Update: making my bf watch SPN
He will only watch 150 episodes, so this weekend we have watched 8.11 (LARP and the real girl), 8.13 (everybody hates nazis), 8.17 (goodbye, stranger), and 8.19 (taxi driver).
He loves Charlie. He wishes she was as prevalent in the show as Cas bc shes awesome. He is worried about her future on the show… as he should be. 8.13 was one of his favorite episodes so far, if not favorite.
He sees Dean as bi. Between Benny and Aaron and Cas… my bf just feels bad for Dean this season bc he can’t keep a man.
He was thrilled to see his favorite character Bobby make an appearance.
He LOVES Crowley. He very much dislikes the show overall, with some episode exceptions. But he thinks Crowley is one of his favorite TV villains. This is definitely going to help him tolerate the rest of the show. Thank god for Mark.
He loved Benny. He was really upset when Dean and Benny said their final goodbyes, he TEARED UP even.
The main reason for his sadness over Benny is bc he thinks Benny is the man Dean deserves. But instead Dean just keeps going back to his “toxic, abusive relationship” with Cas. And… i know there are a lot of people who share this take but this is the first time I am really seeing it too... Lmao. He hates Cas bc he treats Dean like crap and I mean… he isn’t wrong but it’s more complicated than that imo but i love their fucked up love so I’m biased.
He still dislikes Sam but isn’t as angry about him being on screen in S8 since his sideburns are under control. He said “wow, he’s actually handsome now.”
I am dreading Charlie’s death, he is gonna be pissed. But looking forward to some of the higher points of Destiel to try and sell him on them.
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if dean's hell time isn't indicative of overall hell time, then how long was sam in the cage for?
They’ve said it was a year and a half in the show before... I don’t know if that’s true or a handwave and Sam’s experience felt longer (whether because of the inherent nature of the cage or just because of the nature of his interactions with Lucifer).
Michael/Adam has said that they were effectively alone together for a very long time, so I think it’s being implied that they “retreated into their shared mind” rather than engage with Lucifer even before Lucifer got out. That also explains Lucifer’s perspective when he commented on Michael’s state in the cage back in s11 and s12.
But the “hell time” information isn’t new. Back in s11 when Sam was in Crowley’s study in Hell, and then Limbo (because that’s the part of Hell the fake Cage was in), while Dean and Cas were still on Earth, TIME ELAPSED AT THE SAME RATE IN BOTH PLACES. Then in 11.10, Dean went to Hell and spent a good part of the day there while Cas was looking for Amara, before she zapped Cas right to Billie’s Hell Waiting Room. Again, time passed simultaneously. There wasn’t like... weeks passing for Dean in Hell while Cas was delayed from arriving for a short time, you know?
There’s also s6, where Crowley showed Cas around Hell (which we saw in 6.20), though we don’t really have a reference for how long in Earth time that meeting took, since it occurred in flashback, but Raphael gave Cas ONE DAY:
RAPHAEL Tomorrow you kneel, Castiel...Or you and anyone with you dies.
So during that ONE DAY, it’s implied that Cas went to Dean, watched him rake leaves, and then went with Crowley to Hell to borrow the 50k souls he used to slap Raphael down. If their meeting in Hell had gone on the same timeline that Dean’s 40 years occupied... Cas would’ve missed that meeting with Raphael...
Then we have 8.19, where Sam went from Purgatory into Hell. We know Purgatory time runs parallel with standard Earth time, and yet Sam’s strict time limit to get back to meet the reaper who’d bring him back to Earth wasn’t affected by the short time he spent in Hell. It all supposedly runs concurrently with Earth time, and Dean’s activities back on Earth (i.e. Benny shows up in Purgatory at the same time Sam’s expecting the now-dead reaper...). I know this is a more hand-wavey example, but it’s still at least worth adding here as an example.
What it comes down to is Dean’s statement that his time in Hell felt more like 40 years than four months as the ONLY “proof” that Hell time runs differently. Every other example we have has always suggested otherwise. Dean’s experience may have been that way, but nobody else’s has. Which leads us to believe that the time dilation effect was unique to Dean’s experience there, and a function of the urgency to hurry along the process of breaking the first seal and starting the Apocalypse-- which was the entire goal of everything in the show up to that point.
Which also makes John’s year in Hell more plausible, too. John... wasn’t the one “destined” to begin the apocalypse, so he didn’t get the intensive treatment either. When he walked out of Hell in 2.22 with a smile on his face looking completely intact, it becomes impossible to imagine that he spent more time in Hell than Dean did, you know?
This is not to discount the suffering Sam’s soul experienced in the Cage. That was a very special kind of torture on its own, and different in purpose and intent than Dean’s experience. Dean very specifically needed to be “tortured into becoming a torturer himself,” as per the prophecy. Sam... was just trapped in the cage as the sole target for Lucifer’s rage. We saw the direct results of that trauma over s6 and s7, and we know it STILL haunts Sam to this day (per his conversation with Rowena in 13.12 and understanding how Chuck has now confirmed that all of this, their entire lives of suffering against the supernatural, was set up for Chuck’s own entertainment...). But there’s never been anything in canon to suggest that time in the Cage passes any differently from time on Earth, or in Purgatory, or in Heaven. There’s no narrative reason for Hell to just ~be different~ on that sort of scale.
Assuming Dean’s very specific personal experience applied as a blanket statement to all of Hell is just unfounded speculation. It would be like assuming that any one person’s experience in their personal heaven was therefore a blanket truth about ~everyone’s~ individual heavens, and the entirety of Heaven as a whole, you know? It’s just not rational.
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There should have been a scene in Taxi Driver where Dean frantically explains how hell works to Sam before the reaper takes him. He would start off by sharing stuff what wasn't too upsetting but slowly it would get more and more fucked up as he works himself up into a panic until Sam just goes "hey, woah, calm down. I'll be fine." Which Dean clearly doesn't believe for a second, but what can he do? He promised he'd let Sam do the trials.
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