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#Tigerstar point one
pinkytoothlesso11 · 1 month
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Father and son.
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yuridovewing · 6 months
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Adderswift lineage is like "Okay so not only are Spottedleaf and Redtail Tigerstar's aunt and uncle, but Tigerstar is also first cousins with Darkstripe and Graystripe, this is indisputable canon btw you can't argue against this it's totally set in stone and what we intended the entireeeeee time. Oh also Patchpelt fathered a bajillion babies and Longtail and Swiftpaw are siblings for some reason because obviously Swiftpaw has to be Longtail's baby brother for him to give a fuck about his death. You can't feel sad someone died unless you wanna fuck them or they're family. This 100% makes sense btw and you cant contest this"
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katiek101 · 1 year
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☀️ More about your Gorsepaw AU?
It takes place at the end of the last hope. StarClan is celebrating its victory while also welcoming the new cats who died and joined their ranks. Old Clanmates and long-lost kin are being reunited, it's all very touching.
Gorsepaw wants to join in the celebration but he feels out of place. He knows from past experience that if he walks up to a new warrior and greets them, even if they're from WindClan, they're going to look at him like "should I know you". The ones who recognize him do so only by name and then they're like "oh you're the apprentice from that story my mom told me about!" And what story are they referring to? The only one that Gorsepaw plays a part in, the one where Tigerstar makes all of WindClan watch as he pins him down and makes an example out of him.
Despite the celebration, Gorsepaw feels hollow. He's tried for such a long time to accept his death and just when he thinks he's made peace with it, he realizes that he's still a bitter apprentice. So he leaves in search of an important pool.
In StarClan there are different pools that can show you different things. Anyone can look into them, but there is one pool that everyone has always advised Gorsepaw to ignore; the pool that can show a cat glimpses of the future, either a cat that is still alive or a cat that died young. Gorsepaw has never looked into it and asked what his own future would've held if Tigerstar never killed him. But now it's eating him alive and he just has to know.
But before his future is shown to him, there's a commotion. Gorsepaw startles and falls into the pool. He opens his eyes and suddenly he's not in StarClan anymore, he's in WindClan. He's frozen in shock. He doesn't understand what's happened but he doesn't have time to dwell on it either because just moments later, Mudclaw bursts into camp sounding an alarm, and Gorsepaw instantly realizes what day it is; it's the day that TigerClan attacks WindClan and Tigerstar kills him to send a warning to everyone else.
Without thinking, Gorsepaw runs out of camp, far away from the battle. He's frazzled and confused and scared but he knows that he is Not supposed to be alive rn. He decides to tell Onewhisker, his mentor and future leader, everything and maybe they can come up with a way to get Gorsepaw back to StarClan. He really doesn't want to die again but he also doesn't want to change the future.
When Gorsepaw returns to WindClan he finds out that in his absence, Tigerstar used Onewhisker to make an example out of. WindClan's next leader is dead and it's Gorsepaw's fault because he ran.
Firestar and his patrol arrive but just like last time, they're too late. Firestar and Tallstar speak and agree to form LionClan. Gorsepaw has always admired Firestar and he knows that StarClan has sent him dreams for a long time; if anyone is capable of believing his situation then it will be Firestar.
So Gorsepaw asks to speak to him alone. He explains his situation to Firestar, explains that he is supposed to be dead and Onewhisker would have gone on to lead WindClan, and he asks Firestar what he should do now. Firestar's answer catches him off guard:
"You live."
There's more to it ofc but basically, Firestar says that even though they don't understand exactly how or why, Gorsepaw has been granted a second chance at life and Firestar thinks it would be a waste to not use it.
So then... okay. Gorsepaw won't focus on getting back to StarClan, he'll focus on living a normal life but he wants to cause as few ripples as possible. It's very important to him that the future remains as untouched as possible.
So he doesn't tell Firestar about BloodClan or Scourge or SkyClan, etc, and Firestar doesn't ask, he simply says "see you in three days."
Gorsepaw attends the meeting with TigerClan, but as WindClan and ThunderClan merge, he begins to realize that there are cats present who should be dead; Silverstream, for example, and not only is she alive but she stands with ThunderClan. He hears murmurs that Mistyfoot and Stonefur are dead, killed by Tigerstar. Sandstorm stands beside Firestar as deputy; when Gorsepaw whispers to a ThunderClan apprentice and asks why Whitestorm isn't present, they stare at him blankly.
TigerClan arrives. Gorsepaw is shocked to see Bramblepaw following his father, and only then does he notice that Tawnypaw presses close to Brackenfur, her very first mentor.
The meeting plays out exactly like Gorsepaw remembers, despite the unfamiliar ranks. Firestar reveals the truth about Tigerstar. Tigerstar introduces Scourge and his BloodClan. Gorsepaw braces himself, waiting for the strike that will steal all nine of Tigerstar's lives at once.
He watches in horror as Scourge lands that strike on Firestar. The famous leader crumples to the ground and does not rise again. There is chaos; Tigerstar is furious. He snarls that it was his destiny to kill Firestar and no one else's. Scourge has stolen this from him.
Scourge decides that because Tigerstar is ungrateful for his help, their deal is no more. Five mornings from now the Clans will either leave the forest forever or they will die. It's the same deal that was offered before, but this time the forest does not have Firestar to lead them.
Tigerstar orders his Clan to return to camp but Leopardstar speaks up and says that TigerClan is no more; he lied to her about the crimes he committed and if one ShadowClan warriors steps foot onto RiverClan territory, they will die.
Furious, Tigerstar returns to ShadowClan. The other Clans return to their own camps, and a great sense of foreboding covers the forest.
Tallstar decides that without Firestar, the Clans stand no chance against BloodClan. They will find a new home. Gorsepaw knows that they can't give into Scourge's demands. He feels responsible for Firestar's death so he assumes his role; he convinces some other WindClan cats to travel to ThunderClan with him to speak to Sandstorm.
Sandstorm is too furious to grieve the loss of her mate. She doesn't care who stands beside her, she doesn't care if she is the only warrior who will fight, she is going to meet Scourge in five days and she is going to avenge her mate, and then she's going to kill Tigerstar, too.
ThunderClan rallies around her. Gorsepaw and his Clanmates promise to be there as well. That leaves RiverClan and ShadowClan; ThunderClan is harboring Silverstream after rescuing her and her kits from Bonehill. Silverstream volunteers to visit Leopardstar and strike a new allegiance. That just leaves Tigerstar and ShadowClan.
Sandstorm looks at Gorsepaw and says that she will visit ShadowClan as long as he comes with her. Gorsepaw is caught off guard by her request but he agrees to it.
They, along with a few others, go to ShadowClan. Gorsepaw doesn't know what they can possibly say to Tigerstar to convince him to ally with them, but in the end it doesn't matter; Blackfoot and the rest of ShadowClan chased him out. When Sandstorm asks if ShadowClan will join LionClan, he agrees to it.
The battle takes place. Sandstorm kills Scourge. As BloodClan flees, Gorsepaw suddenly notices Tigerstar weaving through the crowd towards Sandstorm, his claws glistening.
Gorsepaw thinks about how Tigerstar held him down and forced WindClan to watch as he killed him. He thinks about a future that doesn't exist now, where Tigerstar and Firestar battle one more time. He reacts almost without thought; he tackles Tigerstar. For a split second he has the advantage of surprise on his side and he uses it to find Tigerstar's jugular and he bites.
He doesn't know what he'll do when Tigerstar comes back to his body but if he's managed to steal even one of his lives then Gorsepaw has avenged himself.
Tigerstar never rises. The Clans are shocked; Gorsepaw knows his bite didn't have the power to kill Tigerstar nine times. That's when Runningnose appears and admits that StarClan never granted Tigerstar nine lives; that's the reason he went hunting for BloodClan.
Scourge is dead. Tigerstar is dead. The Clans won.
That night, Tallstar gives Gorsepaw his warrior name: Gorsefire.
Gorsefire sits vigil that night and thinks. No matter what he does or doesn't do, it seems like he won't be able to protect the future. Firestar and Onewhisker are both dead. Sandstorm will lead ThunderClan. Who knows about ShadowClan or RiverClan or even WindClan. With that in mind, Gorsefire decides to honor his namesake and live without fear of the future. Maybe he can even help build a better future.
The next morning Gorsefire is relieved of his vigil. He's halfway to the warriors' den when Mudclaw sounds an alarm. Gorsefire panics until Mudclaw brings Sandstorm - Sandstar - into camp. She asks to speak with Gorsefire.
Once they're alone, Sandstar admits that Firestar told her everything about Gorsefire's situation before he died. She doesn't want to know the future of ThunderClan or the fate of the forest; she only wants to know what her own future was supposed to hold.
Gorsefire understands. He tells her almost everything, leaving out the journey to find SkyClan. He tells her that she became one of the most respected warriors in ThunderClan, and she trained many apprentices, and she had two daughters named Leafpool and Squirrelflight, and she grew old with Firestar for as long as any leader and mate are allowed to.
And finally, Sandstar can grieve. She thanks Gorsefire and before she returns to her own Clan, she tells him that he will always have an ally in her.
Time goes on. Gorsefire becomes something of a legend; as an apprentice he killed Tigerstar and saved Sandstar's life. When Mudclaw dies in a pointless border skirmish, Gorsefire has just finished training his first apprentice.
No one has any objections when Tallstar makes Gorsefire his deputy.
And when Tallstar passes away by the lake, no one objects when Gorsefire steps up as WindClan's rightful leader. And for many moons, there is peace.
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perenlop · 1 year
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tawnypelt and dovewing really feels like such a natural fit for a good bond between the two characters because tawnypelt has not only been in dovewings shoes in being ostracized from her birth clan over stuff she couldnt control and moving to shadowclan to feel close to family that does care about her, but i always got the impression that tawnypelt has made peace with her past, not stewing in bitterness over it. like, she knows shes from thunderclan, she knows shes the daughter of tigerstar, shes mature enough to just let all that slide now and focus on the life she’s built over there, but doesn’t hate her thunderclan family either, like she still cares about bramblestar clearly. so if she sees another thunderclan cat who left her clan because she felt ostracized and disrespected, i don’t think she’d go “EUGH ew im projecting my past onto her because i hate myself for what i did and outsiders BAD” i think she would be a good mentor figure for dove and help her adjust and get along with her new clanmates.
like if tawnypelt was apparently super bitter over all that and still hated thunderclan so much that she hated any cat that was from there, that doesnt come through in the text before her novella. she constantly goes over there for refuge she constantly confides in her brother she cares about where she came from but doesnt belong there. there is literally nooooooooo good reason for her to just hate dovewing besides the erins loving petty but boring drama that will never be expanded upon
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volcanicflowers · 2 years
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i think we could fix the film industry if we handed the whole thing over to warrior cats fans
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anxiouslyextroverted · 11 months
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Shadowweaver Catra
Dipper bill cypher
Isabella Emma
Coroline Other mother
Reach but tsukasa mitsuba
Kyubey modoka
they r so c!discduo
i had some of these written down already but kyubey and modoka were in maybe pile but fuck it they kinda similar also Tsukasa and Mitsuba is mad but I see it
every other one I agree with entirely. whats with c!dream fitting the manipulative motherly role so well lmao
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denkies · 1 year
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🐈 clan-confessions  Follow
i'll never say this publicly but honestly i think tigerstar had some valid ideas about having one big clan. obviously he was super wrong with all the violence and force, but one big clan could solve a lot of issues. No more border patrol fighting, more food for everyone during leaf-bare season, no drama involving cross-clan mates, etc etc. a lot of deaths could be avoided if we all took care of one another instead of fighting all the time
🌠 fishluvr76  Follow
ok are we all going to ignore that anon is siding with a literal DICTATOR??? :/
🌸 sweet-tooth  Follow
That's not what they meant and you KNOW it. They brought up some valid points about preserving lives, and denounced Tigerstar's actions as much too violent. Starclan above, no cat can have an opinion these days...
🌒 singlequeen7  Follow
Honestly I don't know how I feel about this... each Clan is beautifully unique and has their own traditions, which would fade away if Clans were desolved altogether. But OP makes a valid point about less violence and food scarcity. I hate the idea of sending my kits off to become Warriors, only for them to die during a stupid argument about Sunningrocks. A pile of rocks is NEVER worth a cat's life, whether they are in your Clan or not. And we have lost lives like that before.
🍄 medicinepawz  Follow
I agree! Traditions are important, but every medicine cat knows that working together saves lives. Sharing herbs can stop the spread of greencough, and sharing prey stops kits from crying from hunger. We really need a better system, because I can't cry myself to sleep another night, blaming myself for not having enough cobwebs to stop a kit from bleeding out in front of me.
🐅 lonelywarrior5346-deactivated
leave it to a woman and a medicine cat to emotionally manipulate proud warriors into giving up our PURECLAN bloodlines and Clan patriotism lolol
🍄 medicinepawz   Follow
HELLO?????
🐛 bug-enjoyer  Follow
> complains about "emotional manipulation" (it wasn't?)
> proceeds to be misogynystic AND racist in the same sentence???
> we get it babygirl, you want to fuck Tigerstar. weird ass mf.
🐈‍⬛ moondrops  Follow
"Lonelywarrior5346" is Flintstep from Riverclan btw
🌸 sweet-tooth  Follow
LMFAOOOOWAGWHQAKDHOA
🫐 berrycloud  Follow
GET HIS ASS
🌌 dorkstar  Follow
nah bc which one of you killed this dude yesterday lmfao 😭💀
🌸 sweet-tooth  follow
NO ARE YOU FR
🐛 bug-enjoyer  Follow
@ dorkstar say sike right now 😭😭
🌌 dorkstar  Follow
border patrol found him dead in a ravine 😭 yall play too much
🫐 berrycloud  Follow
when i said get his ass i did not mean like this
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kiwianacat · 2 months
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#crookedblue4lyfe
Feat. a concept I have for a medieval themed pmv to Simon & Garfunkel’s Scarborough Fair lol. It’s a bit out there, but I think it’ll be a lot of fun if I can scrape together some motivation.
Crookedblue feels so much more angsty than Oakblue; two friends turned lovers who become seperated by the ambition that once connected them. (explanation of au below)
In this au I imagine they have an initial litter of Misty/Stone/Moss, the two survivors being raised by Greypool and Oakheart.
- Crookedstar sires a litter for his friend Willowbreeze but ends up raising Silverkit after her death.
- Mistyfoot and Stonefur feel at odds that he reared his full-clan daughter but only stayed in their life as an uncle
- Oakheart still dies keeping their parentage a secret and Greypool dies revealing it.
- Bluestar assumes he moved on from their relationship, but he never does; he becomes more aggressive towards Thunderclan to hide his mixed loyalties.
- Fireheart and Graystripe rescuing his grandkits and offering charity encourages him to open Riverclan up more. Things are very tense when he shelters Thunderclan from the forest fire and I imagine he has his last one on one conversation with Bluestar at this point.
- I think it’d be very dramatic if Crookedstar was assasinated by Leopardfur as puppeted by Tigerstar. His increased cooperation with Thunderclan being a primary motivater for both.
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what's the second most Iconic Classic Warriors Map. five giants is already the best one but what's second place
if it's not seven years old minimum it doesn't count
*i can't actually verify that this is 7 years old bc it's privated apparently but i sure Think it is???
** every time i close the tumblr app to go check things i run the risk of getting any kind of interaction while i'm checking at which point the post writing feature will be forcibly closed and i will have to rewrite the entire poll again, because polls are not saved in drafts. i have typed this poll 3 times I'm Tired i don't want to do it again. You Know The One
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bonefall · 2 months
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Clear Sky is a Monster.
Of all the characters in Warrior Cats, I think Clear Sky was the most heavily mishandled.
At every turn, the narrative begs you to sympathize with him, to "understand" the "misunderstood." To this end, his brother Gray Wing is used to "keep faith" in his inherent goodness, his abused son, Thunder, is forced to go back to him over and over, and his second dead wife is completely lobotomized in death to absolve him of all sin.
Because of this, of all this set-up for the "redemption" arc they're trying to tell in the last three books, DOTC is Clear Sky's story. Everything primarily exists to benefit and serve his arc. Thunder and Gray Wing might have POVs, but HE is the character who truly drives the plot. So in order to HAVE conflict for that back half, two evil foreign cats, Slash and One Eye, are summoned to act as contrast.
Their narrative purpose is to display "true evil" to make Clear Sky look less bad in comparison. Unfortunately, Clear Sky is the most malignant, deadly character who has ever blighted Warrior Cats.
The "pure evil" examples they summon aren't effective contrasts because they're flat. Clear Sky is what real abusers look like.
His rhetoric is what it sounds like when a cult leader is trying to keep control over a group. He lies when it benefits him, justifies his actions with his tragic backstory to assuage his guilt and manipulate others, and violently lashes out when his feelings are hurt before blaming his victim for making him angry.
He only made "some mistakes" in that SOME of his actions were accidents-- the vast majority of them were malicious, self-absorbed, intentional choices to punish, hurt, and kill others.
I've spoken about Bumble. I've tallied his body count next to Tigerstar. I've talked about how his infant son's death was his fault in sequel books, and called attention to the infected wound face shoving scene that no one talks about. I can't fit every detail into a single post-- because he's so rancid that I would practically be posting entire books.
So what I want to do here is tackle the heart of Clear Sky. Everything he does, everything he's motivated by, is absolute and utter control over other people. He leverages his "trauma" to evoke empathy from his targets to make them easier to manipulate. He's a dirty liar. He breaks down to physical violence when all other tactics stop working.
He's one of the most severe and realistic abusers I've ever read about outside of very adult literature-- and when I read the reasons why he's attracted to Star Flower, my stomach immediately lurched.
The Killing of Misty
Starvation Rhetoric and the Memory of Fluttering Bird
Aside; a question
Hunger as a punishment; he doesn't care about starvation
Exoneration arc
Predation: Star Flower is a replacement for his son.
I think that index is an evocative content warning. But to say it again; this post contains child and domestic abuse, physical assault, public humiliation, incestuous grooming implications, and a lot of murder.
I need to start with the death of Misty. I see a few people saying that Clear Sky killed her for "being on his land" or trespassing, but this is actually a misstatement that I feel is important to correct.
Misty and her children were on their own land. It was her house. Clear Sky killed her to take it.
This is one of the most important details to remember about Clear Sky, that this is the consistent end point of his obsessive need for power and control. By harassment, by violence, or by death, he will brutalize anyone who does not give him what he wants, or who makes him feel bad, and find some way to justify it.
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This territory expansion was for no logical reason. There was plenty of food and plenty of land. Any aggression that's happening on this territory is in response to how he's been stealing land and mauling people.
When it's found out she was fighting to defend her children, Clear Sky's immediate response is to slaughter them too.
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Petal doesn't have milk either. It wasn't about the logistics. He wanted to kill the kids, because looking at them made him feel bad, and she just managed to stop him.
Starvation Rhetoric and the Image of Fluttering Bird
It is often said that Clear Sky is doing this because he's "traumatized" from how his little sister, Fluttering Bird, starved to death in the mountains. That the emotion came from wanting to feed people. That's incorrect. It wasn't about food. Fluttering Bird's death, and all the "starvation" he's faced, are used as manipulation tactics to guilt, influence, and control other characters, particularly when he might meet resistance or be held accountable for something.
It was always, ALWAYS, about control.
He does not care about actually helping people; "Starvation Rhetoric" through Fluttering Bird is an image he can invoke to justify the actions that are as bloody and cruel as the one this post starts off with. Either in his own mind, or in the minds of the cats he's manipulating.
He does this to Falling Feather, before slicing her face open in anger when she doesn't buy it. He does it to Rainswept Flower, before he strangles her to death. And he does it in the chapter just before Misty's murder, both to his Clan and then to Thunder,
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Clear Sky climbed up in front of an entire crowd and gave a grand speech about hunger and "adjusting" the borders around territory he plans to conquer. When he gets to "forgiveness" he feigns pain to make his point because he is performing. If the sentiment is not a total lie, then at bare minimum, he is intentionally playing this up for the crowd.
He is rallying the Clan to support his violence against the cats whose land he wants to steal, and selling it with his life's hardships.
The audience is clearly well-trained, because several cats recognize the cue, particularly Frost who is praised for loudly comforting him. This signals "loyalty" because showing your sympathy towards his "suffering" is how this type of emotional manipulation works. It creates a persecuted, righteous in-group.
He's also apparently used this tactic before, since this entire crowd knows what "I Would Never Forgive Myself " means.
He's made sycophants out of his followers. Like a cult leader.
His abused son, however, hasn't been fully indoctrinated yet. Seeing Thunder uncomfortable with the idea of expanding the borders for no reason, Clear Sky calls him over for a personal propaganda session.
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Clear Sky begins the exchange by calling this a "duty" and a "great honor." Immediately framing what he plans to do as righteous.
He puts on the act when Thunder shows resistance, dramatically pausing to let the guilt trip sink in.
"Thunder waited, realizing that he said the wrong thing."
And then Clear Sky launches into infantilizing Thunder, talking down to him like a child who's too inexperienced to see the "signs of starvation," acting like he's being "patient" in "explaining" it.
And then we get it. "I know what starvation looks like (so stop trusting your own eyes) because I have been through more than you (so shut up and do what I tell you), and I'm being a HERO for what I'm about to do (so opposing me would make you a bad person)."
Thanks to these crocodile tears, looking "moved," the act works. The victim is immediately wracked by guilt because the abuser seems genuinely emotional.
He even lovebombs him over the corpse of Misty in the next chapter, making Thunder feel threatened.
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Thunder doesn't have the words to describe what is happening to him, but he knows that this sudden snap to praise isn't natural. That something is very wrong.
A Question.
Before I move on to show that this IS an act, and that he is lying about how important avoiding starvation is to him, I will ask a question. Please think about it, because I promise I mean it genuinely;
Why does it matter if Clear Sky actually believes this or not?
The victims are just as dead either way, yes? Thunder is just as abused and guilt tripped. The entire Clan has been driven towards violence while coddling and cooing at their Supreme Leader. Clear Sky is slowly annexing the entire forest. If you have ever accepted that he had "good intentions" as an excuse for the harm he did, or that abuse and murder was what he imagined was "the right thing," or that his trauma justifies the way he leverages his own pain to make cats do what he wants... why do you think that?
Why does that make it morally better, as the narrative concludes? Would you accept the same for every other WC villain or antagonist? Tigerstar? Slash? Tom the Wifebeater? Brokenstar? Rainflower?
How could you tell the difference, if you couldn't read their actual thoughts on the page? ...are there any other "good intentions" you've accepted, somewhere else?
Don't share that answer with me. It's a question for you. Sit with it.
Hunger as a punishment; he doesn't care about starvation.
...but, regardless, Clear Sky is not deluded about starvation. It's a justification for his obsessive need for control, and always has been. There was no shortage before stealing Misty's land and kits, he is fully aware that there's more prey than they can eat.
He punishes Falling Feather with hunger and harassment for thought crime, by briefly thinking of leaving. But first, he invokes Fluttering Bird at her like he did before, flying into a screeching fit of rage when she doesn't buy it,
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"I'm sorry I hurt you... BUT" is THE wifebeater phrase. THE stereotypical line of a domestic abuser. "I'm sorry I hit you... but it's your fault for making me so angry."
She went through the same exact starvation he did, calls out that he's just framing his greed as being for the collective benefit of his subjects, and is assaulted for that.
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When we're in his head, we see his REAL concerns are not about hunger. He invoked Fluttering Bird to try and make her shut up and bow down to him; what he's focused on is her "gossiping" and "whining" about the open wound he left on her face. He's still furious at Fircone and Nettle for how Thunder QUESTIONED him. So he will "strengthen their commitment."
When "starvation" DOES enter his thoughts, it is to assuage his own guilt and JUSTIFY what he already did. What he already WANTS to do. It's post-hoc.
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He had to suppress his own guilt at how his greed and ambition made these children into orphans, completely unable to admit that he's ever been wrong or has a change to make, so he invokes the starvation rhetoric at himself to excuse it. So he feels less bad.
Everything, EVERYTHING, in this confrontation is about his pleasure at being able to torment his subordinates. To continue the abuse when the initial confrontation is over. If it isn't pride in his power and control over them, it's plain sadism.
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He invokes starvation in front of the crowd, again, after being pleasured at the guilt in her eyes, hoping that everyone sees her writhing with shame and embarrassment. Fear wasn't at the root of why he assaulted Falling Feather; rage was, and now he feels better that he got to humiliate the person who offended him.
Starvation Rhetoric is a manipulation tactic.
It goes RIGHT BACK to his twisted idea of "loyalty." Obedience.
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A cat who's actually, primarily concerned about starvation wouldn't encourage other cats to steal her food if they feel like it. He wouldn't be using it as a weapon to retaliate against her because she hurt his feelings.
This is paired with the fact he restricts and monitors the diet of his cats. They eat when he allows it, and only what he gives them, in spite of there being piles of dead animals rotting, going to waste.
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We then find he personally doles out food from these piles, plucking carcasses off them and flinging them at his cats, one by one. Probably so he can watch how grateful they are to him and make sure they stay a little hungry-- and definitely because it means he can control WHO gets to eat at all.
If Clear Sky chucked a mouse at Falling Feather and someone took it? She would have gone hungry. For not groveling to him. Like when he decides to starve her brother; a hostage who he promised to feed and care for.
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He's a dishonest snake. He lied about abandoning baby Thunder, calling it a "test of strength," he lied about Bumble's death, he lied about keeping Jackdaw's Cry fed.
And he lied about starvation to Thunder, because he was just making up an excuse to steal more land.
He wasn't "seeing the signs" of starvation when he moved to "adjust" his borders. Even FURTHER into this so-called "delusional slip" into tyranny, he's freely admitting that it takes months for a person to starve when it benefits his sadistic need to punish undeserving cats.
"Dumb moor cats, always expecting more than they DESERVE."
Not need. DESERVE. It's not a delusion about starvation and it never was. STARVATION is how he CONTROLS SkyClan, and once again he's angry that his pleasure has been sullied.
The massacre at Fourtrees was started over Jackdaw's Cry catching a bat after being starved, on land that Clear Sky has decided RIGHT NOW that he also owns, because it mades him think about being disobeyed.
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The bat is forgotten as Clear Sky pivots into a tantrum, wanting to make his family HURT for being 'disloyal' and 'ungrateful.' For leaving him. He LIKES seeing people grovel, cower, and beg, getting PLEASURE from watching how he can hurt and command other cats, and if you don't give him what he wants he will kill you.
Which, make no mistake, is what the "First Battle" actually is. Clear Sky attempting to murder those who don't worship him or swear their undying fealty to him and his twisted dictatorship. Particularly his own son, the most prominent victim of his emotional abuse.
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It's not about the bat. It was never even about food or starvation. It's about retaliation for any perceived lack of control.
Once again he breaks out starvation rhetoric to try and manipulate someone, and when Rainswept Flower doesn't buy it just like Falling Feather didn't, he murders her in another fit of entitled rage.
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Exoneration arc.
At the end of this battle that was entirely his own fault, we're introduced to the hollowed-out ghost of Storm. She has been flushed of all personality, so that she can be the perfect narrative mouthpiece.
She accepts yet another Fluttering Bird Invocation in spite of how we saw it's not sincere. He was lying the entire time and using starvation rhetoric as a manipulation tactic to get control over his victims.
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And that's it.
That's the consequence. Storm's a little mad at him until he says "Buttering Flird" and she swoons.
He doesn't have to be ""afraid"" anymore because the cats just invented an afterlife to believe in. He keeps all of his power and influence and gets off scot-free, because "guilt" (which we SAW him repressing anyway) is supposed to be the best consequence for murder, abuse, and tyranny.
The husk of Storm even materializes again at the end of book 5 to say it outright; he "never drove anyone away." Not even after Book 4 where it's also his fault One Eye took over his Clan for 5 minutes. It was just destiny.
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His "redemption arc" is just an exoneration arc. The narrative doesn't think he really did anything wrong.
EVERYTHING about Clear Sky has ALWAYS been about making grabs at power, but since the narrative didn't see a problem with him extorting his personal tragedy and the death of a child, his own sister, he continues doing it. As if these behaviors are normal personality 'traits'.
Even when that sister COMES OUT OF HEAVEN TO YELL AT HIM DIRECTLY,
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He finds a way to COMPLETELY miss the point, so he can interpret her words in a bizarrely specific way that will conveniently end with him being the supreme dictator of the entire forest. Just like he ALWAYS does.
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It's the entire 5th book. Clear Sky trying to convince everyone, including himself, that it's Fluttering Bird who wants him to grab at power, NOT himself and his own ambition, that THIS time, he promises, for realsies, it's actually about keeping everyone safe.
But just like ALWAYS, because he does not change, when this tried and true tactic manages to work on Thunder, during ANOTHER exchange where he's dramatically pausing and using the cold shoulder to make his pitiable act land harder,
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He lapses right back into bullying his child, creating situations where Thunder will have difficulty or be put in pain, so that he can have an excuse to mock and belittle him.
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And this all comes to a head when Clear Sky takes romantic interest in Star Flower, his abused son's previous romantic interest.
Predation: Star Flower is a replacement for his son.
Direct parallels are drawn between Thunder and Star Flower. Star Flower contrasts her loyalty to her father to Thunder's "disloyalty" to his own, in an appeal to Clear Sky.
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Clear Sky brushes it off for now, citing that he cannot accept her because of who her father was.
But then, Thunder makes the connection between himself and her, because he knows what it is like to be a victim of parental abuse and correctly clocks that they have this in common,
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On his vouch, Clear Sky accepts her into the group. She starts trying to offer himself to him; hunting twice as hard as the others, self-imposing harsh conditions like taking a wet sleeping spot. In their second interaction, Clear Sky begins to take interest in her.
Thunder himself points out that Star Flower is seeking an abusive tyrant to replace her own father, which reads like he's deflecting the stress of how his father is abusing him to deny a connection he already made. As if Thunder sees so much of himself in Star Flower that it makes him (rightly) feel sick that his father is romantically invested in her;
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Thunder then goes on to follow his own advice and form his own Clan, because Clear Sky IS like One Eye... while Star Flower remains here. At Clear Sky's side. Because she feels like this is what she "deserves," that she "understands" him, truly believing that her crime (warning her father that Clear Sky brought an ambush in case he lost the 1 on 1 death match he requested, which he did) are on the same level as his abuse and murders.
Clear Sky is attracted to Star Flower because, in his own words;
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She is young.
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She will not betray him.
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She won't question him,
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and she obeys him.
We've seen what "betrayal" is to Clear Sky-- not taking his excuses or his beatings. To "disobey" is betrayal. To "question" is disobedience.
These are ALL things he's tried to drill into Thunder. We saw him happily exploit their difference in age to tell him he can't have an opinion. He constructed humiliating games in retaliation for ever being questioned. He tried to murder Thunder and his friends for their "betrayal." Even now, being disobeyed causes explosive reactions.
He was previously grooming the things he now identifies as attractive in a young woman into his child.
If your body becomes too useless to serve him, like Frost and Jagged Peak, you're thrown out. If you don't unquestioningly follow his bloody commands, like Falling Feather or Thunder, you're subjected to abuse and public humiliation. If you're in his way, like Misty or Rainswept Flower were, you die.
If you meet all of his expectations...
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You will be in a horrific position where you will never have agency over your own life ever again. Every move, every word, will have to be carefully crafted so that he feels like you're "loyal" to him by the arbitrary standard he feels that day. Never step out of line, never doubt his decisions, never live for anyone except him and the children you will give him, not even for a moment, because then you will not be "worthy" of his grace.
Star Flower would be in serious danger if this series wasn't written by abuse apologists. They accidentally wrote a perfect reflection of how child abuse victims often find themselves in unsafe and toxic romantic relationships with large age gaps which mirror what they went through as kids; but this team doesn't clock it, playing this relationship as wholesome and genuine.
He finally has someone who ""understands"" him. Because they think the character they wrote is misunderstood.
but reality is plain to see.
Clear Sky is a monster. The most realistic monster in all of WC-- far, far closer to real life predators and domestic abusers than the "born evil" rogues like Slash and One Eye. The Erins seem to believe that what separates Clear Sky from One Eye is "fundamental" good and "fundamental" evil, when the truth is that they'd be separated by very, very little.
If they had realistic motivations, they would be exactly like the character their existence is meant to excuse.
Slash and One Eye HAD to be kept flat and one-dimensional. If the book was more earnest, the only difference between Clear Sky and One Eye would have been that One Eye is stronger. So strong that Clear Sky needed to manipulate the other groups into helping him.
While anyone can change, not everyone will, and Clear Sky has no reason to. He sees no consequences. He has everything he wants; power, a pretty and obedient young mate, and unchecked authority over a brainwashed forest cult. There is always a victim on a leash, a naive enabler, or a bunch of desperate and gullible marks somewhere in his proximity to bully into doing his dirtywork
Whether his "intentions" were sincere or not (evidence points towards not) at its root it was always about control. Power is something he perpetually keeps, and continues to violently use.
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Leaders can choose which life they want to lose in order. The will experience something related to that cat's death or, rarely, have a talk with them. When the leader dies, they go into a misty, swirling meadow, surrounded by the cats who gave them their lives.
Pinestar chose Harepounce first, wanting to brave it. He felt the aching in her stomach, but also the intense love for her daughter, Whitekit. It is a looming feeling, especially when he first eats kibble, his belly full while other cats go hungry that night.
Bluestar chose Mosskit last, and instead of feeling the winter's chill, she felt nothing but safety and love, the snow becoming a blanket to settle into. Mosskit allowed her to spend her last moments lucid, seeing all of her children on the bank as she passed.
Crookedstar chose Appleshine for his first, and felt the intense pain she had felt as she died, and the pain gave him determination to keep going during a battle with Thunderclan. (Guess what they were fighting over!)
Tallstar's second to last life was lost after the Bloodclan battle, he chose Dawnstripe's life. She showed him the thrill of the battle she had passed away in, but that while sometimes fighting for something is necessary, it isn't always the only option. It sticks hard with him.
Brokenstar picked Sagewhisker to get rid of it first, he felt the intense pain of the heart attack that killed her, from that point on he made other cats fight his battles more, wanting to hold onto his lives.
Leopardstar's final life was with Brightsky, who she had been avoiding. She watched her mother's life slip away, and the heartbreak that her mother had felt seeing that 2 of her children had been born sleeping. She realized as the world faded to cold darkness that she'd made a mistake.
Losing all his lives at once, Tigerstar had begged each of them to save him, one by one. But they could not, even if they wanted to. The last lost was the tiny warrior, Olivetail, showing her death was at the claws of his own ancestor, Gorsestar, in the same way he himself bleeds out now.
Firestar choses Swiftclaw first to get that over with. It is agonizing pain but all the Might of Lionclan in his bones keeps him going and fighting even when the literal jaws of death clamp down. He remembers Swiftclaw, and all the young cats he is fighting for when he comes back to the living world.
Blackstar chooses to lose the life Blizzardwing gives him, wanting to be rid of it as fast as possible. He feels sickness claw at him, and rage at an unfulfilled life full of regrets. It's... sobering, especially when he just lost the life due to a branch falling on him.
Leafstar choses Dawnstar (who gives a life for Selflessness) during Skyclan's Destiny to see if she is doing the right thing by helping the rogues. It is calm and cold and quiet, her lungs feel tight but she can feel guilt baring down on her as she watches herself through Dawnstar's eyes denying herself catmint to make sure the other cats can live through the greencough epidemic, seeing a Starclan cat looming over a kitten, knowing he will be a heroic leader.
Onestar's final life was Brushclaw, who didn't show him his death, but only talked about how disappointed he was. He gave Onestar a life for friendship, and Onestar chose to isolate himself afterwards, acting unfriendly towards even his own clanmates.
Mistystar's first life was Crookedstar, and she spoke with him about what happened to Leopardstar, and if she was a bad cat for it. He gives her reassuring words, and tells her that he is proud if her.
Bramblestar's first life lost is for Longtail, he feels the terror as he loses his sight, reliving Longtail's last moments before the tree crashes down, all he can think of is the last though in Longtail's head: I can't let prey go to waste, I'm sorry Poppydawn. It rattles him completely.
Rowanstar chooses Cedarheart during a Yellowcough life loss, who fought with all his might to protect the Riverclan nursery, dying for them just as the retreat order was called. It fills him with vigor and strength.
As Harestar lays dying of Blackcough, he picks Barkface. They talk, and Barkface confirms that, no, he will not recover from this. But not to lose hope, for Windclan's future is still bright, have faith. As he gazes over at Breezepelt, he feels a glimmer of hope.
Tigerstar's second life lost after Rowanstar was Flametail, he missed his brother too much to save it for later. The water made him afraid, but when he saw how Jayfeather had tried to SAVE his brother, he personally traveled to Thunderclan and invited Jayfeather to a feast, re-building a bridge that had been hanging in threads.
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willicewc · 1 year
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What if Bluefur/star took in an injured Tiny as some kind of a replacement for her kits and acted as a mother figure to him......
I wonder what his warrior name would be like. Maybe something like Frostgaze ? Tigerclaw would bully him and still call him Tiny. Or even call him a more "warriorish" name like Tinywarrior or Teensytinylittlecat
Or maybe Tiny would become a medicine cat ??? That would actually be a fun parallel with his canon version !
Just a small tangent here, I feel like most people paint Scourge as this unhinged cat that will kill everything and anything for fun, while in the manga he is depicted as rather calm and logical (in the book he is depicted as eerily calm all the time if I remember well !) and doesn't actually kill anyone when it's not needed, he only has an actual fewd with Tigerstar and no one else, he even feeds his brother and sister at some point, showing that he is capable of mercy even to people who were terrible to him. Scourge never actually made an effort to rally every cat under him from what I remember, he doesn't seem to be the most ambitious cat either ? Cats just followed him because they felt protected by him and his little crew. When he challenged the Clans, he did that mainly because the place would be great to live in and allow his cats and himself to live a better life, while Tigerstar only wanted power over everyone else.
Therefore I tend to think that Scourge is not naturally bad (Unlike Tigerstar where I feel that, even if his father stayed in the clan, he would still become a terrible cat) and doesn't take that much fun out of killing people, and would have turned into a somewhat decent cat if he had been in a better setting ?
Also headcanon that Scourge/Tiny will always sleep in the weirdest position ever
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stickstone · 21 days
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i think wind really demonstrates one of the main issues with the way warrior cats is written, that being the fact that nothing gets planned out in advance and the writer changes every book
because every book has to end with this big Moment, certain plot points get either rushed or delayed. for example, why the hell did they wait til the very end of thunder to make splashtail the leader? just as frostpaw got back?
it would have made way more sense for splashtail to be made leader early on in the book, so we could see from sunbeam’s chapters how splashtail was rebuilding riverclan in the background and gaining loyalty and respect. it could a sense of dramatic irony, with frostpaw and the reader learning the truth about splashtail while those back in the clans trust him more and more, giving him a great deal of power
this way, by the time frostpaw gets back, splashstar is a well established leader. it makes more sense why riverclan would be so opposed to the idea of loosing such a strong, stable leader, and it would be easier for splashstar to use his reputation and the current political climate to make it look like tigerstar has turned poor traumatized frostpaw against him
instead, by having thunder leave off on this big, dramatic ‘reveal’ of splashtail being made leader, the erin’s write themselves into a corner. there is no reason for frostpaw not to share the truth, so she does, but whoops! they can’t just end the arc with splashtail getting overthrown, so, even though it makes absolute zero sense for LITERALLY ALL OF RIVERCLAN to turn on her, they do
so now the erins have to justify why splashtail hasn’t been overthrown yet. if he was written the way he was previously written, it would make no sense for all of riverclan to throw their support behind him, so the erins have to turn him into a tyrant that everyone is too scared to stand up to
this is how splashtail goes from a clever, manipulative, if very impulsive and easy to anger villain, to a Godless Heathen Tyrant who kills his deputy for mildly disagreeing with him
because thunder ended with a Big Plot Twist, wind has to spend the entirety of its runtime justifying why the main conflict doesn’t just end right then and there. that is why the pacing screeches to a halt and that is why an artificial upping of the stakes happens right at the very end
wind is a book that spends its runtime trying to justify its existence. which is not what you want to see in the penultimate book in an arc
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perenlop · 2 years
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honestly the wc fandom seems to get weirder and weirder the more i see from the new books but one thing i do like is how we all hate bramblestar now. Good <3
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duskstar727 · 22 days
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Started mentally grading the Erins for continuity errors and lore accuracy as I was reading ASC Wind.
Firestar restoring SkyClan? 4/5 points, correct, but no mention of Sandstorm's involvement.
Brambleclaw telling the story of The New Prophecy? 5/5 points, impressed they remembered which of the journeying cats actually recieved the signs and which ones just tagged along. Even remembered which cats were apprentices at the time! Almost took a point off for no mention of Feathertail and her death, but they're trying to get the newcomers more interested in ThunderClan than RiverClan so I let it go.
Firestar leading the Clans to their new home at the lake? 3/5, I mean he was there, but it was more Brambleclaw and the other TNP cats that led them on the journey.
Firestar leading the Clans in the Great Battle against the Dark Forest? Eh, 4/5, I don't know if I'd actually give him credit for leading ALL the Clans, just ThunderClan, but I bet the other leaders are like "well he did die so we'll let him have that W" lmao
Mothwing discussing witnessing Tigerstar 1's brutality as leader of ShadowClan? Oooh Erins that was SO CLOSE! The time period and lore is correct, and Mothwing was probably alive, but she would not have been in the Clans at that time and thus could not have witnessed it firsthand! 2/5 for effort.
2 bonus points for remembering the charming detail of Squirrelpaw constantly getting stuck in things.
Overall score: 20/25, 80%. Overarching information is generally correct but needs more attention to detail.
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bonebabbles · 6 months
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God the new ultimate guide sucks
It's not JUST the awful art, either. The art's just worth mentioning because even if the book's info had been terrible or contained nothing new, really cute art can make it still worth having.
But, no, it's even full of recycled lines we've been hearing for years like "Bramblestar Can Match Squirrelflight's Fire Not Contain It," and that's when it DOES get everything right. These entries leave out major, important details (making them bad summaries) and are sometimes even straight-up incorrect.
SUMMARY THOUGHTS
Leafpool is said to have watched Brambleclaw kill Hawkfrost to save Firestar-- but for one, no, she was not there because Ashfur was still leading her and Squilf towards the scene. For two, no, Brambleclaw did not kill Hawkfrost just to save Firestar, it was self-defense. Hawkfrost had him pinned and was going to kill him.
They're REAL cute about Leafpool's death, too, neglecting to mention WHY the Sisters needed to be saved at all and just saying Leafpool's "generosity" lead to her death in that cave-in.
I'm not even going to get into everything on Bramble's entry jesus christ.
Sagewhisker's entry is ESPECIALLY fucken' dandy, framing Yellowfang's Secret like she was simply waiting patiently for Yellow to realize her 'destiny' and not actively shoving it on her at every opportunity.
Leopardstar's entry states that romantic interest in Tigerstar was part of her motivation. "Perhaps she'd hoped he would be her mate" please speak to a woman irl for once in your life.
Gray Wing's entry forgot that the reason he "blamed himself" for Bright Stream's death is because he was literally staring at his big strong brother too much and tripped on a root in front of him. It IS his fault she died.
Clear Sky/Skystar's entry is just obscene. "He regretted abandoning his son and after a fire, he encouraged him to live with him" instead of "saw his teenage child was useful now and bullied and belittled the kid and his uncle into letting Thunder come with him." "Retaining his fierceness towards his cats and outsiders which caused his son to leave" instead of "murdering, brutalizing, and abusing everyone around him caused Thunder to leave." I'll just say this tho; "Fierce" is an interesting way to spell "Cruel."
It's interesting that they don't point out that a major part of Jagged Peak's arc was proving he was "Just As Good" as every other cat in spite of his disability, thanks to his introduced-and-pregnant-in-the-same-book wife becoming his life coach, only earning Clear Sky's respect after being allowed to physically lead a patrol in Blazing Star. Instead they frame him finding his place through taking care of kits, which... was something he seemed to resent in the actual series, considering how the books suddenly treat Gray Wing's protective treatment of him as a terrible thing in Blazing Star because he "didn't give him a chance". But at the same time I actually strongly dislike Jagged Peak and his messy, frustrating character arc so I'm not really UPSET with it. Just... noting it. I suppose this is the official direction they're taking away from it?
Shadowstar's entry is barely even 3 paragraphs yikes.
SHORT STORY THOUGHTS
And if you're wondering if the 4 brand new stories they smooshed into the end in a desperate attempt to make the rush job worth buying are good? No. Of course not. They're all slop.
Story 1: Firestar and Graystripe
First one's a marginally cute story about Graystripe and Firestar which is setting up the framing device linking the mini-tales together. They both remember this situation where Firestar fell into a ditch wrong. The punchline is that Thunderstar remembers it perfectly and they're both like, "WOW! Too bad Thunderstar's memory sucks!"
It's not terrible, but it does feel a bit pointless. But, hey, if you want more Firestar and Graystripe in the series that tosses them fanservice at every turn, who am I to judge?
Story 2: Dovewing and Ivypool
The next one is the Dovewing/Ivypool reconciliation passage everyone's talking about. It's... fine, but immensely dissatisfying to me.
Dovewing is apparently having problems adjusting to her Clan, grapples a little bit with the fact she has no friends but is going to be finding meaning in helping tigerHeartstar "bring the new ShadowClan into existence." She ultimately decides that she needs to talk to her sister, and begs for reassurance that Ivypool believes in her, feeling that her support can help her get through this difficult time in her life.
I think its biggest problem is that Dovewing was not the right choice for the POV here.
Dove was never the one responsible for the rift in their relationship. Ivypool is. Ivypool is the one who was jealous, willing to sabotage anything that would put Dovewing closer to Tigerheart, and continues to be generally aggressive towards her. So when Dovewing is reaching out to Ivypool in hopes of them reconciling, it feels wrong because Ivypool is the one that should be reaching out to Dovewing. SHE is the one who has some things to apologize for, and to show how much she loves and misses her.
It's even kind of frustrating, because Dovewing can never catch a break. She has to have these problems to force her to reach out, Ivypool even ends up suggesting that she leave and come home and take her kids with her, but in the end even a LITTLE bit of assurance from her aggressive sister helps.
I feel super bad for Dovewing, man. She deserves better than this cheap writing. What was the point of such an unsatisfying, rushed reconciliation, shoved into a crummy field guide, when we KNOW from the newest book that they're just going to use tension between them as part of the drama anyway?
shouldn't have even been written, imo. Even ends off with, "They'll always have each other :)" which is so... cliche. It's TIRED. Are any of you really happy with just getting a retconned platitude in a good-for-nothing field guide, instead of seeing complicated, INTERESTING feelings in a main book?
Story 3: Alderheart and Twigbranch
A tale of Cherryfall getting sick during TBC and Alderheart sneaks back into the territory to treat her. Also Crowfeather has a scene where he yells at him. Charming.
Twigbranch comes up with a diversion while Alderheart does his work, which is cute. It's a fine story.
Story 4: Clear Sky
Trash. Three dogs spawn in the middle of a gathering so that Skystar can have an uwu big boy sendoff saving his grandkit. Then he goes to StarClan and throws a fit because they can't give him ANOTHER life, becoming so upset that he attacks the nearest woman. Naturally, Shadowstar brushes it off because it's not the first time Clear Sky has pummeled her in the midst of an adult tantrum and this book series thinks violence is fine if their favorite sadboy does it.
Then Gray Wing brings him to the magic mirror pool where you can see the living, to confirm that Star Flower is ok and that makes him feel better.
Then it launches into Firestar saying "ouuuugh yum I LOVE the taste of his butthole. Clear Sky is so misunderstood, He Just Loved Too Much."
to which Graystripe responds, "Yes, he was a good and amazing person and his farts smells SO good, and can you believe that some people think StarClan punished his Clan for his arrogance? As if he ever did anything wrong, ever?"
Firestar, indignant, refutes it with, "Ugh!! StarClan would NEVER be interesting, we don't punish living cats we just float around and make vague, frustrating prophecies that do nothing but pad the word count. Why cant ppl understand that, gosh."
who wrote this? Gray Wing??
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