#ofmd discourse
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"Izzy is to blame for Ed going off the deep end"
"No, Stede is the one who broke his heart and made him go nuts."
I have a radical proposal which is that actually Ed is a person who just had serious pre-existing issues that were triggered by a long series of blows starting with betrayal by his former first mate and old friend (meaning two people here), surrendering to the English, giving up his identity of years, rejection by his love, mockery by his new crew, and harsh words/more rejection from his oldest friend/subordinate.
It makes sense for Izzy and Stede the CHARACTERS to feel responsible for Ed's downward spiral, but we don't have to treat what they say as fact.
We the audience have the ability to see the larger picture and say "actually, Ed was teetering on the edge of this since we first met him after a lifetime of trauma and this probably needed to be addressed before he was ever going to be stable and happy."
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“they killed the suicidal character!”
babes, ed’s fine! you gotta finish ep 3!
#ed teach#ofmd meta#ofmd#my toxic trait is pretending I don’t understand that fandom has given the entire main character’s arc and storyline off to izzy hands#so their anger can feel more justified!#just be sad and normal about this p l e a s e I am begging yall#stop using therapy speech to justify your over reactions take 935 it’s exhausting#one izzy fan to another yall didn’t find that at all hot?????#tw suicide#the 💿🐴#ofmd discourse
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pt II our flag means death but I've never watched it
HELLO OFMD FANDOM! It's the Good Omens Mascot and Resident Dumbass, back again for part II. First, let's clear the air of all controversy!
Some of you lovely maggots were kind enough to warn me about certain discourse about a salad spoon and also about a certain gentleman named Izzy. I was warned not to make assumptions and not to take sides, and I hear some members had to leave the fandom for a while because it got toxic. Maggots. All the rest of you. Worry not about me. I'm here to unite the OFMD fandom! How, you ask? By being so undeniably stupid in my own opinions that you all will have to unite to disagree with me. You underestimate the power of my dumbassery. Well, let's not dilly dally and dawdle, here's the updated summary:
I have been informed there is cannibalism on this ship but it is not real. Someone pretends to eat someone and then their wife helps them fake their death while they run away from the ship though their lover wanted them to run to China.
There are BDSM lesbians, which is honestly such a slay, Pinterest has let me down by not informing me of that when I made Part I. I will no longer be using Pinterest a reliable source in future academic essays.
Mermaid Stede performs necromancy while a song called Kate Bush plays (I don't know who this is, a politician? Idk whether of US or UK).
Gravy Basket is a destination and Buttons is a sea witch and there is educational stabbing. Buttons is then a bird because of the BDSM lesbians.
There is a lady who is extremely beautiful and intimidating and powerful and she has twenty husbands and I assumed incorrectly that you were all talking about a Jack Russel terrier.
Let's start with the controversy! Izzy. Secondary protagonist or antagonist? Good or bad? Kindly father figure or homoerotically charged friend? Necessary death or not? No no no. Behold:
I present a new question, a hot take sizzling from the pan: Did Izzy really exist?
Personally, I firmly believe that no, he did not. I believe that the rum on the ship was spiked with hallucinogens.
Izzy was simply the manifestation of Ed's Freudian subconscious, taking the shape of a human being, vaguely resembling a humanoid potato Ed was forced to boil as a kid. I was a psychology student with a final grade of 99% and I accept only destructive criticism on my posts thank you. Feel free to discuss whether he boiled the potato in a fit of rage or whether he was forced to.
There are assorted Ned's, Mary's and an uncertain number of Jeff's on ship.
One of the Jeff's is an accountant, and there is a nonbinary talking sword named Jim. Actually I'm not sure if they talk.
Love you all, rooting for the show to be renewed.
REMINDERS. Be polite to each other in the reblogs, on tumblr reblogs spread posts and not likes (which don't do anything for visibility) unlike other social media sites, but MOST IMPORTANTLY.
I ACCEPT ONLY DESTRUCTIVE CRITICISM, THIS BLOG IS A GODLESS, LAWLESS LAND, AND ALL RAGE AT EACH OTHER MUST BE REDIRECTED AT ME. UNDERSTOOD? YAY.
#good omens mascot#weirdly specific but ok#asmi#maggots#lgbtqia#renew as a crew#adopt ofmd#ofmd#ofmd fandom#pirate omens#our flag means gay#our flag means death#omfd summary#omfd izzy#izzy hands#ofmd meta#ofmd discourse#spanish jackie#stede bonnet#blackbeard#ed x stede#blackbonnet#gentlebeard
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Gonna start some discourse:
By far the WORST part of S2 is that we did NOT get any glimpses of Ed’s BELLY!
Seriously, wtf??? So many opportunities and not only did we not get even a sliver of tum but the shirt was FULLY TUCKED IN 😡😡😡
I’m disappointed no one is talking about this travesty tbh
#meet me in the Waffle House parking lot Gypsy Taylor I just wanna talk#rip Ed Teach’s crop tops#we were all FERAL for the tummy how could they do this to us#hyperbole but also I am legit a bit upset about it#let me objectify that man who is the same age as me and therefore not at all old#ofmd discourse#our flag means death
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We said goodbye to Izzy this season. What was your initial reaction to learning his fate, and how did you prepare for his death?
Con O’Neill: You know what, I’ve been around a long time, and going through those first few scripts and seeing which way the arc was going, it didn’t surprise me.
This is so god-damn tragic to me.
Obligatory disclaimer that I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth, or make it sound like this is the only way to interpret this.
Having just watched a big chunk of Con's filmography, this man has played so. many. tragic. queer. characters. So many tragic characters in general, but so many of them queer and...I mean we were all really hoping that Izzy wouldn't be one of them, but to think he might have been hoping that and then been wrong, and seen that bus coming? Makes me feel awful.
I agree that he got to really go out with a bang, and did an amazing job, all the awards, really great arc - but God I wish this role had bucked the long, long, trend.
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Okay. OFMD discourse.
I see a lot of passive aggressive digs at "media literacy" and claims that we're watching different shows, and... I guess that's true? There's obviously a fundamental disagreement about what story OFMD is telling. Like, I feel like we need to sit down and do some kind of Story Analysis 101 just to make sure we all have the same foundational understanding of the show.
Like. What I was talking about in the first part of this post.
If you and everyone in your server are doing OFMD media analysis and you've all concluded that the show's main plot is the crew's storyline, you're going to come to very different conclusions than me. You're going to wonder why so much time in S2 was given to B plots and scenes that don't move the crew's story forward. You're going to be annoyed that so much of the season is devoted to Gentlebeard and not Izzy and his relationship with the crew. You might even conclude that the whole show is an example of "bury your gays" because the central queer character -- the character whose development is, in your eyes, the heart and soul of the show -- dies at the end.
The thing is? The "big cliffhanger" of S1 was not the crew's separation, and the first episodes of S2 aren't about the crew's reunion and Izzy's arc. Izzy and the crew are not the show's protagonists. Stede and Ed are the protagonists; their relationship is the main plotline. It's very silly to call S2E4 a "mistake" that "[shoves] the show's main plot and most of the characters into 1 minute scenes in between much longer gentlebeard scenes" because the Gentlebeard scenes are the main plot.
Prior to OFMD, my favorite characters were always secondary and a lot of my personal analysis focused on action that fell outside of the main story. Heck, one of my blorbos of choice takes an antagonistic role to the story's protagonists, and yeah, I sure do sympathize with him even though he's not positioned as the guy who's in the right. But I'm always aware of my blorbo's place in the narrative.
It's okay if your favorite character(s) aren't the protagonists of a story. It's okay if the plotline you're most interested in isn't the main one. It's okay if you hang out in the corners of fandom that focus on the parts of the story you care the most about. It's even okay if you're mad at OFMD for letting you down by not giving enough time and attention to the bits that are the most important to you.
Just.
Stede and Ed are the protagonists. OFMD is, first and foremost, about their relationship. When I see analysis that denies this, I feel like I'm completely losing my mind.
#ofmd#ofmd fandom#fandom critical?#idk i feel like a crazy person sometimes#and sometimes this fandom is frustrating#ofmd discourse
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Hey OFMD friends! There’s a few little things (and one big thing) I’d like to try to clear up based on a number of discussions I’ve seen in various places.
1. Stede understands sex & sex references. When he responds with “I don’t know what you’re talking about,” or something similar, that’s a posh people thing. They pretend they’ve never heard of sex whenever it’s brought up in public or with strangers. Just weird aristocrat things! But Stede knows. He’d definitely had plenty of (likely not very pleasant) sex with his wife, and he’d very likely had other sexual experiences as well. More importantly, though, he’s a voracious reader! The man likely had a whole stash of filthy, bawdy novels & books of poetry. There was PLENTY of it, even back then!
2. Ed & Stede’s inn is NOT on the same island as the Republic of Pirates. They’d never settle on an island currently occupied by British military. They sailed away from the Republic of Pirates & went to a totally different island.
3. Frenchie is the new Captain because he was already First Mate, so there was no reason for them to take a vote. Yes, the crew chose Olu in 1x9, but that was when they were mutinying against Izzy & there was no official First Mate in place. The crew don’t seem to have any qualms about Frenchie’s abilities (so far anyway!) It will be a lot of fun to explore that dynamic in S3.
4. Zheng’s very likely only going to be with The Revenge until she finds one of her remaining ships that weren’t in the Republic of Lirates harbor when Ricky attacked.
I’m hoping, though, that we, the audience, will get lucky enough to keep Zheng with them for a while before she does find one of her own ships. I definitely want to see some shenanigans with The Crew, Zheng, & Auntie, including at least one raid. Fingers crossed!
The one BIG thing:
There are MANY disabled characters on the show. Wee John has mobility issues & chronic pain. Lucius is an artist & scribe w an amputated finger & also has chronic back pain. Swede has scurvy. Jackie’s right hand is a prosthetic.
It’s extremely important to understand that all disabilities are relevant no matter how visible they are. There has been some very harmful discourse about disability representation surrounding Izzy’s death & it really needs to stop. A HUGE percentage of disabilities are invisible. Those of us (yep, myself included) with invisible disabilities have had to fight tooth & nail for basic recognition & acknowledgement, let alone benefits & proper medical treatment. We’re still fighting & it’s a major uphill battle!
Let’s not give more ammunition to those fighting against us by claiming that Izzy’s disability was the only important one.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk! 💞
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No, OFMD did not 'promise' the viewers a safe time (only happiness, no angst or death) then 'betray' them with Izzy's death, as i've seen some complaining.
The show is called Our Flag Means Death and there is death and angst from season 1 episode 1. At no point did the showrunners promise us 'this is a show where all characters will remain safe'.
Being a comedy doesn't mean the story will be all joy and light. Comedies using upsetting topics and death is not unusual. It's actually quite common! If done well, comedy can give a contrast to angsty moments making them more heartbreaking.
The writers have a story they wanted to tell and have said since season 1 aired that there is a 3 season plan for the show. It's likely that they planned major plot points for each season (like Izzy's death) before S1 was filmed. They didn't change the plot to kill Izzy because they wanted to make the show darker or to spite fans. You are not owed a perfectly happy story when the writers have set out to tell something different.
If you're a person who can only handle stories where everyone is always happy, that's fine! Stories like that exist! It just makes no sense to watch a show with death in the title then blame the writers for 'betraying' you when death happens.
#ofmd#our flag means death#I know i'm not good at making my thoughts concise.#ofmd spoilers#ofmd discourse#look I promise I won't only post about OFMD discourse. i've blocked and muted a lot of people on twt and Tumblr.#The fandom is going to calm down.#OFMD is my special interest and I won't hold back from defending it when I see unfair criticism.
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The most ridiculous take I keep hearing is “season 2 might have flaws but you’re not allowed to criticise them because of all the show has done for the queer community”
Ok, what exactly has it done? We’ve never heard David, Taika or Rhys publicly advocate for LGBT+ rights (which of course no one has to do if they are involved in a show with queer rep, but it gets weird when your whole message is “yeah we get you, this show was made for you, we are sooo happy that we are soooo amazing at creating a space for queer people”).
Creating a show with queer characters is nice but it dosnt change anything in the real world, it might help us escape from reality for a while but it won’t make the reality we need to escape from better.
When cast members/DJ talk about it at all, its always very unspecified and unpolitical “Yeah, let’s just all treat each other with kindness” vibes.
Literally the only* cast member who openly stand up for LGBTQIA+ rights, somebody who regularly shares his support for trans people online, who on his own initiative used the opportunity on panels to talk about queer rights and what we can do to keep them (“vote the fuckers out”), who is not afraid to find very clear words to defend the queer community against arseholes is Con O’Neill… you know the ONE person who’s character David decided to kill off.
Sorry if it offends you, that I think a 57 year old queer guy, who engages with the fandom daily, publicly defends my right to exists, has played a notable amount of queer characters during his career, has probably done more for the queer community than Mr. David-I don’t know what queer baiting is- Jenkins.
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*I do realise that you can count Vico Ortiz as a queer activist, although many thinks they do that people refer to as activism are actually just them existing in public, they’re also a drag king and drag is a form of protest.
!Edit: have been informed that Vico indeed does a lot of activism in spanish that my non-spanish speaking ass just didn’t pick up on
=Con O’Neill is the only one EXCEPT Vico Ortiz
#ofmd#our flag means death#ofmd season 2#ofmd discourse#ofmd s2#ofmd spoilers#ofmd 2#ofmd s2 spoilers#ofmd izzy#con o'neill#queer media
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I wish I could say I found this, but someone else posted it, and before I could reblog it, tumblr washed it away.
all props to the OP!
#ofmd#our flag means death#ofmd s2 spoilers#ofmd s2#stede bonnet#rhys darby#ofmd spoilers#gentlebeard#ofmd season 2#ofmd season 2 spoilers#Izzy hands#con O’Neill#no sorry I no longer trust David Jenkins#it’s a lame joss Whedon move to kill a beloved character and they are both rightly criticized for it.#Justice for Izzy#israel hands#ofmd critical#isreal hands#ofmd discourse#rip izzy hands#the izcourse
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i know a big point of contention in this fandom is Ed's Anger. but the thing is that it's rlly hard for this to be an "agree to disagree" issue because the sides are like:
edward teach does have anger issues. in the show he becomes disproportionately and irrationally angry, and he expresses that anger in harmful and unacceptable ways. saying ed doesn't have anger issues is flattening a complex indigenous character for the sake of respectability politics.
edward teach does not have anger issues. every instance of ed's anger in the show is proportionate to the situation he is experiencing and ed is shown to be capable of controlling his anger. the way ed expresses his anger is normal and acceptable within the fictional comedy universe he exists in. saying that ed does have anger issues reflects implicit biases about men of color being inherently and exceptionally angry and violent.
and like, i've rewatched this show a billion fucking times at this point. i've seen these scenes more times than i can count. never, at any point, did i think ed's on-screen expressions of anger were indicative of anger issues. i have always considered ed's anger to be reasonable. even in the brief period of time before i began engaging with this fandom, i did not think ed had anger issues. i was surprised to find out that some people believe he does.
i just. i have a hard time, after watching this show over and over again and finding ed's anger to be a reasonable response to some very difficult situations, seeing people say they think those reasonable responses are indicative of anger issues. i've heard the arguments, and i just don't agree. and the question of why i don't agree really comes down to: am i subconsciously over-correcting for racial stereotypes and flattening the complexity of a character of color, or are other people reading ed's anger as more extreme than it is due to subconscious racial bias?
and that's. really not a question i think any of us are ever going to be able to answer.
EDIT 7/8/23: A QUICK POST ABOUT THIS POST
#ofmd#our flag means death#ofmd meta#ofmd discourse#edward teach#edward teach born on a beach#blackbeard#mine#meta#txt#og#ofmd fandom crit#if you want to try and debate/discuss with me specific instances of ed's anger feel free#im busy so idk when i'll get back to you but i'm always open to discussion#at the end of the day tho. it's been almost a year. and i really doubt i'm going to change my mind on this one any time soon.
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Yeah fuckit I'm already getting death threats.
So the fact that for some reason OFMD fandom has decided that the idea that Izzy Hands is an unpleasant, rage-filled, deeply fucked up little man with internalized homophobia who did sorta fuck around and find out AND the idea that Edward Teach, the dread pirate Blackbeard has a dark side and some unfortunate violent habits cannot possibly be things that coexist.
And if you believe this, you are racist for thinking the pirate Blackbeard is capable of violence. Because actually, everything he ever did as Blackbeard, his entire persona, his success, actually that was all the doing of a white man and the indigenous man doesn't have any agency. This is the correct progressive position to take.
I honestly feel like I'm going mad sometimes reading these takes. If you think possibly Edward, the Kraken, the man who on-screen attempted murder of one of the main characters (multiple times, actually), who on-screen mutilated his longtime associate and forced him to self-cannibalize, who we have been told over and over committed acts of violence, maiming, and indirect murder...if you think this character has more darkness than the average teddy bear in him, it's racist character assassination and you're a sick Izzy stan prepare to receive our death threats.
You are all poisoned by discourse. You have outlined two extreme positions on this topic and barricaded them and laid mines between the two to explode anyone who dares to venture into the no man's land of nuanced character interpretation.
I love Edward Teach. He was My Blorbo from the moment he appeared on-screen and I identify with him and his self-protection mechanisms very strongly. And seeing large portions of the fandom insist on only a pure and sanitised version of his character absolutely SENDS ME BONKERS.
I don't write this as an Izzy stan. I think he's a fascinating character, but mostly I don't give a shit about him. I say this as an ED stan, who is tired of bland fandom versions of one of the greatest characters of the last decade.
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Ed buried Izzy with the same level of emotion he had when throwing his leathers into the sea
#as if they were both just symbols of blackbeard to him#ugh#smh#ofmd s2 spoilers#ofmd season 2 spoilers#ofmd spoilers#our flag means death spoilers#ofmd s2 finale#ofmd critical#ofmd discourse#justice for izzy#izzy hands#blackbeard ofmd#edward teach#blackhands#edizzy
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no, ed is not irredeemable. he went through a lot of shit which caused a spiral which hurt many people. he knew that it was out of character for him, and the crew saw that and eventually forgave him.
no, Izzy is also not irredeemable. he hurt ed a lot, by threatening him and forcing him back into the blackbeard persona. but he also was in pain a lot after that, and the crew saw that and supported him.
in different times within the story, they had a suicide arc and moments where they severely hurt others, and yet they both had the crew love them in the end, regardless of the bad things that they did.
I think we should focus on that, because that's what the show is about. finding the people that see your mistakes and understand that you're trying to be better, and that you're a good person on the inside.
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so what are our takes on ofmd season 2? I just finished and I’m struggling to articulate how I feel about it. there were a lot of good moments but season 1 definitely felt stronger overall. like, I enjoyed it, but at the same time… what?
#idk don’t ask me what I think yet I can’t figure it out#mostly like. wow. a lot of stuff happened there#ofmd#ofmd season 2#ofmd s2#ofmd spoilers#tagging this as like every iteration to prevent spoilers even though I’m a latecomer#ofmd discourse
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"Victimhood should not be determined solely on the basis of identity."
I shared a post about the Baeddel movement (radfems in disguise) on my main blog, @the-raider-king , but I couldn't help thinking about how fucking applicable that is to the bizarroland ofmd discourse these days.
Sometimes, "brown" people do bad things.
Sometimes, white people are hurt.
separately, it weirds me the fuck out how Ed stans reduce his entire identity to "brown" when it's time to talk about abuse 🤔
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