I can’t😆I can’t anymore 😆😆

HEAR ME OUT. Corroded Coffin doing a cover of Teenage Dirtbag but when it comes to Noelle's part, the lights go out and there's just a grainy voice recording of Steve singing the part.

"I've got two tickets to Iron Maiden, baby

Come with me Friday, don't say maybe

I'm just a teenage dirt bag, baby

Like you"

Thank you for your attention, have a good day.

I think one of the biggest Byler proofs is just the fact that the duffers told Noah that Will is going to have a happy ending. Like, hello? I really don’t think Will can be truly really 100% happy if he’s not with Mike. He is head over heels in love. If Mike rejects him or ends up with El then Will just stays in a wierd unrequited love thing. Idk if y’all know but a happy ending isn’t being in love with someone that doesn’t love you back. Byler cannon in s5 100%.

🏌🏼Golf in Las Vegas

Las Vegas Sphere Trolls Golfer

i believe s5 will see our characters have everything returned to them that was taken from them in (or before) s1.

hopper will have a wife and a daughter again. lucas will have the love of his life, max mayfield, come back to him when she’s freed from vecna. dustin will avenge eddie’s—and by extension all outcasts’—name. joyce will have a healthy family and a loving husband. nancy will be free of societal expectations. jonathan will be able to live his life without the obligation to constantly worry over his mom & brother. steve will find that he’s already got the family he wanted, and robin will have a beautiful girl to share her truest self with. el will have a real family, a real mother and father, which was stolen from her as a newborn.

and mike wheeler will get back will byers, the one who’s never fully come back to him since he was taken by the demogorgon—the best boy that’s ever happened to him, who was taken from him by forces of evil and repression on a fateful november night.

and will byers? he’s going to be returned to the arms of mike wheeler, his knight in shining armor, the boy he couldn’t lie to, the boy who has been destined to love him unconditionally, for the rest of his life, since the moment they met.

When the GA realizes Byler is real...

The Duffers

They really said you all thought we were giving him different hair style 😭 sorry to all you long haired will byers fans. Hair is looking soft tho!

I don’t care! I need my pizza boy and himbo to at least talk or something. I need it more than air at this point, give i to me!!!

photo credit

out of curiosity, what do you think the duffers could have done to help mitigate the homophobic fandom? do you just mean making byler canon earlier, or dropping heavier-handed hints/clues/foreshadowing that are harder to dismiss in the show? or are you thinking something they themselves could’ve done in real life, like actively going out of their way to support pride month or something like that?

i’m also thinking abt how the show presents itself, on several occasions, to be very anti-bullying and how it prides itself on celebrating those who might be considered losers, weirdos, and outcasts. but because this idea is never really explicitly stated or emphasized in the show, casual viewers tend to gloss over it, or miss it entirely. is this the duffer bro’s fault? is this an indication that they could have done more? done better? and do they have a moral responsibility to educate those who are intent on missing the point?

maybe! i don’t rly know how i feel. i love the show, i love byler, and i do agree that there are certain moves the duffers have made that i’m not 100% happy with. also the idea of a gay plot twist is kind of…. you know, fun, but not the best. however, i also try to keep in mind that these are two (presumably) cis straight men and so, i cut them some slack and i immensely appreciate what they’re trying to do (assuming ofc they are moving in a canon byler direction).

for them to establish two canon queer relationships in a mainstream show that i love that isn’t centered around queerness??? i could cry tears of joy just thinking abt it, and so i feel i’m more compelled to dismiss some of the mistakes the duffers make along the way.

anyway, sorry that the ask is ridiculously long (feel free to ignore it, or only address a small part of it if it’s too overwhelming!). i hope it makes sense, though it might just come off as incoherent rambling - whoops. i’m honestly just speaking recreationally lol, but i’d love to hear some more thoughts frm you on the subject if you’re willing!

Agh, thank you for the ask, I love hearing your thoughts!!!

[Re: this post]

To touch on the first/main question - what could the Duffers have done to mitigate the homophobia?

There's a lot they could have done.

Within the show, if they're intending to make Byler canon, which I do believe they are, I think that season 4 should have officially broken up Mileven and also have had an undeniably, overtly romantic moment for Byler that the GA can't miss. Even if the final cabin scene had a hand touch rather than the shoulder touch, that would have been enough for me. Because yes, to me, and you, and 250k other Bylers, it has been obvious; but for the GA and Milevens, they have purposefully left enough wiggle room to keep them on the hook. Again, I respect the straight-bait, but if they're prioritizing straight-baiting over protecting their queer fans, that's not a great look.

But to me, much more important is what they could do outside the show. While there are occasional posts about Byler on various Stranger Things social media, I feel like there is so much more that could be done to show support to the ship and its queer fans, especially if it is endgame.

They could have explicitly and overtly addressed Will's sexuality on all channels after the release of season 4 instead of leaving it to Noah Schnapp.

They could have explicitly stated in an interview that Will is an equally viable love interest for Mike as Eleven is going into season 5 instead of prioritizing shock value and spoiler avoidance over the wellbeing of their queer fans.

Most vitally, they could have acknowledged/addressed the presence of homophobic fans and bullying in the fandom and explicitly condemned hateful folks as misunderstanding the show's core values. Take for example how Rick Riordan responded to racist fans criticizing the casting for Annabeth & Grover:

"The negative comments she has received online are out of line. They need to stop. Now. Anyone can be a hero. If you don’t get that, if you’re still upset about the casting of this marvelous trio, then it doesn’t matter how many times you have read the books. You didn’t learn anything from them."

After season 4's confirmation that Will is gay, they should have made an outright statement along these lines, that hate is unacceptable and that those who are hateful are fundamentally opposed to the values of the show. Instead they (or at least, Netflix) is more preoccupied with maintaining the general audience for as long as possible, even at the expense of the often-more-dedicated queer fans.

Really though, I'm more happy about a queer relationship being canon in such a mainstream show than I am upset about the lack of support for queer fans, because ultimately, this queer relationship and representation is offering support in a lot of ways. But they're doing this while also spending years allowing some of their biggest fans to be gaslit into thinking they're "delusional" for interpreting what the show is saying.

I guess ultimately I just feel like, if they're going to engage with queer stories and queer characters, they also have to have some responsibility for mitigating the negative impact they can have on real queer fans and queer spaces.

“ Will Byers breathes.”

Mike Wheeler:

Our finales have typically ended with the evil defeated, or at least pushed away, allowing our characters to catch their collective breath and return to their normal lives. But because this is the penultimate season, we wanted an Empire Strikes Back style ending — meaning, it ends on a down note, with our characters experiencing real defeat for the first time. The bad guy wins. Friends (heroes) die, or are badly wounded. We felt this led to some incredibly devastating performances from our cast, as they come face to face with death and loss, a feeling which will cast a dark cloud over the final season. Like a lot of people, high school was a very challenging time for us — you’re facing the pressure of figuring out your future at the same time you are trying to fit in, or even just trying to understand who you are. It’s a lot to take on at that age and it can leave you feeling hopeless, like there’s no end to the uncertainty in sight. This emotional truth was at the center of Vecna. In many ways a physical representation of anxiety and depression, he is an evil force that leeches on youth’s frailty. The devil on your shoulder, the dark whisper in your ear. We hope that the show ultimately gives hope to kids that, with the help of loved ones, you can overcome anything. You can run your way up that hill, out of darkness and into the light. During filming, the script mostly went unchanged, although on set, and in the edit, everyone worked hard to make each character moment as impactful as possible. Some of this came from actor improvisation. For instance, in Eddie’s death scene, the simple exchange where Eddie and Dustin tell one another they love each other was improvised by Gaten [Matarazzo] and Joe [Quinn] during filming. Lucas screaming for Erica to help as Max dies in his arms was similarly an idea that came from Caleb [McLaughlin]. Our editor Dean Zimmerman heightened the moment of Eddie’s decision to fight back by slowing down the footage and adding flashbacks. Our music editor, Lena Glikson, cut a remix of “Running Up That Hill” into the final battle in a way that just took our breath away. It was just many, many moments like these from our cast, crew and post-production team which, hopefully, brought further emotion and humanity to the words on the page.

It Starts On The Page -- An Introduction to The Piggyback by the Duffers, as submitted for consideration to the 2023 Emmy Awards 

no but imagine.

Will convenes with the party in s5 and they decide that, if they want to stop Vecna, Will has to go into the gate into the upside down to find him and kill him. Will is given a shotgun, and Dustin and Lucas start driving him to the Lover's Lake gate early in the morning, so that they have time to say goodbye.

Mike isn't there because he already said goodbye to Will the previous day, feeling like it would be too painful to actually go with him the gate. He's going through a binder of Will's artwork, like he did in s1, when El walks over and asks him what's wrong. He talks about feeling... lost without Will, like something's wrong, when suddenly he gets to the painting Will made in s4.

"Oh, this is my favorite. I-I know you commissioned it, but it'll always remind me of him." A pause.

"Mike... I don't know what you're talking about."

And then it all clicks.

Back at the lake, Dustin, Will, and Lucas are saying their goodbyes. Will takes a deep breath, about to dive in, when suddenly...

"Will!" It's Mike, running out of the woods, out of breath. He locks eyes with Will, and both their eyes widen. "I... I need to tell you something. I forgot-"

"There's no time, Mike," Will says, his voice clearly full of pain. "I... I have to do this. I don't have time for..." Finally, he gives up on explaining himself, and shakes his head. "Never mind. Just... I'm sorry, okay? But I can't. Not now. Not anymore." Will turns back to the gate, breathing in and out, his hands curling into fists as he tries to ignore Mike calling out for him.

Finally, he winces, and dives in. The silence is deafening. Mike stands there, looking like something in him's just died.

"Mike..." Lucas says. But Mike doesn't say a word. Instead, he tosses down his bag, sprints towards the lake, and before anyone can register what's happening he's jumping in, going after Will. Lucas and Dustin stare into the waters, shocked. They slowly look up, exchanging a glance. Then-

TITLE SEQUENCE. SEASON 5, EPISODE 5, THE PALADIN AND THE CLERIC.

winona ryde-

when the final scene of stranger things is a grown-up will byers at his kitchen table, drawing, and he calls out “hey, sweetheart? can you bring me my good eraser?” his husband walks out of their home office with the eraser in his left hand, wedding band glinting, wordlessly handing will the item.

will smiles up at him. “thanks, michael,” he teases, and mike leans down to kiss him. “you know, you still need to finish your part of volume 5 before we can send this out.” mike stands up, huffs a laugh and gently rubs will’s shoulders.

the camera focuses on what will’s been drawing—the first draft of a graphic novel. will reaches forward and flips from the early page he’d just been sketching on, which depicts the dnd campaign from s1e1 and will getting captured by the demogorgon, and flips to the end, which depicts the Party saving him in s5 (which we’ve just seen earlier in the episode).

“remember?” will points at empty speech bubbles on the page. “this was all happening in your perspective. i was literally in a trance. i can’t fill it in for you,” will laughs, a mirth-filled sound that radiates through their cozy kitchen and living room.

“oh my god, and especially this part.” will flips back to volume 4 of their comic, showing frames of will and mike in the pizza van. “you left all your thought bubbles empty, babe. lucas and dustin are brutal when they edit our shit, you know they won’t let it slide—”

“yeah, yeah,” mike smiles. he sighs as he reaches down and traces his fingers over the thessalhydra on the final pages of the novel. “will?”

“yeah?”

“this is gorgeous.”

“oh, stop.”

“…and i wanted to ask you—“

“yeah?”

“do you think anyone will believe us?”

the room falls silent. will knows what he means—are readers going to believe that this really happened to them and their friends, that this is really their love story? or are they going to think it’s pure fiction? just a metaphor, maybe? and the bigger question hangs between them: do they want people to believe them?

mike clears his throat and continues. “i guess i should ask you what i’m really worried about. do you think people will… like it?”

finally, will’s face breaks into a beaming smile. “oh, yeah. the smart ones. the ones who know what it’s like to be… different.” will leans back into his husband’s arms. “it’s late. we should sleep. el is picking us up early tomorrow, remember?”

“oh yeah, that’s right. she’s really excited about teaching that yoga class.”

they laugh together and roll their eyes lovingly at the thought of their best friend, and will gets up from his chair. he starts to follow mike into their room, but gets stuck on the image of the whole Party physically pulling him from vecna’s clutches on the final page.

mike notices and peeks out from the hallway. “hon, you coming?”

“yeah,” will says, and he smiles fondly, thinking about how lucky he is to have the people that he has, and to have been to hell and back with them. “yeah, was just looking at a couple things.” he sighs and closes the book, and follows mike. his voice trails off as he says “you know, i’m still not sure about the title…”

the camera shows us that the draft’s cover reads:

STRANGER THINGS HAVE HAPPENED…

by William & Michael Byers

Introduction by Jane “El” Hopper

Epilogue by Maxine Mayfield-Sinclair

Henclair Media, 2016©

I’m confused so does that mean they’re not editing Will’s birthday to be in May now? If that’s the case maybe that’ll actually be addressed as “forgotten” in S5 (this is wishful thinking I don’t have that much trust in the writers lmao)

why did i make this