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raayllum · 10 months

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In regards to the post about people occasionally misunderstanding Callum and Viren's flaws, what have you seen people do with there characters that stood out to you as wrong? I only ask cause I'm very much a pantser of stories and write based of what vibes, so I want to know what kind of things to look out for.

Disclaimer: I am by no means an expert but I have been writing/analyzing for a long time, and now in a somewhat professional capacity, so here's just how I personally think of it / what I've personally seen in fandom. I also don't think pantsers are more inclined (from the writing friends I know, they tend to be more intuition based, which can serve you very very well) even if I am definitely a planner.

With all that out of the way, it basically boils down to ignoring all of Viren's virtues / good intentions, and modifying or ignoring Callum's vices and 'bad' intentions i.e. assuming that Viren's motivations are nothing more than being power hungry and selfish, and that Callum's motivations are always pure and good.

One of the things that I think that's really elevated my writing and analysis is digging my heels into like, examining things from a pyschological basis. What this means is looking not only at how a character's flaws or strengths manifest, but figuring out why and where they're stemming from. This is important for like, you can only write a character if you understand where they're coming from, as this process forms the basis for knowing character motivation (and therefore justification).

Because yes, Viren is power hungry and selfish, and we see in 4x02 he kind of knows that, but he's not admitting that or thinking that way for the bulk of the series. That may be how other characters / the audience sees his actions, but how does he see his actions? Understanding how a character can justify/rationalize things to themselves is important if you want to portray them as well rounded. Viren can say something contradictory like "We must be ready to sacrifice, even the things we love" about his family and "I have always been ready to do anything to protect my family, however dangerous, however vile" and have them both be simultaneously true, because most people — or at least, compelling characters — have contradictory notions or conflicts, and it's the war between opposing wants and desires that causes their internal arcs to well, happen.

Same thing for Callum. He doesn't mean to be a jerk to Ezran in either the beginning or ending of S1, we already know how much his little brother means to him and how nurturing he is, usually. But loving someone deeply isn't the same thing as always treating them kindly, as I'm sure most of us know. So Callum blows up, immediately regretting it in 1x02, and remaining far more of a jerk about it in 1x09 until he apologizes. If the takeaway is just that one of Callum's flaws is his temper, that's all well and good (and it very much is) but it fails to consider when and why his temper comes out. (Which, if you're interested on something more in depth, meta on that here.)

For example, for me, a lot (if not the bulk) of Callum's characterization comes back to a Core of wanting to protect/help his loved ones. Which sounds vague, but that's why the specificities are what matters. Callum's temper tends to come out, specifically, when he's frustrated that he can't do anything to help someone he loves, and he either lashes out at the person getting in his way or someone who is (unintentionally) reminding him of that helplessness. Callum's curiosity / ambitious pursuit of magic is also, to me, tied to that same core. He wants magic because he wants agency, and he wants agency because he wants to be helpful / useful.

If you understand why a character is doing something, it leads to being to extrapolate and place them in different / more intense scenarios, but still retain that main core.

For example, Claudia's primary core is to keep her family together. That's not a main motivation in S1, but it's shown in the way she takes care of her family (being Viren's listening ear and trusted with the more important task; trying to cheer up Soren and giving him hot brown morning potion) in ways that they don't really do for her (Soren goes along and helps out with her plans, but there's never an instance of him taking care of her in the same way, even if we still see that he cares and wants to protect her, i.e. doesn't tell her the truth about Viren). Then in S2 it becomes clear that Claudia's main motivation is to keep her family together, and that Core Want stays true even in increasingly insane or worrisome circumstances (S3, S4, S5) as well as explaining some of her more contradictory behaviour. Of course she's going to believe Viren over Soren with the gaslighting the second she's given an option to, because believing her father lets her keep them all together, and believing her brother means losing Viren.

Which is to say, maybe, that most of the mages we've seen in show (with the exception of Lujanne, perhaps, who's built a life among literal solitary ruins for the express purpose of leaving them as ruins) have a Fixer tendency. Magic allows them to fix the issues they see in the world - that's why they chase it.

Viren believes he has to fix the issue of an empty throne and the knife held at humanity's throat, and he's uniquely suited to know how to fix it (hence why he should be king); Claudia leans on her preparedness and perfectionist tendencies because if she's good enough, nothing bad ever has to happen to her family again, right? She can keep them together, she can fix this; Karim wants to fix the issue of humans and losing their way of life, "I will banish that darkness [...] We will be whole again"; and Callum wants to fix issues for his family (the assassination, the fake coup, Rayla's binding, Rayla's family, etc); "And he's my father. It's my duty to help him".

But what fixing looks like, of course, is also a matter of perspective, and that's where you get variety.

But if you look at Viren's desire to fix things - in his case, to ward off weakness - you can understand the through line of his actions. He wants to fix the danger they're in of killing Avizandum and leaving an heir; his desire for more power and knowledge (tools he can use to create solutions and thereby inflate his self importance) tempt him away from killing Zym; he holds onto the egg so that elves and dragons can't 'use it' the way he would. "An empty throne is a beacon of weakness" "[A child king] will make weak choices!" And Viren is man of strength; a man who can get a grip and compartmentalize and repress and do whatever needs to be done to protect humanity. To fix the magical inequality and banish the Xadian threat.

Whereas when you look at our non-mage characters, they tend to have different cores. Rayla and Soren are clear cut Protectors, for better or for worse. Ezran and Janai both continually seek Change and healing. And often times these goals can go hand in hand! Wanting to protect someone can be a Fixer urge (Claudia, Viren, Callum); wanting to fix your mistakes by Protecting someone can also work (3x09 with Soren; Rayla with Zym). But that could be a whole dissection/analysis for another day.

Back to Callum and Viren.

I think sometimes stripping them down to more monstrous or angelic forms comes from people thinking only one thing can motivate a character at a time, even though we as humans obviously have multiple motivations or responses at a time, particularly for villainous characters.

Viren can turn back to help the Queens of Duren because he feels guilty (this was his plan), he wants to help and knows he can make a difference, and because he wants to feel like a hero. Callum can be accepting Rayla unconditionally and be hurt about it and still trying to protect himself a bit in 4x09 by saying "I know" while not going after her; the same action can be growth and regression simultaneously.

When you write a character, you have to approach them from an interior to exterior process - the old phrase "everyone is a hero in their own mind" is certainly true, or rather, "everyone justifies their actions some way or another" - which is largely the opposite of how you view a character as an audience member. Not that the two can't be conflated or overlap, they certainly do (and you do want to be aware of how your characters may or may not come off to well, your audience) but it is a different kind of process.

For example, for Viren, he genuinely believes that what he's doing is what's best for humanity > his own gain. And while he's clearly lying and doing a lot of things out of self importance / convenience, the fact that he Believes the lie means that the lie doesn't really matter, internally, because it's something he either dismisses or doesn't think about at all. And Viren does have admirable traits: loyalty (and I would say most people have conditional loyalty anyway), cleverness/intelligence, ambition, hardworking, globally minded, etc. But a lot of this stems from Wanting To Be Special/Important (his core, arguably, and one I think a lot of people would relate to) and when that doesn't often pan out, he crumbles. Him having an inflated sense of self importance means that he's used to thinking he probably knows better than other people (and gets very frustrated when they don't listen and/or agree with him) and thinking you know better than other people also bodes very well with, if taken to extremes, blatantly dehumanizing them (omg dark magic ideology hi!). He presents as being confident and smooth and knowledgeable, but every time we see him alone/internal he's almost always a hot mess or wracked with guilt/doubt, and he's not very good at adapting to shit, like at all, even if he's great at being cruel/brutal and pragmatic. He's also often times awkward when presented with openly joking/teasing affection, is a guy who waves to little kids, makes dorky jokes with his best friend, and genuinely loved (loves?) his kids once upon a time.

For Callum, a lot of his traits are a double edged sword as well. His attention to detail is born from his curious and observant nature. This allows him to be incredibly nurturing and considerate, but also lets him go for the jugular and what would hurt the most in a fight when his temper gets going. He wants to make his loved ones lives better/easier, but this can sometimes be at the expense of what they need or being overprotective. This can sometimes tie a bit into Viren's own "I know better than you" even if Callum doesn't usually go that far, as he has more self awareness. He has a strong sense of right and wrong but is willing to bend without defense if he thinks the ends justify the means (i.e. never defending his dark magic use, and unlike Claudia, believing/knowing that dark magic is wrong - whereas she doesn't think anything of the sort - but using it and being tempted by it anyway, even if he rejects it in 2x08). His determination is great but can lead to him being obsessive, even if he's also good at knowing his limits / when to yield and fold on things, and will often fold first. While this is great in his relationships and doing relationship repair, it's not so good for his goal setting, as it means he can have a defeatist attitude and then grow frustrated when that "I can't do the thing I want to do / do anything" comes in full swing. This makes him lash out because he hates feeling helpless, particularly when it comes to the people he loves, and all of that circles back to what I've said above, in that he loves his self proclaimed "inner circle" more than "anyone or anything". Just cause he's sweet and goofy and caring doesn't mean he doesn't have teeth (a temper, a ruthless side, etc).

TLDR; characters contain multitudes in their internal psychology and if you can figure out what a character's psychological core is, you'll have a much larger but more cohesive range to write from, emotion / action(s) wise. Feel free to give your happier, more sunshiney characters an edge / claws and fangs (just because someone is nice doesn't mean they're good; external presented attitude is not everything and certainly not necessarily morality) and your edgier, evil characters some redeeming and/or admirable qualities.

#tdp viren #tdp callum #characterization #thanks for asking #pedanticseal #writing advice #tdp claudia #requests #analysis series #analysis #this got so long i'm sorry #did this make sense? hopefully the bulk of it makes sense #that said u (or anyone else) feel free to ask for expansion and/or clarification on anything #callum #viren

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kesleyjo · 8 months

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I'm having some finale wine and I think I've got it. My final resolute head canon of Riverdale.

Keep in mind I have not watched the end of season 5 through the end and have absolutely no intention to, but I've seen and heard enough about *gestures vaguely* all of that to still stand by this.

Disclaimer: I do not believe this is what the writers intended whatsoever. This is all my imagination. I do however believe in this canon whole heartedly and its as true to me as whatever RAS's vision is to him. You choose who to trust.

Okay so first and foremost the entire series is written by Jughead. It's all his writings that are probably all sitting in a google docs draft folder.

I justify this due to the following:

He is the narrator

The entire series is obsessed with Betty Cooper for good or ill (I'll get to it)

Its all kind of sort of been alluded to that its all Jughead's writings anyway. At least in S1, again. I'll get to the why of that in a second.

He started writing season 1 in his junior year (so a year after the events of the S1). He read In Cold Blood (on his own, not for class, very important to him that you all know this) and was like "Hey my town had a murder and I have some trauma around it, so I should totes do this." And thus S1 is born.

This is why that season is (relatively) more grounded and far more realistic than the rest of the series because its based on a real true thing that happened and the real feelings and emotions of people involved. It has the least amount of exaggeration (but enough, because Jughead) and has the most coherent plot, which would make sense since Jughead isn't making anything up, he is recalling events.

This is also the only season that directly ties Jughead's narration and the plot to the book Jughead is writing on page, and thus tying them both together. Because again, its a thing that really happened.

So the characterizations, motivations, and actions of everyone in season 1 is the model of how and how these characters actually are and are a base for further exaggeration.

Seasons 2-4 are also based on true events but are exaggerations/interpretations of things that really happened, but are altered to make them more interesting to Jughead's readers (heh).

I don't want this post to be a novel so here is a brief listing of that I am thinking here for some of the main plots (but if you have a plot you want me to fit into this canon let me know):

The Black Hood: When Jughead showed Betty his first manuscript (S1) the positive constructive criticism she gave was that, "True crime is really popular right now, so this fits in with the zeitgeist." And Jughead ran with it. Fred also had his first heart attack at this time...we all know where I'm going with that so I'll just leave that there. RIP.

Making Hal the Black Hood: Hal leaves the family after the Polly debacle and finding some racy pics on Betty's computer (she sent them to Jug, she wasn't a camgirl) and decides to start his life over with a woman who is far more moral (and probably like 2 years older than Polly)

The Serpents/Class War with Hiram: Not a gang, just those under the boot of the rich that Hiram tries to eradicate through good ol fashioned gentrification. Archie and Veronica also start spending more time doing rich people shit and that drives a divide between the two main couples of the core four. But less about political plots and more about teenagers growing apart because of different interests

Season 3: Putting this all together because Jughead was having a hard time finding a plot here. So he focused on Alice's new weird young boyfriend who actually ended up taking off with Polly (leaving her twins), his newfound obsession with DnD (Betty was exhaustedly supportive of this) and Kevin's endless talk about the new megachurch he just joined. He and Betty also started watching a lot of horror films and Hitchcock at the time which leads us to...

Season 4: He and Betty go off to different schools but its because of college, not because Jug is the chosen one (again see why he is writing all of this himself). He meets a lot of pretentious people that challenge his relationship with Betty and he turns it into a mystery.

So now we have made it to 4.17. Ugh.

Okay so Jughead has written all of this, and reading everything back feels that Archie and Betty (who go to the same college now and are friends again after growing apart after he dated Veronica) have grown too close and Jug self destructs.

He self sabotages so hard and makes a story up in his head that Betty would be much happier with Archie who is doing perfectly mediocre at college while Jughead flunked out.

So he and Betty break up after a lot of frustrated fighting.

And he begins to write Betty differently. Wildly differently.

(You can't tell me this doesn't make more sense than whatever the hell happened in the show.)

Jughead dejected from his failure at school and his breakup Writes on and off for the next few years. His next main attempt is S5. His attempt at more realistic writing.

(Its also after Betty enters his life again, because at her core Betty is his muse)

He works through his fictional frustrations of Betty and Archie as a possible couple (They never dated. Archie is actually a aromantic pansexual who does not do commitment) and realized that he made it all up and they have nothing in common.

Jughead and Betty get back together at the end of "Season 5" but Betty tells him that writing about their real life is what tore them apart, so he needs to not use their relationship in his writing anymore.

So Jughead decided to get weird and wildly experimental with his writing. And because Jughead is not a particularly good writer S6 and S7 are born.

Betty, absolutely running out of positive things to say about his last few writing attempts tells him that maybe these exaggerated versions of their lives that bear no resemblance to the real world have run their course, and he should try something new.

So Jughead wraps up this now unrecognizable series of writings and moves onto something new.

With Betty diligently serving as his editor. She got distracted with her new job and left him unattended for those last few seasons and look what happened.

Also I realize that Archie/Veronica/Cheryl/Toni are absent in this so briefly

Archie: He always was in awe of Archie and slightly jealous of what he perceived he had over Jughead...this is why he is the quasi-hero and also why he tortures Arch and treats him like an idiot.

Veronica: I cannot stress this enough. He and Veronica have no relationship. She is his friend's girlfriend and his girlfriend's best friend. The only thing he really knows about her is she is rich and hot. So he makes that her core personality and slaps on whatever traits fit her best for whatever plot he is writing at the time.

(This is also why almost all the women Veronica, Tabitha, Jessica, and Toni all are at some time his love interest. Self instert fan fic Jug. We see you.)

Cheryl/Toni: He and Toni are friends and Cheryl is her girlfriend who endlessly terrifies him. That is the core of her characterization.

I already regret the fact that I am sharing this long-winded mess with the world...but I can't take it back now.

Enjoy. And if you don't that is fine. It's my head canon not yours. Go make your own.

Have fun on finale night folks.

#rd spoilers #not really but for safety #head canon #this is a mess #but I stand by it #I didn't proof this and I'm a glass of wine in so be gentle

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starrynightzie · 9 months

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I mostly wanted this acc to be specifically for art, not rly for anything else but i need to get this off my chest. Obviously if you’ve been on twitter, you’ve probably seen a lot (and i mean a LOT) of hate towards gay ships/shippers recently, (first w togachako, then w stsg) i wanna address all the weird shit thats been happening w jjk dudebros lately. Idk what it is but they’re rly upsetti spaghetti abt even the mere thought of stsg being more than platonic besties, going so far as to shoot down any hint of them being romantically inclined in the slightest - so i thought that i’d take it upon myself to provide poof that stsg has queer, romantic subtext since ppl are being extremely obtuse abt them, all for the sake of protecting their friendship from us evil gays. (other shippers do this too but im mostly focusing on dudebros bc they’re the ones primarily acting like assholes to us for no reason, like yeah, sure, some stsgs are extremely cringey & weird but that can be said for ANY shipper in ANY fandom. When you’re in a fandom as big as this, of course there’s gonna be some bad eggs, it’s inevitable.

ok so. !!DISCLAIMER!! i do not speak japanese, so if i say something incorrect then please correct me. i’ve done enough research to be sure that what im saying is right, but im only human, and sometimes, i might be wrong. so, take what im abt to say with a grain of salt. (just in case).

first off, it should be stated that gege akutami, the creator himself, is an avid bl fan (and ik what ur thinking, ‘oh, that doesn’t mean anything! just bc u read bl, it doesn’t mean you’re likely to write gay relationships into ur own manga!’ which is true, gege HAS said that he doesn’t want to write romance in jjk. HOWEVER, as much as i love stsg & see them in a romantic light, i do definitely think that the reason why their relationship feels so ambiguous is bc gege intentionally made it that way. i think he made their relationship up to the individual’s interpretation. And for ppl who’re thinking ‘why would he do that?’ well, he doesn’t like writing romance, right? so this is the next best thing he could do. and also i have to point out (in case ppl get defensive), gege literally does not and will never care if ppl ship stsg or not, again, he’s a bl fan and if anything - all of the evidence that im going to talk abt proves that he most likely ships stsg himself, so… 🤷‍♂️

2. i’d like to talk about s2’s op & ed which are HEAVILY romantically coded. If you don’t know, the op was written to be from gojo’s pov & vice versa with geto for the ed, the op in particular is a very special case. The song is explicitly abt reminiscing the past , wishing gojo had noticed geto’s sorrow sooner and it also mentions a ‘silent love’. the word ‘love’ being used here is ‘koi’ which EXCLUSIVELY means romantic love… now, since this song was specifically written with gojos pov in mind, doesnt it seem kind of weird to have the word for ‘romantic love’ in there?? (koi can be referred to as ‘young love’ or having a ‘crush’ on someone…. hm… ThAts WeIrD.) instead of using ‘ai’??? which would make more sense if stsg were just besties bc ai is more general and can be used towards friends & family.

and then ofc there’s the whole theme of ‘blue spring’. director park (who directed s1 & jjk 0) has stated in an interview that geto was gojo’s last warm spring of youth. now if you dont know, spring of youth/blue spring means a time in a young person’s life where they have hope and happiness… in animanga, it often means falling in love too… so judging by this, it seems very likely that gojo perhaps developed feelings for geto during their teen years together. Director park has also mentioned in an interview that gojo & geto’s relationship goes beyond ‘friendship’ & being ‘familial’. 👀

3. another clear indicator of gojo being in love w geto is the whole ‘love is the most twisted curse of all’ spiel he said to yuta. ‘but he could mean platonic love!!’ idk, considering yuta had romantic feelings for rika and hes discussing them with gojo & gojo knows this, dont u think it’d be a bit weird for him to mention geto here too? if they were just best friends?? (that’s not even mentioning the fact that gojo & geto’s relationship is supposed to parallel yuta & rika’s in jjk 0…)

4. and then ofc we have gojo saying his last words to geto, which were censored. now, correct me if im wrong but the ONLY times ive ever seen inaudible dialogue being mouthed to another character is when its a love confession mostly seen in romance anime. and like, there’s also no need at all for gojo’s last words to be censored in the first place. (although, i do suspect that his last words may play a major role in the future when he faces kenjaku.) what solidifies it for me being a love confession is that, 1. geto blushed after gojo said whatever it is that he said to him, (only in the manga tho, idk why they didnt make him blush in the movie but its whatever.) and geto replies with, depending on the translation, ‘at least curse me a little at the very end’ or ‘you should at least curse me at the end’. which heavily implies that gojo said something extremely sweet & heartfelt to him as his final words. and if thats not enough to convince u that gojo’s last words were indeed a love confession.. gojo’s eng VA HIMSELF, said that his last words when translated into english means three words… im not saying that gojo’s last words were specifically ‘i love you’ or anything like that, but i am definitely sure that whatever he said was a love confession/something very romantic in nature. bc why else would gege choose to draw geto blushing?? that wouldnt make any sense.

gojo also killed geto on the 24th of december, which in japan, is the most romantic day of the year & couples in japan treat christmas eve as kinda like a separate valentines day. even in the jjk manga recently, gojo offered to fight on dec 24th & kenjaku mocks him by saying how romantic it is… even gege himself acknowledges how romantic christmas eve is in japan, this enforces the idea that gege must’ve chosen dec 24th for a reason, bc why else would he have picked an extremely romantic date as not only the day where he fights kenjaku who is inhabiting geto’s body, but also making it the day geto died?? yall have to remember that all of this has been planned out by gege, none of it is a coincidence… he didn’t just come up with all of this on the spot, he’s been planning this stuff & thinking about it for literal years.

5. and finally, probably the BIGGEST piece of evidence there is, geto & gojo’s character songs. gege chose romantic break up songs for BOTH of them.. like im sorry but if stsg were rly truly only best friends, he would not have chosen those songs for them, it just doesnt make any sense.

conclusion: obviously, this probably isn’t every subtextually romantic thing about stsg’s relationship but these are all the things that i’ve noticed. again, if you see their relationship as purely platonic then that’s fine but don’t be assholes to people for seeing romantic subtext that’s quite clearly there. if i have missed anything out then please let me know and i’ll edit them into the post.

#jujutsu kaisen #sorcery fight #jujutsu gojo #gojo satoru #satoru gojo #geto suguru #suguru geto #stsg #satosugu #sugusato #jjk analysis

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mobius-m-mobius · 5 months

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I know I am wildly late to this observation, but I just rewatched Thor for the first time in a very long while, and. I'd genuinely forgotten that at the start Thor is headed down a path at least as dark as Loki's? I mean Loki is making very extremely bad choices, but Thor isn't exactly less horrifying with his whole jumping straight to the 'lets "break the spirit" of an entire realm by murdering as many of them as it takes' shtick. And it's just so clearly laid out that the divergent paths they are on by the end of the first film isn't illustrative of some inherent difference in their natures or predetermined by choices they'd made before the film started. The difference is that Thor gets the opportunity to love and be loved by people outside the skewed and insulated world he grew up in, to be loved without strings attached, and discovers that the friends he had all along loved him more unconditionally, aside from his power and conquests, than he'd realized. While Loki learns that their father attaches all sorts of strings to his love, and 'learns' (somewhat truthfully with regard to Odin I think, though not with Thor or Frigga), that the love he had from them was always conditional, mitigated, based on lies and offered to a version of himself that never existed.

And I just—my point isn't 'you can't blame him for his war crimes 'cause he was sad', just that. Man it really was about love from the very beginning!!!

(P.S. I sent you an inordinately long series of messages about s1 Loki a couple weeks back, and your response was delightful, and added excellent points—just wanted to say that you; that was lovely of you, and I really appreciate how kind you always are on this blog!!)

Hey there anon, lovely to hear from you again! Thank you so much for your own kind words and taking the time to send another message! Your previous ones were a wonderful read as is this and as far as I'm concerned there's no such thing as being late to anything that isn't already scheduled, especially regarding media or fandom when there's a chance to discover someone/something new around every corner 💖💖

(Case in point how unexpected getting this captivated by a Marvel series was for me, which I only bring up because, well... quick disclaimer, I have an understanding of everything that happened in phase 1 but haven't exactly seen any of the Thor movies or until a few weeks into the airing of Loki had any real exposure to anything Marvel/Loki related between the original Avengers movie and then, which ironically I love because the moment S1 kicks off Loki's journey is where my perspective starts as well!)

As Loki mentioned many times previously, Thor truly wasn't ready to rule back then (not that Loki was either, lol) and you're not only exactly right about them both going down dark paths but I see Thor's view as worse considering he grew up surrounded by a level of confidence in companionship Loki never knew. The attack on Jotunheim pretty much says it all when Thor didn't hesitate to use hurt pride as an excuse to kill as many Frost Giants as possible, then after getting an entire war kicked off all Thor's friends were actually angrier with Loki for letting news of their visit get back to Odin despite the fact that they would've all been killed otherwise 🙃

Odin not being the best father to either of them is an understatement but there are unspoken conditions to his interactions with and love for Loki specifically due to his birth that (by nature of what an imposing figure Odin is) would almost subliminally impact everyone within range so I can't even imagine growing up in the midst of that and having no idea of the real cause, though I don't doubt Frigga's love for him or that the Thor of now wants them to be equals. It really does all come back to love from beginning to end, and makes it all the more important that Loki finally found that love and acceptance beyond his wildest dreams in Mobius so here we are now just waiting for them to find their way back to each other :')

#yes i'm aware of the universe audibly laughing at me as i devote my life to a marvel property lol #all bc of silver dilf owen wilson. the mcu knew mine and loki's weakness was a time bureaucrat with a heart of gold before we did 😔🙏#and ty again for the ask!! i might not know quite as much about things outside the loki series but love learning about them in comparison #just previously had little mcu interest and now very limited free time that only goes towards watching owen related media 😂#but i completely agree with all the points you made and have interestingly noticed they're ones not often acknowledged in the fandom #also always appreciate so much when anyone thinks of me when something about the show or anything else is on their mind!!#sending lots of love your way towards an amazing weekend! 💕#ask

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bugsbenefit · 2 years

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thoughts on the time skip and how it could tie in perfectly with Mike getting targeted early on

with Mike being such a central character to Will’s And El’s character it really seems like he has one of the biggest targets on his back narrative wise during the next season. especially since Mike was the only character to directly and verbally confirm that he will help Will kill Vecna he now isn’t just one of many threats Vecna could possibly face but also directly standing between him and Will, who’s Vecna’s most reoccurring target (this turn of Mike siding himself with Will isn’t even just told to us in the cabin scene but also later reinforced with the ending shot of Mike being the only one to stand directly by Will’s side)

i do really like the possibility of Mike getting targeted or temporarily taken out at the beginning of the season, but then ended up wondering how that would actually play out in the greater narrative. could they really skip forward a year while leaving this open ended for the characters? and well, there are definitely some interesting ways this could tie in with the story currently being set up:

the impending time jump is one of the things that’s been bothering me the most ever since s4 aired. (in one interview the Duffers estimated it after e2, this may have changed in the writing process but seems to be the best guess we can go off of right now) it’s always hard to incorporate time skips During a season without it feeling rushed. you essentially have to re-meet the characters halfway through. because it doesn’t matter if you tell the audience “none of them changed”, relationships will progress, especially if you jump 1+ year(s) forward. and i’ve really been racking my brain about how season 5 could actually pull off a time jump without essentially having to “start over” since that usually kills the drive and action for a bit which is a bad pace for a final season.

and so, usually, the only really good excuse to abandon your characters for an extended period of time while avoiding having two “beginnings” is to ensure that the characters have no chance to drastically evolve off screen. and in my experience there’s only really one way to show that the characters start back up where we left them. and it’s by breaking up the group.

friendships and relationships are halted that way, the audience knows they’re not missing any critical development. often character arcs are also halted this way in ensemble heavy stories since moving characters away from the group often removes the driving factor of character conflict and development.

IT is a very good example of this. (disclaimer: talking about the book, i haven’t seen any of the movies) the book jumps back and forth between the adults and their kid selves (shown in flashbacks) interestingly, the adult and kid characters are still very familiar despite the characters having lived almost 30 years off page. this is because their character arcs only start majorly moving again when their group reunites since they’re all tied to each other. the book is imo one of the best examples of “they all go their separate ways and find back together” since you really never feel like you missed out on something during the time skip

but while splitting up is usually the best approach to time skips, splitting up the ST cast seems very extreme, because how would this feasibly happen? they’re all back in Hawkins at the end of s4. so while having the characters not interact much for a year or two would probably keep the audience the most invested in the characters... how would this happen without feeling like it came out of nowhere?

and. well. it Did surprise me a bit how easy it would be to explain with story beats we were already shown.

watching the show it’s actually interesting how far the group drifts from each other. it’s also a frequent complaint i’ve seen from viewers: we start with a close knit friend group in s1. but s2 already breaks from that idea a bit by having the hospital and non hospital group. Will and Mike are doing their own thing, and even before Will gets possessed Mike actively pushes their friends away who are trying to help. and as the seasons progress and more characters become important they start splitting off. Dustin is usually with the older teens or Erika and rarely with all of the party. El and Mike were established to neglect their friends for a whole summer. and then in s4 this reaches a peak and is finally starting to get addressed. Max ghosts them. Will and Mike barely talk. and the argument that is highlighted between Lucas and Mike IS about the party splitting up and going their own ways. and it doesn't get resolved by the end of the season.

so we’re actually already left with a set up where the integrity of the group dynamic got repeatedly challenged and then finally verbally called out during s4. the idea that this could be built on during s5 isn’t that far off, especially given that the argument between Lucas and Mike is still open ended

interestingly enough. if we’re actually getting a scenario of Vecna targeting Mike pre time jump, Will’s love confession about Mike being the heart of the party could actually be some really cruel foreshadowing.

because what Would happen if Mike was out of the picture for the time skip? well thankfully Will actually went out of his way to tell us this last season. the group would fall apart.

the line did always feel significant to me. it seems very deliberate narrative wise to have Will not only point out Mike’s importance to their friend group, literally calling him the heart twice, but also mentioning what would happen if Mike wasn’t there.

just throwing ideas out there but this could play out as them genuinely growing further apart without having Mike act as their heart /glue in this case. or them growing more focused on their individual goals without Mike acting as a unifying factor since he’s always been the unofficial leader of the group, their DM. this could have El and Lucas stuck trying to find Max, possibly with different approaches too thanks to their different abilities (we’ve seen Lucas read to her, El was trying to find her in the Void etc). we were already shown that Dustin would stick to the town and school, the Duffers confirming he would be dealing with grief over Eddie also fits that picture. and all this would leave Will on his own, most definitely clinging onto the hope that Mike is still alive which would give us the perfect parallel to s1 like we were told we would get. however, this time it wouldn’t be Will who’s missing

#this wasn't supposed to be this long originally but after i started writing it really hit me how plausible a group split would actually be #even just based on the events we've already seen on screen #the fact that this would also perfectly tie into the possibility of Mike being out of the picture for a while is just a +#Stranger things theory #mike wheeler #mike gets vecna'd #mike hostage theory #will byers #byler

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pynkhues · 6 months

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I recently watched The Newsreader because I saw some mutuals on another site posting about it and really enjoyed it! Was wondering (a) if you've seen it/the most recent series and (b) whether you had any other Australian tv recs? I just realized I've seen very very few Australian shows and am looking to check out some more.

Yes! The Newsreader's so good! I actually haven't gotten around to watching a2 yet, so I am a bit behind, but I loved s1 a lot. Sam Reid and Anna Torv are always great, but I have a big soft spot for William McInnes - he's lowkey an Australian TV icon.

And yeah! Look, Australian TV's a mixed bag - it's criminally underfunded and operates in a really different way to American and UK TV (funnily enough, a lot of what the WGA strike was fighting against - in particular mini rooms, writers not being on set and the lack of a showrunner - are industry standard here), so I do think a lot of Australian shows tend to be undercooked.

But! Let's focus on the good, because there is still a lot of good. I wasn't sure what you fancied, especially since The Newsreader touches on so many genres, so I've tried to breakdown genres and rec that way. Hopefully there's something here that piques your interest :-)

Drama

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I've spruiked Safe Home on here a few times before, but it really is just such a great little series. It's about a women's community legal centre who poaches a publicist from a major lawfirm when they discover they're at risk of being defunded by the government. They mean to use her to try and raise the profile of the non-profit legal centre, but end up throwing her in the deep end when it comes to stories of family violence which make up the majority of the centre's clients. It's harrowing in parts, but also emotionally rich, full of interesting relationships and feels pretty tragically true to life. It's only a miniseries, which is a bit of a bummer, because I really feel it could've kept going.

Other dramas:

Total Control - an Aboriginal woman is recruited as a senator by the prime minister after she has a heroic moment facing off against a gunman outside a courthouse. The premise sounds a little soapy, but Total Control is a really compelling political drama that explores the complexity of being a First Nations woman and a First Nations politician in a colonial state. Deb Mailman is it as an actress too, quite frankly.

Love Me - a relationship drama, Love Me focuses on three different generations within one extended family as they pursue romance. The show steers clear of schmaltz though as its particularly about the desire for intimacy and the complexity of being vulnerable with a new person, and I think it lands to mixed effect throughout the series, but man, when it lands, it really lands. Fair warning, there's pretty explicit sex in this (although very tenderly done! And I went to an amazing panel with the intimacy coordinator on it who was so interesting talking about it all). Also: Hugo Weaving in his best role in a minute.

The Lost Flowers of Alice Hart - full disclaimer, I haven't finished watching this one yet, but I've enjoyed what I've seen so far! Plus they somehow managed to get Sigourney Weaver in it?? Wild. It's about a girl who's reunited with her estranged grandmother on a flower farm after her parents die in a mysterious housefire. CW though for incest and family violence (although that's before Alice ends up with her grandmother).

Dramedy

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Offspring is proooobably my favourite Australian show ever? Or at least it will forever rank top five. It's part romantic-comedy, part family-drama, part medical procedural, and part ever growing portrait of birth and death as it follows Nina, who's both obstetrician and chronic sufferer of Middle Child Syndrome, her older sister and little brother, and their divorced-sometimes-still-hooking-up parents. It's funny and charming, but has also made me sob like no other show on TV, so if you're ever in the mood for something like that, this is your pick.

Other dramedies:

Deadloch - I've posted a million gifsets of this show, haha, which actually seems to have picked up tumblr traction (unheard of for an Australian show!) but it's both a hilarious spoof of nordic crime mysteries, and a genuinely great crime series. Plus it is the most sapphic show you'll watch in a minute.

The Let Down - a really sweet, funny dramedy about new parents navigating life with a baby, while also looking pretty keenly at postpartum depression. Just watching the trailer made me want to watch it again, haha, but also my sister worked on it, so I might be a little biased.

Bump - okay, I'm just realising how many dramedies Australia makes about having kids, haha, but this is just a cute little YA show about a teenage girl who doesn't realise she's pregnant suddenly having a baby. It's a lot about parenthood, particularly about her own relationship with her mother, but it also leans into so many

Comedy

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I've actually only just watched Fisk with a friend, but am enjoying it so so much. It's got Kitty Flanagan, a beloved Australian comedian in it, and features her as a newly divorced, freshly fired contract lawyer who ends up back in Melbourne at a wills and estates law firm having to deal with people (and grieving people!) for the first time in a hot minute. It's very funny, but also just totally charming, and the cast of characters feels pretty fresh for this sort of fish-out-of-water sitcom.

Other comedies:

Utopia - imagine The Office, The Thick of It and Veep had a baby! Part office-drama, part bureaucracy political hellscape! It's set in a fictional government department called the National Building Authority that manages infrastructure and it's very funny. If you're in the Succession fandom too, Sarah Snook's husband's a lead in it!

Upper Middle Bogan - okay, the trailer for this one isn't very good, but I love this show a lot. The premise is a woman in an upper middle class family discovers suddenly that she was adopted, and her biological parents were teenagers when they had her and are - - well, bogans, which is basically the Australian equivalent of a hillbilly. It's funny, but also genuinely just has a really big heart.

Black Comedy - I do find this pretty hit or miss, but its a sketch show, so I feel like that comes with the territory. But! This is an Indigenous sketch comedy show! And man, when it's good, it's really, really good.

Period drama

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Okay, this is kind of a cheat, because it's not really a period drama, but it's designed to feel like one. Plus! It has Sam Reid and Essie Davis in it! Three nuns who've been living isolated on an island together are faced with the modern world when a priest from the mainland arrives hoping to sell the island for redevelopment. Things get! Out of hand!

Other period dramas:

ANZAC Girls - World War I drama about ANZAC (Australia New Zealand Army Corps) nurses in the Gallipoli peninsula, which is largely regarded as the battle that made Australia 'come of age' through the tragedy of the loss.

New Gold Mountain - miniseries set within the Chinese community during Australia's Gold Rush. It loses its way a bit towards the end, but it's also a really thrilling little miniseries that provides a compelling insight into the culture clashes and interests of this early chapter in Australian history.

Crime

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Miss Fisher's Murder Mysteries is such a cult hit, and it's for good reason! Set in the 1920s in Melbourne, Phryne Fisher becomes a private investigator following her sister's disappeaarance. It's equal parts camp and dramatic, romantic and personal, and it just really scratches the itch of an oldschool murder mystery series. It's perfect.

Other crime series:

The Principal - a miniseries set in a rough highschool in Sydney where the faculty is left to deal with the fallout when a student's murder reignites racial tensions among the school community. It's heavy and harrowing, but also an insightful look at the broader fallout of a crime.

Wentworth - imagine a darker, grittier Orange is the New Black. Australian shows so rarely get more than three seasons because they no longer get government funding at that point which often makes them untenable, so its a testament to the quality and the audience of Wentworth that it lasted eight. If you want a show about dangerous women, you can't really get much better than this.

Science fiction / fantasy

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Australia unfortunately doesn't make a lot of science fiction, which always bums me out, but Cleverman was such an exciting series when it came out, and I think still has a real legacy in terms of entwining Indigenous cultures with genre storytelling. It's was created by Aboriginal writers and directors, and pulls Dreaming myths into a dystopian future in a way that's just so compelling. It's a pretty great series with a unique take on the genre.

Other science fiction / fantasy series:

Glitch - I mean, technically its a zombie series, but it really feels like so much more than that. A bunch of people come back from the dead in a small town in regional Australia, only they have no memories of their life before they died. It's a deeply felt series about grief, but also identity and relationships, and if you're into genre shows, this is definitely one to watch.

#hope you find something here you like!#i've tried to keep it to stuff that's fairly recent #but there's a lot of older stuff that's really good too #also your ask has definitely reminded me to watch s2 of the newsreader so thank you haha #tv asks #welcome to my ama

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thestobingirlie · 8 months

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are other people seeing romantic stobin way more often than i am? bc without any filtering or trying to avoid it i've seen maybe a dozen fics for them total (i've been in the fandom since s1 + tbh most were written before s3 even came out), and in the last year probably only 1. never once seen art or tumblr posts. yet every ship poll has a disclaimer about it, and some hc posts too, and some posts entirely about how much they hate it and random ass confessions talking about the evils of letting a man near a lesbian. from my pov, there's been WAY more talking about romantic stobin than actual romantic stobin

i know rule 34 and i'm sure there's more fic if i actually tried to hunt it down, but i never want to so it just feels like an invisible enemy i don't want to bother spending mental energy on

people just want something to complain about lmao. romantic stobin, like, barely exists. you really do have to search for it to find it. no one’s out and proud shipping robin with steve on tumblr, they’re all on facebook lmao. like you said, i’ve seen far more people complaining about romantic stobin than i’ve ever seen shipping them. (i do kinda think some people complaining about romantic stobin actually just hate stobin, but need a morally correct reason, so say shit like “people just like platonic stobin because they ship them!!!” (insane take))

ugh, every time i see a romantic ships poll and they’ve put “stobin (this is disgusting!! don’t click)” i just roll my eyes. like wow!! you’re such an activist! i’m so glad you don’t ship a lesbian and a man.

just don’t put them on there.

sorry, that’s a pet peeve of mine lmao.

#stobin #stranger things #asks #anon

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variousqueerthings · 3 months

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Hi!

I’m currently watching Doctor Who (2005) for the first time. Just finished season 4.

And I just read your post from last October (?), where you state that you dislike the character River Song. And even though this might sound a bit mean, I was so happy to read that I’m not alone in my strange aversion against this character from the very moment she appeared in the Library episode. Similar to you I just don’t like the fact, that one of the companions is getting this kind of super special treatment, especially when it is interwoven with a romance and even marriage.

Now I’m a bit apprehensive to start with season 5, because I know River Song will be a huge part of the plot... Is it possible to skip her episodes or would I get problems to follow the overarching story line, when doing so?

Something else I noticed and wanted to ask about is the fact that River Song only appeared in the TV series up to and including season 9 (according to the tardis wiki). I know there are many other kinds of media she appears in after 2015. But I’m curious if they indeed dropped the character in the TV show in some way after a couple of seasons?

So far I enjoyed Doctor Who immensely. It is a fun watch, a great opportunity to get lost in strange worlds and, on a more personal level, a nice way to relax after a busy workday. So I just don’t want to ruin this experience for myself, because I have to follow a character/ or a character construct I really don’t like.

And please don’t worry about giving away future plot points. At this point it is better for my enjoyment of the story to know what will happen, at least in regards to River Song.

SoooOOOoooooeeew hello first of all hello hi! welcome to Doctor Who! (I say, if you've seen s1-4/specials you're firmly In It!)

I want to disclaim to begin with, I know a lot of people do like River Song, and would rec seeing her narrative to understand her whole... Deal. I'm personally not a fan of that narrative, but I'll give you a rundown of it below and if you decide you wanna give it a looksee, or a partial watch, there are suggestions for some episodes including her below as well

to allay your fears that she's overpowering/unavoidable, she's kind of shockingly not, considering what M*ffat seemed to want from her. you can pretty much excise her episodes from the plot and miss almost nothing (and I let you know what you do miss below)

the seasons she's in the most are s5+6. she's only in two episodes in s7 and one more in s9 (with none in s8), which ironically does make it feel even odder to me that she's presented the way she is in s4. I know in the audio dramas she does meet other Doctors but in main canon on the show she meets 10 once, 11 a few times, and 12 once. compared to characters like the Master, Jack, even Rose and Clara according to M*ffat's own canon (these are episodes you will see, so you'll know what I mean at that point) she just doesn't compute for me as this "Most Important" thing that M*ffat tries to pull, in which her "specialness" feels incredibly linked to amatornormative monogamy (and generally M*ffat's penchant for introducing women as mysteries first, and characters second). Also in s5+6 especially she's presented as this uncomfortably "femme fatale" type character with dialogue that makes me want to claw my face off

I do have a watchlist that's for when I next go into this era that does skip the River Song episodes (that being said, I actually quite like her last episode. I have a theory that Peter Capaldi is such a grounding presence that over-the-top narrative and terrible dialogue is made emotionally resonant to me)

SO, first things first, I'll give you a rundown of her arc, and then a watchlist of how I intend to enjoy s5-7 moving forwards that you can totally follow

River Song canon (in brief): River Song is the child of Amy Pond (fifth/sixth season companion) and her husband Rory (also companion in those two seasons). Because she is conceived in the Tardis, she has some regeneration energy innate to her (I wasn't a fan of that personally). Before she is born a space cult that's obsessed with the Doctor for truly overblown reasons that are never fully delved into, but can be summed up as "Gallifrey is un-destroyed and the Doctor has the ability to bring it back into the Universe by using a passcode that's his name, and so this cult has formed in order to stop the Doctor discovering this fact and uttering his name," kidnaps Amy, replaces her with a flesh double who has Amy's memories, erases her knowing she's pregnant and then have her wake up in her real body at the moment of giving birth (if this all feels violating af, yes it is and it's never addressed)

then the Doctor and Rory go to rescue her, but in the moment they succeed, they discover that the baby Amy is holding is also a flesh double and the evil cult took her daughter/River from her and... *sigh please know I am only saying this because it's how they describe it on the show* "raise her to be the perfect psychopath" whose only wish is to kill the Doctor (all this training or whatever happens offscreen), but then the Doctor almost dies while saving her life and she gives up her regenerations to save him and the obsession turns into love, and so in summary her following the Doctor around is still centred around being groomed to be obsessed with the ground the Doctor walks on (okay can you tell I really really don't like this)

there is no examination of River's trauma in all of this, and only one moment related to Amy being angry she couldn't raise her child. There's also this creepy overtone of "The Doctor can't see you ageing because then he'll get bored of you" considering she was raised to have her whole selfhood revolve around him throughout her entire childhood

the final thing about River Song is that she was held in a top-security prison for awhile because she did end up killing the Doctor due to being "programmed" to, but the Doctor knows ahead of time that this will happen and so manages to change things so he doesn't die

SO that is River Song's arc in s5+6. now let's completely avoid it -- it's surprisingly easy:

ep 1. The Eleventh Hour (introduction episode)

ep 2. The Beast Below

[then come episodes Time Of Angels + Flesh & Stone. a double episode in which Amy meets the Angels and also River Song. the important thing here is that the main "mystery" are cracks in space and time that erase you from having ever existed. the other important thing here is that at the end of the episode Amy is about to get married and kisses the Doctor/tries to sleep with him the night before her wedding, and the Doctor Very Much Does Not Want This, which leads into the next story-]

ep 5. The Vampires Of Venice

ep 6. Amy's Choice

[NOW WE ARRIVE AT THE FIRST SNAG -- if you want the rest of this season's mystery, you should simply watch the rest of the season. This will include River Song in the final two episodes being involved in that mystery, but if you'd rather jump to where I personally think things get interesting again, or gauge if you're up for it, here's the short rundown of salient points:

Rory is swallowed by the cracks in time and Amy forgets his existence (but the Doctor doesn't)

Rory is brought back as an auton/living plastic out of Amy's subconscious memory of him and accidentally shoots Amy due to programming while they're in Roman-era Britain

Amy is then put into a stasis chamber for 2000 years until she can be brought back out and revived using modern technology, and auton-Rory guards that stasis chamber for 2000 years

the cracks in time came from the Tardis exploding, which is making the universe implode, but they fix that

the Doctor closes the cracks in space/time and everything is reset, including Amy's parents returning from non-existence, and Amy and Rory get married -- to be clear, we never see Amy's parents again, nor are they mentioned in the future, so this catharsis is kind of irrelevant

There is a very famous episode in this called "Vincent and the Doctor." it's about Vincent van Gogh. the only thing you need to know going in is that during this point in the timeline Amy doesn't know that Rory used to exist, otherwise it's a solid standalone episode]

ep 3. The Curse Of The Black Spot (to note, I always think this episode makes more sense directly after Amy's Choice as a "they're not married yet, but they're solving their relationship issues now," because s5 never has them adequately deal with their relationship issues, but s6 is solid on that front, but that's just me)

ep 4. The Doctor's Wife

ep 9. Night Terrors (to note, this episode takes place right after they discover that River is their daughter who was stolen from them. notice how this just... never comes up)

ep 10. The Girl Who Waited

ep 11. The God Complex (to note, this is the perfect final episode for the Ponds, but I will rec two more that come next season)

Season six can genuinely just be watched as these five episodes and it's quite an enjoyable season. The only thing that hints properly at a connective tissue related to River Song is that Amy in the first two both is-and-isn't-pregnant (because Amy is a flesh-double in the first two episodes) according to the Tardis scanner, and she sometimes sees a mysterious woman with an eye-patch. this is her briefly slightly waking up while captured

neither of these are relevant to the episodes they appear in

QUICK NOTE: in the first episode of this season the Doctor discovers a strange woman who has been turned into a Dalek, called Oswin. He never sees the face of this woman, but we do, and it's someone who returns again in another lifetime, under the name of "Clara Oswald" -- I do not recommend this first episode, it is Very Very bad)

4. The Power Of Three (to note, this could form a good coda for the Pond narrative and it's a fun episode, but it's not necessary to end their story if you're happy with The God Complex finishing things)

[you can watch episode 5 "The Angels Take Manhatten" if you want (I mean, you can watch anything you want). it's the official canon departure of the Ponds. it's not great, but it's not the worst episode. River Song is there, but it's not so egregious in terms of writing. if you don't want to watch it: they go back in time, there are angels, they send Rory and Amy back in time and the Doctor can't follow them there because of squiggly wuiggly logic, and so they are left to "live to death" -- Amy writes the Doctor a goodbye note in which she says she and Rory have had a very happy life together]

we have now gone past the River Song narrative for the most part, although she turns up in a genuinely not bad cameo in the s7 finale that interacts a little bit with the library episode -- do note that at this point she and the Doctor are *sigh* married I guess. I have mixed feelings about the s7 finale episodes, but it's not because of her character, and I think the latter half of s7 is worth watching for you to form your own opinion of all of it

She appears again in the Christmas special of s9, which I quite enjoyed. I think also Alex Kingston has way better chemistry with Capaldi, and I sometimes think the show knew this too, because they literally at one point had her describing Eleven/Matt Smith as looking like a 14 yr old, which is... such an odd way to describe the seeming "love of your life" or whatever

so that's it for River Song. Hope this all made sense, let me know if you have any other questions

I have a separate list I'm developing like this for Clara's era, but she might be more your cup of tea, so I'll let you engage with her for yourself to gauge. Can always reach out if you're not quite vibing with her, or if you really really are, I'd love to know your thoughts!

#doctor who #dw #im watching nu!who #im watching eleven who #anon ❤

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stayarmytinyzenmoa-l · 2 years

Text

Prominence [WCh. 2.65]

Social Media AU ; Idol AU ; Added Unit AU CW/TW: Language Genre: Comedy, Romance Pairing: NCT x Idol!Reader, Seonghwa x Reader Y/N Pronouns: Female (She/Her) Word Count: 5.0K

Notes: I originally split this chapter because it was too long and then I ended up making it longer lmaooooo so here's the once in a blue moon long chapter because I cannot for the life of me figure out how to make it shorter or how to nicely split it without breaking the pacing. Disclaimer: Please remember that this is an AU and a work of fiction, obviously the idols mentioned/written about in this story would never partake in these actions. The idols mentioned in this work are meant to be seen more as face claims rather than the actual idols themselves.

Feedback is greatly appreciated!! Thank you for reading!

25 February 2022

Tapping the soju glass against the counter, you sighed and slid against the wood until your cheek hit the table. It was cool under you, at least. Your sight was maybe a little hazy, a mix of overall exhaustion and the few drinks you had. You did as you were instructed, dropping a quick tweet about how you and Jeno were strictly friends, and of course the comments flooded with the usual support and the few rude replies, which were soon drowned out by memes and rational responses. The usual day on Twitter. You had spent the last few hours scrolling through your tags, a toxic trait of yours, you know, but you couldn't help it. You needed to assess the situation before making any further moves in promotions or on social media, unless you wanted Suho and Seojoon on your ass again managing your socials, you'd rather not give them the extra work. It was only natural that you wouldn't have liked what you saw in your searches and tags. Somedays, it felt like whatever you did just wasn't enough. Your eyes glanced to the clock. It was nearing midnight, and you didn't think anyone would be showing up. How did you get into such a pitiful situation? Wait, you already knew the answer to that.

"(Y/N)! Hi! Are you already there?" Yangyang's voice was chipper. "Hey, sorry, something came up with the WayV guys, you know, they're sentimental so they won't let me out of this "family bonding" shit, so! So, so, I prepared a little surprise for you! You'll love it, I promise, and if you don't I know you'd be lying because I know you too damn well! Trust, okay?"

Yangyang had suddenly called you earlier, conveniently right as you arrived. There was a slight hint of laughter in his voice, the kind you knew him to have when he was planning something in particular. He never intended to come with you tonight, that much you knew for sure, and you were clever enough to put two and two together.

The person who was supposed to accompany you tonight was none other than the one who had been trying so hard to see you, and you had to give Seongwha credit for that. You're the stubborn one, and it was times like this when you could really sit and think about it when you wonder why? Why is he settling for you? Surely, there's someone else out there that could be his perfect half, and yet, here you are, staring at his contact picture. Maybe you should call him? You couldn't lie to yourself, you wanted to see him. Despite the fact that he was now nearly two hours late. Then again, when had any date of yours gone right? Did this count as a date? The sound of a cuckoo clock from the back room of the shop was enough to answer your questions.

"Auntie, can I just stay here a bit longer?" You ask. What could be holding him up? You wanted to call and ask, but at the same time, you felt obligated not to ruin the surprise. You knew they were in the midst of a tour, so you were certain that if anything it was practice holding him up, but goodness, you were worried about him. It was far too late.

"Stay as long as you need, hon," your aunt rubs your head affectionately before walking off to the back room. Your head felt heavy, maybe you shouldn't have drank while waiting, but there was no way you'd want to discuss anything heavy sober right now, you just wanted to relax. If you didn't have this, you'd be knocked out in bed by now.

Before you knew it, you were calling him, holding the phone to your ear. One ring, two rings, three rings, four, then it fell silent, the obnoxious beep tone playing instead and prompting you to leave a message. You hung up, lying back down against the counter. You heard the shop entrance open, as signaled by the quiet bell chime. Was it him? Was he here? You didn't have the energy to get up, your eyelids felt heavy, and the countertop was much too comfortable. Whoever entered took a seat next to you. You could see the polished combat boots, the dark jeans that had faded with age, and the loose chain that hung off the belt loop. You already knew who it was, and it wasn't who you would've ever expected to be here.

"(Y/N), it's not safe to fall asleep in restaurants," his voice was the same as you'd remembered it. Soft but strong, maybe a bit scratchy from lack of use and a bad smoking habit, but not enough for it to be worthy of note. You hadn't heard his voice for, what, a year now? For some reason, your mood only soured. "You should go home." A concerned sigh came from him.

"Did auntie call you?" You asked quietly, your words slightly muffled because of your squished face against the counter.

"I wouldn't be here otherwise," his voice was tired. You heard the sound of a lighter and, soon, the faint scent of smoke.

"Oi! Jung Kanghoon, you'd better not be smoking in my restaurant!" Your aunt's voice was clear. Your older brother made no effort to listen. Instead, he slid the pack towards you.

"No thanks, I have to take care of my throat more," you yawned. "Too many of those guys smoke in the dorms, I'm afraid I'm going to die of secondhand smoking or something," you sighed.

"Too many of them, huh?" Kanghoon sighs. "Were you waiting for someone?" You hear him slide the soju bottle away from you. You turned your head to the door. No one was coming any time soon.

"Yeah, I was," you sat up now and stared at your phone, looking at the one lone message from Yangyang.

'I'm sorry, I don't know where he is, he said he'd be there. You know I just wanted to help...' His heart was in the right place, it always was, and while you appreciated it, you hoped that he didn't take this to heart. Then, another text came in. 'Do you want me to head over there? I'll take you home.' You didn't respond, rather, you didn't have the chance to.

"Don't think he's going to show up though," you added. Kanghoon leaned one arm on the counter. The smell of smoke grew stronger. "So... you came running when auntie called you, but whenever I try to call you it's like I'm no one, huh?"

"You know it's not like that," Kanghoon took a drag of his cigarette. "Those are different, you're trying to get me to come over and get out of the house, and auntie told me that you're on your fourth bottle."

"Don't worry, I can drink more and be fine," you nodded. "So, what did you want to say to me?"

"Just go home, (Y/N)."

"I'll wait a little bit longer..."

"Go home. It's dangerous outside for an idol."

"It's not the first time he's been late to something."

"Stop being stubborn, go home." You glared at him and he only rose an eyebrow back.

"I hate how you do that," you grimaced. "Pulling your big brother card without saying it, jerk," you groaned and packed your things. "Hey, at least read my messages, okay? I'm worried about you."

"I'm more worried about you," Kanghoon reverses the topic back to you. "Take care, (Y/N), I know you're an adult now, but if you need anything, anything important, call me."

"Yeah, yeah, if you pick up," you waved him off. "Not even going to walk me home?" You ask. Kanghoon reaches over to your bag and you push his hand out of the way.

"If you're still sober enough to do that, then you're sober enough to walk a couple of blocks home," he turns back so that both of his arms were resting against the counter.

"Yeah, you're right," you crossed your arms. "Just would've been nice to actually catch up, you know? Or are you too busy to do that?" Kanghoon looks over at you, as usual, you couldn't read him at all, but you could make out a faint hint of concern.

"Good night, (Y/N)," he cuts off the conversation instead, turning away from you.

"Good night," you knew that you weren't going to get anything out of him, not tonight, at least. He watches you leave from the corner of his eye. Once the door closes, your aunt walks back out.

"Why did you call me?"

"Why else? She always listens to you," your aunt huffs. "I've been telling her to go home for the past hour, and here you come, tell her a couple of times, and she's gone! Stubborn as hell, why'd you raise her like that?"

"Rather her be too stubborn than for people to walk all over her."

"Like they do you?" His aunt places an ashtray on the counter.

"Of course," Kanghoon responds.

"I'm worried about her."

"You and her thousands of fans."

"That's different, Kanghoon. Before I was worried about how she was handling all of the publicity, but now I'm just worried about her wellbeing, all that stress on her, it's not healthy," your aunt spies your untouched bowl of ramen. "She walked in here and just sat there. I had a feeling she was waiting for someone, and usually she'd talk to me, at least. Instead, it looked like she was thinking of something the whole time, but she didn't know how to bring it up. She got off the phone with someone and, next thing I knew it, she was ordering bottles instead. I almost called her ex-boyfriend, but I figured that was probably why she was so lost in thought so I decided on you instead," she continues. "You're cruel though, Kanghoon, having her leave herself," she shakes her head.

"Whatever, she can handle it," Kanghoon puts out his cigarette against the ashtray. "I'm heading out."

"Kanghoon, you really should talk to your sister more, I'm being serious here."

"I know," he only nods his head. "You should've called Hamin."

"He's on a whole other continent, why call him when you live just down the street of her dorms?"

"It's actually a couple of blocks," Kanghoon's voice jumps at the last word just as his aunt hits his head with a wooden spatula.

"You're horrible, Kanghoon, what happened to the little boy who was attached to his siblings' hips? Hmm?"

"He grew up," Kanghoon ruffles his hair slightly while sitting back. He spots your wallet on the table and picks it up, rifling through the cards and bills, or lack thereof. He was still trying to figure out if you left it there on purpose, as if to probe him to pay you a visit to return it, or if you really were too drunk to realize.

"Kanghoon, none of that secretive bullshit, you talk to her. Get into her head, somehow, lord knows I can't do it. I don't know what she's thinking now, and I'm worried because of it." Kanghoon looks back at her. No words were exchanged, but there was that mutual understanding. Kanghoon, regardless, stepped out of the restaurant and back into the cold air. He adjusts his jacket just as he notices someone turn the corner. His hair was a mess and his coat buttoned incorrectly, wherever he was going, it was clear that he left in a rush.

In that instant, he and Park Seonghwa made eye contact.

Seonghwa skid to a stop when he saw the stranger, taking deep breaths to compose himself. Roughed in the edges, his jacket was worn and tattered in some spots, but the chains on his belt and around his neck were enough to distract from it. Seonghwa knew better to stare, but that old scar on the stranger's cheek was prominent. He shook his head, he had no idea he'd run into anyone tonight, much less a delinquent. He wasn't expecting to be late, who plans to be late anyway? It was supposed to be a quick trip to the company, just to kill time before heading here, he wanted to sort out his thoughts with Hongjoong, what with the possibility of a close friend of his being your stalker, if it was true, he figured he'd let Yangyang know, thinking that he'd be meeting him tonight. He wasn't expecting Eden to pull him aside to record some lines for a track he had in mind. Even when he insisted, Eden promised that it'd only take an hour.

Needless to say, it has been way more than an hour. Seonghwa figured it would be alright, Yangyang of all people would understand that work gets in the way sometimes. Until he saw Yangyang's contact name flashing across the screen, an incoming call from an unlikely source. It was that one-sided call that got Seonghwa running out of the recording studio as soon as he could.

"Hey, so, this is my fault. 100%, I should've made it clear but I was thinking it would've just been a nice surprise but, of course, whenever I plan things something always goes sideways. Like when I spilled coffee all over Red. But, anyway, yeah, I'm not meeting you tonight. It's (Y/N). I think there's something up with her, I don't think she's told you yet, but she's been getting these weird messages, we're also like 98% sure she has a stalker, and recently more stuff have been piling on her plate, just... just go spend time with her. She likes you a lot, like, disgustingly a lot. She has fun with Mark and I, but anyone can see the difference when she's with you, even if she denies it. Seriously, though, if you can't make it, just tell me now and I'll go there myself."

Like hell he was going to let Yangyang steal his thunder. He hung up the phone and came right here, taking a taxi the whole way and just barely being able to hide his face until he got to the front of the restaurant. He fixes his coat before walking at a brisk pace, noticeably toward the restaurant entrance. Kanghoon watched him as he did so.

Of course, Kanghoon knew who Park Seonghwa is. How could he not know the identity of the man who broke his little sister's heart? He may not have answered every one of them, but he certainly did read every message you sent to him about your relationship. Every message asking him to come out of his house to meet him or for them to come over to his house. He was sure that you'd found the one until that happened. If only he wasn't working, he would've said yes, no, he should've made time for you. That was beside the point now. Now, he read all the messages asking what you did to deserve what happened. He'd never forgive him for that. All those texts you'd sent him asking why, if he wasn't so busy with his job he would've come running, he swears. Regardless, Kanghoon stayed relaxed as he watched Seonghwa move, until finally he decided to spare Seonghwa the effort.

"She's not there anymore, you just missed her," Kanghoon pulls his keys out and Seonghwa, with one hand on the door, turns back.

"I'm sorry?" He looked at him as if he were an overstepping stranger. Maybe Kanghoon should introduce himself properly? He thought about it for a while before deciding against it. You already have enough problems going on, he'd rather not add to it. But, at the same time, you're his little sister, and he'll always keep in mind for you what he thinks is the best for you. And Park Seonghwa?

He's far from what you deserve.

"She just left, don't bother, the owner's cleaning up," Kanghoon continues.

"With all due respect," Seonghwa glowers. "I don't think that it's any of your business." Kanghoon clicked his tongue quietly. This wasn't how he imagined meeting Seonghwa for the first time, that was for certain. He didn't recall you mentioning that Seonghwa had a bit of an attitude either.

"Don't go chasing things you can't keep up with." Using the wallet, Kanghoon points down the street towards the dorms, a motion that Seonghwa followed, silently understanding what he meant. Then, Kanghoon tosses the wallet to Seonghwa anyway, knowing you, if you really liked Seonghwa so much you'd see him soon. Kanghoon would rather spare himself the trip to the dorms. Seonghwa caught the wallet and eyed it curiously, his expression relaxing as soon as he realized it belonged to you. Maybe it was a bad choice on his part, Kanghoon's, that is. Maybe he shouldn't leave the door of opportunity open for Seonghwa. But maybe Seonghwa would surprise him. Kanghoon grabs his helmet and straps it on, riding off before Seonghwa could answer.

"Dammit." Seonghwa looked inside the restaurant and confirmed that it was empty. He pulled his phone out, ignoring the many texts from Yangyang, he decided to call you instead. One ring, two rings, three rings...

"Seonghwa?"

"(Y/N)," he let out a sigh of relief. "I'm sorry, I'm here now, did you go home?"

"I'm on my way back, actually, I left my wallet there."

"Stay where you are, I'll meet you there and walk you the rest of the way home," Seonghwa looks down at your wallet, moving in the direction of the dorms. "Stay on the line."

"I know, honestly, I was about to call too, it's kind of spooky right now," he didn't realize it until now, but there was that floaty tone in your voice.

"(Y/N), I'm serious, stay put," Seonghwa says. You laughed lightly.

"Yes, sir! I'll stay right here. Wherever I am," you added with a short giggle. There was no doubt about it. You were definitely drunk. Stage Two, as he and your close friends called it, Cloud 9. He missed stage one, luckily, grumpy.

"What do you see?"

"I see you!" Seonghwa looked around, not seeing you anywhere.

"(Y/N), are you sure that's me?"

"I mean... I think so? You're pretty far away though. Aren't you wearing a brown coat?"

"(Y/N), love, it's winter in South Korea, every man and his best friend are probably wearing a brown coat."

"That is true. But... he really does look like you," you insisted. "From a distance... at least... I kind of assumed he was you, he's on the phone too, looking right at me, where are you?"

"I'm just crossing the street."

"Oh, then that's definitely not you."

"That's what I've been saying, love," Seonghwa shakes his head with a small chuckle. "Are you the one sitting on the bench?" The more appropriate word would be slumped, but he was sure that you already knew that.

"Yes! That's me! Oh, you're almost right next to your look-a-like! Don't talk to him, that's bad luck, you know." Seonghwa turned his head and, color him surprised.

"Oh, hyung!" Kyungjae smiles and waves while Seonghwa's lips fell into a frown.

"I'll be right there, (Y/N), stay put," Seonghwa says.

"Okay!" You hung up first.

"What are you doing here?" Kyungjae asks.

"Picking up my girlfriend," Seonghwa forces a smile. "Excuse me," he makes a move to leave, but Kyungjae stops him.

"Hyung, actually, I wanted to ask you something."

"Me too, what are you doing here? I thought your apartment was further from here?"

"Oh, well," Kyungjae looks taken aback. "I just had to drop by the company, my boss called me in for a concept meeting," he says. "But, er, did I hear you correctly, hyung? You're back in a relationship?" Seonghwa sneaks a glance to you, who had, miraculously, dozed off on the bench.

"I am, yes, sorry, can we get caught up later? I have to make sure she's safe," he makes a move to leave again, but Kyungjae stops him again.

"Actually, hyung-"

"Not now, Kyungjae, if it's a question, you can text it to me later," Seonghwa squares his shoulders and Kyungjae catches the memo.

"Hyung." Seonghwa, despite being further away, turns to look at him. "Don't do something you'll regret." Seonghwa turned away, walking over to you instead. When he looked over his shoulder again, Kyungjae was walking in the opposite direction. Instead, he turned his attention to you.

"(Y/N)," he shakes you gently. You grab onto his wrist with a death grip, fully ready to react. "Wait! Wait, it's me!" You look up with wide eyes and grin.

"Oh! It's you!"

"How did you fall asleep here?" He chuckles.

"Well, I saw you over there, talking to your twin, and figured that I'd be okay here," you rest your head against his hip and he sighs. "I always feel a bit happier when I'm with you!" Your voice was muffled against his coat. And it was true, as soon as he was in clear eye sight, you felt like you were walking on clouds, it was so easy to forget worries and stresses when he was around. "You'll never guess the day I've had... I'm exhausted but for some reason I feel a little more energetic now."

"Let's get you home, okay?"

"Okay, but, hm, hold this," you reached in your bag, handing him a half-finished bottle of soju. "Shh, don't tell auntie I swiped it," you held a finger to your lips before attempting to stand up. In no time at all, Seonghwa had a hand around your waist to support you. "The cap is broken, so I think it's going to spill if I keep it in my bag, that's why it's half empty," you continued, latching your arms around him.

"Sure, (Y/N), sure," Seonghwa rolls his eyes.

"I didn't drink it, I'm serious!"

"And I'm Choi San."

"You are?" You let him go in an instant, stumbling back and just barely catching yourself. "Choi San! That's very inappropriate of you! You know that Seonghwa and I are seeing each other again, why would you try to take advantage of my semi-drunken state? I thought we were friends? I thought I could trust you!" And you continued to ramble all while Seonghwa held his phone up, recording for educational purposes. "Things are finally looking up, ish, I can't have anyone ruining that right now! I even have to figure out how to tell Choi Yeonjun that I can't do the collaboration because of all these random things coming up about me online, I can't afford that! People are saying that I'm a kitten killer what's with that? Where did that even come from? Oh, gosh, I can't in good conscience ruin another idol's image! Why would you do this to me?!" Seonghwa stopped recording.

"Yeonjun asked you to collaborate with him?"

"Yes! And I said yes, at first, but then I thought about it, and I realized, oh god, I must not have been in the right state of mind if I said yes. Especially now after someone threw a hissy fit because I went to the gym with Jeno!"

Seonghwa knew about that, but he hasn't had time to open any socials, and now he was more hesitant to do so.

"What I'm trying to say, San," you continued, fully convinced you were talking to San at this point. "While I appreciate, that you like me, I can't reciprocate those feelings, so you should move on and find someone better," you placed your hand on Seonghwa's arm. "Besides, you're not my type." Seonghwa, once again, started recording.

"No? Why not?" It was just a curious question.

"Because... because..." You trailed into a thought. "You're like... a buff Yangyang." Yup, that'll do it. Seonghwa broke into laughter, resulting in an offended look from you. "What's so funny?"

"What do you mean, what's so funny? Did you hear what you just said?" Seonghwa says between chuckles.

"What? You're a lot more similar than you'd think! And that's like... weird, why would I date my best friend? He's my best friend for a reason! If we dated that would be weird... Plus, sometimes his face pisses me off, all smug and stuff, makes me wanna one up him at everything!" Your brows scrunched together as you rambled.

"I agree, that would be weird, you know what? Let me grab Seonghwa," he laughs turning you around and ending the recording. You turned around at your own accord and smiled again.

"Hi," there was a bashful smile on your face, a drunken glow to it despite the night air.

"Hey," Seonghwa's voice was soft, savoring the moment as much as he could.

"You will not believe what just happened," you laughed.

"Try me," Seonghwa ushered you forward, listening to you drunkenly recount the tale of what had just happened a few minutes ago, but listening to every word anyway. You were nearing the dorms now, and he silently hoped that he wasn't blacklisted from the building anymore. You looped your arm around his and slightly pulled him closer to you. He was hoping that he'd get to talk to you about Kyungjae today, but considering how slow you were walking, it would be a fool's choice to bring up anything remotely important.

"You know what?" You finally ask. Seonghwa only looks at you, waiting for an answer. "I think we should just date now."

"Is that not what we're doing?"

"I mean, I know I said we should wait, because there's so much on my plate right now, and you're going to be leaving for Europe soon, but I miss you, a lot," despite the way you looked, you sounded sincere. "And, I know, I complain a lot, and I can be a handful, but, you're here right now, you're standing right next to me, and that means something, right?" You looked at him. Stage three, sentimental. You were both standing in front of the building now. Seonghwa placed his hands on your arms, holding you steady and holding you close.

"Of course, it means something," he says. "(Y/N), I know you're not going to remember much of this, but I do love you, so much," he continues. "There's so much I want to do with you and there's so much I want to do for you, I can't even begin to say it in words, and I'm not going to try now, not when I know you won't remember most of it. But this?" He holds up the soju glass. "Let's try to control this a little, alright? Next time you feel like going for a drink, let me know, okay?"

"But... but then I would've ruined Yangyang's surprise..." you frowned. Seonghwa stopped for a moment.

Oh. It all made sense, the short message that morning with no context, the fact that you waited so long without calling him. There was a slight pang in his heart. Your best friend tried to set up a time for you and him to spend together, and Seonghwa very nearly brushed it off. If he hadn't gotten that call, he might not have showed up at all.

"Oh, well, that's on him for managing it so poorly," you snickered. It would appear that even in a half-state of mind, Yangyang was still a relentless victim. You both walked inside now, Seonghwa was too worried to have you ascend on your own, there was a quick nod of understanding between him and the security guard and then he was in the clear to enter. He was glad he followed you, especially when you stared at the elevator buttons for too long. Long enough that Seonghwa was able to pull your key out of your pocket to scan it over the reader for you and slip it back into your wallet without you remarking. The elevator began ascending and you gripped onto both him and the railing. "Gosh, I can never remember which floor it is."

"That's probably because there isn't a button to your floor."

"Right! Security," you continued, the elevator halting to a stop and sliding open to the hallway. As soon as you stepped out, your path began to lean to the right, and Seonghwa swiftly pulled you in the right direction. Stage four, drowsy. "Hey... Seonghwa?" You lightly turned him to face you. You moved closer, your lips inches away from his, and Seonghwa's world slows. In an instant, his hand flies up to cover your mouth. "Mmph?" You let out a confused sound, your eyes wide with surprise.

"You're drunk right now, I don't think it's a good idea to do this," he says. Your eyes seem to sadden and he sighs.

"Mmm mmrph wrmph." He let's go of your mouth.

"What did you say, love?"

"I said that you're right, look at you, being responsible," you yawned and knocked on the door, despite the key being in your pocket. "Guess no one's home." Seonghwa was ready to open the door for you until the door opened.

Taeyong stared at the both of you. A worried look was on his face as he looked at you.

"Hi, Yong!" You smiled. Seonghwa held up the soju bottle and held up five fingers. Taeyong sighed while he reached for the bottle, but before he could speak, he was pushed out of the way.

"Hi, (Y/N), I'm glad you're home safe," Johnny smiles. Ushering you inside.

"She-" Johnny glared at him and shut the door, effectively cutting Seonghwa off. Seonghwa let out a long breath but, at the end, a small laugh bubbled up and a grin settled on his lips. He turned around, ready to head home, and then his phone buzzed in his pocket. He read the message from you and felt his heart soar.

'Good night <3 I got home safe, so promise me you will too, okay?'

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slayerkitty · 8 months

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helloo!! sending you the ask as promised :)) firstly, how are you? how’s your health? hope you’re feeling better now!!

so here’s what i was thinking, completely entertaining the thought that ep1 & 4 of OF were in fact referencing SKAM. the reason i even thought of this comparison between OF & SKAM was because of the title cards in ep1 & 4. as i was researching, i also found that texting between characters which was used as a motif in SKAM, also shows up in in OF ep4 between nick & top (i’ve attached screenshots for all of this). however, for reasons such as the fact that the narrative frameworks used in OF don’t repeat in a linear pattern and that there definitely has to be a reason behind why a particular narrative framework was chosen for a particular ep, i think the reference runs deeper than just the title cards and text trails. given your post on narrative frameworks in OF & the super tiny discussion we’ve had in its comments, i thought i’d ask you for your opinion on this :))

title cards part 1:

SKAM:

ONLY FRIENDS:

text trails:

SKAM:

ONLY FRIENDS:

title cards part 2:

SKAM: i’m not sure if we saw title cards of the name/actual title variety in SKAM and i couldn’t find any in my brief YT rewatches also but pls do lmk if u find any!!

ONLY FRIENDS:

lil disclaimer here, i watched the dutch remake of SKAM till mid of s3 (which is the queer season) when it was airing, so sometime in late 2019/early 2020. the original SKAM was also polish so there might be a few discrepancies between the two shows (none that i came across tho) and some gaps in my memory but anyway, coming back to the point.

so for context, the most important thing about SKAM that remained consistent across all of its remakes (i think) was that it told the story of a group of teenagers within a high school in whichever city the show took place and while each season had a new protagonist/core characters etc. they were all connected and were friends w each other (for example the protagonist of s3 was classmates w the protagonist of s1 (and as far as i remember friends w her boyfriend?) so more like everyone was a friend of a friend/classmates etc.). this meant that while each season dealt w a different couple/core group of characters, these characters and their plot was still impacted by the side characters, the side plot lines, the past, the present etc. and vice versa.

now, one thing that i noticed in both ep1 & 4 of OF was that we seem to move away from the typical couples and get a larger peek into the relationships of all the characters, their dynamics w each other, different past storylines etc. more than in the other 3 eps. ep1 was obviously more of an intro/context-setting episode where we were introduced to each character, the different relationships we’re to get etc. but ep4 specifically went more into the past of the friend group, top & sand’s past, explored vulnerability in nick & sand’s friendship, the whole ordeal with ray & mew. it essentially explored relationships between characters from different couples (in both the past & the present), that we otherwise haven’t seen much of at all. do you see the similarity i see?

now where am i going with this? idk either, this is the point where i get stuck. now while all of this could easily be chalked off as part of building the plot in OF and have no connection to SKAM, i am just not able to ignore these similarities. i also didn’t go too deep into my own research/exploration of this similarity so there might be stuff that i missed (pls pls tell me if u think i have) but i think a deep dive is extremely worthy here. further, i think that as more eps air, and we get to some new narrative frameworks/old ones repeating, we’ll probably be able to identify patterns better and get more insight into this similarity and arrive at the purpose/rationale behind the other narrative frameworks.

what are your thoughts @slayerkitty? do you see what i see or am i trying to connect dots that are worlds apart? cant wait to hear your thoughts on this!!

also also, so i have been reading the ephemerality squads posts on voyeurism and how OF explores this motif and i found some really cool connections to SKAM in this regard. i’ll not go into too much detail here because this ask is already miles long but apparently SKAM poland played a lot with the use of social media in its show and the characters had real, live instagram accounts that fans could access between airs. additionally, when SKAM poland was airing, the official SKAM website would apparently drop 5-minute clips of the show at the same time as when the scene occurred within the show’s universe (as in if two characters had a chat at 9.30am on tuesday morn, the scene would drop at the same time) throughout the week at random intervals and then these would be compiled into the final, weekly episodes. i’m not sure if the show intended to incorporate these in the context of voyeurism, but do you see the controlled voyeurism similarities?

Aww, thank you for asking. I'm doing a bit better, not quite 100%, but getting there.

Oooooo you gave me some stuff to chew on.

I'm not sure if the days are an homage to SKAM or not, but that is a very iconic shade of yellow, so I can't rule it out. P'Jojo did say there was more to the whole day's of the week thing because it was a way to show how structured Mew was (apparently it got cut). I think I'm gonna add this to my narrative frameworks post as a visual moment for episode one.

Text trails are harder because it's very common for shows to do this. I don't know if we can correlate this back to anything specific because I think it's just a sign of the times with phones. Having said that, you could be right and combined with the yellow text cards...

So I have watched all the queer seasons of all the SKAMs, lol (except newer seasons of SKAM France cause that show is on like season 10 omg), and pieces of other seasons. I do not recall if the titles ever appeared on screen, I will have to look into that. If they did, that could possibly lean us toward more certainty.

Now I've seen people mention that OF is more along the lines of Queer as Folk, which P'Jojo has referenced, but I wouldn't necessarily shoot down the core friend group being a kind of homage to SKAM either. It's not a perfect parallel either way. (And yes, Isak and Jonas are BFF, and Jonas dates the main from season one, though they break up later, and omg, I forgot her name).

YES!!!!! The way that SKAM airs to this day (I think France, Germany, and maybe Italy are the only ones still on air, but apparently Korea is gonna try their hand at it next year??) is that clips drop during the week at the time they take place. So if the characters are doing shit at 1am, a clip is dropping at 1am. Then, at the end of the week, the network airs all the clips together as the epiosde on tv. SKAM was revolutionary and wild. They did social media, too, and the nature of its release combined with that does have a very voyeuristic vibe as well.

Season three of original SKAM (Norway) was also an homage to the late 90s film William Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet, so it could fit in with the late 90s aesthetic we've picked up on in OF.

I think you are definitely not wrong to have made these correlations - I see them, too! I think we might need a few more episodes before I wanna weigh in with any certainty, but I am like this right now: 👀👀👀👀👀

#only friends the series #only friends meta #thai bl #ephemerality squad #anyone familiar with SKAM have any thoughts on this?#SKAM Norway

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