#jirt. what the fuck.
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sam when he thinks frodo's been killed by shelob: all i want to do right now is throw myself off a cliff, but i'll force myself to go on just long enough to destroy the ring and then come back here so i can never leave you again, implying that i plan to lie down next to your body until i die because i don't want to make the journey home if you're not with me. also before i leave i'm gonna take one last look at your face to take in how beautiful you are
jrr tolkien translating the red book of westmarch:
#lord of the rings#lotr lb#despite my samfrodo posting i actually can see a platonic reading for a lot of their interactions#but this? especially after sam fighting shelob away from frodo was compared to a small creature defending its mate?#jirt. what the fuck.#anyway i went back and forth on the phrasing of this post a million times#bc i really didn't want people to argue about whether or not sam could have carried frodo's body out of mordor if he'd really died
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"Actually the hobbits in the movies were super inaccurate because Tolkien wanted everything to be strictly medieval" buddy if Jirt wanted the hobbits to be strictly medieval he wouldn't have given them working plumbing (ft. Pippin nearly flooding the bathroom) and waistcoats.
#thank you for coming to my ted talk#listen its fucking FANTASY jolkien rolkien rolkien tolkien can do what he wants#lotr#lord of the rings#lotr meme#hobbits#jrrt#jirt
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sick and twisted how much frodo loves the shire, his home, and yet most of the people who live there didn’t care about him when he came home, didn’t want to hear his stories, just thought him cracked. respected him enough as he had wealth and his class as landed gentry. but didn’t care. tolkien what the fuck
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Sméagol and the Gift
'Now!' said Sam. 'At last I can deal with you!' He leaped forward with drawn blade ready for battle. But Gollum did not spring. He fell flat upon the ground and whimpered.
'Don't kill us,' he wept. 'Don't hurt us with nassty cruel steel! Let us live, yes, live just a little longer. Lost lost! We're lost. And when Precious goes we'll die, yes, die into the dust.'
Devastated by this. Just a little longer, he begs. Even though his existence is a torment. Even though the will that holds him to life is barely his own anymore. He has long outlived his time but it's such a cruelty that now the only freedom for him is in death. I'm glad Sam didn't kill him but the whole scenario is awful.
When a mortal keeps a ring of power he does not gain more life, he continues, denied natural mortality as the fear of death is amplified and twisted into fear of separation, nothing matters anymore but the keeping, the continuing. In that miserable existence there is no peace, and at its end there is no graceful goodbye to life, there is only dust. Sudden, empty, and final.
It would take murder to spare him that. Or falling with the ring into the fire.
Bilbo let it go in time (did he feel anything when it was destroyed?) Frodo is freed of it now, though the toll it extracted for the separation was at very least a finger. It was too late for Gollum for the price to be anything other than it was, and that's brutal.
If you live long enough, death is no longer the enemy. What Sauron did to Gollum ensured that it would always be the enemy, to be feared and avoided for ever, once time and the ring had fashioned it into the only escape left. Evil.
#lotr newsletter#suicide mention in tags#haunted by the au in which gollum goes into the fire with the ring On Purpose#bc he still couldnt separate himself from it but frodo's compassion had somewhat released him from its evil#in a way an honor to frodo's quest and in a way an act of mercy to be able to give up the self-torment#which gives me shrimp feelings bc of the everything but also back to the original point that it is so tragic that death is all that awaits#bc death is natural and that was taken from him. what is the will to live in the absence of natural death?#smth deeply horrible about that#matt bugg screaming we'll be dust. so famous and rent free#lotrn325#damn it im having more thoughts#wraiths vs gollum: discuss#the nature of the ring kept affects the nature of its possession no? those rings were made FOR thralldom#sauron has power over gollum but not That Much and his own ring is all abt the domination#what would a 2000 year old gollum even be like ._.#the wraiths are probably even more tragic bc at this point they're like...undead. even death isn't freedom#on that topic what happened to the witch-king's spirit fr#I'm pretty sure he isn't ever actually called that in the book but it's epic and gender and way snappier than lord of the nazgul#anyway shoutout to i think yambits for breaking the lore and giving them peace that was sick#where's my gollum rehab fic#i know he's a horrible little man who is constantly trying to murder my boys but i love him so#the au...gollum gaining the willpower to destroy himself because he was given trust and kindness and companionship for once. FUCKED UP.#fucked up horrible i need a minute. being shown compassion and then becoming more self-compassionate. epic#that compassion entailing seeking the freedom of death your soul was denied bc this is fantasy and somehow the exact#arc that usually leads to fighting to live is now flipped. HUH.#yeah jirt alluded to his motivation being For Frodo but i maintain that the willingness to die is HUGE there and extremely relevant#me and my red string keeping me company#ugh tag championships i win i think but at what cost#who wants to spin around miserably in a pool like franknfurter with me as we listen to gollum's song#tam you're already invited i have a floaty for u
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Crazy how for the Dagor Dagorath, Tolkien put the ultimate destruction of Morgoth in the hands of a man meaning that it may not happen (because Men are not bound by the song). It's the ultimate suspense, what if in the end he becomes too afraid? (not likely) what if he allies with Morgoth (EXTREMELY not likely)? However, NOT impossible. Nothing is impossible because Men are not bound by the song.
#silmarillion#jirt#tolkien#The lord of the rings#the hobbit#the dagor dagorath#wars of arda#fuck Morgoth#NOT LITERALLY ANNATAR#ykw do what you want#children of hurin#the amount of hatred and enmity behind that death blow could solve the energy crisis#headcanons#middle earth#eldar and edain#welcome to Silmarillion study#we're all children of Eru#*sings Nolodante while Mae and Fingon are tongue dancing in the back*
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Tolkien: death is the gift of Eru to men. It cannot and should not be avoided or defeated. Any attempt ends in madness and tragedy
Also Tolkien: yeah and then Tuor became immortal lmao
#jirt what the fuck we had a theme going#silm#genuinely wondering if anyone has any thoughts on what this means like. thematically
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if hobbits have smocks and pinafores im sure they have jumper skirts somewhere <- guy trying to logicize an oc’s outfit
#the entireee shire cant have JUST 18th century outfits#i know that on-screen its just likely hobbits from the same area so they cant show The Entire Shire#i think each farthing deserves a special . fuck whats the word.#special 'dress'#each farthing should be a little different or have something unique#cuz im sure that michel delving is dressing the same as long cleeve#and that buckland is dressing the same as longbottom#AND between the influences of bree with buckland and being 'different' i feel like theyd dress a bit more . modern? idk. different lol#tobias talks#REGIONAL OUTFITS#thats the word#i mean maybe they are all dressing the same#but#thankfully this is a fantasy book so i can do what i want#sorry jirt#<- also i think itd be fun to have regional differences in the shire#theres already regional dialects#<- at least according to stuff ive read im not a tolkien scholar lol
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andy serkis gives *all* the rohirrim soldiers karl urban's new zealand accent. which makes sense, in terms of defining them as a cohesive culture! i think we get dialogue in the book from more different rohirrim than unique members of any other culture except shire-hobbits, which is not a question i had ever pondered before. *maybe* rivendell elves?
it's just also, you know, one hell of an experience to have tolkien's narration going on about how awesome old english the rohirric language is, while you're hearing something so very different from old english
#(how do i know what the fuck an old english accent sounds like? jirt spoke with one afaict)#(i don't have the ear to tell if there are aspects of south african accent to it)#(but it's very not received pronunciation and it's just about letter for letter how he says to pronounce things in the appendices)#(and i know for a fact he spoke extremely fluent old english so i should imagine he spoke it with the correct accent)
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Nerdanel for blorbo bingo?
thank u SO MUCH…… my boytoy nerdanel:
bingo here
#im fucking chewing her shes EVERYTHING TO ME.#blowing everything up with my mind right the fuck now.#jirt doesnt give us much details abt the ladies in the silm but what we got about her is enough to make her bounce around my brain giving m#depression. god bless#WAIT I NEED TO GIVE FICREC: golden days by lyra i think from silm writers guild its fucking slaps#i love u nerdanel
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WHY CANT I REBLOG THE COOL HOBBITS ARE ENTWIVES POST TUMBLR PLEASE
#im gonna fucking riot what is this#why is tumblr not letting me have lotr on my blog#what have i done to deserve this#jirt im sorry for whatever i did pls let me reblog the cool entwives post
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In honor of Return of the King's 20th (!!) anniversary this week, this poll asks just what has made Jirt and PJ's epic trilogy so enduring.
youtube
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Ask me about my not-yet-written-fics from this list
thanks, @eowyn7023 also tagging: @polutrope because you sent me an ask about this a while ago and I just haven't had the spoons to respond until now, sorry! <3
Elrond in Valinor + Second Flight of the Noldor
so this stems from three possibly spicy Opinions I have about LOTR: 1) The Valar kind of suck, actually, and it was wrong of them to bring Elves to Valinor in the first place and it went directly against Eru's plan. 2) Valinor is kind of liminal and bad for you if you were born in Middle Earth 3) Elrond sailing (and staying) in Valinor is makes very little sense for him as a character, and is more about Jirt's wish fulfillment than it is good writing.
Obviously, unfortunately, due to the narrative, Elrond must sail at the end of LOTR. He needs to recuperate from the absolute havoc Vilya wreaked on his system, and he also needs to reunite with Cel and get some closure about a few things, like Celebrimbor's death, Gil-Galad's death, and his relationship with Elwing.
So Elrond sails, as he does. He reunites with Celebrian. He spends some time meeting his various family members and spends quite a lot of time with Gil-Galad and Celebrimbor. He has exactly one (1) talk with Elwing to ask her some questions and explain what became of Elros, but in my head he is not really interested in pursuing much of a relationship with her. Elwing respects that.
He and Celebrian work on healing their relationship and re-establishing intimacy.
Elrond slowly recovers from the damage Vilya did to him.
He might need to spend some time in Lorien actually. He is very good friends with Este and Nienna.
After a while though, things just don't feel right. Valinor feels very static and strange to him, and he doesn't really feel like he Fits. And that hurts because everyone is so glad to have him there and they expect that he's just as glad to be here as they are.
Also he really misses his kids, and wonders about his grandkids, and the Dunedain.
Eventually he starts connecting with more and more people who feel like they don't Fit. Mostly Noldor and the few Sindar that sailed. Many of them are still dealing with PTSD from Middle Earth and Beleriand, or with scars that refuse to heal. Many of them are just Restless. Most Vanyar do not understand this, and it's hard to talk about.
He and Cel begin work on a second Rivendell, and this keeps them both busy for a short time. He still doesn't feel Right though.
Eventually he starts experiencing like a reverse sea-longing and it gets more, and more, and more painful.
Finally, he talks it over with Celebrian. And they petition the Valar, who are not very happy to be petitioned. And then Elrond starts preparing to sail East.
Listen listen listen. Everything that Elrond has ever built, worked for, or loved is back in Middle Earth. It makes zero sense for him to be happy in Valinor. He aligns overwhelmingly with the Sindar and with the Dunedain in the books, and the Dunedain also consider him as one of them. Rivendell is there (he left it in the care of the Dunedain). Arwen and Aragorn are there. Gondor, and what is left of Elros are there. His grandchildren are there. Elladan and Elrohir are still there. The people left for him in Valinor are all people he has already mourned and found closure with.
He's not really made for Valinor anyway. He's made to watch over Middle Earth, to keep its lore and secrets, and to caretake Elros' line. He made a vow, once, and sure Aragorn and his descendants are doing just fine but he still feels half-whole without them.
And he's not the only person who doesn't feel Right in Valinor, who miss the mold and the rot and the fungi and the sheer diversity of life, and the Men!!! The humans!!! The normalcy of pain and suffering and scars and disabilities!
And so Elrond sails with Celebrian, and many of the Noldor say 'fuck it' and they go with him. They're tired and restless and have misgivings about the Valar anyway. A remnant returns to Middle Earth, and this time they go for love.
Elrond retakes his seat in Rivendell and the Dunedain rejoice that the eldest of their race, their most beloved uncle has come home. Celebrian reunites with Arwen, and meets a long line of adopted children that she never got to see, and meets Aragorn and her grandchildren.
They live through the ages, quietly doing what they have always done: living as watchers and caretakers, carefully preserving memories and lore and history.
Rivendell becomes a place that is both mythologized and startlingly real, where it is rumored that anyone who needs it will find help and sanctuary.
Many of the Noldor live in Rivendell, but some set up their own small kingdoms or simply live alongside the men and dwarves. They're finally there to guide and watch over the Secondborn, just as was intended in the Theme.
Eventually, of course, Elrond must grieve Arwen and Aragorn, but he's there for his grandchildren, and his great grandchildren, and his great grandchildren, and all of his family thereafter -- and in Arwen and Aragorn and their line, it almost feels like he is reunited with Elros again.
Elrond is there to help.
#<3#listen i know part of Tolkien's Themes are magic leaving the world etc etc. but I don't like it#and especially for Elrond as a character it makes very little sense#elrond#celebrian#lotr#i do like other people's interpretations of Elrond in Valinor and I enjoy Elrond in Valinor fics!#but this is the one in my head that works best for me and how I see him
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(I was wondering for a while if I should edit this post to be neater, or erase the things I've already said, but after all I decided to keep it just as it was, because over the past few months I was adding more and more thoughts to it as I edited, and I wanted to keep them that way, unedited and just the way they came to me. so here are some thoughts I had while editing the newsletter)
editing LOTR to go chronologically felt like constantly finding some hidden gems that can only be found when you read that way, and wondering if they were put there intentionally (and knowing jirt, they most probably were). it was a truly, deeply special experience, and a unique way of experiencing LOTR to me
there are so many fragments where jirt says what happens after everything! the ponies were okay, Pippin cried when he heard horns after the battle of Pelennor fields for years to come, even the prologue reveals some information about who survived the War
the long breaks in Rivendell and Lórien were very interesting in this format. some people were remarking how they liked thinking about the fellowship just chilling during those breaks, and I think it created a nice effect of both the characters and us forgetting how close the danger is for them. it let us take those breaks with them!
the only part of the quest that doesn't have a date assigned to it takes part in Lórien, it's the one where Frodo and Sam sing about Gandalf. and it's SUCH a good detail! Tolkien kept track of every event, of dates and even times of day for the entire duration of the quest, but this fragment is just Somewhere There, because in Lórien time seems to stand still, and you can never know when you are
the only other fragments which are confusing time-wise take place during the dark days with no sun, which is of course a great writing choice, but even they are described in Appendix B - the Lórien fragment has no date, no reference point, nothing
it doesn't hit you that much when you read the book, but the battle of Helm's Deep happened literally just one (1) week after the breaking of the Fellowship. Aragorn was out there having the Worst Week Of His Fucking Life
I loved feeling the impact of certain events more while reading chronologically (the three hunters running for days made more impact on me when I was sending yet another entry and they were still running)
before actually going through TTT and ROTK, I was preparing for very long entries for each day. but after the Tower of Cirith Ungol and the Battle of the Pelennor Fields (March 15th), the next ten days before the Ring is destroyed are so... empty in comparison. and it works amazingly well when you read according to dates. we hear just enough from Aragorn and the Host of the West to let the tension grow and grow. we hear just enough from Frodo and Sam to feel the oppressive atmosphere of these entries. but on the other hand, the entries are short enough to set our imaginations to work and make them fill in the rest. to me it's the perfect balance of the horror you read about and the horror you know is still there even after you close the book. this is what I mean by hidden gems, because it works that well only when you read day-by-day - in the book those fragments are just a few pages long, and you can get through those ten days very fast. but when you read according to dates, the torment is spread over so much time
the previous point is why I loved seeing the pacing in LOTR this way. in LOTR, so much can happen in ten days; and yet so little happened between march 15th and 25th besides fear and suffering
there was one part that gave me a headache because I spent so long trying to figure it out I forgot to eat - March 10th-14th in the Frodo and Sam subplot. it was a huge relief when I opened my atlas of Middle-earth and found its author Karen Wynn Fonstad had the same doubts when she'd been researching for the book that I did (and also that she arrived at the same conclusion).
apart from the March 11th-14th fragments, the most challenging day to edit was March 15th because Everything Happened So Much, and many things - simultaneously. it was a choice between chopping certain fragments into really small bits or sacrificing the impact of certain scenes
the only thing I'm sad about losing in this format is the ending, because Frodo getting ill and leaving Middle-Earth in fall, the same season as when he first set out, brackets the plot of LOTR such a beautiful and heartbreaking way and underlines one last time that "there and back again" is never really just that - you always end up somewhere else than where you started
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What gets me about the Lord of the Rings every single fucking time is that whenever someone hears the description of Tom Bombadil for the first time they're like "oh yeah I know him"
He feels like Jirt ripped him wholesale from a very common folktale or set of folktales. And you feel like you have absolutely heard his stories before but you can't quite remember where but that description of his bright blue coat and yellow boots and his wife the rivers daughter is so familiar
But if you go looking for it you discover that our boy Jirt completely invented him
That fucks me up
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Just reblogged that Aragorn and Arwen kissing gifset and then burst out laughing remembering that audio interview with Tolkien I listened to a while back where the interviewer is like So I can't help but notice there's no sex in Lord of the Rings, what's that about? And Tolkien is like I mean yeah I didn't write any sex scenes but that doesn't mean it isn't there. If you don't think there's any sex in my books that sounds like a YOU problem. Lmaoooooo, I would die for Jirt, fucking icon.
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Any eol thoughts? :0
OF COURSE I HAVE THOUGHTS.
First of all, I know many people don't like him for understandable reasons. So if you are a Eöl hater (so valid) this is not the post for you.
HOWEVER I feel we are sleeping on the fact he absolutely slayed. Morgoth? No, Eöl is more goth. He wears his jet-black armour and his jet-black armour ONLY when he leaves Nan Elmoth and his face was 'noble but grim'. GOTH KING.
Personally I like that he is one of the most dubiously moral elves we have. We need more fucked up elves that are fucked up for reasons entirely unrelated to the plot - no oaths, no dooms, he's just like that.
Alright: serious and extremely lengthy thoughts under the cut because this got away from me, whoops.
Eöl is 'kin' to Thingol - I don't know if he would call himself Sindar (though the Sindar don't call themselves Sindar either, so...) but I think he's distinct from the Avari or the Nandor in that he was living among the Doriathrim until he's granted Nan Elmoth
Personally I think 'kin' here is referring to the fact that both Eöl (or perhaps his parents?) and Thingol were part of the host of the Teleri together, and quite possibly high status/close to Thingol, rather than them being literally related
Close enough that Thingol grants him Nan Elmoth for the price of one (very chatty) sword.
He invented a whole ass metal that's so freaking cool.
He was friends with Dwarves - IMO this is a point in favour of an Eöl who is capable of making friends and allies
I think he still had friends in Doriath too - I think it was Girdle and the city he was most uneasy with, I think he desired to live more like they had during the Great Journey. I don't think he visits them, though he might write.
Sometimes they visit him - but infrequently, with long gaps of time between visits, because what is time to elves - and then war comes, and leaving the Girdle becomes more and more dangerous.
I think he is generally, a stern and serious kind of man - strong-willed and proud
But he's also clever and creative and he loves the stars and the woods and wilds and forging; I don't think his life was absent of joy.
I also think he has a strong distrust of the Ainur. It's almost ironic - he thinks they are full of sorcery and trickery and malice, they are kin of the Shadow that hunted them on the Journey, one of them ensnared Thingol, who's to say what happened to their kin across the Sea, if they ever reached land?
It's unfortunate that he chose to live in Nan Elmoth. That forest is deeply entwined with Melian's power, with Song, with Shadow, with magic - it's a beautiful but dark place that only starlight reaches.
The paranoia and fear and distrust inside him festers. Perhaps he has good reason to dislike the Ainur. Perhaps he has good reason to feel paranoid. Maybe he just didn't vibe with Menegroth.
But Nan Elmoth - it takes what's inside of you and amplifies it.
For Melian and Thingol - that was love.
For Eöl? It's fear. It's hate.
Part of the appeal of Eöl for me is this. Nan Elmoth is such a gothic location (as in the literature).
The whole Aredhel/Eöl and Maeglin situation is SO extremely gothic I LOVE gothic lit and I love Sindar so JIRT actually wrote it for me personally.
As for the Noldor - well, I think his dislike of them is pretty valid. I think fanon tends to exaggerate the Noldor-Sindar divide but in Eöl's case he's stated to blame the Noldor for the coming of Morgoth. Of course it isn't actually their fault, but I think this is a pretty understandable emotional conclusion for Eöl to make.
He clearly still considers (as does Thingol) the Teleri his kin and he takes Alqualondë personally.
Now - Aredhel
I consider the Silmarillion version canon:
It is not said that Aredhel was wholly unwilling, nor that
her life in Nan Elmoth was hateful to her for many years. For
though at Eöl's command she must shun the sunlight, they wandered far together under the stars or by the light of the
sickle moon; or she might fare alone as she would, save
that Eöl forbade her to seek the sons of Fëanor, or any
others of the Noldor
I think they loved each other. I think there was a period of time, in the beginning, when they were happy. They shared a love of the wilds, of wandering and a desire for freedom from authority of kings
Things start to go wrong as Eöl's fear of looming disaster deepens. He becomes more and more restrictive, quicker to anger, more paranoid and fearful
I think this coincides with Maeglin's birth
It's not foresight. It's not Nan Elmoth's Bad Vibes (though they don't help); it's the end of a path of paranoia and fear he's been on for a long time, fear he doesn't know how to deal with so he deals in the only way he knows
He fears for Aredhel as much as he fears her; if wives become of their husband's kin, would the Noldor come and slay her as readily as they might slay him?
Of course not, but he is not mentally able to recognising that
He fears her because - she is a Noldor, she may be a kinslayer herself, what if she turns on him, one day? Best keep her safe in Nan Elmoth, with Maeglin. She can't hurt him in his own house, surely, he thinks.
When they leave, he follows. By the time he catches up to them, he's wound with anger and fear and anxiety - he hasn't been anywhere other than Nan Elmoth and the Blue Mountains in a long, long time. He's in a city of Noldor, who he hates and who have good reason to dislike him
Side note but when he says: 'this land is the land of the Teleri' he's right. The Noldor don't have any more claim to it than anyone else, and until the Noldor & Morgoth came, the Teleri (or the Sindar & Nandor & Avari - but again, they just called themselves Elves) were living across Beleriand. Thingol 'allows' the Noldor to have realms of their own (because well, even if he didn't want to, the Doriathrim are out numbered and Intra-Sindar relationships are complex), they don't have magical claims to lands 99% of them have never seen.
I also don't think it's quite fair of Turgon to say Nan Elmoth would be destroyed/overrun without the Noldor. It's not as if Eol chose to have them as neighbours. He would be in Nan Elmoth whether the Noldor were there or not. They're there to defend their own lands, not Nan Elmoth, which just happens to be there.
It shares borders with Doriath too. Sindarin swords (and Melian's power) keep it safe too.
Continuing with Aredhel & Maeglin now:
I don't think he went to Gondolin with any intent to kill her, or Maeglin.
He wanted his son back (he seems willing, though reluctant, to let Aredhel remain)
It sucks that he seems to consider his wife and child some kind of property, but Turgon has to be reminded that Aredhel is his sister and not his servant so it's a zero point game here. I think this is more a reflection of patriarchy within Elven society (Watsonian) / Tolkien's own biases (Doylist) than anything particular to Eöl.
He is offered a choice: Live in Gondolin, the golden city of sunlight (that he hates) full of Noldor (whom he hates) and Sindar (who probably have little care for him either) or Die in Gondolin and the same choice is given to Maeglin.
I can't help but wonder here - if Turgon had permitted him to leave, would things have gone differently?
It's Maeglin he tries to kill, and Aredhel who steps in to save her son
This makes me insane.... accidentally killing your wife in your attempt to murder your son, after your brother in law has offered you a choice of a gilded cage vs death.
I am not sure why he doesn't say the javelin was poisoned. Was he asked? Did he believe Aredhel had died straight away, so it was a moot point? Was it out of anger? Or did he think they knew? Perhaps he customarily carried poisoned javelins, and thought Aredhel or Maeglin would mention it.
I do think he feels guilt - terrible, awful, all consuming guilt, but rage too, because who was Aredhel to deny him his right over his son? Other sons and other husbands she could have once he and Maeglin were dead. Who was Turgon to command him live in Gondolin or die? Turgon was not his king nor kin.
The Eöl who is thrown off the walls of Gondolin is a shell of the elf who granted Nan Elmoth. He is twisted and tormented by his own mind and his own actions; hate and fear darken his heart, not any curse or doom, nor any innate quality of him.
It's not a curse he yells at Maeglin. It's not a prophecy - it's what Eöl sees as the inevitable result of tangling with the Noldor. Clearly his fear and hate was justified - these Noldor are going to be his doom after all, and so will they be his son's.
Imagine being so terrible they invent the death penalty just for you.
Basically all of this is to say: Eöl is an incredible complicated and fascinating character, with insane Gothic Literature vibes that make me want to put him in a jar and study him
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