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warsamongthestars · 10 days

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Honestly you are so right. I never thought about it like that.

Having recently rewatch TBB from their introduction episode in TCW, i kept going "what the hell".

Admittingly, i did NOT like them at first. I enjoyed the other clones, but i just.. couldn't care until after s1 of TBB and even then, only S2 made me fall in love and S3 made me dwell deeper.

But rewatching TCW episodes... i can see why. Its not just that its different writing, that whole episode was INCREDIBLY cheesy, they were cheesy. And whats funny is i don't think they're too bad after their introduction episode.. but its like. They all fit into their sterotypes first episode, but TBB actually gave them personalities i feel, so when rewatching their introduction... it feels.. Not super iconic, sorry if that is an unpopular opinion.

Like their poses and first fight is really cool, but the whole conversation they have not only implies what you said, but also comes off as "edgelord 10 y/o boy who has watched way too many adventure movies". Which i get they were trying to be show offs as well as show the audience they are extreme.

But it just.. comes across as goofy to me.

and to be clear, i know star wars in general can be seen as cheesy, I'm not knocking down cheesy-ness, and i love most TCW episodes new and old, but i think thats why it bothers me ? I don't remember feeling "oh thats cheesy" in a negative light in any other episode, even with other series.

Sorry that this got long !!!!!

Damn, first ask. XD

Thank you for that! But uh...

... The irony here is that I have to disagree. I liked them in TCWs over TBB, and I wanted to see more of what the TCWshow's BBs had to offer.

I went the old fashioned way of watching TCWs (For the clones, I don't care that much about Jedi stories), and by the time I reached S7, they were announcing TBBshow. I had the build up from that, to reach the momentum and when I made it to the Bad Batch Arc, it was like falling in love with clones all over again.

Cliche in function, yes, by all viewing they fullfill their cliches.

But let me point out something that occurs in character writing--How the character acts to their friends, will be different with how the character acts to their coworkers, and how they act to their own families, to how they act to strangers. This is part of how you create a 3-Dimensional Character.

So my interpretation is different. Here's how my thought process went.

What we saw in TCWs, was merely how the BBs act when acting under officers (Coworkers) they didn't know (Strangers).

( Wrecker starts enthusiastic but "dumb" muscle, but as the Arc went on, he actually mellowed out. Showing that while he's excitable, he's not actually as excitable as what he introduced himself as. He's clever not "dumb muscle", he's multi-capable (he's the second pilot of the Marauder), he's in more control of himself than anyone on the team (hence that when he lifts Jesse up, Jesse is fine afterwards, when by that point we've seen that he lifts ships--he could've easily hurt Jesse but he didn't))

Given they don't look or act like clones, and looking and acting like clones is expected in their position or risk removal, they were effectively playing themselves up as their "cliches" in order to sell their skills and avoid unnecessary or even dangerous questions.

( Hunter is constantly snarky and never directly answers anything about "who you report to" or "how many missions you were on". But at the start, he was promoting the hell out of his unit's capabilities. )

The Bad Batch were a series of characters that bounced off each other beautifully. Its something everyone noticed about them.

(From Crosshair using Tech's shoulder as a mount, to Wrecker tossing Hunter up, to Hunter and Crosshair's subtle backing each other up, to Wrecker quoting Tech. )

Their group dynamics are part of their greatest strength as a set of characters.

With the introduction of Echo, who unlike in TBB, Echo was enthusiastic and clever and crafty, with a playful sense of humor (not unlike how he started as a character in TCWs).

You've got an excellent addition to a group that already has strong character dynamics.

Echo, having been an Audience Surrogate Character for Clones in TCWs, would've easily been the main POV of whatever BB show came out of TCWs. Because he can ask the questions the audience would ask, and Echo is a familiar character with years of backing that the audience would be familiar with.

So you're right, in my book, about TCWshow. Though how I view how right you are is different because of my subtext.

The Bad Batch Arc of TCWs was a Good, if a bit trippy, Start, and not a finisher for the team. After all, all introductions tend to be rather clumsy (just ask TCWs' pilot film).

Which laid in the implication that we're going to Get that Finisher. And the journey.

But when we hit TBB... Then turned the nuance surface of TCWs Bad Batch, and either cut it out, or dumbed it down, or in two cases, changed it entirely.

( TCWs Hunter was a snarky worrywort who let his brothers do the actions while he stays in the corner, but he's dragged out because he's the "Sergeant". TBB Hunter is a stoic quiet type who wants order and control. TCWs Hunter and TBB Hunter are two entirely different characters. In fact, if I may speculate fan wise, TBB Hunter would be the kind of person that would cause TCWs Hunter to Shutdown... and we have evidence of this from TCWs; where Rex gets into Hunter's face, and Hunter shutsdown entirely until after the scene change. )

( Wrecker got dumbed down. That Explosive Enthusiasm he played up, became his defining feature (They effectively pulled a misfandom on their own original creation). While they did show he does have vulnerabilities and some of that TCWs cleverness... it often got overshadowed. )

( They removed Crosshair and broke the group dynamic, destroying the strongest part of their characters, which was their interactions with each other. )

( Echo went from Enthusiastic, Clever and Humor, to Just Bitchy. They didn't bring back his other facet at all. And mid way through TBB, they removed his character--effectively making anything about him a moot point. It nullified his introduction into the BBs )

( And I'm not going to go into a tyraid here about Omega. )

And suddenly, there wasn't any nuance anymore, because the BBs acted the same everywhere they went. There wasn't any developments, because the BBs didn't discuss anything for the audience to know.

Maybe a dramatic glance in the distance--but that's more Cliche than their character archetypes. Character Archetypes, no matter how obvious, can shift and change as they Develop.

But there's no character developing in TBB that doesn't involve how the show broke what made them strong characters to begin with.

Its like trying to make a house, but the foundation is the ceiling and attic, and the "ceiling" is the 3000 tons of solid fucking concrete.

The story, which was about how the Empire rose from the Republic, was literally elsewhere, so there was nothing that spurred the characters to do anything that involved the plot.

Now as you can prolly guess by this point, I'm very very keen on Character Driven stories, and I pay attention to character. While I treat all things as a "fan-fiction" (Given that fan-fiction shows the effort it takes to create a story or create anything), when it comes to officially published stuffed--so with teams, and a budget, and hired people to do the work--I expect the "fan-fiction" to go up in quality, to follow the format and standard set up and simply either stick to it or surpass it.

I think TBBshow was too clumsy, too fragmented, and far too shiny, for what it had. Having a small part of the metaphorical quilt work, doesn't subtract from the fact that the rest of the quilt is full of holes.

Have small good points, I'm afraid, doesn't make up for the fact that it was overall, a poorly written show that bites its prior series' hand.

It just means that, now, you have to steal the good points to add to whatever BBsquad exists in one's mind.

You take the part of the quilt that works... and make your own Quilt, and damn whoever fucked up the first job.

#ask #star wars #star wars the clone wars #star wars the bad batch #the clone wars #the bad batch #hunter clone wars #hunter bad batch #wrecker clone wars #wrecker bad batch #crosshair clone wars #echo clone wars #echo bad batch #analysis #critical analysis #construction and deconstruction

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nottawriter · 6 months

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20 questions game

Thank you @luthordamnvers for the tag!

1. How many works do you have on AO3?

Individual stories: 10 (some are series and 1 translation)

2. What’s your total AO3 words count?

Individual stories: 337,399

3. What fandoms do you write for?

Supergirl- Primarily, Arrowverse with the main focus on Supercorp, but other ships as well

4. What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

PRIDE and Prejudice (Super gay retelling of the classic), Tell Me It’s Not Too Late (Post-S4 finale), I Believe in a Thing Called Love (Entire Season 6 episodic rewrite), Wouldn’t It Be Nice (50 First Dates Movie AU/Continuation), What Has Been Lost (Human/Original AU Series).

5. Do you respond to comments? Why or why not?

Usually. I appreciate getting the comments, so I try to repay that effort.

6. What’s the fic you wrote with the angstiest ending?

When She’s Gone, the Darkness Comes

7. What’s the fic you wrote with the happiest ending?

PRIDE and Prejudice… though it could be said Lena and Kara both get very happy endings in Speak Now (18+ Explicit Sexual Content)

8. Do you get hate on fics?

Not really “hate”

9. Do you write smut? If so what kind?

See Question 7 lol… I do have smaller sex scenes in other fics, but nothing that compares in scope

10. Do you write crossovers? What’s the craziest one you’ve written?

My Human/Original AU Series is an amalgamation of original story work with various locations, character names, character descriptions, and/ or conversations, pulled, used, and/ or referenced from throughout all of the CW Arrowverse and DC Comics Universe, though primarily Supergirl. It’s not really crazy, but it is intricately woven throughout the storyline.

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Not that I know of.

12. Have you ever had a fic translated?

Yes, my I Believe in a Thing Called Love into Spanish.

13. Have you ever cowritten a fic before?

Not yet, but I’m not opposed.

14. What’s your all-time favorite ship?

Supercorp... There are others (Avatrice, Caitvi, lots of wlw really), but nothing compares to the hold they still have on me.

15. What’s a WIP you want to finish, but doubt you ever will?

I plan on finishing all of my actual WIPs that have writing associated with them. There are a couple of WIP ideas I have that I’m not sure I’ll ever get to… A Christmas fic, one loosely based on the movie D.A.R.Y.L., a couple with other main relationships

16. What are your writing strengths?

No idea… Someone once told me they love the way I sometimes write a singular scene from different POVs, telling the story in pieces to eventually for the whole… Not sure that’s a strength. I guess plotting out the story details then?

17. What are your writing weaknesses?

Lol stealing @luthordamnvers‘s answer: Actually writing.

18. Thoughts on writing dialogue in another language for a fic?

English is the only language I really know, so in the past when I’ve needed to write in a different language (I’ve done Spanish and Icelandic), I used Google translator- which I now know is kind of bad at what it’s supposed to do. I need to ask a native speaker to check on the Spanish I’ve done, but I don’t know any Icelanders. For Kryptonian, I use the Doyle dictionary but I don’t know if I do the grammar/ syntax right or not.

19. First fandom you wrote for?

Supergirl/ Supercorp.

20. Favorite fic you’ve ever written?

Oh, this one’s hard… Um, I like a couple of my fics for very different reasons, but I guess the Human/Original AU Series is the one that’s taken the most effort and I’m most proud of… It also started as my first, so you can see how I’ve grown as a writer as it continues which is fun/interesting/embarrassing for me lol

Tags, but no pressure: @casualsavant @itsalliebitheway @fyonahmacnally @natalievoncatte @villainousunsub @vox-ex

#supercorp #supercorp fanfic #supercorp fic #supercorp endgame #supergirl fanfiction #fanfiction #writers on tumblr #ao3 writer #sapphic fiction #sapphic representation

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and-loth-cat · 10 months

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Star Wars Rebels Asks bc idk if anyone would actually do it so im just gonna give the answers

What is your absolute favorite episode of the show? [The Honorable Ones, obviously!! Or Family Reunion - and Farewell, or Shroud of Darkness...]

Which episode did you not like at first, but grew on you after one or more rewatches? [Hm I honestly don't know, possibly Legends of the Lasat? I don't recall not liking it, but I don't think it was my favorite when I first watched, now I love it for sure!]

How do you feel about the Ahsoka show being live-action Rebels season 5? [I CANT WAIT!! I do know though that if Kallus and Zeb aren't in it, I am going to lose my mind]

Who is your favorite one-off character on the show? [Zare for sure! He's in a few episodes, but I have to give credit to my boy]

If you could change one (non-death-related) plot point in the show, what would you change? [I might have to edit this one later, I genuinely cannot think of anything]

What are your two favorite ships from the show (canon or not)? [KALLUZEB AND KANERA!!!]

Who is one character you feel isn't appreciate enough by the fandom? [Probably my boys Jai and Zare]

If you could've added an episode/story arc to the show, what would it be about? [KALLUS AND ZEB ON LIRA-SAN BEING MARRIED AND GAY AND HAPPY]

Obligatory "who's your favorite member of the crew" question. [Chopper, obviously]

Aside from season 4 episode 10, which episode made you cry the most? [Oh my god, probably the finale]

What is one joke/moment from the show that always makes you laugh? [Chopper's reaction to being used as a bet gets me everytime]

Which design for Sabine's hair and armor is your favorite? [Season 4 with the white and purple hair!]

Chopper vs Palpatine- who's making it out alive? [Chopper. Is this even a question?]

What is your favorite moment of the crew being a family? [Probably any episode where they all do something to help one person (The Mandalore Arc, Hera's Kalikori, Ezra's parents, Lira San]

What is your favorite Kanera moment? [I wish..I could see you...]

Who is your favorite villain/antagonist? [Early seasons- Kallus. Late- THRAWN]

What is your opinion on the World Between Worlds? [I love it. I cry every time]

Where do you think Ezra has been all this time? [Somewhere in hyperspace or stuck on a remote planet,,I guess we'll find out soon!]

What is one of your favorite Kanan moments? [This is my excited face :)))]

What is one of your favorite Hera moments? [I DONT CRASH, I HAVE VERY EXCITING LANDINGS!!]

What is one of your favorite Chopper moments? [I am getting this motherfucking leg if it's the last thing I do...and also him holding Hera's hand in Dume and him with Jacen]

What is one of your favorite Zeb moments? [Any moment he's with Kallus]

What is one of your favorite Sabine moments? [Her darksaber training arc]

What is one of your favorite Ezra moments? [I'm in space..AND IM ABOUT TO DIE!!]

Which of Ezra's two lightsabers would you rather have? [His blue one for sure!!]

Would you rather be stuck in an elevator with AP-5 or Lieutenant Lyste? [AP-5 because I'm sure we could find a topic of conversation]

Which plot point do you wish the show had expanded on? [We didn't get enough of Rebel Kallus >:(]

Favorite recurring character? [KALLUS!!!]

Favorite piece of music from the show? [Kallus is really good!]

Most under-rated episode? [A Princess on Lothal and Stealth Strike!]

#star wars #sw rebels #rebel #rebels #star wars rebels #swr #kallus #kalluzeb #can you tell i love kallus or no #rebels ask #ask game #feel free to send any in ask box and i can elaborate #but i just wanted to do it

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tomicaleto · 10 months

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how about “who the hell did this to you?” for obikin?

Hi Nixie! Thank you for sending this prompt, I'm sorry it took me so long to answer!

hurt meme

So lately it feels like I'm always saying I'm having trouble writing or coming up with ways to fill prompts I'm sent and this is no exception lol.

This needs a bit of context: so I somehow have fallen in a Ben 10 frenzy, I been watching breakdown videos and having a lot of nostalgia. So this is a Ben 10 AU of sorts. The original series had Ben and his cousin Gwen at 10 years old, in one episode we meet Kevin, an 11 years old that becomes a villain that occasionally shows up. Then we get the Alien Force series where Gwen and Ben are uhh 15/16 and we get a sort of redeemed Kevin at 16/17. Gwen and Kevin have a thing, it's great and I shipped them so much.

So basically this AU is set in a kind of Alien Force setting. Ahsoka, only mentioned here, is Ben, in the sense that she has the omnitrix, but is still a Togruta. Obi-Wan and Anakin fill Gwen and Kevin's role. Anakin is kinda a redeemed villain (like Kevin) but has Gwen's power set (he's an energy being called anodite) while Obi-Wan is like Gwen (in the sense that he's not a former villain and his Jedi backstory which I haven't thought about yet ties him with Ahsoka) but he has Kevin's powers (he can absorb energy and matter)

That's a very lengthy introduction but otherwise this may not make much sense.

Oh! Also, Anakin and Obi-Wan are kinda established but it's complicated

“Who the hell did this to you?”

Obi-Wan checked his watch, only five minutes left of the class. His students were finishing taking notes so he cleared his throat to grab their attention. “If there are any questions left, this is the time to ask them.”

As he finished speaking, three different hands got up in the air and he pointed at the nearest one. “Yes, professor, we’ve mentioned that Plato’s allegory of the sun was later…”

By the time he finally reached the doors of the university, he was dreading his walk back home, the often peaceful time tainted by his tired body. He would have to talk with Ahsoka about patrolling so late in the night, he was not a young man anymore. But he was pleasantly surprised when he looked up and found Anakin’s car waiting for him at the entrance, as students stared at the yellow details Anakin had painted on it.

His steps now eager, he approached the car and leaned down, forearm on the driver’s door, and smirked. Anakin’s tinted window began going down and he was ready to open the conversation with a teasing remark when he saw Anakin’s torn clothes and black eye. The words dried in his mouth and his whole expression shifted into a serious one.

“Before you say anything,” Anakin said, most likely having figured out Obi-Wan’s burning concern, “get into the car, I’ll tell you on the way and I don’t want to make a scene.”

Of course he didn’t, Anakin, despite being quite unsubtle when expressing his emotions more often than not, was still extremely private. He didn’t like Obi-Wan’s students whispering as they stared, nevermind that Obi-Wan knew that half of the time they were gossiping about the ‘handsome man that kept visiting professor Kenobi’ or that Anakin was around the same age as them.

So he simply nodded and circled around the car, getting into his designated passenger seat and buckling his seatbelt. Anakin started the car then, and pulled away from the university building with ease.

They stayed quiet around three seconds before Obi-Wan turned towards Anakin and hissed: “Who the hell did this to you?”

“Let’s just say I found doctor Vindi.”

“Did he attack you? Why didn’t you call me or Ahsoka?” He asked, torn between worry and anger. Anakin could be proud at times, but Obi-Wan had thought their little team had grown on him.

“Ahsoka is at class, she wouldn’t have picked up and I didn’t want to interrupt your students either, I know they have an exam soon.” It was touching that Anakin paid Obi-Wan enough attention to remember when he was planning to quiz his students. But still. “And before you say that this was worth interrupting your class, let me say that I wasn’t exactly looking up the dude, alright, I kinda came across him accidentally and I wasn’t prepared.”

Obi-Wan’s frown –when had he begun frowning?– eased a bit and it made Anakin's shoulders relax. “Even then, it’s quite strange for you to get surprised like that, were you low on energy? Did your spells fail or something? Should we be worried about your mana or your anodite form?”

Anakin snorted and immediately stopped, one of his hands leaving the wheel to grab at his ribs. “My powers are fine.” He stubbornly said. “It’s just… there were plenty of civilians, alright? I had to multitask.”

It made sense. But Obi-Wan still worried. “Let’s go to my place so I can put some ice on that eye and check that your ribs aren’t broken. You’ll call Ahsoka and we’ll plan there.”

Anakin sent him a side-eyed look. “As you wish.” He answered softly.

#obikin #Anakin Skywalker #Obi-Wan Kenobi #Star Wars #SW #The Clone Wars #TCW #ROTS #Revenge of the Sith #Prequel trilogy #Star Wars AU #Ben 10 AU #Tomi's fics #asks #nixie-deangel #Ask Game #Hurt meme ask game

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luthien-under-bough · 6 months

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20 questions for fic writers

@anamazingangie tagged me - and what better way to procrastinate on actually writing any of my fics??

1. How many works do you have on AO3? 92

2. What’s your total AO3 word count? 378,489

3. What fandoms do you write for? House of the Dragon (Daemyra) almost exclusively now; previously mainly Dragon Age: Inquisition and Horizon Zero Dawn, with several different single fic fandoms like Assassin's Creed: Valhalla, Mass Effect, Star Wars, Skyrim, and probably others I'm forgetting.

4. What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

I found some hate for you, just for show

better not touch (i want it too much)

i got a bad desire (baby i'm on fire)

do you feel the hunger?

ain't nobody hurt you like i hurt you

5. Do you respond to comments? Why or why not?

I try to! Sometimes I respond right away - other times it takes me a while to get to it. Tbh sometimes it's harder to think of a comment reply than it is to write the fic - especially those amazing long, thoughtful comments. I always worry nothing I can possibly respond will properly express how happy I am to receive them. But I truly appreciate everyone who takes the time to comment - nothing makes my day more than seeing that Ao3 comment email.

6. What is the fic you wrote with the angstiest ending?

It's got to be i've looked at clouds from both sides now - the ending is just purely hopeless angst. Even my necro fic where Daemon & Rhaenyra both die somehow has a less angsty ending.

7. What’s the fic you wrote with the happiest ending?

It might surprise people to learn that a lot of my fics actually do end happily, despite my deep, abiding love of angst. peak ends very fluffy and happily; and after some angst in the middle, better not touch (i want it too much) has a very happy ending.

8. Do you get hate on fics?

Not outright hate - sometimes I get comments I don't necessarily appreciate, but I've been pretty lucky so far I guess? Maybe I'm not writing fucked up enough stuff, idk.

9. Do you write smut? If so, what kind?

Yes. Whatever I'm in the mood for - which in the past couple of months has been cannibalism and necrophilia. So. But usually it's some flavor of Daemon being dominant and dirty-talking a lot, featuring my not-so-subtle hand/finger/ring kink and choking kink. I also really enjoy writing Sad Men Jerking Off.

10. Do you write crossovers? What’s the craziest one you’ve written?

Crossovers aren't usually my thing, although I did recently write a ridiculous HotD/Naked Attraction crossover: Naked Attraction: The Lost Episode.

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Only once that I know of, but it was quickly taken down. It was literally a copy/paste of do you really feel alive without me mixed with the work of another Daemyra author.

12. Have you ever had a fic translated?

Yes, with my permission.

13. Have you ever co-written a fic before?

No, although I definitely take a lot of inspiration from conversations I have with other writers in the fandom. I like to think we all mutually enable each other's ideas, with excellent results. And the #ghost 2 au that you might see pop up from my asks has definitely been a collaborative idea with a number of anons! Otherwise, my writing process is too chaotic to make co-writing really viable. I would end up being too stressed over annoying my co-writer with my disorganization.

14. What’s your all-time favorite ship?

Daemyra quickly took root in my brain and became my forever OTP. <3

15. What’s a WIP you want to finish but doubt you ever will?

I have confidence I'll finish all my HotD WIPs. I have an outstanding fic I wrote for The Magicians for a prompt event that is supposed to have a second chapter, but I don't know that I'll ever get around to it since all my fandom energy is spent on Daemyra these days.

16. What are your writing strengths?

I feel like I come up with some interesting premises and can push myself creatively pretty regularly. I feel like I'm good at adjusting my prose and narrative voice to suit the setting? Idk, I like my own dialogue and am not ashamed to admit I make myself laugh when writing a lot of it.

17. What are your writing weaknesses?

Uhhh plotting lmao. I mostly write based on vibes. Also planning, outlining, posting with any sort of regular schedule, etc. Like I said earlier about my writing process - it's pure chaos.

18. Thoughts on writing dialogue in another language in fic?

I use High Valyrian phrases mixed into dialogue a lot, but otherwise I'm way too lazy to write in a language other than English because I'm nowhere close to fluent in any other language, and I don't want to embarrass myself with shitty online translations.

19. First fandom you wrote for?

Harry Potter. Dramione was my original OTP. <3

20. Favorite fic you’ve written?

My favorites change constantly depending on what mood I'm in. Here's my current fave from each of my fandoms:

ain't nobody hurt you like i hurt you (House of the Dragon)

Something Wretched About This (Dragon Age)

Closer Than My Hands Have Been (Horizon Zero Dawn)

You Don't Have to Go It Alone or: How to Handle Personnel Issues Aboard the Normandy (Mass Effect - okay this is also my only Mass Effect fic but I really like it so I'm including it)

I’m tagging: @grandlovescheme, @delinquentpurplefox, @rainbowslinkyy, @bluegoldrose

(if they haven’t already done it)

#tag game #my fics

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mishasminions · 3 years

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The Last Time I’ll Write a Long Post About Supernatural (15x18-15x20)

15 YEARS OF WATCHING THIS SHOW. 11 YEARS OF RUNNING A BLOG ABOUT IT. IT’S BEEN QUITE A RIDE.

[15x20 Speculation + evidence at the bottom]

First off, I just wanna come clean and say, after all these years, I still think they should’ve ended at Season 5.

If you’re going to come at me with “Then why’d you stick around to watch it if you didn’t like it?”, your question is immature, and the answer is simple: I just want to know what happens next (I also love the main characters and their actors too). You can watch a show and still think it’s shit.

Call me a clown, but despite all the disappointment and trust issues that this show has given me, I would still look forward to the day where it might just turn itself around and bring back the quality it once had, or realize the potential of each story it was trying to tell, or at the very least, do justice by my favorite ship.

Never happened.

They’ve had a few good episodes here and there. I can’t imagine the SPN Universe without The Man Who Would Be King, The French Mistake, and Scoobynatural. Seasons 6-10 were enjoyable at times. I blocked out most of 7 & 11-15.

If you’ve been following this blog since its heydays in 2010-2014, you’d know I’d try my best to defend Destiel and this show’s decisions regarding it no matter what.

Because you know what, as a CONCEPT, this show is good. If you take a look at all the worlds its storylines have birthed in fanfiction/fanworks, you’d see how much Supernatural has wasted its own story arcs. The writing got shittier as each season progressed, and they’ve obviously given up in production as well because the quality in the execution has noticeably gone down too, but if you take a step back and take a look at the bigger picture, you’ll see that this show still tries to make sense of itself.

[If you’re still following this post, please bear with me, I know this is long, but I just want you to understand how jaded and pessimistic I am with regards to this show, so maybe you can buy into whatever hopeful thing I’m about to say later on.]

SO LET’S TALK ABOUT DESTIEL

Never in my wildest dreams did I think that they would give us Castiel’s “I love you” speech. To the point where, if I weren’t so desperate for it, I would argue that it was completely out of character for him to word vomit the way he did (but I’m not gonna diss on that right now because I’ll take what I can get).

I’ve valued every meaningful and obscure exchange that Dean and Cas have had in the earlier seasons, and I was willing to accept their relationship as just that--undefined, without any clear boundaries as to what they really are. And I think that was beautiful on its own.

But now, they’ve chosen to define it.

After they’ve driven every possible wedge between Dean and Castiel in seasons 11-15, to try to explain away their feelings as something they offer to a collective.

Dean can’t mourn and pray for JUST Cas, he has to mourn and pray for EVERYBODY--even Crowley, even some chick he just met, because god forbid he cries about just the guy who has given up everything for him--that would be “too homo”.

They’ve even set Cas on a path to abrupt fatherhood just so he can care about something other than Dean. Make it seem as if Dean wasn’t his purpose through and through.

And after all these years of this stupid show trying to deny it, they choose to acknowledge it at the worst possible circumstance, at a time where they’ve been so far apart, that it seems so foreign for them to suddenly come together.

But here we are. And they’ve chosen to tell us.

Chosen to tell us that everything that Castiel has done leading up to his death, he has done it because he was IN LOVE WITH DEAN WINCHESTER.

Chosen to tell us that the ONE THING THAT WOULD MAKE CAS HAPPY IS DEAN WINCHESTER.

Chosen to tell us that BEING WITH DEAN WINCHESTER is something that CAS WANTS BUT KNOWS HE CAN’T HAVE.

And they’ve also chosen to tell us nothing about how Dean feels.

Sure, finding out your angel made a deal, the stipulations of said deal, his newfound happiness philosophy, his long-winded monologue of why he loves you and why you’re worthy of his love, and to top it all off he tells you that being in love with you is enough to make him happy while he subtly hints that he’s always wanted to be WITH you romantically, was a lot to process in the 5 minutes after you’ve just had an existential crisis.

It’s whatever, right? Let’s culminate 11 years worth of tension and feelings in 5 minutes. Let’s waste the entire episode with cringey expository dialogue, and irrelevant sequences. The whole season was a waste anyway.

You know what Supernatural? FUCK YOU FOR THAT. They deserved better. WE deserve better.

And I would love nothing more than to hurl every possible insult your way,

But for the last time, I’m going to HOPE that you’re finally going to try to make it better for the fans that stuck by you all these years.

No more baiting new viewers, no more placating casual viewers, no more excuses. 15 years. Bring it home for the people who have actually been around.

SO HERE’S HOW I THINK 15x20 IS GONNA GO

There’s two ways this series is gonna end. Horribly or Spectacularly.

First let’s all take into consideration what Andrew Dabb says about it:

So, let’s start with

ENDING HORRIBLY

In this scenario, Misha is telling the truth about his last day of filming being 15x18. His “camping trip” during the last few days of filming 15x20, was actually a camping trip. He doesn’t go to Vancouver to shoot.

Jensen wasn’t “being careful” during the zoom interviews that it was just him and Jared quarantining for the shoot, it really was just him and Jared (althought most of these were done pre 15x19) Supernatural isn’t smart enough to do misleading PR, and they’re once again oblivious to the potential of their own story.

Misha hasn’t posted a “Goodbye Castiel” tweet because he’s probably saving it for last episode or he forgot because it was overshadowed by the Destiel trend that night.

So what we get is:

Sam and Dean are on the road again, up against the monster of the week. Only their world no longer has actual Supernatural beings anymore, so the monsters they’re fighting are humans.

Humans end up killing the Winchesters (despite having gone up against literally every powerful being imaginable INCLUDING God himself). Dean and Sam end up in heaven and relive their greatest hits.

Meanwhile, Castiel rots in The Empty because he died after realizing that he was happy and gay. Jack doesn’t bother rescuing him—his surrogate dad, the guy who made this specific deal to spare him—even though it was so easy for him get Cas in and out of The Empty when he had a fraction of the power that he has now.

Dean never speaks of Castiel’s confession because despite all the hints of a profound bond in the earlier seasons, and the fact that Dean has never cared for anyone (who isn’t his actual brother) as immensely as he does Cas, Supernatural just can’t have its main macho character be “suddenly bisexual” because that would hurt the male ego or some shit.

His heaven would probably be living happily ever after with his family. “Family” meaning Mary and John Winchester--two of the shittiest parents ever (but they’re not going to include them in this episode like they were supposed to because of Covid) and Sam.

Sam also gets a dog. As usual.

I wouldn’t put it past Supernatural to do this. After everything they’ve pulled, this would be right up their alley. I actually expect this ending.

Anyway, onto the next possible ending

ENDING SPECTACULARLY

In this scenario, Supernatural tries to stick the landing, and Jensen’s whole “It didn’t sit well with me at first, but then I took a step back after talking to Kripke, and realized that I had to view it from an audience perspective, I am now really excited about it” (DC Con 2019) anecdote about his thoughts on the final episodes, were actually about Dean potentially ending up with Cas. (Which would totally make sense because Jensen at first didn’t see Dean as anything but hetero, but as of late, he has been throwing in Destiel jokes of his own, so he seems to have warmed up to the idea)

Backed with Misha’s tidbit (DLConline 2020) that he and Jensen had conversations about Destiel, and that they wouldn’t have gone through with it if Jensen wasn’t onboard with it, but Jensen didn’t push back at all. (Why would they need to check with Jensen if it was just Cas going all in?)

Robert Berens (writer of 15x18) also wrote the script at the beginning of Season 15, but made Misha privy to the concept a year prior (Season 14), so they went into this season knowing about Destiel going canon.

This one’s a reach, but this scenario also supposes that Misha was lying about his whereabouts during the filming of the final episode, and him saying that 15x18 was his last episode is part of the diversion to avoid taking away from the weight of Castiel’s death.

And that Supernatural is actually self-aware of its own material (similar to how they have wrapped things up in the past—lots of expository dialogue, poor execution, but fulfills the story arc)

Since Season 15 is basically a Meta Season (Chuck/God as a writer, pretentiously calling out how he created the worlds, its characters, and basically invalidating the past 14 seasons), and 15x19 is supposedly the finale for Season 15, written by two of the worst Supernatural writers, Brad Buckner and Eugenie Ross-Leming (Bob Singer’s wife), then we can assume that 15x19 is where the shitty writers kill themselves--as Chuck, of course.

So we get a badly written episode that produces a bad ending, or as Becky put it, “All action, and no Cas”

So we get the bad writers season ending at 15x19.

And 15x20 is where Sam and Dean write their own stories, and where the cast had a hand in pitching ideas for it.

Dabb has mentioned that 15x20 (Act Two) is a SERIES finale, where they try to resolve the characters’ journeys.

Because as everyone has acknowledged, Supernatural isn’t about the story, it’s about the characters.

So here’s what we can get out of it:

With no more Supernatural beings left to fight, Sam and Dean are in a stalemate. They’ve resigned themselves to fighting to the bitter end, but the “end” has passed, and they’re still standing.

So they try to figure out who they are now, and what they want out of the life they still have.

Sam still wants a normal apple pie life. Before Dean dragged him out of college to go hunting with him, he had a whole life planned out for him. Become a lawyer, settle down with a nice girl, and get a dog. He gave all that up because they had work to do, but now the work is finished, he can finally go back to wanting that for himself again.

Dean finally realizes his self-worth after Cas saves him again. His prayer to Cas in purgatory may have helped him come to terms with his anger, but the whole “you’ve done everything you did for love” speech finally put him in his place, and he learns not to hate himself anymore.

But of course, he cannot fully reconcile with himself if he doesn’t get Cas back, and tell him how he feels.

Because Dean actually wants something for himself this time. Something he knows he can finally have if he can just salvage it.

So maybe this time around, with the help of Jack (off-screen), Dean saves Cas. Grips him tight and raises him from perdition.

They bypass The Empty deal by turning Cas human, and he lives the rest of his days with Dean.

Dean and Cas know they deserve to be saved, and they know that they deserve to be happy.

(Wishful thinking, maybe they kiss a little)

Anyway...

I’m just saying, there’s NO WAY that they’d have Cas go through that whole rushed speech, if they weren’t going to do anything about it later on.

But again, after 10 years of disappointment, I wouldn’t put it past Supernatural to pat themselves on the back and say, “Okay, we sort of gave them what they wanted. We’re good now”

If that’s the case, Supernatural, I’m sorry I wasted my time on you.

Here’s to hoping 🤡

#THE LAST TIME I'LL CLOWN FOR THIS SHOW #SUPERNATURAL #DESTIEL #15x20 #15x19 #15x18 #UNTAGGED #INSIGHTFUL INSIGHTS

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h50europe · 3 years

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Why the ending of the series finale felt off for many of us (and what PL could have had really in mind) - Aphorisms

As you can easily see from the photos, season 11 was a safe bet, as was a new team member, McCole. What could have been, it says, written by Justin, the wife of Alex stunt/stand-in double. I'm going to play the advocatus diaboli.

In the penultimate episode of H50, Lenkov created a new character. He was sort of based on Steve, but also not. As it turned out in the last episode, Cole and Steve also had a mutual friend: Catherine. Why does that not really surprise us? The rumor mill was really churning, and it was a given that PL was definitely going to bring her on board. So, without further ado, he made her a key person. She was the one who cracked the ominous code that Doris had left for her son. Question, couldn't Jerry have done that just as well?

Anyway, PL set up Cole and Steve. But the chemistry - for us - wasn't really there. They could have just as easily put anyone next to Steve. PL built on the military past of the two (what else) and finally the common denominator: Catherine. Oh, how original. NOT. If you look at this constellation, you can already guess where this was going. But there remained this one obstacle: Danny.

Well, no problem, Lenkov thought and had him kidnapped without further ado. All planned because of all the great McDanno moments we got to see in season 10. So appropriately for lulling, even if these moments did not have nearly as much heart as in previous seasons, but hey, the fans would swallow and relish it, PL thought.

Then came the obligatory threatening call from Daiyu Mei (note the clever pun ala Yoda: die you may...), and the drama unfolded. The whole thing was further clarified by the words of Wo Fat's ex: "I have the person you care about most in the world." Bummer, as she is not talking about Catherine but Danny. Queerbaiting at its worst. Then comes the usual. And during the escape attempt, Danny, who is already half-dead, gets shot. So far, so good, or not.

Danny's injuries could have easily been fatal. So now I'm going off the premise and just claiming that this was PL's original plan. Why? PL did mention at one point that he could imagine H50 without Steve or Danny, but he certainly wasn't stupid enough to believe that. It was nothing more than a smoke grenade. But what PL had wanted for a long time was the end of McDanno. He preferred another ship. But while McDanno sailed blithely across the seven seas, PL's fav ship never left the harbor. But now, he had the ultimate opportunity with a new, equal partner at Steve's side (Book'em Cole), who also pulled Catherine out of a hat.

PL's heart did somersaults. What a great plan that was. Alex didn't say anything about really wanting to quit, even after the series ended. While he had been open about his departure after season 7, there was no need to hide this fact now in season 10. And as you can easily see, all signs were pointing toward season 11. What PL didn't count on was the massive resistance from CBS.

In contrast to PL, they had no problems with Scott/Danny or McDanno. They knew that this was the heart and soul of the show. And PL's protector Moonves was no longer available because he had been kicked out of the network. So PL's back was against the wall. And nothing and nobody could change that. Too bad, because actually, PL had everything perfectly planned.

Danny would either die on the way to the hospital or later in the hospital. This would lead Steve to a massive revenge attack, which should have ended in a brilliant showdown (brilliant for PL, not necessarily for the fans), but Daiyu Mei escapes eventually. Then, Steve would have been driving around aimlessly. We were possibly shown some flashbacks, only to end up at Casa McGarrett, where Catherine would have already been waiting for him. Nice reversal of the goodbye scene from season 6.

The conversation between Steve and her would have been similar to Danny's, except that it wouldn't have been about his parents, but about Danny and that he just can't take it in Hawaii any longer. Too much reminds him of his dead friend. Steve also wanted to pay his final respect and bring him back home to Jersey. Of course, Catherine suggests joining him. What else? Now that one ship sunk, PL could easily replace it with HIS fav ship. And because Cole has done so well, Steve also entrusts him with the task force's leadership. Before Steve leaves to accompany Danny on his last journey, he hands Cole his credentials.

Steve and Cath stand next to each other at the airport and watch as Danny's coffin is loaded onto the plane. Then they board the plane together, ending with them holding hands as we know it. Fade out, season 10 ends.

How would it have continued in season 10? Danny's funeral would have happened off-screen, like so many other pivotal scenes. Steve would have maybe spent an episode or two mulling it over and then returned to Hawaii to hunt down Daiyu Mei with Cole and the team, which now included Catherine.

So much for Lenkov's wet dream, um, plan. However, because CBS knew that McDanno was the heart and soul of the series, they found this idea more than lousy and turned PL down. We could imagine that Alex also threw in that he would certainly not continue without Scott. There was a short back and forth, and it was decided to cancel the show. So we've come full circle to the sloppy, heartless execution of the last episode and the absolutely meaningless words PL put in Steve's mouth as a result. Due to lack of creativity and apparent lack of time, the deadline seemed to be predetermined, considering how quickly the soundstages at Diamond Studios were obliterated.

The crew was equally surprised when PL succinctly informed them that there would be no season 11. See the post from an angry crew member on IG.

Can we prove any of this? Nope, but it's the only reasonable explanation for why the show ended the way it did. Namely, completely illogical, with a Steve who was more than just off the rails. At the very beginning of the series, Steve gives completely different reasons for staying. If you do a rewatch, you'll see.

Everybody knows that you don't solve problems by running away. You don't get rid of the weight that you carry around with you. Steve may be a stubborn mule, but one thing he has never been: self-centered. And if Danny was really the most important thing in the world to him, as Mei said, then he wouldn't have dumped him in the end. Because that's what you do when you really love someone, you stay and fight against all odds. Especially when someone is in a bad place, like Danny, who has just jumped from the brink of death.

You don't suddenly go on a self-realization trip and kick the person who's already lying on the ground. But that's exactly what Steve did. At least the way PL wrote the part. The man must have really lost it when he wrote those lines. I'm sure he was enjoying pure schadenfreude.

And if you take a close look at the two protagonists, you can clearly see the reluctance with which they shared it all with the audience. There was no more room for any affectionate ad-lib actions that we knew from before. They could only stubbornly reel off what was in the script. PL would have done well to sit down with Scott and Alex and find a common solution instead of imposing his version on them and the audience. That's what people with integrity do, but the man never any.

In our opinion, the show's ending ranks among the dumbest and most unimaginative of all time. Rarely a person manages to drive a show against the wall in such a way and at the same time assassinated the main characters. PL shouldn't be proud of it. He should rather stand in a corner and be ashamed of himself.

And now you can go ahead and bash us, or just ignore the whole thing and keep on scrolling. Thank you for your time and for letting us share our thoughts with you.

#McDanno #steve mcgarrett #danny williams #scott caan #alex o'loughlin #H50 the final chapter #H50 series finale #Lenkov #lance gross #cole #catherine

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alignallofthelights · 3 years

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Social Media Trending Analysis: Walker vs. DeanCasWedding

Social Media Metrics for Duke 1x05

Now that it’s the next day after the premiere of Duke, the fifth episode of the first season of Walker, I wanted to share the insights I found. Last night #Walker trended to #3 at United States Twitter Trending Top 30. During the course of the evening the show accumulated an excess of 12.3K, some additional hash-tags that trended during the course of the live tweeting included: #SendLoveToTexas and #Micki.

It’s come to my attention that during the live tweeting a Destiel fan posted some information concerning the social media analysis which directly compared the #DeanCasWedding to #Walker. I will share the tweet for ease of reference.

As you can see there are a number of issues with this data/cross analysis. I’ll begin to go through them point by point and then do a cross comparison of the two campaigns side by side.

First and foremost you will see from the tweet in question that the poster did a 7-Day analysis between #Walker and #DeanCasWedding. This means that during the time #Walker was trending they completed a report that ran from 2/12-2/18. For those who are unaware #DeanCasWedding trended on 2/14, and Walker airs regularly on Thursdays. The past two Thursdays were 2/11 and 2/18. The poster is comparing a 7 Day analysis of a hash-tag to one that surges on Thursday during a live-tweet. The author is comparing apples to oranges.

Secondly, Nielsen and Networks, don’t care about 7 Day reports and trends unless they are news programs or soap operas who have content being shared with public audiences every day or every week. There is no reason for them to monitor chatter in this way. Additionally Nielsen does not care about anything outside of the 7 hour airing window of the show in question. For example if you want your tweets to count towards the network/show and Nielsen’s top tweeted shows and your show of preference airs at 8 PM, only tweets from 5 PM - 12 AM will count towards the shows social media presence. Networks and content providers don’t care about anything outside of those hours. Which again shows how meaningless a 7-Day report is for social media concerning television series, and why I won’t track hash-tags outside of the day/time it trends.

Now that those quick details have been addressed, I’m going to do a side-by-side analysis of the two hash-tags when they trended on the dates in question #DeanCasWedding on 2/14 and #Walker during the live tweet of 2/18. For those who are interested in seeing my original report on the DeanCasWedding trend data it’s here for reference.

#DeanCasWedding

As shared before this is the most important data from the #DeanCasWedding. It trended on Twitter’s United States Trending Top 30 at #4 on 2/14, and generated a collective 46.3K tweets before it stopped trending at around 10-11PM EST. As mentioned before this campaign had a very high retweet threshold 67%, and a very high portion of the contributors had accounts that have been active for less than 1 year (26%), this is a high indication of sock puppet accounts/fake accounts. The average Destiel fan account tweeted 5-8 times on average to make the hash tag trend over the course of the 10-11 hours, with some of the top contributors tweeting an excess of 400 times. All this is provided in the report shared earlier.

What does that mean? I want to zero in on the contributors column and the reach, because this is the heart of it all. Although they had 5.3k people contribute to their campaign the conversation was very insular, that means that the people tweeting likely had the same audience, same followership, and in general the same handles talking back and forth in a very small pool of people trading comments between one another. I will do a comparison to #Walker’s premiere later on because it’s the only other campaign I have record of that had a similar tweet threshold and trended for around the same time (During it’s premiere #Walker and #Jared Padalecki trended for 15 hours, peaked at #4 on Twitter’s Top 30, and generated 59.6K tweets).

The bottom line here is that even though #DeanCasWedding was able to trend the substance is not meaningful due to the factors of reach, retweeting non-original content and sock accounts polluting the tag with what networks really value which is eye-balls reaching the tag and new people either learning or engaging with show/content.

#Walker (1x05, “Duke”)

Looking at the data side by side, you will begin to notice a few differences. Some are intuitive. #DeanCasWedding had more tweets 43.6k to Walker’s Duke 12.3k, and as such they had more tweets and contributors. This makes sense, the hash tag trended longer, and Duke is in episode 5. However look at the reach between each of these campaigns.

Duke’s Walker was able to reach 6.5 Million people, compared to DeanCasWedding’s 3 Million. Again this 12.3K+ tweet hash tag that trended for a handful of hours when the episode aired, was able to out reach a hashtag that trended for 10-11 hours on a Sunday with less competition, and on a day where people have more disposable time. This was also in light of Texas going through a major power outage, and understandable concern in addition to more topics taking light away from Walker (understandably and rightly so I may add).

What this shows is that the individuals who are contributing to the Walker hash tag are diversified, meaning they have different account followings, different accounts who are live tweeting, and that the reach of these individuals is beyond that of Supernatural, and that they are engaging with more people overall. Even though Walker had ~30K less tweets than #DeanCasWedding the economical value of this hash tag is greater because of the reach, and the fact that the contributors are truly diverse from each other (i.e. they are all not retweeting and retargeting towards the same audiences, and double dipping and speaking with the same accounts).

This can be seen in the number of original tweets created during each campaign. Walker’s Duke had 6.2K original tweets for a 12.3K hash tag, while DeanCasWedding had 13.7K original tweets for a 46.3K hash tag.

Here is another interesting factor, the age of the twitter accounts who participated in this hash tag are lower than the DeanCasWedding one, showing the likelihood for less fake accounts. Walker has 18% of these newer accounts, while DeanCasWedding has 26%. Again why does a Destiel have so many users with less than 1 year accounts when the ship has existed for 13 years?

Conclusion

What’s my point with this? Just because something has a high tweet count doesn’t mean it’s actually valuable as a social media campaign. It’s more important to go deeper into the data and understand who is interacting and how they are interacting. The number of tweets is just a small portion of a larger picture.

I’m going to make my last point here because I know the Extreme Destiel fans are children and they will likely only look at the contributors column and boast how they have more people tweet over their campaign (ignoring the fact that it took them weeks for several of the content creators to prepare for the date in question, and that they jumped on the fandom wagon from Samantha and Chad with the Roadhouse AU twitter roleplay), and so I want to dispel the notion here by sharing the Walker Premiere data.

Walker Premiere

As mentioned above the Walker premiere trended for 15 hours on January 21st, peaked at #4 on the Twitter Trending Top 30, and generated 59.6K tweets. As you can see here the total contributors for the premiere far out scale and outweigh any numbers of the Destiel fan made wedding, and ultimately this is the reason why I don’t think any of their smear campaigns, jealousy and angry tweeting matter. The economic value of Walker is more than 7 times greater than the value of Destiel.

When you compare similar scaling trends it’s clear #Walker is way bigger than Destiel is. 9.2K contributors, 5k individuals creating original content during the premiere, a retweet rate of 3-4, and wait for the K.O.

Look at that reach. 102 Million for Walker vs. 3 Million for Destiel. To further add salt to the wound:

Minimal to no bot accounts.

#micdrop

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craziestfangirl98 · 3 years

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My thoughts on Love, Victor season 2 cause I have too many feelings and I need to talk about it.

Disclaimer No. 1. This has massive Love, Victor season 2 spoilers so pleaseeeee leave if you have not watched it. Also if you do not want to engage with it.

Disclaimer No. 2: This is my opinion on the season so if you don't agree please leave. Don't come for me. I don't mind having proper discussions but I don't want unnecessary arguments so thanks.

There are a lot of unpopular opinions so as I said earlier if you don't want to be respectful, please leave.

I absolutely adoooooooored this season. I think it met its potential quite well and I liked how it panned out. I felt it was brilliantly done. I know a lot of people don't agree with me but I actually saw that it was gonna be an acquired liking but yeah.

THIS POST WILL BE GETTING TO THE MORE MAJOR PARTS OF THE SEASON. MEANING VICTOR, RAHIM, BENJI AND VENJI.

Let's start with individual breakdowns.

Right of the bat we see that this season is gonna deal with Victor with the rest of the world. The first season was very internal and dealt with his own stuff in his own head. We very minutely see his interaction with different people and how that internally affects him. This season was more of how the outward world dealt with him. His intersectionality of being a Queer POC that plays sport really adds to the discussions within the queer community and the sense of being outcasted within the community. I liked how he was able to talk to Andrew about the whole being 'the most non gay gay' and also not being 'gay enough'. It was really nice and I loved that interaction. I also liked the fact that they discussed the whole aspect of being stressed about the first time and such.

I liked the full cabin sequence in terms of his anxiety about having sex for the first time. That too with an experienced gay. It all just makes sense and makes me glad that it was addressed.

I loved him as the 'mentor' for Rahim and the fact that they could relate to each other about being POC with religious parents I think was the exact push needed for the discussions to move forward.

I think his conversation about his queer experience as a POC with Rahim was something I have been waiting for since the first season. He definitely should not have revealed Benji's secrets without talking to him and that was a mistake on his part and something that will affect Venji in a long while. But the fact that Rahim and Victor relied on each other was not surprising.

I am going to address the rest of the aspects of Victor with regards to his relationships with each of them after their individual breakdown.

Now moving forward to Benji.

I know its gonna be a hard truth but I think his character was the one that I liked the least. And this is specific to the fact that his motivations are hidden from us. He is not really open to talk to us (through victor). I had the same problem with him in the first season and was hoping he would be fleshed out more. We only see him as an extension to Victor and just his boyfriend. Even then, we barely see him communicating with Victor or anybody else all through the time. Also, that being said, I have seen a lot of people say he was OOC but I think he was actually not really OOC. The way he reacts to Victor's mom's reactions although they come from a place of wanting better for Victor, he doesn't really think twice about why Victor must not be reacting or doing so subtly. He feels very unsympathetic on many occasions and that is a pattern we see from season 1.

I'm not saying he didn't have any troubles of his. Cause he definitely did. We know that with the drunken driving episode and the AA meetings and the strip club story. They were all awful, but that doesn't excuse him from trying to understand where Victor is coming from. Maybe having a little more context and communication about him would make us understand him and his motivations better.

This season specifically, I actually found him to be very token-ish of a gay guy which is weird because it has two other gay characters (or 5 based on the multiple cameos).

Now getting to Rahim.

I LOVED HIM. He is, I think right behind Victor in my heart. I fell in love with him barely minutes into the episode. His coming out retelling was the most wholesome of all things. I loved the friendship Pilar and him shared. I'm surprised we didn't get a scene with Pilar teasing him about his crush on Victor but I think that was because the writers didn't want to make it obvious. I felt he had a character of his own that was explored more than just coming in between the main couple. The one episode where they skip school we found out more about him and it was intriguing to say the least.

He is a Muslim gay boy who likes to put nail polish and fashion and believes that his parents will not accept him. It is soo refreshing to see this theory get denied and the parents being completely okay with it. Next, Victor and him have an interesting relationship between the two. When victor needs his mind to be taken off of things or talk to, Rahim does just that and when Rahim needs some advice or just some support Victor does that.

NOW VENJI.....

I think this is again... a little unpopular right now, but... their relationship was not that great this season. And I.... kinda expected that to happen. That is for multiple reasons. They spent 50% of their time making out, 40% of it fighting and 10% communicating. Were they flawed? Absolutely and I get that. They had massive miscommunication problems. Trust issues and everything under the moon. It is to be expected especially cause they are teenagers and they are not mature enough. That being said, flaws are not when you are dismissive of your boyfriend's issues because he doesn't fit your ideal gay stereotype. Flaws are not when you say your boyfriend is too much for you to handle and say something like you are the only one taking care of them. That's manipulation. Flaws are not when you don't realise that the context your boyfriend comes from is very specific to himself and if you want to do better you need to be open to listen to where he is coming from instead of getting offended by him saying you are white when you don't get the specifics. You need to understand that by saying you are white, he is not dismissing your experience with alcohol addiction and with your father taking you to strip clubs and shit. He is just saying you don't get where I am coming from. The reason I say I saw it coming is because even in season 1 we see Benji go ahead with what he wants to do instead of thinking about the consequences. Case in point the kiss on Victor's birthday. Victor told Benji that his grandparents are homophobic and still he kisses Derek. Because it is fiction and a teen drama the consequences weren't dire and it came to be a growth point for Victor but just imagine if the consequences were different. If it ended up being something worse, what then. I feel this season we are especially able to see Benji out of the rose tinted glasses that Victor had last season.

That being said I admit that Victor was also not entirely good. He did breach Benji's trust. I don't see how they can go back from there. He didn't communicate from his side as well, but just think of it like this if someone says you are too much to handle would their partner actually be willing to communicate what's bothering them?

The things about Isabelle walking on sex. If it was my house anything remotely sexual, irrespective of the gender would have been met with shame and anger just as Isabelle did. They are 16. The little brother was right next door. In any way whether it is straight sex or gay sex it would still have been met this way I feel.

So yeah as much as they are supposed to be the main star couple of the show they lack in almost every aspect. So yeah...

Now coming to VICTOR X RAHIM

Straight off the bat, I don't know if I watched the same season that others did because I actually felt the chemistry between them was actually more than Venji had in scenes other than the make out ones.

Also, they come from similar backgrounds. They understand each other much better than any white dude could ever understand them. They actually talk and communicate.

Rahim and Victor on the other hand are both new to this whole being gay, out and proud thing and I feel they would understand each other better. I think a big problem people have with them is that the writers fall back on the love triangle trope and stuff but I like it in this instance. It made sense to me.

Why? Because they are teenagers. Also, the gay pool in schools are so small and people are bound to explore. Like Victor said, what are the odds that you end up with the first person you start dating?

Also, regarding the wedding. Benji said he would not come, so I don't think he has the right to question who he came with. It was completely innocent on Victor's part because he did invite Pilar first. I guess it is the whole first slow dance that was the betrayal and as much as their chemistry was palpable I feel Benji should have allowed to here him out. I don't know maybe you all feel different about it but I feel that is not a betrayal on Victor's part. What could have been a betrayal was the kiss. I know it is once again a repeat of the cheating stereotype and I had hoped that the showrunner's did it a bit differently but well it has happened. (But again the chemistry in that kiss!!!)

What do I want to happen next. I definitely ship Victor x Rahim more than Victor x Benji. I would love for it to be Rahim behind the door but it feels unlikely that the showrunners will actually do that so my hope is even if they get together, Benji and Victor realise just how much they don't fit with each other and break up amicably and then Victor x Rahim gets explored and slow burn happens.

I don't want Victor to be the only one apologising if Venji do get together again. For whatever small amount of time. I need them to communicate better.

So yeah..... this was long and what I thought of the main portions of Love, Victor. It's really ironic how people love everyone other than Victor in a story about him and care for all the stories other than him.

#love victor #love victor season 2 #rahim love victor #victor salazar #not gonna tag Benji cause I am not too forgiving on him #can you tell author loves rahim?#and victor #and especially loves them together?#Victor x Rahim #we need to come up with an appropriate ship name for them #Vichim? Rator? I don't know just something!#Anywho... Another one coming up sometime about the friends and family #kayblyeeee #first post in ages

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the-paris-of-people · 3 years

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Hi. This is really not a question but more of a rant. A really really long one. I apologize in advance. I honestly care waaaaayyyy too much about this show than I should. Clearly too bored🙈.

After reading people's comments on this show and the ships, there are so many things that irk me and I thought I'd share even if I might get crap for it. So here goes:

1. "Ben only wants Devi when she is with Paxton." I.e. it's about Paxton. Lol people are funny. As though Ben thinks he can compete with Paxton on a social level. He's not stupid, he knows full well he can't. It's about Devi and in part her obsession with Paxton. People don't like thinking about things from Ben's perspective because they just don't like him. He's the one that finds out Devi is cheating, she runs after Paxton at the party ( now granted before she runs out, she's intensely staring at Ben and then realises Paxton is leaving but Ben's not gonna remember that) and she was busy chumming it up with Paxton in episode 3 in front of Ben with absolute disregard for him. So his natural defence is to guard himself and have his walls go up. It is a valid response. He burries his pain (exactly what Samberg said). And does not let his guard down around her romantically until episode 10 when Paxton literally rejects her at school. At the school dance, sparks are flying between those 2. Is Paxton around at the time...Uhm no (I'll get into the whole Aneesa thing). In his mind Paxton is out of the picture and it's like he can almost trust her again. And then when Paxton shows up with Devi, he basically feels like a fool for ever thinking that he was ever something more than 2nd best or sometimes anything at all ( especially considering Devi still wants Paxton after Devi and Paxton's last public interaction that Ben witnessed- I mean he does not get to see the shit behind closed doors). But then when Eleanor spills the tea, that look on his face is disbelief, yes a little bit of jealousy but overwhelmingly heartbreak. He is essentially watching the chance he never knew he had go away. Now you could argue that he should have known that she wanted him back but she broke his trust and does not explicitly say, " I want you back". Ben's not trying to get burnt again based on some assumption/hunch. He has been wrong before.

2. "How dare Ben be upset that Devi is with Paxton when he is with Aneesa". Fair point. Just like how dare Devi be upset and lose her shit over Ben and Aneesa. But yet it still happend. Devi gets 5 episodes allowing her to be upset and Ben can't even have one moment when a firkken bomb gets dropped on him.

Aneesa and Ben should have never date. Everyone knows that. He was never over Devi. He just pushed those feelings down to make him believe he was over her. I obviously don't agree with this. Aneesa doesn't deserve that. Ben needs to go to therapy. He needs an outlet. He is similar to Devi in that he doesn't want to process what happened and would rather move on and react. However, his reactions are far less impulsive/severe as Devi's. Him dating Aneesa is unfortunately a reaction. He didn't give himself time to really process how he feels. People say he dated Aneesa solely to spite Devi which is not true. Is there an element of " you never wanted me but someone else does"... absolutely but Aneesa is also very kind to Ben, they get along really well and she puts him first. Technically what's not to like. I mean if it was just to spite Devi, could he have not tried to hustle his way back in with Shira?? Problem is that dumb dumb didn't work through his Devi feelings and let's just be honest, the same spark and chemistry he has with Devi, is missing with Aneesa. It often feels forced, especially in regards to the pace of the relationship. I so wished Aneesa remained friends with Ben. That's what he needed...not another relationship.

3. "Aneesa is so amazing, she doesn't deserve to get hurt." I agree. She absolutely doesn't deserve to get hurt just like Ben and Paxton didn't deserve that crap Devi pulled. I think Aneesa is a great addition and I like that Devi has someone within her community to connect to. I'm South Asian myself and I genuinely value this aspect of my own life. I mean she is pretty great, kind and the anorexia rumour Devi unintentionally started was pretty heartbreaking. That scene where she talks to Devi at the relay about it, is so sad (especially coz we as viewers know Devi messed up). Now that being said is Aneesa also low key shady? YES. And it's not because she dated her friend's ex. It's because she started dating him knowing that Devi started the rumour about her because she was jealous about Ben and her. How does she think Devi would go from being so jealous that she starts a rumour, to the next week becoming their biggest "Stan". Come on girl. But there was no way Devi could say no after the crap she pulled with Aneesa. Ben did ask her out so if there is blame, he absolutely gets it too but he didn't know why Devi started that rumour (based on his surprised AF face when Eleanor spills the tea). Which leads me to my next question. Why didn't Aneesa tell him? Aneesa said Ben was supporting her through the rumour. She probably told him Devi started the rumour but didn't tell him why? That is odd? Clearly if Ben had known, he may changed his perspective on Devi actually wanting him instead of ignoring his feelings.

Lastly Aneesa knows there are unresolved feelings between Devi and Ben. This is evident from that dance scene. She literally runs to cut in their pretty intense conversation. Like why you running girl? I didn't think much of it at first but coupled with another moment, it makes a lot of sense. When Ben agrees to dance with Aneesa, he looks back at Devi and lingers and Aneesa picks up on this and pulls him away. It's a blink and you will miss it moment but it is there.

Now all of this doesn't mean she needs to get hurt but they probably need to break up. Ben needs to be single for a while and work through how he feels about Devi, Aneesa and most importantly himself. Whilst I don't particularly enjoy their relationship, you never get to see it from either of their perspectives. Maybe that could change things but honestly I just prefer Ben and Devi.

Also can everyone stop acting like Ben is dating Devi's best friend. Being brown doesn't make you automatically best friends and Ben and Devi met Aneesa the same week. People are acting like he is dating Eleanor.

4. "Devi chose Paxton". Please! The only thought through decision that girl made in regards to these 2 boys is when she chose herself and decided not to be Paxton's little secret. I mean in episode 1 and 2 she can't decide so she dates both. In episode 3, she interacts with Paxton because of the whole tutoring thing. He says they don't makes sense. While she seems a bit sad she doesn't seem too upset like she is season 1 and she isn't looking for any opportunity to spend time with him (unlike season 1). Episode 4,5,6,7 and 8 she is losing her mind over Ben. Half way through 8 she knows she has no choice but to let him go. But even after that she doesn't pursue Paxton. He does that at the end of episode 9 when in all honesty she hasn't really thought about him in a while. Then of course Paxton does what he does and she finally choose herself, issuing an ultimatum essentially. Paxton does eventually show up...but it's a choice by default. She just yo-yo's between them. She also needs to be single, deal with her loss, love herself and think about what she wants.

5. "Devi loves Paxton". Sure bud. Does have Devi have feeling for Paxton? Duh! But is it love. Nope. People like to confuse infatuation for love. She has been infatuated with this boy this the 3rd (she knew squat about him). When her dad died, she turns that infatuation into an obsession. It like becomes a full time hobby in season 1. She ruins relationships over it. In season 2 you can argue there is more depth to it and Paxton does grow in Season 2. But somehow she is still fixated on the fact that it's Paxton Hall-Yoshida. I mean she smells him (totally normal), Mc Enroe's comment at the relay was, "did this hunk of beef just say he likes spending time with her", when she breaks up him she says , "you are very good at kissing" not possibly any of his other good qualities. And at the end she says , "I guess I'm Paxton Hall Yoshida's girlfriend now". This boy is so far up a pedestal that if he fell of it, he'd break something. Now granted if he fell of it in Season 1, he'd be dead. So progress I guess...

Maybe the relationship will change in Season 3 and she genuinely falls in love with him. I mean Id be sad but obviously a real possibility. But also that relationship needs to move on from being just the "Paxton project" which it was basically all of season 2. Maybe actually talk about her every once in a while.

Also people who find the ending so amazing because he shows up...bare minimum bro. I understand his perspective, how does it look to go back with someone who cheated on you. Fair point 💯. However she didn't start this shit up again. He did. He liked her so much that he had to make out with her In the middle of the night out of the blue but not enough to respect her publically. That's some BS right there. If he started it, he should have thought it through instead of guilt tripping her. But he is a teenager and ALL of them make incredibly stupid decisions (we all have). Devi messed up big time too and she apologized. The same compassion must extend to him but in no way is it a grand gesture, it's the bare minimum...like her apologies

6. "Paxton forgave Devi forgave Devi so quickly whilst Ben didn't and was so mean". He did forgive her pretty quickly. Good for him. However let's not act like circumstance didn't carve the way for that. They were pushed together because of the whole tutoring thing and he knows that they have to see each other all the time. So logically just makes sense to keep the peace. But still mature oh his part. Also he wasn't as emotionally invested as Ben. Did he have feelings? Yes. However, based on his inner monologue (Gigi Hadid) his ego took more of a hit because how could Devi, the "weirdest girl" he ever liked two time him with Ben Gross. Did his feelings deepen by the end? Yes. But at the start...it isn't that deep.

Also it's great and all that he "forgave" her so quickly but he sure did like bringing it up a lot. Like at the relay guilting her, upset at the end of 6 because he failed...I mean wtf girl you owe me- I don't really care what else is going on in your life, again in episode 8 in the car and finally we all know the mess that is episode 10.

In regards to Ben. His anger is justified for reasons stated in point 1. In fact his reaction seems more real because he is deeply hurt by Devi. Do I like some of his reaction (i.e. nose piercing-will discuss this further) ...nope but she only sincerely apologises to him in episode 8 vs 3 for Paxton. He accepts it. People acting like they would be so calm and chill about being cheated on. And yes he did cheat on Shira. He tries to kiss Devi at party twice but apologises that day and the following week. He doesn't try anything with Devi the whole of episode 10 until she kisses him. He acknowledges that it was wrong and immediately breaks up with Shira. Although cheating is not something we should condone can we actually acknowledge that Shira was the worst and doesn't even remember Ben's name. Compare that to Devi's premeditated cheating. Her Eleanor are literally laughing at how amazing they are for pulling it off and Devi didn't care about either of their feelings cause she was going to be India. Sorry but that is far worse. She also thinks she can bullshit her apology with Ben. He isn't here for that...which is fine! He kept trying his level best to avoid her but even that she wouldn't let him do.

7. "Ben is Horrible". Has Ben done some shitty things. Absolutely. People complain that he has never apologised for anything. Fair enough. He needs to apologize for the UN comment and the psychosomatic comment. It was incredibly hurtful. However, no one does call him out of it. Now you could argue he should just do it. Please... have you watched these particular set of teenagers? None of them apologise without being called out on it first(except maybe Fabiola). And you only get called out my your support system ... which Ben does not have. He practically looks like he raised himself. He doesn't have parents to put him back in line or a sister to call him out on his shit. Devi has her mom, cousin, grandmum , Elanor, Fabiola and her therapist. Does she ever listen to them the first time? Nope. And her first time apologies are such messes. She only gets it right the 2nd or 3rd time. All of them have some form of support but not really him. And it is heartbreaking. It's why I genuinely believe he needs to go to therapy. He needs an outlet to express everything he feels. He also needs to be held accountable for those comments and understand the root of it (ok let's be honest Devi even in their rivalry was probably the most constant person in his life, and fighting with her meant she stayed close by- it's a subconscious thing). He should apologize to her and also find better ways to communicate what he is feeling. The nose ring thing was manipulative. I agree. He should apologize. But I'm not gonna lie, it doesn't piss me off as much because I think it's pretty messed that it took that for her to realise how much she hurt him. Also tbh if you were willing to alter your body on a 2 minute thought out dare, you wanted to do it anyway. But again not a healthy way to emote on Ben's part. The David thing doesn't upset me because he knows how to pronounce her actual name. It's not like he doesn't know how and doesn't bother to try. It was part of their rivalry to irritate her. I honestly find it quite endearing as part of their friendship and think Devi does. I may be wrong and she may not like it and in that case he needs to stop and apologize.

I am not upset by him coming over to her house and calling her out about Aneesa. She deserved it. Also if she was that uncomfortable she could have taken him outside to talk like she did with Paxton. She is clearly comfortable enough to have him in the house. And her therapist agrees with Ben. If he hadn't, she wouldnt have known that Aneesa was leaving. Her mom took away her phone. And even then her first attempt at an apology was soooooo bad. And I don't think Ben did it solely to get Aneesa to stay so he could date her. This is Ben, he was willing to do long distance with Devi from India, I think he could have done the same with Aneesa from like the same town 🙄

I genuinely like Ben because he is a good kid. He makes mistakes like they all do. His personality is hilarious to watch but also his and Devi's relationship is so special. Me liking Ben and Devi has nothing to do with what Paxton has or has not done. I just like the dynamic between the two. They obviously care deeply for each other. Their conversations are hilarious. I love their banter. I love how comfortable they are with each and am sometimes surprised by the depth of their conversations. But also they have amazing chemistry. All the jealous looks and angst are between these two idiots pining for each other. I think she does have chemistry with Paxton but it's more because he is PHY, school Adonis. I mean let's be honest, he'd probably have chemistry with Fabiola solely cause he is PHY. The two nerds just match each other and it's so funny how often they are in sync. It's honestly adorable. They just get each other. That bathroom scene was the sweetest thing and also proves he's not this terrible person. She only comes out of the stall because of his support. He is genuinely hurt for her when technically it should have been a great moment for him.

I do believe the two have to be single for a bit before admitting their feelings for one another and moving forward. That's why my main thing for season 3 is that he absolutely cannot interfere in her relationship with Paxton. He needs to give her the space to figure that. Do I think there will be moments between them... absolutely but no cheating please. Everyone needs to move on from that. If they do it...I honestly think il be done with the show.

Anyways sorry for the really long ramble. If you made it to the end thanks for your patience 😌

Thank you for this beautiful masterpiece, I pretty much agree with everything and need to put it out there for the world to see

#im obsessed with benvi and yall KNOW it #ben x devi #thanks for the response i was soooo entertained while reading it #never have i ever

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elizabethrobertajones · 3 years

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Hello there. I have a question (more like a thesis): What would have happened if Cas told the Truth anywhere between season 7 and 15? Do you think it would have had the same impact on Dean? Logically speaking Cas could have told him anytime.

Oh gosh, yes. I mean Dean’s reaction in season 15 is still the best it could have been really :P He was in the best place and most accepting of himself and he still had a BSOD for a moment and then Cas had to shove him away so he could go die... (Assuming you take the on screen boring presentation of what happened as canon and not throw in the reciprocation, tears, pull in for a kiss, etc that we know exists either in our hearts or on Jackles’ phone.)

I’ve been thinking about this and the parameters we’d have to apply if we were gonna get something like the show being self-healing back to its self as we know it but we were allowed a confession. Also the show has to be as punishing as ever. So these are my personal theses on each season...

Season 7 the confession would have to be after Cas comes back, and everything in 7x17 that looked like Dean was jealous of Daphne and Meg textually was meant to be read that way in the set up for the confession. To make it the most painful obviously we still get Cas exactly as he was all through to the end of the season and he never really says anything too different but then right when they’re having the “cursed or not” discussion he’d bust out of nowhere that he supposes it is inevitable Dean would talk him into going on this dangerous mission to get Dick because obviously Cas loves him. And Dean, who is in a weirdly zen sort of place in the remaining minutes of season 7 after Bobby’s send off and final words that helped him go make up with Cas, is in a similarly season 15 oddly okay spot, mental health wise. At least. COMPARED TO ALL THE REST OF SEASON 7. But I still personally have always read it as a genuinely good place for him that could have endured much longer if not for *gestures everything that happened after stabbing Dick* and obviously making up with Cas was step one and a huge part of his process.

(idk if you’ve noticed but 7x23 pretty much has no Sam and Dean interaction after Bobby’s send off, and their last good broments are really scarce; it feels sort of natural for abrupt calamity and no time for teary farewells in a season with a strong commentary on grief, which also hyperfocuses the attention on Dean n Cas there.)

So I think Dean would maybe be stunned but maybe quirk a sceptical smile like “He can’t mean it like that and anyway he’s currently coo-coo, this doesn’t mean anything hahaha oh Cas :)))” and then idk shake his head and move the story on and Cas just turns one longing look after him like “dammit that didn’t work out like planned”

Anyway then the exact plot beats of 7x23 follow, exactly as seen on your screens, but we’re left going into season 8 and Carver era with Dean far far more messed up about Cas and it can force clarification in 8x02 in Purgatory where Cas is entirely adamant he meant what he meant and furious at Dean for being mad at him and Dean’s mad at Cas for all the season 8 reasons so they continue angsting at each other but Benny’s reaction shots are just 10x funnier. This is followed by Dean’s reciprocation of “I love you” instead of “I need you” in the crypt scene in 8x17 and from there honestly it’s been built up into canon in such a way that the emotional arc of the show has to go off the wheels and I can’t keep to the self-healing model to continue following the “real” plot and contain this much raw power.

Coincidentally, if the first confession is in season 8, it would be “what broke the connection” after a season 8 where nothing was different up until that point. Cas flaps off while Dean is still processing that the answer was “You. I love you.” and Dean is left yelling at the empty crypt like “What the hell, Cas?!”

Then he’s as mad at him as he was in canon except instead of being borderline a really bad overreaction into his anger phase which we have to weather as miserable fans tethered to this ship who know sometimes Dean gets mad and yells at Cas for no reason, he’s reacting proportionately. It’s always seemed like 8x22 only makes sense if Dean is furious at Cas for confessing and fleeing except, obviously, in our “”real”” canon, it can only be like Cas confessed and Dean took it that way and also felt embarrassed how far he went with his own feelings only for Cas to run.

This would make the bar scene with the cupids in 8x23 make a lot more sense too, and after they get the cupid bow Dean’s going to turn to Cas and give him a nervous smile, and then - Naomi flaps in like she does and distracts them away from reciprocation.

I think this one could go long - maybe even season 13 Cas being dead and Dean being like “FUCK I never got a chance to work things out with him” and 13x06 onwards is where we get any actual work on the ship, because Carver era was so determined to be emotionally gruelling and unsatisfying and relentless from one issue to the next. And the confessions are so bound up specifically in the moments of miscommunication or failed attempts, cut off conversations etc that whether Destiel is canon or not, they’re never gonna get to talk it out under those conditions. Cas is only explicitly the grieving wife and jealous ex to Crowley’s smug take over of Dean’s affections rather than subtextually.

The season 9 confession... I feel like we’d come perilously close to the Monkey Paw curse we once envisioned of Buckleming making it canon because they love jumping the gun on plot points and making them too obvious. So the end of 9x03, Cas is really blatantly angling to come in with a big “Hey I’m human can I live in the Bunker look at me I learned to do The Sex can we do it now” kind of vibe. All the enthusiasm he was giving to eating that burrito in the background while “Zeke” was trying to get him kicked out, but with lusting over Dean :P

If we avoid that we can leap to Mr Bobo Berens and his first episode, and have this thing handled by a pro, as it’s already very much about Cas as a homeless queer man with a bad ex he still loves rolling into town where he’s just trying to make a new life and play straight - I mean human - for his own survival. I suspect the confrontation with Iphraim would make it really obvious that Cas didn’t just want to live as a human but had an eye for living as a human with Dean, and then he’d attempt a confession right before Dean would accidentally talk over, like, the L in “love” honestly, to tell him that sorry things do still stand that you can’t come back with me. Leaves Cas utterly devastated but Dean is none the wiser and he drives off and Cas pines piningly at the pine trees in his Gas n Sip.

Again the end of season probably would force the real confession, since there’s a ready made moment in 9x22 where Hannah tries to force Cas to kill Dean and he gives it all up for one man. Cas can just lower that knife and be like, “No, I love him,” talking to his shoes and Hannah rather than meeting Dean’s eyes. Mark of Cain Dean is fuuuucked up at that point but we still get the moment where Dean carries Cas’s bag into the bunker and sits down with him and tries to care about his health and now also this confession. Sussing out what the heck is up with Cas, and maybe he looks like he’s playing it cool and is still so messed up but Cas is vulnerable, and finally Dean starts to reach across the library table for his hand, and it’s a moment where maybe things could have started to go better for them...... Cue Gadreel walking into the library, Dean going feral, blah blah demon!Dean, blah blah explicitly stated Drowley, blah blah muuuch healing and Cas giving Dean a wide berth for a lil while. Though, in this scenario, 10x22 is far worse but has the reverse crypt scene moment, so Dean can be more obviously unable to kill Cas because he loves him, and then he walks out, followed by season 11 and Cas being returned to them. Unfortunately. Yep. Another finger curls on the Monkey Paw... 11x03 by Buckleming would absolutely be where Destiel goes undeniably canon as it is their first real interactions post Mark of Cain. Our only consolation - directed by Jensen Ackles.

Season 10 confession, hm. Poor Cas. He has the option of 10x03, of confessing and then immediately apologising and walking off to handle stuff with Hannah (thanks Buckleming!) or the Burger Date, where Dean may be slightly less stunned stupid but still likely to laugh it off and not believe it. There’s not much heavy tension between them most of the season so it’s possible that the only time Cas would really get is to confess in 10x22 while telling Dean that he would have to watch him murder the world, and that would suck because I love you. At which point the story dictates that Dean beats Cas to paste so it’s a very bad look. Season 10 destiel confession is the worst.

Season 11 may be better because Cas has options to be jealous of Crowley and Dean’s connection to Amara multiple times and then Casifer happens and that can really play up things in a season where a confession is coming.

I think the Beer Run in 11x23 might be the only viable place, where Dean grabs Cas and takes him out for that drive for last drinks before the end of the world. Cas gets the “you’re our brother” thing and just lays into Dean with the certainty of someone who knows this is it - now or nothing - with “You know that’s crap, Dean. You wait until the end of the world and you can’t even say it. Well I can; I love you.”

Cue awkward tension, well-placed interrupting Moose, and then the world very much not ending so that when Dean n Cas hug and kiss in front of Mary in 12x01. Well. There’s even more explaining to do to her. Since we’ve made it to Dabb era, I believe any confessions from this point onwards can just slot into the show as we got it from there since it’s entirely compatible to start season 12 assuming Dean n Cas are literally married and never be contradicted by the text in their behaviour. But since we’ve had canon Destiel since whenever, obviously the final episodes are good instead of. That.

Season 12... Going to have to go with the first sniff of true canon coming in Lily Sunder with just a few lines leaning even further in the Cas’s Angel Family Are Homophobic Assholes metaphor, leaving Cas’s relationship with Dean even more live wire exposed. Followed by The Mixtape Scene where Cas is going to confess to Dean and get him startled up out of his seat, accidentally knocking the mixtape to the floor and for a moment it’s like, did he throw it is he mad? but then he’s smooching Cas, fade to black, return to scheduled programming but the whole line about Cas stealing the Colt from under Dean’s pillow makes fuckin sense, as well as the fall out argument and how mad Dean was at Cas followed by how devastated he was at Cas’s death. This just means Dabb era continues as planned except we get a kiss in 13x06 under that big glowy cross, and some more smooching here and there when things are good from then on.

Season 13... Hm. Cas has to do the confessing and I don’t think he’d throw that at Dean on return from death so unlike if Dean was the one who was being made to confess obviously the aforementioned glowy cross scene obviously would be it for him... Cas could keep that bottled up much longer, especially as he has so much to do with Jack this season. It’s entirely possible we go through the whole season and then Cas lobs it at Dean as a final card when he’s making his Michael decision and we actually see the scene that we didn’t get, where Cas has to watch Dean getting possessed. Except Dean is like, tearful and furious like why would you tell me that now, and anyway i’m doing this for you as well dumbass but fuck you but also how dare you anyway I need to be an archangel now and save our - your - son, bye. Cue Cas sitting there not just in total horror at what happened but also kicking himself for fucking up the moment :P I guess this way at least we can have that moment where Dean is un-Michaeled and tells Cas he’s going to shower and finger guns at him, and now we can have Cas wordlessly and furiously follow him.

Season 14, we get Cas at Rocky’s bar confessing to Dean while figment!Pamela cheers the whole thing on. If there was EVER a time to use the power of love to snap Dean out of it, Cas upsetting his cosy routine with “this isn’t real, I’M NOT HERE IN YOUR FANTASY” is absolutely the time to pull a reverse crypt scene which has such low stakes in terms of neither of them needing to punch each other when Michael is an external aggressor.

My ONLY issue with this is that Sam has to witness the whole thing and we would get reaction shots and I am a weak mortal who will start cackling at them when I’m supposed to be having the transcendent moment of canon and the whole thing would be ruined just because of the way Jared gurns when doing reactions to dean n cas interacting. Wow thanks. Thanks a lot.

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turtle-paced · 3 years

Text

A:tLA Re-Watch: Fine-Toothed Comb Edition

Well, not quite on the long weekend, but here’s the recap anyway.

Book 1, Chapter 6 - Imprisoned

(0:55) Previously, on Avatar, the Water Tribes know what it’s like to be stuck at the ass end of the world slowly dying, but Katara’s hope is actually inspiring and she and Sokka found the Avatar for a reason. It’s going to be a Katara-centric episode. The group is still heading to the North Pole, while Zuko continues chasing them.

(1:45) We’re out of the snow! It’s still winter (seeing as the next episode is titled ‘The Winter Solstice’), but yeah. No snow. At the very least, this area’s warm enough that snow isn’t an all-winter condition.

(2:02) This is what I mean by the show bringing up supplies when they’re an issue. Note that Sokka doesn’t actually know what any of these nuts are. He hasn’t spent enough time in the Earth Kingdom to know what’s edible.

(2:48) The character contrast in two nutshells. Aang and Katara run towards the loud booming noises in the forest, Sokka advises hanging back (but goes with the majority). Then, when they find Haru, Aang and Katara want to make friends, but Sokka says he looks dangerous so they should be cautious. It’s a joke, mostly at Sokka’s expense, but it’s also consistent characterisation that helps give Sokka an important role in the team even when he’s outshone by ridiculous amounts in the direct combat department. He thinks very differently in some ways to his sister and his friends. This is sometimes unhelpful and sometimes downright necessary for the characters collectively to succeed. Today is an unhelpful day.

(2:56) Upon seeing Katara, the practicing earthbender drops everything and runs, going so far as to block pursuit. No questions, no chances, just immediate flight. Weird reaction, hey?

(3:06) Aang says that Haru must be running somewhere. Like a village. Which should have a market. Like I said back in episode one, every main character is smart. Showing it in these tiny, low-stakes, incidental conversations makes it believeable when they do big, dramatic smart things.

(3:21) Pan over this Earth Kingdom village. It’s pretty different to Kyoshi Island, and honestly looks a fair bit more prosperous. Earthbending means this village has got a very neat-looking mine and that building a wall around town isn’t a big deal. Interestingly, most building here are made of wood, or at least significantly involve wood in their construction (lintels, structural beams, doors, floors, I think even the rooftops).

(3:40) We get Haru’s name here as Katara spots him and follows him into his mother’s store.

(3:55) As soon as Aang says ‘earthbending’, Haru’s mother slams the doors and windows closed. Until now, the gAang has only travelled in free territory. Scared, paranoid territory, but free territory. This episode is a quick and brutal look at life in an occupied Earth Kingdom village. There’s a lot of fear here.

(4:09) Right on cue, Fire Nation soldiers drop by. The taxes they’re collecting are extortionate and their schedule for payment is arbitrary. The occupying force is taking financially and using this as a terror tactic. This becomes more explicit as the soldier says “we wouldn’t want an accident, would we?” and creates a fireball in his hands.

(4:58) Love the worldbuilding on this show. Why’s the Fire Nation here? Sokka asks, and Haru’s mother has an answer. Turns out all those coal-fired ships the Fire Nation uses? They need coal. The village is being exploited for its natural resources, too.

(5:09) Katara asks why Haru doesn’t help fight back, as he so clearly wants to. Especially since it means not bending, which she says is part of who she is. Haru’s mother explains that Haru would be arrested and taken from the village for earthbending (hold on to the information that the walls and mine are clearly products of earthbending), just like Haru’s father was. So let’s add some deeply personal and cultural oppression to the list of things going on here.

It’s also a tough lesson that resisting the Fire Nation in places like this isn’t as simple as saying “fight back.” There are serious risks involved.

(5:43) More panning over Earth Kingdom scenery. Vegetable patches and a silo can be seen. Little visual touches to remind the viewer that these background characters were in this place before the story arrived there, and will continue on offscreen once the story leaves. It helps make the world feel real.

(6:08) Katara and Haru go off and bond. Katara apologises for accidentally bringing up any hurt related to Haru’s father, ‘cause she’s a good, considerate person.

(6:18) Haru tells Katara how brave his father was to resist the Fire Nation invasion, against what odds. After which Haru’s father was taken away, and his family haven’t seen him since. The only way Haru can feel close to his father is by practicing earthbending, which also puts him in danger.

The entire backstory here gets into the big issues - invasion, mass internment, cultural oppression - by linking it with the much smaller slice of life. Just Haru, missing his father.

(6:48) Katara gives the exposition on her necklace, the last memento she has of her mother. The conversation leaves off pretty brutally as well. “It’s not enough, is it?” “No.” And that’s it. There’s only acknowledgement of their mutual pains, not closure. There’s not enough. There’s a hole there that cannot be filled.

(7:05) As Katara and Haru head back, they pass the mine collapsing. What happens when an earthbender-produced mine has to operate without earthbenders? It seems very likely to me that earthbending is a major part of mining safety and maintenance in Avatar world, and the removal of earthbenders from town would logically result in more mine collapses and accidents.

(7:32) Haru bravely earthbends to rescue the old man from the mine collapse.

(7:59) One of the really nice things about Aang? He’s impressed by Katara’s accomplishments, even one as small as inspiring Haru to his own little rebellion.

(8:12) Sokka brings up that point from back in 1.04 that if they hang around a village (especially an occupied village) they’re going to be in trouble. They have to keep moving. Continuity! Learning the lessons of previous episodes!

(8:41) Fire Nation soldiers show up in the dead of night to arrest Haru for earthbending, on the information of the old Earth Kingdom man Haru saved. Informants and midnight arrests - it’s a freaking scary depiction of life under occupation. Not to mention the moral texture it brings to the series. The Fire Nation is inarguably wrong and oppressive. But that doesn’t make the people of the Earth Kingdom saints. Individuals have a range of responses to the Fire Nation, and here we see it’s up to and including willing collaboration with their oppressors. We’re never going to see this old man again. He never gets any on-screen comeuppance. He never gets told he was wrong. This is just a lesson for the main characters.

The show’s worked up to this idea, with the hostility of the Kyoshi Islanders and Bumi placing the gAang under arrest. Now it’s serious. The characters can’t assume that Earth Kingdom people will be on their side.

And this ultimately leads up to the point that this conflict isn’t about one nation being inherently bad and the others being inherently good.

(8:56) Love to see some mundane uses of bending - in this case, Katara doesn’t bother actually pumping water, she just yanks it out of the pump.

(9:23) And a nice thing about Sokka - when he sees Katara is upset, he moves to comfort her physically. However, also notice what Sokka actually says. Part of his idea of comforting Katara is working on solutions to the external problem, working out what happened and what they might be able to do about it. It’s very pragmatic and not very touchy-feely. While it comes with the best of intentions, and Katara doesn’t even have to ask for Sokka’s support and assistance, you can see where Katara might want a friend who’s a little more emotionally supportive. Different people fill different roles.

(9:31) But on to the main event! Katara’s got a plan to break Haru out of Fire Nation prison. Thus far Katara’s been strong and capable, and particularly impressive in how she’s dealt with a grief-stricken Aang. This marks her first opportunity to take up the foremost heroic role in an episode. She’s making the plans, she’s driving the action, she’s saving the day. It starts with her getting arrested for earthbending.

(9:49) A team plan! Katara had the basic idea of using airbending to simulate earthbending, but it looks to me like Sokka did the actual engineering of finding the vents that connect, while Aang’s going to be doing the actual bending. This is also a classic example of how Sokka’s character development is going to go over the course of the series and the reason he’s such an important part of the team. He puts the details into the big ideas.

(9:55) And here’s Aang’s fun-loving, lighthearted nature shown as a flaw rather than a virtue (in a fairly comedic, low-ish stakes kind of way) before the serious long-term implications become most apparent in season three. He’s goofing off and not taking responsibility for his part in this plan. Later, when Aang doesn’t want to find a firebending teacher and doesn’t want to think about how he’s planning to deal with Ozai, that’s perfectly believeable. We’ve seen him skip out on small details, so we can believe Aang would skip out on the big ones.

Furthermore, in character and plot terms, the character trait that’s a minor hiccup in the plan this episode causes serious problems later, and yet remains an important strength in other episodes (and across those episodes in how Aang actually keeps moving forward). There’s nuance there in Aang’s character, and nuance in the plots that recognise that things aren’t usually as simple as ‘this character trait good, that character trait bad’.

(10:18) This entire scene gives me the giggles so bad, starting with this Fire Nation soldier’s bemused reaction. Earthbending style.

(11:17) The group exchanges a bunch of anxious looks. Despite the comic nature of the faked fight, they did just arrange for Katara to get arrested by the Fire Nation and hauled off to a prison for dissidents. This is serious stuff.

(11:30) Cut to a port, and Katara on a boat. Nobody seems surprised that the prison is offshore.

(12:15) Cameo from George Takei here, hamming it up.

(12:41) The faux affability of the welcoming is shown by the Warden’s willingness to use fire on a prisoner when the prisoner simply coughs. Followed by condemning the man to a week of solitary imprisonment. Also worth noting that the Warden is completely unfazed by the presence of a young teenager amongst the prisoners.

(13:05) The Warden helpfully points out that the rig is made entirely of metal, which earthbenders cannot affect with their powers. (At this point in the series.) It brings a pretty significant limitation of earthbending to the table in a series set just as their world’s industrial revolution is going global.

It’s also a good indication of how hard imprisoning a bender is. This rig must be absolutely brutal to live on, for the guards as well as the prisoners. It couldn’t have been cheap to build, either. I’ll come back to the topic of criminal justice and bending ability later in the series, but for now just keep in mind that prison for benders a) requires cruel conditions and b) is logistically burdensome to say the least.

(13:16) The Warden also describes earthbending as ‘brutish savagery’, so here’s some fire supremacy for you all! Again, the big thing - the Fire Nation taking over the world and thinking that’s okay - is reflected in the little thing, a Fire Nation character casually dismisssing any worth in earthbending (when we just a few minutes ago heard Haru speak about how important it was to his family bonds).

(13:47) Katara looks over the prisoners and sees a lot of people in absolute despair. Keep an eye out for female prisoners. I keep raising this background detail thing because it tells you how the writers and animators are thinking about the “normal” state of the world.

(13:52) A nice touch from a design standpoint is that Haru is about the only person wearing a deep, living green, rather than the prisoner brown/grey/very dried-out green combination.

(14:11) Haru did at least succeed in finding his father, Tyro.

(14:29) This exchange does nicely to set up Tyro as a kind individual whose sense of humour has not been totally eradicated by the situation he’s in.

(14:52) Tyro tells Katara that there’s no escape plan, only a survival plan.

(14:58) There are some female prisoners in this shot! Which is evidence of female earthbenders, even though we still don’t see very many in the rest of the series.

(15:14) Much like in town, Katara is reminded that things aren’t necessarily so simple as “fight back”. She’s talking to people who have been dealing with the Fire Nation, unsuccessfully, for years. What does fighting back look like to these people, after all this time? What do they stand to lose?

(15:21) I do love this exchange. Tyro says, “I’m sorry, but we’re powerless,” and Katara replies, “We’ll see about that.” What she wants and what she aims to achieve is to give the prisoners here their power back. She’s trying to help them to help themselves. Even though this speech doesn’t work. Very eloquent for an impromptu speech, too.

(16:44) Aang and Sokka arrive to provide backup.

(17:01) Katara refuses to leave the prison until she’s accomplished her objective. She emphasises that it’s the people she’s not giving up on. For all her character development over the series, this trait stays exactly the same, arguably the very core of her character.

(17:30) We get the split in group opinion again. Katara and Aang want to stay and help, Sokka wants to leave. Outvoted, and aware that he’s not going to overcome Katara’s stubbornness on this point, Sokka says they’d better hide.

(17:48) Two guards report an Appa sighting to the Warden. This is actually a really good drawback to the convenience of having a flying bison, narratively - he’s just not all that inconspicuous.

(18:06) The Warden throws a man overboard for questioning whether the difference between a flying bison or a flying buffalo is all that pertinent. Love this show. I’m also getting serious “do the tides command this ship?” vibe. Only less competent. Though the Warden does have the competence to get the core point that there’s something amiss, and orders a full search of the rig.

(18:42) Aang wishes he knew how to make a hurricane, because then the Warden would run away and the party could just take his keys. Now this is what people mean when they call Aang naive. Note that this wishful thinking from Aang doesn’t involve direct confrontation with the Warden. He wants the problem to go away. It’s not an issue with Aang’s intellect, it’s an issue with Aang’s psychology.

(18:53) Sokka wants to give the earthbenders some literal power. Some literal substance they can bend so that they can free themselves.

(19:08) It’s Aang who points out that earthbenders are able to bend coal, and the Fire Nation keeps coal on the rig. Naive, not stupid!

(19:22) Like I said, Sokka doesn’t often lead the way or deal with the party’s biggest ideas, but he is absolutely unmatched when it comes to making their goals into workable plans. As Katara asks Sokka “are you sure this is going to work?” we can be sure that the details here were Sokka’s doing. Moreover, he’s applied knowledge of vents he picked up earlier in the episode.

It’s also worth noting that Sokka was against staying to rescue the earthbenders and still put his all into coming up with a plan once he was outvoted. He works with Katara and Aang in good faith so that the disagreement doesn’t wreck their teamwork.

(20:02) Once again, Aang provides the muscle as he airbends some staggering quantities of coal onto the deck.

(20:22) Again, quite realistically, the earthbenders are hesitant to take the opportunity Katara’s just provided. The Warden underlines the point that it’s Katara’s inspirational words versus years of oppression and despair. Sure, that is the problem here. Katara tries, and she’s mocked by the villain for trying.

(20:59) But as the lump of coal crashes into the back of the Warden’s head, the show says that Katara was right and the Warden was wrong. Katara’s faith was not misplaced and her words and actions did make a difference here. Even if it sounded silly to start with.

(21:09) Love that the coal actually ignites when hit by fireblasts.

(21:25) Yes, we did see a female earthbender prisoner fighting back there! And I’m still pretty sure that this is one of the vanishingly few occasions we’ll see female earthbenders active in the background of the series.

(21:57) The earthbenders prioritise getting off the rig.

(22:05) Here’s Katara again. This is the first we see her actively participating in this skirmish. She hasn’t actually done much fighting - the point here was always what she could do to empower others to fight. She’s still got her necklace at this point. Notice also Aang’s creative use of airbending to propel small pieces of coal at the Fire Nation soldiers.

(22:33) The earthbenders steal a Fire Nation ship and head back to the mainland. Katara’s lost her necklace in this shot. Haru and Tyro spell out the effect of Katara’s actions.

(23:04) Tyro declares his intention to take back all their villages, which tells us that the prisoners were not from just one place. They must have been brought in from several towns and villages in the general area. Looks like the gAang’s leaving some insurgents behind them, right in Ozai’s coal supply.

(23:26) Haru thanks Katara for her help with that small thing of returning his dad for him, and wishes he could do the same for her. She also realises that she’s lost her mother’s necklace at this point.

(23:35) And who should pick it up but Zuko, who we haven’t seen for almost two whole episodes. Presumably he’s followed a report of Avatar-based shenanigans, and he’s got real sharp eyes to pick out the one Water Tribe thing in all this.

#a:tla #fine toothed comb edition

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kedreeva · 3 years

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So, not a secret that I absolutely love outer space. A short while ago, I decided to give Netflix’s “Another Life” a shot and due to a mix up I accidentally started watching from episode 3 instead of episode 1 (GREAT choice tho, 10/10 recommend) but I went back to watch ep 1 and 2 just to see what they were about. They were okay. Not amazing, but okay. In my personal opinion, some unnecessary things happened, but whatever.

Then, still in a mood to watch some space stuff, I decided to give Netflix’s “Away” a chance as well. Seemed like a fairly classic “I really liked this thing and here’s thing other thing that’s basically the same thing”

And the scary thing was that...... it WAS. I didn’t make it all the way through “Away” (which I will get to in a minute) but the first few episodes are.... almost EXACTLY the same beats as Another Life. A woman (mother of a daughter, lover of a husband) leaves Earth in a spaceship. The spaceship’s crew was previously captained by a man who is still a part of the mission but no longer in command. At least one person on the crew does not like this, and does not think she is fit to lead. There is an attempted mutiny, which is curbed. An illness takes hold in the crew and they must get past it. A major technical malfunction occurs and must be survived. Her life is put in danger in a way that brings the crew together. She misses her daughter terribly. She misses her husband terribly. One of them suffers a damage from illness/injury and she cannot be there for them.

I’m sure that, had I continued watching Away, I would have found even more similarities where each show hit the same beats (which is a whole other conversation about humans coming up with the same stories at the same times unrelated to one another!!), but here’s the thing..... despite their MANY similarities, despite that they are both centered on something I love, “Away” was exhaustingly heterosexual. Even though one of the main characters is a woman that has fallen in love with another woman, her storyline feels very told through the eyes of a straight person. She is in a secret relationship which gets outed against her will (which in itself I’m tired of, but that’s a personal thing), and then has to say goodbye to her lover because Reasons. The captain’s ability to lead the mission is called into question simply because she has a family and they saw her care about them one (1) time (EVEN THOUGH EVERYONE ELSE ON THE SHIP HAS A FAMILY TOO). There’s also a weirdly aggressive “her husband had a stroke and is in a WHEELCHAIR and it is THE WORST and nothing will EVER be good EVER AGAIN if he doesn’t get FIXED” plot going on, and some SUPER weird side plot with the daughter back home who liked this boy and he “surprised” her with a “date” that was just them going to midnight mass on christmas eve (???). Just about the only thing I can commend the show on is that one of the astronauts left his little girl in order to go into space the first time (which was decades ago), and she hasn’t forgiven him since, and he asks her to forgive him because he might die on this mission and she basically tells him “I don’t owe you forgiveness for doing wrong by me.”

I dunno. It was just... I spent a lot of the time I was watching “Away” feeling uncomfortable about it. I didn’t particularly care for any of the characters. or their plotlines. and despite that it was almost exactly the same story I JUST watched and loved the hell out of, but it was exhausting to watch and I didn’t like it at all.

Anyway, TL;DR: if you are wanting to watch a space show and are choosing between “Another Life” and “Away,” pick “Another Life” because it was astronomically better.

#another life #personal #long posts #x #xx #away

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fordanoia · 3 years

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Fic Writer Interview

I was tagged way way back by @endae (my beloved). Thank you for the tag!!!

How many works do you have on AO3?

19 (haha), I really gotta work on moving all my paranoid ford one shots over into a one shot series though. I have about 70 fic posts on here.

What’s your total word count on AO3

180,212. Half of which all comes from Gotham Falls which isn’t a surprise.

How many fandoms have you written for and what are they?

Mainly just Gravity Falls.

I wouldn’t really count the other stuff I’ve done because it’s only been 1 fic, and that was it really. R.ise of the Guardians, O.utlast:Whistleblower, S.anders Sides. N.aruto and D.eath Note if you wanna go way back.

What are your top 5 fics by kudos?

1. Even Stone Crumbles 2. I Think I Saw You 3. Gotham Falls 4. A Blinded Eye for a Blinded Eye 5. Please Come

I’m pretty happy ITISY is up there since that’s kind of my ‘best series work’, Blinded Eye too, that one’s been a lot of fun to write because it’s a ficlet series.

Kind of really thrown that the Even Stone Crumbles one shot is the hightest one though, dang people really just wanted to see Ford cry huh, I can accomodate that.

Do you respond to comments? Why or why not?

Uh... rarely.

Basically, it’s something where creators responding to me got me nervous so I didn’t generally do it as a creator myself until I found out some consider it polite to respond and since then I’ve been making an effort of doing it going forward.

I’m not online that often nowadays though so... I haven’t done it much.

Wanna emphasize tho how much I THRIVE off of comments and that I appreciate them even if I didn’t reply to them. Genuinely I’ve made fics a higher priority bc a comment revitalized my passion for the fic.

What’s the fic you’ve written with the angstiest ending?

Most of my paranoid one shots wind up with angsty endings where it’s implied that Ford just has to keep Living in it.

I had one where he woke up and thought Bill had Killed A Person while he was possessing him, and it leaves off an unsettling note.

Do you write crossovers? If so, what’s the craziest thing you’ve ever written?

Rarely. I wouldn’t consider myself a crossover person, which is funny because I have one exception for that and it IS Gotham Falls (which is the stan twins from gf inside of gotham from b.atman the animated series).

For the sake of the question though imma include rp for wildest thing I’ve ever done which was rp as Chris McLean from total drama island and hosted a game of ‘rabbit doubt’ (which is an angsty rp game where 1 person is a killer and is killing the other characters until they’re the only one left or the group discovers who it is). Players included bill, some undertale characters, and etc.

Have you ever received hate on a fic?

No. Worst I’ve ever gotten was slightly rude stuff.

Do you write smut? If so, what kind?

‘Rarely’ really is the word of the day here. Some g.ravity falls and some vamp oc content.

Have you ever had a fic stolen?

Nope.

Have you ever had a fic translated?

Nope.

Have you ever co-written a fic before?

No. Closest I’ve ever done has been rp. Remembered I co-wrote a fic with a friend when I was in middle school. Dual self-insert where the a.katsuki (from n.aruto) kidnapped us from our world and we wound up becoming ninjas.

What’s your all-time favorite ship?

hands down, B.illford. Manipulative and toxic is a ship dynamic I enjoy a lot.

Honorable second place B.lackice (J.ack Frost/P.itch Black) which i’ve been coming back to read fics for every long once in a while since 2013. Even if it’s only in spurts it is still technically the longest I’ve cared for a ship. (Surprisingly, I actually like this ship when Pitch genuinely reforms, kozmotis style)

(I don’t care about the vast majority of ships so not a hard competition here.)

What’s a WIP you want to finish but don’t think you ever will?

Gotham F- lol no, I’m determined to not die until I finish that bad boy.

Dear Stan(ford). Unfortunately, an easy answer. I’ve never gone back to finish it really, and it’s the lowest on the totem poles out of all my wips.

There’s nothing wrong with it, and it’s got good legs, but I think the slice-of-life sort of pace makes this harder for me to write especially with it being an episodic set up which gives me nothing much to jump to between each letter.

It’s a bit of a ‘as the mood strikes me’ but I always have something higher priority and I’m more invested in so the mood never strikes.

What are your writing strengths?

I’d like to think that once I’ve got a character down that I can do their dialogue really well and character interactions. Characterization in general.

Also tense scenes.

What are your writing weaknesses?

Fluff, casual conversations, new characters, fighting.

Whenever I try anything entirely light hearted I generally fall flat and it all comes out so stocky/woody.

New characters, if I don’t Know A Character Through and Have A True Feel for them, then I just flounder all over the place. I don’t know how to write if I don’t know what they’d be thinking and feeling past about how ANY person would think/feel.

Fighting - I mean hell, common weakness, same issue as fluff/slice-of-life I just feel like I’m pushing words. Half the time I can get in a groove with it, but other times it’s - arm hit wall, punch go to face but miss.

What are your thoughts on writing dialogue in other languages in a fic?

Yeah, more than fine. If the 2nd language becomes plot important then I think you should either include translation or mark the language as multilingual, but yeah nah.

I’m someone that has to know what it’s saying even if it’s not Plot Important so I prefer the translations regardless (if google translate won’t get the point across for me).

What was the first fandom you wrote for?

N.aruto.

See above for mention of that self insert a.katsuki kidnapping fic.

We posted it on quizilla, and it’s a shame it’s gone because it was actually fun to read from what I remember.

What’s your favorite fic you’ve ever written?

.... That’s a hard decision.

My baby is Gotham Falls, always has been. I’ve reached a difficult point on it though because I’m at a point where I’m bringing in mmm 6 new characters (B.atman villains) which I’m trying to bring in over the next 10 chapters PLUS it’s going to be with fight/action scenes probably every other chapter if not nearly every chapter - both of which are really hard for me to write. I adore it probably the most and it is easily the most I’ve worked on any fic, but it’s also my biggest challenge. (And it holds some of my oldest writing which as always can hurt to read when you’re better now, but NO way am i updating 60k of old work).

Then I love doing p.aranoid ford fics, they’re my favorite go to. Writing A Prime P.aranoid Ford fic that just flows out is one of my favorite things.

Alternatively - ITISY because it’s definitely my top 5 story concepts and one of my best executions of something wasn’t a one shot.

I’m tagging @pinesbrosfalls, @fexalted, @novantinuum and whoever else may like to do this. Sorry if I double tagged and no pressure to do it of course.

#long post #tag meme #ask game #fic talk #fordachat

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charcubed · 3 years

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I agree with your opinion on ?no thing and wanted to ask what do you think of jackles saying his number 1 reservation about 10.05 was destiel mention. People also use that as a proof that he is/was homophobic, which I tbh can't agree with, bc there's like a million reasons someone can dislike a ship involving their character and it's not fair to immediately make the worst conclusions possible? Idk, can you share your opinion on that?

Part 2: Forgot to add: and even saying that those reservations mean he dislikes the ship is already an assumption anyway - 10.05 anon

Hi anon!

First thing I’m going to say is that I think it’s frankly bonkers for anyone, in any fandom, to call someone homophobic for not loudly supporting or maybe not understanding a gay ship. Of course this is a blanket statement and in some ways it can still depend on the situation, because could someone be outright homophobic about a queer ship? Sure. But that’s not always (and tbh, probably rarely) the case in situations like this. As you said, there are a million reasons someone can dislike a ship or simply not understand fandom culture with that kind of stuff; if one is unfamiliar with it, it does take a certain level of PR coaching to understand it more fully. I’ll go back to that though.

I looked around for ages, and for the life of me I can’t find a source on Jensen saying that the Destiel mention was his number one reservation. If that was something he said, can you (or anyone reading this lol) point me to a source?

All I know of–and found in my search again–is this video / article, where he talked about his initial reaction to the episode.

"I didn't have a positive reaction," Jensen Ackles told E! News. "The first time in I think 200 scripts I went and sat down in the showrunners office and said, ‘What in god's name are you doing?! Why? I need to understand why this is happening.'"

It took some convincing from executive producer Jeremy Carver for Ackles to finally come around to the idea.

"He gave very eloquent answers and did a great job of explaining why we were doing what we were doing," Ackles said. "I guess I had been aware of this 'fan fiction' for a while and I felt like maybe if I ignored it, it would eventually go away. When I read it in the script that is what I do for a living and is my work—I'm very protective of these characters and the story and I think we have a right to be—I wasn't angry. I just wanted to understand why and what was the message we were ultimately sending with this script and story. By the end of it, I felt good and it gave me all the confidence I needed. It was better than I could have ever hoped."

He continued, "I never should have even sat down in that office, so Jeremy, I'm sorry."

So from the perspective of this quote (if that is indeed the quote in question):

No part of this is anti-Destiel lol. I think it’s very clear what he meant by having concerns about this episode. I’d even go as far as to say that if he has said something about worrying about the Destiel name drop (if there’s a source on that I don’t know about), then it was still in this context: he wanted to know what message they were sending with this story.

I think it’s also key to remember that he’d been aware of fanfic and ignoring it. Why? Because he was also primarily aware of w*ncest fic and J2 tinhatters and the like. There’s a sordid history there, and it’s not unrealistic to say that it caused problems. That was Jensen’s first and primary encounter with fanfic and shipping as concepts, and it makes sense that his method was trying to ignore it and not focus on it.

Then, the flip side: maybe he didn’t want the fans to feel ridiculed either. What kind of message were they sending with this episode? aka is this going to be a nod to fans, or be seen as making fun of them or even getting their hopes up about a ship?

Then clearly things were explained to him, and he understood, and felt good about it. That counts for a lot. After that conversation, he clearly liked 10x05 and often said as much in other interviews too.

Overall, look, ultimately... I don’t know Jensen as a person, obviously. I wouldn’t ever claim to. But I think he seems to be the kind of person who just doesn’t like being back into a corner, especially very publicly such as at conventions. I think he–like all other actors–know they don’t write the stories and can’t promise things on behalf of the writers’ rooms. This applies to any instances people dredge up across the board.

I think he also–especially in the early days–didn’t understand what fandom wanted from him when they asked him leading questions about Destiel... because even at the best of times sometimes fandom doesn’t know what they want, and because without being coached in the best kind of responses no one would know how to answer perfectly especially back then. A mere 5, 6, 7 years ago, social media was still growing, talk of queer rep was still actively evolving and becoming louder, and fans were becoming emboldened (not necessarily in a bad way) to demand more of stories–but that didn’t mean everyone (especially actors) were engaged or educated on what that all meant for the ways they had to respond including on the spot.

SPN season 10 aired in 2014. Same sex marriage wasn’t legalized country-wide in the US until 2015. Lexa died in The 100 in 2016, and I mention this to put in perspective where queer rep conversations were at the time, using a marker many people know about.

Is it so surprising that an actor in a show from the early 2000s–with the baggage of w*ncest shipping debacles, network pressures, inability to speak for writers, and already many years’ worth of playing a character who felt personal to him–wouldn’t have known that fandom wanted to hear the exact phrasing of “I’m not sure Destiel is where the story is going but all interpretations are valid and if you think Dean is bi then of course he is” anytime he was asked a question practically designed to trip him up?

It’s not homophobia to have a cocktail of concerns surrounding a topic like that, in context like that, and especially in very public spaces like conventions. (Homophobia is shit like “not everything is about the gays, okay gay people?” Lol.) There are many reasons an actor could dislike a ship, but even more so, there are many reasons an actor may not understand fandom culture or not know how to perfectly address a ship / queer question because they didn’t know what the fans wanted to hear.

Basically, in summary: I agree with you and I’ve never personally seen anything from the backlog of history that Jensen’s said that struck me as either homophobic (a big word people should stop slinging around!!) or deliberately anti-Destiel with malice.

#asks #anonymous #jensen ackles

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