#LL sandor
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five's character suddenly makes a lot more sense when you look at it as a metaphor for a kid indoctrinated into an abusive evangelical church, who has been convinced that hell is real.
[longpost, talk of religious abuse--mainly the evangelical christian variety--after the cut.]
he's convinced that everyone who doesn't comply with the church's rules will go there; that leaving won't save you, because hell will be waiting for you in the end; and that everyone who claims to believe differently is lying and knows better, they're just pretending they don't because they don't like the idea of acknowledging authority in the time they have before hell catches up to them. and as much as he's been taught to be self-righteous and unsympathetic about people who '''choose''' hell, in practice he's the kid who goes around trying to have the 'so have you accepted jesus into your heart' speech with everyone he even remotely cares about, and won't back off about it even though it goes over Absolutely Fucking Terribly and he's being an asshole, because if he doesn't get them to convert when (he thinks) there's any chance they might have done so they will go to hell and it will be his fault.
and like, this adds a lot of layers to his hatred of nine and what he thinks (and in some ways is correct 🙃) that he stands for. but one of the big ones is that as far as he's concerned, nine can and will snipe people to send them to hell out of spite for converting to save themselves. one of the things that made him hate him so much--decide he Needs and Deserves to Die--is that he was told sandor made the decision to comply with the mogs because it was the Smart Thing to Do... and that nine punished him for it by murdering him brutally. and that given half the chance nine would do it to him.
for all he's been indoctrinated to value Having Power Over Other People and Deserving It Because You're Special, at heart five has major just world fallacy going on because he desperately wants to believe that everyone can be safe, and happy, and understand each other. that all that needs to happen for them to have that is to make the right choice. he doesn't actually believe the mogs are inherently Superior; he thinks they have the same fair shot as everyone else and that the only difference is that they will take that shot, and are honest that they're doing so.
whereas what is one of the other big things he hates nine for? the one that fills him with so much rage he has to stop reading about him? the idea that nine is inherently superior to him and the others, and deserves a better life, regardless of any choice they ever could have made.
he's told that the elders saved nine for last because he was strongest, and that the earlier numbers were cannon fodder because they were weak. he's told that he and the lower numbers were forced into hiding, made to suffer, to buy nine a little more time. and he's told that in the event he managed to survive that far, he would be nine's inferior--his servant--because he's a lower number.
five talks about how he's superior and deserves to rule everyone else because he has 'potential,' but it's not about how powerful he is because of his legacies; it's that he thinks he's willing to make the right choice. he thinks the idea of treating someone like they don't have a right to that choice because they're inherently worth less than others is absolutely fucking repugnant. and where the mogs get him is by twisting his idea of what constitutes Everyone Being Happy so far that they convince him their cause, which is doing exactly what he hates most, is the one that's fair.
add onto that that he's terrified of the idea that you can in fact just be completely fucked no matter what choices you make, and just gets more and more invested in coping via denial the clearer it becomes that he is the one who is utterly royally fucked no matter what he does, and... well, you get some real unfortunate end results to say the least. but like, that's where he's coming from.
so to wrap this back around to the evangelism metaphor: if you believe what five believes, the idea of someone being willing and able to do what nine does by sending someone to hell regardless of their own choice would be Existentially Horrifying to begin with! but it also goes against one of five's deepest core beliefs, both reasonable and Unfortunate Coping with Trauma. and when you pile that on top of the immense suffering he's gone through over it, the result is going to be visceral burning hatred.
anyway this post is already Long and i've got a lot more thoughts in me about it, but suffice it to say five absolutely is a metaphor for evangelical trauma, and how victims get weaponized into extensions of their church's abuse. and it's an evangelical survivor's nightmare, because the version of hell he's been taught to base his entire worldview around fearing is objectively real. 🥲
(the real smoking gun here? not only is the Great Book a really obvious analogy for the bible, but the name is a retcon. what was it called before that, while he's evangelizing about it no less?)
(the Good Book.)
(welp.)
#lorien legacies#LL number five#LL number nine#LL sandor#LL tag#cws in post#looking back at the characters and parts of the worldbuilding i got most invested in back in the day i am seeing a Pattern#and that pattern is called It's Religious Trauma All the Way Down#on both an individual and community level#the mogadorians and five /could/ have been a really good raw painful narrative about the grief; ugliness; and difficulty holding onto hope#for the culture you grew up in and the people who escaped it and the people who haven't and the people you couldn't help#and for the people who never wanted any part of it to begin with and are having to suffer for your community's systemic upfuck#it's why rereads have left me increasingly soured on adam; and made me appreciate rex more despite his own moral dubiousness#i thought adam represented grief and hope for the culture and community that traumatized you while refusing to go back to them#and instead he represented violent dehumanizing fuck-you-got-mine hatred and victim-blaming for Every Other Victim#instead of 'i recognize that the work of engaging with the community to help the victims inside of it is important and worthwhile'#'but i cannot be the one to do it because i cannot and will not have that community in my life anymore; therefore i will focus my efforts#on helping and protecting people who are targeted by the community from the outside when internal damage control isn't enough'#his narrative was to pull the ladder up after him; then torture every other survivor for the rest of their existence to atone for their sin#which...... hmmmmm....... sounds familiar..............#whereas rex represents being able and willing to go back into the burning building as many times as he needs to#because there are children in there#anyway. subject for another post#dyn: lost boys#dyn: but i'm helping you anyway
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LL incorrect quotes but it’s just quotes from my friend group
John: I’m an old person. My body wakes me up at 6 am
Ella: *quietly and seriously*: My body screams
Nine: *singing* my chick bad my chick hood
Six: stop it
Nine: why
Six: your life depends on it
Eight: Do you eat hotdogs?
Marina: yes
Ella: awww
Nine: I need to get it in this time
Five: Fuck off
Nine: That’s what he said
Five: Fuck off?
Marina: I was more of a befriend the tiramisu kind of girl
Ella: Dude I have like the body length of a Viking
*cicada chirping*
Sandor: What’s that?
Brandon/Henri: That’s called a bug
Adam: If you were going to kys what is the stupidest way you could do it
One: One time I actually used a fork to get my food out of the toaster
Sarah: Don’t give up, chase your dreams!
Five: My dream is giving up
(Nemo to Nine): Your texting style is so different from the way you speak. Except for the number of bitches you use. Bitches remain constant
Sam: The author of my textbook suddenly stopped using the Oxford comma I’m gonna kill myself
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Book Sandor is irredeemable ll
Oooh, hmm, depends on how we define redemption! I am not a religious person so I don't really have strong views on sin as it were, and therefore I feel a bit at a loss as to what can "pay back" for sin specifically and what the objective authority is on that (and of course I would say ASOIAF is similarly undecided).
I don't think that you can ever erase the bad things you've done, though I don't think that's what paying back sin means anyway. In a modern (universal?) context, I do believe in restorative justice, I think you can seek forgiveness from those you have wronged and it's possible that you would be forgiven. I don't think that is likely to happen in ASOIAF, I don't see Sandor going to people he's hurt and asking to be forgiven. Maybe he will feel regret, maybe he already does (I mean I would guess that he already does, whether or not we the reader have directly seen it). He's cynical but his cynicism is torturous to himself, IMO, and that means something. He is still capable of acting in ways that could be argued to be "equal and opposite" of his sins and of making those actions a way of life for himself (in other words, devote himself to good deeds). But he would have to have enough faith in ... existence in general ... to decide to do that in the first place.
I'm a bleeding heart and I tend to believe everyone is capable of change and worthy of more chances. At the same time, not everyone will make those changes, and then there is the issue of whether or not Sandor would ever feel like the society he lives in accepts that he has changed. That would take a lot of visible heroism, and Sandor would have to get over any frustration at having to prove himself to a society of flawed hypocrites if he wanted their acceptance. Really, I'm not sure whose acceptance Sandor wants, and that is part of his tortured nature, he is hurt by things he says he doesn't believe in. If he could decide what he believed in, the next step would be to have the courage to stick to that, regardless of what anyone else said. This is actually a very big thing, just said in simple words. There are always going to be hypocrites, and judgmental people who don't know your specific history, or even much about life in general. Ultimately you have to move past them, and not care if they credit you or not. If Sandor believes that he will never be credited by the authority that counts, he is never going to behave in redemptive ways, and will lose out to despair. It takes a certain courage to believe that you are redeemable, after all.
So I guess my tl;dr is that he is not irredeemable, but that isn't enough to guarantee that he will behave "redemptively", and personally I come from a place of religious agnosticism saying this. I have focused on forgiveness and good behavior as (additive? substitutive? IDK!) qualifications for redemption, reflecting my vague identification with secular humanism. I hope this isn't a wholly disappointing answer! It is a very deep question and I am possibly not a sufficiently deep person 😬
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Okay. Well.
#i mostly like little soft boys i guess 🥺#rat.txt#got sandor#gta trevor#got tormund#soa juice#twd eugene#sv shane#twd milton#mcu steve#ll clyde logan
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Lorien Legacies + Fallout Humor
Setrakus Ra, Adamus Sutekh, Sandor, Number Nine, Number Five, Number Seven, Number Four
#hi Fallout makes me smile#pls appreciate it with me#lorien legacies#i am number four#pittacus lore#john smith#setrakus ra#number seven#marina of the sea#number five#number nine#stanley worthington#sandor#adamus sutekh#my edit#LL edit
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It may be tinfoil but song Bear and the maiden fair song include cunnilingus. Especially the part where the bear taste maid's honey and she kicked, squeal and sigh and started singing. Thoughts?
Could be! My thoughts are it's a song about romanticized non-consensual relations.
I think it's alluding more to Tyrion, Sandor, and Littlefinger than it is to Jon.
Though it's entirely possible we don't have the full story yet.
[Is there any connection between Sansa's story and the song "The Bear and the Maiden Fair"?]
Well, we´ll have to see. - George R. R. Martin (2008)
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yay, laptop!
as i don’t usually post any updates for my fanfics here (because most of the times i update them on ao3 it’s already around 1am or even later in my country and i need to be at work by 9am lol), i came up with an idea to post a weekly-blabbering-on-Sunday-afternoon (yep, it’s late afternoon here) about my updates, fanfics, etc. because sometimes i just like to blabber about them and none of my friends is sharing this fandom with me :C
so, to the business
Call Me by Her Name, otherwise known as that bloody fake-dating christmas-themed fanfic which i wanted to finish by the new year’s eve and still keep going - i really hope i’m approaching the end of it... well, at least i posted another update last week!
i don’t remember now, but i think i mentioned it in the comments to one of the chapters that my initial intention was to make it twice smaller than it is now, but well, once i’ve started something i won’t be able to stop until i wrote e v e r y t h i n g which came to my mind, so here i am, the new year’s eve and both christmas are already over, and i am still working on it, the initial promise of light-hearted fluff lost and forgotten...
btw, as i finally reached my laptop, i managed to apply all the changed to the chapters 1 - 3, so they’re betaed now c:
Don't Forget your Happy Days - even though i mentioned this particular fanfic won’t be updated very often (because the chapters will be huge), i still decided to post the second chapter, so the whole fucked up time-travelling concept will be finally revealed. so yeah, my plans for this fanfic are a little bit monstrous, with Sandor reviving all the events of all books once again - or maybe not reviving, who knows what he could do while being in the past lol :D
buy yeah, i really wanted to put Sandor in this situation, maybe because it was interesting for me to see what changes could happen if it was him who travelled back in time and got a chance to correct his (and maybe not only his) mistakes, or maybe just because i like to write Sandor’s POV very much :’)
The Wife, the Dog, and the Kingdom to Boot - chapter 17 and f i n a l l y s a n s a n i s h a p p e n n i n g - -
well, not a sansan actually, but finally there’s a really important move from Sandor’s side, so now it is a matter of one or two chapters before my children will be finally married :’)
(and i really need to find some time to sit down and reread all the fanfic in order to find some stupid typos and everything like this, writing fanfics on your phone is suffering)
and now i look at ll my fanfics, at everything i wrote here and kind of regret i didn’t ask my friends or family to give me an extra day on the week as my christmas/new year present, as i really need it :’)
anyway, blabbering’s done, thank you for your attention :’D
#sansan#gardakuka blabbers about her fanfics but is so vain that - thanks god - doesn't have any credibility#stupid references now even in my tags#fanfics
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I´ve had a change of heart about Jonerys
Show!Jonerys don’t get exited, i hate the ship in the show , i´ll always will , so please keep scrolling, this is not something you would like
They haven’t meet each other, they are posibly related ,and most people just ship it because they are main girl and boy.
I was an anti because i though it would be the classical :
“I have boobs”
“i don’t”
“WE ARE SOOO PERFECT FOR EACH OTHER”
So...Show!Jonerys ,Show Jonerys will allways be the incarnation of ships i hate
However, GRRM is not D&D , he most of the time knows what he is doing, he is not a master on romance nor healthy relationships but he does give great character dynamics,therefore i don’t see why they won’t work as a pair (romantic or not)
Second thing: they are not each other´s type
Daenerys liked Daario , too flaboyant, not serious and plain looking like Jon
Jon liked Ygritte,Val , (and “vomit” GRRM was going to pair him with Arya in a earlier draft) , and to compare; is not atracted to elegant ,sweet and femenine women like Dany , (thinks Cersei is the most beautiful woman but doesn’t like her as a person even before the events of GoT began ,thinks of Myrcella as dumb and ,not a romantic example but the sibling he likes the least is Sansa who is very similar to Dany) , so it´s safe to asume Jon would find Dany physicaly appealing but personality wise she is not his type.
Yet again, Sansa´s type was pretty boys such as Ser Loras and Joffrey and ended up atractted to Sandor of all people.So the stated before is not an argument against the ship, but that it could be actualy interesting
The other reason i once cited to not like the pairing is because how people compares to Lyanna/Rhaegar , a pairing i despise
But , now with a second tought; it doesn’t matter what the rest of the fandom sees. Jon is not the free spirited Lyanna, Dany is not the selfish asshole Rhaegar. Therefore i found out it was not a reasonable point to hate it. Jon/Dany doesn’t have to be like them
The sole idea of Jon x Dany is boring , dull and cliche to me i , i 100% would rather it not to happen , but a good writer can make a dull concept into something good , and say what you want about GRRM ,but he is a good writer (at least to me).
Besides, hating something that hasn’t happened yet, is just as unreasonable as standing it
So, i´m not a shipper ,there is the huge posibility i won’t like it when the book comes (then again, i don’t read ASOIAF for the romance) but i´m not longer a closed minded anti. I´ll be just in neutral ground hopping that: It doesn’t happen or it turns out to be actualy pretty great.
The good thing is, that if works we will have another thing to add on the list of why the books are ulterly superior to the D&D trash
#a song of ice and fire#daenerys targaryen#jon snow#anti jonerys#just in case#anti game of thrones#anti D&D
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i've been way too tired and all around grody-feeling to write up any proper meta longposts lately, so my 'nine is autistic and adhd as fuck' post that Goes Into It is still in the pipeline, but man if this right here doesn't sum it up
#lorien legacies#LL number nine#LL john smith#LL sandor#he is just tiny your honor......#this moment becomes significantly more 🙃🥲 with canon!nine in the context of Their Dynamic Later On#but whether it is NL!nine or canon!nine it is still precious#anyway yeah said it before and i'll say it again; it's fairly obvious he's Meant to Be adhd-coded but man if that ain't some autism too#it would honestly kind of be great rep if they weren't Like That about him. Giant Impulsive Gotta Move Autistic#who is (meant to be) a charming and fun and likable major protagonist; who is accepted; understood; and accommodated for#by his large friend group and chosen family of whom he is a central pillar#We Could Have Had It Alllllll#LL tag
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seriously though i want to expand ships so if you think one of your muses might fit with sandor UHHHH
te ll me let us Talk about it
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Flash Back Friday Fic #5
This week's fic is a Regency period multi-chapter au. I love canon fics the best, but I am also a sucker for a historical au. We got balls, bonnets, fluff, a hasty marriage, UST, until it becomes RST. 😍😍😍
First Impressions by Veeebles
https://archiveofourown.org/works/4535823/chapters/10322871
Rating: Teen And Up Audiences
Archive Warning: Creator Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings
Category:F/M
Fandom: A Song of Ice and Fire - George R. R. Martin
Relationships: Sandor Clegane/Sansa Stark
Characters: Sandor Clegane, Sansa Stark, Arya Stark, Tyrion Lannister, Joffrey Baratheon, Ned Stark, Catelyn Tully Stark, Bran Stark, Rickon Stark, Lysa Tully Arryn, Robert "Sweetrobin" Arryn, Robert Baratheon, Robb Stark, Jon Snow, Margaery Tyrell, Renly Baratheon, Loras Tyrell, Cersei Lannister, Jaime Lannister, Shae (ASoIaF)
Additional Tags:, mild violence, mentions of abuse, Attempted Rape but not ll bad i promise!pride and prejudice au, wicked earl au, preety gowns, balls, family, protective sandor, joffrey being a meanie, tyrion playing matchmaker
Language: English. Stats: Published:2015-08-09 Completed: 2015-08-09 Words:49269 Chapters:33/33. Comments: 28 Kudos:119. Bookmarks:39. Hits:2880
#flash back friday fic#sansan fic recs#sansan fan fic#sansan#fan fiction recommendations#first Impressions#veeebles
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8.03 a love story
I loved how they left breadcrumbs all along and yet we were too oblivious to see them .... I loved that the dagger that was supposed to end bran s life actually saved him ... I loved that bran knew what 'll happen as well as melisandra and beric ... I loved that he gave the dagger to his sister in the same place in which she defended him ... I loved hunting all the Easter eggs including : "stick them with the pointy end" and "what do we say to the god of death? Not today" and "when I was ten I killed a giant" and "I see eyes that you shut down forever : Brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes" I loved how they made references to previous battles (Jon snow' s scene in the battle of bastards)... i loved how they showed us how arya ll defeat the night king a whole season ahead (arya vs brienne scene ) ... I loved that sansa × tyrion s human and witty scene in the crypts... I loved that ned s sword (ice) defended his castle while used by both brienne and Jaime making them both true to their words and oathkeepers to their vow to lady Cat. I loved how they fought together (vs fighting each other in 3.02). I loved that they had no armor but each other ... I loved melisandre s dramatic entrance and exit... the dance of dragons ❤ ... I loved (In a sad heartbreaking way) that theon died a stark in his home ... and that lyanna mormont was a true giantsbane ... I loved that braime and gendry and ser davos and pod and sandor survived the battle... But most of all I loved that "NO ONE killed the night king" ... that "NO ONE protected sansa"... that NO ONE IS ARYA STARK FROM WINTERFELL and she defended her home ... Ps Djawadi is the true king of westeros ❤❤❤ new osts ; a lot of dubstep during the first scenes after the dothkraki were killed... Arya got a new them ❤❤❤❤ and he just created the perfect soundtrack : the night king. THANK YOU HBO FOR THIS EPIC EPISODE
#Game of thrones#house stark#house lannister#house stargaryen#ser jaime#see Jaime lannister#Jaime x brienne#brienne x jaime#braime#oathkeeper#ice#winterfell#the battle of winterfell#Jon snow#arya stark#no one#sansa stark#gendry#ser bienne of Tarth#ser da vos#the three eyed raven#the crypts#sansa x tyrion#the long night#the night king#bran stark#got#the dance of dragons
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Robb & Sandor
Robb: I am a leader
Sandor: A fear of mine is that I´ll never live up to my true potential...
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fsdfadf i did a height chart with me and my boys lmao
in height order
sandor - 6′6″
kylo and clyde are the same height (obvi) but trevor is also the same height - 6′3″
tormund - 6′
juice - 5′11″
steve - 5′4″
and me!! - 5′
#actually i think adam driver might be 6'2" but i only have 6 figures available lmao#rat.txt#got sandor#sw kylo ren#ll clyde logan#gta trevor#got tormund#soa juice#mcu steve#self shipping#self ship#self shipping community
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