I’m a bit stuck on my game’s fourth chapter because of overthinking. A lot of the overthinking ties directly into the handling of a plural character, so I figured I’d ask you.

So the third chapter introduced a character named Mildthryth. This was during a rescue mission for the local noble named Leofwaru. Mildthryth had a particular attachment to her.

In a flashback we see that another noble named Sceowynn had subjected Mildthryth to a sort of exorcism. Sceowynn is turned away after an argument with Leofwaru. Leofwaru basically said that you shouldn’t exorcise a child without her consent(as well as some political points that aren’t relevant to this discussion). After this, Aethelthryth(the demon in question) talks to Mildthryth direction and tells her that Leofwaru seems safe.

Back to the present, they find Leofwaru and her personal guards dead. They host a funeral pyre, then a feast. During the feast, Sceowynn arrives, feigning honorable intentions. After Sceowynn insults Leofwaru directly, Aethelthryth force fronts to yell at her. Then Sceowynn provokes Aethelthryth to chase her outside.

Originally I intended that their friend Cyneflaed would calm Aethelthryth down, but then I realized it didn’t make sense for Mildthryth to be talking to her first. I do want Cyneflaed to have a role in calming her down, but for that Mildthryth’s words need to be insufficient.

My current plan is that Mildthryth and Aethelthryth don’t recognize the possibility that Sceowynn might just want to kill them both. Mildthryth is just worried to lose her friend to a possible exorcism attempt. In that case Cyneflaed would point that out, and make Aethelthryth realize how recklessly she’s behaving. But I worry this might seem insulting somehow. Just wanna run it by people who know better.

Additionally, I wanted to have a second flashback with Leofwaru somewhere in there. I think it’d be for when she’s introduced to Aethelthryth. The main thing I wanted to make clear with such a scene is that Leofwaru was unambiguously supportive of them. And I was hoping for advice on how best to convey that.

I think that’s everything I wanted to ask about. Thanks for your time!

It makes perfect sense to have a friend try to calm a more volatile alter/headmate if it's needed, especially for their safety, Demon or not. That this demon is fronting initially to defend Leofwaru helps avoid some of the "evil alter" tropes that might otherwise be present. But that Demon's still a person and not gonna always be the most levelheaded when it's needed, and that's within narrative reason!

As for Leofwaru, you could show Mildthryth talking about the friendship they've made, and Leofwaru erring on the side of "This is making you happier, and I want you to be happy." And that could be how he shows his support.

Or maybe he mentions noticing that Mildthryth has gotten more of a backbone lately, and that's been good to see, only for it to be revealed that it's been Aethelthryth that he's been seeing do those bold or brave things. And he gets to express that her life seems to be better with this support in her life. That fully depends on what Aethelthryth's personality is like, but it's an option.

I hope that prompts some inspiration!

-Mod Tick Tock

ve were wondering about getting internal family systems therapy to try to become plural, does that seem at all feasible? or like a stepping stone at the least. Ve're out of any other options cause ve feel like currently, ve aren't capable of becoming plural without assistance. (combo of various disabilities makes it too hard)

Maybe...

While IFS might be able to cause plurality, it's not really for that and I might advise other methods first.

There are countless tlupamancy guides out there for those wanting to make their own headmates, and a thriving community that can lend you their advise. Failing that, there's also daemonism as an option.

https://www.tumblr.com/sophieinwonderland/748011398558285825/hi-this-is-one-of-those-is-this-plurality-kind

hi. that. i have that exact same experience, i. had to make sure i didn’t send that in myself.

if it helps, if any of your kins start losing the ‘me’ feeling then i would think that’s another sign towards plurality (it’s happened to me a couple times, but other times it’s turned out to just be a kintype fading. in my experience it sort of varies??)

and. idk, i think i mostly wanted to say i experience that too. i think there’s a sort of comfort in knowing you’re not alone in your experiences, especially when they fit your own to a T.

Thanks for the addition!

If anti-endos are mad about the Christian God being a system, they’ll absolutely lose it when they learn about Hinduism.

As someone who is unfamiliar with a lot of the specifics of Hinduism, I'd love to hear more! 😁

Morpheus suddenly appears before you and offers you the choice between ingesting a blue pill and a red pill. If forced to make a decision, would you take the blue pill or the red pill?

I'm turning around.

I make a habit of not accepting drugs from strangers.

At the very least, I'm going to want to have a long, drawn-out conversation about these pills and potential side-effects before sticking them in my mouth that would not be very cinematic.

(But like, if I had to, Red Pill. Anything that erases my memories is a complete non-starter, and knowledge is power.)

I think a huge thing some people are missing about the "God is plural" topic is the larger implications.

It's not just "God is plural, and that's cool."

"God is plural" is a starting place.

The real importance, I believe, lies in Genesis 1:26.

And God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness"

Man was made in the likeness of God. And this verse is generally considered to be referencing Man's spiritual or mental attributes. Most agree that we don't literally look like God.

And this very verse uses plural pronouns to refer to God. The Hebrew word for God used here is Elohim, which is also a plural word.

While God being plural would be cool in itself, I feel the bigger and more important point is that if God is plural, and mankind is made in the likeness of God, then it adds further credence for Natural Multiplicity from a Trinitarian perspective.

I think a huge thing some people are missing about the "God is plural" topic is the larger implications.

It's not just "God is plural, and that's cool."

"God is plural" is a starting place.

The real importance, I believe, lies in Genesis 1:26.

And God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness"

Man was made in the likeness of God. And this verse is generally considered to be referencing Man's spiritual or mental attributes. Most agree that we don't literally look like God.

And this very verse uses plural pronouns to refer to God. The Hebrew word for God used here is Elohim, which is also a plural word.

While God being plural would be cool in itself, I feel the bigger and more important point is that if God is plural, and mankind is made in the likeness of God, then it adds further credence for Natural Multiplicity from a Trinitarian perspective.

Hi, this is one of those "is this plurality?" kind of asks. Hope I can get your thoughts on this:

I've considered myself fictionkin of multiple characters, and recently started thinking maybe the kinshifts are actually switches instead? Though I have no amnesia at all, but some days I can feel the change in my perception, I can get dysphoria specific for the character (height, voice, etc) and the other day I feel dysphoria for another character. It feels like I'm becoming a different person every now and then. But I'm not sure if I'm one person who's personality changes often or if I'm multiple people. Or maybe something in-between. Either way I don't know.

Also, we kinda talk to each other sometimes, but it feels like daydreaming, idk how I can know that the characters I imagine are actually sentient and talking to me, rather than just me imagining them talk. Because I just like thinking about my kins, they're nice, so sometimes I want to talk to them, when I don't feel like actually "being them". So, yeah... Thanks in advance!

That sounds plural to me. I mean, kintypes don't usually talk to each other from what I know

To be fair, people naturally have the ability to make up imaginary characters to talk to, but these aren't usually autonomous or conscious.

Another thing that might help sort this out is that imaginary characters wouldn't recall experiences that happened in your body like it was theirs. So one thing to look out for would be if your "kins" identify with certain things "you" do or say while shifted into them. Do memories that happened in the body feel like they belonged to them?

My advice is that, when you talk to these kintypes next, ask them questions about their perspectives on shifting or if they view themselves as their own people, or similar introspective questions. Act as an investigator trying to learn all you can about them.

Best of luck in figuring things out

Btw it's fine to sometimes get like. Relapses in your ability to communicate with your system members. Like you might want to figure out if anything specific caused it (like stress, illness, etc.) but generally speaking this just happens sometimes and it's not the end of the world so don't work yourself up too much over it. Especially considering that building communication is part of recovery for most disordered systems; it's normal to hit roadblocks or to experience relapses in your recovery from time-to-time. Don't panic if communicating with your system has become difficult or impossible recently. Take a deep breath, return to the basics of what helped you build that communication in the first place, and don't push yourself too far trying to get it back. Maybe it's burnout. Maybe you're going through a rough patch. Maybe you just need a break. Who knows? But working yourself up over it isn't going to help, so try to take things one step at a time. This just happens sometimes, so give yourself/ves patience when it does.

Soooooo how common are sudden influxes of fictive headmates? It's been a while since we had a bunch show up at once, but didn't experience it with fictives before. For reference, body has ADHD and the host has had a hyperfixation on a specific media for well over two years. Yesterday we experienced.... About 5 or so fictives of that media popping up? It's exhausting, disorienting, and everybody is severely confused

Along the same trail of thought, is there a word for two fictives who are technically the same person but behave completely differently? Say, a fictive of a character from when they were a young adult and then there's another fictive of that same character of when they were far older? Is there a way to keep them calm, because they're severely freaked out by each other's existence?

Headmates with the same source are usually called Doubles. Not sure if there's a specific term for doubles that are very different from each other, but they're still Doubles.

As for influxes, for some, yeah. There are a lot of systems out there who will have periods where they form a lot of headmates super fast. Saying that every system is different feels like a cop-out, but every system is different. 🤷‍♀️

We've never experienced what you're describing because we're a relatively small system and always have been, but I bet many people reading this will relate!

I love being plural! I love my headmates, i love their identities and their hobbies and seeing them fulfilled alongside me. I love the fluidity of change and not feeling pressured into a singular Self. I love myself and myselves and those of us that aren't me and those of us that are sort of but not really. I love being able to relax and sit back while someone else controls the body. I love the feeling of working together with different strengths! I love seeing other members' hobbies and skills develop, as well as their lives and selves grow and change. I love my system I love being plural and nobody will ever take that away from us

Soooooo how common are sudden influxes of fictive headmates? It's been a while since we had a bunch show up at once, but didn't experience it with fictives before. For reference, body has ADHD and the host has had a hyperfixation on a specific media for well over two years. Yesterday we experienced.... About 5 or so fictives of that media popping up? It's exhausting, disorienting, and everybody is severely confused

Along the same trail of thought, is there a word for two fictives who are technically the same person but behave completely differently? Say, a fictive of a character from when they were a young adult and then there's another fictive of that same character of when they were far older? Is there a way to keep them calm, because they're severely freaked out by each other's existence?

Headmates with the same source are usually called Doubles. Not sure if there's a specific term for doubles that are very different from each other, but they're still Doubles.

As for influxes, for some, yeah. There are a lot of systems out there who will have periods where they form a lot of headmates super fast. Saying that every system is different feels like a cop-out, but every system is different. 🤷‍♀️

We've never experienced what you're describing because we're a relatively small system and always have been, but I bet many people reading this will relate!

It baffles me the offense taken at @sophieinwonderland 's plural trinity theory (that many others, including us, have come to independently) because she's checks notes using it to push an agenda.

Like, do y'all not understand how xtianity works? Have y'all listened to a preacher before? Have y'all ever been inside of a church after a big controversy has hit the news and heard a message relating to that from the pulpit?

Most scripture we see quoted is to push an agenda. Most sermons are backed by an agenda. Even earnest spiritual explorations of the Bible are informed by one's preexisting beliefs and biases (and those of the teacher if there is one). It's not wrong to push an agenda through theological interpretation. That's just what theological interpretation is.

The specific agenda may be harmful yes. But the problem is that they're pushing a harmful agenda, not that they're pushing an agenda.

Is it deeply offensive to make jokes/theories about Jesus being ace? Hell we've seen articulate discussions in xtian and ex-xtian circles about if Paul was ace or gay and doing a whole bunch of moralizing to justify his queerness. Would it be wrong to point out to a transphobe that Jesus (only having the XX chromosomes of Mary) would have therefore been either trans or intersex? How about to quote passages that seem to be Jesus specifically preaching that transition is holy?

Shit, when we had aspirations of becoming a pastor we worked on a sermon about how the early church in Acts was straight up communism. We wrote one on that meme where Jesus says "Did i fucking stutter?" We tried to get our church to start a queer ministry program. We tried to build it into a mutual aid org. Cause I'm a queer xtian anarchist and I have an agenda to push.

And I'm predicting a response out there. "Oh Faye! But that's not what social justice preachers or televangelists are doing. They're interpreting the True Word of God and building their agenda from that!" Which would be worthwhile to entertain and discuss. Except that the disdain at God being viewed as an endogenic median system is coming from non-xtians.

And sure, she's an atheist with an ex-christian host. So maybe you can think that it's wrong for her specifically to push an agenda through xtianity. But xtian theology isn't sacrosanct and immune to outside interpretation. It fucking lost that privilege when it forcibly tries to convert half the world. You can't tell someone to stop touching a religion when that religion is being forced on everyone.

Anyone who's fighting Sophie's take on the trinity on the grounds that it's wrong to interpret doctrine to push an agenda is doing christofascist colonialist's work for them. Christofascists are the ones that have a vested interest in xtianity having one true doctrine free of politics or agendas. It's those people that want to say that the xtian Bible simply agrees with their bigotry and any interpretation otherwise is blasphemous and degenerate. They want xtian doctrine to be a settle issue that lands squarely affirming their death cult of heteropatriarchial, xenophobic, antisemitic violence. Not something open for interpretations in ways that further equality or justice (exactly the goal that Sophie clearly states).

-Faye

Soooooo how common are sudden influxes of fictive headmates? It's been a while since we had a bunch show up at once, but didn't experience it with fictives before. For reference, body has ADHD and the host has had a hyperfixation on a specific media for well over two years. Yesterday we experienced.... About 5 or so fictives of that media popping up? It's exhausting, disorienting, and everybody is severely confused

Along the same trail of thought, is there a word for two fictives who are technically the same person but behave completely differently? Say, a fictive of a character from when they were a young adult and then there's another fictive of that same character of when they were far older? Is there a way to keep them calm, because they're severely freaked out by each other's existence?

Headmates with the same source are usually called Doubles. Not sure if there's a specific term for doubles that are very different from each other, but they're still Doubles.

As for influxes, for some, yeah. There are a lot of systems out there who will have periods where they form a lot of headmates super fast. Saying that every system is different feels like a cop-out, but every system is different. 🤷‍♀️

We've never experienced what you're describing because we're a relatively small system and always have been, but I bet many people reading this will relate!

Here's another Plural Song for you! We Three by The Ink Spots totally sounds like three Headmates (Echo, Shadow, and the unnamed singer) lamenting how lonely they are and expressing a desire for Romantic Love.

"What good is the moonlight

The silvery moonlight that shines above?

I walk with my shadow

I talk with my echo

But where is the one I love?

We three, we'll wait for you

Even till eternity

My echo, my shadow, and me"

Hmm... I don't know... paging @is-this-plural. 🤔

Nah, I'm kidding! It's totally plural! 🤪

Thanks for sending it my way! 😁

(As an aside, I feel like we've heard this on some TV show or movie but I just can't place it...)

I also think it's funny how that one blog just straight-up admits that they wouldn't be pretending to care about saying God is plural if it was anyone else saying it. But since it's coming from me, they're going to act mad.

it's become a bit of a theme I noticed, where certain syscoursers will see me saying or doing something, get angry over it, and then just not care if someone else says or does the same thing. They usually don't spell it out so blatantly though.

I'm pretty sure what SAS is trying to argue here is "people refer to God having multiple personalities in a mocking and ableist way, therefore acknowledging God is plural supports ableism and hurts people with DID."

Or something like that?

Personally, I feel like acknowledging the plurality of God would be akin to reclaiming. Rather than supporting ableism, it takes its power away.

This is stupid but I've seen it twice now so I'm genuinely curious: why do some people take such offense to calling God plural/making plural jokes about Christianity? Gang, they've got billions of followers and two thousand years of history, I don't think making blasphemous jokes on tumblr dot gov is going to seriously offend the pope.

(Now granted, I am an ex-christian so maybe I enjoy blasphemous jokes of any variety, but to be fair, I make dick jokes about the gods of my actual current religion. So.)