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#because they didn't really HAVE all that much in the way of a grand overarching plot
x-i-l-verify · 1 year
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Everyone bellyaching about how Trigun Stampede is “giving away all the plot twists right in the first episode” needs to watch this video and then go outside and sit under a tree for awhile.
Bonus:
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crehador · 6 months
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translation issues aside, the story of reverse 1999 is really surprisingly good for a gacha. i'm vibing with the characters and setting, and the STRUCTURE of the currently released chapters is just downright excellent
major spoilers for chapters 1 through 4 below the cut
introducing us to the world through regulus was such a good call for chapter one, it's all new to her just like it's all new to the player. we get a chance to learn through her eyes
another reason this works so well imo is it paints vertin, in regulus's eyes, as this hyper-competent character with her own agenda and agency (only to reveal bit by bit that she's in a much more difficult position than it may seem at first, and in so many ways is still just a hurt kid trying to right the wrongs she's seen in this world, desperate not to lose more people)
then we move on to chapter 2, where we see schneider's tragedy unfold and meet some major players like arcana. schneider's story even on its own is pretty damn good, but the way vertin acts and reacts in chapter 2 is full of perfect little hints to what kind of past trauma might have shaped her
THEN CHAPTER 3. THE TRAUMA. i loved schneider's story, but i think this is where we really dive into the meat of the overarching plot. and it is such a perfect dive
like after the events of chapter 2, it does more or less make sense that vertin is being treated for Something. right away chapter 3 gives off a bit of a foreboding feeling because vertin's in the hands of the foundation now, which we as a player knows she doesn't trust, and it's deliberately made ambiguous what she's being treated for and exactly when she'll be released
but at this point, to me at least, it still seemed... possible that she really was just being treated for damage from chapter 2
THEN THE HORRORS UNFOLD vertin's past is shown to us throughout this chapter, and bit by bit it dawns that the foundation is capable of much more heinous acts than we already expected. when we meet the ring and isabella, a feeling of dread sets in right away. because they're clearly important to vertin, but where are they in the present? it's not hard to figure out she lost them (which adds so much dimension to her reactions to everything with schneider)
when the escape plan is coming together, with those side looks at what constantine is scheming, the inevitable dread gets heavier and heavier. like even knowing exactly what would happen, that the kids would be deliberately funneled into the storm just so vertin would see them die and feel responsible because it was her plan that led them there... seeing it actually happen was still a major gut punch, very effective
vertin's naivete in this past is such a haunting thing to see as well, there are moments where the text even shines a light on "will they realize this is going TOO smoothly for them?" and no! no they do not!! because they are 12-year-old kids who haven't lost all hope in the world!!!
seeing these grand scenes unfold with chess (and later go) on the screen was visually very cool as well, imo. might feel a bit gimmicky but it's a gimmick i enjoyed
anyway so then we get to chapter 4, and by then the sense of dread surrounding the foundation has fully set in. so it's almost unsurprising (yet still HORRIFYING) when you realize holy shit the foundation is keeping vertin hostage in a medically induced coma!! treatment for trauma my ass!!!
i feel like chapter 4 was the perfect place to end this arc as well, it was like an extended prologue. a lot of the tension/excitement for me came from the realization that vertin doesn't yet have a place to belong, it's not like "manus bad, foundation good" and that's that
looking at it through the lense of arknights, it would be like if doctor didn't have rhodes island at the start. all these factions around vertin, with their own agendas, and she doesn't have her own "home" yet
we get there, at the end of chapter 4. but of course it's not perfect, the terms of her operating her own team are very conditional, and there are loads of unanswered questions for the future
but it's a nice little set-up for future events, for vertin building this team (family) of arcanists who have some measure of freedom. the tension is still there, the foundation is still scheming, and some new mysterious organization is getting ready to enter the chat...?
all in all just, imo, an excellently structured story so far. it's a shame the translation detracts so much from it, i do think some powerful moments suffered from that. but the actual story is really quite strong, and vertin and her circle are all quite captivating to me so far
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duckprintspress · 20 days
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hey, i'd like to just throw this out to you, since you're a press so i have a feeling you might know. if i was seeking to publish a book but i didn't want it to ever be sold through amazon, what would my options be?
Hiya!
I'm assuming you mean you're interested in self-publishing? If yes, then yeah, I can give you at least some information about your options. :D
If you don't want to use Amazon, you definitely still have some options for self-publishing a book. I can sympathize with this sentiment; we hate Amazon and I've done what I can to keep our works off there (and, ultimately, failed, but still kept it to a minimum).
There's two overarching questions you'll need to consider when deciding how to proceed:
What formats are you selling? Are you doing e-book only or e-book + print or print book only? What about audiobooks? Which will influence your choices.
Are you mostly interested in direct sales (as in, you personally sell the book to the customer) or sales-through-an-intermediary (as in, a bookstore sells your book to a customer) or distribution (as in, you list the book with someone who acts as an intermediary between you and other vendors)?
As briefly as I can, first, here's what Duck Prints Press uses:
Ingram - e-book (and, once we have one - we're working on our first! - audiobook) distribution. Ingram is the biggest book distributor in the US and has a virtual monopoly on distribution. Even places that aren't technically Ingram, such as draft2digital, usually use Ingram. Because they're a near-monopoly, Ingram has a lot of ability to, well, screw people, and one way they've tried to screw people is they keep making it harder to get into their better services, pushing people to their much-less-supported service IngramSpark. I managed to get the Press grand-fathered in to Coresource, which is their e-book and audiobook distribution system, even tho we don't meet the current minimums for number of titles for that product. I CAN'T get into Lightning Source, which is their better-supported print book distribution service, because we don't have enough titles (we'd need 30, we currently have 10ish). If I wanted to use IngramSpark, I'd have to ditch Coresource, and I don't want to do that because Coresource works great and has good customer support, and so I had to settle on a compromise I don't love until we meet the minimums for Lightning Source - I use Coresource through Ingram for e-book distribution (and don't distribute to Amazon), which is...
draft2digital - print book distribution. This was my work around for not losing Coresource in the name of getting Ingram print on demand (pod), and it came with a price: d2d doesn't let me opt out of Amazon, much to my irritation. So the three titles we currently have pod on ARE on Amazon.
our webstore - e-book and print books, directly sold to the public. Our website lets people download e-books; I package print book orders made through the webstore myself and mail them myself.
in-person sales - I started vending at events last year; this year I'll be doing about a dozen.
All of which goes to show, even trying to publish while avoiding the most evil places is really hard and a source of frustration. If anyone knows a good option for ethical publishing distribution, I'm honestly all ears. Competing with Ingram is extremely David vs. Goliath (see also the recent death of Small Press Distribution).
So: remembering that Amazon is easily the worst but that there's still basically no ethical consumption or production under capitalism...
Ingram
Of the places I'm familiar with, the best-known option with the widest reach for self-publishing distribution is IngramSpark. As mentioned, I don't use Spark, but Coresource lets me completely customize which of Ingram's partners (vendors, wholesalers, libraries, etc.) I actually distribute with, and I've assumed that other Ingram products are the same. I believe IngramSpark is currently free per title; they get paid by charging fees per sale and because they get better listing deals with partners than an individual would get (like, Ingram might get charged x per title they list with, idk, Barnes and Noble, whereas you as an individual would get charged y, where y is larger than x, and Ingram pockets the difference).
I know a lot of people who use IngramSpark and my impression is that when it works, it works really well, but when it doesn't, getting help/customer service can be a nightmare. Virtually everyone I know who has used them has stories about late titles, support taking a week+ to reply, that kind of thing. I believe they have an option to pay for better/more rapid responses from customer support, which I feel kinda tells you everything you need to know about IngramSpark.
Draft2Digital
Another option is draft2digital. They use the Ingram distribution network, but again they can do so cheaper than an individual can because of their bulk sales through Ingram. They also offer e-book, audiobook, and print distribution. I use draft2digital for print and I've been quite satisfied with their customer support, but their print distribution doesn't allow opt-out of Amazon. HOWEVER, I believe their e-book distribution does. At minimum, there's a checklist on d2d about "steps you have to take to distribute e-books through d2d" and I'm assuming if you just. didn't do that checklist. then you obviously wouldn't get your books distributed through them. The other big thing I don't like about d2d (which may also be true of IngramSpark, idk) is that they charge after the first revision. Which is to say: you put together your book, you upload your book, you get it all set... and you notice a mistake. Okay, fine. You fix the mistake and re-upload. Re-uploading uses a "change token." You only get one free change token per title per six months. So, you notice another mistake you feel you have to fix a few days after that first? That'll cost $25. I've personally just kinda... tried to find all my mistakes right off and fix them, and anything I spot after that, I keep a log and will update all of them at the six month point. (I understand why they do this, btw - they have actual humans doing set-up on their end, so if you revise eight times in a week, that's a lot for an actual human, and charging for the tokens forces people to be careful, helps ensure people submit books that are actually ready in good faith, and helps keep costs low. That doesn't mean it's not annoying, though.)
Bookvault
Bookvault is a UK-based print-on-demand option (so NO e-book distribution, just print) that has recently started offerings in the US too. They currently have a relatively limited distribution network, but they're growing, and especially for UK-based people they're a strong alternative. I've heard a lot of positive reports about their printing in a FB group I'm in (Kickstarter for Authors - do recommend, lots of great info there), but I'll own my personal experiences weren't great and I've decided not to keep using them for now. However, if what you primarily want is print books as print-on-demand, and some limited distribution choices, they're a good choice, and they can help with option five below.
Do It Yourself Lite
A fourth option that's a LOT of work is...you add it everywhere yourself. Most places will let you. For example, here's how to sell on Barnes and Noble.com. When I self-pubbed a book a few years back, before I ran the Press, I submitted my work by hand to several different options (B&N, Kobo, Amazon because I still used them then, Smashwords, to name a few). However, doing this isn't the same as distribution - it only will sell through that specific vendor - and as far as I know there are no options for doing print-on-demand those ways (I THINK, tho I'm not sure, that Amazon is the only place you can set up both e-book and pod through a single vendor - it's not something I've researched tho, cause with the Press, doing single-title-at-a-time entry across so many different vendors is simply not realistic).
Side note on this: I don't believe there's a way to list self-pub books on Bookshop.org, but don't quote me on that.
This method also doesn't work well if you want to get your title in with libraries. I researched this a bit well over a year ago now, so I don't recall all the details, but before we signed up for Ingram I DID try to see if there was a way for us to publish and get in libraries especially without involving them, but there...wasn't really. Places like Overdrive that handle e-book-to-library distribution don't really have a way for individuals to submit; I have this vague memory I found a way to do it that involved paying per title but tbh I can't even find that now (though while I was looking I did find this decent-looking article about how to get your self-published book out in the world, echoing a lot of what I say here).
Do It Yourself Difficult Mode
Your fifth major option, and what we originally did as a press, is: do it all yourself. You can get your own storefront (ours is through Woocommerce + Wordpress). You can do your own crowdfunding. You can run your own newsletter (I use Mailerlite), do your own advertising, etc. You can do your own printing (we currently use Booklogix and I'm quite happy with them, their customer service is A+++). You can vend at events, you can market to local bookstores, sell through bookstores that do consignment, etc. You can learn to format your own e-books (I use a combination of Affinity software and Calibre, with an assist from Daisy to improve the accessibility of our e-books). You can get access to stock images and vector art to make things look nice (I use vecteezy). There's a LOT you can do entirely on your own. And that's what I did for myself before I ran the Press, and what I did for the Press for the first couple years we operated.
The reason I changed how the Press handles things? I hate to say this but the sad truth of publishing is that not using Amazon is utterly crippling to a publisher. As of 2 years ago, Amazon represented 67% of all book sales in the United States. Not selling through Amazon means accepting you'll simply be completely unable to reach more than half of the people reading works in English all around the world (works not in English may be different, I don't know that market since I publish in English). And for myself, alone - for my works? I could make that choice. But the Press currently works with well over 100 authors, and I ultimately felt I couldn't make the same choice to them. I tried so so hard not to compromise this, but refusing all distribution, when we were also avoiding Amazon, meant completely hamstringing the ability of authors we work with to market and sell their books. It meant, to work with us, people would have to sacrifice so much of their ability to earn money from their words, and it just didn't feel right to continue in that avenue as we grew. So, I was forced to compromise: first to use Ingram, which I did on the condition that I'd be able to reject Amazon specifically, and then by having to use draft2digital, including their goddamn Amazon print-on-demand, at least until I qualify for a better option, which as soon as I can do? You bet your butt I'll be switching and opting out of Amazon again.
The current climate makes these choices really hard, and I didn't make them lightly, nor did I make them alone - there's about 20 people on the DPP staff, and they all contributed opinions and voted on the final decisions I implemented for the Press in these regards.
(and sorry, I know "what DPP does and why" is a bit to the left of your actual question, but I felt like it'd be weird to make a list of recommendations without including the decisions I've personally made and why - like, why would I recommend you something I don't do myself with the books I publish? So sorry for the info dump.)
The TL:DR of all this is, as far as I know, and as I've been forced to accept as part of the realities of running a small press in the modern world of publishing, is that avoiding one Big Evil (Amazon) with any hope of achieving even a modicum of success basically requires partnering with at least one other Big Evil (Ingram especially). It's a very hard game to win.
HOWEVER, you are doing this FOR YOURSELF, NOT for all the people involved in a business larger than just you. If you're willing to put in the extra work to figure out a lot on your own and manage your own marketing, you can theoretically build enough of an audience to go it alone without Amazon OR Ingram OR places like Kobo/B&N/etc. You'll have to outlay more out of pocket - things like webhosting cost money - and you'll have to be a lot more careful - if you're running your own website instead of using someone elses, you gotta go above and beyond making you're in compliance with privacy rules and such - but it can be done.
And if you don't want to go that route, and your only real "to avoid" is Amazon specifically... use IngramSpark.
Sorry I'm long-winded. I hope this helps! Good luck with your publishing goals!
(and if others reading this have some other advice and resources, things I may not know about, please do weigh in! I bet the asker would like to know, and I'm always eager to learn about new options too.)
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greensaplinggrace · 8 months
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🔥 Darklina?
I don't really get the argument that alina should have stuck around. yeah, baghra could be lying and alina has no reason to trust her, and I will criticize all day long the deus ex way this happens when alina could be operating at a much more complex and engaging level of agency - as well as how the writing overall about the reveal could have been better tailored to the intended themes and messages. but in general, the argument that alina should have stayed to hear him out is unfair.
alina just discovered someone else with shadow powers. she has had everything she believed upended, and she is about to further her intimate relationship with a man that someone of status claims to have nefarious plans for her. I think the method of reveal is ridiculously stupid, but that's just my criticism for the writing of baghra overall and the cheap ways bardugo employs narrative devices. alina running makes sense, and even if it didn't logically follow, that doesn't negate an emotional and illogical reaction to stress, fear, and shock.
why should alina stay and risk her safety? leaving is also a foolish idea, considering the outside world is unkind to grisha and she's naive about the persecution of her people and the sociological climate, but alina has no awareness of this. all she knows is that she trusted someone, and that trust has been broken (in a method that is devised by a woman who she should be able to rely on completely).
what would happen if alina stayed? what if she confronts him, and he decides she knows too much? what if she questions him, and he at first tries to reason with her, but realizes their morals are so misaligned that he must betray her regardless? what if he tries to work with her, and decides later down the line that she compromises the greater good of his people?
I think the darkling is right about most things, and to be honest the moral tone of sab is sickening when considering both grisha persecution and alina's regressive arc, as well as the writing of the female characters in general and the overarching puritanical plot structure, but I don't think alina was necessarily wrong to run. there were cons to her running, sure, and maybe she could have stayed to talk to the darkling. but in the end, is that a risk worth taking? she decided it wasn't, and I agree with her.
and alina is a selfish character. the reason the darkling decides to follow through with his plan in the first place is probably because she asks him to when they first meet. because she would rather live a selfish, safe life than a grand and heroic one. she would rather remain in a place she knows than try to experience real change. alina is a character comfortable in her mediocrity while longing for more, but terrified of actually leaving the only piece of her identity behind - because she struggles so much with defining and knowing herself.
what she experienced at the little palace was the real change that she'd been longing for, and she started to find a real identity within all of that which went beyond the scraps she clung to throughout her life. then she actually began to want to help more people - to stretch truly beyond herself and sacrifice for others. but realizing that all of that sudden change which you love but that society has taught you is bad (and of which you are wholly unprepared for) - realizing all of that is tied to something that could hurt you? it's an understandable reaction. alina was rocketing into space after being held back for so long, and she thought she saw a planet in the distance. is it any wonder she swerved to avoid crashing?
send me a 🔥 for an unpopular opinion (x)
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quaranmine · 2 months
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Things that Could've Happened in Firewatch AU but Didn't
Hi, and welcome to scrapped plot points. This fic had a general direction from the beginning but a lot of details came together as I went.
🔥First of all, I've posted the discord message before, but I actually originally envisioned it as "ambigious" whether Mumbo was dead or alive. This was scrapped the moment I tried to determine HOW one makes that ambiguous. think about it for a moment.
🔥I've also stated this before but I initially wanted this to just be a string of vignettes throughout the summer with no real plot or resolution to it. This is where I got a lot of early ideas for Grian and Scar hangout/character relationship development back in Dec 2022 (Scar and Top Gun, Scar's job as a door to door salesman, etc) (the salesman idea was actually from one of my tumblr asks, thanks!)
🔥Originally I....had more of a human conflict present? I actually struggle to remember some of what I planned because it got scrapped so quickly once I thought it through more. But you can still see references to it in my notes:
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(last one is from first draft of chapter 11, one year prior to the final draft.) There's??? so much conflict implied here. Grian gets CHASED! people BROKE into his tower! someone STOLE THE BIKE! drama!!
I scrapped it because it was too unbelievable. Specifically, it was unbelievable for this plot line. I still had the same "truth" to the plot present—that there was no conspiracy and Mumbo had just died after being injured in a place outside the initial search zone. All this other behavior would have just been red herrings from people who had nothing to do with Mumbo's disappearance.
A lot of this also very reminiscent of the actual Firewatch game type of intrigue. I was always heading to a similarly anti-climatic ending (aka no overarching conspiracy) as the original game. But this did not fit. Because...why would someone else do this? They wouldn't have the same motivations as Ned Goodwin in Firewatch. It'd just be some pissed off teens/the firework couple who decided to mess with Grian to throw him off. Except they wouldn't know they were throwing him off anything, because they wouldn't know him, so it'd just be purely some third party messing with him. But I felt like real life is rarely this....malicious. I've had people go out of their way to harass me with road rage, sure. But all of this drama was scrapped because I felt it was SOOOOO unlikely for a random person to just be harassing Grian like this Just Because. It did not fit! It was so coincidental and requried people to make questionable decisions that I couldn't fit into any good framework of motive.
It was a bad idea and I'm glad I abandoned it. It might have been a good idea in a different context...but it did not fit at all here.
🔥I briefly toyed with something like what happened with Cian McLaughlin happening in this fic. Cian McLaughlin is an Irish man who went missing in Grand Teton National Park (nearly adjacent to this story's setting) in 2021. He was never found, unfortuantely. His case is notable because a woman provided a false eye witness report of seeing in a completely false location. On purpose, to be clear. She purposefully lied to the National Park Service about seeing him somewhere she didn't, while providing enough personal detail they thought it was a real report. She claimed to have done this to ensure that multiple locations were searched for him, to expand the search area, but she really just derailed over 500 hours of search time to the wrong place. It's so sad.
I was like, this is an intriguing case. What if this happened with Mumbo? What if this is why he was in a different location than the search was? Because someone falsely reported him being where he wasn't? But I faltered on it for many reasons. First of all, I felt it was kind of disrespectiful to Cian Mclaughlin and his family to blatantly draw off details of his real life disappearance in such an obvious way. It's a recent one too. This is not a cool mystery detail, this is real life and a real person and a real grieving family. Secondly, it goes back to the problem with the other issue about people interfering the case: why? You could ask why this woman interfered with Cian's case too, and that's real life. But in a fictionalized setting—why? What would it add, when I know that the truth of what happened to Mumbo was going to be mundane anyway? Why introduce this bizarre secondary plot element just to distract Grian and the reader? It could have just been a mistaken report, not a purposeful one, but it's just derail the story in a very unsatisfying way.
In the end the only remaining trace of this idea is Grian in chapter 5 (?) saying that someone had seen Mumbo at the Cloud Lake Trail and provided an eyewitness report. Which, for the record, is supposed to be an accurate account—he did go there, his car was there, and he did get spotted there at the beginning of his trip. He just diverged from the trail at a later point.
🔥I meant to do a fun little formatting thing and have Mumbo's past through processes and actions be intercut with Grian's present-day processes in Chapter 11. Or to put that more clearly, when Grian was running down the mountain away from the fire (but before he saw Mumbo) I wanted his choices to be contrasted with the ones Mumbo made. It would've been a stylistic choice. Mumbo's paragraphs might have been in italics, and I toyed with doing a right alignment instead of left alignment so it'd really stand out. The idea was to show how their two independent thought processes converged and led them to the same point on the mountain at different times. It would've been the only time in the story we ever got something from Mumbo's POV.
I scrapped this because I hated what I'd written in Mumbo's sections and never got around to rewriting it or adding it in retroactively. I think it was a cool idea but I did not pull it off. I don't the the fic is worse for it, though. I think it does a good enough job leading the reader into that parallel without spelling it out Quite that much. I also kind of....like that Mumbo never has his own voice in this story to explain his own decisions. It's sad, but it's part of the story.
🔥I seriously did not always have the main wildfire at the end of the story in the plot. I actually initially had Scar just coaxing Grian to tell him where he was, or allowing the search and rescue to come find him. And that would've been it, the search and rescue coming.
🔥Or.....when I toyed with whether or not Grian and Scar should meet at the ending of the story, I also considered an alternate ending where Scar came to Grian to rescue him. That he reported Grian's location to SAR, and then came himself. I scrapped this because it made no sense logistically. It's all well and good for there to be a dramatic scene of Scar coming to Grian's aid and them meeting for the first time in person. But Scar is miles away. And more importantly, Scar has an established disability and chronic pain that limits the trails he walks on. He specifically says he hasn't explored trails too far from his lookout because it'll pretty much wipe all his spoons for ages. (well, he doesn't say spoons because this is the 80s, but that was the meaning.) I was like okay. He's not only far from the trail but he's literally physically unable to make it there in time and one thing I'm NOT doing in this fic is undermining his disability (especially since I already had to make him a ~certain~ degree abled in order to do the job.) So I kept him in his spot. I think it added more tension anyway, because it's such a special kind of horror he experienced having to witness everything go down but be unable to help Grian other than over the radio.
🔥Speaking of the wildfire, I had a version where Grian escaped it for an embarassingly long time. Like until January or even February still (of this year!) The idea was the Grian outran it and then got found. A lot of this was just that I didn't want to figure out how to write him surviving a wildfire. I knew it'd be difficult and straddle the line of unbelievable. I wanted to take the easier way out of writing the scene.
But honestly...there was no way else the scene could've gone. I spelled it out in chapter 8 with my rather blatant foreshadowing—you CAN'T outrun a wildfire. I mean, I guess in good circumstances with good wind and experience you probably could. Afterall, hotshot crews and wildland firefighters are able to get in and around the fires without (normally) casualties all the time. But fires move faster than people. WAY faster. It'd just be a disappointing conclusion for Grian to somehow be the Super Lucky One who somehow skipped being in the danger. No, I had to follow through with what I'd set up and just go for it.
🔥I also entertained an idea of him sheltering in the overhang with Mumbo. It would've played out nearly like the fire played out in the main fic, the only difference was with him. It was the most "meaningful" option for shelter (since the other options were no shelter, and random shelter.) He would've been surviving death right next to Mumbo, who didn't survive. I could have made that very poignant if I wanted.
But I disliked this because I'd already written the part about Grian deciding to move on. I felt that bit of the scene was really key for the message of the story as a whole.
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I wanted Grian to make the CHOICE to live instead of just refuse to move and survive anyway. You know? Grian, in-universe, would have no idea what decision would lead to his survival. But as the author with the power to do what I want, I knew he was surviving all my options. So my options were: 1) easy scene to write where he survives but doesn't experience much danger, 2) hard scene where he survives and makes the conscious decision to live and move forward, and 3) medium difficulty scene where he survives but was still emotionally stuck-in-place.
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(Above: some random notes I typed about the finale scene options on my phone, in a situation where I should NOT have been writing fic notes on my phone lol)
In case it's not obvious, the final scene is the second one—Grian makes that key decision to live, but still experiences the danger I've set up so that I can follow through on the tension I created.
🔥I restructured the final chapter so that there was a bigger gap in time between Scar and Grian talking about Everything and Grian arriving. I initially had it when Grian essentally just came...and then like 5 mins later they were laying all that out while Grian sat on the bed. It just made the vibes of the scene Off. It was too quick, not satisfying. So I kept most of the same dialogue and stuff and structured it into a chapter where Grian meets Scar, and they kind of spend a mostly chill afternoon talking and hanging out until they delve into the Deep Stuff later that night while stargazing (let's be real you can never go wrong with stargazing for a deep scene.) I felt it was likely they'd kind of pretend everything was "normal" at first until they were more comfortable in each other's prescence. Also, we ALL know the middle of the night is when the real stuff comes out lmao. You can see my cut up and reused pieces of the original chapter version in the indented italic parts of chapter 12. I liked some of those interactions so I wanted to preserve them somehow even though the final chapter was structured in a way that cut it out.
So far, that's all of the major plot differences that I can think of at the moment. Some of the other elements (like the mistaken permit situation) came into play after I already had chapters uploaded, but I don't have a concrete idea of what might have happened in their place. Chapter 9 really evolved and got out of hand as I wrote it, but I knew from a few chapters earlier that he was going to do Something that got him fired. So I was able to refine the specific actions when I got there, since I just knew it had to be major and outlandish in the name of getting more information.
I had most of this story worked out ahead of time. But there were absolutely major changes that happened during the course of writing it. I was just fortunate that my intense outlining and focus on it ensured that I never encountered a situation where I had to make changes that majorly affected an already uploaded chapter. Yay for sticking close to the general outline even when the details were in question!
If I think of anything else, I'll reblog this post. :)
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dorkynerd23 · 1 year
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NOT ALL CARTOONS NEED TO HAVE LORE AND BE STORY-DRIVEN
I just gotta say this real quick because it's honestly been on my mind lately and I think more people need to see this because this issue is kinda an ongoing problem with cartoons these days, especially with cartoons with high expectations from some people out there, and with the recent TCS hate that's been happening around lately on Twitter, I'd figure I make a post and give my thoughts and also give my thoughts on people who expect every cartoon now to be story-driven and have lore.
Not all cartoons need to be deep and serialized, have shipping, ect to be good and watchable, not every cartoon needs that and it isn't always necessary. I'm saying this because people still whine and complain about the reasons TCS and shows like it, (like BCG, TGAMM, and more) are just bad because it doesn't have deep storytelling and isn't dark, (Hell, some haven't even watched the show and given it a chance, and still call it shit) but it isn't really relying on that and besides, cartoons are supposed to be fun and give you a good and fun time, it shouldn't matter what the story is just as long as you're enjoying watching them. Now let me just say this, there's absolutely nothing wrong with liking shows that have lore, the issue is setting up high expectations for other shows and being upset because it doesn't have lore, not every show needs to be like Steven Universe, The Owl House, Amphibia, and so on, not all shows need that, AT ALL. Sometimes it's good and fine to watch characters going on wacky adventures and just be episodic and fun, not everything needs to be serialized to be good.
And also, let's not forget before shows like Avatar The Last Airbender came around, we always mostly had shows that were episodic and didn't take themselves all that seriously and we're just there to make you laugh and have fun. :) Trust me, I enjoy and love serialized shows (even though they aren't always my cup of tea, it depends sometimes) as much as others do, and I do get interested in what'll happen next and things to theorized in lore type of shows and enjoy seeing the world-building and strong storytelling. But, at the same time, sometimes I just wanna step away from serialized shows and just laugh and turn my brain off and a thing I love and enjoy about slice of life/episodic shows is rewatchability. And while yeah, overarching narratives can be rewatched, but it's kinda hard to pick out an episode in a serialized show because some episodes might include some important details that you might've missed and such and have to go back, if that makes sense. So most of the time I usually wait until a show ends to really catch up and watch them, since it's kinda difficult to watch a show that's still ongoing.
Now, even though I absolutely love and adore Cuphead and the show, I'm not gonna act like everything in the show works because it doesn't, there are some issues. TCS isn't perfect at all and is pretty flawed and there's things I hope they approve on if they get renewed hopefully, but I just wish some would appreciate the series more, because most criticisms I've seen of the show is that it's not like the game and doesn't have lore, which is criticisms I'm honestly sick of when it comes to shows like TCS. It's understandable if you don't like the show and just aren't a fan, but at least understand and see that not every cartoon needs to be grand and epic to be good and give actual reasons for not liking it! To conclude, I just think episodic shows should be more appreciated and deserve so much better, and it isn't fair for how people treat slice of life shows, it's okay to like and enjoy both serialized and episodic shows, they're both good and great in their own way.
Sometimes, all a cartoon needs is a blend of fun, comedy and along with heart, you don't always need a deep, grand epic story for cartoons. There's no need to fight and harass others over which one is better and more superior, just let people love and like what they love, let people enjoy their cartoons!
I'd totally recommend watching these videos by Alpha Jay Show + KashCash when it comes to my post, because I think they do a better explanation and talking about this ongoing issue in the cartoon community and the high expectations people seem to get when it comes to certain shows. Again, this isn't me trying to start a fight and harass anybody, I just wanted to give my opinion on this issue because it's really starting to be talked about on Twitter, so many people are really just tearing down The Cuphead Show for simply not being serialized. Even though as I've mentioned, not all cartoons need to be that and besides, shouldn't we remember that TCS is clearly trying to be based off 1930's cartoons, especially shows like Looney Tunes, Mickey Mouse + Disney cartoons, and Tom & Jerry. Which didn't take themselves seriously and we're just very simple and there to make you laugh and smile! They're also still very loved and appreciated by so many today and they didn't rely on anything big and epic, and give anything complex to be entertaining and enjoyable.
(Links To The Videos I've Mentioned!)
[Alpha Jay Show - https://youtu.be/0jSXat7kEa4]
(A Deep Dive Into The Awful Criticisms Of Cuphead)
[KashCash - https://youtu.be/UcB3ZtziXvg]
(Not All Cartoons Need To Have Lore)
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opbackgrounds · 2 years
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Since you are reading the older arcs, I feel like you have a better vantage point to talk about this: how do you feel Oda's pacing has changed over the years? I keep getting the sense that he's going through stuff faster than before but when I check the number of chapters for each arc, the later arcs are so much longer. I don't know if it's nostalgia but I feel like the older arcs might have been shorter but they felt really detailed and well paced.
I've actually thought about this quite a bit, and I'm convinced that the answer is in the edit.
There's a lot of factors to consider when considering this question. Firstly, the cast is much bigger now. A bigger crew requires more enemies for fights, and grander world-spanning stakes requires an equally grand second- and tertiary characters. This is an inherent problem with creating a world and story that's as big as One Piece's and Oda's hardly the only person who's ever struggled with it--Just ask fans of GRR Martin how they're holding up waiting for The Winds of Winter.
However, while some of the growth is necessary and expected, Oda's done himself no favors. The recent Road to Laugh Tale sketches show that the Red Scabbards started out with only four samurai. Personally I think five or seven would have been a better number, but just imagine how much shorter Wano would be with the samurai plot threads essentially cut in half. And, really, as cool as it was that Oda was able to sit down and come up with the Eleven Supernovas in an afternoon, once they're introduced into the story Oda has to do something with them. In one fell swoop Oda introduced nine plot lines that simply did not exist before the Sabaody Archipelago. He did the exact same thing when introducing the Seven Warlords, and while that's a cool group that definitely has a place within the world of One Piece, I understand Oda's grief when he says he wished he'd made it a smaller group.
But, what's done is done and having introduced all these characters Oda doesn't really have much choice but to use them. I think for the most part his handling of the Supernovas has been really good, weaving them within existing arcs, but not every group has been that successful. The absolutely best thing Oda could have done for his pacing is cut out a lot of the fluff and streamline the story as much as possible. That's not to say that there's not a place for character interaction and jokes, but its like finding steak with the right amount of fat. You want enough for some flavor, but not enough to ruin the cut.
And that just hasn't happened. I brought it up at the beginning of Water 7 about how tight the plotting is. Even a lot of the jokes and character interaction end up tying back into the themes and plot of the story itself. I distinctly remember a chapter early in Wano where a ton of pages were spent on a joke about Franky going from
place to place looking for blueprints to Orochi's mansion, and while it's a good joke in and of itself, it didn't do anything for the overarching story of Wano. Had Oda cut it, the story would have lost nothing and he could have used those pages on something more important. The same can be said about the cute fox story the tied into the weapon stores. It was cute and heartwarming, but the benefit to the overall story of Wano did not justify the page count Oda spent on it. And it's not just Wano, because there's no reason why everyone and their dog deserved flashbacks during Dressrosa, and Doflamingo definitely didn't need three.
That's the power of the edit. Working on a serialized schedule means editing works differently than someone making a second pass on a novel. You have to be ruthless when deciding what to cut and what to keep before anything's been drawn. Because as I've said before, making a comic is one of the least efficient ways to tell a story out there, and stupidly labor intensive even when working in black and white and using assistants.
Oda's also made several comments, more lately, about being ready for One Piece to be finished. He has a different mindset now 25 years later than a young man just starting out on his journey. I don't think the fandom appreciates just how much of his life he's given up to see this story through, the years he wasn't able to spend with his wife and children, days of little sleep cooped up in a room drawing on a grueling schedule known to kill people. That has an effect on the story itself. A person only has so much endurance, and while I'm sure Oda still loves One Piece you can definitely tell how the simple passing of time has affected how he's gone about writing it.
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magebunkshelf · 1 year
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This was originally posted to my Ko-fi page. If you follow me there, you may have read all this already.
Hang on, #1? Well... Let's say we'll save talking about the moth listener character for another time. I'll explain why at the end.
This audio stemmed from the idea of further expanding the lore of the world that most of my audios are set in. While having a non-human character interrogated by a human speaker is a fun dynamic, ultimately the uniqueness of the moth listener was tangential to the overall goal of introducing more about how the world works and where these non-human characters come from.
I've been informally referring to this continuity as Mitch's World. This is the universe in which the majority of my stories take place, with the notable exception of the Respawn series (which takes place in a completely unrelated world called the Plane) and my fantasy and sci-fi stories like the Wounded Elf and Alien Abduction, which are all self-contained. Everything else, if it doesn't contradict pre-established lore, takes place in Mitch's World. 
When I'd started making audios, I of course didn't have some grand overarching plan for interconnectivity, I was very much playing things by ear. I suppose the first example of the beginnings of this was actually Mitch. I'd already done the Wild Foxboy character, but that audio was for the longest time my least-well performing video. Then along came Mitch, who was kind of (if not consciously or intentionally) a bit of a take-two for the Foxboy, possessing a bit of a similar personality and having a very similar dynamic with the listener. We now had two characters who clearly shared the same world lore; demi-human character which the human listener is rather surprised to come across, showing that these characters are not common. But you'll notice none of the human characters freak out enough that they'd call the police or think they were nuts. 
In this world, reports of the existence of demi-humans have been increasing for the past few years, moving from rumour and word-of-mouth to reports on the news that are starting to become less and less implausible. A good shocked reaction can be very satisfying, but a character denying the reality in front of them isn't as engaging. As time goes on, demi-humans will slowly begin to integrate into society, as we saw in the Dragon Guy Kai audio, which I imagine is set a little ways into the near future.
I had originally started developing a little backstory for the lore to try and explain a then-planned collab that fell through, but it was far too heavy handed; coming from other worlds into ours via portals... It made the planned scenario possible, but really wasn't all that deep. "Why? Because don't worry about it." Nah, we needed something better.
The problem was, how to introduce this background lore? We can't just have characters come out and go 'as you well know...' and explain things. There's also the problem of, whose story should cover it? There's no point in cramming deep lore into Mitch's story, that's just not the aim of his audios. I felt we needed a brand new character whose purpose was to be a catalyst for the lore.
The moth was actually originally going to be a butterfly. The scenario flowed pretty naturally from the premise; a demi-human is captured by a shadowy organisation for mostly humane study, but ultimately you've no reason to trust them. Due to the dynamic, it made sense for the listener character to be somewhat on the physically weaker side, to emphasise the powerlessness of their situation. A butterfly made sense, similar to the idea of a fairy caught in a jar. I very nearly went with that, but it just didn't feel right. I think, putting myself in the position of the the viewer, the idea of the butterfly as the listener character felt like too much pressure to me? They're too beautiful, too elegant. A moth on the other hand felt a little more down-to-earth and approachable. It just felt more appropriate. I can't play a butterfly, but a moth? Much more comfortable. But again, more on the moth another time. 
I don't want to get too deep into the lore just yet. We've only just started to scratch the surface of this subplot, and it's more engaging to let it unfold without commentary, but I'll mention a few things; I was actually able to find a full moon calendar that goes back pretty far! The dates given in the audio should match real world full moons. It was kind of serendipitous, but Kitsune 3 launched on a full moon as well. It's definitely too early to talk about the moon just yet though! Keep an ear out though, I'm a big fan of hiding tiny slivers of lore in plain sight.
Speaking of, the numbers at the start of the audio was the date. Timecode 95-09-09, Zero Four Five Nine. Or, just about 5 o'clock in the morning, on the 9th of September 1995, which was indeed a full moon. This was a little bit in the past, around the time the existence of demi-humans was starting to become more detectable. But of course, that doesn't mean non-humans haven't existed for longer. Remember that the vampire audios take place in this world too. Hah... Conversely, sometimes things get into stories that doesn't actually have any deeper meaning! I've received a few comments about the name of the speaker, Dr Eric Foreman. Turns out he's a character in House MD! Unfortunately that's not a show I'm familiar with, and the name was entirely coincidental this time around; Eric was just a name I'd heard recently at the time, and Dr Foreman came from 1960's Doctor Who. For once, no deeper meaning there!
Side thought, the second character voice, the Desk, is... I believe my first character with an American accent, which I did to make him even more distinct from Dr Foreman. I don't really pride myself in having a good acting range, I've mainly stuck to focusing on getting tone and emotion right and not worried too much about putting on voices, check out the Dragon Guy post for a little more on that, but again I wanted to challenge myself a little. Plus with the anonymisation filter (some obvious inspiration from "The numbers Mason!"), I felt it'd probably mask any inadequacies. I'm actually pretty happy with how it turned out, and allowed me to have two characters in the same scene with easily-distinguishable voices!
Something to do with the moon... And what's going on with this Facility? Stick around for more!
As I said, the moth listener was made to serve as the viewpoint into this scene in order to facilitate the lore. Turns out quite a few people enjoyed being a moth. While we most likely won't see part 2 to this particular scenario, I don't think we've seen the last our listener. 
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analyzingadventure · 1 year
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You think the digital world is gonna appear this seadon?
I think... that really depends on the "future" of Ghost Game. Like...
If Ghost Game is a normal 55~ish episode kids anime, then it'd be way too late at this point, since we'd only have like 6 episodes left at this point.
If Ghost Game is like Psi though and is like, a near 70~episode series, then I think there'd be a higher chance we might see a few episode worth of the DW possibly
But these are both relying on the idea that GG is ending in like 6-20 episodes, there is a third option where GG ends but we get a second season much like Zero Two and Hunters (though maybe without a new protagonist). And although it's theoretically possible, I kind of doubt it.
So TL:DR; no I don't think we're gonna see the DW in this series, mainly because I don't think it'd actually add anything to the story.
And to elaborate a bit more on that;
So what I've been getting from GG is that Gammamon is a reincarnation of his previous life as GulusGammamon (or a higher evo form, I know there's new evolutions in the VB but I did not look at those on purpose), the Dark Conqueror. Somehow he died and turned into a Digiegg with no memory of his past life (as the series has been building up to that, explaining and establishing the cycle of death and rebirth, memory, etc), and now in his reborn form Hokuto shipped Gammamon off to be Hiro's baby brother, giving Gammamon a second chance at life. And that's what GG is about.
GG is Gammamon's second chance at life, it's about us witnessing what kind of a person he grows up into, if his past sins will be inescapable and if he's doomed to become a corrupt, cruel entity once more*, and if so, should he be given another chance again, and again, or if he should face total deletion (if that's even an option in this series) for the greater good, including himself.
*Interesting sidenote; the Shadra/Nanomon episode went really hard on establishing and Digimon can not retain memories of their past lives, but Gulus seems to Know Things. So, Gulus is special somehow in that regard, and it's going to be interesting to find out why and how
So, since that's what I'm currently getting from GG, I don't think Hiro and co going into the DW would actually help with telling that story. Like it could be a cool backdrop for a final battle, but I don't think it'd add anything to the story. The battle could happen in Hiro's dorm room, it wouldn't make much of a difference really.
Really all we "need" from the DW is to maybe get Hiro's dad back if he can even be brought back (like he could also be totally dead and can only exist as a ghost in the DW or something, IDK), and we don't even have to really go to the DW for that, just open a gate and make sure Hokuto's at the right place at the right time and boom, he's been brought back.
I will say, let's say GG does go on for like 70 episodes or gets a sequel, if GG takes a turn where Gulus goes on a rampage and flees into the DW, forcing Hiro and co to go on a grand quest to fetch him, Espimon and Ryudamon replacing Gammamon as Hiro's partner(s), THEN I think we could get to experience this series' DW in more detail, but I kind of doubt it.
There was a recent interview with the staff where one of the GG staff members (can't remember who but you can find the interview on WtW) explicitly stated they didn't want GG to focus too much on an overarching story, just to keep the show more fun and make kids more likely to tune in, thus the heavy emphasis of the MotW formula in GG. And, knowing that, although the scenario I suggested above could be something you'd see in another season of the franchise, with GG, I don't think it'd actually happen, since it'd just go entirely against the goals of the staff and what they want to achieve with GG.
I've rambled on enough now but I think you get what I've been trying to say, so, yeah. Don't think we'll see the kids go to the DW in GG. There's no reason in the narrative for them to do so right now at least), and little time left for them to create a reason.
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hopelesscatdad · 4 months
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So for a while I had a friend out in Cali that went to a Mormon church and like. Always partaking in rituals or events or gatherings cuz they were encouraged to be there as much as possible and strongly shamed anything sexual, masturbation, lgbtq, preached endlessly of virginity and purity which also meant by default encouraging men to value that over women being, you know, women, and all this among other things by proxy encouraged borderline abusive helicopter parenting in families.
For the longest time I thought no way, and ain't no way these temples exist for the purpose of this stuff.
Well. Guess who got to visit one. Lds mormon temple was completed out in Idaho and for the grand opening they allowed members of the church to invite small groups to tour the place granted we had scrubs on our shoes and didn't touch anything at all, not even doors, the members had to open them. As follows:
"Soooo why the scrubs on our shoes?" "Oh you aren't supposed to wear shoes inside but we're compromising today." Oookayyyy.
Being preached to the glory of Jesus around every turn.
Oh look white Jesus paintings
"Oh what's that fancy room for?" "(Some ritual)"
"Oh what about this room?" "(Some ritual)"
Oh look white Jesus paintings
Surely this one is something different- "(Some ritual)"
Mooooore white Jesus paintings, and more preaching. How much did you say this temple cost again?
Sees a room full of glorious lighting and carvings and an ornate circular marble pool with stairs leading up to it. Let me fucking guess.
"This is a lot of stuff, how often do you have things going on here?" "Oh almost always. That's why you're encouraged to visit and participate as much as you can outside of work and school." O-O
Oh look a painting that's not Jesus! Ah, it's Abraham, the dude about to kill his own son because God was self conscious about his followers devotion. Yeah that's a healthy dynamic.
"Obviously you guys are just visiting and that's sort of because to be a member other than being born into it you have to-(lots of social ladder networking, getting on your knees to kiss peoples feet(figuratively) and so on)"
"Oh alright, but what if you want to leave?" "(Really awkward convoluted answer that essentially boils down to you can't or else you're eternally dammed to the worst pits of hell and ostracized by everyone you know."
"Ah makes sense. But what if you absolutely have to move somewhere far away?" "Oh usually we can help you find a church or temple wherever you're going!"
More rooms and halls and congregation areas that quite literally cost a fortune and look like a palace-
Thoroughly anxious, nauseous, creeped out and still being praised to about God, I finally ask. "And what about the lgbtq? I'm pretty sure I'm gay."
Oh shit that worked. They're leaving me alone. They're actually physically moving away slowly but surely. Win I guess.
Anyways I learned a very important lesson that day. I was constantly dismissing that friend despite going through some of my own questionable experiences within churches. I actually had known a woman before her that escaped from a similar lds community and dismissed her too as a child. I still regret both immensely. This experience though also led to a deep dive on various religions churches while still being forced to go to Mormon and Christian events myself, and I slowly realized any "good" churches, regardless of religion, is actually by far the exception. That is to say doesn't have systemic abuse(mild to extreme) and/or have a history of sweeping under the rug abuse from members/preachers/organizers.
Lesson learned. Just because you're religious experience wasn't that bad doesn't mean it can't be far worse. In fact you're probably the exception, not them. Like, good on you, super glad you had a good experience. But now I know that's no reason to excuse the overarching theme and other people's worse experiences.
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So as a TC fan you must be happy with Flux so far
Very much so, yes.
I was a little hesitant during the first episode because it had such a breakneck pace and in general, I do feel like there was no need to introduce basically the whole cast in that episode. Like, Vinder? Williamson? Claire? None of them really needed to appear for the story that The Halloween Apocalypse was telling. That said, I enjoyed the episode a lot, and I enjoyed War of The Sontarans.
The Doctor's gambit where she offers information on herself to them only to reveal who she is was something that I don't think I've ever seen her do before but it's such a great trick. The line "Men like you make me wonder why I bother with humanity." Cut me deeper than I was expecting. It definitely echoes Harriet Jones, except this time The General isn't likeable at all and has no heroic deeds under his belt, nothing to justify it. But the most interesting part of that episode was the setup for the next one, with The Mouri and the planet Time. When the lantern creatures called Time "evil" I got chills.
Once, Upon Time may just be a big flashback episode, and I know The Doctor's flashbacks are the only ones that really matter, (except Maybe Vinder's, and those are pretty damn compelling, I won't lie) but that doesn't mean I don't love em. Getting to see Jo Martin again, getting to witness The Doctor during their time with The Division...it's all spooky as hell. And I didn't notice until this episode but Swarm changed actors when he escaped his prison...and he said "renewed at last." So...Swarm totally regenerated, right? Not sure what to make of that, but between this and Azure seemingly having been under the effect of a Chameleon Arch...I wonder about the true nature of the Ravagers. Anyway, this one was fascinating. But it was also in this one that I really noticed just how awful The Doctor has been to Yaz during Flux. I was legit mad at her, she's mistreating Yaz for being confused about things The Doctor won't tell her about, and I'm not here for it.
Village of The Angels is, and I don't say this lightly, the scariest that the Weeping Angels have been in years. It is easily their best story since Blink. The atmosphere and the way they're used, just. It all works really well. Claire is a delight and so are Peggy and Jericho. I haven't really talked about Vinder or Bel yet but I adore them both. I know there's a theory that they're The Doctor's birth parents, but like...that doesn't seem likely. At this point Swarm and Azure are more likely to be The Doctor's parents, if anything. Dan is someone I like more and more with every episode, and getting to see how The Flux has torn the universe apart also helps, especially now that time has begun to "run wild." I really dig the idea that Time is it's own force of nature and that The Division are the ones who decided to try and "tame" or control it. Speaking of them, I also enjoy the Rogue Angel's character and the way they flesh out this overarching villainous force. From their warnings to the ultimate betrayal, this is a solid story and it does something new with the angels. I really like the Rogue Angel as a character. Also, obligatory shoutout to that friggin cliffhanger.
Then again, it didn't amount to much, but that's okay. Survivors of The Flux is still such a sledgehammer to the face for everything it reveals. On one hand we have a neat storyline about Yaz, Dan, and Jericho traveling the world. We have Kate Stewart going full Doctor and offering the Grand Serpent a choice (little disappointed that he's just working with Sontarans but whatever) and the best part of the episode, The Doctor's scenes in....what I assume is Tecteun's Tardis? Yeah, we need to talk about her. What a villain, and what a performance. Seriously, this is one aspect which makes me very sad that we couldn't get a full ten episodes for Flux, because they keep introducing badass Division operatives that I want to know more about and then killing them off immediately. (Gat is underrated, by the way.) Tecteun is such a powerful presence and is very well characterized and just, everything about her. She's just as much of a monster as we all thought, but I cannot get over Barbara Flynn's performance and yes, Chibnall's writing as well. I so wish she'd gotten another episode or two, because her potential to stand as a rival with a unique dynamic to The Doctor...it's limitless. Every scene they shared captivated me, even before I knew who she was - though I kind of suspected it from the start.
I don't know if The Doctor's going to get her memories back in the next episode, but the trailer sure makes it seem like it. At this point, I have to wonder if The Doctor isn't a Ravager them-self, based on the title and how the Chameleon Arch was used on them. But if that were true, why did The Child appear as a human in the Matrix? It could have just been another visual filter, but The Fugitive Doctor looked human too. Either way, there's some connection between The Doctor and the Ravagers and I am now more sure than ever that they come from The Doctor's original universe, even if the Solitract Theory is probably dead at this point. We know where The Flux came from now. It's all a matter of reversing it. Again, not thrilled that the Sontarans are making a comeback, I kind of feel like we have enough to focus on, but oh well. Either way, you're right. As a fan of the Timeless Child storyline, I have been well fed by this season. And considering how popular Flux has been, I think this really goes to show: If you start to tell a story and the fans hate it...the solution isn't to erase the story you've already started telling and segue into a new one. Finish the story you've started to tell, because it pays off, and the alternative is Rise of Skywalker to awkwardly negate everything you have so far.
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lokiondisneyplus · 3 years
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Although Loki has been a fixture of the Marvel Cinematic Universe since 2011’s Thor, the character has never had his own musical identity. That all changed with Loki - the Marvel Cinematic Universe’s latest Disney+ series - and the music of Natalie Holt. The innovative, versatile score is a perfect match for the God of Mischief’s sensibilities and is easily among the best sonic works we’ve heard in the genre.
As such, we were excited to sit down with Holt to discuss the inspiration behind the score’s instrumentation, sticking up for her music in late-night dub sessions, and being part of the MCU.
I want to start right at the beginning. What was your reaction when you booked the Loki meeting?
I just knew that it was the biggest opportunity I'd ever had, and I really prepped hard. I went into the meeting with my ideas really fleshed out, and quite a lot of my responses to the script seemed to by some lucky coincidence fit with the directors. That was cool. I then got to do the pitch after the meeting, so I had to score the time theater scene in episode one, and I totally went to town on that as well. I really wanted this job so much because I felt that Loki was a great character and I was a big fan.
You and director Kate Herron were immediately on the same page in regards to using a Theremin for Loki. What was it about that instrument that appealed to you for this project?
A friend of mine had sent me ‘The Swan’ by Clara Rockmore ages ago, and I just loved the sound of it. I had also been listening to lots of BBC Radiophonic workshops, and I'd seen this documentary about Delia Derbyshire as well so I had all these 1950’s, analogue-y synth sounds buzzing around in my head. Tom Hiddleston has a Shakespeare-like quality to his performance, so I thought this needs to have some kind of classical, weighty grandness. So it was a fusion of those two things.
You weren’t on set for Loki, and I know that is something you like to do. In the absence of that, what sparked your creativity the most?
It was engaging with the character in a really deep way. The storyline really got under my skin and inspired me. I had the Loki theme in the pitch, so that’s been there from day one. And as for the riffs in the theme, I feel like Loki is the Salieri to Thor’s Mozart, so I was listening to lots of that. There's a bit of ‘Ride of the Valkyries’ by Wagner in Loki’s theme as well. That was all in the pitch. Then I had a month to write the suite. That was the Mobius theme, the Sylvie theme, and the Variant theme.
For all the hi-tech stuff we see in Loki, the TVA is also very analogue in some respects and you’ve clearly taken that into account with the score. How quickly did you catch onto that and are there any other ways that are reflected in your score?
I sampled lots of clock-ticking sounds. I worked with Daniel Sonnabend - he’s got lots of old analog tape machines - and we were messing around with that. The tape machine player almost became its own instrument. We had this big church bell for the timekeepers at the beginning of episode four. That was sampled and then downgraded, so it gets glitchy as it goes on to signify what’s happening in the story. I was just messing around with a lot of that in the background, and it's all over everything. There's always an urgency and a time-ticking feeling in the background of lots of tracks.
How long does one spend listening to samples of clocks before you find the right one?
I've got a lot! I'm sure they'll come in handy at some point.
I’ve read that you wanted a score that “reflected Loki’s personality.” What were some of the characteristics you were looking to emphasise and accentuate with your score?
Something that I touched on with Kate, from reading the scripts for the very first time was Anthony Burgess’ A Clockwork Orange. In that film, Alex commits these horrendous acts and he's extremely violent, and yet somehow you connect with him. I feel like Loki is the same. He's a likable villain. In the series, he comes to terms with his fallibility and it is quite painful for him. So I suppose my job is to help him reach those emotional depths. When he sees his mother in episode one, his past is calling to him and that's when we hear those haunting Norwegian instruments that suddenly seem to shine. Yearning for your mother is something we can all relate to.
We’ve spoken a bit about the use of the Theremin. What drove your selection of the other instruments?
I did this amazing lockdown project for an ad agency. They kind of got all of their artists to play Pass the Parcel with a theme, and we just did this lockdown piece. I'm not sure how successful it was, but the person that I got sent the material from was Charlie Draper who's a theremin player and a theremin enthusiast. So he was in the back of my mind, and I knew I really wanted to collaborate with him at some point. He played on my demo. And then the Norwegians... I saw them at a concert in Stoke Newington about three years ago. They're in this group called the Lodestar Trio. They're amazing, and they play with Max Bailey. I've known him for years, and I just went to this concert. He did all these interpretations of Bach, but with a kind of Norwegian folky twist. I just loved the instrument combination of the Nyckelharpa, the Hardanger fiddle, and the violin. It sounds mystical and magical and amazing. It felt like the perfect pairing with Loki’s past.
I read that you started with the finale and worked backward. Is that an unusual way of working for you or do you do that often?
This whole show has been a departure from anything I've ever done before, in terms of the scale of it, and, you know, the resources. It's all just been different. I think Kate and Kevin [Feige], the producer, saw it as a six-hour film. They didn't want it to be a TV show. The thing about scoring a film is that you do have that time to really craft themes and to have more of an overarching narrative than you sometimes get to do in TV because there's usually a quicker turnaround. And I guess because of the pandemic as well, I had more time.
I didn’t want to just work my way through the score in a linear order. I wanted to know where I was going and then seed it. I think writing a suite before starting on a picture, and having those themes in my mind before seeing the footage was super useful as well. I think I'm always going to do that from now on.
Are we ever gonna hear the full suites somewhere down the line?
I had never done one before. And I was like, “have you got any examples from anybody else?” So they sent me suites from a couple of other composers, like Ludwig Göransson’s one for Black Panther. I was totally geeking out on that. I heard Mark Mothersbaugh’s suite for Thor: Ragnarok as well, and that was kinda intimidating. But it was really good to hear that they've all gone through this process.
You get to see these epic moments in Loki before there’s any music to it. Was there any particular moment you watched that you were excited to work on?
I read the scripts, and I had Mobius in my head as something very different. I saw him being a bigger person who was quite slow, like a kind of cheeseburger-eating cop. The way Owen Wilson brought that character to life was so brilliant, as was the chemistry between him and Tom. I loved watching their bromance. It was really fun to score them as their relationship blossomed. When Mobius is pruned, that was so awesome. I loved episode four. I had seeded everything and built their friendship up. That moment where Tom walks down the corridor in slow motion with tears in his eyes… I loved scoring that.
Loki is a man of many multitudes, and the show goes down a lot of strange avenues. I love the tracks where you really get to do something different from the main body of the score, like ‘DB Cooper’ or ‘Miss Minutes’.
I had a bit more time for episodes one and two. Like, I had a month to score episode one. By the time I got to episode six, it was really frantic. So, with the tracks you mentioned, I just had the time to do it. Kate was like, “we've got a source track that sort of works, but wouldn't it be really fun if we could do a version of it with the Loki theme?” And I was like, “yep, cool, let's try it.” It was one of the upsides to the pandemic, that we had more time to work on it and do stuff like that. I did a film before with where I got Chris Lawrence - he's like a bass player in London, and he plays in orchestra’s but he also plays at Ronnie Scott’s - and he did the baseline on ‘D.B. Cooper’. He’s so good. And I sang on that track too!
‘Miss Minutes’ felt like a moment to tip your hat to those sci-fi shows and do a pastiche. So I got the theremin and the choir and had some fun with that piece. And again, that's got the TVA theme in it. I think that’s really nice, and it's something they did with WandaVision as well. There's cohesion in the score. Even when you're hearing this jazzy track, you're still getting the Loki theme and you're hearing a different side of his character.
You mentioned how you had more time to score the earlier episodes. Was there anything positive about having less time on the later episodes? How do you prefer to work?
I remember reading something about people who can see colours with music. I feel that I have the same thing with a scene. I can watch a scene and I can start hearing it in my head, and as I get more into a project... I remember watching episode six, and because I was so into the project and into the characters by that point, I was like, that's what needs to happen. I could hear it as I was watching it. I feel like sometimes if you’re spending ages working on something, that instinct can get a bit boiled down. Episode six felt like my most instinctive version of the music because I didn't have time to fiddle around with it. It just felt like that was my very undiluted response.
I like it. Natalie Holt uncut.
I just kind of sketched it all out on the piano as I heard it. It was very quick.
How long did you have to work on that particular episode?
I think it was a week. It was a very quick turnaround with the orchestral recording, and I thought we were going to need more time.
How involved were you with the track Tom Hiddleston sings in Asgardian?
They had found a Norwegian song, and he'd already recorded it. I was like, I think we need a musician in the background. There should be someone on that train who’s a little bit drunk and has an instrument, and it's a kind of space-age fiddle, and they're going to accompany Tom in the scene and I think that's going to really help. Kate and Kevin were like, yeah, that could really work. So I did a few versions where I just took what Tom had done, added some violins,  and then improvised a bit in the middle where Loki sings to Sylvie. And they're like, yes, we've got to do this. So they went back in and shot a pickup of an alien musician in that sequence because I insisted. I really wish it was me!
We know that season two of Loki is in the works now. They better have you on camera.
Oh my god, I'm so up for it!
How did you find it working remotely? Were you involved in the mixing stage at all?
It was kind of frustrating. Getting picture to work in the orchestral recording sessions was a problem. Marvel is very strict about how a picture goes out because they don't want any leaks, so that was quite challenging. I could never send people the picture to play with. It's kind of nice for the musicians to come in and see what they're playing against, but there was none of that. That was a bit of a downside. With that said, it was easier to get hold of people because everyone was at home and really happy to be working. I don't know if I'd have got the job had it not been for the fact that everyone was suddenly happy to accept more remote working than they would have done in the past. So I feel like it's opened some doors. The frustrations and the benefits seemed to be in balance.
Speaking of opening doors, you’re only the second woman to compose an MCU score (Pinar Toprak scored Captain Marvel in 2019). That feels significant.
We're in a time, certainly, where I think people are very consciously opening up opportunities to all sorts of people that wouldn't have had those opportunities before, which I'm really grateful for. A few years ago, I wouldn't have gotten this opportunity until a bit further on in my career. So it accelerated things. We are moving forward. But the thing that I really struggle with… I went to a state school and I got scholarships to study music. It wasn't prohibitively expensive to go to university. I did a master's and I didn't come out with 30 grand of debt. The opportunities are here for me now, but I think if I was young and I wanted to go to film school I wouldn't be able to afford it.
So what bothers me is social mobility. I still think we're opening up our industry, but we're not supporting people being able to study music and being able to get into film, and being able to spend those years doing low-paid jobs from the ground up. I still think we've got a long way to go with that. But I think at my age and my level, I'm just privileged that I did have those bursaries and those opportunities to study music, and I hope they're still there for my daughter's generation.
You have a lot of synths in this score. How tricky was it to find that balance between the classical and modern instruments?It's a blend. There’s some in-the-box stuff. Some of the synths are recorded, and then I ran them through the analog tape machine to dirty them up. I've got a Juno 60, so I've got some analog synths going on. It's such a weird process, isn't it? Creating something and being like, no, that's right! Jake Jackson - who mixed the score - must feel like I’m a complete control freak. I was like, “yeah I really like your mix but can you just go back and basically listen to my demo?” I was quite specific with him. He did an amazing job. The D.B. Cooper track... I cannot believe that he made it sound like that. I've never worked with him before, and handing your work over to an engineer does feel a bit like, oh, how's this gonna be? But it was a really, really great experience, and I think Jake is a genius. He really gets it, and he was really collaborative and respectful of my intentions with everything. I never felt like he was trying to put his mark on anything. It was a really smooth part of the process.
What conversations do you have about how prevalent your music is in the mix when it comes to the TV side of things?
I was so obsessed with Loki that I couldn’t let it go. I went to the dub even when it was two o'clock in the morning. I just wanted to check in and I was calling Kate and asking her, “please can you turn the music up here?” I was like a dog with a bone until it was ripped out of my mouth and they were like that’s it now, this episode is locked. I definitely fought for things to be turned up.
You had a 32-piece choir for the last 2 episodes. What was it like to get that recording in? Are you watching as they’re recording it from a remote location?
They were a Hungarian choir. The male singers could really go down. I was adding notes in at the bottom for those guys to sing. I didn’t know anyone could sing that low. That was cool. I had never recorded a choir before, so it was a new one for me. I was really lucky to have Andy Brown from the London Metropolitan orchestra. He assisted me with the Brass and singing sessions.
I imagine that one of the cooler things about scoring something like Loki is that you are now part of the wider MCU universe. I think I heard hints of Alan Silvestri’s Avengers cue a couple of times…
I put in a Loki version of the Avengers theme at the end of episode 4. Also, at the very start of the season before the title card, it goes from an Alan Silvestri cue and then segues and then I take it over. It was really cool to get to play around with the multitrack from that. I was always a big fan of the Thor: Ragnarok and Black Panther scores, so those were kind of my inspirations. I was just kind of honoured to be in the same league as those people and those scores because I thought they were great and quirky and had all these interesting flavours and textures.
I love that you’ve been given the freedom to be as bold as you’ve been with your score.
I wanted to do something a bit different, and Marvel's TV ventures... they're wanting to do something a bit different and challenging as well with this new direction that they're taking. It felt like there was a lot of creative freedom being dished out with this series, in every department. Kate was like, “let's try this DB Cooper scene with the theme, if it doesn't work then it's fine.” It was just trying things out and seeing what stuck.
I remember handing over my score for episode one, just before Christmas 2020. I'd scored the whole thing and was very nervous because I think it was the first time Kevin Feige and the execs were going to hear my stuff. I’d really worked hard on it, and it had a lot of live stuff. There was just one note back from Kevin Feige - push it further. I think that's so cool. As we went on the execs were really happy with it, I got calls from Victoria Alonso and Louis D’Esposito [Marvel producers]. They both rang me and just thanked me and they were like, 'we're just so happy that you've taken the ball and run with it'. I couldn't have asked for a nicer bunch of people to work with. I wasn't sure how it was going to be, I was a bit intimidated. I thought it might be a bit more terrifying. But actually, it turned out to be a really amazing, fulfilling experience.
Welcome to the world of Loki YouTube covers! How far down that rabbit hole have you fallen, and how much are you enjoying that side of the MCU experience?
It's really flattering. I’ve posted some of them on my Twitter. It’s just amazing how quickly people will post music from the show after episodes. They sound almost the same as my demo, and they’ve knocked it out in about two hours the minute after they’ve watched the episode.
Once your work on Loki was complete, how did you detox? Do you delete all your voice memos?
I've still got them. The TVA theme actually came to me as I was walking down the high street. I've got some in the bank for the future as well. I'm always noodling and sketching things down on manuscript paper. How do I detox? I just bought a new piano. It’s 100 years old. I haven't had a piano for a bit, so I've just been playing a lot of Bach.
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umbralstars · 3 years
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(Picrew because the drawing machine broke :'). Really cute Picrew though here's the link: https://picrew.me/image_maker/614903)
Name: Yekaterina (Katya) Deryn Blaiddyd
Gender: Female
Orientation: Bisexual
Race: Human
Ethnicity: Faerghal
Age: 13 (Pre-TS); 18 (Post-TS)
Birthday: 12 of the Wyvern Moon 1167
Height: 4'11
Family:
- Rufus Cassius Blaiddyd
- Darya Artemi (deceased)
- Emyr Artemi Blaiddyd
- Dimitri Alexandre Blaiddyd
- Others not listed
Starting Class: Commoner
Residence: Castell Itha (Formerly); Traveler
Faction: Jeralt's Mercenaries; Holy Kingdom of Faerghus
Basic Backstory
The daughter of Grand Duke Rufus Cassius Blaiddyd and Duchess Court Darya Artemi.
Katya was born during a particularly turbulent time in the court of Itha. With the death of the Duchess Consort a few of the more enterprising and ambitious courtesans strove to elevate her half-siblings to the role of hier or remove the competition entirely. Katya was mostly spared from the political machinations by being so young at the time, but her earliest memories are of this dark period. Despite the circumstances, Katya's early life was not completely mired in darkness and she sought to bring happiness to her life and lives of her family.
She grew very close to her older brother Emyr and a few of her half siblings as well as the other noble kids and castle staff. She could never grow exceptionally close with her father and holds tightly to the pleasant memories of Itha she does have. Katya was very aware of the tension that existed between Rufus and Emyr, and did, for a time, believe it was somehow her fault. She had an interest in the various flying creatures of Fódlan, especially the native Itha Gryphon and swore she would one day learn to fly on them again like the knights in Faerghus' stories. Katya has a great love of Faerghus' stories of chivalry.
When she was around 6, she followed Emyr out into the town and was kidnapped by a group of thugs wishing to extort her older brother for gold. Emyr ended up rescuing her in the end and event served to bring the siblings closer together. Emyr taught her magic in order to defend herself if she ever wished to sneak out of the castle again.
Katya was 8 when the Tragedy of Duscur happened. She didn't understand the true extent of what had occurred at first. Why her father had to move to Fhirdiad, where her uncle went, or why her cousin was suddenly so distant. When her brother came to Fhirdiad from the Officers Academy, Katya didn't understand Emyr's pleas to leave Faerghus but willingly left with him anyways that night. She still wears the same blue cape Emyr brought with him from the Officers Academy.
After the siblings were folded into Jeralt's mercenary company, Katya took to the constant traveling and fighting as best she could. At first, like with Byleth, she wasn't allowed to fight and was taught skills and cared for jointly by her brother and the other willing mercenaries. She helped out in other ways like cooking, mending clothes, and learning healing magic/potion brewing from other proficient members in the company. She does miss her family in Faerghus dearly but considers the Mercenaries just as important to her.
Personality
Curious - Katya is always willing and ready to learn new things. She's imaginative and open minded with a fascination for pretty much anything. She is extremely intelligent and a borderline genius for her age.
Perceptive - To Katya nothing or no one is unimportant. She pays attention to pretty much everything around her and can pick up even the slightest changes in body language or emotions in a person. She hates being presumptive and always airs on the side of being wrong, and will apologize if he is, but always wants to take account for other people's feelings and needs.
Enthusiastic - Katya's energy and optimism seems nearly boundless. She's warmhearted with an extremely friendly disposition. She loves talking to anyone and loves hearing different ideas and perspectives than her own.
Festive - She always tries to find joy in the present moment. Katya knows that joy can often be fleeting and genuinely wants to bring as much joy into the lives of those around her as possible.
Overly Optimistic - Katya is always trying to keep and peace and uplift others. She has a rosy outlook on life and often makes well-intentioned if naive choices. She genuinely believes that often it is worth the risk to trust people and give them the benefit of doubt, even if someone has not necessarily earned it.  However, she has a hard time accepting hard truths and will stubbornly cling to her faith in others.
Restless - Believes she has to always needs to be doing something. Katya will get restless and stressed if she isn't working on some kind of project or overarching goal. She does like to relax but relaxation had to be in a way productive.
Hides her feelings - Katya is much more willing to hide her own sadness or frustration if it means she can help someone else with theirs. She keeps a cheerful disposition nearly all the times and only breaks down when things become too much for her. Once she does break, it takes a very long time for her to calm back down again.
Loyal and Dedicated - Katya will do anything and everything for her family and friends. She's extremely loyal to those who she cares about, and actually won't hesitate to use trickery or other dubious methods to help someone.
Likes: Sweets, her family, making friends, animals, helping others, lively places, painting
Dislikes: Lies, Emyr's overprotectiveness, Indolence, People who will hurt those she cares about
Other Notes
Katya is a light prankster and loves to jokingly poke at people, most often her brother.
She loves the woodcarvings Emyr makes her and her brother's poems.
Katya does sorely miss home and doesn't understand why Emyr's so hellbent on keeping their identity a secret at Garreg Mach.
She goes by Katya Artemi while they are traveling with the Mercenaries and does prefer "Katya" over her full name.
She is very religious and often prays to the Goddess for protection.
She doesn't mind fighting as long as it's to defend others and herself. Her brother and the other merchs are teaching her how to handle weapons, and she really enjoys her lessons because she gets to spend time with her brother.
She does really love her father and half-siblings and wishes she got to know them better.
She goes with Arash to Derdriu after the Blaiddyds are scattered on AM, SS, and VW while her brother fights with the resistance in nothern Faerghus.
She eventually makes it back to the other Mercenaries and helps out during the war.
She will not join during Crimson Flower but will survive the war unlike her brother and likely leave Fódlan all together for safety.
After Azure Moon she likely returns to Itha to help her brother manage the Grand Duchy.
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Hi! Maybe you've answered this already beore so I'm sorry if i just didn't find it on your blog, but have you already typed the characters of CR campaign 2??
(for obvious reasons, spoilers for Critical Role campaign 2)
I did, but it was all very tentative since it was quite early on (like...maybe 20 episodes in), and I was only able to find it by remembering approximately when in Campaign 2′s run that I did it and checking my archives because it didn’t show up on search. So, here’s the original (also has campaign 1 in it) and here’s my follow-up:
Fjord: haha remember when we all thought he was the competent adult of the group? Good times. I think his enneagram is 8w9 and is actually, not too bad on health, and I stand by my ExTP and think he’s an ENTP - he’s impulsive, and an excellent talker, but he’s got too much lateral thinking to fit ESTP properly. Keep in mind that he’s old enough to have decent Fe at this point and be early on in real Si development too.
Beau: still an Se-dom but I think I was thrown by her analysis early on as well as all her emotional walls. She actually shows a lot of the signs of an Fi-aux, especially one just starting to develop Te in her leadership, and her decisions are often emotionally grounded so I think an ESFP. Also, a very obvious 7w8.
Caleb: Definitely IxTJ - I’m not even sure why I considered Fe - but I’m no longer positive on Ni. I could go either way. Having a character with a canonically eidetic memory messes with some of the Si stereotypes, but currently Caleb’s situation is that he used to be very set on one highly specific idea of what he wanted, and has since started to change that. He also doesn’t really believe in like, an overarching plan, but I think a lot of that is based in trauma. So IxTJ, to be determined, and probably a 5 enneatype. I lean more INTJ, but I’d hear arguments for ISTJ. This also makes his and Beau’s friendship super cool because they possibly are the only Te users in the group as I’ve typed them.
Nott/Veth: ESTP. Her identity stuff had a much more concrete source, plus high Fi usually has a more solid identity. She’s way more extroverted than she seemed earlier on, and way more chaotic and impulsive.
Jester: I still think ESFJ is a good fit, and definitely a heart core, probably 2w3 but could be 3w2. Her responses are actually fairly healthy Si, and it’s worth noting how much of a product of their experiences SJs are (I mean, we are all products of our experiences, but SJs especially, and someone who grew up in a very loving household where her quirks were encouraged would be super weird despite being an SJ).
Molly: yeah that’s how old this post was. There was, uh, not much development to be have after this, and ESFP still is a good fit. Which makes Molly and Beau’s interactions much more interesting, as a head-to-head clash (and the fact that Fjord got along well with both really interesting as well). Also definitely a 7 enneatype, but probably 7w6.
Caduceus: not in the previous post for obvious reasons. Definitely intuitive in outlook despite being super perceptive. I think an ENFJ, but also possibly a 9 (9w1, natch) which tones some of the extra-ness of dom Fe down, since he is very much a people person. It’s all very much about grand plans, and not much about tiny details.
Yasha: I think I still need some more time, now that she’s back for longer, but I feel confident in introvert and sensor, and I think she’s a feeler. She has some aspects that make me think ISFP, but more that make me think ISFJ forced from her home by truly tragic and extenuating circumstances, trying to adjust. Her humor is a little more ISFJ to me, and she seems to draw from her past very extensively.
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moonlitgleek · 7 years
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I'm sorry! I didn't mean to sound like I was trolling you! I was just wondering how Jon should view Ned after learning about the truth and what it means for Rhaegar. I'm sorry.
No, no, don’t apologize. I made that leap so it’s on me. It’s just… somehow when I wasn’t looking, Rhaegar became the most argued about character on my blog. I don’t mind discussing him - I’ve been engaged in such a discussion over IM for the past two weeks - but I’ve gotten some, let’s say, interesting responses that were pretty much designed to pull my leg. I found the premise of your questions kinda strange and based on a dichotomy that does not really exist in the books, which is why I thought you might be trolling me in the vein of previous responses I got. I’m sorry if I made you feel bad.
I’m gonna start my response to the questions you posed in your previous ask by asserting one point: Ned Stark and Rhaegar Targaryen do not occupy even a remotely similar place in the text. There is simply no way to compare their respective narrative importance to Jon. Ned is the guy who raised Jon and the father Jon looked up to and loved. For better or for worse, he is the only parent Jon ever had and the father that Jon wanted to make proud; his model is the one that Jon strove to live up to. And Jon loves Ned and loves the family Ned raised him in, that’s not going to change just because he discovers that he is not biologically Ned’s. Because he is still Ned’s son in all the way that matter. Ned, for all his mistakes, loved Jon and protected him and gave him a family at a high personal cost to himself. He besmirched his honor in order to save Jon’s life and essentially committed treason and put his life on the line by concealing him. He is an integral part of who Jon is and a vital linchpin to his identity.So Jon would certainly be angry (and he has every right to be), he’d probably lash out spectacularly, but I don’t think it’dlead him to stop seeing Ned as his father or that it’d change how he feels about him. The bonds Jon has with the Starks run deep and true and so I imagine that his dominant emotion once the initial shock wears off would be only sorrow.
But while Ned is personally dear to Jon, Rhaegar would be little more than a name to him, a name attached to a dark history at that. The significance of Rhaegar’s fatherhood in Jon’s arc is largely thematic because the truth about Jon’s parentage is gonna be a major hit to Jon’s self-conception and identity. Because the only identity Jon ever wanted or dreamed of is that of a Stark. He struggled with his bastardy and the conception of his identity in light of it but he was proud that he was Ned Stark’s kid. Finding out that he is not Ned’s son is a hit in and of itself but then to discover that his father is none other than Rhaegar Targaryen, oh that would be just brutal.
This is (one instance) where GRRM subverts the classic trope of the downtrodden boy with a hidden parentage and a grand destiny, because Jon’s origin story is a horror story that is going to devastate him. Not only does his real parentage remove him even further from the identity he desires, not only does it mean that the father and siblings he loves so well are not really (biologically) his own, it also comes with the sobering realization of the circumstances of his own birth. Like, the identity of Jon’s mother has always been a point of tension in his relationship with Ned, and he finally, FINALLY gets his answer, except it’s a punch in the gut. Because the circumstances of Jon’s conception and birth are fucked up. Rhaegar absconded with Lyanna without sparing a thought to the consequences of his actions, so focused he was on getting a third child for the prophecy that everything paled in comparison, even insulting two Great Houses and throwing the realm into war. Lyanna was his means to fulfill the prophecy and get the third head of the dragon in a situation that reeks of consent issues. It’s not a particularly happy origin story.
That’s the truth Jon will find out, the answer to his lifelong question. His mother is the sister of whom his adoptive father couldn’t talk because of how painful it was. His father was the crown prince who is known for carelessly breaking every chivalric code by absconding with Lyanna Stark, the guy whose actions sent the entire realm into war and created the situation that led to the murder of Rickard and Brandon Stark. His father pretty much used his mother as a vessel for a prophecy-child that she died birthing, and then his adoptive father had to claim him as his own bastard - damaging his own marriage and lying to both his wife and Jon himself - to prevent his best friend from murdering baby Jon for the grand crime of existing. Jon was literally born for the purpose of a prophecy so that he could fulfill a destiny his birth father was willing to throw the realm into war for. So how is Jon going to react to that? My belief is that he, in his initial anger and pain, is going to reject said destiny. He’ll reject his Targaryen heritage, he’ll reject the prophecy, he’ll reject Rhaegar and his ready-make destiny and the purpose for which he sired Jon.
And that would be the struggle in Jon’s arc and the choice he needs to make. Is he a hero because his lineage dictates it or a prophecy told it or Rhaegar decided he would be, or is he a hero because he chooses to be? Is he the maker of his own destiny or a puppet dancing to the strings of prophecy and his ancestors’ decisions? Is he fighting for humanity because he is the ready-make prophecy-child fulfilling the purpose of his birth or because it’s the right thing to do? Is he is driven by the prophecy or by hope that humanity can prevail and usher in spring after they throw back the winds of winter? Who is Jon Snow and why is he fighting?
Here’s the thing, Rhaegar prioritized the prophecy above any and everything else. He caused a lot of destruction in his pursuit of a prophecy-child and in the name of saving the same realm he doomed to war. Causing a political crisis that ended up making the realm bleed was an acceptable collateral damage to him as long as he got the third head of the dragon. Jon is going to have to come to terms with the fact that this guy is his father and that he was born specifically for a prophecy; he’ll have to accept his parentage because it’s a part of accepting himself - you have to accept where you came from before you conceive who you are. But Jon’s parentage isn’t going to be what defines him or who he is, his own choices are. Because choosing who you become when you’re faced by the abyss is perhaps the most prominent overarching theme of ASOIAF.
Jon is not going to be a hero because Rhaegar made him one by siring him, or because a prophecy foretold his birth. If my prediction that he’ll reject the prophesied destiny that Rhaegar was willing to throw the realm into war for is true, that means that Jon is not going to be a hero because of Rhaegar but despite him. He did not need either Rhaegar or the prophecy to put him up to fighting the Others or saving people, he was doing that on his own and by his own choice because he recognized that as the most important cause and the right thing to do.Jon’s heroism is his own choice, his destiny is of his own making; he’ll fight not because his lineage compels him to or because it’s the purpose of his birth but because he genuinely wants (and chooses) to do the right thing and save the world.
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oumakokichi · 7 years
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I've seen your ranking, and I wonder why you like Juzo so much ? I can't help but think his redemption doesn't outweight his previous actions. He helped stopping the killing game but that was him fixing something he did and saving someone he cared about, which isn't selflessness. He assaulted people for reasons that were petty or unjustified, so it felt really forced when he saved Naegi. Also, he let Junko end the world because he didn't want Munakata to know he was gay ? Please enlighten me.
Personally, I like Juzo becausehe’s not supposed to be a selfless or a sweet or softhearted character. If Juzohad stopped the killing game for any of those kinds of reasons, or if dr3 hadsuddenly tried to play Juzo off as a character who was entirely selfless foreveryone’s sake, I’d have been incredibly disappointed. But as it is, Juzo’scharacter development was one of the few things dr3 managed to do right.
Juzo scores #3 on my personalcharacter ranking because he’s an incredibly well-written and flawed characterwho is given his own autonomy and has a compelling arc of development. He’s alsopretty much the embodiment of the Undying Loyalty trope, something I like in mycharacters—and even better is that dr3 managed to emphasize that that’s hisstrength and his weakness at the same time.
In a lot of ways, Juzo remindsme of a better-done Maki. Like Maki, Juzo is a bit of a throwback to some other“killing machine” characters, like Mukuro and Peko. While SHSL Boxer is a farcry away from SHSL Soldier, Swordswoman, or Assassin, it’s still a fact thatJuzo is thought of first and foremost as hired muscle, by Munakata, Tengan,Kizakura, and pretty much everyone else in the Future Foundation. He’s meant toact as an enforcer, act first and ask questions later—and he’s perfectly finewith that.
Juzo is no strategist or ideasman by any means, but he’s aware of that. His forte is punching problems untilthey go away, so that’s what he does, the same way that Maki’s first instinctis to eliminate a target so they’re out of her life completely.
But Maki’s characterdevelopment is ultimately hampered by having to center around Momota’scharacter, and all the frustratingly misogynistic “life lessons” he gives herabout how “women should take care of children, not use weapons,” “women shouldlook cute, not work as a hired assassin” etc. Juzo, on the other hand, doesn’thave that problem, because the sad fact of the matter is that male characterswho are cold and aloof and think of themselves as weapons will receive bettertreatment from the writers than female characters with the same flaws.
Just as Maki prioritizes Momotaover everything and everyone else in the group, Juzo does exactly the samething with Munakata. But again, unlike Maki, whose coldness and recklessnessalmost never gets called out by the narrative (not even when she tried to killeveryone else in Chapter 5, for which she received a slap on the wrist atmost), dr3 pretty much spends all its time calling Juzo out. And that’s exactlywhat I like. There’s hardly a character in Future Arc who didn’t allude to Juzo’sfeelings for Munakata or lampshade the fact that Juzo would throw everyone elseunder the bus in two seconds if Munakata asked him to. Characters like Kizakurawere smart enough to realize that Juzo will get angrier on behalf of Munakatathan he will on behalf of himself, even. And this is a good way to highlightthe fact that loyalty isn’t always a good character trait necessarily.
Juzo absolutely didn’tsacrifice himself for everyone else’s sake—he only did it for Munakata’s. IfMunakata hadn’t been involved in the killing game, I have no doubt that Juzowouldn’t have given two shits about pretty much anyone else involved, exceptmaybe Chisa or Seiko, who were in their same faction. But he wouldn’t have goneto the lengths he did to stop the game just for their sake. What really madehis sacrifice powerful and memorable is the fact that he was willing to stopthe game, willing to cut off an arm, all for the person he cared most about inthe entire world.
Juzo’s loyalty is tragicbecause it’s his primary character trait, both his strongest advantage and hisgreatest weakness. It’s tragic because he was loyal to someone who ultimatelynever felt the same way about him, who doubted him and suspected him and neveronce really had those same feelings towards him. His sacrifice to end thekilling game isn’t supposed to be taken as some selfless gesture for the group—it’sa gesture meant for Munakata only, and Munakata still arrives too late, unableto really understand or appreciate the lengths Juzo went for him.
I would hesitate to say Juzowas seeking redemption with his actions. Atonement, perhaps, but redemptionimplies receiving recognition and forgiveness from everyone he ever wronged.And there’s none of that with Juzo. Juzo’s hot temper, his excessive violence,and his pettiness are never excused by the narrative or played off as somecutesy character trait. If anything, the reason he saved Naegi is because he’sstill as angry and petty as ever.
He didn’t save Naegi for anygrand, overarching ideal. He didn’t do it because he wound up agreeing withNaegi’s idea of “hope,” or anything like that. No, in the end, Juzo saved Naegionly because he was angry at him—for having defeated Junko where Juzo keptquiet about her, for reminding him constantly of the ways in which he fuckedup, of his own role in the way the world is now.
By dr3, Naegi was essentiallyrevealed as some grand savior who stopped the Big Bad Enoshima Junko and herdespair with his platitudes about hope. For him to just give up and die supereasily from the same despair-brainwashing video that killed everyone else wasthe biggest anticlimax—it was anticlimactic and pathetic enough that it pissedJuzo off, and that’s why he savedNaegi.
This is also perhaps a bitoff-topic to the subject, but I’ve always been curious as to why people actedlike Juzo was more irredeemable for being violent and reckless and punchingpeople early on in dr3 than many characters who have actually committed murderor other atrocities. DR is a series about murder and death and killing—and yetJuzo was immediately deemed a more unforgivable, awful monster than characterswho have killed without any remorse whatsoever. I suspect it has something todo with the fact that many people were mostly angry about who Juzo was punching or kicking, rather than the fact that he wasviolent and reckless in general.
After all, without knowingalmost anything about Mitarai or his character, people were very up in arms about Juzo kicking himin episode 2 of Future Arc, because he seemed cute, innocent, and everyone waspegging him for an “innocent cinnamon roll.” People then said that this wasbecause Juzo got killed Bandai killed by violating his NG code—but it’s not asif Juzo did it intentionally knowing that Bandai couldn’t witness any violence.He was just as surprised as everyone else when Bandai died. But I stilldistinctly remember people bending over backwards to say that this automaticallymeant Juzo was the worst character in the franchise, despite the fact thatthere are many DR characters who have intentionally done much worse.
As for the final part of yourask, about Juzo “letting Junko end the world”… Haha, I guess this is somethingyou could probably only understand if you can relate with Juzo on a personallevel. If you honestly blame him more for Junko’s actions than Junko herself, Idon’t really know what to tell you. What Junko did to him was blackmail. It wasinsidious, horrible, and the absolute worst-case scenario for Juzo. It was “despair.”If you can’t understand the fear of being outed, especially to the person you careabout the most, then you’re probably very lucky, anon.
As someone who is gay andsomeone who has been outed to abusive family, I can say that it goes beyondjust normal fear. Gay people aren’t afraid of being outed to their friends andcrushes and family because “oh no, someone will know that I’m gay.” We’reafraid of being outed because there is always a chance that people we loved andtrusted will immediately turn on us when they know, will look at us and call us“monsters,” “evil,” “sinful”—all of which I actually did have thrown at me whenmy family found out.
Juzo wasn’t afraid of much, buthe was afraid of Munakata finding outand recoiling from him, disowning him as a friend, wanting nothing to do withhim anymore. Not knowing how Munakata felt was preferable because it meant henever had to face the “what-if” possibility of Munakata finding out andtreating him like he was “disgusting” for it. If that had happened, that wouldtruly have been “despair” for him.
He was blackmailed andpressured and manipulated into keeping quiet about Junko the same way thatJunko either manipulated or intimidated or brainwashed everyone into keepingquiet and doing what she said. It makes absolutely no sense, in my opinion, tohold Juzo more accountable for “letting Junko end the world” when Junko is theone who did it. And to be entirely honest, if Junko hadn’t been having so muchfun holding that threat over Juzo’s head and seeing his reactions, she would’vejust killed him. The only reason she let him live was to make him sufferfurther—but if he had seemed like he would’ve told Munakata regardless (andJunko could’ve predicted if he would’ve, I have no doubt), then she wouldn’thave let him leave those school grounds alive.
This has gotten pretty long,but I hope I’ve been able to summarize my thoughts pretty well. Juzo is mythird-favorite character in the franchise for many reasons. He’s well-written,his flaws and mistakes are never downplayed by the narrative or turned into anendearing character trait, and I can relate with him on a very personal level.I was overjoyed when he was confirmed gay, even moreso when it wasn’t played asa joke or retconned in future episodes. Dr3 didn’t contribute much to thefranchise overall, but Juzo was at least one really incredible character tocome out of it. Thanks for asking, anon!
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