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blbnowi · 17 days

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I have thoughts and I need to air them.

I really wonder how the transition of Power came so easily when Zuko became fire lord.

He fought an Agni Kai yes but first of all there were literally no witnesses. He literally could've claimed victory with no evidence to back it up.

Secondly Zuko was a KNOWN traitor to the Fire nation not only once but twice plus had been exiled from it for three years. It must've been totally clear that he was not the chosen heir for Ozai.

Zuko really has no base for his claim to the Throne except that he is the heir apparent. (Not even explicit or named heir by Ozai or just about anybody else with authority.) Even in our real world when Juan Carlos I, king of Spain, took over the dictatorship from Francisco Franco, whom had him declared his heir, and tried to start reforms reactionary forces tried to start a coup.

Also he IMPRISIONED the previous Fire Lord, his own Father and his right hand Azula, who was also Zukos sister. All of this severly weakens his legitimacy.

His only backing comes from the Avatar, at this point the prime enemy of the fire nation and the southern watertribe. He probably also had the backing of the northern water tribe and some parts of the earth kingdom but don't forget: the Capitol of the earth kingdom at this point was under fire nation occupation and had a collaboratist government installed which relied on the fire nation for support since they didn't have any legitimacy themselves.

He basically Couped his way to the Throne with just about no known support from anywhere within the fire nation and the first thing he does is to end a war, which the fire nation had been reasonably winning lately and gave up all their gaines they made in the last 100 years of fighting. The whole war, this entire nation had been indoctrinated to believe that it was the best thing the fire nation could do for the world yes that it was the best thing to happen to the world, was very suddenly ended without proper reasoning except "Well yeah wasn't as cool of us to invade literally anybody and genocide an entire nation". They basically lost this war they had just come so close to winning after a CENTURY . We also don't know if there was a relevant Anti war faction within the fire nation and it is reasonable to assume that there wasn't one.

Just imagine Germany winning ww1 just so that in the deciding moment an half forgotten, banished and traitorous prince appears, wins a duel against Hindenburg, takes over the entire nation and declares the war ended and gives back everything they had gained. All of this whilst being publically backed by the Entente powers.

All of this suffering the people had endured was absolutely for nothing. All the sacrifice, all the dead All the hard years and tears just so NOTHING would come of it but shame for an entire nation.

Realistically Zuko would've been couped imidiatly. At least a major civil war would've broken out in the fire nation, one side supporting Zuko another probably led by a high ranking military commander would've tried to reinstate Ozai or Azula as Fire Lord and some other minor faction probably would've just tried to carve out their own little domains in the Fire nation. Not to forget the colonies which would've been left unsupported by their motherland, which could've started a major famine there plus: they don't have the military protection anymore they rely on to survive. The Dai Li or some other earth kingdom faction probably would've tried to win them back. Its also likely that some governors of the colonies would side with Ozai whilst others would just make themselves independent. There could've been a civil war of the colonies too.

All of this is to say that Zuko had incredible luck that his transition to power went over this smoothly. In the real world it would've ended in a major civil war and political unrest in all nations.

#atla #avatar aang #avatar the last airbender #fire nation #fire lord ozai #fire lord zuko #earth kingdom #azula #civil war #phoenix king ozai #fire lord azula #heir #what should have happened #really I cant state how lucky Uuko was here

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burst-of-iridescent · 1 year

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hey, so i saw your post about the atla comics and was wondering if maybe you could tell me roughly when in them aang proposed anti-miscegenation?? it's not that i don't believe he did that, it's just been a very long time since i read the comics and hated them so much that i immediately forgot almost everything from them, and now i feel like i need to find that scene again and see it for myself because it just sounds so ridiculous lmao. i do remember him agreeing to kill zuko, which i firmly believe aang would never actually do and idk how anyone could ever think he would. the comics being so bad is part of why i'm skeptical of every new atla project that gets announced.

aang says it in the promise, part 3! the relevant portions are attached below in case you don't want to read the whole comic to find it (which i strongly recommend, just avoid this comic like the plague):

and of course, the only reason he changes his mind is because katara reminds him that separating the nations would mean aang can’t be with his “forever girl”:

the wonderful writing of the promise: in which aang forgets that his people were nomadic, and lived amongst all four nations, that he himself had (and has) friends from all the nations, and that he’s yknow, the fucking avatar, aka the literal embodiment of the unity and harmony of all four elements in one.

so anon, being suspicious of any new atla projects helmed by bryke? i’m right with you on that one.

#anti atla comics #anti kataang #anti bryke #asks

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majorbaby · 2 months

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I don't mean to be rude or offensive, I'm really just curious, are there any m/f ships you really like in mash or other fandoms?

oh that's not offensive in the least. i think what can get grating is when people are rude about "everything being about gay ships all the time" when i've made it pretty clear that there's a lot of gay stuff on my blog and if someone doesn't like it they can avoid me pretty easily.

so, a few things: 1) i'm relatively new to shipping and it doesn't rank high for me amongst things that draw me into a narrative or fandom - i am not dedicated to many ships in general.

2) even if i can logically 'see' a ship, i like to write smut so if i'm not turned on by the idea of these people fucking then i won't have more than a passing interest in them as a ship. i can be into a fic that uses sex to explore a dynamic without being into the sex itself, but it's not where the majority of my time is spent. that said, i've been in this MASH box so long I've produced fic i would've never dreamed of writing when i first started the show. see: infinite monkey theorum for why that might be lol.

in general, i wouldn’t say gender affects what appeals to me in a ship or a character. i like traphawk because of the nature of their relationship, not specifically because theyre both men, although in their case, the two of them being each other’s non trad partners is relevant to the anti-establishmentarian themes of the show. I dont think it would be half as effective, and therefore as impactful on me, if they were a het ship. their joint commitment to being little shits is why i love them so much together.

ANYWAY to actually answer your question: yes

within MASH i'm really into: margaret/trapper, ginger/trapper, almost any threesome with hawk/trap + a lady friend, hawkeye/kyungsoon

passing interest in: trapper/louise, hawkeye/margaret, hawkeye/bigelowe, hawkeye/carlye, klinger/soon lee, frank/margaret, ginger/oliver

highly situational crackships: trapper/carlye, BJ/aggie, hawkeye/kellye, trapper/kellye, hawkeye/peg hunnicutt

other het ships i'm into to varying degrees from very popular fandoms: katara/zuko (atla), rose/nine (dw), ten/martha (dw), ten/rose (dw), roy/riza (fma), batman/wonder woman (dc comics), nightwing/batgirl (dc comics), ollie/dinah (dc comics), rogue/gambit (marvel comics), han/leia (star wars)

... altho now that i think of it, the caveat with most of these is that with the exception of roy/riza, i don't think i endgame ship any of these. i won't not read a fic that implies they're endgame, i just don't think i really "OTP" any of these, I just enjoy them for various reasons.

honourable mention: mulder/scully - have not seen the x-files but i believe in them.

#replies

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immaturityofthomasastruc · 2 years

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I honestly like that Chole betrayed them at the end of season 3. It genuinely seemed like an interesting and good move to me.

I thought she was going to have a arch like Zuko's from Avatar: The Last Air Bender. (Very general spoilers ahead) Where he's bad, good for a bit, bad again, then permanently good (along with the internal struggle in-between those alignments).

But every time she's shown up in season 4 (as far as I've seen) she's not "bad" (as in actively working with Hawkmoth or if not that, trying to sabotage Ladybug) she's just... The annoying school bully that hates Marinette. She's not developing anymore either and she shows very little remorse for her actions. It's like it's season 1 again. I'm still holding out for Chloe redemption in season 5 or later because I don't see the show/writing as being *so bad* that they ignore Chloe's character entirely. But it definitely makes me uneasy with how they've handled her so far. And it also makes me lose hope a bit for how good a redemption it will be if they're not building her up to be anything more than an annoyance at school.

I don't mind Zoé's character. She doesn't have much going on but she also hasn't appeared too much as a relevant character. I think they can make her better with time. But with how Chloe's being written now, it really does feel like Zoé just exists at this point to replace Chloe in the Queen Bee role. Which is just stupid? It's fine to replace Queen Bee (personally would like to see Chloe develop without the miraculous and to never get one again even after she's "good") but I don't get why you'd introduce a character *just* to replace her. They could literally write fights that don't require the bee miraculous at all. Or have Ladybug or someone else use it. It doesn't *have* to be Chloe nor does it *have* to be someone new. So Zoé, while I do somewhat like her, just feels like an unnecessary character to have.

Again, my problem with Chloe is that the writers don’t want her to be a hero anymore, but they don’t want her to be a full-blown villain or even an anti-hero. They clearly don’t want the audience to root for Chloe anymore, but they don’t want to go all the way with her character even though it makes sense for her to help out Shadowmoth as a field agent now that Nathalie is bedridden from using the Peacock Miraculous. They built her up as a serious threat in the Season 3 finale after her previous akumatizations were, and now we get even more comedic-looking Akuma forms for her like Queen Banana and Penalteam.

The thing about how the writers are trying and failing to shake up Chloe’s character after the betrayal is even worse because there’s a show that has a character who was manipulated by another villain and eventually turned against her allies, and one with a bee motif at that, that is far more complex in only a few episodes compared to everything Chloe’s done this season.

Aguilera, from the currently airing Kamen Rider Revice, was supposedly the leader of the Deadmans cult, which intended to resurrect their demonic leader, Giff, with Aguilera acting as Giff’s “fiance”. However, it was later revealed that she wasn’t actually the leader of the cult, as another villain, Olteca, planned to sacrifice her to act as the vessel for Giff once he was resurrected. Even after the other Kamen Riders saved her from being sacrificed and it seemed like the statue containing Giff’s spirit was destroyed, it broke her. Because she was conditioned to love Giff since a child and because she hated both the heroes and true villains, she went rogue and is currently affiliated with herself and a recently depowered/reformed villain who still wants to help her, Julio. In addition, the Kamen Riders, mainly Sakura/Kamen Rider Jeanne, who fights Aguilera the most.

In just a few episodes, there’s an interesting shake-up in the status quo connected to Aguilera, she becomes a greater threat after assuming her Queen Bee Deadman form, and there’s more drama as the heroes still want to help this woman who was conditioned to love a demonic god and is really screwed up in the head.

Compare this to Chloe, who just acts worse than she ever did before without really explaining what she did last season to the point where you’d think this was a parody of her, as the other characters stop trying to help her and traded her in for the new model, Zoe.

Is it any surprise I think the actual villainess with depth is more interesting than what Astruc’s team is doing with Chloe right now?

#immaturity of thomas astruc #iota #thomas astruc #thomas astruc salt #miraculous ladybug #miraculous ladybug salt #chloe bourgeois #queen bee #queen b #not miraculous ladybug #kamen rider #kamen rider revice #aguilera #aguilera kamen rider

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narutakijune · 3 years

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About ATLA Relationship Arcs

So, this is me, finally trying to write some meta after lurking in my little tumblr corner for months! Hi!

Although I’ve tried to tag properly, if you are a Kat*anger and just want to enjoy your favourite couple in peace, this might not be the post for you. I am not trying to bash characters but I do have a lot of critical stuff to say about the writing.

Anyway, you have been warned and here is my story about my personal first Atla experience: I watched the show this year for the first time, and after the end of Book 1 I decided to look up spoilers, because after what happened to Yue, I wanted to make sure that Zuko and Iroh would be ok. So I knew what was going to happen: Kat*ang endgame and absolutely no Zutara at all. Still, by the end of Book 3, I was convinced that I had read wrong - that there would be an epilogue with a different ending or at least that Aang would only get together with Katara post-show- in that Korra series or something - because anything else wouldn’t make sense- right?

….

After I got over my shock and surprise, I went online and found out about that decade-long aggressive passionate ship war and how even the showrunners got involved.

And then I really worried that I might have missed a few points. Apparently ”Aang and Katara were the DNA of the show”, according to the creators themselves, and “Zutara could never have happened”.

Another popular anti-ZK argument I found was: Why do you always go on about Katara and Zuko? Just look at Zuko and Aang! They are the hero/ anti-hero and each other’s foils, their relationship is much more meaningful!”

So I tried to find out what it was that I apparently couldn’t see.

(Another disclaimer: I love analysing stories (like many Zutarians apparently) and this will get long and rambly. If you get bored to tears when people start talking about “narrative structure” you will probably not like this.)

Talking about narrative structure, I do believe that, in order to let your story, your characters and their relationships really shine, a good basic structure is important. There should be a recognizable development and individual parts of the story that build upon each other and lead to consequences and change, until there is a completed arc - because it is all about the journey that takes you to a satisfying ending, right? So that’s what I tried to do, with my personal Kat*ang vs. Zutara take, I tried to look at the structure and development of their relationship arcs.

The argument that threw me off track for a while is that compared to Aang and Zuko, Zuko and Katara’s relationship is not supposed to be that relevant for the plot. After all, Zuko is the foil, the anti-hero, the deuteragonist to Aang, who is the hero protagonist.

This is all true of course. But then why is it that in every finale, Zuko’s main opponent (and later ally) is not Aang but Katara? Why is it that their sun/moon, red/blue, fire/water dichotomy is so obviously highlighted?

I think one reason why Zuko and Katara are paired off so frequently in the story - as opposite elements, as opponents and as allies - is that they BOTH are Aang’s deuteragonists. While Zuko also acts as antagonist and Aang’s foil/mirror, Katara takes over the more traditional deuteragonist role of confidant / best friend/ narrator.

Protagonist Aang is what connects them, although they are on opposite sides: Both need Aang because he represents their hope to save their world. Very simply put, Katara protects him, so he can make the world a safer place again, and Zuko wants to capture him, so he can go home and be safe again. That rivalry between them is already established in the first episode, even before they meet each other: Katara, who hopes that the Avatar will return (as she tells everyone in the intro), and Zuko, who seems to be obsessed with finding him for more sinister reasons.

And just to make sure, I am not talking here about the characters’ feelings and emotions! This is just about the abstract roles they have been assigned within the narrative.

When regarding Zutara’s special connection to Aang and their rivalry with each other, it makes absolute sense to stress their “same but different”ness as well, visually and metaphorically: Red and blue, fire and water, sun and moon, arguably Painted Lady/Blue Spirit, and, when you put into account their story arc, also Oma and Shu.

With this basis, which puts them together and sets them apart simultaneously, their relationship already becomes very dynamic and interesting, even before you consider any romantic potential.

And here’s another thing, Zuko and Katara also have their own story arc within the main plot. Although they don’t have many scenes together before Zuko joins the Gaang, when they do meet there is always a new shift in their relationship and in quite a few cases their interactions are important for the main plot as well. If you just look at their “end fights” at each book’s finale, there is an obvious and consequential build-up, like any decent story arc should have:

Book 1 starts with Zuko as the powered-up enemy and Katara as the weak newbie waterbender. Both are battling over Aang. At the end of Book 1, they are finally established as equally powerful fighters but still fundamentally different (You rise with the moon, I rise with the sun!)

In CoD at the end of Book 2 happens the next step: they realize that they are not different at all! But Aang still doesn’t represent the same for them and they end up on opposing sides of the war again.

In the Book 3 finale, when Zuko has completed his own (anti-) hero's journey and Aang represents the same “hope” for both of them, they do not only join forces: Their “same but different”- traits make them such a uniquely suited match that they are even able to save each other’s lives during their fight with Azula (who in turn happens to be Katara and Zuko’s antagonist/mirror/foil).

And in addition to their own story arc they even get an individual recurring theme, which also appears in every book whenever their relationship status changes: The lost mothers, especially Katara’s mother.

In Book 1, Katara’s necklace (the symbol of Kiya) plays not only a major part in two of Zuko’s capture attempts, it is the reason for their very first one-one one encounter in the story.

Their first friendly connection in COD in Book 2 happens because they start talking about their mothers. And in Book 3, their final reconciliation (sealed with a very cathartic hug) happens after their life-changing trip which is, of course, all about Katara’s mother.

Again, I am not even trying to analyse their characters and motivations within the story - there are many metas that have already done that much better, more detailed and with screenshots. This is just dry structure and tropes and themes. But I think people recognize and connect with a well-structured arc, even subconsciously, which is one of the reasons that makes Zutara such a compelling couple. They complete and contrast each other, their relationship dynamic constantly changes, builds up, falls apart, reconnects. Such a setup is the perfect playground for a lot of creative takes on what-ifs and alternative scenarios and of course, shipping them romantically is extremely tempting - think of all the possibilities! It’s no wonder that the Zutara fandom is still so active decades after the end of the show. And it’s also no wonder that the Zutarians are known for “over-analysing everything”. You can only over-analyse if there is anything that gives you enough food to analyse to begin with. Which brings me to

KAT*ANG

I just go right to the top and take the quote from Br*yke themselves:

Kata*ng was in the DNA of the thing from the start…. [Zutara] was just dark and intriguing.

If you read this quote and then start watching the show, I would (grudgingly) agree that:

Aang and Katara understand and complement each other really well. Aang gives her the chance to have fun and go on adventures and in turn, Katara is his fiercest supporter from the very beginning, something that he really needs after he lost all his people AND has to find out that the world thinks the war is sort of his fault. In turn, the journey to the North Pole is as important to Katara as it is to Aang, because it is her dream to learn waterbending properly. That’s what she literally says when Sokka & Co try to banish Aang: (Sokka: Where do you think you’re going? Katara: To find a waterbender. Aang is taking me to the North Pole.) In that way, they are friends who give and take equally and are equally taken care of. They even have the last Airbender/ last Southern Waterbender status that connects them. The few times they have a fight, Aang does something in the end to redeem himself (perform some heroic feat) and Katara sees that she is right to believe in him.

Aang has this very sweet crush on her and it will be very sweet and wholesome when Katara will return his feelings at the end of their adventure after he has hit puberty. On the other side, there is also some heavy shipbaiting with Zuko: I save you from the pirates. The betrothal necklace. June and her excellent shipping taste. But in the end they are enemies, they barely know each other and, come on, it would be too dark and intriguing! There is no real threat against friends to lovers Kat*ang, the soft heart of the story. It’s very straightforward and there are a lot of simple “the hero saves the day” scenes for Aang but that’s fine! It’s not really my kind of ship but that’s not the point, it works for the story they want to tell.

End of Book 1.

In my - probably harsh- opinion, everything you really need to know about the Kat*ang relationship has been told by this point. If you want to be really mean, already by Book 1, episode 3.

That explains maybe why many (not all! but many) pro-KA arguments sound as if their shippers have not watched Book 2 and 3 at all. The Book 1 synopsis also perfectly sums up Bry*ke’s quote above. But then Book 2 and 3 are still there and I don’t know what happened but it seems as if they somehow decided that the Kat*ang story does not need any new and lasting input. Maybe because they were afraid that too much new development and change would stray too far away from their original Kat*ang vision. But there are still 2 more books and more adventures and Kat*ang somehow has to be kept apart until the finale.

So the tension in their potential romance is based largely on the question whether or not Katara will return Aang’s feelings. In general I don’t have a problem with that will-she-won’t she-technique. It works well in books where the love interest is not a POV or in shows/ movies where the love interest is not one of the main characters. But Katara is not only the female lead but also arguably the narrative voice of the whole story! As a result, this kind of writing makes Katara look as if she doesn’t have any agency in their relationship, which is not surprisingly a very popular anti-KA criticism.

Additionally, since her dream - learning waterbending - has been fulfilled by the end of Book 1, the relationship work becomes a bit one-sided. Of course Aang is the hero and his journey is the heart of the story. But in order to highlight their special connection it would have helped to give Katara another personal agenda, which Aang could have supported in some way. She is still the last Southern Waterbender and he the Last Airbender but this is not really explored in the Kat*ang relationship. And her other personal agenda, her mother, is already reserved for the Zutara arc.

Instead, in Book 2 and 3 the Kat*ang story is somehow all over the place. Of course there is new conflict and a few romantic scenes as well. But obstacles are either introduced too late or just dropped when not needed anymore, conflict is not resolved and their flirty, romantic moments never lead anywhere- and if they do, they lead to more conflict that is not resolved (yes, I am looking at you, EIP Kiss!).

Take for example Katara’s very sudden argument that they cannot be together now because there is a war going on. We hear her saying that for the first time in the very last episode (EIP) before the 4-part finale. That is too late to have any impact! That she has these kinds of thoughts was never even alluded to before. Not once.

Or the pattern Aang runs away/ is flaky - Katara is upset - Aang comes back and does his hero thing - Katara is relieved. In regards to their relationship arc, nothing changes here between Book 1 and the finale, only the stakes for Aang’s heroic performances get higher.

Or Katara being the one who is able to calm Aang down when he cannot control the Avatar state (which, in my personal opinion, is neither romantic nor healthy). This is also connected to the problem with the seventh Chakra, that Aang needs to let go of his attachment for her. I will be angry forever with how they wasted this for a possible relationship development! That Aang has to decide to either do his duty or save his forever girl (because let’s be fair, he did try to let go and only ran when he had the vision of Katara in danger) - that’s a fantastic setup!

But no, it doesn’t have any real consequences for Kat*ang at all. Instead there were only half-baked attempts – Aang does lie about his failed practice with Guru Pathik but the ultimate reason why his chakra is blocked is Azula, not his decision to run. Aang does try to let go of Katara for a little bit but then Azula shoots him. Nothing in Book 3 shows any change in his feelings that could have been a result of his instant let-it-go. If anything, he gets weirdly obsessive - which could have been used as a side effect of his blocked chakra but – again, no, nothing happens.

I suspect the whole thing was just introduced to create temporary drama for poor Aang, but it is never explained why Katara holds him back, what aspect of the attachment is blocking him or what would happen if he did let her go. Maybe they tried to make a statement about how love is more important than Avatar rules – which would have been fine but it’s also never properly explored. Instead, as soon as that plot point becomes inconvenient it’s simply dropped like a random rock™.

Compare all that to the Zutara arc, where both characters’ feelings about each other are always very much in the open, and where every interaction causes lasting effects in their relationship. Yes, it is unfair to compare that to Kat*ang, because up to the end of Book 3, Zuko and Katara almost never meet, while Aang and Katara spend almost every episode together – of course they cannot do meaningful things all the time. But on the other side, with Kat*ang, there would have been a great chance to show a subtle, gradual build-up instead.

It also doesn’t help that the Zutara arc seems hellbent on sabotaging every romantic moment Aang is allowed to enjoy:

There is Kat*angs first maybe-kiss in the dark before the background of the Oma and Shu legend. But it does not lead anywhere. Instead, Zuko and Katara almost reenact the legend itself in the Book 2 finale as two real enemies to almost-friends, including a glowy rocks-backdrop and the right costume colours, just so nobody misses the message.

In Footloose The Headband, Aang and Katara have a really sweet dance together, and everybody can see how they almost intuitively know each other's moves. This could be a great hint on how well they will fight together in the finale. But is it plot-relevant? No, because the final tag team is Katara and Zuko! While Aang gets paired off with random rock™.

Then there is Aang’s riding off to battle- kiss in DotBS, which Katara is not even allowed to enjoy, because keeping her feelings vague is apparently more important than character development at this point. It is the only romantic moment that gets mentioned again, but in a way that sinks the former cute and wholesome ship into the deep ocean, and the reason is - Aang is jealous of Zuko!

If all of this was only done for the sake of shipbaiting, then it really went out of control at some point.

In the end, the showrunners still had their reasons to choose Kat*ang, maybe because that corresponded more to their own vision, and there are still enough people out there who agree with them. Which is absolutely fine! In the end, what matters most is how you personally connect to the characters and nobody needs to defend their personal taste. But the typical anti-ZK claim, that all the Zutarians with their crazy analysis and rambling meta essays are reaching and delusional and that they desperately try to construct something that isn’t there, is not only a very lazy argument but simply not true.

And I’d claim that in spite of the canon choice, Zutara is technically the better written relationship. By far.

#zutara #antikataang #anti kataang #anti-kataang #atla critical #atla writing critical #long post #atla meta

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thinkingisadangerouspastime · 3 years

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hi! i really like your posts and recently i came across some anti kataang arguments and i would like to see your opinion on that (if you want to answer because you must be very tired of answering those lol)

“i remember perfectly aang forcing himself into katara. not only once, but a lot of times. in that talk they were having during the play it was one of the moments aang was intrusive”

“i saw people saying that katara was jealous of aang with that kids in kyoshi island, which she obviously was not. she was annoyed at them”

“kataang had no development. it feels like a ship made out of nowhere”

“aang is completely obsessed with the idea of katara being his. proof is that episode were the guru tells him he has to let go of her and he choses to break the connection. it’s like: look what i did for you, you should stay with me. aang learning to let go would have been a evolution for his character”

“making them stay together in the end just because aang is the protagonist and has to stay with the girl is boring and adds nothing to the plot”

“he spend years after a girl that never felt the same for him”

hi anon! im very flattered you like my posts ��💛 and you’re not wrong that sometimes it gets a lil tiring addressing anti kataang arguments, but that’s because 90% of them are the same foolish rhetoric dressed up in a different costume, lol. i finally have some free time, so i’ll take a stab at these for you!

“i remember perfectly aang forcing himself into katara. not only once, but a lot of times. in that talk they were having during the play it was one of the moments aang was intrusive”

not gonna lie, this particular “argument” made me crack up laughing because they “remember perfectly… lots of times” but can only name one instance 😂 like i am on the floor, because trying to get away with that in a formal essay would earn them nothing more than a goose egg. you need evidence to support a claim, which this “claim” has none of. i mean,, when does aang force himself onto katara?? when katara initiates every cheek kiss they share?? when they are mutual participants in several shared hugs?? don’t get me started on DOBS - the Now or Never Kiss that falls under literally requires reciprocation from both parties, lol. but regarding the ever-so-infamous EIP episode they bring up:

This post talks specifically about EIP and the play’s portrayal of Aang and Katara (and how it cannot be used to define their relationship). This post explains the true source of Katara’s conflict in turning down Aang (i.e. the war itself and the risks the war presents for both of them) and why the EIP kiss did not “ruin” Kataang’s relationship. This post explains how the EIP kiss was resolved through narrative parallels. This post explains how the EIP kiss is so often blown out of proportion. This post explains how Aang did not “threaten” Katara in EIP (with some excellent commentary in the notes, too).

the fact of the matter is that yes, aang overstepped a boundary with katara there. no one has ever contested that because to do so would be to disregard canon, and here’s the thing about kataang shippers: we love atla canon. it gave us everything we wanted and more. (imo, that’s what anti kataangers don’t understand.) the EIP episode can be interpreted as a “low point” for many reasons, but the primary “takeaway” is that the play performed was imperialist propaganda that preyed on the gaang’s insecurities and demeaned them (much to the pleasure of the Fire Nation audience), which had negative consequences, one of which was aang kissing katara largely out of desperation. no one has ever excused that! thus, what i think isn’t clicking with anti kataangers is that aang and katara’s miscommunication in EIP is not a representation of their relationship being doomed to fail. aang made a mistake and immediately backed off without question or hesitation. katara has time to make her own decision and chooses to forgive him. doesn’t it strip more of katara’s agency away to conclude that katara could never ever ever forgive her best friend for a single mistake that - comparatively - could have been a whole lot worse?

(im just saying.)

“i saw people saying that katara was jealous of aang with that kids in kyoshi island, which she obviously was not. she was annoyed at them”

honestly, i have a question for whoever came up with this jfksjdasks. okay, yes, she was annoyed. that’s a given based on her exasperated eye rolls and sighs. but why was katara annoyed with them, hmm?

here’s my thing about katara’s feelings in this ep: jealousy and annoyance are not inherently the same, it’s true. a person can be annoyed without being jealous (obviously). as such, there are essentially two possible interpretations that have validity, although one in my opinion has greater weight in canon:

1. yes, it is possible to interpret katara’s annoyance that episode as being solely related to their delays on kyoshi island. one can reasonably argue that katara’s romantic feelings for aang were not as strong so early in the series (it’s only episode 4, after all, although lbr - she was Looking at aang’s tattoos in episode 1 lmao), and therefore the primary reason she was annoyed at the fangirls is because they were one of the causes extending their stay on the island when katara felt they needed to leave. it’s a fair interpretation.

2. a different and stronger interpretation, in my opinion, is that katara’s irritation was a product of both annoyance at their extended stay and jealousy of the fangirls’ obsession with aang. because here’s the thing about jealousy: it doesn’t have to be some extreme, exaggerated emotion/reaction! when katara gets jealous of on ji in book 3, she makes a single comment about aang and on ji dancing together. when aang gets jealous of jet in book 2 (because of sokka’s teasing), he, too, makes a single comment (i.e. that it would be a bad idea for katara to kiss jet). i bring these two moments up because they explicitly demonstrate within atla canon that reactions of jealousy do not have to be dramatique and outrageous, à la zuko throwing ruon-jian across the room in book 3, lmao. jealousy can be simple! kept to oneself! as such, katara’s disgruntled manner in that episode - which, might i add, is largely if not only shown in reaction to aang with the fangirls - can certainly be interpreted as a quieter form of jealousy akin to several other moments within canon.

more than that, however, if the writers did not at all want jealousy to be an interpretation on the table… why on earth would they have bothered to mention jealousy as a possibility? here’s the relevant excerpt from the episode transcript:

Koko: [Stomps her foot in annoyance and puts her hands on her hips, while another girl happily waves at Aang; irritated.] What’s taking you so long, Aangy?

Cut back to Aang and Katara; the former enthusiastically waves back at his awaiting fangirls, while the latter raises an eyebrow at the scene.

Katara: [Slightly mocking.] Aangy…

Aang: [Enthusiastically.] Just a second, Koko!

Katara: [Sarcastic.] “Simple monk,” huh? [Annoyed.] I thought you promised me that this Avatar stuff wouldn’t go to your head.

Aang: It didn’t. You know what I think? You just don’t want to come because you’re jealous.

Katara: [Close-up; angrily.] Jealous? [More high pitched voice.] Of what?

Cut to a broader shot. Aang moves back slightly, when an irritated Katara resumes to ferociously stuff the basket with more fruits.

Aang: Jealous that we’re having so much fun without you.

Katara: [Irritated.] That’s ridiculous.

(sidebar, but can i just say that seeing “ferociously stuff” to describe putting fruits away is arguably the funniest thing i’ve ever read sjkdhsjalks)

to me, this excerpt alone all but proves katara’s irritation is a mixture of annoyance at the girls’ (and aang’s) behavior/their delayed departure and jealousy regarding how the fangirls’ fawn over aang. katara clearly demonstrates frustration at aang’s seeming lack of concern for their time crunch and how he’s letting his status get to his head (and remember, y’all: this is very early book 1 aang, he’s barely begun to truly reconcile what it means to be the avatar and the last airbender, which is understandable and a-okay! can’t have growth if he doesn’t start somewhere!). that checks out. but next thing you know, katara’s reaction proceeds to dramatically heighten when aang teases the idea of jealousy to her. again: why include this moment if jealousy was never on the table whatsoever as an interpretation for her feelings of irritation? why make katara’s response intensify so strongly if she’s not jealous even a little bit?

in sum, while i don’t think katara’s aggravation is solely fueled by jealousy, the episode itself points to jealousy as at least a part of it. simple!

“kataang had no development. it feels like a ship made out of nowhere”

this take screams willful ignorance, like did they even watch the whole show?? it’s not worth addressing over and over, ngl.

This post and this post explain how Katara’s feelings for Aang develop throughout the series. This post explains how Aang consistently supported Katara throughout the series. This post demonstrates how Kataang is literally ingrained in every episode.

“aang is completely obsessed with the idea of katara being his. proof is that episode were [sic] the guru tells him he has to let go of her and he choses [sic] to break the connection. it’s like: look what i did for you, you should stay with me. aang learning to let go would have been a evolution for his character”

“completely obsessed” h e l p i weep for the lack of brain cells 😭 it is so hard to just say “kataang isn’t my cup of tea” and go?? seriously?? i thought we were past making stuff up to support shipping agendas. lord help us. real quick:

This post explains how Aang never acted like he was “entitled” to Katara’s affections. This post explains how Katara and Aang do not “idolize” each other. This post and this post talk about Aang’s chakra being blocked and unblocked, and how it had to do with fear, not attachment. This post talks about Aang and the Avatar State, explicitly discussing “The Crossroads of Destiny” and the notion of attachment/letting Katara go.

okay, let’s take this claim one sentence at a time:

“the guru tells him [aang] he has to let go of her [katara] and he choses [sic] to break the connection.”

first of all. FIRST OF ALL. can you imagine the hellfire that would have rained down if aang hadn’t chosen to go rescue katara? here is a piece of the episode transcript:

… Right before he is able to completely open the final chakra and master the Avatar State, however, he hears a shriek from Katara and sees a vision of her in chains. At this, he jumps out of the energy sphere and runs away from the Avatar Spirit. The energy bridge that leads him there slowly vanishes behind him until it catches up and falls from underneath him, causing his image to plummet toward Earth. This cuts his connection to the Avatar State, which forces him back to reality.

Aang: Katara’s in danger! I have to go! [Prepares to exit.]

Pathik: No, Aang! By choosing attachment, you have locked the chakra! If you leave now, you won’t be able to go into the Avatar State at all!

Aang hesitates but leaves anyway, leaving Pathik concerned and disappointed.

aang chose to leave because katara was in danger. if he had chosen to stay,, dear god. the vitriol that would have been thrown around. “aang doesn’t really love katara! he chose not to save her!” “aang is so selfish and greedy! he chose power over love!” it’s literally a catch-22. damned if he does leave, damned if he doesn’t leave. #fandomlogic

anyways, yes, sure, aang chose to leave, which at the time broke the connection. he was indeed in avatar state limbo for a Hot Minute. whoop de do.

“it’s like: look what i did for you, you should stay with me.”

logical fallacy: ad hominem, hasty generalization, ∴ not worth our time 💛

“aang learning to let go would have been a [sic] evolution for his character”

i have amazing news for those who perpetuate this take. aang did let her go! he would not have been able to enter the avatar state in COD if he hadn’t! point blank, it is utterly untrue to pretend aang did not “let go” of his attachment to katara. now, im not going to get into the concept of “attachment” here and what it truly meant for aang to have “let katara go” in the book 2 finale (if it was good, bad, etc. etc.). there is a lot of material to work with there that would require like,, an entire post to dig into, if not more. the fact of the matter is that aang did let katara go, and the proof is that he successfully entered the avatar state before azula killed him. the above claim thus sits in complete contradiction to canon and is a moot point.

“making them stay together in the end just because aang is the protagonist and has to stay with the girl is boring and adds nothing to the plot”

“making them stay together” again, is it so hard for someone to just say “kataang isn’t my thing, im gonna stick to fanon pairings, but y’all have fun” i mean that really, really does not seem so difficult to me! also, “making” is a hilarious word to use just because,, atla is a work of fiction. in that respect, the writers “made” everything happen. you cannot escape their sphere of control.

anyways. that’s just funny to me lmao

but no, aang and katara did not get together in a romantic fashion just because aang was the lead male protagonist and katara was the lead female protagonist. i refer back to these posts from earlier:

aang and katara got together because their relationship had been developed since episode 1, duh. reducing their relationship to “lead guy + lead girl” completely disregards the legwork done and the foundation laid for their romantic partnership. like, all someone has to do is rewatch the show 😂 and i hate to break it to whoever created that take, but to say kataang “adds nothing to the plot” again ignores how their relationship is one of the two most important in the show (the other being aang and zuko’s relationship as narrative foils). it is not a cheap coincidence that kataang embodies multiple complementary themes/motifs of atla: push and pull, yin and yang, air and water, oma and shu, etc. etc. their relationship adds emotional depth! how is that not relevant to the plot! atla is a show where just about every relationship is important in some regard (this post touches upon how aang alone transforms all of his friends - think of the bigger picture, then, and how every other dynamic weaves in a crucial thread to create the beautiful tapestry we call atla!).

my point is that kataang is relevant to the plot the way every relationship in atla is, whether or not someone ships/enjoys them. you cannot have a good show without having intimate relationships (emotionally, i mean). can you imagine if someone said zuko and iroh’s relationship wasn’t relevant to the plot?? there is a reason it is such a powerful moment when iroh and zuko reunite in the finale. similarly, there is a reason yue’s sacrifice and sokka’s consequential (and lasting) grief is so poignant. there is a reason it is so heartbreaking when katara and sokka have to leave behind their father at the beginning of tsr. to tie back to kataang, there is a reason it is so hard to watch katara dismiss aang in that same episode. there is a reason so many people are moved when katara pulls aang out of the avatar state when appa is stolen. there is a reason emotional reactions are incited during atla and it is because these relationships are so important!! i don’t care if someone thinks kataang is “boring” - that’s their opinion, they have a right to it. but to insist their relationship wasn’t relevant to the plot? to the story? when in fact it was a key component from episode 1?

are you kidding me?

“he spend years after a girl that never felt the same for him”

“years” lol doesn’t atla take place over the course of a year at most? pretty sure this person didn’t even watch the show 😂 for a third time, i refer to these posts:

i hope i addressed these (nonsensical) arguments to your satisfaction, anon! a lot of them are the same tried-and-failed anti kataang arguments, smh. not to incite new discourse lmao, but it’d be nice if there was at least some variety 😂 thank you again for your kind words, my friend! 💛

#kataang #aang #katara #aanglove #atla #avatar the last airbender #atla analysis #kataangtag #amy answers #anon #amy analyzes

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zuko-always-lies · 3 years

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"Still, I don’t think I’ve ever seen Zuko written in a way that acknowledges his sexism, nor does the fanbase generally have any knowledge or understanding of it."

IME this is especially the case in "Zuko joins the gaang early" fics, most of all the ones that paint him (and often the FN as a whole) as enlightened and actively anti-sexist to make Sokka look bad.

Well, I generally stay away from those fics because they tend to do "Zuko is an awkward turtleduck" at its worst and tend to completely ignore his canon personality traits and motives(which are precisely why it would make little sense for him to join much earlier than he did). Thus, I'm far from shocked that Zuko's is portrayed like that in them(especially if the relevant fics are by Zvtara shippers, who rarely miss out on an opportunity to demonize someone in order to make their precious boy Zuko look better).

Honestly, "Zuko joins the Gaang early" rarely seems to serve much purpose more than to act as vehicle for Zvtara or Zukka shippers. I think you could actually do very interesting things with it if you actually dealt with Zuko's Book 1 and Book 2 personality and its less savory aspects, andwith what it would actually likely take for Zuko to join the Gaang in Book 1 or early Book 2.

#Zuko #sexism #Zuko-critical #not anti-Zuko #anti-Zvtara #anti-Zutara #I don't quite see the utility of a certain common fanfic plot #gender

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ultranos · 3 years

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How involved is Zuko in the creation of united republic and republic city in modulus?

I always thought I was kind of weird the leader of a nation just went and heavily involved himself with another country even in peaceful times I would imagine he would be quite busy

Not a whole lot, but also kind of instrumental at the same time.

See, I thought the same thing. And considering how the Fire Nation would have just gotten out of an imperialist period and Zuko would theoretically be trying to move away from that, being so heavily involved in another sovereign nation is...kind of imperialism-by-a-different-name.

That isn't what happens in modulus. There, the United Republic and Republic City are made up of the sovereign groups of indigenous peoples who originally lived in the land colonized by the Fire Nation. They also do not want to be Earth Kingdom, because there had been some forced assimilation prior to the FN as well. There's enough former FN colonists who are either outcast or otherwise low on the social ladder that absolutely do no want to return to the FN or become part of the EK that throwing in behind the indigenous peoples seems like the best plan.

(These Fire Nationals are your political dissidents and others running afoul of domestic oppression. Basically, in modulus, the radical anti-war queers ended up in the colonies, and then proceeded to say "fuck you" to the FN post-war.)

This attempt to gain back land rights and sovereignty probably would have fizzled and died under the boot of the colonial powers, even with this unexpected coalition-building, if it hadn't been for Aang catching word of things. See, as it turns out, Aang has a very vested interest in establishing a precedent for "ancestral stewards of the land retain rights to it in-perpetuity". Because if that right isn't upheld?

Then there's a clear precedent for every Air Temple in the world being up-for-grabs and even if there are future Air Nomads, they have no right to their ancestral home.

Zuko weighs in to back Aang. And with the Fire Lord supporting them, it's enough to keep the other two nations (mostly the EK) at bay. Zuko doesn't get involved directly with any of the nation-building, other than providing resources-as-reparations and ships back to the FN for people who want out, as well as the international treaty that actually founds the UR. (There are some interesting concessions and other arrangements written into that document. Such as an amnesty clause that in no way ends up being plot-relevant in modulus.)

#atla #modulus verse #nos answers things #it's possible neither zuko nor aang have statues in republic city #i feel like any kind of founding memorial would look very different

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class1akids · 3 years

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The first time I found out that Deku's going to get so many quirks, I was worried he was going to be too overpowered/can do everything himself and everyone else would be cast off to the side. I really hope everyone still has a unique and important role to play by the end - I think this is something avatar did really well with.

Yeah, same here. I didn’t like the multiple quirks because it took so much away from one of my favourite things about Deku (him as a team player / quirk combo mastermind) and it also diminished him as a character, and focused too much on his power-development.

Plus, I feel like it’s quite anti-climatic to have him gain a new power just suited for the situation every time he’s cornered, while other characters have to try to think their way out of it, or use their resources.

I agree that avatar did this very well - because even if Aang had all the elements, he was not at the same level as his teachers. Katara still had healing on him, Toph had metal-bending, and Zuko had a lot of the non-bending/sword skills and the type of confidence Aang lacked.

This I think unfortunately is not the tendency with Deku.

Deku made Satou and Ojirou redundant from the outset.

His Black-Whip is more powerful and versatile than Sero’s tape or Tsuyu’s tongue already and he got fast-track mastery of it in 3 months, compared to classmates who had been honing their quirks their whole lives. It also showed in the war arc with both Sero and Tsu pretty sidelined.

Float is not as versatile as Uraraka’s Zero Gravity, but combined with BlackWhip and super-strength, it can do pretty much everything ZG can do and without the limit Uraraka has.

So yeah, it was pretty sad looking to me to have Uraraka’s supermove be a cutesy Mickey Mouse-version of Deku’s BlackWhip move. Especially because after the Sport Festival Uraraka was supposed to move towards more gritty fighting.

We still don’t know exactly how Danger Sense works, but it could really further reduce characters like Jirou or Shoji, who already have very little fighting role.

HK is also struggling to give a role to Iida, who seems to have been outpaced by both Bakugou and Deku when it comes to pure burst speed, though I think Iida can still sustain it longer. But he doesn’t really pack a punch.

I still expect some characters to be relevant in the end - Bakugou obviously, Todoroki who is set up to have the secondary main fight (sort of how the agni kai went in ATLA and I don’t expect Deku to get an elemental power). Uraraka will have her fight with Toga.

Based on this arc, I’d expect Tokoyami, Kaminari, Kirishima, Momo and Mina to each get some highlight, as well as Shinsou, who has been brought in since the Sport Festival, so he’s going to be important in some way to the endgame.

I think btw that Deku won’t be fully powered yet going into the final fight - I expect him not to unlock the last (or last 2) quirks until mid-fight.

#c1a asks #bnha critical #ofa #ofa plot critical #i mourn the loss of the focus on the kids #i really miss them

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myinterestsvary-writes · 3 years

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gotta admit, in the beginning of the resurgence I was open to the concept of zutara as I've previously harboured affection for ships similar to it and was yet again unsurprised that kind of dynamic dominated in fandom. frequently seeking and liking their posts, reading their meta and genuinely willing to change sides as I've seen many zks have done since I was impressed with the thought that kataang was maybe just a phase, with their reasoning being understandable (though a little odd) until I saw the uglier side of the zutara fandom that just. DID NOT. sit well with me. in short, they seemed very out of touch with what I associated most fondly with atla from memory pre-resurgence: iroh, whom I recognized as the heart of the show at the time - you know the fandom's single most important character's mentor and father figure? the same man whose quotes are so easily accessible and relevant even now. yeah, I found that a lot, a lot of their reasonings for their stance for zutara and against kataang were shallow, insignificant, and for a lack of a better word...bullshit because it relied on the popular trend of categorizing characters into either good or bad radfem tropes with the pure intention of moralizing to the youth and encouraging them into thinking there were to be no other way to tell a story without their method that'll work or in ways that you can find even the slightest bit acceptable. especially without even bothering to look at intention or nuance behind the storytelling decision because of the fact that, "iT mADe mE unCOMFortABlE".

another thing is the media circulation picking up on the ship war happenings from CBR, screenrant, the mary sue, some obscure fan blog/professional enough news outlet tailored to geeks called The Fandomentals or ridiculous headlines like that hilariously (and almost disgustingly) titled Slate magazine article, "Katara Should Have Ended Up with Zuko, Not Aang (they chose the wrong ship 👀)"

and this post pretty much cementing how I would continue to feel about that particular subfandom and how I will interact with it on a similar level until I leave the general atla fandom:

all pushing the same tired arguments and coming across as utterly bitter despite their fandom being so "welcoming", "loving", and "beautiful"...

alright, iroh wouldn't care for any of it.

why can't anti kataangers ever be evidently nowhere near involved with zutara in any sense prior to? why couldn't some of the biggest criticisms of such an incredible show like atla never not reek of shipping biases on some level?

at least, from what I've witnessed from within the kataang fandom is that we identify and praise what ourselves have recognized as the show's heart on a daily basis. note that I'm biased but also consider it's because he's the other half of our beloved ship.

all I'm saying is that shipping kataang has brought me closer to enlightenment

#cruising on the canon ship #unsinkable ship #their mark is already made and permanent #anti zutara #am i unintentionslly insinuating ya'll should ship more iroh ships?#maybe...

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firelxdykatara · 4 years

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Hi! I follow you mostly for your zutara content and I noticed you also ship captain swan! I'm assuming you aren't as active in the ouat fandom as you are atla, but i'm curious why you ship captain swan and what your thoughts are on anti-cs arguments since from the ones I've seen, they seem to be somewhat similar to anti-kataang arguments. thanks for the great content! :)

oh god, this ask sent me on such an emotional journey. (and thank you, by the way! i’m glad you like my content <333)

ouat ended before i lost my old blog in the purge, and i’d stopped watching after season 6 ended to begin with, but my old blog was restored (like eight months later which is why i never really went back to it) so if you want to check out my ouat tags over on @thepinkrvnger i was. very active in the ouat fandom for a very long time. (relevant tags are my captain swan tag, though you’d have to dig past gifsets and things to get to any meta, and also my anti swan queen and anti swanfire tags [there was a lot of bad blood in the ouat fandom and lordy did i have Many Opinions])

it’s been so long i can’t really. say for sure anymore, but i was definitely among the first wave of captain swan shippers. like many of us, i started shipping it almost as soon as killian was introduced in season 2, and it was that infamous episode with the beanstalk that really cemented my love for the ship--and, aside from emma herself, captain swan was one of the few things that kept me watching when the show’s writing quality took a steep nosedive.

uh. anyway. to actually answer your question, honestly? i’d need some specific examples, because i can’t think of any anti cs arguments that remotely resemble anti kataang arguments, in large part because there are no similarities between them. in fact, captain swan is much more similar to zutara--enemies-to-friends-to-lovers, complete with a season 2 betrayal following an emotional connection when they were isolated from their respective groups (actually if i really thought about it i could probably make a connection between emma’s connection with killian at the top of the beanstalk and katara’s connection with zuko in the crystal caverns beneath ba sing se; it wouldn’t line up perfectly but there are thematic similarities there which are actually pretty damn juicy now that i'm mentally putting the two scenes side-by-side), and the entire show basically setting them up with parallels and narrative symbolism, killian’s redemption arc being second to none (seriously, much as i love zuko’s, his is not the only way to have a redemption, and kiliian is an excellent example of a true villain redemption done right--interestingly, the other attempted redemption arcs in ouat were piss poor, which makes me think they used up all the good writing for killian’s, but that’s another rant altogether), and emma being the driving force in her own romantic narrative the entire way through their relationship arc.

one of the biggest anti kataang arguments, for me, has always been katara’s lack of agency in her own romantic narrative--and this absolutely does not apply to captain swan. killian falls in love with her first, but emma is the one making every choice--to save him, to trust him, to include him in her family. a lot of killian’s redemption is wrapped up in his feelings for emma, but she doesn’t change him--while it is his growing love for her that, in the beginning, makes him want to be a better man, he still makes every choice to be better on his own. he feels remorse for his bad actions and he does what he can to make amends to his victims, where possible. the show keeps bringing up new, horrible things killian did in his past, but unlike when it does this with regina, he always feels remorse, and he is always the one trying to make up for the bad he did, rather than being painted as a victim (the most egregious example of this is during the camelot arc, where regina is attacked by a man whose entire family she brutally slaughtered--not only does she not give a shit, but she’s painted as the victim throughout the entire interaction).

it does help that emma is the central character of the series. we are privy to her thoughts and emotions, and she’s never presented to killian like some sort of trophy or prize for Doing Good--there is a moment where he kisses her without her consent, but a) the situations are entirely different, and b) they don’t get together Right Away (in fact, iirc, it takes the entire rest of the season for them to actually get together, and there is a lot that happens in between), and emma’s feelings are the most prominent at every stage of their developing relationship.

i’m actually really interested in knowing which arguments exactly you mean, because i can’t think of a single argument against kataang that would apply to captain swan in even the flimsiest respect. they are entirely different relationship dynamics that come from very different places and have entirely different journeys, and, as i pointed out, if captain swan parallels any atla ship i think it’d be zutara more than any other. so if you can think of examples, please send them to me, i’m curious!

#atla #ouat #captain swan #zutara #anti kataang #just or the mentions #asked #Anonymous

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memo1005 · 4 years

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Azula probably has the most disgusting antis, they will dehumanize her and place her evil above any other villain in the series with such conviction

Honestly!!! Since most people saw ATLA as children, they definitely have some warped memories of Azula.

One simple example is how apparently Azula would hurt the turtleducks with rocks or even kill them (lmao what?). In the flashback, Azula was actually just throwing whole pieces of bread to the ducks. Zuko even told Ursa, “This is how Azula feeds them.” No mention of killing whatsoever. There was also likely no one to teach her how to “gently” feed the turtleducks.

Another example is that she kills just about anyone. She doesn’t. Everyone she’d captured was merely imprisoned and unharmed. She banished the servants even though she suspected betrayal/ an assassination attempt when she could’ve done worse like what Fire Nation law decreed. If it is not needed, if it is pointless, she will not do it.

I think that a lot of people view her negatively because they wholly empathized with Zuko’s character first as children. I don’t think you should fully believe Zuko’s opinion/thoughts about her because he is also biased. When he told Aang, “Everything comes east to her.”, you get the sense that he’s jealous of her and fully believes that she is “lucky” when she’s really not. Or that she always lies. Sure she does, but her words also have truth in them. Azula being nosy af saved Zuko’s life when he was nine lmao.

I also want to link some of my favorite metas:

Azula’s emphasis on using “fear to control people” is not a psychological hang-up but a natural tactic of the Fire Lord, military, and Imperial Government to maintain obedience; as a teenager with limited life experience, she has internalized her role as a princess and warrior to the detriment of her personal relationships and emotional maturity (this is where the “child soldier” narrative has relevance). - The East Asian Origins of the Fire Nation and Its Villains

Mirror & Misdirection - The Distortions of the Mirror Scene

It’s difficult to convince her haters though because they’re so hell-bent on erasing her humanity. I don’t think they’ve considered that she’s very young, and that she has a life ahead of her where she can adapt to not being used as a war weapon.

Some of them don’t understand her complexity which is a shame because she’s arguably the most complex character on ATLA. She wanted her family together, believed in the power of the Royal Family, recognized that Zuko was the Crown Prince but she also wanted leadership to be earned and to be competent. I think she wanted Zuko to truly earn his place in their family. She basked in Ozai’s favor but didn’t fully believe he would make her his successor, not until Zuko ultimately betrayed them in Book 3. Those are just examples of her complexity.

this turned out long. tl;dr to haters:

#azula #atla #avatar: the last airbender #my asks #this turned out too long lmao

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violethowler · 4 years

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Dark Enchantress

Following on from last week’s essay, I would like to talk about one character who has often been overlooked both in-universe and out. Someone who was a major character in the first game, but whose presence has diminished in the years since, even as subsequent games have subtly laid the groundwork for her return to prominence.

I’m talking of course, about Maleficent.

Because of the fact that she hasn’t been a major threat since the first game, many fans tend to overlook Maleficent in later Kingdom Hearts games and dismiss her as an unimportant distraction, or even an outright joke. Outside of Re:coded, her schemes have had no immediate impact on the overarching plot of any games, and she’s constantly overshadowed by bigger antagonists like Xehanort.

However within the framework of the Heroine’s Journey, Maleficent fills a crucial role that has not yet been completed. To explain, I must first elaborate a bit more on the narrative archetype into which Sora and Rikus’ relationship falls:

The character dynamic between the protagonist and their Animus in a Heroine’s Journey often follows what I have heard others informally label as a Dark Youth/Light Youth narrative[1]. There is no official name for this archetype, so I will be referring to it by the terms it was labeled as when I first learned of it. While the archetype is not exclusively used for romances, many Heroine’s Journey romances fit into this dynamic, as romantic Dark Youth/Light Youth stories tend to follow Beauty and the Beast, rivals-to-lovers, and enemies-to-lovers archetypes.

The Light Youth is most commonly the protagonist of a story, while the Dark Youth typically serves as a Shadow figure to the main character. While there have been rare instances where a Dark Youth is the protagonist of their own story, in most examples, the Dark Youth will be a deuteragonist to the Light Youth. The Dark Youth represents what their counterpart could have become had their circumstances been worse, and in a coming of age narrative they symbolize the more turbulent aspects of growing up.

They typically begin the story as an anti-villain or tragic villain before transitioning to an anti hero or outright hero by the end, with their interactions with their light youth counterpart gradually driving them to change for the better. For all that various groups in fandom spaces will debate about whether or not a character “deserves” redemption, a well-written Dark Youth archetype is meant to teach younger audiences that no matter how many mistakes you make, it’s never too late to turn things around and do better.

Some examples of Light Youth/Dark Youth pairs include:

Belle & the Beast (Beauty & the Beast)

Aang & Zuko (Avatar: The Last Airbender)

Rey & Kylo Ren (Star Wars: Episodes VII - IX)

Lucy & Edmund Pevensie (The Chronicles of Narnia: The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe)

Allura & Lotor (Voltron: Legendary Defender)

Kagome & Inuyasha (Inuyasha)

In many examples of this dynamic, the Dark Youth often spends a significant portion of the narrative under the spell of an Evil Sorcerer figure. Someone whose actions and influence create or maintain a rift between the Dark Youth and their counterpart. In order for the story to reach its climax, the Evil Sorcerer’s control over the Dark Youth must be overcome. This hold can be literal in the sense that they are physically holding the Dark Youth captive, or it can be metaphorical in the sense that their words and actions influence the Dark Youth psychologically.

While the character that fills this role in the narrative isn’t required to be magical at all, one of the most common forms this archetype takes is the Wicked Witch (hence why I refer to it as the Evil Sorcerer). In Dark Youth/Light Youth stories that deal with themes that are relevant to real world experiences, they can often take the form of an abusive parental figure, like Fire Lord Ozai in Avatar or High Priestess Haggar in Voltron.

Thus, we come to Maleficent. Despite the fact that she hasn’t been a serious threat since the first game, her influence still lingers. She spent much of her screen time in the original game convincing Riku that Sora had abandoned him, driving him down the path to villainy. Despite working in every game since to redeem himself, her influence still casts a shadow over his interactions with Sora. While they reconciled during their reunion in Kingdom Hearts II, Sora and Riku did not meaningfully address the latter’s behavior during the first game.

Sora’s views about “Riku” in Chain of Memories prior to the Replica reveal indicate that he believes Riku was not in control of his actions and was therefore blameless for what happened. But we as the audience know that despite being manipulated by Maleficent, Riku was in control of his actions. In order for the rift between the two to fully heal, they need to have a conversation where they talk about why Riku behaved the way he did and, in doing so, they must get to the heart of why Riku was so jealous of Sora.

As mentioned in my previous essay, the depiction of Riku and his bond with Sora across the series is consistent with how love interests in the Heroine’s Journey are portrayed. In addition to this narrative pattern, multiple textual parallels with canon Disney couples point towards Riku and Sora having romantic feelings for each other:

In the first Kingdom Hearts, we have two prominent moments of one character calling out for another as the party flees the location of the world’s boss while it quakes around them: Aladdin calling out for Jasmine as the party flees the Cave of Wonders, and Sora calling out for Riku as the party flees Monstro’s stomach.

Kingdom Hearts II uses plot details involving Disney Princess romances to foreshadow Sora and Riku’s reunion in The World That Never Was.

Aladdin is avoiding Jasmine at the start of the first visit to Agrabah just like how Riku is avoiding Sora throughout the game as a whole.

After being freed from Xaldin’s influence in the first visit to Beast’s Castle, the Beast is afraid to talk to Belle after how he behaved, just like how Riku didn’t want Sora to find him after how he acted in the first game. (Notably, we don’t get to see the Beast’s curse broken until *after* we’ve seen Riku no longer trapped in Ansem’s form)

Ariel is afraid that since she’s a mermaid and Eric is a human that he’ll reject her, just like how Riku didn’t want Sora to see that he’d taken on Ansem’s form.

When Sora, Donald, and Goofy are separated from Rapunzel and Flynn in the Kingdom of Corona during Kingdom Hearts III, Goofy says that Rapunzel and Eugene will be fine as long as they’re together. The last time this phrasing was used in the series, Goofy was saying that about Sora and Riku.

Kingdom Hearts III connects Riku’s sacrifice for Sora in the Keyblade Graveyard with Hercules diving into the River Styx to save Megara’s soul. (This is more clear in the original Japanese, as the localization translated the term taisetsu na hito [literal meaning: precious person] as “person I love most” for Hercules and “what matters” for Riku.)

In Jungian psychology, which the Heroine’s Journey is heavily influenced by, the Evil Sorcerer working to keep the romantic leads apart is symbolic of romantic/sexual interference. They represent cultural forces attempting to dictate what kind of romantic relationship is socially acceptable for people who share some aspect of the protagonist or Dark Youth’s identity.

Maleficent got her hooks into Riku at the beginning of the series by convincing him that Sora didn’t value him or their bond. Since then, he’s gone to the opposite extreme. Instead of lashing out over his jealousy of not being the center of Sora’s attention, he bottles his feelings up. While some fans perceived his distance from Sora in recent games as him stepping back, it ‘s more accurate to say that he has resigned himself to the belief his feelings for Sora will forever be unrequited. This is best demonstrated in the Limit Cut DLC, where even after a year of multiple characters attempting to trace their connection to Sora with no results, the idea that his own bond with Sora could be important never crossed his mind until the Fairy Godmother said there was a clue in his dreams. And until Riku learns to let down his walls and admit to Sora how he feels, Maleficent will still have a hold over him.

Despite the narrative setup for a romance between the two of them, they will not be able to get together until Riku has fully broken free of Maleficent’s influence. This is the reason why the “Healing the Wounded Masculine” stage of Murdock’s formula where the protagonist and the Animus mend the rift between them is placed very close to the end of the sequence. Freeing the Dark Youth from the Sorcerer’s influence represents their relationship with their Light counterpart triumphing over the societal forces that the Sorcerer archetype represents. Until that has been achieved, neither lead is emotionally or psychologically ready to begin a relationship.

So while Maleficent may not have been as significant a threat as she was in the beginning, she still plays a major role within the framework of Sora’s Journey, and she will continue to have a presence in the series until that role has been completed in full.

Sources:

[1] Death of a Dark Youth, Desecration of the Animus; December 20, 2018. https://www.teampurplelion.com/death-of-a-dark-youth/

#kingdom hearts and the heroine's journey #kingdom hearts meta #kingdom hearts analysis #kh maleficent #soriku

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royaltealovingkookiness · 5 years

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What do you think about Combustion man/sparky sparky boom man? Was he actually relevant or necessary for the book 3 plot? Was it even in character for Zuko to hire an assassin to go after avatar & co?

How much time you got? In short, I HATE with a fiery, burning passion everything about him.

Oh, did you ask why? I’m gonna tell you anyways…

Me, rubbing my hands before Book 3: I’m really looking forward to Book: Fire. I can’t wait to see something about the government and the politics of the Fire Nation, like we did with the others. And the fire siblings. Their relationship is so fascinating and full of contradictions, I love it. And the dangerous ladies. Can we get into that particular hot-mess? This should be good.

Bryke: That’s boring. You know what would be cool? A guy that can make explosions with his forehead. I even have just the character-design.

Me: But the entire character makes no sense. He has no name, no background. He’s so powerful that the master-of-three elements Avatar, the greatest earthbender and a bloodbending waterbender can’t somehow deal with him? They even have a boomerang-and-space-sword-wielding plan-making genius? All you have to do is get behind the guy’s back…

Bryke: I know. Third-eye Explosions! Boom! Boom! That’s totally LIT!

Me: it also doesn’t really make sense for Zuko’s character. He immediately regretted his betrayal of Iroh and is very conflicted all the way home. He seems pretty bummed by his meeting with dear dad and that nothing is like he imagined it would be. And anyways, we saw him being compassionate and never really having the stomach for killing and violence. And he’s super-obsessed with honor. HONOR. HONOOOOOR! Hiring an assassin just seems kind of out of character.

Bryke: Can’t hear you. BOOM. BOOM. BOOM.

Me: And how does Zuko know this guy anyways? He just goes around the palace asking for assassin-recommendations? Or are you telling me, he always knew about him and could have just hired him way back in Book 1 instead of running around?

Bryke: It’s a kid show. Nobody will ask these questions. They’ll be too amazed with the EXPLOSIONS. And Zuko is DARK now and EDGY. Don’t you get the chiiiillz?

Me: Wouldn’t it make sense for Zuko to try to investigate himself every strange incident instead? I know… he could snoop around finding reports and getting more worried. If you want a cool design, make him the Blue Spirit again. That was great. He could maybe even beg an assignment investigating that factory Katara destroyed. I think it would be pretty cool if he realized immediately what had happened, and would be forced to cover it up, so Ozai doesn’t realize the Avatar is alive. And this way he could even meet Fire Nation commoners and see that the war didn’t particularly serve them well either. I mean if you plan to make him Fire Lord at the end of the series, wouldn’t it be meaningful for him to see the Fire Nation in its stark reality?

Bryke: Don’t worry. We got this. Zuko will be conflicted. He’ll brood. Even his hair will brood. It will be proper emo-length. And he’ll go to a beach party. Don’t you want to see a Fire Nation teenage beach party? It looks exactly like an American teenage beach party except everyone wears red. And there will be fire. E-X-P-L-O-S-I-O-N-S. BAAAM. That’s edgy.

Me: But once Zuko realizes that he wants to be good and join the Avatar wouldn’t he just call off the entire assignment? It’s pretty anti-climatic.

Bryke: (*evil whisper) You cannot un-hire Sparky-Sparky-Boom Man.

Me: Why not? That makes no sense whatsoever. And you are not calling him that?

Bryke: Sure we are. It’s funny. Or maybe Combustion Man? Hmm, both are very cool. Anyways, then Zuko will swing in and Boom-Boom Man will almost kill him. BOOM-BOOM-EXPLOOOOOOOSIONS!!!!!

Me: Why would he want to kill Zuko? Isn’t Zuko paying him?

Bryke: Why are you nitpicking here? Combustion Man is not very smart. He just goes BOOM. The kids will love it. It’s fun action.

Me: Uhhm, OK. But if Boom Boom man is so dumb, how did he manage to come up with that whole trap for Katara and Toph in The Runaway?

Bryke: That was like six episodes ago? Who remembers that shit anymore? I know, we can add more booms and Sokka with his boomerang and the guy self-explodes. Boom Man is BOOM-eranged to death. It’s hilarious? Get it?

Me: Well… At least he’s dead. Let’s never ever mention him. Let’s forget he ever existed. I’m so psyched about Zuko finally joining the Gaang. I waited 52 episodes for this….I’m not gonna let friggin’ Sparky-Sparky-BOOM-man ruin it.

FIVE YEARS LATER…

Bryke: Hmmmm. Need some cool villains for this season. I know, I know!!!!… do you remember the best one we had? That guy with the exploding head???? I must have that drawing on the computer somewhere….

Me: No. No. that’s not your best villain. Remember Azula? She was great, smart, funny, chilling, tragic, great firebending, lots of booms. Or if you want someone with less high- profile, how about Long Feng, or Zhao or Hama?

Bryke: But do any of them have exploding heads???? No. You see? Sparky-Sparky-Boom-man, but this time we’ll make it a WOMAN. That’s originial. That’s representation. That’s progressive.

Me: Didn’t we say, we’ll never talk about this entire assassin-plot again? It was after all so OOC for Zuko.

Bryke:

Me:

#atla #atla saltbending #combustion man #book 3 #narrative choices #zuko #anti-bryke #sparky sparky boom man

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