Mentally I'm here
Joyce, Hopper and Terry's message
I've already talked about the many Kali-Henry parallels, but there are other very interesting things. For example, like other people pointed out, Axel's mask is also at Melvald's (and the girl's mask is a tiger, hm)
Brain damaged. The only close up we get of the tattoo is in 2x01. Mike also mentions brain damage in S3, when he's worried about El. So, 2x01, the first time we see Kali, starts with a police chase, Brain Damaged tattoo and Kali creating an illusion that causes a car accident. What could it mean for El? If you follow my blog, you know my car crash theory. A car accident in the past that involved Hopper, maybe drowning, and then being revived? (Breath! She wasn't breathing)
A bald man even says to El: You're dead! We're all dead! (Ten in 4x01: Ellis and Six. Dead. They're both dead)
The only bald child in the show is Sarah. And she's dead. And the other scene where we see bald people (the prisoners) and kids are mentioned, is when Hopper yells at Dimitri that his son is not his son.
But this also seems connected to Joyce. In this scene we see Kali and El in front of a wrecked green car (there's also a green car in Terry's memory), the words mom and Janice (J, like Joyce), No. (number) and Ace.
Green car, mom J, police, El, car accident and Kali (Number One)
But speaking of Sarah. Dottie wears a clown mask. There are clowns on Sarah's pajamas, and Will was scared of clowns.
In 2x07 we see a flashback of what Kali does before the police chase in 2x01. I think it could be another hint at what happened in the past, maybe even what caused the car chase and the accident. Kali kills a man connected to the lab: one of the articles El reads in 2x05 is about the abduction of a newborn boy from a hospital by a nurse, who is later found dead from a gunshot wound in her house. Name of the journalist: Frank Williams
This extra, a blonde pregnant woman. El's mother? But the number on the bus is 4+2+2= 8 (or ten, if we count the other 2). Not eleven. Eight/Kali makes people see or not see whatever she chooses, so I wonder what is true and what not in Terry's memories.
The song that plays in this scene is Runaway
All your life all you asked is when's your daddy gonna talk to you. But you were living in another world, trying to get your message through
Then shot of the cops. This reminds me of Hopper seeing and hearing Sarah, but telling himself that it was all in his mind.
(end of the episode, when El sees her dad in the void, Mike says almost the same words. He too is trying to get a message through. I need to get through! I need to get through! I need to warn them. It's a trap!)
The cops are drinking coffee. Like coffee and contemplation (and donut). First thing Hopper says, when Flo tells him that Joyce can't find her son. And he has his coffee mug in S2, when he and Murray talk about the girl, the "russian spy".
In 2x05, at Terry's, before El enters the room, this is what they're saying on the TV:
Name a way you occupy your time when you're having a boring day at work.
Drink coffee.
"Drink coffee" said Mike.
...
Yeah! Five answers will beat it, Lynn.
[Lynn] Visit with other employees.
[host] "Visit with other employees!"
Terry: Rainbow.
Mike? Well, maybe not our Mike. I'm thinking about the many Michael Myers references, and Mikhail not being Dimitri's son.
Drinking coffee when you have a boring day at work -> coffee and contemplation. So, the first thing they do is connecting Terry and Hopper. And they do it in S1 too, when Becky says twice, with a smile, that Terry and Hopper would get along. They even have the same octagon table. Eight again...
The name Lynn. Like Vera Lynn? Her song, We'll meet again, plays after the sauna scene in S3, when we see the crowd of Flayed people. A song about Vera Lynn is in Pink Floyd album The Wall (Ross posted the photo of the poster a few weeks ago) which was released in 1979. I could be wrong, but...
Vera Lynn-> 1979, and Terry's first word, after Lynn says "visit with other employees", is rainbow
Could this be a hint that Terry wasn't just a subject of the experiments, but worked with Brenner? (employee) That she was Mama to Brenner's Papa?
Back to the coffee. Not only do they mention it on the TV, but then Terry shows El two coffee mugs, when she changes the channels, after a police chase (Kali calls Hopper policeman) But why would Terry show El police chases and coffee mugs? The other commercials seem about the lab. Terry is not just randomly changing the channels. She's talking. And for some reason, she's including Hopper in her message.
Blonde woman. Not sure if she stands for Terry or Virginia.
The score: 91, 64 -> 9+1, 6+4. Ten and ten. One and One. Or two. Lol, or eleven. I have to make a post about all the other things they show on that TV.
After the blonde woman, Terry shows El donuts. Many identical donuts and Was it worth the trip? Imo, a hint at the lab kids.
Then a Computer Supercenter. The Lab. MkUltra. I think Will's visual aid about Alan Turing hints at that too, not just at his queerness.
Then the police chase and the coffee mugs. But, like I said, if all this is about Terry and El's past, what does Hopper have to do with it?
Unless Terry is connecting El and Sarah. Maybe in S5 we're going to see Sarah's story in the lab, but I doubt it, or maybe Sarah and El were swapped at the hospital (after the car chase?) and that's why there are so many parallels between Hopper, Joyce and Terry?
Joyce and her coffee mug! But the coffee is drugged. Interesting.
Another big clue, imo. Ray was in Vietnam (here) And there's an extra who resembles Hopper in Terry's memory
It's just crazy how connected Joyce, Hopper and Terry are.
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And their extras were also both there that day.
Will double's is in the blue plaid while Will is in the yellow.
Also note El and her double are wearing the milkshake stained dress…
I was thinking about how again, it makes no sense to have Noah on set at that location, wearing the yellow plaid and bowl-cut wig, if he was not in fact filming at that location. While the production did spend a month renovating that location, they only spent 4 days actually filming there.
While it's not uncommon to do multiple shoots simultaneously at different locations in one day, it's can get very expensive. It requires a lot of manpower to have all those trucks lined up and a bunch of people hired for security and all the other duties required to keep things going smoothly.
So to have a lead actor leave another set and then go to another location, at least 30 or so minutes away, in costume and everything... I just don't see that being very likely.
Because they wanted to get the Rink-O-Mania shoot done fairly quickly, it's likely most of their location shooting in those 4 days was isolated to that location, at least in terms of those actors being expected at that location only because of all the scenes they might have had to cover in that short time.
And reminder, they also had Will's double there that day, who they wouldn't have had present unless they truly needed him, in the case they needed a stand-in to prepare certain shots or film shots that involved Will not actually being seen head on. But what shots would they need for a blue plaid Will, if Will himself wasn't even wearing his blue plaid? If they both just came from a shoot at a different location, wouldn't they be wearing the same thing?
Which brings me right to the implications of a Vecna vision. I don't think it would be a case of El's situation with Nina, because this isn't the same. Nor do I think it will operate in the same way it did as for Vecna's curse victims in s4. I mean, this is Will we're talking about. He already has a connection to the mindflayer, and that sort of connection is bound to make a trick coming from Vecna look a little bit differently.
When it comes to what I think could theoretically go down, I think it's most likely going to stem from a moment that involved Will being isolated at Rink-o-Mania. It allows going into this memory in s5 work a lot more smoothly, because we'd be able to see him in s4 in a way we remember, and then transition a lot easier into him in s5. It would also make sense to need a stand-in for s4 Will isolated, and then have s5 Will watching from a distance behind his past self in this memory.
The first moment would that comes to mind is early on in the afternoon (right around the time we get those shots of the birthday tables) when they're all skating together. We see Will by himself trailing behind Mike and El on the rink (Angela's POV). But tbh that looks like Noah to me and not like the double, considering it is also clearly Millie and Finn in front of him, but still I guess we can't know for sure.
But then there's this other shot that I find even more interesting...
We've talked about how the lights in Rink-O-Mania above the rink look very similar to the mindflayer, which parallels with Max's memory of the snowball, which also has lights that look like the mindflayer.
It's both of the settings in big block letters feat. a disco-ball at the center for me
We know they were being watched that day at the end of s2, with the lyrics in the background literally saying I'll be watching you, along with the mindflayer just outright watching over them from the UD at that very moment.
And then we have Rink-O-Mania, which starts with the kids piling out of the van and going inside, only for Jon to stop Will, with him turning around looking hopeful, only for Jon to tell him to have fun and with Will looking disappointed before turning away.
Most of us understandably read Jon's expression afterwards as him feeling bad for Will, now that he's starting to figure out for certain that Will is in fact gay and in love with Mike. And yet there's also this eeriness to it. Jon doesn't just look like he's experiencing pity or understanding, he honestly ends that shot looking like he is forgetting something...
And then we get that lyric in the background right then: I've got to have my way now, baby.
Mind you, what followed this moment was a disastrous afternoon at Rink-O-Mania, filled with signs that it was Will's birthday...
If it was Will's birthday that day (I'm like 99% sure at this point that it was), then this IS coming back. Like it's a given.
And I honestly don't see them holding off until mid-season or until the end of s5 to bring up the fact that it was Will's birthday, only now trying to open up fans to realizing what happened and how it is going to have an impact on Will. That was a heavy storyline last season, and they'll need to wrap it up to move on to where that storyline is going to take us.
Not to mention birthdaygate is something fans just cannot accept even as a possiblity right now. Fans needed it to be something outright acknowledged in s4. All the birthday references were not enough for them. And I would agree in the sense that I think bc it wasn't confronted in s4, it's something that they have to confront us with pretty quickly in s5, so that when rewatching we can go 'Oh shit! Here were all the signs leading up to what is about to hit us right now in s5!' It makes those details worthwhile because fans only had to wait 1 episode into the following season to have it acknowledged.
Another detail I find interesting, is that Noah is wearing black roller skates here. Initially I thought they could be his own personal skates, and that is still possible. But if dude had the time to put on personal skates, he had the time to change out of his costume to avoid risking messing up the hair and the clothes. Or he could have just put on any of the skates afforded to all the actors on set, similar to the other three alongside him in this bts.
But now honestly, after actually thinking about it, the black skates make me think this could be a vision/nightmare. It's something that feels isolated and wrong. Like, yes we're here, but something isn't right. It's not Will in his Cali fit in some skates from Rink-O-Mania, it's Will in what he was wearing in Hawkins at the end of s4, witnessing this in a vision, meaning it would make more sense to throw the black ones on him to hint that something is off (AKA THIS ISN'T REAL!).
I could literally picture a POV shot of Will all disoriented coming to, opening his eyes as he's looking down at his skates, while the audience is watching like 'Wait! What? Why is he--? WAIT WHATS GOING ON!?!?' Only for us to see Will witnessing himself in the past from behind in this memory of the events that day, with him watching what's going down with El on the rink.
CAN YALL SEE THE VISION OF THIS VISION?
Another thing about this shot and this scene in general, is that it parallels another scene in s4, when El is confronted by Angela and the others after school, where Will is looking from a distance, frozen.
It's worth noting these parallels and connections are meant to exist, leading up to El discovering the 'truth' about what happened in the massacre.
And considering we have Will lurking in the corner of that final shot with El at the very end, when Mike parallels Brenner shouting during the massacre, makes me wonder if this memory/vision could involve some parallels that also start laying the groundwork for the truth about Will's connection to things in the past...
Someone noticed (here) that March 29, Billy's birthday, is also the day the Cali crew is back in Hawkins.
So, I'm thinking. We see the name Billy as Max is reading the letter, but the name William when she is in the Vecna vision. That could just mean different timelines, or maybe it's also a hint that the theory that Will is in a Vecna vision at the end of S4 is correct (here)
Maybe on March 29 Vecna goes into William's mind and what he sees from the moment he touches his neck is a vision (everything else is real) The end credit song, Spellbound, is definitely an interesting choice...
I would love it if S4 starts with a flashback of El in the lab, and ends with Will in a vision. Also, we know that S5 starts with a UD flashback, so:
4x01 -> lab flashback -> then El's letter, in which she lies about her life in Lenora
5x01 -> UD flashback -> then a vision, which is also a lie?
What would Vecna show Will? Maybe the day at Rink-o-mania. But I think this would be different from El's letter. This time we would see the truth, twisted by Vecna, like the truth about Max wishing her brother to die. Maybe Vecna would tell Will that he is jealous, and that the reason he didn't help El is that, deep down, he wants her to suffer.
Well, Will is jealous, but that's normal. It doesn't mean that he's cruel or doesn't love his sister. We see that in the van scene and in 4x09.
And how could Vecna show Will that he is jealous and wants to hurt his sister? Maybe by making him be the one who throws the milkshake on her dress.
Remember the BTS photo of Noah at Rink-o-mania in his 4x09 outfit? The boy behind him and Millie is the actor who plays Jake, or his double. Jake is the one who throws the milkshake on El's dress. Jake has a bowl cut and kinda resembles Will.
So, maybe Noah was wearing his 4x09 here because this is the vision scene, and this time he's the one who humiliates El.
I could be wrong, but I think this would be a very interesting parallel with the beginning of S4. And a way to make Will more vulnerable
@chirpsythismorning @shippingfangirl013
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