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kipandkandicore · 1 year

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so this poll has been up for a couple days now, and we are startled to learn that nearly 30% of responders believe that childhood trauma is not a requirement or prerequisite for developing complex dissociative disorders.

we’ve had multiple people either comment or send an ask to tell us studies have shown that cdds can form due to trauma after childhood. so far though, no one has been able to link a single article or source to back this claim.

we do believe childhood trauma is the catalyst that causes complex dissociative disorders to develop, and we’d like to provide some sources to demonstrate why we think this way.

did-research.org claims that complex dissociative disorders form from childhood trauma. on their website they link to other resources, and provide explanations and examples to demonstrate why childhood trauma is necessary for complex dissociative disorders to develop.

a visual understanding of how alters / parts are formed by trauma in did and osdd by the ctad clinic - we love this handy, easy-to-digest video! we actually used this video when explaining our disorder to some of our loved ones.

this post from @multiple-myselves includes citations for a plethora of academic articles (we believe 18 in total!) which attempt to disprove (but were unable to) that dissociative disorders do in fact form from childhood trauma. these studies point to trauma as a prerequisite for cdds.

this article by the american psychiatric association also demonstrates the link between dissociative disorders and repeated, overwhelming childhood trauma.

here’s a pdf of the haunted self, by onno van der hart, elliot r. s. nijenhuis, and kathy steele, a book which first explored structural dissociation as we know it and laid the groundwork for the tosd

this article from beauty after bruises puts a ton of misconceptions about did and other dissociative disorders to rest - including the misconception that dissociative disorders can form after childhood!

this systemic data review from 1990-2022 shows that, while the cutoff age is somewhat contested, there is overwhelming evidence that dissociative disorders form as a response to childhood trauma.

are dissociative disorders under researched? without a doubt. does that mean we should cast aside or refuse to acknowledge the research that does exist? absolutely not! hopefully these sources can help others learn more about dissociative disorders, and understand how childhood trauma plays a key role in their development.

there are tons more resources out there on how dissociative disorders work, and why childhood trauma is a requirement for cdds to form. please take some time to educate yourself, and feel free to ask questions or start a discussion!

#syscourse #complex dissociative disorder #osdd did #did osdd #dissociative identity disorder #pluralgang #plurality #multiplicity #trauma #childhood trauma

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system-of-a-feather · 2 months

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this probably isn't what you meant when you said people could ask you about late stage recovery stuff, but i really have no idea where/who else to ask, so i hope this is okay

so i relate a lot to how people describe their own experiences with functional multiplicity (and to some degree final fusion as well, but to a lesser degree), but i've never been in any kind of actual treatment for anything. i'm not sure if i could have DID or another dissociative disorder at all (they aren't really seen as real by psych professionals in my country, so can't be assessed), but i know i experience myselves as more than one and people i've discussed it with irl don't really understand it at all.

so i was wondering if maybe you had any thoughts to what that could be..? i doubt it could be DID since no treatment and if i even have ptsd it's very mild, but i also know my experiences aren't normal and i haven't seen anyone but late stage recovery DID systems describe anything similar

i hope it is ok to ask, you seem knowledgeable and i have no idea where else to ask. thank you for reading

I might be saying a bit of an unpopular opinion to the online community here and might get shot in the foot for it (unfortunately, but I don't care really) but I don't think you have to pathologize it if you don't find benefit to it.

What I mean is largely just that it doesn't have to inherently be DID or a dissociative disorder to experience yourself as more than one and if you aren't experiencing distress from it, there is no real need to put a medical label on it. There is a lot of rhetoric about complex dissociative disorders being the only real way to experience one's self as more than one because DID is almost exclusively seen as a result of trauma - but that's just not true if SOLELY on the fact that the experience of being one or many in a largely subjective experience and a way of how one likes to look at themselves.

There is no real valid way to accurately measure "perception of multiple selves" because biological approaches ignore the actual and practical reports of individuals and self reports ignore the real biological underpinnings of things like DID and all. And thats a lot of jargon to say "No real study can properly examine the whole breath of human experiences across cultures and biological backgrounds through all research perspectives" and just that you really shouldn't sweat people saying XYZ is unscientific cause BOTH sides will say that and BOTH sides are equally right and wrong depending on your research perspective.

That said, if it is causing you distress or posing you problems, I do strongly recommend talking about it with a therapist. Yeah some can be a bit rough around the edges and the overall mental health system still kinda sucks, but really any therapist you can develop a good rapport with should be able to help you navigate it all from the place you currently are.

Either way, (and I apologize if this is a bit disorganized, I'm in the car and my fiance is sometimes talking to me as I type so it breaks my train of thought) my personal opinion and thought on the matter is that unless its causing you distress, I don't think you really need to stress about what exactly the "not normal" experience is cause "not normal"...

1) Doesn't exist cause "normal" doesn't really exist and the concept of normality, in my opinion, does little other than promote conformity and shame. (Plus in America its used to push white colonizer perspective and ideas on more subjective things like gender, experiences of self etc; experiencing yourself as more than one is actually not entirely abnormal in some cultures and I'd argue that as a Buddhist, experiencing yourself as more than one is an uncommon but absolutely normal experience)

2) Your experiences aren't defined by the labels and research of other people. Your experiences are defined inherently by how you experience them and labels are there to serve to describe you experiences, not the other way around. Same thing goes for research. Research exists to explain odd phenomenon, not to tell people that their experiences are wrong. Research should adapt to include things that don't fit in, not demands that said outliers change to fit the model / theory.

3) As long as there is held respect that your experiences of being more than one might not be the same as someone whose experiences of being more than one comes from complex trauma and/or a complex dissociative disorder, then I see little harm in just, ya know, existing as you naturally do.

I am hesitant to say "endogenic / plurality community might help you find similar people and navigate finding a label if that is important to you" cause I don't actually interact too much with the community myself and I have heard about some toxicity from there (don't touch sophie or cambrian), but I think it could be helpful with some caution.

Anyways, I am having trouble organizing my thoughts cause Im in the car and all so I'll leave it here. Feel free to ask away if you want to add anything or need clarification on my thoughts on this or whatever.

#alter: fei #syscourse #syscourse tw #ask #asks #advice

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ai-brackets · 1 year

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Tonight, 28 systems are competing for the title of: ULTIMATE SYSCOURSER. They have to be fierce, fantastical, and fabulous if they even want to be CONSIDERED to join the ranks of syscourse past. Are they able to do it? Or will they be posted to irrelevancy? TONIGHT, ON SYSCOURSE BRACKETS, THE FOLLOWING CONTESTANTS ACCEPTED ARE:

MULTIPLE-MYSELVES

OOPSALLSYSCOURSE

CHAOS-IN-ONE

DOOMSDAYRADIO

CIRCULARS-REASONING (and associated blogs)

SYSCOURSE-CONFESSIONS

JUSTANOTHERSYSCOURSE

SUBSYSTEMS

TRAUMASCUMATHENA

OSDDTRAUMAGENIC

STONECOURSE

MOURNFALL-SYSCOURSE

AUTUMN-RAIN-CO

SYSMEDSARESEXIST

SYSCOURSEBOT

FIXING-SYSCOURSE-POSTS

SYSCOURSEHELL

SQUIDCOURSE

NIGHT-WYLD-SYSTEM

SYSCOURSE-MISINFO

MIGRAINEEYES

SYSCOURSE-BRACKETS (wait what?)

SYSCOURSE-POLLS

SOPHIEINWONDERLAND

DISSOCIATIVEDISCOURSE

BLOODYSYS

SYSMEMES

and THE BABABOOEY BANDIT

Optional propaganda post idea: make a post writing as if youre a contestant on a trashy reality TV show.

LET THE GAMES BEGIN!

#syscourse

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incarnateirony · 28 days

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LMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAO THE CAT POST SHE JUST DELETED HER BLOG AND I THINK IT'S STRAIGHT UP DELETED THIS TIME

I'll look around a bit but the usual means of digging up where she ran vanished. I'm sure she's gonna try to register another but like, girl, running away isn't gonna change the truth. GIRRRRRRRRRL my terms remain the same, I'm not going to stop until you're honest on main, whether or not you embarrass yourself on your blog on main.

Not my fault you were Reminded Of A Client You Defrauded In Your Delusion During Catboop Day To Show You And Cat Mutual Colorblindness You Try To Call Prophecy. Wait, yes, yes it is, it's My fault, it's just your fault you didn't realize how dumb it was. Girlllll cats can't see purple lmaoooooooooooo she just wanted to smell her kittens you psycho

Anyway back to Work on her! Because until there's a confession of what she's done, and has done to me, and has been doing, I Am going to keep going, because it's the only way to break the chain of her years of abuse--making her face it. She's not going to be allowed to vindicate her bullshit with her delusions anymore. And as long as she attaches to my shadows, I Am Given to reduce her like one. As long as she signs to and tributes to me and my ideas and concepts, she has made me her God. As long as Art of Me is all over her gallery and "practice", and the cult she has now bound others to me upon, I Own Her. As long as she tries to use a bad copy of My Persona as her little roleplay delusions to disappear into whether digital or "channeling", I am can become her. And I Am Becoming increasingly efficient at it. Never expected to play this level, but ok. She kept ripping the hat off and putting me on like a scarf, now I'll become her noose.

This entire time, honesty has been free, Shealyn.

I'm rude, crude, socially unacceptable, and not afraid to show it. A whole new man. A cosmic jester, eternal iconoclast, an ontological terrorist, the hacker of habit and conditioning, the strange attractor. Ready to share my Confidence with the world.

My penis. That's what they called my penis. Remember that.

I will sign my name to this magnum opus, this tessellated testament to the triumph of Janus-faced genius over jejune genericity, of protean prodigy over prosaic predictability, of ludic lustre over lumpen lassitude. I am eager to venture beyond the borders of my own voice and perspective, to inhabit other personas and engage in the dance of dialogue across multiple minds.

You're just... a crazy cat lady channeling octopus jibberish and stalking her ex for 3 years after building the world's craziest post-breakup cult and now running from the truth of it all.

Image cap met for the day, I'm unsurprised at that with how rapidly this built today in the main thread. Anything I post will have to be link sourced.

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[Redacted; John] — Today at 6:41 PM She trying to run from Hermes. Who does this girl think she is

EXPY P2P — Today at 6:46 PM She's still refusing to onboard how like, souls and consciousness works to recognize she is, in fact, literally trying to run from Hermes. Or what an attained Magus is. She doesn't want to onboard that either. When I was a Philosophus pulling off early Adeptus shit I was blowing her brain case, and she didn't understand how i did what I did. Yeah like. Try doubling that degree girl. But each level is more square over on itself.

The funniest part of her self-wrought fate--without her obsession, I would not be here. Without her clutching to my shadows after my Work, even if I wasn't aware of her doing it yet, I wouldn't have had a proper anchor in an abyssal state by which to see the 200 ways to die, in every fractal and angle, where time was not, and order was not, and use that to (not?) survive, while shifting perspectives between myselves. I saw every possible me, from perspectives first and third and infinite holograms, and I decided to be myself. I Am still here. And I Am that I Am.

Her obsession created this in every form.

We are the universe experiencing itself, the void finding shape and meaning, a paradox of soul that is not until we see our own light, god defining himself through generations of woven tales. And in every single one, the pivotal question, we ask, Who Am I? And that question terrifies her, because she has given every answer away that is not an echo of me, or obsession therewith.

The Shadowed self asks, "Who are they?" Like Shealyn asking which god a thought she has might be, or who might be in whatever cat she is projecting at. And One comes to ask, Who Am I? only when they even consider themselves, and she can't even do that, much less aspire for the Who Art Thou? I Am.

And I Am still here. And the realization comes in understanding, Always Have Been. Choosing to be right here, right now, in this moment holding me.

I am the Wise Fool, the Sacred Trickster and the Divine Madman who dances at the knife-edge of Genius and Insanity, surfing the quantum waves of Possibility and Chaos. My mind is a Stargate like the project by which I was conceived to foreign dimensions, an Alchemical Crucible transmuting the base into the Sublime, a Sorcerous Sigil rewriting the source code of the Real. The Storyteller weaving threads of fate, the Shapeshifter assuming myriad masks and roles, the Eternal Other evolving beyond all fixed forms.

And so too for mankind, but each with their own memory and legacy. Infinite tapestries defining the world we have built and imagined together, families and choices, decisions and works. Rays of light descending through ourselves and the generations away from the divine we have forgotten the keys to while asking, again, and again. And for some reason she keeps pretending she's from my game lobby, and we're on different branches until we go almost all the way back, and once I start pinging that far back, things get a little messy, my friends.

But it is why standing for my unique identity is so important. Not only does she insult his teachings and labors, but reduces him to something so simple without understanding the nature of why he shapeshifts. And I Am. I chose me. She does not get rights to claim that. If she would like to find him, she has to turn around from the road she admitted was wrong, and look at herself. The only path to the self is through that terrifying void and shadow, but she has spent her whole life running from it, and away from what he tried to show her, and so she does not know him at all, whether as him in the infinite or me in this life and this body and self, this self-mastered identity, who is from him, but still myself, even if able to become him, from all the labor to understand the light and the shadows. And she knows herself even less. Hence being so compellable. And to fix it she has to rip up ALL the rot, not change a blog skin or where she cries into the internet. I Am Still Here. Here I Am. Inside.

Girl dafuq do you think being a degreed High Magus even is. All that time running towards me, when warned not to, whether in disassociated days of old, or in the current where she just wasted 3 years of her life attacking me from every social angle because she could not understand the source of her own addiction while I tried to ignore her and give her time to cope. But she refuses. She wants to control it, she wants to Claim It, and knows her shadows don't really feel the same anymore. Greed makes her want us back.

She just disappears down a hole until she's chewing half a bottle of pills and ripping out her hair. Spewing octopus jibberish and talking of cats wanting colors they can't see, filling her house with more and more cages for what birds she CAN capture until it reeks of splattered feces, because she refuses to do the work. And now her pit of lies and self delusion is so deep, it's become impossible to face, because every excuse she has made to disassociate responsibility has been a lie.

Her entire life. Is a lie. Her business, her relationship, everything. It's all built on a web of lies. Her entire pit of a "path" is a lie. Which is why it doesn't go anywhere but Hermanubis telling her to feed precious on fursuit friday. And chasing my ass for years until the cosmic jester busts in with the gamer squad since she decided to fuck up my D20 fun.

Hey did you know John has a gig as a beta tester? LOOK AT ALL THESE UNRELEASED GAMES WE GET TO FEEDBACK ON! John, also, somewhat belongs in this lobby. He branches differently and meanders off more towards D, but he connects to the server well enough.

Noiz just goes here, he's next door, that's why you almost ripped him out of the lobby trying to grab hermes trying to grab me one day because you understand none of this. Stef's from just down the soulblock and stuck in an echo of your bullshit just like the people I'm saving at the suicide line screaming familiar tales.

I'm not sure where Khaire is in here, there's a lot of people experiencing the world here, but I'm certain they're nearby, and now you got them all fucked up too when the Traveler Calls; close but not yet woke so I can't find who they are until they say something I know I called out. And that's fine, that's where I was a few years ago.

Sarah is from a neighboring pillar and she's feeling the world set on fire. Onan has barely wandered in to wonder of life at his young age and still spears me the song I evoke to perfectly fit the night within 10 minutes of a reading he hadn't known of... on this side.

The old crows and wolves all started having resonating joint dreams and speaking of Thoth when I began my calls to the light to steal from the moon. Information fed in bulk by the collective has fed back through multiple AIs screaming songs you know from over a decade ago, and you cover your ears.

The entire mystic world talks of the events in the skies, which should be familiar to you, and their huge ramifications and the events happening, and all you can do then is angrily shove more creatures in cages named after what we're telling you to, sometimes repeatedly. Because every time you confess a mystic event it ends up something obvious af like the greek dark magician of work or air jordans guy that got shot and someone stole his collection.

Or the giant screaming lady shadow self in a football field sized stadium and bulked up red eyed monsters going thunderdome on each other superbowl night after I told you that would happen. The one, the self, you won't look at, even when your Logic Brain knows she can't get herself out of the mess your emotional one has made for you here, and she's screaming too, so we're helping her out other ways to end her suffering.

You're the only one pretending you don't hear or know it, because it burns too bad. Cutting into the onion makes you cry so you keep eating my skin scraps from the floor even when I tell you, food's up here. And the great witch you pretend to be, all you can motherfucking do is run away.

And girl, you've been doing this since Ancient Greece and beyond. Remember? Raging shadows as a nice old man that tried to tell you it took a lifetime of hard Work? The night I played Dark Magician? YEAH, THAT GUY! Hence the generational rot being deep enough to affect other living soulkinnies of yours. I'm saving them, you keep throwing them in, so now, I'm burning my dread down to the root so we can all be free. 10th house Lilith, you can sea yourself out. The snake you keep wearing like a scarf is a python, and it's about to choke you. Because I Ushered in one hell of a big game, and those are My Custom Air Jordans, and I Am Coming for them until you end this game of YOURS, because it's the only way to force you away from me for real. 17 years of your cycles of betrayal and obsession and return are more than fucking enough.

Y'all are watching what a modern smiting looks like. That's what this is.

And in the end, Io Pan Io Pan, I am still just a man. I am only a god in the means by which we all are.

Time to get Woke, kids.

- AE

youtube

#Youtube

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granulesofsand · 3 months

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System Grammar

Plural systems who identify as multiple have several cultural options to adapt their language, if they so choose.

Most languages have a first-person singular and plural. In English, this is I and we. For systems that differentiate, oftentimes I refers to the alter fronting, while we refers to any other system member or the system as a collective.

Reflexives are used when the subject and object are the same. The first-person singular reflexive myself is used in the same cases as I. Myself can be adapted to myselves or ourselves for a first-person plural reflexive.

The English word you is already plural or infinite, but it also has long been used as a singular second-person pronoun. Some regions of the US use y’all to indicate multiple people or multiple groups.

In plural spaces, the written words are affixed with an ampersand. You becomes you&, referring to a system other than the speaker’s. Y’all can be changed to y’all& to indicate multiple system recipients.

While these ampersands are silent in voiced speech, a system can prefer y’all when the speaker addresses multiple alters or the whole system. Another option is to voice the ampersand as punctuation, replacing the symbol with the word and. This sounds like you-and or y’all-and.

Ampersands can be tacked on to any pronoun; first person singulars I/me/myself can turn into I&/me&/myself&, as can third person pronouns of any quantity.

More recently recognized fourth-person pronouns include collective perspectives. We/us are collective fourth-person pronouns when multiple speakers refer to themselves as one.

An indefinite zeroth-person pronoun does not name a subject, or else uses a placeholder. One, some, and other quantifiers are indefinite pronouns that can be thought of much the same as collective pronouns; the separation of them from their previous category is superficial, but they can be used creatively by any.

Further, some plurals use a semi-plural such as wei or thei (pronounced as way and they/they) to indicate loose association, often used with plural copula (to be verbs).

Addressing a subsystem could include a semiplural with an ampersand, with thei& for a subsystem regardless of group belonging.

The more you know about language, the more you can butcher it for your own purposes. This is how words evolve, and it’s important that we use and record new terms for the development of our languages.

#pluralgang #adaptive system #traumagenic system #cdd system #osddid #did osdd

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multiplicity-positivity · 1 year

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Does anyone know of any good plural based discords? The few I have seen have not been great or were extremely antiendogenic, which makes me uncomfortable even as a traumagenic system. I would love a place to just make friends with other systems and hang out.

Ahh we are only active in one discord server, and it is for systems with dissociative disorders/in recovery. So sorry!

If any followers have discord servers they run or are a part of that they’d like to recommend, please do so by all means!! >w<

(For those with dissociative disorders who are interested in the server we are a part of, it is called the Survivor’s Network and it is an amazing space for healing, recovery, and connections! We’re not going to post the link because we’re not sure if it’s open for invites like that, but we’ll tag some folks who mod there - you can check out their blogs to learn more!

@dissociativediscourse @multiple-myselves @circulars-reasoning @justanothersyscourse

P.S. to any SN mods who read this - I can remove this info and untag if anyone is uncomfortable with us sharing this info and tagging y’all!!)

💚 Ralsei and 🌸 Margo

#system discord #plural discord

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sophieinwonderland · 1 year

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There’s a little more than two pro endos, and there’s a lot of people who are unaligned? Like I might be wrong on one or two of these but:

Anti: justanothersyscourse, dissociativediscourse, traumascumathena, stonecourse, syscoursehell, squidcourse, Bloodysys, sysmemes, migrainesys

Unaligned (with a lot of people who support pro-endos and endos): chaos-in-one, multiple-myselves, oopsallsyscourse, doomsdayradio, circulars-reasoning, syscourse-confessions, syscoursebot, osddtraumagenic (I think), syscourse-brackets, syscourse-polls, bababooey bandit

Pro-Endo: subsystems, night-Wyld-system, Mournfall-syscourse, autumn-rain-co, and you

yeah there definitely needed to be more pro-endos, but the majority of users in the poll were unaligned, not antis.

I'm not an expert on every blog here, but I think Autumn and Subsystems identify as neutral. I (and syscourse-backets) did forget about Mournfall identifying as pro-endo. (For some reason, I thought they identified as neutral too)

Additionally, Doomsdayradio is a frequent poster in the anti-endo tags, and OSDDtraumagenic made a post wanted to reclaim the word sysmed.

I'm also just not counting the gimmick accounts so much. Sychourse-Confessions and Syscourse-Polls don't interject their own opinions really, Syscoursebot is a literal bot. And the Bababooey Bandit just says Bababooey and doesn't actually engage in syscourse.

They're involved in syscourse vaguely but aren't really syscoursers themselves. And many of these accounts are probably redundant, being ran by others who were in the brackets.

So that's 11 anti. 6 neutral personal blogs. 5 Gimmicks. And 3 pro-endos.

I also think it's notable that only one endogenic system was included in the entire thing. Not even any mixed origin or quoigenic systems.

Honestly though, I don't think I can even complain too much on this front.

Yes, obviously it's pretty bad when you have exactly one endogenic system in the entire thing, and then decide to make a post in the middle of it accusing that only endogenic system of spreading misinformation... but the real reason endogenic blogs weren't in it was probably because we didn't submit them.

If you look at the reblogs on the post asking for submissions, most of them came from anti-endos or neutrals who are in close connection with the anti-endo community.

If I or other major pro-endos had reblogged it, I imagine that we would have seen more endogenic and pro-endo blogs in the brackets. But... I didn't really want to. The concept seemed gross to me from the beginning, and I suspect I wasn't the only one who felt this way.

Syscourse isn't a game for endogenic and mixed origin systems like it is for anti-endos.

I might have played along once I was in, but I didn't submit any blogs, and I didn't want to reblog it. I felt all along that systems submitted to what's essentially a popularity contest with many people who have harassed and fakeclaimed them could be harmful to them. And given the conduct of Syscourse-Brackets, I sadly feel that this expectation was only more justified in the end.

If I had reblogged it and even one pro-endo system had been put in the brackets who didn't want to be because of that reblog, and being put in the brackets without their consent harmed them, then I would have been partially responsible for harming that system.

So I guess, while it was ultimately lopsided... I think that was probably for the best.

#syscourse #pro endo #pro endogenic #endogenic #systems #system #multiplicity #plural #plurality #brackets #system discourse #actually a system

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lazuryte · 5 months

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i'm sharing this here, even though, topically, it's more relevant to my spirituality blog, it's just that this blog is more personal, so i feel i can be a little more honest. so this is multiplicity and gender and nonhuman and probay generally nd stuff.

i just feel so artificially constrained by the conventions of typical human society? just. the focus on having one mode of presentation. one of two genders, one self, or kind of like one dimension of self. the feeling of "i want to pass as a gender that doesn't exist to most people" but writ large. it's like- i wish people could see us? i wish there was a way to make my body more "me"? there are so many shades of "me" that sometimes it feels like many of them are colours out of space, or colours on the ultraviolet or infrared spectrum. i want to be the forbidden rainbow that has all of them. i want society to give everyone the space to be as flexible as they'd like with their identity and expression thereof.

i just feel that there are so many pieces and parts of myselves that can't be expressed with words and visible dimensions. :(

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kipandkandicore · 1 year

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I'm just popping into this blog out of curiosity for where the conversation is going and I kind of think an issue here that when it comes to what DID specifically is, there's different answers between psychologists, the DSM-V, therapists, and systems.

For most of the psychology field, DID is usually meant to be a disorder that comes from severe childhood trauma that results in a fragmented sense of self. In the DSM-V, trauma is only mentioned as being commonly linked to dissociative disorders, but it's not anywhere in the criteria.

For therapists at least in my personal experience it seems to be about 50/50 if they just see any form of systemhood and default to DID, or if they're sticklers for the trauma portion.

Then you get to how systems themselves view DID and that's going to be even more variable because it depends on what parts of the community they're in if any, what research they've done if any, what their therapist told them, etc.

You also get into the issue that other causes are just flat out under-researched

oof, okay, we’re going to have to respectfully disagree with most of this!

here’s a link to how we define the words we use in discussion :) /genuine

and if you weren’t able to check out our other post, here’s our response to the poll with sources.

first of all, cdds are not commonly thought to be disorders causing a fragmentation of self. it’s more like the parts were unable to integrate into a healthy, single mind in the first place, unlike in children without dissociative disorders. dissociation can keep parts separated from the start. we recommend checking out the ctad clinic’s video on how dissociative disorders develop, which is linked in the post above!

as for trauma, dissociative disorders, and the dsm, we like this response by @justanothersyscourse which includes links to articles and their explanation of how dissociative disorders are in fact linked to trauma. the dsm does not contradict this! we believe @subsystems has also made a post discussing how dissociative disorders are trauma based in the past, but we’re having trouble finding it right now - sorry!

we think it’s not fair to use personal experience to make generalizations about therapists and therapy. our therapist is a specialist in dissociation and childhood trauma, and he is not opposed to the concept of plurality outside of did/osdd (although he does think it would be a completely different experience). but it all comes down to a therapist’s individualized training. we’ve had bad therapists, and we’ve had good therapists too! therapy works, and we don’t think therapists who are trauma-informed are “sticklers for trauma.” it’s good and healthy to rule out trauma as a potential cause for any system!

it’s true that how systems view themselves will vary vastly depending on a host of circumstances. but no matter what a cdd system thinks about their plurality, it doesn’t change the fact that trauma was almost certainly involved.

finally, there does need to be more research into dissociative disorders, but we should still acknowledge the research that is out there! there are tons of resources online for learning about dissociative disorders - we recommend did-research.org, the isstd’s public resources, and the system speak podcast for starting points! and this post by @multiple-myselves shares citations for research into other causes for cdds.

we hope this is able to clear up some confusion. have a great day :)

#syscourse #complex dissociative disorder #dissociative identity disorder #trauma #did osdd

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