#anti jaehaerys targaryen
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patterns of abuse with jaehaerys
this post made me deeply depressed and i reread f&b which was my first mistake.
tldr i’m making the argument that jaehaerys definitely sexually abused saera and alysanne, and likely viserra and gael, and also i hate this man. if you disagree and want to say so *nicely* that’s cool but if you hardcore love jae and don’t want to hear criticism, maybe just scroll past bc i’m not nice to him at all (obviously, i’m accusing him of csa lol).
breaking this down by each woman, so there’s 6 sections: saera, viserra, daella, gael, alysanne, and alicent.
saera targaryen
If she were the king’s firstborn, or better still his only child, she would be well content. Instead she finds herself the ninthborn, with six living siblings who are older than her and even more adored. Aemon is to be king, Baelon most like will be his Hand, Alyssa may be all her mother is and more, Vaegon is more learned than she is, Maegelle is holier, and Daella…when does a day go by when Daella is not in need of comfort? And whilst she is being soothed, Saera is being ignored. Such a fierce little thing she is, they say, she has no need of comfort. They are wrong in that, I fear. All men need comfort.
that’s septon barth’s opinion on her and barth is always right. simply put, she’s a deeply neglected child who acts like a brat to get her parents attention because she’s learned the only way they’ll pay attention to her is if she’s causing a problem.
Before she was eleven, she was stealing wine and ale instead. By twelve, she was like as not to arrive drunk when summoned to the sept for prayer.
The king’s half-witted fool, Tom Turnip, was the victim of many of her japes, and her unwitting catspaw for others. Once, before a great feast where many lords and ladies were to be in attendance, she persuaded Tom that it would be much funnier if he performed naked. It was not well received.
stealing alcohol at 10 and being a committed alcoholic at 12 is not normal behavior. it is a sign of something deeply at wrong at home. also, the way she kind of, sexually humiliated tom, someone who is too “innocent” to even realize she’s sexually humiliating him…gives me the ick re: how she views sex.
Saera had learned the art of getting anything she wanted from her father: a kitten, a hound, a pony, a hawk, a horse (Jaehaerys did draw a firm line at the elephant). Queen Alysanne was far less gullible, however, and Septon Barth tells us that Saera’s sisters all misliked her to various degrees.
i don’t like this. nothing wrong with giving your child gifts (see ned going above and beyond to get arya not just instruction on how to fight but also a specific style that would gel with being smaller than your average opponent) but in conjunction with “jaehaerys ignores saera unless she’s pressing him for an expensive gift which he immediately gives her and alysanne doesn’t get why he caved so quickly” its an alarming dynamic.
also speaks to how isolated saera specifically was, that the only siblings that like her (aemon and baelon) are usually out and about, and there’s a clear wedge between saera and her sisters, even viserra.
The screams were coming from Tom Turnip, who was lurching helplessly in circles trying to escape from half a dozen naked whores, whilst the patrons of the house laughed uproariously and shouted on the harlots. Jonah Mooton, Red Roy Connington, and Stinger Beesbury were amongst those patrons, each one drunker than the last. They had thought it would be funny to see old Turnip do the deed, Red Roy admitted. Then Jonah Mooton laughed and said the jape had all been Saera’s notion, and what a funny girl she was.
again with sexually humiliating tom.
it continues with her friends. it’s not unusual for a 15 year old girl to want to fool around with other 15 year olds but alys and perri are all guilt ridden and upset and alys is with child. it reminds me a lot of cersei sexually abusing taena in affc. when she’s caught (now, mind you, she’s been marched in front of her parents sitting on the throne and not brought to them in their private rooms. she’s being treated right off the bat as if she’s guilty of a crime and not guilty of being a shitty teenager):
“She went from denial to dismissal to quibbling to contrition to accusation to justification to defiance in the space of an hour, with stops at giggling and weeping along the way,” Septon Barth would write. “She never did it, they were lying, it never happened, how could they believe that, it was just a game, it was just a jape, who said that, that was not how it happened, everyone likes kissing, she was sorry, Peri started it, it was such fun, no one was hurt, no one ever told her kissing was bad, Sweetberry had dared her, she was so ashamed, Baelon used to kiss Alyssa all the time, once she started she did not know how to stop, she was afraid of Stinger, the Mother Above had forgiven her, all the girls were doing it, the first time she was drunk, she had never wanted to, it was what men wanted, Maegelle said the gods forgave all sins, Jonah said he loved her, the gods had made her pretty, it was not her fault, she would be good from now on, it will be as if it never happened, she would marry Red Roy Connington, they had to forgive her, she would never kiss a man again or do any of those other things, it wasn’t her who was with child, she was their daughter, she was their little girl, she was a princess, if she were queen she would do as she liked, why wouldn’t they believe her, they never loved her, she hated them, they could whip her if they wanted but she would never be their slave. She took my breath away, this girl. There was never a mummer in all the land who gave such a performance, but by the end she was exhausted and afraid, and her mask slipped.”
What does Jaehaerys ask after all of this? “Have you given any of these boys your maidenhead?” Her response:
“True?” said Saera. It was in that moment, with that word, that the contempt came out. “No. I gave it to all three. They all think they were the first. Boys are such silly fools.”
Now mind you, Alyssa and Daella have both died of childbirth recently and her parents are mad she had sex as a 16 year old bordering on 17 year old, and not the fact that she like, at best peer pressured her besties into having sex and now one of them is pregnant. jaehaerys has only asked if she’s still a virgin.
“I will be married,” the princess said. “Why shouldn’t I be? You were married at my age. I shall be wedded and bedded, but to whom? Jonah and Roy both love me, I could take one of them, but they are both such boys. Stinger does not love me, but he makes me laugh and sometimes makes me scream. I could marry all three of them, why not? Why should I have just one husband? The Conqueror had two wives, and Maegor had six or eight.”
i keep trying not to give my opinion and just lay it all out but the thing is i’d just be reposting the whole scene because it’s just filled with so much weird sex stuff. if you don’t remember it, go reread it. it doesn’t feel (to me) like regular “george is bad at writing sex” vibes but “george is purposefully trying to skeeve you out” vibes but i am willing to admit i could be wrong and he really just doesn’t understand what he wrote.
anyways remember how i said saera acts out to get attention from her parents? all she’s done here is act out, her “crimes” are basically nonexistent; beyond how alys feels about being pregnant, saera consensually had sex with boys around her age who aren’t married, and then blithely compared herself to some asshole relatives. if your teenager idolizes dick cheney that’s probably worrying but not a crime! this is not how jae treats it however.
When the princess heard his words, she rushed toward him, crying, “Father, Father!” but Jaehaerys turned his back on her, and Gyles Morrigen caught her by the arm and wrenched her away. She would not go of her own accord, so the guards were forced to drag her from the hall, wailing and sobbing and calling for her father.
The king was angry and unyielding, for his shame was deeply felt, and he could not forget Saera’s taunting words about his uncle’s wives. “She is no longer my daughter,” he said more than once. Queen Alysanne could not find it in her heart to be so harsh, however. “
saera tries to escape.
This time the princess was not allowed to return to her own chambers. She was confined to a tower cell instead, with Jonquil Darke guarding her day and night, even in the privy.
Princess Saera watched from the window of her cell. Jonquil Darke, her gaoler, made certain that she did not turn away.
that’s as her dad is murdering stinger btw. is he a creepy 19 year old? yeah. but like, making your 15 year old watch you murder her 19 year old trust fund baby stoner boyfriend sure is something.
so then they sent her to the silent sisters where she’s beaten all the time and has to pray all the time and she runs away, becomes a sex worker and literally never looks back.
The truth did not come out until a year later, when the former princess was seen in a Lysene pleasure garden, still clad as a novice. Queen Alysanne wept to hear it. “They have made our daughter into a whore,” she said. “She always was,” the king replied.
“You need her as a Dornishman needs a pit viper,” Jaehaerys said. “I am sorry. King’s Landing has sufficient whores. I do not wish to hear her name again.”
but before we move on, let’s look at one more related ick, when saera’s sons show up to the great council:
From Essos came three rival competitors, grandsons of King Jaehaerys through his daughter Saera, each sired by a different father. One was said to be the very image of his grandsire in his youth.
after her drinking, acting out, and jaehaerys’ focus on calling her a whore, explicitly pointing out that one of her grandsons looks just like jae is a choice. i know they’re super inbred. it’s still uncomfortable in context.
viserra targaryen
alysanne makes no sense here but i’m just gonna quickly explain instead of lay it out or we will be here all day bc viserra’s engagement is completely nonsensical. theomore manderly is old, ugly, has a shitton of heirs, and viserra clearly doesn’t want to marry him. also if she wanted to be queen, why is she going after baelon, aemon is still alive. anyways jaehaerys is no help here, then she goes to baelon for help, but she’s also super drunk.
Frustrated, Viserra next turned to her brother Baelon in hopes of rescue, if court gossip can be believed. Slipping past his guards into his bedchamber one night, she disrobed and waited for him, making free with the prince’s wine whilst she lingered. When Prince Baelon finally appeared, he found her drunk and naked in his bed and sent her on her way. The princess was so unsteady that she required the help of two maids and a knight of the Kingsguard to get her safely back to her own apartments.
she gets drunk with some friends again, goes riding, breaks her neck. i wanted to point out this pattern of drinking and acting out at a young age. as well as this pattern of targaryen daughters who aren’t “meant” for a brother and are promised to men who are old and with heirs
daella targaryen
i wanted to add daella because her getting married at 15 makes as little sense as viserra, and her match to a old man with several heirs is equally nonsensical. but also this:
“I would never marry her,” the boy said, in front of half the court. “She can barely read. She should find some lord in need of stupid children, for that’s the only sort he will ever have of her.”
where did vaegon get that mouth.
Daella was not clever, even her septa had to admit. She learned to read after a fashion, but haltingly, and without full comprehension. She could not seem to commit even the simplest prayers to memory. She had a sweet voice, but was afraid to sing; she always got the words wrong. She loved flowers, but was frightened of gardens; a bee had almost stung her once.
Jaehaerys, even more than Alysanne, despaired of her. “She will not even speak to a boy. How is she to marry? We could entrust her to the Faith, but she does not know her prayers, and her septa says that she cries when asked to read aloud from The Seven-Pointed Star.”
The queen always rose to her defense. “Daella is sweet and kind and gentle. She has such a tender heart. Give me time, and I will find a lord to cherish her. Not every Targaryen needs to wield a sword and ride a dragon.”
so daella is 12 at this point.
Her sixteenth nameday was fast approaching, and with it her womanhood. Queen Alysanne was at her wit’s end, and the king had lost his patience. On the first day of the 80th year since Aegon’s Conquest, he told the queen he wanted Daella wed before the year’s end. “If she wants I can find a hundred men and line them up before her naked, and she can pick the one she likes,” he said. “I would sooner she wed a lord, but if she prefers a hedge knight or a merchant or Pate the Pig Boy, I am past the point of caring, so long as she picks someone.”
i just don’t like this. other “simple” targs are not required to marry, like vaella and aelora, two of daeron ii’s grandfaughters so i don’t get why daella is pressured into marrying before she’s even of age. at least jae 2 forced rhaella and aerys because of a prophecy? what is jae’s reasoning for so sexualizing his daughter?
gael targaryen
this one is definitely a reach but i’d like to point out that this is basically all we know about gael:
Princess Gael, a sweet, shy child of seven, became the queen’s constant shadow and support, even sharing her bed at night.
and our information on how she dies is so shady:
A sweet-natured girl, but frail and somewhat simpleminded, she remained with the queen long after her other children had grown and gone, but in 99 AC she vanished from court, and soon afterward it was announced that she had died of a summer fever. Only after both her parents were gone did the true tale come out. Seduced and abandoned by a traveling singer, the princess had given birth to a stillborn son, then, overwhelmed by grief, walked into the waters of Blackwater Bay and drowned.
how does gael get pregnant by a traveling singer when she never leaves her mother’s side? why doesn’t anyone in court know gael got pregnant and killed herself until after aly and jae both die and how was this even found out?
am i implying that jaehaerys sexually abused all four of his daughters? yes because he literally sexually abuses his own wife.
alysanne targaryen
“I am forty-two years old,” she told the king. “You must be content with the children I have given you. I am more suited to be a grandmother than a mother now, I fear.”
King Jaehaerys did not share her certainty. “Our mother, Queen Alyssa, was forty-six when she gave birth to Jocelyn,” he pointed out to Grand Maester Elysar. “The gods may not be done with us.” He was not wrong. The very next year, the Grand Maester informed Queen Alysanne that she was once more with child, to her surprise and dismay.
he uses the birth that killed their mother and that is condemned by rhaena and alysanne as reckless and cruel of rogar to force on her. that birth.
at this point as well, he had abused saera and daella, then they’re gone, then viserra starts drinking and dies, then jae marital rapes aly into having gael, giving him access to another young girl to abuse…i’m aware this is a very uncharitable reading of him but…
alicent hightower (and kind of alyssa targaryen)
Ser Otto’s precocious fifteen-year-old daughter, Alicent, became his constant companion, fetching His Grace his meals, reading to him, helping him to bathe and dress himself. The Old King sometimes mistook her for one of his daughters, calling her by their names; near the end, he grew certain she was his daughter Saera, returned to him from beyond the narrow sea.
saera is the one he fixated on yet again but notable that he’s fixated on his daughters as he dies and not his sons, despite jaehaerys turning to drink after aemon died bc he was so upset.
He announced his intention to wed Lady Alicent of House Hightower, the clever and lovely eighteen-year-old daughter of the King’s Hand, the girl who had read to King Jaehaerys as he lay dying.
The Hightowers of Oldtown were an ancient and noble family, of impeccable lineage; there could be no possible objection to the king’s choice of bride. Even so, there were those who murmured that the Hand had risen above himself, that he had brought his daughter to court with this in mind. A few even cast doubt on Lady Alicent’s virtue, suggesting she had welcomed King Viserys into her bed even before Queen Aemma’s death. (These calumnies were never proved, though Mushroom repeats them in his Testimony and goes so far as to claim that reading was not the only service Lady Alicent performed for the Old King in his bedchamber.)
i know it’s just mushroom being a perv but a rumor that 15 year old alicent “serviced” jaehaerys existing besides rumors that he mistook 15 year old alicent for the daughter he last saw when she was 17 - and viserra was 15, gael 19, and daella 15, all around alicent’s age and all died before age 20. all the targaryen girls that weren’t born “for” a brother exit the narrative after some sort of sexual abuse that centers around jae, as teenagers; daenerys was born for aemon, alyssa for baelon, and maegelle for vaegon before they both fucked off and maegelle was too pious (and too old). this idea of being “for” a brother leads directly to alyssa’s death before 30:
“You were made for battles, and I was made for this. Viserys and Daemon and Aegon, that’s three. As soon as I am well, let’s make another. I want to give you twenty sons. An army of your own!” It was not to be. Alyssa Targaryen had a warrior’s heart in a woman’s body, and her strength failed her. She never fully recovered from Aegon’s birth, and died within the year at only four-and-twenty.
and alysanne being “for” jaehaerys is how he excusing sexually abusing her into a risky pregnancy. essentially what i fear is that because saera, daella, viserra, and gael aren’t “for” someone, jaehaerys gets it into his mind that that are for him. even without him raping them tho, that subtext is there! he is entitled to saera’s virginity and calls her a whore multiple times, even decades after she’s left, and murders her boyfriend in front of her. he claims a weird sexual ownership over his neurodivergent daughter daella and his alcoholic, depressed daughter viserra, and we get zero information on gael’s pregnancy or his reaction to it. but jaehaerys deciding his daughters are “for” him certainly has a basis in canon just judging from the erratic and worrying behavior of his younger daughters.
jaehaerys is a creep and i hate him and i don’t know how much of this is on purpose (like, will aegon vi or dany find out jaehaerys was a shady pedo and it shatters their world? will dunk and egg find it out and it affects their plot somehow? did george just put it in there to make a comment on power and monarchy and misogyny, similar to aegon iv raping the bracken women? or is just there for window dressing creepiness, like “i will pepper in the fact that jaehaerys is sexually obsessed with his daughters” thing?) or if george just made jaehaerys sexually obsessed with his daughters on accident?
on the one hand, it seems out of character for george. he romanticizes drogo thru dany’s eyes but it’s clear he’s meant to be seen as a creep (dany talking about being pregnant followed by “she had just turned 14” is sickeningly jarring for a reason) and also, drogo dies bc of his own pride. sansa doesn’t like any of the old dudes touching her; she is at least marginally freaked out by her wedding night, the unkiss, and lf & dontos taking liberties with her, and rightly. the story that’s told about the mountain raping a girl and making the father pay him is meant to disgust us. the walk of shame is a harrowing chapter to read, because whatever cersei’s crimes, this sexual humiliation is not something she deserves. on and on. yes, we all hate the way arya is sexualized in the mercy chapter, but crucially, she’s not blithely and happily seducing these pervs, she’s going hard candy on their asses. is this just messy set up for something like that?? i think, given how little dany knows about her family’s crimes that somehow learning jae sexually abused (and maybe even impregnated) his own daughters after she herself experiences sexual abuse would be huge. the same goes for aegon vi learning that sexual abuse runs rampant in his family tree; would he empathize with saera hiding out in essos to escape the sexual abuse of her father, see some of elia and his own plight in her? in gael?
or did george really just. not realize how sexually obsessed jaehaerys was with his daughters?
idk how to end this. where’s the winds of winter george i need answers.
#anti jaehaerys targaryen#anti fire and blood#valyrianscrolls#saera targaryen#viserra targaryen#gael targaryen#debated the vs tag bc i know it’s probably gonna annoy some people but. i do actually wonder if this will be a plot point in the books#or if it was an accident#rani attempts meta#gael and the bard#saehaerys
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Much has already been said about the various ways that Jaehaerys has neglected, demeaned, and abused his daughters, so I'm going to talk about their marriages (particularly for the younger girls).
Daella and Viserra are both matched off to much older men who already have heirs of their own from a first wife - any children of theirs would inherit nothing. Then there's Saera - Jaehaerys considered all of her teenage companions to be promising matches, except they're really not. They are heirs, but Houses Mooton, Connington, and Beesbury aren't particularly impressive. They're not Lords Paramount (Rodrik Arryn - Daella) and they're not even prominent vassals (Theomore Manderly - Viserra).
So, what gives? Why is Jaehaerys organizing such terrible marriages for his daughters?
My theory: he's intentionally organizing bad matches as a means of limiting the number of half-Targaryens who could one day challenge for the Iron Throne.
The formative experience of his childhood was Maegor usurping the Throne, and one of the challenges of his early reign was Rogar Baratheon attempting a coup to crown his niece Rhaella (who may or may not have been Aerea). Queen Rhaena could have pushed her own claim after Maegor died, and Jaehaerys is lucky that she didn't. Then there's Aerea, an angry teenage girl who was upset about losing her position as heir and upset about being stuck on Dragonstone with her mother, who went and claimed Balerion when left unsupervised. Imagine if she'd successfully commanded Balerion to fly to King's Landing to push her claim - that's not a fight Jaehaerys and Alysanne could have won.
Branches of House Targaryen are a threat. Nieces and nephews and cousins with Targaryen blood are a threat. If preventing that threat means marrying all of his girls off to old men and letting their children inherit nothing, then so be it. Aemon and Baelon are the only ones who really matter.
Jaehaerys wanted to give Alyssa to his heir Aemon, but Alysanne insisted she was "for Baelon," so he accepts this one branch while keeping an eye on them. He ensures his sons are close and sets up Baelon as a future Hand of the King for Aemon. Viserys and Daemon don't receive cradle eggs, and neither one of them claims a dragon (or is allowed to claim, if I were to guess) until after their father Baelon becomes heir apparent. When an eventual succession crisis arrives, Jaehaerys settles the issue clearly and publicly through a Great Council.
As for the other possible branches? Even if all of his younger daughters had married, even if all of them had sons, those sons wouldn't be in any position to challenge the Throne. Maybe a half-Targaryen Lord Arryn would be a threat; a third son of House Arryn wouldn't be, nor would a fourth son of House Manderly. A half-Targaryen Lord Mooton or Connington or Beesbury could never muster an army or gather enough support for his claim. If his daughters have daughters? As evidenced by Aemma, they'll have no better prospects than a Targaryen prince as husband.
His daughters have no value as people who deserve happiness. They're either brides for his sons, tools to be used, or obstacles to be removed.
#anti jaehaerys targaryen#asoiaf#valyrianscrolls#fire and blood#jaehaerys i targaryen#saera targaryen#viserra targaryen#daella targaryen#long post#my stuff
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Rhaenys vs Rhaenyra vs aegon
Who has the strongest claim and why?
okay, so first of all, in this post i'm going to talk about rhaenys, rhaenyra and aegon's claims - not who they are as people!
i know we give viserys a lot of sh*t for his role in creating the dance - and rightfully so! - but actually the problem didn't start with him. it goes wayy back to aegon i.
aegon i married visenya to secure dragonstone. but why would he have to do that? he is the eldest son, the heir. from this , we can assume that the targs don't follow the "son before daughter" law like other westerosi houses, and just marries the eldest son to the eldest daughter and have them rule together.
we have further proof of that during jaehaerys reign, when alysanne claims their eldest daughter daenerys should be their heir, and jaehaerys (who cleary wants aemon to be his heir) calms her down by saying it doesn't matter, because daenerys and aemon will be married anyway and rule together .
so the targ succession is a mess, there are no clear rules.
so jaehaerys, wanting to prevent a civil war but also wanting viserys to be his heir, gathered the great council. he knows that the other houses follow the son before daughter law (grandson before granddaughter?) so if he'll let them chose - they'll def chose viserys. and they did. jaehaerys wanted to set a precedence, son before daughter.
and we do know viserys had every intention of following his grandfather's footsteps. rhaenyra was not named heir, no one claimed she should be named heir (like alysanne did for daenerys) and it looked like the targs fully accepted the sons before daughters rule.
until viserys named rhaenyra his heir.
while there is precedence, the targs never officially followed the law, and viserys made an already messy situation 100 times messier. he changed his mind 10 years into his reign, abandoned the precedence set by jaehaerys - the same precedence that put him on his throne in the first place!!! and wanted rhaenyra to be his heir.
but wait, if the eldest is the heir, then rhaenys has a stronger claim than viserys. (eldest should inherit = rhaenys over viserys, rhaenyra over aegon)
but viserys is king, so it's male before female. (aegon before rhaenyra)
but there are no clear inheritance law. = a huge mess.
by having a son, and choosing not to marry him to rhaenyra like the old targs did, viserys created a massive succession crisis. caused by lack of any actual rules.
so, who has the stronger claim? i honestly don't know. if viserys claims eldest should inherit, than rhaenys is the rightful queen and he is a usurper, but viserys is still the king, even though he is younger, so his younger son should inherit before his eldest daughter. it's a mess lol
#house of the dragon#hotd#aegon ii targaryen#rhaenys targaryen#rhaenys velaryon#rhaenyra targaryen#anti viserys targaryen#anti jaehaerys targaryen#alysanne targaryen#aemon targaryen#daenerys targaryen#aegon the conqueror#visenya targaryen
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Fuck what the maesters and Jaehaehae have to say, I personally think that Saera and Viserra did regularly bicker and fight as siblings do but they also did love and look out for each other. Let me have healthy sister relationships in the ASOIAF world for once.
#mine own postsss#ASoIaF#dexreadsbooks#dexreads asoiaf#saera targaryen#viserra targaryen#anti jaehaerys targaryen#jaehaehae can choke on his own dick tbh#all her sisters disliked her to some degree yeah but who doesn't feel that way towards their siblings?#I just get the vibe that they went out of their way to demonize Saera#who probs was just acting out due to being spoiled but also craving the attention her older siblings got :((#it's common for toxic families to have golden children who can do no wrong and scapegoat children who always do everything wrong#not out of the question for Jaehaehae's family given the kind of parent he is#can you imagine how much saera's heart broke when she learned about viserra's death :((#dexrants#fuck jaehaehae all my homies hat jaehaehae
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the thing i hate most in fire & blood is that Jaehaerys does shit that makes Alysanne so upset she puts herself in self imposed exile because she’s so upset about the loss of her daughters and the way Jaehaerys treats their daughters, but both times when they reconcile, it’s just Alysanne agreeing not to be mad anymore and Jaehaerys agrees to…nothing!! He never once gives up a single god damn thing to make his wife happy!! Like, Alysanne definitely could have and should have gone to Lys and gotten Saera back and told him to fuck off. She should have told Rodrick Arryn that he’s not allowed to consummate the marriage for several years, until Daella is older and can handle a pregnancy or he’d face Silverwing (bc what is the point of having a dragon that helps you keep your throne if you don’t use it to protect your daughters when your husband refuses!!!!). She should have watched Viserra’s drinking closer and actually attempted to find a match that made Viserra happy. Some of it is at her feet but like, people just tell them “you should make up” and his idea of it is “babe stop being mad at me” LIKE THIS IS YOUR GOOD TARGARYEN KING????? THIS NASTIE MISOGYNIST IS WHO DANY SHOULD EMULATE??????
#THE WORST#anti jaehaerys targaryen#anti targ restoration#pls i just wanna get to the dance already i hate jaehaerys so much 😭😭😭#rani liveblogs asoiaf#like i sure HOPE dany whose claim is the exact claim jaehaerys gleefully puts the side more than once in targ women#would look at his rule and be like ‘wow he kinda hated women i should rethink some of those policies’ smh#and there’s not like. a lot of interesting info or good writing. don’t always love tyrion’s chapters but there is interesting prose & use of#metaphors and imagery. his despair during the trial is so well done. this is just kinda there. bleh#fire and blood critical
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I have a question about F&B that will probably come across as dumb but.... I don't know. Now I hate the Targs as much as anyone else and that includes Jaehaerys. The way he treated his wife and daughters were heinous. However people say he and Alysanne were horrible for forcing Daella to marry an old man. But iirc didn't they offer her three options of suitors and she's the one who CHOSE Rodrik Arryn because he was nice to her. So how was that forcing her to marry?
Is it really a choice if she was being forced to get married because her father refused to have any patience for her? It was either get married or join the Silent Sisters which means Daella didn't really have a choice.
It's like when Sansa was dragged to the Sept and Tyrion offered to give her choice between him and Lancel, at the end of the day Sansa would have to marry a Lannister whether she wanted it or not.
Even Alysanne blamed Jaehaerys for Daella's death
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The best Targaryen king abused his daughters, forced into marriages that killed one of them, killed one of his daughters lovers while she watched and then forced her to join the silent sisters, when she escaped and left Westeros he bullied his wife into not rescuing her, when his wife told him she didn’t want anymore children he disregarded that and very very likely raped her. Fuck Jaehaerys I and fuck the Targaryen restoration.
#anti jaehaerys targaryen#anti targ restoration#anti targ stans#anti targaryen#anti house targaryen#ask a gal
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Jaehaerys and Alyssane might have been decent rulers but they were awful parents and grandparents. If anyone is described as having "better luck with roads than daughters" then they seriously fucked up as a father. And for all we hear about Alyssane being an amazing matchmaker, she really tried to marry off almost all her daughters super young to old fucks. She also married Daemon off at only 16 despite his clear disagreement with a match. And that's not even touching upon rhe whole succession crisis they caused.
In this essay I will-
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Worst Fathers in HOTD:
Viserys Targaryen: Didn’t show Rhaenyra how to rule, neglected his children and raped his two wives. Caused Aemma’s death and is responsible for the Dance of the Dragons.
Daemon Targaryen: Domestic abuser, neglected Rhaena since she doesn’t have a dragon and I wouldn’t be surprised if he did try to kill Jacaerys, Lucerys and Joffrey to ensure his pure Valyrian children ascended the iron throne.
Jaehaerys Targaryen: Treated his daughters like trash and honestly his older sister Rhaena deserved the Iron Throne.
Aegon IV: Treated his son Daeron like trash, caused a succession crisis and raped his wife Naerys until sadly it killed her.
Aerys Targaryen: Traumatised Viserys and Rhaella, raped his wife and possibly fathered Tyrion Lannister.
Rhaegar Targaryen: Abandoned his wife and children, raped a child and abandoned her. Elia and Lyanna deserved better.
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"Hating Jaehaerys is not a personality" Well, it's mine
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“In 86 AC, Queen Alysanne announced the betrothal of her daughter Viserra, fifteen years of age, to Theomore Manderly, the fierce old Lord of White Harbor.”
commission of my bby Viserra from @wodania
#viserra targaryen#alysanne targaryen#anti jaehaerys i targaryen#jaehaerys i targaryen#anti alysanne frankly#bc wtf was this betrothal#asoiaf art#fire and blood#my comissions
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Chapters: 1/1
Fandom: A Song of Ice and Fire - George R. R. Martin, A Song of Ice and Fire & Related Fandoms
Rating: Teen And Up Audiences
Warnings: Creator Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings
Relationships: Saera Targaryen & Viserra Targaryen, Mentioned Perianne Moore/Jonah Mooton, Mentioned Saera Targaryen/Alys Turnberry, Mentioned Braxton Beesbury/Saera Targaryen
Characters: Saera Targaryen, Viserra Targaryen, Original Male Character(s), Original Female Character(s), Saera Targaryen's Bastards, Jaehaerys I Targaryen, Alysanne Targaryen
Additional Tags: Anti Jaehaerys I Targaryen, Anti Alysanne Targaryen, not for targ fans, not for fans of jaehaerys and alysanne, Jaehaerys Targaryen's A+ Parenting, Alysanne Targaryen's A+ Parenting, Dysfunctional Family, Sister-Sister Relationship, I'm a "Saera and Viserra LOVED each other" truther first and a Jaehaehae hater second, Grief/Mourning, Saera is not the devil child the texts try to make her out to be, Guilt, Survivor Guilt, Implied/Referenced Character Death, Implied/Referenced Incest, Saera loves her siblings (well most of them), Denial, no beta we die like men, Not Beta Read
Summary:
The princess across the Narrow Sea learns of her beloved sister's death, as well as the events leading up to it, and her heart breaks in two.
#mine own postsss#mine own ficsss#saera targaryen#viserra targaryen#be gentle this is my first published asoiaf fanfic#so some stuff my be inconsistent/ooc#mostly because I was more focused on exploring the sisters' relationship as how I imagined it to be like#Anti Jaehaerys Targaryen#Anti Alysanne Targaryen#because this royal couple royally fucked up
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in TWOIAF they say that the dance has its roots in Viserys’ reign and like, he definitely could have stopped it by actually dealing with the problem instead of assuming that the Targaryen exceptionalism would force the lords to fall in line (when all that godhood propaganda does is convince aegon AND rhaenyra they have the right, and promptly set the continent on fire) but let’s not forget we can definitely lay this shit at Jaehaerys’ bitch ass feet too.
it was Jaehaerys, for all his supposed goodness, who insists on the precedent that women can’t inherit first with his own daughter Daenerys, than with Rhaenys. He refuses to hear Alysane out, insists this is the correct way. It’s not like Jaehaerys is against insisting Targaryens be allowed to break with tradition when it pleases him - he starts the Doctrine of Exceptionalism specifically so he can fuck his own sister, and he could have made the argument that the Doctrine means Targaryen women are exceptional and must be allowed to inherit over younger brothers. If this argument had come from the king, it was more likely imo that the lords would be forced to listen (especially since Dorne succession works like this, so it’s not unheard of, and Aegon also deals respectfully with Sharra Arryn!). But he point blank refuses to acknowledge that a woman can rule in her own right, which not only causes succession issues, he also allows the Great Council to give the throne to Viserys who doesn’t even have a living son!
Sure, Viserys inherited a thriving kingdom and managed, through incompetence, pride, and thorough inaction, to help usher in a succession war of world war ii proportions onto a continent that had never had these issues before these dragon riding idiots had shown up, but Jaehaerys sets up a thriving kingdom only to shoot himself in the foot by entrenching a deep and violent sexism in the roots of his house that chews up Targaryen women and spits out monsters, if they manage to avoid short, unhappy lives where they’re treated as brood mares, that is.
#my god i hate these people#anti targaryen#anti house targaryen#anti jaehaerys targaryen#rani liveblogs asoiaf#rani attempts meta#i can’t wait to get to the maiden vault and SCREAM
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Idk why but for me, Jaehaehaeaereyrhsyh and his kids Baelon and Alyssa always seemed so insufferable to me. I like the fan art of them, but I mean reading about them makes me annoyed. I guess for Jaererheasrhahraa, it was just the huge incel vibe that old man gave with his generous heapings of misogyny. Baelon and Alyssa, I'm not sure about them, but humiliating their younger brother Vaegon is probably what soured my opinion on them.
The names you keep using jsjhdfsjhgdf
I dislike Jaehaerys so much that I've ignored his kids I don't already like. Tbh they're both so lame and cringy. As though GRRM wanted to make them cool but they come off as boring assholes.
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Targ stans are insane. Imagine calling Alicent a misogynist, but worshipping Jaehaerys I, the man who passed over Princess Rhaenys (daughter of his late oldest son Aemon) as a successor in favor of a male descendant (Viserys, son of his second oldest son Baelon). The Great Council he called established absolute male primogeniture in the eyes of most lords.
Or calling Rhaenyra a feminist. When the issue of female inheritance beyond herself is raised, she gives an excuse about how she's a special case and in no way suggesting other women should be allowed to inherit before their brothers. Or sending a letter to Daemon ordering him to execute Nettles, his supposed mistress. (which is also a capricious command that had no place in the middle of a war).
#thank you for your ask#they certainly are something huh?#their nuance glasses are probably broken#anti targ stans#pro alicent hightower#alicent hightower#anti rhaenyra targaryen#rhaenyra targaryen critical#anti jaehaerys targaryen#fire and blood#house of the dragon#asoiaf#ask a gal
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TG stans: Viserys can't choose his heir just like that! King doesn't have this privilege! Andal Law says...!
Yeah...
Aegon I - conqueror
Aenys I - firstborn, but from the second marriage, and polygamy is not practiced in Westeros (is this also andal law?) so theoretically, the true heir should be Maegor - the son from the first marriage
Maegor I - usurper who appointed Aerea as heir
Jaehaerys - andal law seems to say that a daughter inherits before her uncle, so Jaehaerys is theoretically a usurper, because the throne belongs to Aerea
Viserys I - was literally CHOSEN as heir, although Rhaenys had more rights to the throne according to andal law
So... the laws of inheritance and andal laws could be broken many times, but not when it is to be done to the benefit of the woman...?
#house of the dragon#team black#anti team green#hotd#rhaenyra targaryen#pro team black#anti alicent hightower#asoiaf#viserys targaryen#Jaehaerys Targaryen#anti aegon ii stans#anti team green stans
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