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keets-writing-corner · 3 months

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NOT ME

WRITING A LUCIFER FIC

AND REALIZING THAT WHAT BOOTED HIM FROM HEAVEN WAS THE HEAVEN ELDERS/ANCIENTS

AND NOT HAVING INCLUDED THATIN THE FIC

WHO ARE THEY????????????

anyways don't mind me just compiling any references of them I can find and/or other sources and/or speculate just to have it all in one place

K so first explicit reference is in Overture during the exposition dump by Charlie. Not sure which EXPLICITLY are these guys so Imma just add/assume who I think

This them? Are these the assholes?

hmmmm okay either that WASN'T them and she was just talking about angels in general, OR Lucifer was ONE OF THEM, but I'm skeptical

okay assuming these 6 guys are the elders, I heard the number 6 somewhere else too, but that's an unverified source. Okay so maybe he's just a really OLD angel but younger than the elders? Were they like his strict homophobic/fantasy forbidding family or whatever?

Okay so that's clearly Sera and these silhouettes are different, so NOT the elders

Side note, why is Sera so BIG

anyways

that was episode 1... I don't think there's any mention of elders until Dad Beat Dad so let's go to there

Here they are

6 of them again, and the silhouettes match much closer the ones where Charlie directly talks about them. They have 6 wings too tho, so I'm willing to go out on a limb they're all seraphim like Lucifer and Lucifer and Sera were just younger ones (personally headcanoning that Lucifer is even older than Sera, maybe she looked up to him?)

TIME TO GO THROUGH WELCOME TO HEAVEN FRAME BY FRAME AHHH

okay the way Emily says that makes it sound like there are only two seraphim, herself and sera, and lucifer but he clearly doesn't count anymore. So then what are the elders? A different class of seraphim??? they got the 6 wings so what's going on???

"The seraphim" as in a group. But Emily didn't know about the exterminations... IM SO CONFUSED

Sera okayed the extermination, we know that much, but Emily didn't know about it. Do/did the elders know???

K looking at the court angels

Sera and Emily are clearly the highest ranking, there are at least a handful of familiar silhouettes that could be seen in the exposition, so I'm guessing none of these are winners and are all OG angels

are the mysterious elders the ones passing divine judgement?? nobody else is in the loop and they seem the type to withhold information

oh REALLY mmm say like the opinions of 6 crusty old angles is being treated like law??

me: -trying my hardest to dig up lore that I need/want for the fic- Hazbin hotel: teehee you don't know >:)

I did find confirmation that the rest of the court (not-seraphim) in fact did not know about the extermination, look at how equally horrified they are during "You didn't know"

I'm scrounging for scraps in a dumpster I swear

Sera IS the head Seraphim, which would make sense if it's just between her and Emily who's younger (and her job is just to keep everyone happy, which is very suiting for her) but it does imply a degree of separation between Emily/Sera levels of seraphim and whatever the elders are

"Heaven" needs them to perform their roles... but Sera isn't the highest authority, cuz she's scared that maybe someone else would boot Emily from heaven just for asking questions. The elders are clearly ABOVE Sera if she can't do anything about their verdicts.

okay side note

ohhohoho did Sera feel bad for Lucifer >:3c were they CLOSE? >:3c DID SHE DO NOTHING TO HELP HIM??? >:3c Is she ashamed? Is this why she just folds to preserve whatever the elders ordered? Is she scared of them?

Okay only other episode I can look at rn is the last one

sooooooo yeah these two are the only Seraphim that aren't considered "elders" ugh okay things gathered from the episode:

Both Elders and Seraphim have 6 wings

as far as seraphim go, including Lucifer, there are only 3 total that we know of if not period and they are highest ranking but subordinate to the elders

the Elders hold absolute authority being the ones who very clearly and (implied) violently booted Lucifer out of heaven, Sera cannot override their decisions and fears Emily also being booted

They have very specific silhouettes and there are 6 of them

TIME TO SCROUNGE THE INTERNET

nope nevermind, the only thing I found from an actual source was Vivziepop saying in a stream, and I'm paraphrasing the wiki that links it "Information about heaven is being wrapped for later in the series" "It is very interesting" and Dave Capdevielle has a thing about heaven he finds interesting but won't talk about it cuz it's spoilers

In conclusion: RIP ME guess I'll just have to head canon my way through chapter 1 of my fic, ugh I have so much rewriting/adding to do

Chapter 1 is already like 10k words (the fic so far has 30k words and I'm pretty sure that amount is going to quadruple or quintuple by the time I'm done) UGH FINE LETS GO

On the bright side, this gives me MOAR ANGST OPPORTUNITIES? hmmm I might just tweak what I have tho and add some extra scenes? Major thinking needs to be done

#hazbin hotel #hazbin hotel spoilers #heaven #heaven elders #lucifer #lucifer morningstar #Sera #Emily #WHO ARE THE ELDERS #WHAT ARE THEY DOING????#WHY ARE THEY SO MEANNNNNNN #What is their relationship to Lucifer???#slight spoiler for my fic but like #I'm writing Lucifer and Sera having been very close #so when he gets cast out ya know #extra hurt #but now I'm thinking about how traumatic that would've been for Sera too #if my assumption that he's older is correct #then she would've looked up to him #and she would've watched her fairly well meaning and sweet mentor be booted from heaven #and then she would've been the only seraphim ruling #and without the experience and guidance of Lucifer to help her #Of course she reacted the way she did #The elders were scared of something #THE ELDERS #So much that they booted Lucifer #She needs to uphold that #cuz what are they afraid of???#ugh I'm more frustrated than anything #if anyone knows anything PLEASE SEND IT MY WAY

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keets-writing-corner · 24 days

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Alright everyone, buckle up and sit down. I was talking with @nerdasaurus1200 on another post and came to the conclusion that I need to write Sera meta so let's freaking GO

I'm mostly gonna be talking about Sera, what we know about her so far, and what makes her tick (aka her fears) and why she's not a bitch/asshole the way apparently so many people like to portray her? (I've mostly just been hanging out with fan art and headcanons specifically about Lucifer in the fandom so I haven't seen these specifically, but someone approached me about how they liked m portrayal of Sera in my fic which was NOT that of an asshole and apparently multiple people are portraying her that way? Idk I haven't seen any but uh yeah let's talk SERA)

Characters are always the most important part of a story, and even if they're not a main character and/or the audience nor the writer know what they want/need, the writer at the very least needs to know How and Why a character makes decisions, instead of just "oh they're an asshole" So let's do that for Sera. Why is she making the decisions she's making? LETS GO

Let's start off by talking about what we know about Sera

She's at least as old as Lucifer, she was there for the creation of earth given the appearance of her silhouette in Charlie's exposition

We know that the exterminations might have been Adam's idea, but it was HER decision to approve them

We know that she's FOR SURE older than Emily

and the other thing we know for sure about her is that she is the High Seraphim (we don't know WHAT that means exactly but clearly it is a position of authority and rule)

So those are the things we know for sure:

She's about as old as Lucifer

She approved the exterminations

She's older than Emily

and she's the high Seraphim

Now I'm going to circle back to all of these points but I want to start off with her relationship with Lucifer

Unfortunately for all of us, the only thing we can say about their relationship with 100% certainty is that they for SURE know each other, either because they were essentially "coworkers" in the past, or because they're both the respective rulers of their realms (even if Sera has some people above her) and they're implied to interact with each other

(at the very least you cannot convince me otherwise that they don't interact. Someone had to have talked to Lucifer about the exterminations for him to have had "approved it" and we know it wasn't Adam because Lucifer hadn't seen Adam since he fell to hell until the finale, and we know that Sera was not only the one to approve said exterminations but also decreed that no one else in heaven know about them. She clearly must have spoken to Lucifer about it because there's nobody else left who had the authority to do that AND knew about them)

So at the very least in present day Sera and Lucifer have some sort of professional relationship as leaders. And I'll come back to this because it's implied that this relationship isn't a very good one, but first let's talk about the past

full stop, we have NO IDEA what sort of relationship Sera and Lucifer might have had when he was still in heaven. But here's the thing, even if their relation was strictly "yeah I know them cuz I work with them, but that's as far as it goes" Lucifer's fall STILL would have been horrifying for Sera to witness. He was the same rank as her, probably no other angel except the elders likely ranked higher, and they still banished him. Charlie's storybook leaves it at that, but Lucifer implies it was violent in his debut episode.

trauma is a funny thing when you think about it, you're just as likely to develop trauma by watching someone else be assaulted as you are for you to have been assaulted. And Sera was there, she likely saw the whole thing happen. So not only did Sera watch how brutal the elders could be to someone who questioned and disobeyed the order, but the fact that it was done to LUCIFER someone of equal rank and authority as her means that absolutely NOBODY is safe from the elders

and this is without taking into account that on some level, she and Lucifer had to have been close. There are no other seraphim in heaven besides her, the elders (who appear to be rather hands off and uninvolved) and Emily. Emily was likely created as a replacement for Lucifer, so at the time, it was basically just her and Lucifer as the only seraphim up there. They not only worked closely together, they likely had a close bond as well. Now I have my own head canon preferences as to what kind of bond, BUT let's ignore that and look at 3 options (although there are likely more, but huuu this post is gonna be long already so let's not push it yeah? )

option 1: equal peers. You are Sera and you've known Lucifer all your life. You two have "grown up" together, learned about the world and your powers together. You're comrades in arms! You know all of each other's secrets! You lean on each other for support as you lead heaven together. You work together all the time. Sure, he can be a little excitable at times but it's so much FUN right? This guy could be your bestie/brother. And you sit back and watch as the only ones with more authority than you, skewer him and banish him to hell for having questioned the order and now there's a metaphorical spear against your back at all times because you know it could have been you instead, and it could still be you if you don't behave

Option 2: Lucifer is your mentor. He's taught you everything you know. The ropes, your powers, the world. He's fantastic! You admire him greatly. He has such energy you could never hope to match. You put him on a pedestal, and in one fell swoop the only people he answers to destroy your mentor in front of you. You are now alone, without any more advice or guidance other than a warning to not step out of line as your mentor once did

Option 3: Lucifer is your apprentice. He's adorable! A little over enthusiastic but who doesn't love someone who's passionate about the things they like? He brings a wonderful energy and vibe, and... he's your responsibility. You try to reign in his wild energy only for the elders to step in and banish him because you failed him and now you know that the elders could do that to you too

So, I'll be honest, option 3 is NOT the one I'm biased towards, but if it ends up being that one, it would make Sera's behavior towards Emily extra heartbreaking. She already failed one apprentice, she will not fail another one, right?

Either way, Sera is terrified of going against the elders because of what they did to Lucifer in spite of his rank. She knows first hand how harsh they can be and because of that, she will do everything in her power to make sure nobody around her falls into the same fate. No one will ever question the elders again, and she will lie and withhold information to make sure that happens

And we're just talking about the INITIAL banishment.

Now why would Sera bring this up, unless what she was most afraid of wasn't even the initial banishment, but of the suffering she clearly knows comes afterwards? And why would she care or even know about the suffering? Well, if it's true that she and Lucifer were close, then regardless if she was spying on him or not the way we know heaven can do, she still watched a cute enthusiastic little angel go from this:

to this

all because because he suffered.

She watched him question, get banished, suffer, and change into someone she didn't recognize, in real time. And the worst part is, she's not only scared of what happened TO him, she's personally scared OF him and what he's become. He might be fallen, but he's still a powerful angel

And this segways into another bullet: she approved the exterminations, but WHY

Charlie's intro implies it was as some sort of punishment towards Lilith who was rallying the demons and they felt threatened

But clearly there's more to this

So first thing I'd like to point out, Sera doesn't look happy about this decision. She mentions as much in the song "You didn't Know" when she outright tells Emily "It was such a hard decision" and earlier in the same episode she outright tells Adam she wouldn't have approved of this if she had known it'd make things "worse"

But this is incomplete. Something doesn't make sense. Sera clearly meets with Lucifer for certain matters as previously established, and Lucifer, in spite of his initial trauma "NO CHARLIE DO NOT TALK TO HEAVEN" knee jerk reaction, never doubted that he COULD in fact get her a meeting with heaven. He outright tells her at the end of episode 5

He never says, "I'll try to get the meeting". He says straight up, I can do this. There isn't a doubt in his mind that he can get this meeting. He knows Sera will meet with him/take his call (idk how he contacts heaven) and will agree to the meeting. We don't really know WHY Sera agreed to this if she thought it was a bad idea and never really intended to entertain the idea to begin with, going as far as to tell Adam to rig the results and calling Charlie misguided. So what's up? Why on earth would she agree to it? Well...?

Sera is scared of the demons of hell, hence why she approved the exterminations, but she's even MORE scared of Lucifer and folded to his request. (or idk maybe there's more going on here and she feels guilt about what happened to him so she folds to him sometimes idk, but for the sake of this meta, SHE'S SCARED OF HIM)

but here's what's kinda weird. Charlie's storybook only mentions LILITH'S involvement with the demons rising in power, not Lucifer. Sera later claims that they were uprising to Emily as the reason she's scared of them and that it's her job to keep everyone safe.

Clearly SOMETHING happened between the creation of Hell and the exterminations being approved that involved BOTH the sinners AND Lucifer that made Sera scared of both. Sera doesn't seem the type to fear without reason. She fears questioning the order because that incurs the elders' wrath. She fears the elders because of what they did to Lucifer. She fears angels falling because she saw how much it hurt Lucifer. Sera is not the type to fear randomly. Clearly there is some sort of thing that happened that made it clear to Sera that Lucifer is to be feared enough to fold to his requests and that the sinners are dangerous enough that it justifies genocide.

And now to bring back the whole Sera is older than Emily. Emily didn't know this otherwise Sera wouldn't have needed to tell her. AKA Emily wasn't even around when said conflict happened. Sera not only had to go through something that clearly traumatized her to the point where she agreed that genocide was a reasonable response, but she had to go through that ALONE. Trauma is hard enough to deal with, but to have to navigate it alone really gives it some steroids it has no business in having

This genuinely makes me wonder how long the exterminations have to have been taking place. It probably took a WHILE for hell to gather up enough numbers that they started making buildings by the look of Charlie's storybook, AND THEN did something against heaven, so this was not happening from day one of hell, far from it. And this also makes me wonder how old exactly is Emily? She strikes me as extremely young

season 2 come out please, I'm working from CRUMBS here, there is so much we don't know

But yeah, all of this to say, Sera isn't just some alpha bitch who's prejudiced against demons (not to say there isn't bias there, there ABSOLUTELY is, ugh) but at her core, she's a leader who underwent a lot of trauma and she's full of fear and she makes decisions, rational, moral or not, based off of that fear. And yeah unfortunately, fear, especially trauma based fear, messes with us in ways we never would expect

a kind man may suddenly resort to violence. The confident argumentative person, may instead end up frozen. Someone who thought they valued their family all their life instead runs away. We may regret what we do in moments in fear, we might even logically know that we're making bad decisions, or decisions that go against our morals. Sera CLEARLY hates that she made the decision to approve extermination, but she holds onto it steadfast because it alleviates the fear

Funnily enough, I don't particularly LIKE Sera. I dislike her microaggressions towards Charlie and her attempts to sabotage her efforts at the meeting by calling upon Adam. But as a writer, looking at the clues I got to say she's a very interesting character to me. She seems like a reasonable authority figure, but she's so full of trauma that she's letting her fear make all of her decisions for her