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melbatron5000 · 2 days

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The Metatron

Don't ask Neil about any of my theories, please and thank you!

I'm working on the chiastic structure of Good Omens 2 right now, and man, the parallels are weird.

Big events or scenes that you would expect to have mirrors on the opposite time stamp do not, but little words, phrases, and images do. Like when Crowley rings the bell to say he's back? That moment's exact time-stamp opposite is Aziraphale ringing the bell in the book shop for quiet. What the hell?

You know what else has a weird opposite?

When Crowley asks if they can't talk in the book shop because there's a naked man there, and when the Metatron walks into the book shop for the first time.

They can't talk in the book shop at the end because the Metatron is there.

Wait, the Metatron is a naked man?

Oh hell yes.

Let me go on.

My first thought was The Emperor Is Naked, and I think that's a layer here. The Metatron is wearing what he thinks are amazing clothes and everyone else is going along with it because they're afraid of him? Yep, that tracks.

I know what you're thinking, but my story gets better.

Terry Pratchett has said something along the lines of humans being the place where the falling angel meets the naked ape. He's said it in several places, but most notably in the book Hogfather, one of my favorites. But he also said that he would rather be a naked ape than a falling angel.

Hm. So is the Metatron . . . human?

But Neil said in reply to a Tumblr ask that the Metatron in the Good Omens was never human. Hmmmm.

Okay, yes, you know what else Neil said?

Lucifer doesn't exist in the Good Omens universe. Because when he fell, he changed into Satan, The Adversary, and now that's all there ever was. Lucifer the angel is gone.

The Metatron was never human. When Enoch, the human, became the Metatron, Enoch was ended and now there is only the Metatron. And the Metatron was never human.

Bingo.

Now, what springs to mind there is the phrase "only human." The Metatron may not be human, but that's his original stock.

This guy can be beaten.

And I think Crowley has given Aziraphale the information to do it.

#good omens #good omens 2 #crowley #good omens meta #aziraphale #ineffable husbands #good omens analysis #good omens fan theory #ineffable mystery #good omens the metatron #good omens lucifer #good omens satan #good omens crackpotting #good omens parallels #good omens chiastic structure #my brain is spinning and it won't stop

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fallenandproud · 8 months

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fun fact, the breaking point that led me to finally cave and make this sideblog was watching youtube shorts and the algorithm decied to throw a TON of hazbin hotel / helluva boss stuff at me and one came up with Lucifer Charlie's dad just as like. one of those edits and THEN i scroll and THE NEXT ONE IS SOMEONE DRAWING THE FALL FROM HEAVEN and i decided right then and there that on top of my demon fixation coping mechanism i now am going to project heavily onto LUCIFER HIMSELF.

#aster.txt #exmo moment #religious trauma #ell oh ell #exmo #exmormon #ex mormon #ex cult #apostate #i really like hazbin hotel /helluva boss's worldbuilding though #its like the only media that depicts anything even remotely christian that i can actually handle without it fucking me up #i havent watched good omens yet but im sure that one will make me project all sorts of issues #ive been watching the good place and even that one sets me off sometimes #im too messed up for anything even vaguely remniscent of how i was raised #but anyway yeah hazbin hotel youtube edits made me realize i relate to lucifer himself #and ive been going through faith crisis shit for EVER but even just like a year or two ago if you told me that #id have been so wildly uncomfortable for various reasons #i think thats funny #my religious trauma is so funny sometimes #mmmmmm demons

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sharkneto · 7 months

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Tagged by @hauntingyourself

Rules: list 9 of your favourite characters and let people guess your type (in my case I mean qualifications for being my favorite, I don’t have crushes on them)

I have such a type it's not even funny. Can spot 'em a mile off.

In no particular order except Five is Character Of All Time so he gets to be exactly center.

Hal Yorke (Being Human UK), Matt Murdock (Netflix Marvel), Bruce Wayne (not particularly Battinson but he does have one of the best batsuits, the actual Bruce Wayne that's my favorite is Unpretty's version in her fics), Kaz Brekker (Six of Crows), Five Hargreeves (Umbrella Academy), Locke Lamora (Gentleman Bastards), Eddie Brock/Venom (Marvel, they count as one), Arthur Lester/John Doe (Malevolent, they do too), Arthur Morgan (Red Dead Redemption 2)

All of these guys selected by virtue of The Amount Of Time I Have Spent Thinking About Them. The exception is Locke Lamora, who I only met last week but he vaulted into the group by virtue of being My Exact Type Of Character.

Tagging @assaily, @non-plutonian-druid, @neosatsuma, @candiliam328 and anyone else who may want to play consider yourself tagged

#by the criteria mentioned above honorable mentions to crowley from good omens and lucifer from... lucifer #extended honorable mentions are nightcrawler (x-men) and chekov (star trek. anton yelchin's)#don't mind the no pictures for malevolent duo and locke #i did not want to deal with crediting artists for a throwaway post like this and didn't want to steal anyone's art for same reason #some of these guys have been here for a long time #hal is an old favorite #i feel bad having matt up there without frank but it feels weirder putting frank up there instead of matt and having both is too many #i need to get more women in here this is a bad look on that front #a single woman would be a good place to start #did i spend too much time finding pictures and getting them into a nice little grid? yes. yes i did #thanks for the tag haunting!#ask game #thanks for the tag haunting! was fun to think about and read myself to shit for how transparent i am :)

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silent-idea · 4 days

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I need to follow more blogs, so like/reblog if you post about:

Tv shows:

The X-Files, Ted Lasso, The Simpsons, The Witcher, Grey's Anatomy, Station 19, The Umbrella Academy, Lucifer, Shameless, Chilling Adventures of Sabrina, Wynonna Earp, Schitt's Creek, Orphan Black, The Good Place, Gilmore girls, Doctor Who, Good Omens, Sense8…

Art

Journaling

Movies

Books

... and more (check out my blog to see what else I post about) 😊

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thesherrinfordfacility · 9 months

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Yes, my ask was entirely in good faith and with the aim to get a PSA out to the fandom. I have more I'd like to say but not the time to say it, unfortunately.

I will just quickly state that I used the Lucifer theory as my example solely because it was the most recent and causing the most discourse right now. I have also seen some earnestly and genuinely insisting Neil is lying and intends it to be canon. Those are the people my comment is aimed at, as well as anyone earnestly saying they should send him the "Magic Trick" theory. Or the Raphael theory, which he has already seen and debunked multiple times. Or the "Time Stop" theory, which I believe is why he's been asked twice now about the clock during the Final Fifteen. Once more I will say, as a general PSA to the fandom, do not put any fan theory in Neil's line of sight. Keep it to your own blogs, as you yourself did with your separate posts on the Lucifer theory. Otherwise all you (general) do is ruin the fun for everyone else, in several ways.

hi again anon✨ thank you for the clarification, i appreciate that. my response came across quite pissy (and i won't pretend that i didn't intend some small measure of that, the whole debunk fiasco, whilst funny, has had my hackles raised since last night), but i am sorry you got the brunt of it. understanding tone and intention can be difficult on here✨

you're absolutely right re: the arguing back that neil - the author, screenwriter, and showrunner - is lying is not the way to go about things. look - if by some slim, slim chance he is? cool. if he isn't, as i imagine to be the case? we will get something even better than what we imagined. i genuinely trust that. it's a win-win for us either way you slice it.

re: the other theories; tbh i wouldn't be surprised if neil has at least seen some of them. maybe not these ones, maybe so, but it would stand to reason that he has. but that is his risk to take, and completely his choice. so yes, i completely second you in that regard - the fandom should not take that choice away from him.

ask questions about the show, if you spot errors, etc., yes sure! and if the answer supports your theory, take it back to your blog and discuss it there! but don't send theories, don't send fic, don't send anything that could land him in hot water, directly into his inbox. if he wishes to rb or like anything that contains a theory etc, that's up to him. but don't remove the choice✨

once again anon, sorry for my shitty tone in the last ask, but hope you got where i was coming from in the grand scheme of things. sometimes fandom politics is A Lot.

#good omens #not a shitpost but its good omens babyyyy #ask #i appreciate anon coming back to clarify that was nice of them💕#i felt like i had majorly stepped out of line in my lucifer theory shitposting when i didnt think i had and so the teeth got bared #edit: and actually now that ive cooled off a bit im actually pretty honoured that anon considered this small shot blog #to be the place to get this opinion and sakd PSA out into the fandom (assuming they haven't sent a similar thing to anyone else -#maybe they have?) but yeah im humbled that they felt this was the place to do it so thank you thats quite something✨💕

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val-of-the-north · 2 months

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More observations for the trailer I am going insane!!!

I can't claim the original observation of this candle tree detail is mine, but it's from a Japanese Twitter user, here's a screenshot of the post and a link to it as well [x]

The rest of this observation IS mine though, so let's get to it:

With all the talk of cardinal sin, Messmer having a few parallels to Lucifer as pointed out by some friends of mine [x] I have to wonder if he is the cause of a speculated first burning of the Erdtree.

If this is the first time you have heard about this concept, I'll give a short summary. You know how Leyndell is covered in ash by the time we reach it in-game, and how that goes unexplained? We know for a fact that must be the Erdtree's ashes because after we claim the Rune of Death and the Erdtree burns even more, the capital is entombed in it.

We are also told that the Age of Plenty, an age in which the Erdtree gave physical blessings from its sacred sap, swiftly came to a close and the tree had to be changed to simply an object of faith...

So the theory claims that the reason why the Age of Plenty ended so swiftly was due to the Erdtree being set on fire. In theory spaces, the go-to culprit for this speculated action has often been the Gloam-Eyed Queen, with her connections to fire (Blackflame specifically) and Destined Death, but now there's the possibility that this was all Messmer's doing after all. Promotional material and dialogue seems to really denote his affinity for scorching and setting things ablaze.

This probably also means he is the inventor of that scary flame construct that according to Miyazaki as per this interview [x] was an old war machine, no doubt used during this "unsung battle".

Another important part of Messmer's design is the two snakes, which point us back to the Age of Plenty! Godfrey likely ruled during and directly after that time, and the arenas were likely built because of him. It had to be during Godfrey's rule because by the time Radagon became Elden Lord the practices of the colosseums had died down, as told to us by the Ritual Sword and Shield Talismans:

One of the more interesting aspects of the gladiatorial battles that once took place is the snake symbolism on the gladiators' armor.

So the snake was a symbol of a generic "traitor to the Erdtree", and it predated Rykard's blasphemy by an entire age at least... so what if it wasn't generic at all and it represented Messmer himself? He might have been the perpetrator of a betrayal so foul that Marika removed all traces of his existence from her empire's history, but kept the symbol of the snake as a spiteful reminder of him and all other subsequent traitors. After all, she does seem to have power over which one of her children gets remembered or not, and if not her, then the collective of the Golden Order:

Do note that we don't know when she said this. It could have been while she was still at the height of her rule or right before the Shattering. What we do know for a fact is that the soulless demigods inside the Walking Mausoleums have no known history to speak of, which is quite unlike Godwyn, one of the more accomplished members of the family. So yeah, being forgotten by history might be something the Golden Order does to those they deem unfit, so Messmer could be a likely candidate for such treatment... except instead of doing nothing noteworthy he did TOO much lol.

Now I gotta wonder if Marika hated him more or less than her Omen babies. One could argue that locking them down in a sewer close to where she lives was done more as an obligation than any true resentment. She could have sent them to the Shadow Lands if she really wanted them gone and unaccessible, as that place seems filled with Crucible-related things...

I am not saying she was a good mother to them because she didn't kick them to the Shadow Lands, but perhaps she DID have some small affection for them that she really couldn't follow through with.

Of course, maybe she just couldn't banish them anymore after banishing Messmer for whatever reason (maybe she cut-off a connection to that realm?). However, the most likely possibility is that he WAS known like the many soulless demigods and that Mohg and Morgott predate him. It's just that while those two were born undesirable through no fault of their own and were thus only hidden away, he BECAME undesirable which was worse in Marika's eyes so he gets the extra banishment and the removal of all of his history... there are so many possibilities...

#elden ring #messmer the impaler #shadow of the erdtree #elden ring dlc #hi I am really excited if you couldn't tell #I'll try not to think about it too much for now since otherwise I'm gonna blow up because the info will never be ENOUGH #still I'm gonna speculate if some new cool revelation comes up #val-post

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chronologicalerrors · 8 months

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Crowley, Angels and Free Will: More Good Omens Meta

I’ve been thinking a lot about Crowley in the Land of Uz recently. Particularly this scene:

A: Come on! You're a little bit on our side. C: Not even the littlest. A: Well, you're not on Hell's side. C: I go along with Hell as far as I can. A: So whose side are you on? C: My side.

Until this point, although Crowley has never seemed particularly ideologically aligned with the other demons of Hell, we could assume that Crowley’s fondness for life on Earth was a gradual process. He and Aziraphale have come to appreciate the lifestyle (cars and restaurants and music and wine and houseplants and coffee and various aspects of human invention) and the life they had amongst the people, and each came to vastly prefer it to a life in their respective Head Offices. But here, in Uz, we find out that Crowley realised this a very, very long time ago. He’s already discovered the joys of some human delights, particularly the wine. And just look at how knowing his face is here when Aziraphale first tastes food:

That's the face of someone who's been doing this for a while...

This story takes place in 2500 BC. Crowley’s been on Earth for 1500 years or so, only bumping into Aziraphale very occasionally. It’s not known how long Crowley’s only been going along with Hell, but the suggestion is that he’s always been this way. Playing the part of the demon, all while making his own choices. This incident with Job clearly wasn’t the first time he impeded Hell’s plans. He’s been playing his own game since leaving Eden, probably.

The implication here is that he was never really on board with Hell from the start. He was cast out of Heaven for asking too many questions, but never really took to the idea of ‘the other side’, or sides in general. He’s always been on his own side, coming up with his own ideas. The Metatron, who evidently knew Crowley when he was an angel, says as much in the final episode:

Metatron: Ah, well, always did want to go his own way. Always asking damn fool questions, too.

Ever since he was an angel, Crowley was going his own way. He never particularly bought was Lucifer was selling, he just wanted the freedom to decide things for himself. As Crowley says, he never meant to fall. Heaven just couldn’t accommodate an angel who didn’t follow the rules. Hell isn’t the right place for him either, though - and he knows it. Over the years 'my side' has become 'our side', but he's never really aligned himself with Heaven or Hell:

So what’s going on with Crowley and why has he never fit in with either side? For my money, it’s because Crowley has free will. Something angels and demons aren’t supposed to have. Aziraphale says as much in their discussion in Edinburgh in 1827:

A: Look, I am good. You, I'm afraid, are evil. But people get a choice.

But Crowley isn’t evil, and has seemingly never been that way. He’s been an angel with too many questions, and a demon who wouldn’t kill goats or fire guns. He’s always exercised a right to choose how he behaves, what actions he takes. He tries to stop Aziraphale calling his actions 'nice', but he does indeed often choose to do good, even though he's technically a demon. Crowley does things because that’s what he wants to do.

Aziraphale is developing this way too. Angels aren’t supposed to do what they want – they’re supposed to do what God wants. But with Job, Aziraphale does what he thinks is just, even though it's not what he was supposed to do, for the first time. That’s the poignancy of their final conversation in Uz:

A: But what am I? C: You're just an angel who goes along with Heaven as far as he can.

Crowley was an angel like this once too. Aziraphale hasn’t yet broken away from Heaven, though. He’s not quite ready to go his own way, be on their own side, make his own choices. To choose Crowley. He will choose this eventually, but it’s been a more gradual process for him.

Crowley, though. He’s been like this since he was an angel. Which means – was Crowley created with free will? Was he made this way?

God plays an ineffable game of her own devising, after all...

#crowley #good omens #good omens 2 #good omens spoilers #good omens theories #good omens theory #good omens meta #archangel crowley #sort of archangel crowley - this might explain why he's so different...#good omens feelings #aziraphale #free will #bildad the shuhite #go2

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marie-mcd · 2 months

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There's a specific concept from Good Omens that I really like (amongst many others), that I was chuffed to also find in a Sandman and a Discworld story!

I love that in Good Omens (both book and TV), Heaven and Hell are presented as mostly redundant and ineffectual when it comes to human morality - and that Hell in particular find some of the things humans do to be pretty shocking, and/or instructive.

Opportunities for humour aside, this idea flies in the face of the common belief that the world's worst ills are the result of outside forces influencing people to do evil (ie the devil. Or ... lizard people etc? I digress). And it's unlike other stories out there that are like, "World War II was actually caused by xyz characters!" or similar. Good Omens doesn't rewrite history like that, or let us - humanity - off the hook when it comes to the big stuff, when it could so easily have done so in a universe where Heaven and Hell are literally real.

The story, of course, also credits human cleverness to humans, and celebrates the things we should be proud of, like art, music, delicious food, craftmanship, invention, etc. And it credits humans for having a propensity for compassion and goodness.

"[Crowley] did his best to make their short lives miserable, because that was his job, but nothing he could think up was half as bad as the stuff they thought up themselves. […] And just when you'd think they were more malignant than ever Hell could be, they could occasionally show more grace than Heaven ever dreamed of. Often the same individual was involved."

I love this concept because I see it as an uncoupling of religion and morality. They can both exist together, but the former isn't necessary for the latter. (This isn't the only possible interpretation; the more literal reading might be more about free will, but this is where I extrapolated it to).

From Sandman: Season of Mists Episode 2 (plot context stripped out to avoid spoilers, but skip ahead to black text if you want absolutely nothing spoiled if you want to read it).

Lucifer: "And the mortals! I ask you - why? […] Why do they blame me for all their little failings? They use my name as if I spend my entire day sitting on their shoulders, forcing them to commit acts they would otherwise find repulsive. 'The devil made me do it.' I have never made one of them do anything. Never. They live their own tiny lives. I do not live their lives for them."

And from Eric, a Discworld book (this one's related to Hell learning from humans, more than morality/free will... I won't spoil the funny by elaborating!):

"Earl Beezlemoth rubbed one of his three noses.

'And humans somewhere thought this up all by themselves?' he said. 'We didn't give them any, you know, hints?' […]

The earl stared into infinity. 'I thought we were supposed to be the ghastly ones,' he said, his voice filled with awe."

Another commonality between these two stories that isn't directly shared by Good Omens (yet...? still have another season coming …) but that I like enough to point out, is the idea that Hell is a place where people end up if they believe they deserve to go there. I like this because a lot of people are influenced to feel guilty about "sins" that are innocuous parts of normal human behaviour, so it's pretty brutal to fear going to Hell over them. There's comfort in this idea, to me. (granted, the following Sandman quote states this less explicitly but I take the same meaning from it … but lmk if I've done a reading incomprehension; I also haven't read all the books yet).

From Sandman:

Lucifer: "And then [the mortals] die, and they come here (having transgressed against what they believed to be right), and expect us to fulfill their desire for pain and retribution. I don't make them come here."

From Eric (partial footnote near the beginning):

"Interestingly enough, the gods of the Disc have never bothered much about judging the souls of the dead, and so people only go to hell if that's where they believe, in their deepest heart, that they deserve to go."

Eric also really leans into the idea of Hell being a bureaucratic, corporate, boring nightmare, also familiar to Good Omens fans, and the demons are so over it. The tone (you could probably guess) is very different from Sandman, and it's one of the earlier, less-serious Discworld books; it's a very fun, absurd ride of a read!

There are a few other Discworld books I'll talk about in a future post, that may also be of interest to certain Good Omens fans (I'm gearing these posts toward the fans who came to Good Omens from the TV show and haven't had the pleasure of discovering Neil's and Terry's other work yet); the ones I have in mind examine religious extremism, and the uncoupling of religion and morality too. A couple of them also have queer themes, if that is also your jam! (Less shipping opportunities but I assume some fans, like me, like the rest of the material in GO in addition to the love story).

I'll end this with a quote from a footnote from Eric that has nothing to do with anything in this post, but which took me by surprise and had me laughing days later whenever it came to mind. It's referring to books in a section of the library:

"Just erotic. Nothing kinky. It's the difference between using a feather and using a chicken."

And another bonus one that I found while looking for the first:

"Rincewind had been told that death was just like going into another room. The difference is, when you shout, 'Where's my clean socks?', no one answers."

I hope this made sense and is maybe interesting to someone ... I had fun talking about this at least!

#good omens #good omens meta #good omens 2 #sandman #discworld #neil gaiman #terry pratchett #gnu terry pratchett #crowley #eric #eric faust #rincewind #p

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avelera · 9 months

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Where the heck is Satan in Good Omens S2?

And could we perhaps find evidence of him in the places where the furniture used to be?

For reference:

Hastur & Ligur, 1.1: "All Hail Satan." "All Hail Satan."

Crowley, 1.5: "I never asked to be a demon. I was just minding my own business one day and then… oh, lookie here, it's Lucifer and the guys."

Adam Young 1.6: "You're not my dad and you never were."

Satan, 1.6: "No, no, no!" (He promptly dissolves into black ash and vanishes. Immediately after, Aziraphale and Crowley look at their no-longer-flaming sword and tire iron as if not entirely sure why they're there.)

Crowley, 2.1: "Do you ever think, what's the point? ... Heaven, Hell, Demons, Angels?"

Crowley 2.2 (circa ~2000 BCE): "Satan and his diabolical ministers..."

Gabriel 2.3: "I remember when the morning stars sang together and all the angels of god shouted for joy.” (emphasis mine. Lucifer/Satan was the Morning Star. Why the heck is morning stars plural??)

Edit: Shax 2.6: “I demand that you hand over both Gabriel and Beelzebub as gifts for Satan, our master.” (Could debunk the whole theory, might not only because she seems pretty low-ranked and could be going through the motions even though he's gone, but we'll see. Including to get all the evidence down.)

... And I think there's some other S2 references to higher ups and "Our Lord" by Shax supposedly, but I'm too sleep-deprived to go combing through for them (I'd be much obliged if anyone else could grab any other exact quotes that mention Satan by name or seem to refer to him in Season 2.)

Let's first get the Doylist explanation for why Satan might not be around out of the way: Satan was the Big Bad of Season 1. He's been dispatched. Furthermore, he's played by the most likely very expensive Benedict Cumberbatch, so he's not likely to be back in a hurry if it at all can be avoided, and alluding to him at all might just create confusion with viewers who will then expect to see Satan.

(Below the cut: but what if there's more to it than that?)

But as others may have seen with the, "Metatron is actively editing the Book of Life in S2 and that's why things are weird," meta, there's quite a bit of speculation going around that something fucky is going on in S2.

However, while I agree that some points in S2 are certainly fucky I'm not convinced on all or even most of the supporting evidence. Most of the explanations have a Doylist counterpoint like "It's just bad writing," or "They just wanted to bring back some actors they enjoyed working with," or, "The film crew just made a mistake," or "They just forgot that bit of continuity." After all, half of the original writing duo is tragically no longer with us, so there's going to be some level of story drift regardless.

While in general I find the, "It's not that deep," explanation more plausible in most instances, I'd be a very poor disgruntled English Major indeed if I made sweeping claims that the wallpaper being blue is always a coincidence. It's muddier with TV because there's so many proverbial cooks in the kitchen and plenty of human error to go around, but I'd equally never claim that I think Good Omens S2 wasn't a labor of love by those who worked on it, and certainly there's evidence that care was taken in its production, so everything that's off being a mistake is also not a sweeping generalization I'd want to make either.

Which is my way of saying that I'm not convinced by the Metatron meta but I think some of the ideas there are on to something. I don't think it's plausible that a writer would in S3 reveal that in S2, the heretofore largely off-screen character of the Metatron was actively editing the story as we went with the heretofore only mentioned once, never seen, and immediately denounced as a joke Book of Life. BUT, there is some fucky stuff happening that I won't say was the result of some Genius Mastermind Writer deciding it was a good idea to actively write badly and provide stories with no payoff, but I will consider that some of the apparent continuity errors might not be so accidental as they seem, because this was a labor of love and at least on this count, I don't think that Neil was necessarily that careless. Or at least, I'm more inclined to look for clues in places where I can see logistical choices being made, rather than in more subjective claims like "This bad writing is meant to be Bad Writing and therefore a Clue." Because writing is hard even under the best of circumstances, especially in TV and having lost the aforementioned half of a beloved writing duo.

Moving on! Thing is, if we're to believe that there's some sort of mystery hidden in plain sight that was introduced in Season 2, then it did not pay off yet. This makes me a little suspicious of the overall claims that there was a hidden Season 2 mystery, because a good mystery really should pay off within the text, and expecting the reader to keep their unsatisfied suspicions in their heads for 3-4 years for a later satisfying conclusion is... optimistic at best and downright sloppy at worst.

Unless, the mystery spans the entire show. If the clues we're seeing are meant to pay off in S3, and we assume some level of competence, then more likely these are series spanning mysteries that will be satisfying when one is able to watch all three installments. And that means, if there is a mystery in S2, we should be checking back with Season 1 to look for the roots of it.

Which is what brings me to Satan.

What on Earth happened to Satan?

Is Satan still around?

Now, my theory would be much more satisfying to me, personally, if Satan's name was never spoken in S2 but alas, there is the Book of Job episode and I believe some other mentions by name, mostly by Shax? I'd love some backup on that. But I very deliberately don't count demons just saying things like, "Our lord" or making vague referrals to the powers that be to be references to Satan because if he's vanished, someone could have easily filled the power vacuum or there could be an empty throne room somewhere and everyone is just going through the motions (or he's become the Sandman Lucifer who fucked off to lie on a beach, which would be delightful. Anyway).

When Hastur and Ligure showed up in 1.1 they specifically said, "All Hail Satan," and Crowley was shown to be an outsider that he did not return this familiar call-and-response. Yet no one in Hell in S2 uses the All Hail Satan greeting. The references to Satan are few, even in Hell. There doesn't seem to be a lot of fear of Satan either, but more around other higher-ups like Beelzebub, Duke of Hell, who appears to be the highest ranking person we see in Hell?

And also interestingly, Crowley and Beelzebub are both lamenting how pointless all of this seems. Kind of interesting for two individuals who still despise Heaven too and, presumably, took Satan's side once long ago when they all Fell. The political fire has definitely gone out of them, which can be plausibly attributed to the Apocalypse failing and/or the two of them falling in love with their Angelic counterparts, but it's also just kind of weird that suddenly they both really don't see the point in any of these conflicts that once defined their existence.

Perhaps, and this is where I go out on a limb or ten, because Satan isn't around anymore?

Is there no longer a hand at the wheel in Hell, reminding everyone of their loathing of Heaven?

Is there no longer someone actively above Beelzebub, telling them what to do, such that they have the freedom to sneak away and pursue a romance with an archangel and not have their boss show up to stop them the way Gabriel's did?

Did Adam, when he made Satan not his father but more importantly that Satan never was his father, undo more than we realize?

Because that's the kind of Gaiman mystery that I can wholly believe is lurking in plain sight, because Satan was a big deal in S1, he was the Big Bad! It's in the text! The damned book series is built on the idea of a satirical Antichrist take on The Omen. All Hail Satan is one of the first spoken lines of dialogue in the book. Satan is kind of central to any story that's going to revolve around a battle between Heaven and Hell!

And yet... he's barely mentioned this season. And demons suddenly don't remember what they're fighting for. How odd.

Maggie and Nina's actresses also played nuns of the Satanic Chattering Order of St. Beryl. If there was no Antichrist, isn't it possible that neither of those women would have become Satanic nuns and might, instead, own a coffee shop and a record store somewhere?

If there was no Antichrist, isn't it possible that through some convoluted series of events, Madame Tracy, a witch, fell afoul of a demon or managed to become one herself?

Isn't it possible that once you open the door to the ripple effects of a Satan who either never existed (though the Fall still happened) or who only existed up until at least Job, but who was never Adam's father, that some other fucky things could happen too, like Aziraphale suddenly not being fond of alcohol? This continuity detail is much more of a stretch but it is such a plot point in the book that Aziraphale loves to drink and S1 that I do find that particular continuity break particularly vexing and it's one I side-eye the most in terms of "not sure if sloppiness or a Clue".

Anyway, point is:

Satan is curiously absent this season and technically, he was unmade or at least unmade as Adam's father last season. If something is fucking with the timeline, I think that on-screen, very visible event deserves some scrutiny over and beyond vaguely alluded to, off-screen fuckery by the Metatron with no in-text confirmation at all.

There's a lot of weird and bad writing in S2, sure, but some of the continuity breaks do, admittedly, feel too big to be simple oversights and I don't think it's entirely conspiratorial to think something more might be going on and if such a mystery is going to span multiple seasons, we should look back to S1 for the seeds.

It is possible that the unmaking of Satan has had ripple effects that explain some of these continuity changes and some of the cheeky casting of S1 actors in new roles as perhaps not entirely without in-story justification.

So in my mind, the question I have no answer to, but that might deserve some scrutiny going into Season 3 is:

How much did Satan never being Adam's father alter the timeline?

Edit: And here's one last spooky quote to consider: “I remember when the morning stars sang together and all the angels of god shouted for joy." - Gabriel's weird prophecy / quoting of God

Why single out the reference to morning stars plural? Lucifer is very famously the Morning Star, you can't accidentally allude to morning stars in this context without referring to him, you just can't. So what the fuck is going on with this Biblically sourced quote that sort of alludes to Satan, but not by name, and makes the reference to the Morning Star plural?? And even though it is the original text, apparently, it's still a choice by the writers to really highlight the line about morning stars and give that line to Gabriel to say in the present too. Something is sus.

#good omens #good omens spoilers #good omens meta #spoilers #IMO THIS is a hidden in plain sight mystery #because Satan is a MAJOR figure in the world of this story and he's just suddenly GONE #there's TOTALLY reasonable Doylist explanations #but at least if we're looking for where the furniture used to be then Where the Heck is Satan is a reasonable question

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neil-gaiman · 2 years

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Good morning Mr. Gaiman! I was wondering this morning about how the presence of a fandom affects (or doesn’t affect) the business decisions that are made in the media and publishing world. I’d be so interested to hear your thoughts on it as someone who has a foot so strongly planted in both worlds—I at least can’t think of very many other creators who work on IPs as big as you do who are as engaged with and aware of the surrounding fandom culture as you are.

In your experience, are the studios and executive Powers That Be generally aware of the fandom cultures that surround their media properties? And is it considered a good thing, or more of a liability to an IP’s potential commercial success? When a show like Good Omens, or Our Flag Means Death, or Lucifer comes up for another season, are the studio execs aware or thinking about the active fandoms when they decide what gets greenlit? I would imagine that the scads of fan content and online chatter those fandoms have generated would be a good indicator for the success of those shows, but only if the decision makers knew about it and thought of it as a good thing, which of course not all creators do. You’ve shared with us a few very good reasons why some creative distance with fandom is strictly necessary at times. Is an active fandom something that a creator like you would consider part of the pitch when you’re trying to get more content greenlit? Or do the studios not get it or not care?

I think the truth is that for Networks the numbers of people in a fandom are so small, proportionally, to the numbers of viewers, that the fandom doesn't really even show up on anyone's radar. It was very important to me that the Good Omens fandom was treated well when we launched Season 1, but I doubt that Amazon or the BBC will be thinking much about the fandom when they plan the roll out for Season 2, as they already have an existing worldwide audience now in the hundreds of millions, and they will be aiming their promotion at those people and the people who have yet to try it, and not the fans. I'll remind them that Good Omens fandom exists as we get closer, and there are fans out there now in the promotional world (like whoever runs Prime Video's Twitter feed) but pretty much everything will be aimed at the viewers rather than the fans.

Studios and networks like knowing that there's an existing fandom, it reassures them, but it's never big enough to make a difference beyond the possibility of helping get something greenlit in the first place -- and that's not fandom, that's potential audience. The existence or non-existence of a Sandman fandom didn't help sell Netflix on greenlighting Sandman; the fact we've sold over a hundred million Sandman comics and graphic novels around the world definitely did.

As a writer, I realized in early 1989 that I had two choices: I could do things I knew would make fandom (back then, the early early Sandman fandom) happy, and risk making myself bored and dissatisfied, or make myself as the writer/creator happy and hope that enough of the fandom would come on the journey with me. I chose the latter route and it worked, and so it's the route I've always chosen since then.

#Fandom #good omens #Sandman

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rius-cave · 10 days

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About the meeting over time, isn't there a story in the Bible where Jesus gets tempted by the devil and they like. Travel together? I'm a little fuzzy on details because uuuuh I'm not religious and haven't been raised so, but it would be really funny for Adam to show up during that and just. Bicker over the fact that "You haven't changed, haven't you, Luce? You can't help but want to ruin everything He has created, can't you?" And just yelling at each other because Adam is still not over it, and Lucifer doesn't necessarily believe that giving humans the knowledge to understand their free will was a bad idea.

And Jesus is in the background, picking flowers and singing with birds. Dude is vibing while the two entities are having a dick measuring contest.

I can't think of any other times? Maybe when Metal started surfacing as a music movement.

I can definitely see this Lucifer having the same attitude towards humanity as the Neil Gaiman's Netflix series Lucifer. Not really hating humans but maybe a little bit. Annoyed by the fact they blame him for their shitty choices. He's as hands on as God is when it comes to tempting humans himself, and the fact they blame all the shit THEY caused on him makes him boil. They can ruin their own life pretty well without his help.

So I can't think of MANY reasons why Lucifer would visit Earth. Less for evil, more for leisure maybe? Like with Music?

Went to a circus once and he hasn't been the same since.

-🐇

They don't travel together, Jesus is doing his own thing and after 40 days of not eating, the devil tries to tempt him, but he's shut down fairly quickly.

Just like in Good Omens, he also bickers with God about Job, and there's a few other instances here and there where he's seen having power and influence over Earth, maybe not by straight up TALKING like in the temptation story, but he's name dropped here and there. One would need to decide whether that's Satan or Lucifer in Hazbin's case though.

With Neil Gaiman's Lucifer, I'm guessing you mean Crowley...? GO doesn't have a Lucifer really AS FAR AS I KNOW. Crowley actually takes the place of The Devil for a lot of the biblical instances in which he appears, so I guess that still works!

But omg the idea of Lucifer changing his whole aesthetic when circus were invented..... that's really funny. Hmm, or did Lucifer actually plant the idea in a human's head and THAT is how circus came to Earth...? So many possibilities lmao

#hazbin hotel #lucifer #ask

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theravenmuse · 9 months

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Theorizing time! Crowley was Lucifer!

I’m going to preface this by saying I’m 50/50 on this theory, but it’s fun so we’re gonna talk about it.

Now Lucifer and Satan are not necessarily the same person in the Bible. We also know for a fact that Satan and Lucifer aren’t the same entity in Good Omens. (Neil has said this but I’m too lazy to track down the ask.) BUT in Paradise Lost, which I see as a big influence on Good Omens, Satan is the fallen angel Lucifer. Now Crowley is not Satan. We know this for certain as we get interactions between them via the Bentley in S1E1 and at the airbase in S1E6. But in this theory, the lines have been muddled and Crowely is the fallen Lucifer while Satan is someone else. No idea who. That’s not important.

Evidence Part 1: Biblical stories attributed to Lucifer/Satan that Crowley is now known to be responsible for.

Now all of these are technically attributed to Satan, not to Lucifer. See opening note about muddled lines.

The original sin

Job’s trials

The temptation of Christ

Evidence Part 2: Crowley’s former status in Heaven

Crowley can access a file that is only available to “Throne, Dominion, or above.” Now, the angelic hierarchy in GO is twisted up so much I hardly know what to make of that, but it definitely means high up.

Then, shortly after this revelation, we get the Metatron saying this: “For one prince of Heaven to be cast out into the outer darkness makes a good story. For it to happen twice, makes it look like there is an institutional problem.”

Are the two connected? Not necessarily, but the proximity of them indicates to me that they might be.

Evidence Part 3: Crowley’s power

When Shax mentions (in episode 2) the accidentally super powerful miracle that Crowley and Aziraphale co-created, she calls it one that “only the mightiest of Archangel’s could have performed.” Crowley responds to her query with, “how do you know I didn’t do it?” Now, is he talking out of his ass? Who knows. He does tend to do that a lot.

What we do know is that Crowley can stop time and create pocket dimensions. Something we don’t know of anyone else being capable of. He does this most notably by creating a pocket dimension in the climax of S1 to give him and Aziraphale time to talk to Adam, but he also freezes the executioner in 1793 and Mr. Dalrymple in 1827. The latter is especially notable because Aziraphale requests that he do it instead of simply doing it himself. Now this could just be Aziraphale goading Crowley into doing things for him again, but I’m inclined to believe this is something Crowley can do that Aziraphale can’t. Aziraphale is pretty high up by angel standards.

And then obviously there’s the star making in the opening of season 2. Or, more accurately, the star factory making, which is even better in my opinion.

Evidence Part 4: “Let there be light”

Ah, that gorgeous opening scene where Crolwey creates M16, the Eagle Nebula, which contains the gorgeous Pillars of Creation. He uses that classic line, “let there be light,” to set it all off. Lucifer is known as “the light bringer.”

Then we get a call back to that opening scene in episode 5 with Gabriel and the lamp. Being mentioned a second time means to me that there’s something intentional there.

Evidence Part 5: Gabriel’s triggered memory may be a bit more specific than Crowley would like to admit.

“I remember when the morning stars sang together, and all the angels of God shouted for joy.”

Lucifer is also known as “the morning star”

Crowley deflects and says it’s what God told Job. He’s absolutely right, but I don’t think Gabriel picking it out was random. I think it’s because he’s looking right at the morning star (or perhaps one of several, since God says morning stars, plural?)

Now this is probably the weakest bit of evidence out of the bunch, BUT, it’s what tipped me off to this theory in the first place.

Now the cons.

The most obvious is that Satan is typically fallen Lucifer and Crowley is most certainly not Satan.

Crowley also mentions Lucifer by name once in season 1, in the drunk scene after the bookshop fire. Granted, he’s starting on his third bottle of Talisker, so that may be enough for him to start talking in the third person, but it’s still odd.

Like I said, I’m not sold on this theory, but we’ve got at least three years of clowning to do so why not have fun with it?

#good omens #good omens season 2 #good omens theories #crowley #crowley was lucifer #the raven's musings

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the-meta-tron · 8 months

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Good Omens Theory: Matchbox Foreshadowing

Did anyone wonder why there was so much emphasis on this matchbox?

We know that it was later connected to Gabriel's disappearance since it's from The Resurrectionist in Edinburgh, and it's where he stored his fly from Beelzebub. The Resurrectionist, of course, was a double entendre to the body snatchers that were an essential part of Victorian medical research as well as Jesus himself. Knowing at the end of the season that Heaven is planning the Second Coming, all the references to the Resurrectionist seemed like some pretty basic foreshadowing. But I think it goes deeper than that.

THE QUOTE

Why is there a quote from the Book of Job on a matchbox from a place named after Jesus? Surely, there would have been other scripture that was more relevant to JC. No, instead we get this from the book of Job.

Job 41:19 Out of his mouth go burning lamps, and sparks of fire leap out

Upon the first watch, the first thing that immediately sprung to mind when that quote floated on screen was the last time fiery sparks leaped out of someone's mouth in Heaven. Who did that again?

Oh yeah!

Crowley, wearing Aziraphale's face.

I've always wondered exactly what the relevance of this particular quote from the Book of Job meant. After all, references to The Book Of Job were everywhere in season 2. There are some excellent metas out there as to why Job is so important to season 2, but I want to actually analyze what the scripture that's been referenced is describing.

The whole point of the Book of Job is most of it is about God's conversation with Job. Chapter 41 is titled: The Lord's Power Shown in the Leviathan. And I really don't think that is a coincidence.

The Leviathan, as described in Chapter 41 of the Book of Job... is a giant snake that breathes fire. Literally.

Basically, God is talking to Job about all of their creations, and they bring up The Leviathan as one of the most fearsome things they ever created. It's basically God saying to Job: look at my big scary sea snake that breathes fire. Do you think you can fight this big scary sea snake that breathes fire? You can't. He's so powerful. No weapons can harm him. He's stronger than anything. Everyone's terrified of him. But he's not more powerful than ME because I'm God.

So where else does the Leviathan appear in theology?

In the Book of Enoch, The Leviathan is a female giant chaos serpent that lives deep in the ocean, while her mate, Behemoth, is a male giant chaos beast (based off of a hippopotamus or water-ox) who lives in the mythical desert of Duidain, East of Eden.

In the Book of Revelations, The Leviathan is associated with The Devil (a lot of things get associated with the Devil in Christianity. Read my Crowley isn't Lucifer, But... theory for more context). It is also strongly associated with being The Serpent of Eden ("this is the dragon that was cast out of Paradise, that beguiled Eve and is permitted in this world to make sport of us" - Jerome of Stridon), aka our good friend Crowley. In the prophecy of Revelations, the Leviathan, also known as The Seven-Headed Dragon, is kind of important in the final battle between Heaven and Hell.

So, I think Crowley is The Leviathan, and he's going to have a much more important role in the Second Coming than he thinks he does.

The Resurrectionist(s).

I think Season 3 is going to be a biblical zombie apocalypse.

Let me explain.

In the Episode 2 Minisode, we see Aziraphale find out that God is going to let Satan destroy everything Job owns, including his children. Aziraphale thinks killing children is wrong, so he tries to stop Crowley from killing Job's children, only to find out, surprise! Crowley never planned to kill the children and was always scheming behind Hell's back to find a way to protect them. Aziraphle helps Crowley by working together to trick Heaven into thinking Job's old children are dead and they have new ones now, saving the children's lives.

In the Episode 3 Minisode, we see Aziraphale and Crowley get involved with a body snatcher named Elpseth. Aziraphale thinks digging up corpses for money is wrong, so he stops Elpseth from selling the body to a resurrectionist, only to find out, surprise! The medical community actually really needs these human corpses to study anatomy and potentially reduce human suffering. He tries to help Elpseth dig up another body, but Wee Morag gets shot and killed, and Crowley stops Elpseth from killing herself with Laudanum by drinking it instead and makes her agree to live a better life.

In the Episode 4 Minisode, we see Aziraphale and Crowley flirt do a little magic show together so Aziraphale can repay Crowley for saving his books by doing a West End show to cover Crowley's alcohol smuggling debts. Meanwhile, there are literal zombie nazis who have been hired by hell to try to find evidence that the two of them are working together. Aziraphale and Crowley trust each other when their miracles aren't working, and they pull off the magic trick. Backstage, when Furfur rubs the proof in their faces, Aziraphale tricks him by doing sleight-of-hand so Furfur returns to hell without proof.

In the minisodes, we see several consistent themes popping up. We see Aziraphale struggling with morality. We see Aziraphale and Crowley working together to help humanity or each other. We see them saving human lives at great personal risk. We see deception and sleight-of-hand against Heaven, Hell, and Humanity. Lastly and most importantly, we see a lot of death and resurrection. We see the not-death and not-resurrection of Job's children, the deaths of resurrectionists of Victorian Scotland, and the literal death and resurrection of the Nazi Zombies.

Outside of the minisodes, we see Crowley and Aziraphale's combined miracle be worth 25 Lazarii, aka bringing 25 people back from the dead. We see Gabriel, in his purple-eyed prophetic trance, warn of a great storm that will raise the dead. And we see Crowley bring a man who was ripped apart by demons back to life(?).

Not to mention we know Jesus, The Resurrectionist, is going to be around for season 3. And the Second Coming, aka Judgement Day, is going to happen. And the Last Judgement in Abrahamic Theology is the Day of Resurrection; it is "The Resurrection of the Dead, both Just and Unjust" (Acts 24:25); it is Life to the Dead so they may live eternally in the Kingdom to Come. (That's why, in Abrahamic Theology, the Book of Life is so important. You can see my Book of Lies theory for more on that).

The dead are going to rise. It is established that it's possible for the dead to become zombies with the nazi zombie episode. Why devote an entire minisode to the concept of zombies if it isn't important? It's foreshadowed time and time again throughout season 2.

I also anticipate that we're going to see the other themes that were present in the minisodes. I don't think anyone will be surprised if next season Aziraphael will struggle with morality. Aziraphale and Crowley are going to have to learn to communicate properly so they can work together and trust each other again (being able to do miracles of immense power together is a huge Chekov's Gun). We're going to see them do some kind of deception again to trick Heaven and Hell into thinking they're getting their way with the apocalypse when they actually aren't.

In Summary

So, in conclusion, based on that little matchbox and the wider plot of Season 2, we're going to see Crowley be the giant fire-breathing chaos serpent, aka Leviathan (literally or metaphorically), with some kind of essential role at the end of the world. And I think we're going to see a zombie apocalypse or mass resurrection of some sort. I also think we're going to see Aziraphale and Crowley have to learn to trust each other again so they can do A Big Miracle and also trick Heaven and Hell with some really clever deception.

#good omens #good omens theory #good omens meta #crowley #aziraphale #ineffable husbands #good omens spoilers #gos2 spoilers #good omens season 2 #good omens season 1 #the job episode #the grave episode #the nazi zombie episode #good omens season 3 predictions #book of life

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eirianerisdar · 2 months

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hi! i'm really loving icarus, you're a wonderful writer! but i just had a quick question. i love the flock graphics, and they're super helpful! would it be possible for you to maybe list the species of birds for the main 'characters' of the story as well? you don't have to post example photos or anything crazy, but i think just a list like that would be helpful too. sometimes i forget who has what kind of wings, and i think having a list so i can google image the bird would be great.

if that's not something you want to do or don't have time to do or something, no worries!! i really appreciate you taking the time to write icarus in the first place <3

Oof I might as well do a general guide! I never thought a maxiel wingfic would spawn so many specific wing allocations but here's the general list:

Paddock wings in Icarus:

Current grid:

Daniel Ricciardo - Scarlet Macaw (colourful, nimble flyers)

Max Verstappen - Peregrine Falcon (raw speed, inherited from his mother)

Sergio Perez -Crested Caracara (a type of mexican bird of prey)

Lewis Hamilton - Greater Bird of Paradise (beautiful wing plumes, lovely singer)

George Russell - Blue swallow (beautiful metallic-blue feathers, scream like madmen when they fly)

Carlos Sainz - Spanish Imperial Eagle (white epaulets, very regal)

Charles Leclerc - White Dove (need I say more? Perfect white wings, exploited because they're pretty but so intelligent in pathfinding)

Lando Norris - Lucifer Hummingbird (Small, colourful, likes to hover in place)

Oscar Piastri - Little Lorikeet (One of the smaller types of Australian parrot. Very cute)

Yuki Tsunoda - Japanese Long-tailed tit (Photos should be self explanatory. They fly like ballistic missiles)

Alexander Albon - Crested Fireback (National bird of Thailand. Beautiful dark blue and fiery plumage)

Logan - Blue Jay (Commonly found in Florida. Blue, like Logan's current posting, and his eyes)

Pierre Gasly - Osprey (A bird of prey often found near coasts along the European shoreline, and Pierre is from Normandy)

Esteban Ocon - Black Stork (Tall, gangly, also migrates through France)

Fernando Alonso - Kestrel (a type of small bird of prey, hunts by biding their time and waiting then divebombing)

Lance Stroll - Snowy Owl (Lance is cuddly ok and I didn't want to make him a Canadian goose because that's his dad)

Valtteri Bottas - Bullfinch (Look it up. The picture is self-explanatory. The manliest of men)

Zhou Guanyu - Chinese Red-Crowned Crane (A crowned crane for the champion of the universe, as translates his name)

Kevin Magnussen - Raven (Viking. quoth the raven.)

Nico Hulkenberg - Crow (he keeps coming back. As wily as many of their bird counterparts but has a bad rep for being a bad omen)

Retired drivers or drivers not currently on the grid:

Sebastian Vettel - Swiftlet (Extremely good fliers, reaching up to 160km/h and pulls insane G-forces)

Mick Schumacher - European robin (Very cute. Universally liked. Same wings as his father)

Nico Rosberg - Eurasian Sparrowhawk (a bird of prey that hunts by ambushing before a high-speed, agile chase)

Jenson Button - Northern Harrier (hunts in a high-speed flight close to the ground, exceptionally good listeners)

Mark Webber - Cassowary (look up a photo. Just look at it.)

Kimi Raikkonen - Giant Albatross (King of gives no shits, flies very long distances without a care)

David Coulthard - Bush-Stone Curlew (White trousers!)

Romain Grosjean - Red-tailed Hawk (I chose the bird of prey that could best mesh with the phoenix metaphor)

Antonio Giovannazi - White-spotted Starling (Very pretty plumage)

Daniil Kyvat - Great Bustard (I honestly don't remember why. Distributes in Russia)

Nyck De Vries - Common European Sparrow (Small. Commonly found. Unfortunately often hunted)

Nikita Mazepin - Flamingo (Need I say more)

Sir Jackie Stewart - (Clipped) Merlin Wings (Extremely fast Scottish bird of prey. In-fic, Jackie was one of the generation of drivers that clipped their wings, permanently robbing them of flight)

Team Principals and people in the paddock:

Toto Wolff - Black Swan (self-explanatory)

Christian Horner - Golden Eagle (A bit pompous. Matches his hair)

James Vowles - Magpie (Utterly clever, not from any particular prestige)

Fred Vasseur - Partridge (Affable. Cuddly.)

Guenther Steiner - Shoebill (self-explanatory, look up a photo)

Cyril Abiteboul - Eagle Owl (something about his face is very Eagle Owl)

Micheal Italiano - Kookaburra (laughs when they shouldn't)

Zak Brown - Chicken (self-explanatory. Literally and metaphorically)

Andreas (mclaren) - Common Quail (short lifespan)

Mattia Binotto - Pigeon (wants to be as pretty and loved as Charles. Is a public nuisance instead)

Otmar sznafnauer - Peacock (Struts around, can't really fly)

Resident Bastard:

Jos Verstappen - Cuckoo (Cuckoos are brood parasites, and lay their eggs in nests of birds of other species'. The cuckoo parent therefore does nothing while other birds raise their young)

#I've probably missed a couple minor characters so if anyone has any questions feel free to drop a reply and I'll answer #f1 #f1 wingfic #f1 wing au #icarus #my post #writing #fanfic

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endlessthedestiny · 9 months

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okay I read the good omens screen play / shitscript and....... it was something. here are a good idea of what happens there, for those who dosent want to read it

if you don't know what the shitscript is, it's basically a script for a scrapped good omens movie written only by Neil in 1992. it's very different from (I think) any other media/adaptation we had of good omens. apparently neil HAD to make Crowley evil, but I don't know much about it...

tw: abusive crowley

so:

Crowley owns a night club. (yes, Lucifer style)

Aziraphale works as a museum curator.

Also, Crowley cheats in every chess game and wins, making that Aziraphale never won (rather cruel if you ask me) and he hates earth. like really despises.

the plot starts with Satan (here he is more like his sandman/Lucifer2000 counterpart to be honest, even being called Lucifer MORNINGSTAR at some point) gives Crowley the antichrist (Adam).

Crowley is supposed to take care and raise Adam, but when he came back to the club, he put Adam in Madame Tracy's bag to talk to his employee.

Madame Tracy takes Adam home unknowingly. (yes, she will be the one raising him)

Crowley has a fucking panic attack seeing that he lost Adam (also he's fucking pathetic. why didn't he just chase the taxi. stupid).

He drinks alot to calm himself, and then Aziraphale comes into his club and asks what's wrong

Crowley explains (more like spilled) to him what's happening, and Aziraphale decides to help him find Adam. With the condition of being able to make Adam good.

Also theres Anathema. As a child she feels (?) that the antichrist was born.

11 long years of azira and crowley looking for Adam in every city offscreen later............

Anathema goes to tadville (the place where madame Tracy and Adam live) looking for something. she is convinced there is something weird happening.

Madame Tracy's the only one who accepts to rent her a room.

In this version, Madame Tracy's is the "crazy old lady who was hot when she was younger but now she's oooolddddd and craaazy" which is problematic (at my vision)

Adam basically takes care of everything around the house, the bills, breakfast.

Adam resembles more Warlock than Adam from the show... He sometimes is unnecessarily rude towards others, but I think that makes sense with the fact that he had to be so responsible all the time.

He dislikes Anathema at first. But they grow to be friends over time.

theeeen.... Satan calls Crowley again and they talk about the antichrist.

Crowley says that Adam is evil just like him and beautiful blablabla, and then Satan takes a look (using DemonicPowers™) at Adam's face and is very pleased.

Then Crowley comes back at his club and has another panic attack.

Aziraphale visits him again, and again asks what's wrong.

Crowley explains that he met with Satan again, and sarcastically says that he told the truth.

Aziraphale takes his sarcasm seriously and (I think) he was happy that Crowley at least was honest.

Crowley then simply says (and I quote directly) "you are so.... stupid.... you don't deserve to live. I didn't tell him anything. If I had, do you think I'd be here right now?" which is just... damn

azira gets sad and then Crowley basically says that he knows what Adam looks like and azira suggest that they should go to one more town. just one more.

Crowley gets ughhhh fine and they go to Tadville.

Then we get a scene of Adam taking Anathema to his hidden place and showing her his miniature replica of tadville. he says some creepy things about how that in mini tadville everyone does what he says, it's all his.

In the next day, Crowley and Aziraphale go to Tadville. they start looking for a room, but some lady heard Crowley calling Aziraphale "angel" and goes homophobic mode.

Everyone doesn't want to rent a room to them, except Madame Tracy.

Then Adam arrives with the groceries and Crowley immediately recognizes him. Him and Azira take a stroll on the beach, and Crowley says that he's very grateful for Aziraphale.

Aziraphale says he isn't going back to London and Crowley simply says "well, we found him, i don't need you anymore" and Azira reminds him of their agreement of making Adam good.

They invite Adam to go with them for a day in London, and Madame Tracy authorizes much to Adam's content.

They go to London, and in the museum, Azira shows Adam the beauty of humanity and all.

When Adam goes to the car, Crowley tells him that humanity is being above everyone, not caring for anyone (basically, that evil talk etc)

When they get back, Anathema discovers through looking into a crystal ball and seeing Adam's face that he is the antichrist.

Then, Adam goes to talk with her.

Anathema tries to stab him, but she psychologically can't. And she tells him he's the one who is going to end the world.

Adam gets scared for his life and runs away to his hidden place.

Satan transformed his place into a magical scenario full of games and fun and talks with him.

He basically convinces him to enter his side and Adam (who is very fragile because anathema just tried to kill him) agrees.

Basically, the town turns into a huge theater with everyone acting like puppets.

Satan thanks Crowley for raising Adam, and grant his wish of letting him go to Alpha centuri.

As Crowley is waiting for the next comet, Aziraphale goes to him and tries to convince him to help humanity and heaven.

Crowley basically says "hell nah im not helping you"

Aziraphale says "but we are friends."

And Crowley simply replies "Were." :)

Theeen, Aziraphale challenges him to one more checkers game.

They play, and Aziraphale finally wins. But only after cheating.

They find Anathema and she gives them the knife.

Aziraphale enters in full angel form (white clothing and all) and goes to talk with Adam.

Aziraphale basically does "reflect about it" talk to Adam, and Adam seems to not care.

Crowley then goes to Satan and says "I'm not going anymore" and Satan turns him into a snake.

Aziraphale interrupts and points the knife at him. Satan simply desintegrates the knife and hurts aziraphale.

Adam after seeing Madame Tracy's puppet form and reflecting about what Aziraphale said he decides to take a step back and fix things.

He goes to Satan, heals Aziraphale and transforms Crowley back and basically says "I'm not going." and turns everything back to normal

Satan is like ??? and Crowley simply says "wait you didn't rebel to your father too?"

Satan laughs and disappears.

everything ends well

theeee end :3

well, it's not the worst thing in existence but certainly not the best.

good omens but the aziracrow is the most toxic yaoi ever.

#good omens #shitscript #go screenplay #also PLEASE don't ask for a link‚ i don't want the fbi in my house #this is for educational purposes only ok

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wrengrif · 3 months

Text

It is time for my favorite game...

Good Omens, What If.

Now yesterday, I read an amazing post by @ishomieokay, who postulated a very convincing theory that Aziraphale was going to end up being the Big Bad, because Supreme Archangel power was going to corrupt him.

Naturally this made me sad -- until I really started to think about it.

What If - Aziraphale did become power-mad?

What if he did become 'You Bullied Me And Now I'm Your Boss, Bitch' Supreme Archangel. Like it would be so FUCKING BAMF. Utterly horrifying, but utterly BAMF. He walks through the elevator, one of the archangels says something snide (my money is on Sandalphon, asshole), and Aziraphale just Supreme Archangel kicks him through the Heavenly Moon Door and makes him Fall. And while the other archangels are standing there, gaping, he straightens his collar and says, "I think you'll all find I have very little use for abusive language. Do keep that in mind. Where is my office?"

After that it's like as it's Lucifer 2 - The Principality Strikes Back. Aziraphale censuring angels left and right. Uriel doesn't get kicked - Uriel gets beaten for what they said about Crowley and then thrown out for a million mile dive. He makes Michael re-do the entire Second Coming. He's punching and kicking a hole in the archangel system that should be filled by someone who is willing to pull on the brakes. But no one does! Everyone is Too Fucking Scared.

The Metatron realizes that he hasn't trapped Aziraphale up there with them, they are all trapped here by A z i r a p h a l e. Aziraphale who is going to burn everything down because none of it is worthy (Aziraphale isn't worthy) of God's Love and they are just going to tear Heaven and Hell down to the nubs in the floor, and maybe Earth too because you know what, none of it is worthy of God (Crowley). Finally, Saraquel has had enough. She slaps the Down Button to Earth. Rolls herself into whatever dive bar that Crowley is in, and tells him point blank that if he doesn't help stop Aziraphale, it's going to be worse than Armageddon. Everything is going to be destroyed down to atoms, even wine.

Crowley gets to do two things that he's probably always wanted to do. One, he gets to be James Bond. Breaking into the Heaven (the Bond villain lair), knocking out some angel guards, maybe even punching Metatron in the face for getting them all into this situation in the first place. Second, he gets to kick open the doors to the Supreme Archangel's office, stare Aziraphale down from where he's seated behind his invisible glass desk (I imagine him petting a white duck. Why? I don't know.), looking forbidding and dressed in a silver white that matches his hair and his beard. Stereo-typical God, y'know.

And they stare at each other, for a long moment, glowering with all the hurt, and pain, and still - still - love that they have both known for six thousand years. Finally, Aziraphale speaks, his purple eyes flickering, "So what exactly are you supposed to be?" Crowley smiles That Sharp Smile, that one that Aziraphale adores. The one he actually fears. Crowley reaches behind his coat, and says, "Me? Crowley. Anthony J. Crowley. And I'm now the world's greatest magician, because I'm about to make you disappear." Aziraphale tenses in his throne, filled with that same sense of dread and can it be, hope? that Crowley is here to end him. Crowley doesn't look away as he growls, "Hocus Pocus, Supreme Arsehole." He pulls in front of him .... a bird cage. With a nightingale in it. Who immediately begins to sing. Crowley takes off his glasses, looks Aziraphale dead in the eye, and speaks in a rough voice. "I forgive you."

And just like that ... the Supreme Archangel crumbles down into dust, leaving behind a weeping Aziraphale.

End scene.

... I'd probably add some explosions in there. Just for fun. Oooooh and when Crowley is kicking ass through Heaven the song that plays is 'Don't Stop Me Now'.

#aziraphale #crowley #good omens #bamf aziraphale #crowley anthony j crowley #weaponized nightingales

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