After seeing this video I had to look up Nimoy's guest appearance on T.J. Hooker (1983) and was NOT disappointed!!

SNW has left me scared. It is going to take time to heal.

In the 1960s we saw all these characters Spock, Uhura, Kirk, Chapel,Pike, Scotty. Regardless of what you thought about gay couples, if you believed in tolerance Spirk gave you hope from watching Star Trek in the 1960s.

The Spirk pairing is the grand dad of slash. If you did not like slash and wanted to pair spock with a girl. Uhura>>>>>>>>>Chapel. Finally, There was a black girl in the 1960s who people were willing to pair with Spock or Kirk over any other girl. A black girl who was not a maid or a slave on TV, but a black female character that was shown to be the beauty and the brains . This was groundbreaking. Still is.

We did not need the JJ Verse films to push a spock/uhura romance, we can just compare the Spock/Chapel and Spock/Uhura scene from TOS to realise Uhura was the better female character to pair Spock with, if you did not se as gay for Kirk.

This was in the 60s when gay marriages or even interracial relationship were still illegal, frowned upon. Yet Trek chose to be progressive in the 60s by floating the idea of a gay and interracial pairing that fans can play with.

Fast forward 2023, we are now backwards to the 1950s were it is about worshiping the hot blonde woman that society has been doing for hundred of years. A woman who Spock already rejected in the 1960s. The woman Spock would never have been with even if he had the chance. the woman that was not even a big part of spock's life like the main crew he still carried photos off till his death.

I am a minority,a person of colour. I knew how important Uhura meant to women of colour and why she was the lead female in TOS and all the guys liked and respected her.

Since when is Chapel, sexy? can fight Klingon and Gorns? She is meant to even be a nurse.

SNW claims it is progressive but all what the show has done is take a lot from the black girl (Uhura) and the potential gay guy(Kirk) and merged their traits into SNW Chapel, all to push the spock/chapel thing that fans and writers already rejected in the 60s.

I feel a lot of black fans, especially black female star trek fans who watch SNW are going to be traumatised- because again, we are seeing society and hollywood still pushing the narrative that the hot blonde woman will always win, always get the guy, always be the status quo.

In the 1960s TOS Uhura challenged this narrative as not necessarily the truth. This is the reason she was far more popular as a character than Chapel. Nearly 60s years later SNW has told us ....yes, that is the truth. the hot blonde women still wins the war, you women of colour only win battles.

As a trek fan who came to respect the spirk pairing and the spuhura paring because they did not represent the status quo-as both pairing been a gay and interracial couple. I am not sure I can ever look at TOS the same again, knowing how the prequel has re-written the narrative. spock should not even be paired with Uhura in SNW either but please anyone but Chapel.

I am sorry but the spock/chapel pairing is an assault and an insult to gay and interracial couples

honestly I don't know about most of this but "I am not sure I can ever look at TOS the same again, knowing how the prequel has re-written the narrative. spock should not even be paired with Uhura in SNW either but please anyone but Chapel."

I cannot stand by that statement. Its frankly disgusting that you are praising TOS!Uhura but still shitting on SNW!Uhura.

Personally I ship T'Pring/Spock and I think that Chapel doesn't even know what she wants (but that she doesn't want to be tied down to anyone at all, like she's even reluctant to have The Talk with spock).

Frankly I think its unfair of Chapel to be playing with spocks feelings (that song about wanting her freedom? hello) but also I'm willing to wait to see if we get a new take on TOS after SNW. I think they should do it just so that we can get justice for Sulu and Uhura (who lets face it were basically sexy lampshades in TOS).

But again your comment that Spock shouldn't be with Uhura... is plain misogynoir. I'm willing to wait for a slow burn romance. And right now they're solidly in the friends phase and I would love to see it blossom into the flirty/romantic gazes we see in TOS (if they opted to redo the original show). I think that spock is figuring out his shit right now but as much as I'm angry that they turned Chapel into a manic pixie dream girl I don't think its an assault to gay and interracial ships.

Like in my mind I can see Spock getting traumatized by Chapel and being afraid to pursue Uhura towards the end of SNW even though he has great respect for her because Uhura is his subordinate.

But if I see you come back in my inbox with this divisive bullshit again I'm just gonna delete you. We don't need these goddamn shipping wars. We're not running this blog so you can spew your misogynoir unchecked.

mod laina

What are some reasons to actually like Spirk + Star Trek?

I'm an ORV fan but I used to watch Voyager as a kid and I've seen a one or two of the newer movies a few years back (dark something something?) I stayed away from the Star Trek fandom as an adult because I mainly associated it with racism and misogynistic nerd guys.

Hi, anon. Sorry if this ask will take a long time to appear, English is not my first language an I am bad with words on a good day.

You're probably thinking of Into Darkness. It's the second reboot movie. There's a lot of different opinions about those lmao. Personally, I love them even though they do have bad bad points, but then again, I love everything about Star Trek, even at its worst.

There's no denying that there was a bit of period-typical misogyny in the original Star Trek, and it got worse in the long run after Rick Berman was selected for production. Latent misogyny, hetero and amatonormativity, as any 60-to-90s show does. To deny that would be stupid. But.

Star Trek was one of, if not the first, tv programs to depict people of different races working together, as equal as they could get in a military-like setting, in a time when segregation and Cold War were still a thing. A Black woman, an Asian man, a Russian one, a Scottish one, all holding a major position in a government vessel, all iconic characters to this day. Censorship never let him, but Gene Roddenberry, the original creator, always intended to include queer people in ST, as I will explain better later. ‌The original series had episodes which very clearly condemned nazism, racism, the Vietnam war, genocide. The Ferengi race of the Next Generation were created to be a satire of western capitalists but were wrongly pegged as an antisemitic stereotype. If a major character is disabled, they have accomodations made for them, they don't have their disability erased, though I hear that Strange New World kind of fucked that up. An episode of TNG was in protest of conversion therapy though people didn't like how it ended. A major theme of Deep Space Nine revolves around colonialism. It had the first black protagonist (commander and later captain); the first female first officer in the franchise to have a major role, who formerly fought in a resistance movement against a the occupation of her planet by a fascist imperialist race; the first trans woman in all but designation, who btw very much kissed another woman in an absolutely iconic scene; a canonically very neurodivergent doctor. Voyager had the first female captain to star in a series. Seven of Nine's character is particularly dear to me because while it's obvious that she was added mainly to boost and entice the male audience with her sex appeal (and well, I am sapphic and far from immune), it's also obvious how much the writers and Jeri Ryan cared for her storyline and growth. She's such a complex character, I really love her. Seven-centric episodes are always a treat for me. I can't remember anything else off the top of my head, sorry abt that (I also haven't watched Enterprise and the newest series yet so I can't talk about that).

Does ST have bad moments? Misogynistic, racist, homophobic, ableist, amatonormative moments? Hell yes. Some episodes are really cringy and have very bad writing. But there are more good ones than not, and those are the ones I live for, the ones that can give you a message that stays with you, where there was somebody in the crew/cast who read the script, saw something terrible, and went "this will not pass on my watch" and worked together to fix whatever they could. I'm sorry if your experience with Star Trek was with dudebros who think "the woke of the latest series ruined the franchise".

Now, about K/S. I believe with all my heart that nobody needs a reason to ship any two or more characters together. That said, I think Spirk is one of those ships where you have to wear anti-ship goggles not to see the potential (but no big deal if you don't). They touch each other all the time, they risk their life and career multiple times to save the other. This is not inherently a sign of non platonic feelings, and they sure aren't canon as we usually mean it, but.

Writers sure had a field day sprinkling suggestive bits (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) all throughout the franchise, especially queer writers (Theodore Sturgeon, writer of Amok Time and Shore Leave, may his soul be blessed for all eternity).

Bonus for how they look at each other. (1) (2) (3) (4)

Roddenberry himself described their relationship as one of love. It's not mentioned in the series, but in the books it's revealed that they share a telepathic bond that connects their souls, which in Vulcan culture is called t'hy'la which can mean "friend, brother, lover". This definition was created specifically for the two of them, so this is a very obvious wink/nudge, if not an outright acknowledgement that "yes they're in love, but homophobia exists so this is all we can do."

In The Motion Picture when Kirk looks at Spock like a lovesick puppy after a long separation, and the simple feeling not much later.

And can anyone dare to say that those death scenes from The Wrath of Khan and Into Darkness are supposed to be platonic, or what Kirk says about Spock at the beginning of The Search for Spock, that his death feels like he lost "the noblest part of his soul"? And what about "Not in front of the Klingons"??

The books, too, have some very interesting nuance.

Sooooo yeah I absolutely think that Spirk is and will always be the one ship that best comes to mind when it comes to ST. In my eyes and in those of a lot of people they're canon in every way that matters, and if either of them had been female there would have 100% been a marriage in one of the movies, à la Riker/Troi. They'll forever be my ST otp, though I'll occasionally indulge a little bit of Spones and McSpirk. I could even like and reblog other ships like McKirk or Spuhura but only in fanart and only in moderation. I personally wouldn't be interested in reading fanfiction about those. But every ship is valid and equal in fandom, and none is superior just because it's canon and/or had a major role in the birth of shipping culture. Which is the very point all this behemoth of a post originated from, I guess.

This.... Has turned into way more than I thought. Sorry about thay. I hope my answer was satisfactory, anon. Also that I didn't bore you. Hope you have a great day, and thank you for reaching out. ❤️🖖

Hi! It's me again (I promise I am not an exhibitionist ^^" I just can't send you a private message for some reason).

I really haven't gotten any notification so thank you very much for the public answer (sometimes I think Tumblr has something against me personally).

Czech is a beautiful language! I don't know anything about it, but my eyes get heartshaped whenever I hear it or about it (and it was my second choice for the BA degree).

I think I have an idea why the first series are special to you. As I said, I haven't yet watched anything else to compare it with, but I have the feeling that it's in those episodes when the writers care the least about the team and the most about the plot. I mean that the episodes are Kirk centered (even Bones is only occasiononaly present and Uhura, Sulu and Scotty barely communicate with both Spock and Kirk) and I have yet to see a bad episode without a serious message. I know that this will change and I am actually a bit scared by it. Cause when I started watching I thought I was up for silly funny friendiship-tenderness-banter stories that could be pleasantly interpreted as ships. I wasn't really prepared for the complexity of characters' feelings or the tragedy of their choices. I am mesmerized by it. (But maybe I am all wrong and you have a different perception. Would you care to share? :)

Actually, now I really don't get it how like the 80% of fandom only cares for spirk having sex. I mean it is beautiful outside of TOS (and I am forever grateful for all those weeks on ao3) but that is the most boring hc you can have in TOS. You should really be in the 60's and consider gay sex taboo to make it exiting. To be honest, I haven't thought about TOS spones or mcspirk either, but I read a couple of your works last night (it was a really nice escapism night, thank you) and you've made both couples look very interesting (I am honestly looking forward to the new chapters of the spones slow burn work-in-progress). I am especially fond of your style! It's both very delicate and very TOS. It didn't feel wrong even in this missing scene from the Consciousness of the King and I have just watched the episode. I loved especially how Kirk wanted Kodos to be killed and maybe even wanted to see him watch his daughter suffer. I think I disagree with you on the subject of Kodos but it only makes it more interesting.

Huh, this got a bit out of control... I am very sorry!

Hi! I think it might be connected to the fact that you don't appear in notifications? Even when you reblog a post of mine, no one can see you liked/reblogged it in the post itself… I'm not sure if this is what shadowbanned means, but it's possible that it's something like that…

The reason why I like the first half is kinda similar to what you said. Part of the reason is that the episodes are Kirk-centric (but that doesn't really change later, the whole show is Kirk-centric, actually, he's the star after all), but the other reason is that more than the rest of the show, these episodes are actually those where you can see the life on the Enterprise, where you can see supporting characters interacting, where you get glimpses of what TOS could be if it was an ensemble show. There are also some personal reasons, mostly related to McCoy and how much I love his and Kirk's scenes in early s1, but after the writers realized that Spock and McCoy have a fun dynamic, they started to increase that, while lowering Kirk&McCoy scenes…

There are still plenty of good episodes later, with good messages (I think the pop-culture version of Trek is very subtle, almost nonexistent, actually, there are a few episodes like that, but it’s not the majority), but with the change of the showrunner (not sure if that's the correct term lol but yeah), the second season got a bit lighter and fun, and the 3rd season got slightly depressing with its themes and the empty and dying planets, and it focused primarily on the trio only. The show just evolved (even though most of the changes were caused by egos lol)

I mean, I don't watch TOS and think that spones or mckirk have sex, I don't see anything in the show as romantic (nothing reads that way), but it's fun to think what IF because that's what's shipping about to me, and the spones dynamic and the mckirk dynamic are compelling to me on different and various levels (not necessarily just romantic/sexual). So it's fun to try and figure out if I can get them somewhat together in a way I'd enjoy. I have nothing against s/k as a ship (I feel like I always need to make sure that people understand this), I just don't find anything interesting about them as a romantic ship - probably the same way as most people don't find anything interesting about tos!mckirk lol (the never actually experienced simple friendship without subordinate/superior shadows that's part of the show/films is way more compelling tbh, but it's not like you can find that in fanfics, not that I tried though lol but considering everything…) But I dislike the fanon portrayal, and I dislike how aggressive some fans are, so I just prefer not to speak about it with others (I occasionally do make a post about some aspects of their friendship I enjoy though), even if it's just friendship, because I have different opinions, and I blacklist all mentions of it. (it took me a moment to figure out why your ask didn't show for me on my computer, since Tumblr Savior hides all mentions of sp1rk (and variations) for me lol)

I'm glad you had fun with my fics and that the relationships worked for you! I see Kirk as an unreliable narrator in that Conscience of the King fic, so not everything he thinks about Kodos is necessarily true. And his fondness for Lenore made it even more difficult to know what to really do when confronted with someone who could be Kodos.

I hope that my love for spones will come back soon, so that I can work some more on that wip!

ETA: I want to also add that I don’t think there’s anything weird or boring about only watching a show because of a ship or a character and having that as the primary interest. It’s practically what I do too on a perhaps a different scale, but it’s not really different.

About writing spirk and the HR rule: one way I've seen it done is to have them keep it not exactly secret, but unsaid and really muted. The way they approach its impact on their work is that the feelings were there before and they still were able to let the other go into danger, so they didn't see it as a problem in that sense and had no need to make Command aware of it. Another loophole was something about Vulcan having added a law to prevent bonded pairs from being parted, but I don't know if that falls within the realm of what you're comfortable with. Another was them not really dating but acknowledging their feelings and only getting together officially when they become academy professors later on. I guess it depends on whether you want them to live together and/or officially. How dark it is would depend on whether they're happy with it or not rather than the solution itself. I wish I'd saved the fics I'm half-remembering, sorry

It's ok, thank you for taking the time to respond! I think maybe the best solution is to have it be a secret that everyone knows sort of thing, where no one tells command and it's not really out in the open (for what i want to do).

I've seen posts about the musical around tumblr but I never really understood what was happening. The terms "Star Trek" and "Musical" put together however make me want to scream with joy. I'm sorry if you already got asked this, but what is the musical exactly and how can I praticipate? Thank you!!

Okay, so the musical is a thing that is happening in which we make a musical where its Star Trek and canon Spirk tkainf place with Journy to Babel. While the odds are astronomical that it could actuallt happen we're still doing it.

Here's the cast list.

SEINK the vulcan bard/ HARPIST

SPOCK - @fandoms-of-a-random-existence

AMANDA

SAREK - @inner-space-oddity / @mikes-current-obsession

JIM KIRK - @that-alien-that-exists

SCOTTY - @firstruleofcloneclub-felixisking

HENDORFF/BASS GUITARIST

BONES - @spocks-eyeshadow

CHEKHOV - @gender-snatched

SULU

UHURA - @debrie

CHRISTINE CHAPEL - @earl-grey-is-my-middle-name

ALIEN DELEGATE WITH A GROTESQUE LUMP ON THEIR HEAD

WORF

DATA -@bi-peregrin

GEORDI -@justalonelymusicnerd

DOCTOR CRUSHER

STABBY THE ROOMBA - @iamwaytoointostartrek

ORION MALE

INSPECTOR NAME - @mae-the-bass-clarinetist

VILLA NESS

ALIEN PRINCESS - @bangtanbambi

As a spuhura shipper who also enjoys spirk etc. it's very hard to find Post spuhura spirk or mcspirk or mcspock ships that don't rely on uhura bashing which often verges on racism or is not outright racist. I don't agree with the rabid cruelty towards people just writing their ship but it does get tiring. Or they make her a xenophobe (like huh?). I'd also say that as a person who isn't a spuhura shipper you probably haven't seen the horrid comments spuhura writers get (mostly ffnet like 5 to 10 years ago to be fair not so much ao3 these days but still sometimes).

I guess what I'm saying is that if bashing or ooc behaviour was labeled the average sensible fanfic reader would probably avoid. But then people on the net like to get mad so who knows. If people were abusive to you I'm so sorry you don't deserve that.

Ship and let ship I say and if you don't like it block the tag or writer don't be a massive turd.

I dont disagree with anything you said

At the same time, i make a very distinctive effort not to bash on uhura because i love her as a character im just not a fan of that ship and i hate the portrayal in the 2009 movies

I have had people go out of their way to call me racist simply because im not fond of the ship, and its clear those people have never read my fics. I dont see the comments because unlike most people on the internet, i dont go out of my way to find things om not fond of, so no i havent read fics about a ship i dont like. I very much avoid it so i dont squick others yum because thats the courteous thing to do

Idk if you were trying to imply i was being a massive turd but i hope not considering the precautions i took to make sure that opinion was only found by people who follow my blog and already know my history of problems with sp*hura shippers

I do not agree with or condone the way sp*hura shippers have been treated by the fandom, and i understand that when youve been kicked so many times every shadow looks like a foot, but idk im pretty tired of being attacked unprovoked myself just because i said something not incredibly enthusiastic about uhura or sp*huras portrayal. I dont yuck your yum, why are you yucking mine?