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outofangband · 6 months

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Winter in Doriath HCs

Note: I referenced a few of my earlier HCs in this but they’re definitely not necessary to read for this! There is more in the Doriath tag for anyone interested!

Elves and winter general HCs

As always please feel free to ask more or give a specific area to talk about, these are fairly random!

The girdle of Melian provides protection against the harshest weather however, Melian intentionally does not exert significant control over the climate. Snow falls lightly throughout the colder months, many trees lose their leaves and most flowers do not bloom until the stirring. Average temperatures for the coldest months are around 4-7 degrees C or 40-45 degrees Fahrenheit.

Menengroth maintains comfortable temperatures throughout the year. Both the protection of the caves and the magic of Melian defend against extreme cold or heat. A small population of Doriath live in Menengroth in the winter only.

There is a section around Menengroth, part of Melian’s gardens, that is warm throughout the year. This has both outdoor and indoor sections and there are fruit trees in the outdoor section that are more or less free to take from (though some of the species are…unique or possibly dangerous and plenty choose not to take this risk)

Food in the winter comes from this, from foraging and the cultivation that is done throughout the forest, from the rivers, from private collections and storage, and, depending on the time, through trade.

Many of the Iathrim eat little in the winter and some even enter periods of contemplation and reduced movement almost akin to a sort of hibernation. This is also similar to the trances I described as part of Doriath’s summer solstice celebration however longer and less intense. Consciousness is not necessarily reduced or altered during these.

(I will make an entire post just about this to go with my posts about the Ainur and food but in essence, I do not believe elves can go indefinitely without food and water however energy, nutrients and strength are conserved and processed differently than in humans and they can go significantly longer without adverse consequences however they will eventually begin to suffer from them. Like humans, water is more important than food. Many elves eat primarily for pleasure. Maedhros, his life was extended without food or water through Morgoth’s power, similar to how Húrin’s was)

On that note there is also a winter solstice tradition. Like the summer one, many travel for it to obtain privacy, often sitting in trees or upon hilltops by the northern border for days. Most of the week long winter solstice event is significantly more somber than the summer one and there is a day dedicated to mourning. At the end however there is a joyous feast in Menengroth.

Doriath marks the new year in the beginning of the elven season between autumn and winter, Fading. I mentioned their record keepers preserve petals from the first flowers of each year and this tradition is related to other Sindar, Silvan and Avari traditions but their actual new year is in Fading. It is a also a reflective celebration where the sun and moon are honored (after they exist of course) and the past mourned.

Despite the more somber winter celebrations, mentions of snow and winter in song and poetry are commonly playful and whimsical rather than melancholy. Less direct Winter symbology in Doriath include constellations, certain species of ferns (which resemble frost patterns), wood white (butterflies), and maple trees.

Like the Sindar outside of Doriath, the patterns of migrating birds are often remembered and used for indications of weather changes.

#the silmarillion #the children of húrin #Doriath #beleriand #musing and meta #mentioned #(because of my note about elves and food)#Maedhros #Húrin

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growingingreenwood · 2 years

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Headcanon that the Silvan Elves in Greenwood the Great have a truly astonishing amount of ‘folk remedies’ for an equally astonishing amount of purposes and remedies. This is largely due to the fact that most (if not all of their ancestors) have always lived in Middle Earth, a place where even though time could not take their lives from them, there still remained many other things around that could.

And wanted to.

Including but limited to: Melkor & his creatures of darkness and all the repercussions that come with them, infection, blood loss, poisoning, starvation, other extreme physical harm.

Since they did not have the help or protection of the Valar, or even Melian they had to start coming up with their own ways to treat and protect themselves against the hostile world around them. Then make sure that their children and grandchildren never forget the wisdom and knowledge that might one day save their lives or the life of a loved one.

As the ages slowly passed their connection with the land around them continued to deepen, and the seeds of knowledge the first ancestors planted bloomed endlessly with new ideas, useless, and remedies. And whatever they didn’t discover or figure out themselves chances are one of their Avari allies did and shared the information.

By the time the third age rolls around the Silvan Elves of Greenwood have many aspects of these ideas so ingrained into the fibers of their culture they don't even notice them anymore. Except maybe when those outside of their realm are visibly confused, taken aback, or judgmental by something that they do.

Which, admittedly, doesn't happen very often for the combined reasons that the Silvan elves are just generally secretive about the things that have helped their people withstand the evil of Arda and the increasingly distrustful relationship between Greenwood and the other elven realms.

I also think that the Greenwood Elves would refuse to ‘prove’ to the other Elven Realms that their advice and remedies actually work, so when they suggest something and are met with disbelief they just kind of shrug and go ‘whatever, your life. Or death.”

I don’t think that this would really change much until after Celebrian marries Elrond, who always takes the Silvan Elves advice at face value (medical or otherwise) At least until proven to be false.

So if Elrond’s struggling to keep somebody alive due to rapid blood loss, Legolas plucks something from his shelves and goes: “Boil this until it's limp and then get him to drink the water. It will slow his bleeding quickly.”

Elrond’s like: “You heard the man! Boil it now!”

Elladan: “But Ada, normally we dry it and use it to prevent infection?”

Elrond: “And Legolas says that if you boil it and get him to drink the water it will slow the bleeding, since when can one plant not accomplish two things?”

Legolas: “If you crack the stem and rub the paste that comes out onto your skin it will numb it for upwards of an hour.”

Elrond: “Three things!”

I also think that's part of what makes Elrond such a successful healer, he’s able to collect knowledge from basically all cultures and races in Arda and compile it all together in one place.

#Greenwood headcanons #haleighs greenwood #Greenwood #Greenwood the great #Mirkwood #Silvan Elves #Silvan headcanons #silvan culture #tolkien headcanon #silm headcanons #silm #Tolkien #Tolkien headcanons

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hollowwhisperings · 1 year

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Elven Maturity (Tolkien)

an interesting thing about Tolkien's elves is how historical they are: they are the living history of Middle-Earth as they know it (dwarven records & the avari memories likely differ).

the noldo and silvan elves met in LOTR are OLD. so old that Legolas could very plausibly be interpreted as having suffered being treated as "the baby" for, like, four hundred years.

(i assume that Arwen & her brothers are older simply because their parents became a couple before Thranduil became a king)

the age of Tolkien's elves thusly makes it difficult to discern a true "age of maturity": Galadriel was born before Arda had a sun, Elrond's dad is a star, Elrond married Galadriel's daughter and her grandkids look as old/young as she does when the Fellowship meets them. Arwen was an "adult" by mannish standards when Estel came to live at Imladris but her subsequent move & stay with Grandma Galadriel spares readers the awkward thought of Arwen grooming Aragorn for her husband.

This fixation on Arwen is Key because she is of the Peredhel, the half-elven. The first known peredhel is technically Luthien, born of maia and elf, but it is her child with a human who is the first "true" instance of a peredhel in the sense of a "Schrodinger's Immortal".

The age of elves becomes very pertinent to the modern reader when Dior is seemingly orphaned, married to an elven princess(?), has three kids with her, gets abandoned(?) by his maia grandmother due to his grandfather's violent death & left with said grandfather's throne... by the age of 33. not as in "33 years of The Trees" or "33 years in The Lamps"... 33 solar years. Mannish years. THIRTY THREE.

Dior was the first peredhel to be both mortal (human) and immortal (elf): Luthien was the Tolkien equivalent of a demigod but it's unlikely that that changed the expectations for her, in terms of lifestages or maturity.

Dior though? He was raised by isolationist elves during a Politically Tense period of time and no love story is alluded to, between he and Nimloth. The elves Dior was raised amongst did not think highly of humans nor dwarves (nor other elves) and Dior was the first half demi-god, half human elf known. Did they think that his mannish blood made him quicker to mature & doomed to mortality? Did Dior or any of the persons involved with his marriage have enough experience with ELVEN children, nevermind human children to compare against, to discern how "mature" Dior was or wasn't?

I cannot think of any elven romance that did not take at least a decade or three to result in a promise of "forever" or 'til mortality. This makes the prospect of a 30 year old King Dior, newly father to twin peredhels, a disturbing image.

Then we have Dior's daughter, Elwing, meet the only other peredhel not related to her: Earendil, son of Idril Celebrindal and the human Tuor.

Where Elwing was raised by elves & recently orphaned, Earendil had grown up in Gondolin with both an immortal & mortal parent to mind him. Earendil and Elwing were both 23 when they wed: this I find easier to accept, with the extent of their shared experiences of being refugees and not-wholly elven. that Tuor, a human mortal, is also canonically present helps significantly with my comfort zone: no alarms rang in his head when these two 23 year olds got hitched and thus, by mannish standards, they were two consenting adults.

HOWEVER.

we still do not know what ELVES think makes a wholly mature elf - the Noldor elves that these peredhel live amongst are still adapting to the "quickness" of mortal lifespans, of life beyond Valinor. There is, presumably, still a majority amongst the Noldo who predate the first sunrise: whether the silvans hold alternate expectations of maturity, based on living amongst mortals all this time, is unknown. I would safely consider Earendil to be am adult by human standards: he may have also had the mental faculties of an adult elf as well, thus able to recognise and understand an Eternal Committment.

...Elwing probably doesn't. She was raised amongst elves and likely expected to be exactly like Dior and he like Luthien: part-divine and thus, potentially, mature by default. Her actions upon meeting her childhood nightmares - the Sons of Feanor - seem more in-line with a traumatised youth than a traditionally "wise" elf (or human): she jumped out of a window with a [very definitely cursed] holy lightbulb without much thought to the two small children she left behind.

which... her childhood nightmare was "The Sons Of Feanor Stole My Parents And Brothers": Elwing yeeting herself from a tower does Exactly That, all to keep her "rightful inheritance" (i.e. Luthien's winning a silmaril off Morgoth by sing-off/right of conquest & Elwing being Luthien' direct descendant).

the only way i can read Elwing's actions - did SHE know she could turn into a bird when she yeeted herself? did she ever plan on, y'know, coming back after her understandable panic response? no? straight off to alleged elf heaven? kidnap fam it is then - is as Elwing, young adult of several species and never truly able to be any bar one, being out of her depth and going full maia (as her great-grandmother melian before her).

Elrond taking a few centuries to get together with Celebrian, Arwen then taking a few decades to figure things out with Estel... the difference between these later love stories in contrast to Dior and Elwing (& to elf/elf romances) is Very Striking.

Tolkien's elves can get very, very old. Their societies developed with the core concept of their getting old & living eternally. Elves cannot simply marry on a whim - they had better be certain on their spouse or they're in for a very, very taxing eternity (the Avari have different customs but any cross-cultural exchanging of notes seems to have failed miserably in the face of The Maeglin Situation).

The first [mortal&immortal] peredhel died before the weight of immortality could be felt; the second peredhels all left the realms of mortals very abruptly; the third generation of peredhels had entirely unique circumstances that resulted in Elrond being Elrond, Father Figure to generations of Mortal Men and Designated Sane Voice in every crisis.

I wonder what Elrond would think of his grandfather Dior if he were to ever meet him: Elrond has spent several immortal lifetimes learning all things peredhel. I struggle to think of Dior leaving the halls of Mandos, of Dior adapting easily to life amongst the truly immortal.

And if I consider 33 to be "too young" for a Peredhel to swear eternity to an immortal elf... what does that mean for the wholly elven Maeglin, whose orphaning at 80 solar years lead to his being RAISED in the utterly alien Gondolin? Maeglin, whose tween crush on his cousin (who is, if not "older than the sun" very certainly "old as heck" at this time) became blown entirely out of proportion due to his very existence being a Scandalous Tragedy to the Noldo.

Maeglin dying at 190 is considered "very young for an elf". What humans was Doriath in the habit of noticing for them to consider 30 year old Dior an eligible bachelor?

#in which i wildly and egregiously go ham at probably unintentional implications of king thingol being genuinely monstrous #the peredhel #tolkien meta #tolkien elves #silm #dior of doriath #luthien #elwing #eldritch peredhel #earendil #mundane peredhel #logistics of immortality #maeglin was a baby #dior was even more baby #thingol is sus

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mybrainsworldsblog · 1 year

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Nimrodel Learns of Thranduil

Nimrodel had just returned from her evening walk and was preparing her campfire when Frida, her great Wolf friend, approached. Nimrodel was delighted to see Frida. It has been several days since her last visit.

“Frida! How wonderful to see you! Will you join me by the fire this evening? I will not make the flames too high, I do know you do not prefer that…” As Frida approached, Nimrodel could see that Frida’s demeanor was weary. “What is this burden that you carry? Are all things well in the forest this evening?”

“Greetings, Nimrodel, I do come with news.” Frida padded over and sat before Nimrodel ears perked, golden eyes glowing. “There is a very special visitor of King Amroth approaching the forest. He comes with members of the court, guards, and a small army unit, although they do not seem to be preparing for battle.”

“Do you know who these visitors are to Amroth?”

“Their fathers fought and died together in the terrible Battle of Dagorlad during the War of the Last Alliance while battling Sauron. It is said that the same great sorrow from that time hangs heavy in their hearts, and the light in their eyes grow dark when they look to the south, ever fearful of a return of such evil. They are haunted by such loss and reign accordingly. The Elvenking that approaches is named Thranduil son of Oropher and he rules the lands of Mirkwood.”

“Mirkwood?” Nimrodel wrinkled her nose. Mirkwood sounded like a terrible place.

“Thranduil’s homelands and story are linked to your own, Nimrodel. It is time you must learn of these things so that you may be prepared for the days ahead. Trouble is brewing in the world beyond the forest once more.” Frida motioned for Nimrodel to sit. Once Nimrodel was settled on a nearby patch of moss Frida continued, “Mirkwood was once called Greenwood the Great. There was a time when the forest formed the vast primeval woodland which covered most of Middle-earth during the Years of the Trees. Greenwood and Lothlórien may have even connected across the Anduin. The Eldar Elves passed through these lands on their journey to Valinor and it was first populated by the Nandor who were unwilling to cross the Misty Mountains. The mountains were said to be even more treacherous in those days. The Nandor Elves settled in the wooded valleys of the river Anduin. They grew in numbers and were joined by wandering Avari, becoming known as Silvan or Wood-elves. This is your lineage, Nimrodel.

“In the Second Age, the Sinda prince, Oropher, left Lindon to Greenwood where he was taken by the Silvan Elves as their Lord. Not all have resisted the newcomers as you have. The Silven Elves of Greenwood took the Sindarian language and in turn the new Sindarian lord delighted in many Silven customs, eagar as they were to return to a simpler time. Oropher built his halls at Amon Lanc in the southern forest and was accepted as the leader of the Wood-elves of Greenwood, later the Elves of Mirkwood, forming the Woodland Realm.

“At the beginning of the Third Age, Thranduil replaced Oropher as king of the Woodland Realm. The the Silvan population of Greenwood was devastated during the Battle of Dagorlad and became concentrated in the hills then known as Emyn Duir. Apparitions of the dead still linger at a terrible place called the Dead Marshes. Is is a similar story to Amroth’s rise to power in Lothlórien. Same story, different forest regions.

“At the beginning of the second millennium of the Third Age, an enigmatic being came to Amon Lanc in the south of Greenwood the Great. There, he built the stronghold known as Dol Guldur and was knowns as the Necromancer, who was indeed revealed to be Sauron. Fom his fortress tower a shadow of nightshade began to spread across the woodlands so that the Elves began to refer to Greenwood as Mirkwood- the forest under nightshade. Thranduil led his people north, away from the darkness, and built an underground fortress to protect his people. That is where he lives today.”

“How terrible,” Nimrodel felt a newfound sorrow for Amroth and all the people who live to experience such things. It is not right, she thought to herself. Not right at all. She did not know Thranduil, but she thought he should be able to live where he wishes instead of being forced to migrate to escape evil that would hurt those he cares for. She could understand the urge to want to flee instead of fight back an evil that comes back time and again, bring more destruction each time. Nimrodel began to understand that Sauron’s darkness will continue to spread and that there are people who have been fighting his evil back for longer than she even imagined.

“Frida…do you think the darkness would have spread here already if it were not for the sacrifice of Elves like Amroth and Thranduil…” Nimrodel’s sat up straight up. Her heart filled with ice as she realized the full scope of the monstrous loss over ages to countless beings that should have been enjoying sunrises and swimming with friends in clean waters. She saw real scorched earth war in her mind for the first time and was nearly rendered unconscious from the pain. “So many have given their lives so that we may enjoy ours- completely unaware.” Nimrodel was filled with shame for hating the Sindar newcomers. While she protested and bask in her carefree life, they lived with unimaginable horror. Death and things that were infinitely worse. Nimrodel had not really considered death before. Not on such a horrendous scale. To think, Nimrodel had thought King Amroth and his kind the terrorists. They were instead defending faultless creatures of the world. Sauron and his forces were the only enemy. Nimrodel placed her face in her hands and cried for a long time.

Frida watched Nimrodel make connections based on this new information. Her heart broke for the loss Nimrodel’s innocence and she was sorry that she was responsible for that, even if she was just the messenger of such terrible news, but Frida had wanted Nimrodel to know who this approaching stranger was in the scheme of things. For some reason, Frida felt this was an urgent matter but could not reason why. Perhaps time would tell.

If it were up to Frida, their days would be spent curled up by waterside discussing the serious business of shapes in clouds. She wined and curled beside Nimrodel to comfort her. Nimrodel buried herself in Frida’s soft grey and white fur and allowed the tears to flow. After a long time, Nimrodel’s sobs began to break and then recede. They sat with each other and with their pain, feeling the entirety of it, hardening themself to the anguish, and honoring those who have suffered for quite some time before they continued.

“Thank you for telling me this. You are right, I should not hide from important matters of the world any longer. I am seeing that the world is bigger than this forest and I should care when others are hurting. I would want others to come to my aid if it were me or my friends that were hurting.”

Frida loved Nimrodel for this and said so by touching her forehead to Nimrodel’s.

“How long until the Elvenking arrives?”

“He will be here by tomorrow’s nightfall.”

“So soon?”

“He is not a threat. Not that we think. I just wanted you to be aware that he may cross your path and who he is.”

“Thank you, Frida. You are a good friend.”

Nimrodel experienced the first real nightmares of her life that night. Not even Frida nor any other members of the pack could calm her sleep. Shadows crept like smoke monsters through the trees killing every living thing in their path. Innocent creatures rendered wretched cried out for help to no avail. Giant spiders made themself at home in pockets of forests that once flushed with life. Deep below the earth, a monstrous inferno awoke and folk flee in every direction across the lands. Nimrodel tossed and whimpered drawing concern from the woodland creatures so that they called for the Great White Wolf, Haun to stand watch, which he did, and the nightmares continued.

The next morning, Nimrodel awoke with sunshine on her face but her heart was still filled with darkness. Her hair and skin were both grimy from sweat and thrashing about in her sleep. Frida helped her bathe in the clear waters and instructed the squirrel-folk to pick her favorite nuts and berries. The animals were keen to help and before long fox, badger, and even a young bear all joined forces with the goal of cheering Nimrodel. Frida encouraged her to set her trepidation aside for the time being and prepare for the coming of the Elvenking. There was time for worry and that time has not come yet. Nimrodel was eventually able to do a decent job of this and the forest creatures rejoiced when they saw her bathed, fed, and laughing at their antics once more despite herself.

Evening soon came and Nimrodel noticed that the woodland creatures had grown quiet. She looked around nervously for an explanation. The birds had stopped singing. Nimrodel looked to Frida.

"Nimrodel, The Elvenking approaches."

*The writing is mine. The artwork is not.

*Just starting out here. I welcome your constructive feedback. I hope you have as much fun reading it and I did writing it.

#thranduil #king thranduil #nimrodel #the hobbit #lotr #new account #new writter #new writers on tumblr #amroth #silmarillion

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somelotrnerd · 3 months

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A Guide to Tolkien's Elves

If you’re like me, it can be really hard to keep all the different groups of Elves straight in your mind. Therefore, I thought it would be helpful to break down all the clans of the Elves, with explanations of how they came to be.

The journey of the Elves through Middle-earth

Chart of the clans of Elves and when groups split off

The Elves first awaken in Cuiviénen, in the east of Middle-earth, in the Year of the Trees (YT) 1050. There are a total of 144 of them. They call themselves Quendi, which means “Who Speak with Voices,” as they had initially met no other living thing that spoke or sang. These Elves consist of three clans. 14 make up the Minyar, which means “Firsts.” 56 are the Tatyar, meaning “Seconds.” The largest group, at 74, is the Nelyar, meaning “Thirds.” The Nelyar also refer to themselves as the Lindar, or “Singers,” because they are known for their beautiful voices (or maybe because they don’t care to be known as “Thirds”).

After Oromë discovers the Elves in YT 1085, he invites them to live in Valinor. A little more than half of the Elves decide to follow the huntsman, including all 14 of the Minyar, half of the Tatyar, and 46 of the Nelyar. The Elves who decide to make the journey are collectively called the Eldar, or “People of the Stars.” The 82 that remain behind are known as the Avari, which means “the Unwilling.” Many of the Avari are fearful and distrusting of Oromë and the Valar after hearing the lies of Melkor - also known as Morgoth, the first Dark Lord. While some of this group would eventually make their way westward, it is believed that some are captured by Melkor; who tortures and corrupts them to create the race of Orcs.

Back to the Eldar; we have the Minyar, Tatyar, and the Nelyar making the journey. During this journey, Oromë gives each clan new names. The Minyar are renamed to the Vanyar, meaning “Fair Ones.” The Tatyar are renamed to the Ñoldor, meaning “Deep Ones” or “Those with Knowledge.” Lastly, the Nelyar are renamed to the Teleri, meaning “Those Who Come Last.” Oromë leads the Eldar north of the Sea of Helcar and they pass by the ruins of the battle between Melkor and the Valar. At this point, some of the Elves flee out of fear and nothing else is known about them, though it’s possible they return to join the Avari.

Years later, Oromë and the Eldar pass through Greenwood. They rest by the shores of the Anduin River, while the huntsman tries to determine how he will get the Elves over the Hithaeglir, later known as the Misty Mountains. These mountains are considerably taller in the early days of Middle-earth. In YT 1115, Oromë returns and takes them by the High Pass, the very same pass that would border Rivendell ages later.

As most of the group presses on, a group of the Teleri goes south. This group comes to be known as the Nandor, meaning “Those Who Go Back.” From the Nandor, we get the Silvan Elves - or Wood Elves - who would inhabit the later realms of Mirkwood and Lórien (Lothlórien). Later, some of the Nandor would make their way into Beleriand and live in Ossiriand. These Elves are known as the Laiquendi, or Green Elves.

Once again, we return to the Eldar. They pass through Eriador, on what would one day be known as the Great West Road. In YT 1125, the Vanyar and the Ñoldor cross the Ered Luin and reach Beleriand. The Teleri, meanwhile, are lagging behind in Eriador. As we know by now, if you don’t keep up with the main pack, you’re going to get a new name; so this is the actual moment when the Nelyar come to be known as the Teleri. In YT 1128, the Teleri finally enter Beleriand (east of Gelion). During this time, their leader Elwë (later known as Thingol) meets and falls in love with the Maia Melian in the forest of Nan Elmoth. Trapped in an enchantment of their own making, they would not be seen for over 200 years.

In YT 1132, the Vanyar and the Ñoldor are taken across the sea on Tol Eressëa, an island which the Vala Ulmo uses to ferry the Elves across the Belegaer. The Teleri are too far away and don’t hear the summons of Ulmo. In the meantime, some Teleri come to the shores of Beleriand, where they come to love the sea. Ulmo returns for the Teleri in YT 1150, and most of them take the trip to Valinor. However, some of the Teleri remain behind once again, becoming the Sindar - or Grey Elves. While some of the Sindar would settle in realms like Mithrim and Doriath, under a reappeared King Thingol, another group settles on the shores of Beleriand in a region called Falas. This group comes to be known as the Falathrim, and Círdan is their lord.

Meanwhile, in Aman, we now have the entire groups of the Vanyar and Ñoldor, as well as a group of the Teleri. These Teleri are also known by the name Falmari. Back in Middle-earth, all the clans of the Elves who do not make the journey to Valinor - that is the Avari, the Silvan Elves, the Laiquendi (Green Elves), the Sindar, and the Falathrim - are collectively known as the Moriquendi, the Elves of Darkness. These are not Dark Elves in the sense of being evil. They are simply Úmanyar, or “Not of Aman.” They are Dark Elves in the sense that they never beheld the Light of the Two Trees of Valinor.

Together, the Vanyar, Ñoldor, and the Falmari are called the Calaquendi - the Elves of Light or Light Elves, as they have seen the Light of the Two Trees and live in the Blessed Realm. These Elves would come to be known as the High Elves, according to the Dúnedain. While the Vanyar, and a handful of Ñoldor will remain in Aman forever, most of the Ñoldor would return to Middle-earth, and become among the most famous Elves of the coming ages - Fëanor, Fingolfin, Finrod, Galadriel, Turgon, Gil-galad, Celebrimbor, and so many others. Among the Sindar, we get Elves like Lúthien, Beleg, Thranduil, and Legolas. Of course, there will be a number of Elves who will be a mixture of these clans - like Elrond and his twin brother Elros, who are descended not only from the Vanyar, Ñoldor, and Sindar, but also a Maia, and all three houses of the Edain - the great Men of the First Age.

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elamarth-calmagol · 3 years

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What actually is LACE? (an informal essay)

What’s LACE?

Laws and Customs among the Eldar, or LACE, is the most popular section of the History of Middle Earth books. It's available online as a PDF here: http://faculty.smu.edu/bwheeler/tolkien/online_reader/T-LawsandCustoms.pdf . There’s a lot of LACE analysis in the fandom, Silmarillion smut fics are usually labeled “LACE compliant” or “not LACE compliant”, and I’ve been seeing the document itself show up in actual fics, meaning that the characters themselves are discussing it.

LACE is an unfinished, non-canonical essay split into several parts. It covers the sexuality of elves, which is mostly what people talk about. It also covers elvish naming (which I want to make a whole different post about), the speed at which elves grow up, changes that happen throughout their lives, their death and rebirth, and finally the legal and moral issues of Finwe remarrying after Miriel’s death. The discussion about rebirth conflicts with Tolkien’s later writings about Glorfindel’s re-embodiment, but to the best of my knowledge, LACE is the best or only source for most of the topics it covers.

However, LACE is not canon since it doesn’t show up in the Silmarillion. Counting all of the History of Middle Earth as canon is literally impossible, considering Tolkien contradicts himself all over the place. It is only useful because it has so much information that is never discussed in the actual canon. Many people consider it canon out of convenience.

Another important thing to remember is that, other than presumably the discussion of the growth of elvish children, the information is only supposed to apply to the Eldar (meaning the Vanyar, Noldor, Teleri, and Sindar) and not the dark-elves such as the Silvan elves and Avari.

The rest is behind the cut to avoid clogging your feeds.

Problems with LACE interpretations

But because it’s hidden in the History of Middle Earth (volume 10, Morgoth’s Ring), barely anyone actually gets the opportunity to read it. I don’t think most people are aware that you can get it online, so it doesn't get read much.

I feel like this leads to a handful of people saying something about LACE and everyone else going along with it. I definitely did this. I was amazed by all the things that were in the actual essay that nobody had ever told me about, or had told me incorrectly. For example, most people seem to believe that elves become married at the completion of sexual intercourse (whatever that means to the fic author). In fact, LACE explicitly says that elves must take an oath using the name of Eru in order to be legally married. Specifically:

It was the act of bodily union that achieved marriage, and after which the indissoluble bond was complete… [I]t was at all times lawful for any of the Eldar, being both unwed, to marry thus of free consent one to another without ceremony or witness (save blessings exchanged and the naming of the Name); and the union so joined was alike indissoluble.

I’ve seen a marriage oath being included in a few stories recently, but most writers leave out the oath entirely and just have sex be automatically equivalent to marriage. What would happen if elves had sex without swearing an oath? I don’t know, but I’d love to see it explored.

Then there’s a footnote that might explicitly deny the existence of transgender elves... or not, but I’ve literally only seen it mentioned once or twice. Overall, I feel like all of LACE is filtered through the handful of people who read it, and we’re missing out on a lot of metanalysis and interpretations that we could have because most fans never see the actual document.

Who wrote LACE?

I mean within the mythology of Middle Earth, of course. Since LACE appears in the History of Middle Earth and not the Silmarillion, we can be pretty sure that J.R.R. Tolkien himself wrote it and it wasn’t added to by Christopher Tolkien. But that’s not the question here. Remember that Tolkien’s frame narrative for all of his Middle Earth work is that he is a scholar of ancient times and is translating documents from Westron and Sindarin for modern audiences to read and understand. The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings come from the Red Book of Westmarch, and I believe The Silmarillion is meant to be Tolkien’s own writings based on his research (though it might also be an adaption of Bilbo’s “Translations from the Elvish”, but I haven't looked into that). So what does LACE come from?

Christopher Tolkien admits in his notes that he doesn’t know. He says, “It is clear in any case that this is presented as the work, not of one of the Eldar, but of a Man,” and I agree, because of the way it seems to be written as an ethnographic study rather than by someone who lives in the culture. Honestly, it talks too much about how elves are seen by Men (e.g. speculating that elf-children might look like the children of Men) to be written by an elf. This changes once it gets to the Doom of Finwe and Miriel, but that could be, and probably is, a story told to the writer by an elf who was there at the time.

Tolkien actually references Aelfwine in the second version of the text. The original story behind The Lost Tales, which was the abandoned first version of the Silmarillion, was that a man from the Viking period named Aelfwine/Eriol stumbled onto the Straight Road and found himself on Tol Eressea. He spoke to the elves and brought back their stories to England with him. So it makes a lot of sense that Aelfwine would also write about the lives and customs of the elves for an audience of his own people.

Does LACE exist in Middle Earth?

I keep finding fics where first age elves discuss “the Laws and Customs” openly, as if it’s a text in their own world. I usually get the impression that it was brought by the Noldor from Valinor. But did the document actually exist in that time period? For me, the answer is definitely not.

First of all, LACE was probably written by a Man, meaning it could not have dated back to Valinor in the years of the Trees, because Men hadn’t awaked yet. In fact, the closest thing to an established frame narrative for it is that it was written by Aelfwine, who comes from the time period around 1000 CE (though Tolkien doesn’t seem to have pinned him down). This is at least the fifth age, if not later.

But what if you don’t believe that it was written by a Man? It still couldn’t have been written in the First Age, because it discusses the way the relationship between elves’ bodies and souls changes as ages go by. For example:

As ages passed the dominance of their fear ever increased, ‘consuming’ their bodies... The end of this process is their ‘fading’, as Men have called it.

A lot of time has to go by in order for elves to get to the point of fading. As a bonus, here’s another reference to the perspective of Men. LACE also discusses the dangers that “houseless feas”, which are souls of elves who do not go to Mandos after their bodies died, pose to Men. How would they have known about that in the First Age? It further says that “more than one rebirth is seldom recorded” (which isn’t contradicted anywhere I know of), and that’s not something you would know during your life of joy in Valinor, where almost nobody dies. That’s something you learn after millennia of war. This has to be a document written well after the Silmarillion ends.

So what about the sex part? That’s all we care about, right? Well, it is entirely possible that this was written down by the elves and Aelfwine translated it (though my impression is that he mostly recorded stories told orally to him and that elves were not very much into writing, at least in Valinor where you could get stories directly from someone who experienced them). However, why would the elves write this down? They know how quickly their children grow up. They’ve seen actual marriages. They don’t need that described to them. And if they did have a specific document or story explaining the expectations of them when it comes to sex and marriage, why would they call it “Laws and Customs”? That’s a very strange name for a set of rules for conduct. I’m sure they had a list of laws written out somewhere in great detail, like our own state or national laws (that seems very in character for the Noldor, at least). But I seriously doubt that those laws are what we’ve been given to read. LACE is not an elvish or Valinoran document.

Is LACE prescriptive or descriptive?

Here’s the other big question I’m interested in. Prescriptive means that the document describes the way people should behave. Descriptive means that it describes how people do behave. And the more I worldbuild for Middle Earth and the culture of elves, the more I want to say that LACE is prescriptive in its discussion of sex, marriage, and gender roles.

But wait. I’ve been saying for paragraphs that I think LACE is Aelfwine or another Man’s ethnographic study of elvish culture. Then it has to be descriptive, right?

Does it? How long do we think Aelfwine stayed with the elves? Did he wait fifty years to see a child grow up? Did he get to witness a wedding ceremony? Did he meet houseless fea? I don’t think he could have done all of that. Maybe a different Man who spent his entire life with the elves could, but then when was this written? When the elves were still marrying and having children in Middle Earth or when so much time had gone by that they had begun to fade already?

Whoever wrote this was told a lot of information by elves instead of experiencing it firsthand, the same way he heard the stories from the First Age from the elves instead of being there. Maybe it was one elf who talked to him, maybe several different ones. But did those elves accurately describe their society the way it was, give him the easiest description, or explain the way it was supposed to be? If I was describing modern-day America, would I discuss premarital sex or just our dating and marriage customs? Maybe people would come away from a talk with me thinking that moving in together equated to marriage for Americans in the early 21st century. And I don’t even have an agenda to show America in a certain way, I'm just bad at explaining. Did the elves talking to what may have been the first Man they had seen in millennia have an agenda in the way they presented themselves?

Or did the writer himself have an agenda? Imagine going to see these beautiful, mythical, perfect beings, and you find out that they behave in the same immoral ways Men do. Do you want to share the truth back home? Or do you leave out things that don't match your worldview? Did Aelfwine come back wanting to tell people what elves were really like? Or did he want to say “this is how you can be holy and perfect like an elf”?

Anyone studying the Age of Exploration will tell you that Europeans neber wrote about new cultures objectively, and often things were made up to fit the writer’s idea of what savages looked like. For example, my Native American history teacher in college told a story of how explorers described one tribe who (sensibly) didn't wear clothes as cannibals, because cannibalism and going around naked went together in their minds and not because of any actual incident. Unbiased scholarship barely existed yet. Even Tolkien was extremely biased and tended to be imperialistic, as we all know. There’s absolutely no reason to think that Aelfwine wasn’t biased in his own way. (Of course, now we have to consider what biases a Danish or English man from the centuries around 1000 would have when it comes to things like gender roles. I assume he would have been more into divorce and female warriors than the elves are said to be.)

But is that what Tolkien intended? Probably not. He probably wanted LACE to be descriptive. But he also never got much of a chance to analyse the essay after the fact, which might have led to him discussing its accuracy and even the exact issues I just pointed out about explorers. Anyway, we know he's biased, and honestly, what he intended has never slowed down the fandom before.

Conclusion

In short, I take LACE to be a prescriptive document describing the way elvish culture is supposed to be, not a blueprint I have to stick to in order to correctly portray elves. I also don’t believe the document that’s available for us to read existed even in the early Fourth Age, where The Lord of the Rings leaves off. There maybe have been some document outlining the moral behavior of elves, as a set of laws, but thats not the Laws and Customs we have.

Of course, canon is up to you to interpret. If you want Feanor discussing LACE with someone back in Valinor, go ahead. If you want to throw out LACE entirely, go ahead. It’s not even a canonical essay. All of this analysis is honestly useless when you consider the fact that no part of LACE exists in any canonical book.

But that’s Tolkien analysis for you.

#lotr #silmarillion #tolkien #laws and customs of the eldar #history of middle earth #silm #analysis #meta #headcanon #long post #mine

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undercat-overdog · 3 years

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So I think it is interesting and novel to have a Celebrimbor who is half Sindar and wasn’t born in Aman, like in your fic ‘Shall These Bones Live’. What do you think about how it is for your Celebrimbor (and others like Celebrian) to have adapt to living in a place that is strange and new to them? (Unlike a lot of fics where Celebrimbor is returning to a place that was once his home.) Do you feel that Celebrimbor would have been excited to explore new places, and do you think that elves like him miss Middle Earth more than others who were originally from Aman? Since their true home will always be across the sea and forever lost to them?

Thank you for the ask, anonymous! <3 <3

I admit, I, uh, got a bit long winded, because I have so many thoughts on elves from Middle-earth in Valinor (this touches on a few of my headcanons/extrapolations on Middle-earth elves in general in the first half; Celebrimbor himself is in the second).

Short answer, yes. Misses Middle-earth, doesn't see Aman as home. At least not for the first few millenia.

That idea, that feeling among the Elves who came from Middle-earth, that knowledge that they will never go home again and the land they are now in is so different. I think the attitudes of the Middle-earth Elves vary a lot, but wishing to be back in Middle-earth is a common attitude (Dúnedhil, Silvan, and Avari alike). Beleriand might be exile to the Amanyarin Noldor, but Aman is Exile to the elves born in Middle-earth. I’m not sure how much it’s considered, but there are a lot of people who would not be in Aman had they had the choice; many Elves didn’t end up in Aman willingly: plenty of those who wanted to stay in ME would still have chosen Mandos and the potential of rebirth over life as a houseless spirit, or who, like Celebrían, left because they would otherwise fade; Mandos/Aman as the least bad option. Though there are also lots of elves of Middle-earth who were happy to go to Aman and longed for it! I don’t want to forget about those that rejoiced to come either. There are many different experiences, but both Celebrimbor and Celebrían are very much on the “Aman is Exile” side. Neither choose to be there and both miss Middle-earth dearly; I think Celebrimbor in particular thinks of Valinor as a prison at times.

It’s difficult for many to adapt, and for a multitude of reasons. There might not be any familiar faces. Celebrían, for example, knows very few people in Aman: until Gil-Galad is reborn (in the late 3rd Age), Celebrimbor is the only family member she knew in Middle-earth (and Oropher and/or Amdir, if you go with them being related to Celeborn, but I don’t for the sole reason that I would like for there to be a king who’s not related to Elwe or Finwe). There are, I’m sure, a lot of Elves like Celebrían, with no family present, or little. It’s a change, a huge change, and for Elves returning from Mandos there’s the whole “I was dead and now I am not” thing, which is also huge, and to deal with that, while being in a strange land without hope of returning home and possibly without any family or friends? Celebrimbor and Celebrían have it easy in some ways in that, whatever their traumas, both have a social network that's concerned about them as individuals who are loved. Not every elf would have had that and some of those elves would have had as much or more trauma.

There must have been such a culture clash. A northern continental or oceanic climate to tropical and sub-tropical Aman (or tropical/subtropical Tirion, Alqualonde, and Tol Eressea, though Tirion is a highland climate. There are other areas too). Different foods, different fashions, different art and (v. important) jewelry styles, different ways of talking. Some of those culture differences are more serious than others. Two big ones here are the attitude towards death – is it more or less expected or is it unthinkable – and the attitude towards living forever in a land of peace. The Elves born in Middle-earth are accustomed to death, they’ve grown up with it, it’s not shocking; in Mandos they don’t need to come to terms with the fact that death exists. But they are likely much less equipped to deal with eternal life in paradise. And there’s a desire, I think, of many of those of Middle-earth for their own culture to be seen as valid and just as good. The Noldor (and the Iathrim) have a huge superiority complex and that is going to irk a lot of people. I don’t think there are a ton of Middle-earth born elves who live in Tirion on a permanent basis.

They're also now living in a land ruled by the Valar. I think there is a lot of variation among the ME Eldar when it comes to attitudes towards the Valar. Varda I think is well regarded by all – she’s the god of stars and they’re elves and elves like stars to the point that they named themselves the people of the stars – but for the ME Eldar who don’t have high opinions of the Valar, welp, now they find themselves (possibly unwillingly) in the land ruled by the Valar – and the Valar do rule Valinor in a way they don’t Middle-earth. Even those who do revere the Valar revered them at a distance, so the politics of it all is an adjustment. And then there's the Avari! Elves can be cantankerous; there is probably some rhetorical and political rejection of the Valar as rulers, which many who lived through the Darkening respond to with horror and condemnation and fear. So likely a fair bit of political and physical separation, especially once Oropher and Gil-Galad are reborn, and that keeps tensions down a bit.

ALSO! There are a lot of disparate groups from ME. There’s the Dúnedhil, the Eldar of the West of Middle-earth (chiefly descendants of the Sindar and Exilic Noldor with a fair bit of Silvan influence). There’s the non-Noldor of Beleriand who were reembodied in Aman or who sailed there after the War of Wrath. The various Silvan groups. There’s the Avari, who are a whole multitude of different peoples! And any Elda who died on the Great Journey (possibly from fucking too much wtf NoME). There is A. Lot. going on. I suspect the 1st Age Sindar, Amanyarin Noldor, Teleri and Dúnedhil are probably culturally closer to each other than they are to any other group, to the disgruntlement of many in those groups. But there’s always been a lot of cultural contact between the Noldor and the Teleri and in Beleriand the Sindar and Noldor became one people, more or less, and the Dúnedhil descended from that mixed Sindar-Noldor culture, though with a lot of Silvan influence. Tons and tons of tensions, for fairly obvious reasons, and I don’t want to say that various subgroups get along or are allies, but a cultural similarity that does matter.

For Celebrimbor in particular: I will admit that one of my major reasons (I have many) for going with a half-Sinda Celebrimbor is just that it’s never done, and even the “born in Aman, mother stayed” version is almost always played the same with very similar family relationships, and it doesn’t interest me as a writer, because I don’t see anything new that I could play with (no condemnation there at all, just talking about me as a writer/fan). One who's half-Sinda is largely uncharted ground (plus it's easy to make him alienated from his Feanorian relatives, which I like, also because it's almost never done), and it nods to the other versions in which Celebrimbor is a Teler or Sinda, versions which perhaps pop up in universe because there was a time when C was presenting himself as a Sinda? But anyways, one of the things you can do with one who’s not born in Aman is play around with being reborn in a place that is exile.

He misses Middle-earth dearly and a lot of that is also connected to the failure of his ambitions and knowing that Eregion, the land he loved, was ruined and that there is no one to comfort the stones that weep for them. He doesn’t have all the problems other people might have: he’s not particularly bothered by the change in climate, etc. and he does have family (his maternal family, all of whom died in the First Age, are back; he stayed with them after being reborn so there’s plenty of family support). He’s occupied a fair bit with scientific pursuits (of the theoretical kind, not the making Items of Power kind) and is petty enough to be involved in a number of academic arguments and rivalries, which he finds normal and enjoyable; he doesn’t need to find some other occupation like some Elves might. Most of his day to day issues have to do with scientific cultural clashes and wanting to stress that his non-Amanyarin culture is not lesser – lots of emphasizing his Exilic Quenya dialect and the like, as well as rejecting a purely Noldorin identity. Which is all mostly stuff that’s triggered by being in Aman but not intrinsic to the land itself, just fights that he happens to have there because of the situation.

But the stars. The stars are different and that hurts. And the stones and holly trees of Eregion are lost to him forever. The Elves are deeply, deeply connected to their land and that connection is severed, a sharp and final separation.

There’s the sense of exile, but more than that a sense of imprisonment. Less physical and more “all my ambitions were destroyed and I don’t know what to do and I can’t go back (in time or to ME).” He’s perfectly fine day to day – I don’t mean to overstress the angst – but being in Aman is completely tied up with the destruction of Eregion and how his vision, a Middle-earth brighter and fairer and more blessed than Aman, will now never happen. The mere fact that he’s in Aman is a failure.

Finally, there’s a pretty major social issue. I have a lot of reasons for making my version of Celebrimbor half-Sindarin. One of which is that as someone born in Middle-earth, he never met Feanor. Because oh man, I cannot imagine any Celebrimbor who doesn’t have some issues with Feanor and Feanor’s legacy, and this gives me a lot of interesting things to do. “I want to be in Middle-earth” is not the only thing that makes him less than thrilled to be in Aman. The Amanyar look at him and see a lesser version of Feanor and Feanor as a cultural figure is far more important to them than to the Dúnedhil. So Celebrimbor gets: “when are you going to stir up a rebellion?,” “you need to make great things” – which he is not at all up to at the moment and that is something that deeply troubles him – and “oh, it’s cool to meet the second best smith.” By the time of Eregion’s founding Feanor wasn’t much of an issue for him, everyone having gotten past such things more or less after the War of Wrath when a bunch of disputes and heritages just stopped mattering. And… after a certain point there are very few people who knew Feanor in Middle-earth; to most he’s a historical figure. My Celebrimbor doesn’t have mommy or daddy issues (he does have an occasionally fraught relationship with his mother, but it’s over adult disagreements, and he rarely thinks of Curufin, who’s been dead for a few millenia). But for his entire life he has been held up to Feanor and found wanting because Feanor was declared The Greatest™ before his birth and as a result he has a swan-fleet full of Feanor issues.

And now he’s back to everyone looking at him and seeing Feanor. Aside from homesickness, the occasional feeling of imprisonment, I think his biggest issue with Aman itself (as opposed to Aman as a symbol of his failure) is how he’s once again first and foremost a Feanorian, before who he is an an individual person. That may well be one of the underlying reasons he and Nerdanel don’t really have a relationship.

As far as exploring goes, that’s something that Celebrían is much more interested in than Celebrimbor. He’s not a homebody exactly, but not someone who explores for the sake of it. Field expeditions, visiting his grandparents, going to various academic conferences, or being dragged places by Finrod, Amarie, and/or Celebrían are why he travels – which is a fair bit of traveling and means he sees a fair bit of Aman, though a lot of those bits of Aman are urban settings. Celebrían, though, will absolutely just wander for no other reason than to see new places – or she will once she is emotionally able to, once she feels safe again: she was attacked by the orcs on a trip, after all.

That was a lot of words! I hope it answered your question satisfactorily? And thank you for the ask, anon <3

#ask #anonymous #celebrimbor #middle earth #meta #celebrian #elves in aman #headcanons #shall these bones live #or backstory to it at least

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silvantransthranduiltrash · 2 months

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Entirely mu AU and self indulgent:

Noldo elf: so how did the silvans and avari stay out of the war with morgoth.

Legolas: hm? Oh, we brokered a truce.

Noldo: so? We did too, that didn’t stop him.

Legolas: yeah, but, unlike you, we actually had ✨power✨ backing us up that forced him to back off untill further notice.

Legolas: also, our diplomats made it very clear that if he didn’t comply, he would not like the outcome. Very agressive, 10/10.

Noldo: ok, well, how did it go, because Maedhros didn’t even get to morgoth, he was ambushed.

Legolas: weeelllll-

*flashback to beginning of the first age*

The silvan ambassadors *shows up at morgoth’s throne room without notice* we’re here make sure you don’t do something stupid like declare war on our people.

Morgoth, amused: oh, and how are you going to do that? For that matter, what’s stopping me from killing you here and now.

Ambassadors: what’s stopping you is the fact that, if we do not come back within the next hour to where we have to check in, the silvans will assume that you killed us and thus has made a declerarion of war. If it is assumed you have declaired war on the silvans, the long standing alliance between all the avari and silvan nations, pertaining to the terrorism and violance commited by a member of the ainur, will go into affect, and all our international grievances will be put on hold untill we’ve dealt with you-

Morgoth:

Ambassadors: to put this into context: not only will you have attracted the attention and wrath of the silvans, elves who are masters of espionage and assassination and magically above average and a people who’s known for their warrior culture which has amassed over a total of 4000 years with a fully stocked and experienced army, but you will also have the might of the Arctic Empire, who’s succesfully taken over the world, the Okrean kingdom, who’s become completely independent from all things magic, the Agtep Nation, ruled by an elleth known as the God of War, the Bali’tsa Empire, home to the largest army of all the avari nations, the Qitian Empire, who produce some of the deadliest weapons known to this realm, and the Fawneli Tribes, who have the strongest elves in existence, bearing down on you like a rabid dog. And unlike the Noldo and the Sinda you so love to bully, each one of these Nations have a full 4000 years of military history that they will not hesitate to unleash on you like a dam that finally broke. Mind you, that’s before we even take into considerarion the many other smaller elven societies who won’t hesitate to join the slaughter, hell, even the Edireths have thrown their hat in the ring, and they’re particularly known for eating ainur for breakfast. Literally.

Ambassadors: so what will it be? Time is ticking, and you’re almost out.

Morgoth: fuckin- fine. But i won’t lay off forever.

Ambassadors: oh we know. And we’ll be preparing our armies for when that time comes. I suggest you do the same.

*back in the present*

Legolas: yeah, let’s just say they really went in there with a “fuck all” attitude.

#my au #not cannon #hc that the silvan ambassador was Thranduil #listen if the noldo and the sinda could go apeshit in the first age; then so could the silvans/avari #lord of the rings #lotr #lotr elves #the hobbit #silmarillion #silvans #avari #morgoth #4 silvan sibs au #house of edireth #morgoth did not fuck around and find out #incorrect tolkien quotes #legolas

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smaidjor · 3 years

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its the empires + lord of the rings time of the night guys, get ready for another barely comprehensible post!

okay so

given that sausage's 'elven tome' was in sindarin we have possible?? proof?? that the elven language primarily used on the continent is sindarin, which could imply that scott and his empire are sindar. HOWEVER.

buckle up because im about to sound nerdy.

so sindarin was the most commonly spoken elven language even amongst non-sindar elves by the third age, which kinda makes sense given that the noldor, another large group of elves, were a flaming dumpster fire for most of the first age and their last high king had died at the end of the second age. (also the silvan languages were presumably spoken in thranduil's lands given that a lot of the silvan elves lived there but tolkien doesn't say a lot about them*). anyways. so the sindar are wood-elves, so it wouldn't make much sense that scotts empire was on a mountain without many trees IF the book being in sindarin meant they were all wood-elves. that would be a much more high-elven style of building. now, hear me out. in lord of the rings canon, rivendell is headed by the last** heir of the throne of the noldor, who are high-elves. however, he is also the last heir of the line of thingol, high king of the sindar. scotts empire has extremely mixed symbolism, with his protector spirit being a stag, something which would typically be associated with the sindar, while his build style and location are much more high-elven in nature. (you could even add in his association with light/the stars/the night from past servers to argue he has some vanya or avari symbolism going on, since the avari are known as dark-elves who stayed behind instead of going to the light of valinor and thus i kinda associate them with stars + night? and then the vanyar are high-elves in valinor and varda, goddess of light + the stars is super important to them (and all elves really).)

in essence, my theory is that scott is the last heir to multiple elven royal lines, rebuilding the fallen kingdoms and uniting a scattered people. (i know he said his people have lived there for millennia but rivendell was also formed from basically a bunch of elves left over from a war and it was three millennia old by the time of lord of the rings canon.) *in lord of the rings at least, i haven't read the histories of middle earth so dont come at me. **second-to last technically because galadriel is alive, but she has her own lands and the kingship was offered to elrond over her because he was a descendant of fingolfin, who is the older brother to galadriel's father, finarfin.

#scott smajor #empires smp

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outofangband · 1 year

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New Year Celebration Headcanons Part Two

Part one

World building Masterlist

Not all inhabitants celebrate at the same time. The changing of the structure of the year and the different calendars and seasons mean that when the new year is observed differs from culture to culture, even among those who have the same or similar calendar.

The Númenórean calendar begins in midwinter however it’s implied that the months used or at least a similar set were used by humans in the first age as several birthdays in the Narn are given in those months.

-The Northern Sindar celebrate their new year in early spring, as will be marked by the later elven calendars. It is typically still cold and the earth and flora is just starting to thaw. Crowns of nettles are made for the tradition.

-The Bëorians of Ladros have a late winter new year, about four weeks before the spring equinox. The celebrations are more family oriented involving the lighting of candles pressed with specific designs and Warm drinks made with clover or heather honey.

-Doriath marks the new year in that season between autumn and winter, Fading. I mentioned their record keepers preserve petals from the first flowers of each year and this tradition is related to other Sindar, Silvan and Avari traditions but their actual new year is in Fading. It is a reflective celebration where the sun and moon are honored and the past mourned.

-The various Fëanorian realms do not really mark the new year in any significant way. Some celebrate at the same time as the Nolofinwëan host (previous post), or celebrate with human or dwarven or other elven allies. But the traditions from their realms are far more personal and no specific day is widely observed at the same time throughout all of them.

-The Haladin celebrate at Midsummer with fires and one of their larger communal feasts. Many travel south to the more open plains on the other side of the river Teglin for the celebration. It is the liveliest and most crowded of their traditions as the Haladin do not tend to gather in such large numbers (briefly mentioned in The Wanderings of Húrin). It is also one of the only meals where freshwater fish, a symbol of the new year, is served

#the silmarillion #the children of húrin #mithrim #Dorthonion #Doriath #brethil #fëanorians #musing and meta #beleriand

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feanorianethicsdepartment · 3 years

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this one’s for you, fëanorian tauriel anon, as well as @procrastinationonvacation and @whotookliterallyallthenames and everyone else who’s into this bonkers little verse. you’re amazing, your ideas are amazing, and most of these thoughts are me taking those ideas and running with them. and so, here’s my take on the verse where tauriel gets adopted into the house of fëanor:

first, about the red hair:

i’ve said this before, but i think it’s an uncommon-but-not-totally-unheard-of trait that pops up here and there in tatya-descended elven populations. the silvans of greenwood are more nelyarin than anything else, but like most avari they have roots in all three of the main great journey era eldarin ethnic groups

they just have red hair sometimes. it’s not a big deal. at least, not in middle-earth

in valinor... well, the only redheads who came to aman and decided to reproduce were nerdanel’s extended family, and we all know how that turned out

the elves of tol erëssea treat tauriel... weirdly. like, all the silvans who came over with legolas are having some trouble with culture shock, and no one’s going out of their way to be a dick, but still

doubletakes, people crossing the street to avoid her, small children staring at her suspiciously from little corners. it’s worse in alqualondë

and it’s literally just tauriel! she tries to ask people why sometimes, but they always exit the conversation as fast as they can. occasionally they run screaming

it’s frustrating. she has met some people who seem to realise she’s not a noldo, but she still gets sideeyed all the damn time

so when legolas goes to tirion to do politics (they’re woodland elves, not sea elves, wherever they settle it’ll be further inland than teleri generally set up) tauriel goes with him. she needs a break

tirion is... a bit different. she still gets doubletakes, eyes lingering on her for a few seconds, but the fear isn’t there

she gets stopped, once or twice, by people who mistake her for someone else. it’s a little annoying, sure, but it’s a lot less alienating

as interestingly weird as the city is, though, she still technically has a job to do. she accompanies legolas to this fancy court meeting they were warned in advance might devolve into a brawl

it does

after ushering legolas into a secure sniping position, tauriel finds herself fighting back to back with this huge (by her standards anyway) muscly calaquendë. it takes her a moment to actually look at him, but once she see his hair colour she’s like ‘redheads unite!’ and he’s like ‘hell yeah!’

(she’s seen a couple of elves with reddish hair in noldorin country, but he’s the first one she’s spoken to since she reached the undying lands)

fight’s pretty good. they get backup from the guy’s twin brother, who somehow managed to smuggle in a bunch of fireworks inside his wheelchair

when it’s all over, they stagger out of the meeting hall together, the good kind of exhausted. they hang out for a bit, get to chatting

tauriel’s like ‘i’m tauriel. who are you guys?’ and the pair of them just stare at her for a moment

then the one who does all the talking snortlaughs. ‘i’m amras’ he says ‘that’s amrod’

the names mean nothing to tauriel, who figured out maedhros the monstrous wasn’t real when she was 12 and slept through history class. she just waves them goodnight and goes to find her usual crew

legolas, on the other hand, had to memorise all this shit in his prince lessons. when tauriel tells him the names of the guys he saw her fighting with, he immediately spits out his wine

he gives her the skinny. she’s all ‘huh didn’t know they were real’

when amras tracks her down the next morning (he needs a convincing hair double for this anti-turgon scheme the twins have cooked up) she’s like ‘eh, why not’

(the twins are under the initial impression that she’s a cousin on their mother’s side from way out in the boonies. they’re not even wrong, it’s just that there’s a rather big number in front of that ‘cousin’)

(i was gonna put all my adopted fëanorian tauriel stuff in one post, but it’s getting late and the post editor’s glitching out, so this is just the meet cute. i’ll add more... probably the day after tomorrow?)

#silmarillion #tauriel #feanorians #house of feanor #the feanorian tauriel saga #my terrible fic #amras #amrod #legolas #i get the feeling i might have bitten off more than i can chew

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diversetolkien · 4 years

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Hi, I just want to say that this blog is absolutely phenomenal. I recently discovered it and I am so impressed. You put into words what I always felt was "off" about the Silmarillion (i'm glad it wasn't just me who noticed!), and your post about Feanor definitely got me to think as well. I'm not really sure how I feel on that one - I think I need to reread the text, it's been a while. But your post on Lothlorien, Galadriel especially as the White Woman trope, the black/white (1/3)

the black/white language dichotomy, and just the fact that the text is partly just the Noldor colonizing Middle Earth - I didn't know how to put it in words, and you did, and it was wonderful. Your points re: Galadriel definitely got me to think as well, as I didn't notice specifically anything special re: Galadriel, but I completely agree with you there. More people should definitely pay attention to what you're saying - the reality is that the Silmarillion is an inherently colonialist (2/3)

and imperialist text that is told from the pov of the colonizer (noldor), and even if it's fiction&we assume that with elves these elements don't exist (altho i disagree), the fact is that 1st&foremost the text was created and consumed in our world, with our implications and connotations, & we have to treat it as such. I truly love these pointy eared dramamonsters, but it's important to be critical of the literature we consume too. Keep up the great work, and I'm looking forward to other posts!

just to add: it would also be interesting to see the silmarilion from the silvan & esp avari pov. fading (& leaving middle earth to avoid it) seems to be negative in the context of the noldor bc it means they don't have power anymore & their power structure starts to dissolve. Could the end of the elves be read w/parallels to decolonialism? Maybe for the silvan elves fading isn't a bad thing.

Hey there! Feel free to ask me for any points on clarification, especially on the feanor post. There’s a lot of push back for conversations regarding discussing the deep colonialist themes in Tolkien’s work, and who exemplifies them the most. It’s not hard to believe Galadriel does so considering she was Tolkien’s favorite. And again, Galadriel’s narrative is not the only colonialist one, just one of the biggest and most prominent.

And in general, the idea that the Silmarillion is inherently colonist is constantly rejected, and I just can’t understand why? Tolkien grew up in a society where that was acceptable, and our cultural and personal views will always influence our writings. There are even colonialist vibes in hobbit communities.

And I too would like to see a different perspective. What perspective we do get from them is told by Noldor, and unfortunately incredibly demonized (ie: The Silvan elves). And I do feel like there are some strong decolonization vibes, especially with Loth Lorien eventually beign handed back to the Silvan elvesi in Mirkwood when the ring is removed from them, and when their realm fades.

For the first time in ages they aren’t relying on Noldor technology to sustain their realm, they are relying on reach other. I think fading for the Silvan and fading for the Noldor are two different things!

Thanks for the asks!

#the silmarillion #silmarillion #tolkien #lotr #galadriel #greenarmada

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mythopoeticreality · 4 years

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Okay, so basically I’m here working on The Road Goes Ever On and trying to figure out the Noldorin relationship to...well basically Nature in general. And on the one hand here, there is evidence from Lord of the Rings that Elves -- as a whole -- can and do hear and communicate with nature. You have Legolas who can sense the ancientness of Fangorn forest and says how young it makes him feel, as well as his remarks while the Fellowship is in Hollin: “But the Elves of this land were of a race strange to us of the silvan folk, and the trees and the grass do not now remember them. Only I hear the stones lament them: deep they delved us, fair they wrought us, high they builded us; but they are gone. They are gone. They sought the Havens long ago.’

You also have Treebeard, talking about the elves of Cuiviénen and how they not only woke the trees up and taught them to speak, but learned the trees own Language: “Elves began it, of course, waking trees up and teaching them to speak and learning their tree-talk. They always wished to talk to everything, the old Elves did”

On top of that, going back even further to the Silmarillion it is mentioned that Celegorm has learned to speak the Languages of the Birds and Beasts of Middle Earth while Traveling in Oromë’s company. Indeed, Elves in General (as shown, again, through Legolas) seem to have this natural way with animals.

So from the beginning you have elves, these beings who posses these powers of Speach and Communication, and they want to share it with the world. They want to communicate with everything, and in so doing they build this relationship with it.

But this isn’t something I’ve really picked up on much in the Silmarillion? Again, you do have Celegorm, who can speak to animals -- but that talent is presented as being noteworthy, mentioned in relation to his being a Great hunter and a follower of Oromë. The Silmarillion, told from the Noldorin perspective, is focused much more on the relationships between the Noldor themselves: the politics and intrigues amongst the separate branches of the Royal family; The sparkling white-walled cities they’ve built; the items and objects they’ve created-- ranging from jewels and gemstones, to the Palantíri and Fëanorian lamps, to the Silmaills themselves -- and the wars they’ve raged.

Is the answer in that in Lord of the Rings, our representative of the Elves is Legolas? Legolas who is not Noldorin, but rather Sindarin and raised within the culture of the Silvan elves -- Wood-elves, who are supposed to be closer to nature. A scattered folk who are said to be hardly distinguishable from the Avari.

I can’t help but go back to that quote from Legolas in Hollin while thinking about this: “But the Elves of this land were of a race strange to us of the silvan folk, and the trees and the grass do not now remember them. Only I hear the stones lament them.” The elves that inhabited Hollin -- Eregion -- were Noldor. And it isn’t the trees or plant life that do remember them. Only the stones of their former city, the things they made.

I can’t help but wonder if during their time on Valinor the Noldor might have...lost something? If during their tutelage under the Valar they began focusing more and more on building up Tirion and creating these wonders. If their own feuds and drama between one another became more and more consuming. If they did start focusing more on themselves and this relationship with trees and stones became nearly forgotten. Maybe, under Noldorin scholarship it became relegated to an almost half-folkloric sort of place? Maybe the first generations upon Valinor did try to teach the Trees and stones to speak as well. But maybe the Noldor soon came to see such things only as material for their own creations and only a few could still retain the ability to hear them.

I mean, just look at Fëanor himself -- the epitome of a Noldo if there ever was one. He created the Silmarills from the light of Telperion and Laurelin -- Yavanna’s ultimate creation, perhaps the ultimate expression of Nature in Arda, sun and moon and trees all in one. But Fëanor regards the Silmarills as his and his alone, something he alone made and is entitled to.

Anyway, that was what I was able to come up with! If anyone smarter or better versed in Tolkien Lore has any thoughts or opinions on this please do comment! I gotta...get this figured out...

#Silmarillion #Lord of the Rings #Elves #Feanor #Seriously #really would love your input Tolkien Fandom

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nenuials · 4 years

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Who would you say is the most underrated Tolkien-character? This blog has really made me appreciate Halbarad, who I didn't pay too much attention to before.

I would say it completely depends on ones exact area of interest. You know, one thing I love about the Tolkien fandom is that when fans discuss between themselves it feels a lot like this:

What I mean by that? My exact areas of interest are the northern dunedain and the moriquendi (avari, nandor, silvan) and to an extent sindar, and especially the Third Age. One of my mutuals could tell you the exact customs and genealogies of Rohan by heart, another one can iterate on the complexities of Gondorian culture for days, another one knows Gondolin like the back of their hand, another one basically wrote entire essays on dwarf linquistics. Two of my friends would wow you with the amount of stuff they have to say about Rhun and the easterlings. My point is: each of these people have a different answer to your question depending on their exact area of interest.

My personal opinion, if I were to take it by group and Age:

Valinor: Findis and Irime. They are part of the most famous family in all of the history of Arda and we barely hear anything about them? The Feanorians are the Skywalkers of Middle-earth and about their two respective lives so little is known? That should be rectified.

First Age - Beleriand: Laiquendi and the dwarves of Nogrod and Belegost. I find it such an injustice that the only 2 things we know about the dwarves is that Caranthir had trade relations with them and that they stole the Nauglamir and killed Thingol. Also the Laiquendi play such an important role in the tale of Beren and Luthien and many others and we barely know anything about them? Also Nellas? After Turin leaves Doriath we never hear about her again. Who can forget Rog and Duilin of Gondolin.

Second Age - Lindorinand: Lenwe and Denethor. Father and son who ruled long before Galadriel even had the idea of crossing over the Misty Mountains. Also more Amdir. They were the pillars of the nandor of the Anduin, they built a strong society much alike to the one Oropher and Thranduil build in Mirkwood and no one ever talks about them? I find it preposterous how ever since the noldor and sindar refugees came to Lorien, the nandor culture basically evaporated. What do you mean they spoke lorien-sindarin? What happened to nandorin?? What do you mean they wore grey raiments and were golden haired?? What happened to the nandorin clothing and customs? I need answers!! This is one of the worst cases of cultural erasure I’ve seen in the whole of the Legendarium. I mean not as bad as the Rohirrim basically stealing the land of the Dunlending, but close.

Third Age - Edhellond: Are we going to talk about how there’s an elven settlement right over the hill from Dol Amroth, or did we all collectively forget about that? It’s like Lorien would be in sight of Minas Tirith. How did the elves of Edhellond and the Gondorians of Dol Amroth interact? I am dying with curiosity to see this more explored. Also, I love how usually discussions go like: “Name me the elven settlements of the Third Age!” - “Uhm, Rivendell, Lindon, Mirkwood, Lorien... that’s it?” Everyone forgets about the 5th which is Edhellond.

Also speaking of Edhellond. I am genuinely losing my mind over Mithrellas. Mithrellas and Imrazor are the only example we have of an elf-man union where the offspring didn’t have the choice of whether to be a man or an elf. Is it because she wasn’t from the line of Luthien? Is it because her life was relatively simple so there was no need for her children to do great deeds? But, an elf basically married a mortal with no tragedy or interdictions from the Valar, had a nice family, became part of the ruling family of Dol Amroth, her children sired a line that is still known today to be noble. If she can do it and there’s basically no consequences, why can’t more mortals marry elves just like that? If the offspring's are like 95% humans and 5% elves? I mean, apart from the whole everything and everyone will die around you and you will be left alone to suffer bit that the elf in question has to endure.

I have an entire series dedicated to less spoken about humans. But, if I were to choose one it would definitely be the Lossoth. Are we not going to talk about how they have their entire culture built around the Forochel bay? How they live in igloos? How they helped Arvedui and warned him?

My area of expertise is genuinely the dunedain and elves. I could talk about them for ages. I even named my blog after lake Nenuial, where both humans and elves dwelled. As a new Halbarad appreciator, I have a couple resources if you have some spare time. I’d start with the Born of Hope movie, as it touched a bit on his childhood as well as on the dunedain culture. One of the best tolkien fics I’ve ever read in my life is “Tales of the North”, the amount of culture it breathes into the dunedain is exceptional (everything by Nath actually). Also, if you followed my blog lately, you know I lost my mind over “Don’t Panic”, a lot of people said this is the fic that made them give a damn about Halbarad and truly this fic is something else, a true gem.

#Anonymous

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