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katyahina · 10 months

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Some (potentially) useful remarks on Healing Church clothes and weapons

1) Situation with Ludwig's sword(s) might be less simple than we used to think!

(I will be using retranslations document ( x ) by Last Protagonist as usual, to avoid losing some nuances)

So, we know that Ludwig was using the 'normie' silver sword that hunters of his type were using as well - the normal one that you stick in a 'sheath' to make a big one, replicating Holy Moonlight sword's transformed design but not glowing. The simplest variant is, of course, that he found Holy Moonlight sword but since he was so jealous and secretive of it, he was MOSTLY using the 'normal' blade. Perhaps, Holy Moonlight sword was only used on special occasions, or treasured away from most people and "consulted" for advice until later when he went mad. I would not say that this description comes from the fact that untransformed versions of the blades are the same, because... they are not:

And I think it mostly works, and it is worth pointing out that as epic as fanart of Ludwig swinging that turquoise-colored shiny sword is, and as simpler as memes using that sword are to get, but within the story it was not likely to happen consistently! But also:

This bit about description of Guidance rune makes things a bit more strange. If he, say, has been exploring the dungeons and found the sword that later inspired him to mass-produce similar swords, what it is about closing his eyes? Is this really about Ludwig just falling asleep before the sword or something? :')

@val-of-the-north suggested there is a possibility that Ludwig was shown the sword by superior forces - likely by Flora / Moon Presence herself, especially since Ludwig was close associate of Laurence, who was, in turn, beckoning Flora for creation of Hunter's Dream to begin with. For one reason or another, Ludwig could have seen the vision of the sword, that inspired him to create a very similar one under inspiration and become Laurence's knight this way. God- For all we know, Laurence might have planned to ""enlighten"" him!! And then, either himself or the hunters he inspired would go to the Chalice Dungeons and discover the REAL thing on their way. It could even be additional justification for why Executioner type of hunters are roaming the dungeons! Speaking of...

2) It is likely that Ludwig never wore Tomb Prospector set!

We know that Ludwig was THE first hunter of the Healing Church, who were a different type of hunters than Old Hunters of Gehrman's type. But at the same time, description of the Executioners clothes says that they were the very fist prototype for ALL following clothes of the Healing Church hunters, especially having inspired the trademark holy shawl:

So, FIRST was the garb of Executioners, THEN came the garb of Tomb Prospectors, at least as we know it!

(Source for Ludwig's model is Bosses Up Close video by XTrin: ( x ))

Additionally, whereas Tomb Prospector set is bought using the Radiant Sword Hunter Badge, it marks people using this badge as 'descendants' of Ludwig:

So, again; first was Ludwig, in Executioner drip, and then Tomb Prospectors, and their attire, were inspired by him. I... see the only way around it; that Ludwig was wearing Executioner clothes initially, and later wore Tomb Prospector set on his adventures, but when he was back, he also was wearing his normal set.

Interestingly, though, clothes of Executioners keep hinting at Rogeriusz/Logarius, despite him being... well, at the very least, SECOND known Healing Church hunter.

Whatever is the reason of Logarius being met in drastically different clothes, but the statue implied to be him, to which Alfred lays a crown at the end of his mad quest, IS depicted in Executioner clothes. Albeit, with far more robe-like feeling to it than how we see it on Alfred's example. Maybe for a different vibe, maybe Logaius always has been a bit more wizard-like, whichever you think it is!

It is hard to say which one is true, as we are with two variants:

one. Logarius was not the first hunter, but he was the first staff (court wizard?? lol), therefore set the trend of clothes, that Ludwig took upon as a hunter.

two. Ludwig is accursed, he fell from grace and was hated and forgotten as blood-possessed beast; meanwhile, Alfred alone is a good proof that Logarius is still honored and respected! So, perhaps, these clothes came to be associated with Executioners of Logarius instead, since Logarius (undeservingly so) pushed Ludwig from the place of admireable figure! Was it just society's sentiment, or a deliberate political action, hard to tell...

I am more fond of the second variant, and funny enough, this brings me to the next point I want to make:

3) It is likely that Healing Church's saints started wearing crowns thanks to Logarius.

Alright, this one is also slightly lost in translation, since not only the name of the item is different (which can be distracting), but also a sentense is missing in English localization.

Healing Church "sacrificing" someone would imply them giving away something treasured for them, so odds are, they would give away bodies of their saints to them roaming Pthumerians in the dungeons, instead of doing proper burial! The 'they are oddly stimulated by the stench of dead saints' also makes me think of this bit:

(Interview with Miyazaki ( x ))

If this was very special quality of blood what Pthumerian Watchers are after, then sure the saints would be the best; not only as very avid consumers of the holy blood, but also as those 'holding back' on transforming into a beast the most, which would sure make it special.

Additionally, you could use this intention, though it is a bit more vague: when Bloodborne was still a sequel for Demon Souls, Laurence's skull was going to not only look more human, but also have a crown on it:

youtube

Yeah, the simpler times when we had demon-like enemies, when Gasc and Mico would say 'Umbasa', all that.

But even cut content aside, the lore as we have it specifies that there were saints who worn crowns (and fancy rings and wrist accessories)! My lucky guess is that after Cainhurst was massacred, the saints of the Healing Church were... to put it in the most blunt way possible, qualified to declare themselves new aristocracy/rulers/whatever. Maybe it was to establish theocracy and their reign as new most influental figures, maybe it was to honor Logarius who started wearing the crown of the murdered King after his crusade, maybe it was both.

...besides, it means there were so many important saint figures in the Healing Church in the timespan from Cainhurst falling to Paleblood Hunter arriving. We seem to meet Emilia/ Amelia at the very end of whatever authority Healing Church still had, with no seen successors, and current Healing Church hunters chief being Cleric Beast on the bridge... Before this point of time, though? It is an aviary for OCs of the size I can't even describe x)

4) There is a reason why Black Church Servants have a more "dangerous" weapon despite 'black' being lower rank to 'white'.

I am talking about these guys, and their annoying Crucifix weapon that activates Frenzy buildup.

It did not quite make it in the final game, presumably because there were only so many ways to make a proper mace-like weapon, but in the concept, Bloodletter was looking a lot like this as well:

I just want to point out that the 'expelling bad blood' aspect is QUITE important here! Bloodletter causes the user to get Frenzy buildup, much like the Crucifix used by Black Church Servants. And the reason it is believed to "help" with the "bad" blood? The fact that Frenzy is connected with the hunt!

I talked about it more in this ( x ) and this ( x ) post, but TLDR; Frenzy spears are literal weapons manifesting from the person's very blood solidfying, Oedon the Great One is inextricably tied with the bloodshed and bullets and the Hunt itself, and blood itself seems to solidfy into those spears bit by bit.

So, they might have ended believing that what deliberately causing Frenzy would do is to unleash whatever it was in person that was getting corrupted - and thus, more subjective to beasthood. Especially, that would work with Black Church, who were "preventive":

4.1) Just like that, White Church Servants correlate with what White Church Doctors do.

The lamp is especially interesting detail, as it is harmless, and only hurts you with the Arcane projectile when you have enough Insight. Meanwhile, Frenzy does hurt stronger the more Insight you have... Truly, in Bloodborne, the Hunt and Eldrich Truth, the Beasts and Kin are simply two sides of the same coin... Just two outcomes in the same corrupt deity's vicious plan.

5) Use or not, but male Church Doctor clothes have weird similarities with 'foreigner clothes'.

It is hard to confirm of deny anything here... Brador has five buttons but Black Church Doctor has four; similarly, the foreigner set our Hunter arrives in has five buttons and White Church Doctor has four. They're the same striped type of a vest though, and they have the same type of buttons, athough Church's is sewn with dark threads but foreigner is with brighter.

It could have been an intentional reference that either was abandoned or is so hard to decipher that we will never get there. We only have subtle hooks towards Paleblood Hunter being not loreless; such as Cainhurst summon we find in the room we woke up at having OUR name written in it, with one of the Cainhurst portraits featuring Golden Pendant adn Church's necklace. I am always lost with the ideas of what might have went down in the past..... or whether 'we' are secretly related to Brador or his land, bwahaha!

6) They ARE, all in all, DOCTORS clothes.

I find it a bit... harder to tell what DO hunters of the Healing Church wear? We find only so many of the NPCs that wear Healing Church Doctor clothes: for black set it is two black hunters in Research Hall (female and male), one guy in Nightmare Frontier and Adella who has no hunting weapons, for white set it is a praying lady in Research Hall and Imposter Iosefka + likely real Iosefka too, that also doesn't hunt. Seven characters, FIVE of which are confirmed to be associated with medicine (...six if being a Blood Nun counts...?); three characters in Research Hall, one is stated to be a doctor, one is a nun, one does Kin experiments that originated from Research Hall.

Would not put the Black Church guy in the Frontier as a drastic contradiction. What I am saying is, they might not even qualify as hunters. Logically, they'd have weapons and get some self-defence skills as they HAVE to kill (people, less so beasts!). Iosefka is never confirmed to fight, Adella uses normie dagger and not even a legit weapon, and four from the remaining five are reclused to the indoors places.

Mostly, I am thinking as I am writing it, as there is an interesting character - Henriett! She is wearing the clothes descending in design from Old Hunters type (not Healing Church type!), yet she has Church weapons (Repeating Pistol and Kirkhammer) and helps to beat Amelia, Ludwig and Laurence. I always felt like she used to be Healing Church's hunter but found something she should not have and detracted... And I presumed she used to wear Black Church clothes (trousers variant to be practical). Buuuuut.

I might actually take this back. Depending on the interpretation, the current hunters of BEASTS, not of PEOPLE that "might" be beasts etc, could either 1) wear Executioner garb like Alfred does 2) wear unique clothes that is yet to be designed, but might be similar to Executioners garb, for example, design mix of doctors' and Executioners, or TOTALLY unique clothing like Gascoigne for example 3) actually wear 'Hunter' set like Henriett and our Paleblood Hunter from promo materials after changing their foreign garb.

On the other hand, Henriett having been one of them paranoids eliminating people falling for beasthood and then snapping out of it could make such a mess of a character's backstory. Not to mention that some Black "doctors" (and occasional White ones) did blend in with Huntsmen mobs, in chaotic mess of no longer being able to tell where is a friend and where is an enemy. No longer caring for those 'showing' signs of beasthood but only those who fully turned. And foreigners, of course! Like, maybe the 'they are not hunters but so-called "doctors" point USED TO be relevant in Old Hunters era, but during the game events it is not relevant ANYMORE, as Yharnam is basically anarchy now.

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Alright, I think I compiled what I had to say!

Mostly, I made this post for the reference to myself as an artist and a writer, and for my friends that might find it useful, but I decided to put it here just in case if someone else could find something here! Also, a headcanon: whereas Ludwig's Holy Blade was based of the OG Holy Moonlight Sword, the Kirkhammer instead was based off the hammer the Pthumerian creator of Holy Moonlight Sword used to forge it! It was discovered waaaay down there. Because Loran already met Yharnam's fate once. Maybe, somewhere in Yharnam, there is still the 'original' Hammer. And it glows in red upon tranforming, rather than how the sword glows in turquoise!

#bloodborne #bloodborne theory #ludwig the holy blade #old hunter henriett #black church servant #white church servant #brador church assassin #bloodborne observations #not art #text post #hhhhhhh sorry i barely use this blog anymore #i always sit in my personal for some reason.....#don't know how to get in the swing of getting to post here regularly like i used to...#after 2022 life simply turned somewhere wrong #Youtube

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sinecosinewheel · 6 months

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happy 'my phone finally broke for real and i need to get it replaced' day have some old sketches to celebrate

#bloodborne #dark souls #soulsborne #vicar amelia #old hunter henriett #laurence the first vicar #sirris of the sunless realms #blood #wheelart #my art #wheeldoodle #first two are bloodborne second two are from the last time i played ds3 (several months ago)#with my henriett design i was sort of going for haunted porcelain doll #and the ring thing was based on real events #ok bye

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emberizidaemelo · 4 months

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#micolash host of the nightmare #mensis scholar damian #edgar choir intelligencer #old hunter henriett #bloodborne #my art

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katyspersonal · 25 days

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For Fausefka!

9. Does this character remind you of anyone you know? Does that affect how you see them?

10. Do you see yourself in this character even without projecting?

For Henriett!

11. How did you “fall in love” with this character?

12. If you could write effortlessly and as much as you wanted, what story (s) would you write for this character?

(Asks from this ( x ) meme)

For Fauxsefka

9) Does this character remind you of anyone you know? Does that affect how you see them?

She used to, specifically the idea in my mind of her being the initiator behind obliterating Rom's authority in the Choir after having learned that she "allowed Micolash to get away" and even has been hiding his secrets! It was about the way she was very radical on "choir bad mensis good" and never allowed Rom to defend her point. It reminded me of a certain kind of people that is impossible to debate! Later though, not only her taking the lead clashed with Yurie and Ebrietas being literally right there, but I've found a better way to utilise her strong religious (???) position in a story! Though, perhaps, how these conflicts tend to go will find another way to manifest in the story later?

10) Do you see yourself in this character even without projecting?

No :> And never again. In fact, the big contributor in my admiration for her IS how I could never be her! I always write nearly poems about a type of Soulsborne character that has the 'courage' to transcend even the very basic norms of morality and humanity for greater good, and the moment I've learned Miyazaki called her 'heroic' I could tell why. I am more of a "coward" in this regard. To the better or worse? It is hard to tell. I just always envied the kind of courage that allows to not only overcome the peer pressure entirely, but even your own conscience. I am more like real Iosefka, quietly hoping and researching for the "compromise", unable to do something drastic.

For Henriett

11) How did you “fall in love” with this character?

When I've learned about the implication of her having once been the part of the Healing Church, and then abandoning it to be a hunter, not unlike Gascoigne! This character tells a story without a single line of dialogue, just with her items, set and summon locations! Say all you want about the fan-wiki that inserts their """unasked for""" theories within the objective facts, but in my earlier days THAT was what made me pay attention to it! xD I love the character that can see through the cracks of what they've previously knew and take action! Perceptive type that is not afraid to strongly change to the better, and heck, even 'betray' the friends that choose to live in lies.

12) If you could write effortlessly and as much as you wanted, what story (s) would you write for this character?

There are a few stories I'd love to put in a proper fanfic form! Her life as Healing Church hunter alongside Alfred, and how they've started to research more on people of the past and ended by opposing sides of the "conflict", that would also include prologue/childhood memory of her first having a hunch as a young teen together with Amelia. The story about her and Iosefka trying to contact 'the first hunter stuck in the dream, or so the legend goes' through the weird mirror ritual but it backfiring terribly and them having to get out from Nightmare of Mensis (actually has a thing I even consider 'spoilery' hahahaha). AU-ish story where not only Bloody Crow never kills her, but even gains some sort of 'influence' in his covenant to recover Cainhurst from the shambles, and she is caught between his ideas and Eileen's (more about what the heck am I talking about here ( x )). Her trying and failing to fit within the League!

She is just such an interesting character to work with.. Very cool backstory potential, very vivid image of her personality in my mind! Thank you for asking about the girls!

#bloodborne #ask replies #imposter iosefka #old hunter henriett

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headcanontheshitoutofsoulsborne · 2 months

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Old Hunter Henriett drinks like a fish. While she tends to keep to herself for the most part, she will happily oblige in sharing a drink and sharing stories.

As such, she winds up becoming good friends with Gascoigne, as he, too; enjoys a drink and sharing stories.

#bloodborne #old hunter henriett #father gascoigne #headcanon

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fantomette22 · 6 months

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25. Old hunter Henriett

#bloodborne #my art #my inktober #fantomette22art #inktober #inktober 2023 #drawtober #old hunter henriett

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nishihii · 4 months

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6 belts

#bloodborne #old hunter henriett #she does NOT want her posture fucked

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thebrightestlodge · 8 months

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More thoughts on Old Hunter Henriett and Vicar Amelia. My city now, my city of "women being strange about their interactions". Henriett makes it her personal job to make sure someone takes care of Amelia. Amelia doesn't understand why her sole friend cares so much, especially considering she treats her like a person now

#bloodborne #vicar amelia #old hunter henriett #my doodles

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fareehaandspaniards · 4 months

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Hold up, you like Valtr x Henriett too???? I should have guessed because you are one of the last surviving 5 people that aren't restrained by age gaps in shipping but still I thought it was TOO obscure hghjhjk

That's my SECRET side xD I may talk about Damian mostly, since I have a thing for white-haired (blonde) grandpas who are rather evil sexy lords or pure angels. BUT(T). I enjoy really many ships and characters that I never mentioned because I never have enough energy to talk about ALL of them... (in 95% of times I need a lot of energy just to talk so yeah I want to tell a lot but often forget or don't have energy for that)

I am secretly big enjoyer of Valtr, Henryk, Yamamura, Tomb Prospector Olek (lol), Arianna equally with Adella, big FAN of Yurie, Eileen and Bloody Crow of Cainhurst, Ludwig... and etc!

So YES Valtr x Henriett ship looks hot (as you said age gap doesn't scare me. It makes ship even hotter than it was. I don't understand people who scream when two characters who are in love aren't the same age. And by "scream" I mean publicly shaming anyone who ships couples like that! Hope after this I won't receive a message from anon like "SO you can ship 10 y.o. girl yeah???? If age gap in a relationship is cool then you ship kids right????!" because it's pure absurd and hysteria. Age gap is always perceived by fandom-society like something AWFUL, DISGUSTING and mostly by people who enjoy even more weird kinks)

(And you might ship 18 y.o. character with a 2000000010010903 y.o. eternal being and everything is fine for a fandom while eternal being looks sexy BUT WHEN IT COMES TO GRANDDILFS, PEOPLE ARE BEING BITC-)

(sorry it's not a vent post :'D Completely changed the topic)

I can't say I know much about Henriett except for her being beatiful and her connection with Amelia, Ludwig and Laurence. Also she has something against League. And this shit when two fantoms can't be summoned simultaneously makes me go HURRRRR because you know the two have something between them???

She gives me vibes of hmmm... Irene Adler who is now Sherlock Holmes? I remember Crow drew Henriett for you mentioning Shelock Holmes and now this is stuck in my head. Stoic, beautiful young lady who is interested in justice for all. From a good family, maybe even noble, but who chose a path of a Hunter with her huge weapon. I headcanon Valtr to be her former "mentor" until she found out that League is built on his insanity and he can't even see evil bugs himself. Disappointing :с Her vibe is like:

Also I thought that Gehrman/Maria also has a vibe of a teacher/student, but with gehrmaria it's more about romantical guiding the one you love with both mutual respect and tenderness. While these two have... Have some problems with that. I headcanon Valtr as a person who was REALLY interested in Henriett, but could show it through mumbling and telling her his own vision of the world and wanting from her to join him in everything, while she has own plans and ambitions, for example aeeeehhh destroy the wicked ones from the Church? haha so funny, unless...

Anyway good ship.

Little ambitious lady who is ready to kick some asses and tall sad unstable man, who has issues

#my art #funny #mutuals #ask #valtr master of the league #old hunter henriett #bloodborne #bloodborne headcanons

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