'problem' teenager, which eventually drove Breezepelt to the only group that he felt "understood" him.

In a book series that is RIFE with abuse apologia, this is one of the few times that there's any behavioral consequences for abuse and the narrative holds the perpetrator accountable for it.

But people hear Crowfeather's deflective excuse in The Last Hope where he says he never hated him, blames Nightcloud for everything, and just lick it up uncritically.

Gee whiz, I wonder why the guy who never blames himself for any of his problems would suddenly say it was his ex-wife's fault. Real headscratcher!

(Crowfeather's Trial then goes onto, for all my own problems with it, also hold Crow accountable as the reason why Breezepelt turned out like he did. But that's a topic for another day.)

#This is headcanon territory here. But one day I realized I can read Breezy-P with BPD and he became a blorbo.#Never been able to unsee it and it massively endears him to me... Breeze Pelt Disorder...#I actually REALLY hate how his arc was resolved and strongly feel that he should have progressed into a bigger problem #But I equally strongly feel that being redeemed is the ideal ending for him #so if it was between him being pure evil/redemption death or the awful halting we got at the end of oots....#I'd pick the halting over him being pure evil or a redemption death.#I think BB made me REALLY fall in love with him. He's my sweet cheese. My good time boy.#Bones when he sees an angry black cat: ''i can fix you. first i must break you. but then i can fix you''#Like. what i dislike about where he went is that even if your anger issues came from abuse. you STILL are responsible for your actions #but in the end getting that Shitty Dad Approval fixes him. Not his own growth or self-reflection.#it feels like BREEZE gets his agency stripped away for HIS ABUSIVE DAD'S character arc #It retcons in a reason why Breezepelt is not still a problem and then he faded into the background.#while Crowfeather continues to get supporting roles and every now and then Breeze now looks at him fondly #BLECH.#Crowfeather #Breezepelt #Abuse #Child Abuse #Warrior Cats Analysis #And now you know anon!!

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cowardlykrow · 1 month

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"Hah, dude doesn't even know he's in my tamagotchi."

#For some reason he gave me early 2000s vibes as i was drawing him? So of course I turned his box into a tamagotchi✨#Tinky #I don't care about cannon lore or timelines... all i know is this version of Tinky would torment the SHIT out of College ted.#t’noy karaxis #Nightmare time #time bastard #thinks i proof read it: writes always twice #hatchetfield #Heheh - Silly slushie idea came from @yourlocalabomination #and Edgelord Tinky convo idea came from @raftersomefood #God this particular Human tinky would talk so annoying... SOOO Dude-Bro 💛#Anyway i guess i should have tried making him look like curt instead of winging it cuz everyone thought i was drawing Goat ted???#I do think he came out too thin - I dunno know what happened #(PS. feel free to find me on insta for some close ups [same user] and follow me for my annoying stories where i post shitty progress pics)

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unexpectedbrickattack · 9 months

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short king and his shorter kings

#pizza tower #pepstavo #peppinoise #i sketched it out WEEKS ago #but w me almost finishing this godawful comm i felt compelled to do something for Me #i cannot wait to finish; i have a couple of forms sitting there collecting dust but im too overwhelmed w this shitty comm-#-to even attempt to tackle those. i need to scrub my brain and start fresh. but after i finish it lmao #anyway hey. hope everyones okay and vibin #dont take this seriously but also. heehee.#in hindsight i feel like i need to bump gustavos head up a lil bit but weh #not too compelled to fix it.#additional context that i think is fun; gus is just a touchy dude and he finds all kinds of reasons to pick peppino up #and every time peppino is like SO flustered and shocked bc itll be in the view of customers #like some sports team wins and its on their tvs and ppl are hootin n hollerin #and like people will notice and keep cheering and its alot hes like oh my GOD u cannot keep doing that im going to explode and then die #noise will do it to prove he can do it and then his back snaps in two bc he weighs like 80 lbs (36kg)#but for like a brief moment of time he is facefirst in tummy and hes ecstatic #theo it is not funny to be rushed to the er bc u broke ur back #also suggestive (but funny i prommy)#but he absolutely would be that like girl who needed a neckbrace from having her gf accidentally sit on her face too hard #hes like ouuuuhhghh....that was worth it. how long will it take to recover doc bc i wanna do it again :)#meanwhile. i think if that happened peppino would literally go into hiding. ur not finding him.#it would literally haunt him that he nearly killed this rat w his fat ass #as if this is not the way both gus and noise would like to go out. it would be peaceful for them i think #anyway #runs away cutely; see u in two weeks maybe

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tapakah0 · 8 months

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I'M ****ING FREEE

#I MEAN #NOT REALLY #BUT I DON'T NEED TO RIDE ANYWHERE TOMORROW #AND MY HEAD ****ING HURTS FOR NO REASON #AND I HATE ILLUSTRATOR AND INDESIGN AND PHOTOSHOP AND GRAPHIC DESIGN #HOW THEY MANAGE TO EAT ALL MY NERVES #I JUST COME BACK HOME ALMOST AT NIGHT AND HAVE NO TIME AND SIT TO DRAW A LITTLE BIT AND OH MY GOD WHAT DO YOU MEAN IT'S 2 AM AND OF COURSE #CAN'T WAKE UP ON TIME AND I'M A SHITTY MESS TOMORROW AND CAN'T EVEN SLEEP FOR 6 HOURS AND THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT I HAVE TO RIDE FOR 3-4 #HOURS IN SUMARRY AND IT IS SO EXHAUSTING JUST BECAUSE YOU DO IT EVERYDAY #RARRRRRRAAAAAARRARARRARARARARRRRRRR #RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR #ONE DAY IS NOT ENOUGH FOR ME #OH MY GOD I NEED TO DIG THROUGH SO MUCH

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mxtxfanatic · 6 months

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Probably the stupidest, most reckless but undeniably bravest thing Mu Qing did in the entire novel was coming forward to Xie Lian with the truth about the missing golden foil.

#tgcf #yes yes i know i shit on the man all the time #and it is 100% deserved #i stand by that #but he wasn’t always a shitty 800-year-old manbaby #once he was a child with principles #THAT is his potential as a person #like imagine you are the child of a man who your government had to EXECUTE #and you have been put in a position where coming forward about something #would have you dubbed a thief TO THE VERY GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO ALSO EXECUTED YOUR FATHER #who would have the courage to still come forward and just be *honest*?#mu qing who struggles with honesty on a GOOD day made that call #he didn’t know xie lian at that time for shit #and EVERYONE knew of qi rong as an absolute menace #he had NO reason to believe he’d come out of that situation unscathed #yet still!#against all the odds #and all common sense #HE WAS REWARDED!

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tungle-squentacles · 6 months

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huevember 22! ngl I don't like this one as much but I wanted to try something design ish. may redo some time in the future

#squent post #squent art #ok lis g en. I had this thing in mind with the cyan monochrome thing right. Citra was gonna be bluish and r was going to be saturated #but like. they're small as hell 😔#hate the stupid fuckiggg romance novel shoulder grabbed thing bt I couldnt think of any more dynamic poses #it looks like a shitty minimalist movie poster #also I KNOW the room isn't that small but I wanted it to be a vertical shape. love me some composition s #could have done something closer + more intimate but then they'd be uh . making out sloppy style 0robably #i also forgot how the scene went and couldn't access the book. that's the main reason really #anyway. at least it saved me time on the colors lmao. wanted to do something big but i was tired today #fanart #aoas #arc of a scythe #second aoas art I've done. both for huevember and overall #scythe Anastasia #citra terranova #rowan damisch #scythe lucifer #huevember #huevember 2023 #huevember day 22 #huevember 22 #art

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lucienne-thee-librarian · 8 days

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Just to minimize my chances of being genuinely misunderstood OR deliberately misinterpreted, and crucified for something I don't think, How Dare You Say We Piss on the Poor website etc...I'm gonna say this right up top. I absolutely understand why people don't like Thessaly as a character, if anyone does completely unironically stan her as some kind of feminist hero who Did Nothing Wrong uwu, I personally see it as a bit of a red flag. I don't like terfs real or fictional. In a vacuum, I could even completely sympathize and agree with the people who want her cut.

HOWEVER.

It's really something to me to see people clamoring for her to be cut, because she carries and expressed an ugly indefensible prejudice (transphobia) in words towards (1) person. Meanwhile Hob fucking Gadling enacted one of the most violent forms of antiblack racism I can even think of against thousands no, millions of people, the ripple effects of which still affect billions more today. Just a little light idk, profiting off the fucking slave trade and had to be told by someone else that it was bad...and he's a fan favorite.

People are saying Thessally being Dream's love interest reflects badly on him or is somehow endorsement by the narrative (?!?!?!?!?!? Didn't she (SPOILER ALERT AS IF IT MATTERS BY NOW) help participate in his extended assisted suicide? She's not painted as a great person to me just another character what are y'all SMOKING whatever fine. It's fine this is fine.) But shipping Dream with Mr. Former Slaver is not only not verboten or frowned on widely in the fandom but its THEE most popular pairing by far. So...why the difference?

Like where are the same fans who are saying Thessaly shouldn't just be more clearly shown to be wrong, she shouldn't even be in the show at all when it comes to Hobert's crimes??? Yes, transphobia is indefensible. Isn't racism?

And I hear the cries of "it's fiction!!!" Already rallying (if anyone who needs to hear this even sees it lol) to which I say:

HORSESHIT. I KNOW you don't, deep down, really agree because if you did, why get upset about Thessaly being included??? Why does what she said to one person matter if it's Just Fiction You Guyze. Fictional characters are allowed to do bad things and fiction isn't reality sweaty....except when you only apply that standard to fictional racists you like and simp for, but fictional transphobes you don't are SO HARMFUL they shouldn't even be portrayed in fiction.

Like. Give me a big fat BREAK. This looks like bullshit, no? I'm sorry, but I'd love for someone to try and give any other explanation besides one personally offended you or hit home for you, and the other doesn't.

And if that bothers you or you feel like it says something negative about you...idk what you want me to say??? You can't control how other people perceive you and that's how people outside this majority-of-the-fandom bubble see it. You don't need to respond, I just wish and genuinely hope this gives you a moment to think about why fans who ARE bothered by both (and not just paying lip service to being bothered by the one but railing against the other) are so frustrated with people saying everyone is welcome but in practice only bending over backwards for the comfort and emotions of themselves, and people they can easily relate to.

You don't have to like Thessaly (I don't. I find her an interesting antagonist, I don't stan her. And frankly that's not the point of her character) but you'll pardon me for feeling more than a bit cynical and side eying people's motivations for what seems a...pretty obvious double standard, on what fictional crimes related to real world issues matter to y'all, and which clearly don't. Either actually bring the same energy to the table for fictional people who committed atrocities, even if against a group you're not part of and thus don't feel the need to empathize with, or just carry on, but accept that you don't have the SLIGHTEST room to talk about cutting characters who do immoral things. And you also need to accept that you look like a hypocrite when you do.

#thessaly #wanda the sandman #hob gadling #I could've cried sexism!!! Problematic Male vs Female Characters except 1) I don't actually think that's the main reason *here*#2) there are WAY better examples of that particular double standard in this fandom #also i can admit when I'm a bit of a hypocrite or was.#i used to dip my toes into the dreamling stuff too early on #but idk. It just got too sour seeing ppl whitewash (lol I know I'm a comedian)#what he did over and over. And I genuinely had started to wonder #if the show hadn't included that particular crime and I'd just imagined it from the comics because #my memory is shit sometimes and I guess I was naive. I *wanted* to believe someone would talk aboutit #if it had made it in. but ultimately i went back and checked and no #and seeing how the whole fandom behaving affected my non-white mutuals some of whom...#like these are my friends man or ppl I just respect and I can't just. Ignore their feelings and their pov #and act like they werent making points or it doesn't matter #like it's all just fun and games for everyone on the same terms. And seeing how easy it was #for everyone to ignore was so unsettling. I couldn't keep pretending it was just fiction and didn't affect anyone real #Call me a bully a t3rf apologist (fuck you and for the record. no)#a puritan or a Fancop (actually stop comparing #people disagreeing with you online to what cops do. For fucks sake you just make it look like nothing is really real to you outside fandom)#whatever man. Whatever helps you sleep. I'm just gonna block you #if you're clearly sticking your fingers in your ears. engaging with you is a waste of time and energy then #Hell I have sympathy for anyone who doesn't like thessaly #especially trans fans. Especially rn. But lbr that sympathy for a lot of the white trans/queer fans only goes one way!!!#never gets extended to anyone else's issues. Like THATSthe issue. And it's shitty!#(sorry this post is not about me in the confessional lol that's why I put this at the bottom #I just had feelings to get out and yes its my blog but i didn't want to clog the airways)

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sluttylittlewaste · 2 months

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Hilarious that the same people defending any and all questionable choices the Bad Kids make (namely Kristen lbr) by saying "They're just kids! They have all this trauma and it's fucked up to expect teens to be good and nice all the time!" are the same people insisting that Kipperlily is an evil bitch and the Ratgrinders deserve to die.

#it's almost like the rules of empathy and nuance only apply to characters you like 🙃#we know absolutely nothing of significance about the Ratgrinders #and i can't wait for Brennan to remind us of that #you want to complain about Kipperlily using her families money to try to buy the campaign???#The entire shrimp party that kicked off Kristen's campaign was bankrolled by her rich friend #Adaine is a total bitch to anyone who isn't in her immediate friend group #Fig is a literal full time criminal at this point #they have at least 50+ murders under their collective belts at this point #the only verified difference between the Bad Kids and the Ratgrinders at this point is that we know nothing about them #I hope they are the biggest red herring Brennan has ever pulled #because I feel like there are people in this fandom who are so used to self-identifying as victims that they've become full bullies #and they're projecting that shit in some really gross ways #The same way Brennan had to remind Adaine that she wasn't the only one with a shitty life when she was dunking on Zayne?#how about we all take a big step back and try to have a little more perspective #instead of jumping straight to being triggered by a CHILD who had the audacity to not love your faves behavior #let me die #if i die #d20 fhjy #fhjy #dimension 20 #kristen applebees #kipperlily copperkettle #the bad kids #the ratgrinders #we have no context on what those kids went through in all the time the Bad Kids have been running around doing other shit #Aguefort is an awful school and their friend is dead #maybe she has a reason not to like the super special “chosen one” that got personally resurrected by the principal and keeps failing upwards #i didn't want to be a Kipperlily defense page #but the energy of the Kipperlily hate reeks of double-standards and unprocessed high school bitterness

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crimeronan · 5 months

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cons of having a pretty princess soprano voice: that's not very gender of you :///

pros of having a pretty princess soprano voice: no children by the mountain goats is Even Funnier an octave higher.....

#i have no shortage of angry soprano songs thanks to all the symphonic metal i listen to #but other sopranos if you are starved for bitter music. this one is So Fun.#my singing #shitty iphone video bc getting clear audio would mean i'd have to upload to soundcloud #i've tried posting singing things a few times recently but gotten insecure and deleted them for reasons that may be dysphoria related #however. one way of fighting dysphoria. is admitting that pretty princess soprano can be weaponized to be Hilarious.#this was one take while driving on errands so disregard the wiper noises in the background.

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luckycloverforducks · 2 months

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Tell me more about velvette and baggies relationship in the swap au

I wanna see all the different and toxicity in it, and how charlie would react to it and all that

*Not sure eif I sent a similar ask to this or not- if I did sorry)

FUCK YES I FINALLY CAN YAP

And dw you did not my ask box is. Empty

Their relationship is vaguely similar to I think, Mammon and Fizz?? Somewhat, I mean I've never watched Helluva but I've seen people talk about it, Vaggie feels indebted to Velvette for getting her to where she is right now yk with being a popular star, and Velvette is. Interesting

Velvette often switches back and forth between treating Vaggie like a bestie and just another demon working under her, and previously before Charlie came into the picture, sometimes like a girlfriend, which leaves Vaggie constantly confused

Velvette often overworks Vaggie to hell and back, but honestly she kinda? means well? A teensy bit, she doesn't want Vaggie to fall from popularity if she leaves the public eye for too long, and Vaggie does like performing/singing and the praise she often gets from it (even if she gets overwhelmed sometimes) so in a way she's trying to help her maintain the fame and praise that Vaggie often seemed to preen over, so in a fucked up way, in her eyes, she's trying to keep her happy and to keep up everything they both have worked hard for (Vaggie's career). She's also like, really into Vaggie but she gave up on that pursuit a bit ago, doesn't stop her from being petty and toxic about it tho

Vaggie is tired and confused, to say the least. She doesn't really know what Velvette actually thinks of her, if she values her in any way, or even care at all about her. Velvette tends to demean and sometimes verbally abuse Vaggie but the next day she tends to sort of make up for it, like she feels bad. In the early days, they were much closer, and Vaggie genuinely liked Velvette, and maybe had a little crush on her.

When Vaggie does good, Velvette showers her with praise, affection, and affirmation but is she slips up, she gets cold and mean, even a little shouty at times, and "honestly are you trying to embarrass me at this point?!" And Vaggie just stands there confused, ashamed, and a little pissed. Does she even see her as anything other than another asset for her brand? She can't tell. Sometimes it feels like she does, sometimes it doesn't. Vaggie is just so confused.

Velvette pushes her so much because she knows she can do better, but she constantly fails to take account Vaggie's limits, boundaries, and feelings, especially since Vaggie tends to mask her true feelings alot, keeping them all inside until they burst under the smallest addition of pressure, which makes her lash out at Velvette when Velvette didn't really deserve it at the moment, which makes Velvette think she's being unfair.

Vaggie feels that Vel is capable of being a better person, she just doesn't see that she's not one already, or that she needs to (or maybe she's just not worth it in her eyes?)

But neither hate the other, not really. Vaggie would like to, but she can't quite get there, while Velvette wouldn't even dream of genuinely hating Vaggie.

It's complicated, they're both fond of each other but also have a certain animosity between each other, esp Vaggie (rightfully so)

They are honestly both flaming messes, Velvette being the worst one of the two and also a part of the reason why Vaggie is a flaming mess aswell-

In short :Vel is a bad boss and a conflicting 'friend', and Vaggie is struggling through it

And Abt what Charlie thinks? She sincerely hopes Velvette explodes, she would do it herself but Vaggie still has an attachment to her (which Charlie sincerely hopes she'd lose, Vel isn't good for her, or much of anyone) so for now she just lets her be, but they always argue w/ each other (Vaggie just sigh tiredly in the background)

Hope this satisfies you, I have alot of thoughts Abt them :3

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rustyreveries · 3 months

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decided to torture myself a bit and attempted to doodle canon sal. never doing this again

is this what the people want. boring ass green twink /lh

#i forgot how different my sal is from canon in terms of like. physical appearance #my version is soooo much better 😘 /hj #salad fingers #this sucks soooo fucking bad i’m sorry #i could not bring myself to finish this it is vile #i used up all my energy on my little pony fanart 💔#i can never draw sal’s head right it’s driving me crazy #i have no idea how to draw skinny people either forgive me #i was fighting myself so hard not to add eyelashes… he’s so incomplete without the 2 fat lashes i give him all the time #why did his fingers change sizes in this you may be asking? i have no fucking clue please stop asking questions .#maybe check out the other art i posted earlier it's sm better than this. i love sal but he makes my art shitty for some reason #he's like a curse #i just noticed smth. why does sal look like he’s jacking off in the one doodle ☹️☹️#maybe he is idk #why does this look better than my actual sf art :[#i think it's bc i spent like 10 minutes on the head losies #> rust's art <

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inhuman-obey-me · 1 year

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Lesson 12 has confirmed we’re not just sent back to the past but in a different timeline from the original obey me game

Yes! Glad it's basically confirming that this is a whole other "world"/timeline, because anyway basically from the moment we landed in this time, everything would have necessarily branched, because MC obviously did not exist in this time originally! And it's not like MC's presence is a minor little thing; we are SO involved in everyone's lives from there. We were already kind of eye-rolling at Solomon's warning about time paradoxes and not telling anyone we're from the future, especially since he himself is totally fucking around in the past with stuff like that Asmo pact, so it's nice to have somewhat of a counter-confirmation that no, this is just a separate thing.

Then again, the time travel stuff was handled so messily in the first game as is and just clearly is not Solmare's strength, writing-wise! Why they decided to make it the premise of a whole new game is way beyond us. For our part, we're just going to sit here yelling "no take-backs!!" about the different world thing even if they change their minds again later on 🙄

#obey me nightbringer spoilers #convinced that the reason present day solomon had to follow us to the past is literally just #past!solomon has been implied to have been pretty shitty and they didn't want players to have to deal with that version of him #maybe the whole reason for time travel was literally just to prevent having to make shitty past!solomon dateable loool #love u solomon #obey me #obey me!#obey me swd #obey me shall we date #omswd #obey me nightbringer #obey me nb #omnb #obey me nb lesson 12 #ask and ye shall be answered #nightbringer discussion

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chirpsythismorning · 1 year

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The Hellflire Club Foreshadows Mike's Monologue (and More Than You Think...)

Several fans have noticed already that there are direct parallels between Mike's monologue in The Piggyback, with Eddie's monologue in The Hellfire Club.

While we've been grappling with all sorts of supernatural creatures over the course of Stranger Things' entire run, here Eddie is warning us about forced conformity and how that is the real monster.

This has also led fans to joke painfully about the fact that Max 'died' because forced conforming; that's what's killing the kids, aka Mike's whole speech to El wouldn't have happened the way it did in the first place, had him, Will and El not been trying so hard to be who they think they're supposed to be, instead of who they truly want to be.

However, what I want to add to this discourse, because I haven't seen anyone else acknowledge it (correct me if i'm wrong!?), is that this scene at lunch has two extras with whom Mike sits between, which are very likely meant to represent Will and El.

We've seen a lot of (love) triangle blocking used with these three before, often with Mike between the two. This screen-cap below has gotta be one of the most iconic and so I feel the need to mention it briefly:

What also makes this shot relevant as an example for this post, is the costume choice for Will and El here: the same shade of dark blue (hints of gray), and the fact that this doesn’t align with the colors/style they usually wear as individual characters. However, this was presumably one of the few times Will and El have genuinely interacted beyond supernatural happenings. And so now, with both of them standing on either side of Mike, after two seasons of him having only one of them beside him, and while the other was out of reach, what we're seeing is that these two are more or less two sides of the same coin. Whether Will and El are actually blood related (I'm like 75% sure they could be) remains to be seen. However Mike's bond between both of them individually is causing him to sort of be at war with himself (and his identity).

Now bear with me, because I know so many of you see theories/analysis involving set design/blocking/costumes and you just instantly check out and stop taking it seriously. But I can assure you, this is the real deal.

What follows, is so outrageously easy to overlook. And yet upon thinking about what it actually requires to film a scene, especially a scene like this with dozens of background extras, along with how this scene actually turned out, I'm going to explain why there are several factors which make me feel fairly confident about what these two specific extras represent.

To start things off, we know how this scene begins, with Eddie dramatically reading a Newsweek magazine:

"The Devil has come to America. Dungeons and Dragons, at first regarded as a harmless game of make-believe, now has both parents and psychologists concerned. Studies have linked violent behavior to the game, saying it promotes satanic worship, ritual sacrifice, sodomy, suicide, and even... Murder."

After they give us a short introduction to some of the faces of the Hellfire Club (notably Eddie), they cut to this point of view shot from Mike:

Here we are instantly introduced to the two extras that are going to dominate a majority of this scene outside of the main characters themselves, aka Willel...

note: interesting they don't include Mike in the shot for that specific sound bite below... almost as if he considers himself a freak for a different reason...

Yes, on the surface this scene is establishing that Mike and Dustin are finding a place in High School, as the freaks and geeks, but a place nonetheless.

Though, is that really all there is to it?

You'll see what I mean.

note: there's no meaning behind the circles touching here. i just wanted to acknowledge here that the El extra is visible at first, only for her to become hidden the moment that the Will extra becomes visible.

Now, this shot right here below is kind of iconic, because it's what made me realize that this girl extra here in the scarf represents El.

To provide a little more context, the Will extra next to Mike has already been picked up on by a decent amount of fans. I've even posted about it at least once. This guy definitely resembles Will at certain angles, to the point where he could arguably be a stand in/stunt double for scenes that don't require a close-up of him.

Also keeping in mind, this is a scene of the party in high school, in a D&D club. Assuming Will could have stayed in Hawkins and went to high school with the party, he would've more than likely been right here beside them. So that's what I initially got out of this scene and still partially do get out of it, regardless of these other observations I'm discussing here.

What's so fascinating about the Will extra though specifically, is that they avoid showing his face as much as possible, which is a unique choice that we're just not seeing be applied to the other extras in the frame. They even let us see the face of the guy across from the Will extra (blue/yellow striped shirt guy) multiple times, but apparently they really wanted to avoid showing this guys face (there are a few notable, but fleeting side profiles from an outside POV), almost to keep up this guise that we could imagine this is Will and hell, it could be him, bc it's pretty damn close.

However, upon recently rewatching this scene, I remember looking for other points when this Will extra might have been prominent, to see if I could find anything else.

And that's when I realized this girl in the scarf, directly blocks the Will extra at the most convenient time.

And that's when it hit me...

FORCED CONFORMING!!!!!!!

The following images below is when it really starts to get obvious that there was an intended direction going on here with the blocking of these two extras, in accordance with Mike's placement in the frame.

What sealed the deal for me, was noticing how the other extras surrounding them (excluding Willel), do not seem to be granted much importance in the continuity of this scene.

Continuity between shots is pretty essential to filmmaking. It's gotta be the main thing about film that just bugs me, which is that you can tell very visibly when a shot is followed by another shot, but from a separate take (has the capacity to ruin the illusion that this is real and not all fabricated).

For example, what I gather from the beginning of this following conversation, is that there were at the very least 2-3 takes done for these reaction shots of Dustin and Mike, and it's because the extras in the background give it away. Sometimes they're in the frame, sometimes they're not.

The Will and El extras provide a contrast to all the other extras, in that the continuity for their blocking in the frame is fairly spot on each time, equal to the standards of the main cast arguably. Meaning they had a mark and they had to stick with it.

Check this out:

side note: star wars reference (luke & leia??)

The most obvious thing that gives away the importance of these two extras, besides the blocking, is them both sporting an almost identical color in their costume. While the Will extra wears a maroon shirt, the El extra wears a scarf in that same color.

This is so simple yet sort of genius, because again, from what I understand, no one has noticed this, and so it's pretty epic once you finally do pick up on it.

The Will extra is almost always in the frame on Mike's right? The El extra is facing the the opposite direction as them (not on the same page), and wearing a scarf, which is there to represent the tentacle choking her during Mike's monologue...

This theory does take a turn for the hilarious, when at a later point Eddie starts monologuing again, while Dustin and Mike look at him fondly (w/ Mike in focus), the Willel extras are now nowhere to be found...

I think this choice was made to indicate that Mike's attraction to Eddie is based on the most basic type of attraction, while what he shares for Will and El is so much more complicated (and deep). When you're just experiencing everyday attraction, you're not thinking about your significant other or your hearts desire in that moment, because this moment is just a blip encounter that isn't going anywhere, it's attraction and that's all there is to it. Whereas what he feels truly for Will is true love, while what he feels truly for El is familial love. This tiny moment isn't about his conflict over his romantic feelings, it's about the fact that Mike is attracted to men.

And then what follows directly after this, is that little snippet of Eddie's monologue, which echoes Mike's monologue to El at the end of the season...

Oh and look who it is?! The El extra has made a reappearance, just in time!

This is one of the few times they made a point to have the El extra in the frame while the Will extra wasn't, which I also think is intentional because it could be a hint to how Mike's speech about falling in love with El the moment he saw her is a fabrication (copyright to be exact), and it also doesn't resemble the love that Mike has for Will, hence why he was almost entirely left out of those shots. (Also similar to Mike's monologue at the end of the season, where Will was in certain shots but not others, because the words did/didn't match Mike's feelings for Will at those points).

Lastly, we get a Gap (gay and proud) reference for Mike. And low and behold, the Will extra is making a reappearance, just in time!

I think what makes this scene easier to understand on a basic level, without making it too complicated for yourself, is comparing the implications that come with it, to the implications that came with Mike's monologue.

The choice to put Will in most of the shots, directly behind Mike as he professes his love to El, who is lying before him unable to look in his eyes or even respond, leads those truly paying attention, to the conclusion that this is not how you shoot a satisfying love confession. Therefore it can't be a genuine love confession.

Instead what this scene more so depicts is a character having a confession practically wrenched out of him. And because of all the other details happening over the course of this season and just the series overall, we can gather that Mike feels pressured to go through with this because he thinks he has no other choice.

They didn't beat the big bad this time, instead they lost. Because forced conforming, that's the real monster.

With only one season left, they're going to have to face the truth if they want to make it out alive this time (and happy!).

#byler #stranger things #stranger things analysis #mike's monologue #stranger things theory #blocking #costume design #the hellfire club #the piggyback #these scenes could have taken a long time to film #when you've got dozens of extras #with upwards of at least 5-10 in the frame at times #you have to account for continuity and making sure each shot reasonably matches the previous #the problem is sometimes you get a take that's really good but the next part of that same take isn't good #so they have to go with whatever shot works best #sometimes that means having to settle for shitty continuity #and that happens a lot when there are lots of extras #because being picky would make you a pain in the ass to work with #especially when it comes to young actors #though it does seem to me like the willel extras were probably a big part of the framing of each shot including them #bc it's way too consistent in comparison to the other extras for them to not have been in the notes for the shot in some capacity #we also see other times when extras look like will #so this is a decenty common occurrence #i think it also does a good job of hinting at will being in the back of mike's mind at times when we least expect #which is also why will is in the back of the frame facing him constantly #bc in those shots will represents mike's feeling he has for will that he's repressing...#they've been doing that heavily since s2 this is not new at all

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