My sibling: *showing me their drawings*

Me: Their shirt looks like Adrien's.

Sib: Uh..

Me: From Miraculous.

Sib: Okay, I was gonna ask like. Agress?

Me, laughing: Agress?

Sib: Adress?

Me: Gettin farther away

Gabriel: "Nathalie gave me a get better soon card."

Adrien: "Aw, that's sweet father!"

Gabriel: "I'm not sick. She just think I could do better... as a person."

MLBS5 SPOILERS!

Adrien and Kagami having the most badass lovers out of the fandom. The two of them are disney princess confirmed.

A Jekyll&Hyde type akuma whose power is to bring out a hidden or repressed part of your personality (but like, making two of you instead of switching in one body), and when Chat gets hit suddenly there’s both “normal” Chat (I’ll get to that in a sec) and Cat Walker/Patte de Velours at the same time.

(Cue Ladybug freaking out upon learning they’re the same person)

“Normal” Chat looks the same, but is just a bit more intense (since this is Adrien’s way of “letting loose” to not be how he is as a civilian, he’s not too different, but because of the split he does lose some usual traits). I.e. *heavily* flirting with LB, going at it with the puns, more agressive and impulsive with the akuma, doesnt like following orders (especially with the remaining feelings of anger towards the partnership being put further into question as LB prefers CW), heart on his sleeve

Cat Walker is also not super different to the episode he was in, but is also more intense thanks to the akuma: all business- no nonsense, doesn’t laugh at jokes (even in a “I’ll laugh if you want” way, like in Kuroneko), cordial to LB, follows LB’s orders to a T (to the point of not making his own decisions in battle), calm and collected (almost emotionless, even with that plastered smile)

CN starts to hate CW as the fight goes on, because LB seems to prefer him (and she’s understandably getting annoyed with CN’s impulsivity). CN gets territorial, saying that he’s LB’s partner. CW: “then why did she replace you with me?” (Man, look at all the self hatred in Adrien’s psyche!)

So CN runs off and leaves them alone to fight the akuma. This ticks LB off even more, but she has an akuma to deal with- and she has CW- so she lets him go.

As the fight goes on, some of the same issues from Kuroneko occur, so she also gets frustrated with CW too.

Since he’s acting more extreme than normal (more like someone awaiting orders than a partner due to the Jekyll&Hyde thing), it causes more problems (like him waiting for her decisions leaving openings where he could’ve done something proactive)

She actually blows up at him, asking why he didn’t do anything (“I was waiting for you to tell me the plan!”), and she says he should be able to think on his own, he doesn’t need her to tell him everything, but- “I thought I was just being what you wanted.”

(He’s shocked and genuinely hurt- though it’s still pretty quiet emotion, subdued and apologetic)

And that’s when it clicks for her what becoming CW was back in Kuroneko. He was molding himself for her. And this version of CW is even more of that. She realizes just how much CN suppresses, not just for her, but for everyone- why else would this be a major aspect of his personality?

(Also, Patte de Velours? Velvet Paw? That’s basically saying he’s been declawed. Yikes.)

She makes CN get his butt back to the fight (or she finds him- he may have been doing something while away like talking with someone, maybe Alya or Nino, or Luka). CN and CW argue more, with insults. Then she goes on a whole rant/lecture to them about how important they both are, both to her and to each other, how they are one person, and their traits are both important, but each extreme is not great. Ex: instinct/impulse and service/obedience (the key is self control, so that your emotions aren’t controlling you, but neither is another person). He is allowed to be both! Neither personality is bad, and hating one is just hating himself- he can’t just reject a fundamental part of himself.

She makes them agree to work together to defeat the akuma. It’s awkward at first, but they get a rhythm by seeing where each one is needed in the plan (LB does still do that, but how they follow is more fluid now). Two cataclysms now! Yay! (Maybe they used their powers already and have to de transform, and they see themselves as Adrien- the same one, not different, and it gets through their skulls. Idk I’m spitballing).

They have a quick talk between the two about accepting each other, it won’t be easy, I’m nervous, we’ll be okay (“yeah, I think we will :)”), etc.

Ends with them combining back with the ladybug cure. Surprise! His outfit is combined too! (Honestly, I just want the ponytail with the fluffy hair)

LB and CN have a talk after recharging about everything. CN apologizes for lying about CW and explains why and how he did it. LB didn’t realize how much he hid. She never meant for him to change or hate parts of himself. He thought she didn’t like the CN parts of him, but LB promises that isn’t true. She admits she did get… annoyed, but never hate! She loves both sides of him. Besides, CW didn’t work out that first time, remember? (Though she very much leaves out her intense crushing being the deciding factor there)

CN admits he feels more, well, not whole, exactly, he’s actually still pretty uncertain about what all this means for “who he is,” but… he can at least say he feels less like he has to perform all the time. He loves being Chat Noir, but he is exaggerating a bit when he transforms, in part to be not like his civilian life. He tells her he’s not like that as a civilian, but he’s also not like Cat Walker. But he’s not really sure who “he” is yet. (What I’m getting at is Oblivio!Adrien- dorky, but not over the top, in love, trusts his lady to make the plan, but is still proactive, etc.)

LB says that’s okay, he doesn’t have to figure it out right away. But she’ll be there to help him figure it out.

END

Actually Re-Versed Miracuclass:

Marinette: Until I Watch The Special, The One Kid Who Sits in the Back And Refuses To Socialize.

Adrien: Until I Watch The Special, Typical Delinquent.

Alya: Salt Fic.

Nino: Absolute Dick

Chloe: AGRESSIVE FRIENDSHIP

Lila: Brutally Honest

Sabrina: Shipped Off To New York For Working With Shadybug and Claw Noir. (Yes, She's Just Canon Chloe)

Max: Dumb and tries to do sports, but fails.

Kim: Smart, and hates how people try to push him into doing sporty things.

Alix: The Girliest Girl That Ever Girled.

Rose: Juleka Couffaine

Juleka: Rose Lavillant

Nathaniel: Social Butterfly

Ivan: Will Now Throw The First Punch, Instead Of Needing Provokation

Mylene: No Concept of Inside Voice

Cursed!

Les conséquences de leurs choix et comment ils ont réagi (the consequences of their choices and how they reacted)

Avec l'épisode special Paris qui est sorti, il y a encore des zones d'ombres comme le suprême, ce fameux système et pourquoi Marinette n'a pas pu utiliser le souhait, Emilie et ainsi de suite. Toutefois j'aimerai parler du trio de l'autre monde, Toxinelle, Griffe Noire et Hesperia. Dans ce special, on peut voir le mauvais duo travailler ensemble même si ça leur fait pas plaisir. Vu qu'ils ont déjà essayé de voler le miraculous de l'autre, se disputant pour être épargné par le Suprême. Ce qui en dit pas mal sur comment sont traités les agents de ce dernier ! Même Plagg et Tikki sont muets et ne peuvent parler mais on peut voir qu'ils ont peur même sous leur vraie forme. Notre Tikki était au courant de ces autres univers et les connaît bien mais en parler à Marinette prendrait toute sa vie pour n'en parler que d'une infime partie. Donc ouais le special nous rappelle bien qu'on a à faire des êtres particuliers.

Toxinelle qui est plus froide et a plus de répondant envers Griffe Noire qui préfère faire les choses à sa manière. Surutilisant le lucky charm au prix de sa vie. Elle était seule et livrée à elle même n'avait personne pour l'aider, pas de parents, d'ami voir même de petit ami (bien que j'ai crû comprendre qu'elle en avait un mais qu'elle aurait traité de loser). Et en réponse, elle répond par la colère, la frustration de ne pas avoir eu la vie souhaité alors qu'une autre Marinette l'a en lisant son journal. On pourrait aussi l'associer à l'envie envers son alter ego. Tout ses lucky charm reflètent bien son côté agressive, ne montrant que des objets offensifs que défensifs ! Et c'est pour ça qu'elle était une cible facile pour le Suprême qui l'a convaincu qu'utiliser ses pouvoirs lui permettrait de ne plus jamais être blessé, de ne plus souffrir. Ne trouvant pas d'autre moyen que d'exprimer ce qu'elle ressent à travers la violence qu'elle infligera aux autres. Tant qu'elle peut soulager la sienne.

C'est pour ça que sa confrontation avec Ladybug est importante car elle croit que tout a été simple pour elle ! Sauf que bien au contraire, ça n'a pas été le cas ! Elle a essayé de changer et a pu grandir, devenir plus mature et ainsi changer sa vision de voir le monde qui l'entoure pour enfin vivre pleinement sa vie et ça malgré les épreuves qu'elle doit faire face. Elle n'est pas seule car elle a Chat Noir, ses amis mais aussi sa famille pour la soutenir. En sauvant son alter ego, elle s'aide elle même car ça se passe après Destruction ayant pas pu récupérer les miraculous à Monarque. Elle a pu aider son autre version lui permettant de ne pas perdre espoir cette fois !

Griffe Noire est plus impulsif et imprudent au point d'être assez suicidaire en se prenant un cataclysme. Ne répondant que par la destruction, sa manière de faire est très différente de Toxinelle. Ne répondant que par la provocation et des calembours, étant même plus agressif en terme de combat que Chat Noir. Mais Chat Noir est plus malin que lui et a grandi différemment, et c'est horrible de se dire qu'il suffisait qu'un ou plusieurs choix pour se dire que Adrien aurait pu être finir comme Griffe Noire ! Tout comme Marinette aurait pu devenir Toxinelle en fonction de ses choix ! Mais derrière son attitude se cache une peine, un deuil qui ne s'est pas remit celui de sa mère. Il ne peut accepter que son père aille de l'avant alors qu'il est coincé dans le marchandage et le déni. Tandis qu'Adrien a accepté la mort de sa mère et ça lui a traversé l'esprit d'utiliser le souhait. Or il sait qu'il y a un prix à payer et que des enfants seraient privés de leur mère. Et ça il peut pas l'accepter tout comme Emilie. Griffe Noire se montre triste mais aussi terrifié car il ne sait plus quoi faire. Adrien lui suggère de s'excuser auprès de Nino et essayer de devenir son ami, ce que Griffe Noire est hésitant à faire. Or Adrien lui dit que ça ira malgré tout et qu'ils n'ont qu'à voir un film ensemble. D'ailleurs j'aime comment le soleil se lève montrant désormais leur résolution désormais

Quand à Hesperia, ce dernier a perdu sa femme mais contrairement à notre Gabriel. Il refuse de succomber au deuil et l'utilise pour donner et garder l'espoir. Il était avec le Suprême avant et il a dû partir après la mort d'Emilie. Par contre comment il a enlever le sort de mutisme à Nooroo ? Je sais pas peut être que prendre un nouveau départ et utiliser ses pouvoirs pour le bien est le moyen de briser le sort du silence. Mais c'est pas précisé donc on peut que spéculer, dans le combat entre le duo et lui, Toxinelle le pointe du doigt pour avoir volé les miraculous. Laissant supposer qu'ils ont travaillé ensemble avant vu comment elle lui parle ainsi que Griffe Noire. En voyant le monde de notre duo, il le trouve magnifique et beau mais c'est loin d'être tout rose ! Vu que Monarque a les miraculous et c'est dommage de ne pas avoir eu ces deux là interagir. Mais je pense que c'est fait exprès pour montrer la différence entre ces deux là. Et puis Hesperia n'aurait pas pu raisonner Monarque. Et malgré qu'il soit l'ennemi du duo, il continue de tendre la main pour qu'ils rejoignent sa résistance. Vu ses dialogues, je pense qu'il internalise certaines de ses expériences voir même ressenti qu'il a traversé quand il travaillait avec le Suprême. Et du coup sa réponse a été de tourner le dos à ce dernier pour faire ce qui est juste. D'ailleurs sa forme akumatisé a une certaine ironie quand il est montré comme un ange et que notre Gabriel est mort et probablement en enfer à l'heure qu'il est. Sans compter les plumes qui sortent de Chat Noir, cette ironie quand tu nous tiens !

With the special Paris episode now out, there are still some dark areas, such as the supreme, that famous system and why Marinette couldn't use the wish, Emilie and so on. However, I'd like to talk about the otherworldly trio, Toxinelle, Griffe Noire and Hesperia. In this special, we can see the evil duo working together, even if they're not happy about it. Given that they've already tried to steal each other's miraculous, fighting to be spared by the Supreme. Which says a lot about how the Supreme's agents are treated! Even Plagg and Tikki are mute and can't speak, but we can see that they're scared even in their true form. Our Tikki was aware of these other universes and knows them well, but to tell Marinette about them would take her whole life to tell only a tiny part of it. So yeah, the special is a good reminder that we're dealing with special beings.

Toxinelle is colder and more responsive than Griffe Noire, who prefers to do things her own way. Overusing the lucky charm at the cost of her life. She was alone and left to her own devices, with no one to help her, no parents, no friends, not even a boyfriend (although I understand she had one, but would have called her a loser). And in response, she responds with anger, frustration at not having had the life she wanted, whereas another Marinette has it by reading her diary. It could also be associated with envy of her alter ego. All her lucky charms reflect her aggressive side, showing off more offensive objects than defensive ones! And that's why she was an easy target for the Supreme, who convinced her that using her powers would mean she'd never be hurt or suffer again. Finding no other way than to express what she feels through the violence she inflicts on others. As long as she can relieve her own.

That's why her confrontation with Ladybug is so important, because she thinks everything has been easy for her! But on the contrary, it hasn't been! She's tried to change and has been able to grow up, become more mature and change her view of the world around her, finally living her life to the full despite the trials she's had to face. She's not alone, as she has Black Cat, her friends and family to support her. By saving her alter ego, she's helping herself, as this takes place after Destruction was unable to retrieve the miraculous from Monarque. She was able to help her other version, so she didn't lose hope this time!

Griffe Noire is more impulsive and reckless, to the point of being quite suicidal in the face of cataclysm. Responding only with destruction, his approach is very different from that of Toxinelle. Responding only with provocation and puns, he's even more aggressive in terms of combat than Chat Noir. But Chat Noir is smarter than he is and has grown up differently, and it's horrible to think that all it took was one or more choices to tell you that Adrien could have ended up like Griffe Noire! Just as Marinette could have become Toxinelle depending on her choices! But behind his attitude lurks a grief, a mourning that has not recovered, that of his mother. He can't accept that his father is moving on, while he's stuck in bargaining and denial. Adrien, on the other hand, has accepted his mother's death, and it crossed his mind to use the wish. But he knows there's a price to pay and that children would be deprived of their mother. He can't accept that, and neither can Emilie. Griffe Noire is saddened but also terrified because he doesn't know what to do. Adrien suggests that he apologize to Nino and try to become his friend, which Black Claw is reluctant to do. But Adrien tells him that he'll be fine anyway, and that all they have to do is watch a movie together. By the way, I like the way the sun rises, now showing their resolution.

As for Hesperia, he has lost his wife, but unlike our Gabriel. He refuses to succumb to grief and uses it to give and keep hope. He was with the Supreme before and had to leave after Emilie's death. But how did he remove Nooroo's mute spell? I don't know, maybe making a fresh start and using his powers for good is the way to break the silence spell. But it's not spelled out so we can only speculate, in the fight between the duo and him, Toxinelle points the finger at him for stealing the miraculous. This suggests that they've worked together before, given the way she talks to him and Griffe Noire. Seeing our duo's world, he finds it magnificent and beautiful, but it's far from rosy! Given that Monarque has the miraculous, it's a shame we didn't have these two interacting. But I think it's done on purpose to show the difference between these two. Besides, Hesperia couldn't have reasoned with Monarque. And despite being the duo's enemy, he keeps reaching out to them to join his resistance. Given his dialogues, I think he's internalizing some of the experiences and even feelings he went through when working with the Supreme. And so his response was to turn his back on the Supreme to do the right thing. Moreover, his akumatized form has a certain irony when he's shown as an angel and our Gabriel is dead and probably in hell by now. Not to mention the feathers that come out of Chat Noir, that irony!

My issue with Senti-Adrien

One of the reasons I don't like the senti-adrien theory is because I feel it takes away an important element of the environment he's grown up in: that pervasive feeling that it's wrong to not be okay with something, that it's wrong to disobey.

In the culture I've grown up in, Doublespeak is used A LOT. You are NEVER supposed to insult someone or have an impolite conversation with them. You can't express discomfort, and I always seem to find myself in disgreements where if I leave to cool down, that's not the right option.

Everyone -especially the women who face more social stigma- is likely going to get into a situation that they CAN'T leave. They don't know how, and they may not even have the tools to recognize that they WANT TO. That it's not healthy. After all, if someone hasn't done something OBVIOUSLY WRONG, you can't be impolite. Even if you're uncomfortable.

Of course, then it becomes a slow boil, the things you have to not react to (and sometimes even pretend you enjoy) become worse and worse, but never so much worse than the last time you didn't react.

In the end, a lot of people don't understand why you would be near people who make you feel uncomfortable. Why you can't stand up for yourself. Why you treat people who treat you like shit kindly.

Adrien could've been a girl and depicted this. A high class girl constantly under the spotlight for her father's fame could easily be pressured to be a sweetheart, a good girl, and everyone could see "oh, well, she's a girl. Of course she'd be taken advantage of eventually. An abusive father? Well, I'm not surprised."

But Adrien’s a guy who is under the same social pressures as a girl in a believable way. He's not expected to be abused in that way. He's a guy. Guys "can't be emotionally abused/not know this is wrong". Except, yes, they can. Anyone of any gender can be abused by anyone of any other gender, and a guy may show traditionally female signs of abuse and grooming as abused to the traditionally masculine agression and acting out.

First off, Adrien is a model. He's used to being constantly objectified. His body is literally posed for everyone to stare at as his job. He's also a teen model, and almost certainly has had to release private details of his life for strangers to obsess over in an environment that says this is normal. This is good.

He can't complain because much like girls here, it would ruin his reputation as a nice guy, so he's defaulted to a very normal coping skill in these parts. Rationalization. See, it's easier to keep your temper if you can excuse others behavoirs as perfectly reasonable to yourself. And with enough practice, ANYTHING can be reasonable. Combine that with the classic downplay, a classic of everyone in these parts -for the sake of politeness of course, and your reality is normal, bearable, not worth complaining about.

But it obfuscates mistreatment to outsiders. Outsiders who haven't internalized "this is okay. This is normal. This is expected". As Adrien interacts more and more with these outsiders, and they realize what Adrien does not, what he cannot, they become concerned.

And Chat? Chat Noir offers hope. Chat is proof that Adrien, without those social pressures, CAN stand up for himself, and he can do it while still being kind and empathetic and considerate. Chat is proof that deep down, Adrien would thrive outside of those pressures.

Yet, without Plagg, without his ring or an escape, he cant. He can't think of a way to do that since his reputation is on the line. It's enormous, that desire to make people think you're good, that you're not a trouble maker, that you're useful to them. Adrien, I feel, portrays that well.

It is a completely invisible, omnipresent force that outsiders cannot understand. You dont even understand how much of an effect it has on you until you're away from it.

The senti-monster theory makes that force one you LITERALLY cannot disobey. Now, some may argue that makes it work as a metaphor, but no. I think the fact that you CLEARLY have no choice, as seen by an outsider is to its detriment. Yes, being in that situation makes you feel like you have no choice, but to an outsider?

It looks like you do, you're just not taking it. It looks like you're too weak, or indecisive, or stupid to do the obvious thing and realize you're in an abusive situation and leave. There’s nothing an outsider can blame your "flaws" on, no excuse, and under the amount of pressure, nothing that you can say that would justify you be so weak/stupid/indecisive. Because unless you've been outside that culture in a way that let you realize what it did to you, all you can think is that it was just you.

Sorry if my question about how dumb you made Adrien in Dating Prince Charming sounded passive agressive, it's just that no matter how bad someone think Adrien is, the idea of him WILLINGLY dating Lila is way too far fetched, and a story that has him dating Lila and it's not because she blackmailed him or his father forced him to is way too tough a sell. Like you really have to come up with a good reason for why he would do so that doesn't seem too out of character.

Nah its a chill and fair question. I have seen the fics where Adrien willingly dates her with 0 coercion and i also feel those are a step to out of character. Like unless Lila 180’d HARD and gaslight girlbossed so hard that she genuinely convinced Adrien she was a reformed sinner now on the path of good? Nah.

But him dating her cuz dad said do it or else? … yeah. Or dating her from blackmail or dating her thinking hes sacrificing himself in some way? In character.

Hey it's me the not-anon Mary sue(in case folks care I don't post anon)

To agress your response first(trying to clarify my point)

Marinette doesn't face consequences, she gets punished.(I ended up using a mega-kuma example latwr too)

A made up example: Say Marinette is nervous about talking to Luka so she uses the snake to reset time repeatedly, checking each of his responses until she finds the right words to get the response she wants.

What the show would not do is have Luka discover her use and get mad that she was manipulating hom, not allowing him a response to her 'true' self's first thoughts.

What it would do is have Su-Han who had never appeared before show up, explain he had tracked her use of the snake and how her use of the snake at this exact moment had caused a celestial conjunction that released a demon which has possessed Adrien and all her friends.

Like one of these things is interesting, narrative, and connected. The other is just abuse.

As for the Fu/Queen thing:

I misspoke about his Identity. I meant location.

The timeline is: Love Eater shows up, Mari confronts it sans Cat Noir. Her Lucky charm is: goto Fu.

On the way to Fu she sees Adrien and Kagami cozey and is distracted. Instead of her usual routine of sneak somewhere and detransform then go see Fu she just heads right to him. Thus giving him away. (Yes Mayura was following her but I feel it is safe to think a Marinette with her head in the game would slip Mayura just as part of her usual care)

Then she reaches for the Bee and think of Chloé. This also fits Ladybug's MO of having people help their family. It lines up perfectly, but then she instead grabs the dragon and we see her literally yoink Kagami away from Adrien by yo-yo (which was admittedly funny)

None of this is calling Mari a bad person, just a person. It's totally fair storytelling. It just gets bottled up with happy Fu and Always Evil Chloé instead of being addressed.

As for the Guardianship. Two points:

1)Consequences need to be contemporary in a narrative. The Narrative hit the end of the sentence with the end of the season finalé. further complications 'later' don't always track back.

2)The Good/Bad of the changeover is muddled anyway. You could argue she would have lost several episodes of S4 without being the Guardian. I don't really want to dissect that, it just isn't a good barometer.

The mega-Kuma is an example of punishment vs consequences.

Consequences would have been Marianne blaming Ladybug(justified or not) or having to admit to Chloé that even though siding with Hawkmoth was wrong, she had made mistakes too in not addressing Chloé clear misunderstanding better(as a hero)

Punishment is Hawkmoth gaining new powers, none of which were forseeable/clear products of her choices.

The discussion is interesting and all but can y’all make throwaway accounts and talk directly to each other?

Fighting the antipapist cause since 2015 ("Reunion")

After "Oblivio" you wouldn't think Alya was so agressively anti-ladynoir

Tikki "doesn't know much about love" after having spent four seasons dishing out advice on the topic

no tourists in Paris because of the akumas I guess, that's why the Louvre is always empty

yes it sure is nice to communicate with your dad, thanks for pointing it out, not like any dads here have any ulterior motives behind this conversation or have repeatedly attacked families of people with miraculous to extort them or anything like that

it breaks my heart to hear Adrien use the word "Papa" about the guy who HAD FEI'S DAD KILLED FRIENDLY REMINDER

I'm missing Lila here

as if Gabriel hasn't been hiring troll farms to smear Ladybug ever since "Stoneheart", but of all the things I expected this show to discuss, online radicalisation was not one of them

First time I've heard her referred to as "Johanne" but you do you, subs, technically it's not wrong

Tikki's behind the times on universal design

...not to be That Person but beyond using this power for dating therapy, maybe not ask the one whose virginity was like half her brand

Jesus Christ Jalil what IS it with you getting the off-brand horror akumatisations. Like last time you were seconds away from committing human sacrifice. Good on them for showing us that more people than the Mean Girls And Felix are willing to join Hawkdaddy's cause

brave manicure

they could've given us Cat Noir's transformation sequence in the car

for a moment there I thought the return of the truth-telling akuma would give us a return of the surprise!dad's, but alas

of course Adrien had a horse girl phase. of course he did.

autodeakumatisation cheapens by the day and these writers have clearly never tried confronting lunatics online with fact and witnessed them disregard it because it doesn't fit their narrative

I don't know which is more hilariously blasphemic: MLB’s assertian that Joan of Arc never died a martyr's death or Hetalia's assertion that she was reincarnated as an American tourist

well that was an interesting piece of foreshadowing for Kwami's Choice

oh that final scene has BETTER be followed up next episode. also how dare they not show us Plagg retching it out like a hair ball

"You are asking an adrien salter for adrien on the blorbo bingo"

I mean, there are negative spaces in them, you could just mark them.

Yeah but I was asking for blorbo bingos cuz I wanted to gush a bit about favs not complain about Mr Adricole Athanos Agression lol

My friends and I today:

Me: be agressive, be, be aggressive

C: be AGRESTE

My other friend L trying to remember Adrien the fragrance: agreste the flavor

Genuine question. Are there any good in-character salt fics that don’t go crazy over the top and have marinette bring in weird ass characters from other universes? (Like the waynes. Why do I see them so often. She doesn’t need adopting, and the siblings I just can’t see her wanting to spend time around) Like, I’d love a semi-rewrite/redemption for either Chloe or Lila (moreso chloe, you’d basically need a full lila rewrite.) to make it more.... substantial? Like I don’t care about your fic if the whole class suffers and you write marinette as being entirely ooc to justify it. Not to mention the classism present in a lot of these salt fics, usually in blatant monetary value, social standing, or in some cases colorism/racism (usually against alya and nino, portraying alya ‘years later’ as agressive and an idiot etc’  or nino as some kind of cheater or slacker. (???) Like. There’s so much opportunity for rewrites in salt fic but it all seems incredibly immature in favor of boosting up marinette, and in a lot of cases tearing down Adrien in favor of some other romantic partner (usually the waynes. again what?) or felix, which. At least he’s from the same series. Either way, usually not well written. Like I love marinette, I love adrien despite them being flawed. Like. Imagine an arc that has salt for chloe about what she’s done and she FINALLY tries to be better. But it’s hard and she fails a lot, but she’s making. Attempts. Even if she’s annoyed. Advice and quips from her butler. Lila as such gets to prove MORE of a threat before the takedown. Maybe some of the class WANTS to believe the best in her, because theyre following MARINETTES example, but the more proof piles up it’s hard to justify. Hell, even some crossover could make sense in the background. Marinette sleuthing out proof that Lila is a liar, but finding that lila fabricates loose evidence to support it, so it’s a rabbit hole with a subplot needing max’s help. There’s so much stuff you could write about to fill holes in canon and get a fix of salt with sugar redemption for characters you like. Why do you guys fall back on stuff like Marinette Raising More Money and Punishing her Old Friends, or Marinette is suddenly Chloe’s best friend and a Mean Girl and dating some marvel hero and has taken Chat’s ring.

Unpopular opinion (maybe?)

I actually like the idea of Kagami being the first to find out she is a senti and join Felix side to fight to save the sentis still under control, mainly Adrien.

But if thats the case, I do hope Felix is being genuine about Kagami, and not just tricking and manipulating her into help him. Because so far he does seem to rly care about sentis, as shown by his breakdown with Red Moon and by how angry he got when Kagami called them sentimonsters. He honestly wants to help free Adrien even if his methods are not the best. And I dont think it would be OC of Kagami to join him, specially if she truly believes that it's for Adrien's sake.

Kagami joins Felix and helps keep him check to avoid agressive plans that could hurt innocent people, specially her friends. But they would still not join LB and CN's side,for their objective would be mainly about saving sentis, and not fighting Monarch.

Idk I feel like they are wasting a lot potential with Felix this season, and kinda dumbed him down this season when compared to season 4.

Umm Sabine?

You know she's just upstairs right? And youre calling her on something that is the equivalent of FaceTime while Adrien is there, while she's in her pajamas. Sure Adrien has already seen them but you don't know that.

Wait. So she knows? And she still got the version of Alliance that has the person that nearly got her expelled. Twice. I... Don't know what to say to that. Next screencap.

Ouch. Okay I'm back to saying someone needs a word with Adrien and it better not be Nino. The idiot already put the thought that Marinette hates him in his head once. Guess what's bound to be popping in there now.

Oh thank god he didn't hear that. I'm sure the two best parents in Paris will figure out a way to make this painless. Hopefully.

Oh gee. Look at that. Being agressive with someone in denial only caused them to be even more stubborn. Who could have seen that coming? Oh hey. Now I get to blame both Alya and Nino for this moment. This is a good episode.

Something else that paints Adrien's decision to tell Marinette to take the "High Road" in a new light (which I learned from a TV Tropes page for a fanfic that deconstructs Salt Fics): Adrien tried to get Lila to stop lying, and then Chameleon attacked him.

He might have actually been concerned for Marinette's safety when he gave her that advice.

YEAH LIKE

So first off: while I had him there in Lady Luck, Adrien didn't see what happened in the cafeteria.

And just. Adrien can see the pattern with Lila:

Ladybug called Lila out in a very humiliating way in 'Volpina'? She got Akumatized.

Marinette tried to poke holes in Lila's story in 'Catalyst'? She got Akumatied.

Adrien tried to quietly and tactfully tell Lila 'hey I know you're lying but I'm not going to be mean, I'm just going to tell you that we'll still be friends if you stop'? She got Akumatized.

Marinette going off all agressive, just like Ladybug did in 'Volpina' is getting nowhere and will just get Lila Akumatized and make Marinette her target. And she's not making any prgoress because Lila is smart and keeps turning it around on her(doesn't help that she's acting absolutely insane)

Wouldn't it be better to hold back until her lies fall apart and she gets one more Akumatization but is defeated for good rather than 50 more dangerous Akumas that only serve to make Marnette look like an asshole?

It's not a /great/ plan but I can see the logic in it.