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#so their oldest daughter could inherit. was there a conflict? that she just like. won?
atopvisenyashill · 19 days
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IF YOURE SANSA MANDERLY STARK
And you realize, after your uncle Edric dies, that your husband Jonnel is going to name not Edric’s son Cregard his new heir, but his other brother Barthogan as his heir. He is doing this specifically because “Cregan died after Rickon, so since Rickon wasn’t a Lord, it passes to Cregan’s next born son. Since Edric wasn’t a lord, it passes to Barthogan.” You are very mad because you and your sister Serena have been raising Cregard to rule and now you’re worried about her daughters, and her sons, and what becomes of you if Jonnel also dies, and you’re still mad you were passed over, so you decide “yeah fuck it i’m not just going to set myself up well, i’m going to make sure i have the ability to take the lordship, make myself ruling lady, and make things easier for a woman to inherit because now i’m pissed off”
What do you like. Do. Marrying all of Serena’s kids well is important but what would “marry well” mean. Someone rich and southron who comes with money & a household that is loyal to the two of you? Someone Northern, who will back your claim because they have a vested interest in you ruling? A mix of both?
You have to get the King on your side right. Have an in with him so if someone complains he’s like “well a daughter before an uncle blah blah blah.” You want LYANNA and HER husband on your side, and you want all of ALY BLACKWOOD’S daughters and THEIR HUSBANDS on your side because if your ultimate goal is ABSOLUTE PRIMOGENITURE you want the older sisters on your side right. You want the people of Winters Town to like you more than Barthogan and Jonnel. You want to do good things for them, so you want money (again - good marriages for Serena’s children). You want to be more competent or at least seem more competent. You probably want like….what Barthogan and Brandon like Not In Winterfell with you…….
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ethereal (voltron fantasy/royalty AU) (set up; part zero)
Heyo! It’s your friendly neighborhood Voltron fanfic aficionado- now your friendly neighborhood Klance writer but that’s honestly besides the point I don’t even know why you’d bring up my increasing obsession with them in this Klance fanfic that I swear everyone else will be in, too-
Today, I’ll be writing from a fantasy royalty AU with my favorite show cast ever, even though it may or may not be solely because I want to put water elemental!king!Lance in pretty dresses and makeup and just go crazy with my descriptions of gowns and other things.
I imagine, here, Lance would be from a kingdom with strong ties to Pidge’s kingdom, who has strong ties with Hunk’s kingdom, making them a powerful trifecta. I also imagine that Keith and Lance’s kingdoms are on very thin ice with one another, so Pidge encourages Lance to sit down with fire elemental!king!Keith. 
I also imagine that Pidge’s kingdom is closely allied with Allura’s and that the two of them grew up together, while she didn’t meet Hunk or Lance until she became queen. Also, I’d like to have my beloved Ruler Pidge go by she/they pronouns, simply because I see a lot of myself in the way she dresses and carries herself and I actually believe that these pronouns would fit her, alongside all pronouns.
Hunk and Lance likely grew up together in a very close ally ship and continue to be close friends well into adulthood because that’s just how they are. I can imagine Lance is very vaguely aware of Allura’s kingdom and would never dream of picking a fight with hers since, by default, allying with Pidge made him allies with Allura, but he probably doesn’t know her very well pre the canon timeline because I kind of want to build that relationship from the ground up to make up for what the show did to me-
Keith is definitely allied with Shiro, and Pidge and Shiro were always friends through her older brother, who, along with her father, abdicated from the throne and joined an adventurer’s guild instead (because they believed that Pidge would be a better fit for a ruler and decided that, given how they are, reconnaissance and exploration fit them better. She agreed with this insight, deciding to rule the kingdom the best way she knew how). Shiro, being a much more experienced king and friends with their brother, likely prepared them for the role as they grew into it; the two are on friendly terms, but allied isn’t exactly the right term as none of the people in their alliance knew Keith, so they weren’t sure they could ally with him. 
Lance met Keith at a gala years into his reign; they did not get along.
The system of Magic here will likely be dictated by what element one is born in the kingdom of, (i.e., Lance’s kingdom being the Aqua Kingdom, Pidge’s being the Spiritus Kingdom) and the strength of it in each person will be chosen based on a random set of variables that usually depends on the mood of the Gods corresponding to each element.
Lance- Water (Aqua Kingdom)
Keith- Fire (Ignis Kingdom)
Pidge- Life (Spiritus Kingdom)
Hunk- Earth (Terra Kingdom)
Shiro- Moon (Luna Kingdom)
Allura- Light (Lux Kingdom)
I imagine the reason an alliance is called for with Keith and Shiro’s kingdoms is because a traitor to Allura’s kingdom, either Lotor is planning on starting an entire mutiny with the ranks he’s managed to gather and then, consequently, conquer all of the rest of the kingdoms by force in the name of a long-dead kingdom- the Tenebris kingdom. His parents having died in the midst of a total economic crash caused by a codependent relationship with Allura’s kingdom whilst it was under her father’s rule, he was taken in by the state of Lux by Allura’s request, since they grew up together; unfortunately Lotor held lingering feelings of resentment- towards Lux, for causing the destruction of the only thing he could’ve ever considered his own by right, and towards his parents for always making him feel as if he was of no worth. He wants to conquer the entire world just to prove to himself that he is worth something, though, unfortunately, he’s on a path straight to death.
Might redeem him, might kill him off, might exile him- who knows at this point?
Hunk, I imagine, was a commoner who won the title of king through a series of magic-based trials (upon the death of the last ruler) and now keeps his entire family in the palace with him, using his title to take care of his family and citizens as a benevolent ruler. This likely happened when he was quite young- likely when he was 9 or 10, since magic is an innate thing and, in this kingdom, it’s tested in the youngest members of the kingdom in order to deem who is the most connected to their Goddess Terra.
Allura inherited her title when her own father died in the conflict with Tenebris- he went to battle with the people they’d unintentionally doomed in order to protect his daughter and his people, and died in the process; similar to her story in Voltron except her kingdom survives and Lotor and a select few survivors of the Galra become refugees.
Keith became king by beating the previous king’s son in a battle- his mother, being one of the higher ups in the government, sent word to him that the prince didn’t want to be king, so Keith wound up challenging him for the title. He won, successfully making his way into the world of prestige and getting closer to his mother. The prince left the kingdom shortly after- it’s believed that he ran away to be with someone, but no one is quite sure. All anyone knows is that he’s happy.
Lance wound up being king at a really young age- I’m imagining that, prior to his reign, his kingdom was incredibly strictly patriarchal. The previous king likely only had daughters, and the day of his death, Lance was born with incredibly powerful water magic. As a result, at the age of 6 years old, he was forcibly taken from his poor family and raised strictly to be a perfect king- however, he still saw his sister Veronica frequently in secret, the two of them sneaking around to eat baked goods and try on dresses together. When the palace staff found out, they tightened security and warned Veronica that she was no longer allowed to see him unless she wanted to be publicly executed. After his coronation (at age 8), however, he started making drastic changes to the laws that made the laws against commoners interacting with royalty more lax, and, once allowed to dress himself, started wearing dresses and makeup because it reminded him of home and made him feel as beautiful as he knew he was. He gets quite homesick quite often, and he’s still battling to get his family into the palace with him- he has, however, stripped the kingdom of its strict patriarchy. He constantly tells the kingdom that he hopes to one day pass the throne down to his own future daughter and still keeps the three princesses as his trusted advisors because he believes what happened to them was horribly unjust. The story will be told primarily from his perspective.
Shiro became ruler of his kingdom by fighting his way through gladiator ranks when he was only thirteen, winning the entire kingdom by brute force alone and leaving him with a lot more experience and trauma than he’d have liked. Being the oldest of the current generation of rulers and having inherited a kingdom that was closely related to Pidge’s and Keith’s, he guided them both through the process of becoming a ruler and the process of ruling, no matter how difficult it gets. It’s taken far longer with Keith than it has Pidge, since Pidge was raised a royal and has an innate sense of leadership and Keith is... interesting at the whole being a royal thing. Shiro, having grown up with Keith’s mother on the streets of the kingdom of Tenebris, was more than happy to take Keith under his wing- it helps the both of them come out of their shells more, so they have a mutual appreciation for one another.
I imagine this world will be vaguely futuristic and medieval at the same time- they’ll be able to have video conferences and reach other via communicators, holographic calls, things of that nature; but they’ll also be pretty old-fashioned in their manners of dress, their social systems, their currencies, and the vast majority of their laws. I hope that makes sense.
I wonder if it’s visible here that I spent three hours winging this and started getting more and more into it as I went, or if it’s obvious that I spend most of my time working with really obscure fantasy concepts. 
BAHDHAAHAHA I HOPE YOU ALL ENJOY THIS- 
If you’ve got any suggestions for relationship dynamics (platonic, romantic, or otherwise), any pitches for traits you think the characters may have based on their slightly altered backstories, or any feedback in general, feel free to share- I hope you all find this as fascinating as I did while I was writing it!
Also, @keefsteefs It’s happening, I’m doing it, it’s gonna be so fricking awesome-
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cienie-isengardu · 6 years
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Satine Kryze and Pre Vizsla: political & social position
Puttings aside for now morality of characters, I would like to talk about similarities and difference between Satine Kryze and Pre Vizsla and how they could be seen by New Mandalorian society at the climax of their respective arcs.
First thing though: I want to clarify something: as much as TCW may never outright said anything about  Dral'Han (Annihilation) / Mandalorian Excision that happened ~700 years prior to Clone Wars era, this event played a major role in shaping current mandalorian society - or more precisely: two societies: the pacifist and warlike. The Republic occupation and influence still held power over Mandalore, to the point that when Duchess cemented neutrality for her people, soon after that trade routes were closed around Mandalore system - even though the war did not come there yet(?) - what was mentioned in “Corruption” [s03e05]: “Desperate times on Mandalore! Having won neutrality for the Mandalorian system, Duchess Satine now finds herself an outsider with little aid to her people. Supplies are impossible to come by, except on the black market. As a result, the Duchess faces a world consumed by greed.” So, TCW may not discuss in direct way how Republic screwed up Mandalore in the past nor how it mixed into matters of “independent” government now, but it doesn’t make  Republic occupation and its effect on characters any less real.
Saying that, there is the first detail about Satine and Pre I want to talk: political & social position.
The Legends Mandalorian had visible social groups including: Mandalore(s), veterans, warriors, blacksmiths, farmers [and in the case of ancient Taungs, shamans], yet the division between “classes” was not rigid. Mandalorian could be both farmer and great warrior. The title Mandalore was reserved for the best, most skilled, most charismatic and/or the most supported by society person. The status of Mandalorian was either given by birth or by adoption, person could be disavow and/or became dar’manda (no longer Mandalorian) and reclaim the right to mandalorian culture later. People could belong to one of the oldest clans (Vizsla, Ordo, Fett) or be not associated with any family and there wasn’t social class difference between them because all have the same rights (f.e. challenging Mandalore/leader if they did not agree with their decisions) & duties (Resol’nare). In reality, how great of Mandalorian someone was never depended on birth rights or personal connection, but what kind of person he/she/them are.
In other words, Legends Mandalorian did not have aristocracy similar to the ones of Core Worlds (as in: the highest class in society, especially those holding hereditary titles or offices).
The New Mandalorians apparently are closer to Core Worlders / Republic than to the old traditions since Satine is titled the Duchess, Tal Merrik is called Prince [s02e13] and both were born on Kalevala (according to TCW Character Encyclopedia). The animated series made it pretty clear that Satine’s power is similar to the king/queen-like:
on Sundari - the capital city of Mandalore - Duchess has palace that was presented to some extent on the screen and mentioned in the show (“I told senator Amidala that Mandalore was not part of the War, yet here I find a battle in my own palace” [s03e05])
in said palace there is Throne Room where she occupies a central place (throne) even in the present of close allies & friends
she is constantly called “Lady”, “your Grace” and “your Highness” which emphasizes her aristocratic connection/roots and
has power over Ruling Council (“Corruption” episode showed Satine on her throne above seats of Ministers, including Almec, silencing them for good and calling the meeting adjourned.)
There is of course Prime Minister (that according to “The Academy” episode is one of “two people in charge” of Mandalore albeit I’m not sure if we saw Almec making any important political decision without Duchess’ contest - beside the whole illegal business & coup, of course and ignoring Satine’s angry rant about corruption) and mentioned Ruling Council to support Duchess with their advices. Unfortunately, during the Clone Wars, there is little use of Council due to corruption, apathy and bickering between Ministers / leaders of Mandalore. The only real decision / action that Ruling Council did worth to mention was asking Obi-Wan Kenobi (Republic) to provide protection for Duchess during “Voyage of Temptation”.
The Death Watch Manifesto (from Bounty Hunter Code ) - a pro-DW propaganda source, mind you - claims that Mandalorian clans became divided after Mandalorian Excision to the point that even the oldest clans had their members on both sides of cultural conflict. That concerns Kryze family as well Vizsla clan.
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The politically / culturally conflict overlaps with clan rivalry that has been going on for a long time. In short, the situation of Mandalorians is complicated and far from reconciliation, even in the face of threat from the Republic & Jedi.
The source did not explain in much details how the power was passed down through the generations but since the “Faithless” rulers of New Mandalorians are accused of being a puppet government headed by Republic, there is a chance that those families who are now treated as nobility may got the aristocratic titles (and wealth) from Republic itself - as a reward for joining “the right” political system. Then again, the same source claims that Satine’s father was a warlord who actually sent her off-world:
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According to TCW Character Encyclopedia, Satine was born on Kalevala, a planet known for expensive wines, ships and rich cloth and so far a place the most related to New Mandalorian’s nobility. We may only guess if the union (possible marriage) between warlord and Satine’s mother was a political move to connect two influential and wealthy clans or was that dictated by purely romantic motives. Nevertheless, only Satine’s father is described as mighty mandalorian warrior - and that rises some questions. We aren’t told why he sent his child offword… or what offword we are talking here, really. Satine’s homeworld was Kalevala, but she was on Mandalore while being protected by Jedi, does that means her father sent her there? Was he somehow forced to do so? And if yes, by whom? Satine’s mother? Republic? Other mandalorian warlords who wanted more power for themselves? And if Satine’s father, as one of Faithful Mandalorian maybe, wanted independence for Mandalore system - thus became a threat to Republic - Jedi arrival on Mandalore to protect (take away) Satine may not be motivated by her own safety but to secure A) the submission of the current ruler (with daughter as “hostage” in Game of Thrones style, similar to how Eddard Stark took young Theon Greyjoy as his ward) and B)  loyalty of the successor to the throne. I know that sound awful but to be fair, Jedi rarely integrate into internal government matters if there is no profit for the Republic.
I’m not sure if Satine talked in more detailed way about the year on the run under Jedi protection (beside mention of venom-mites on Draboon that seems to be a whole different planet in Mandalore sector). So let’s see what Obi-Wan told us about their time together:
An extended mission when i was younger. Master Qui-Gon and I spent a year on Mandalore protecting the Duchess from insurgents who had threatened her world. They sent Bounty Hunters after us. We were always on the run, living hand-to-mouth, never sure what the next day would bring [...] A civil war killed most of Satine's people, hence her aversion to violence. When she returned, she took rebuilding her world alone.
Satine was born on Kalevala, so…by “her world” does Obi-Wan meant a whole Mandalore system or Kalevala or Mandalore on which they were at that time? Also, since BHC confirmed that there was Civil War in which Faithful warriors (DW) wanted to take control over Mandalore, I don’t really understand why insurgents - the warriors - would hire bounty hunters? I mean, I know they were outnumbered and all, but frankly, we aren’t even told if the bounty hunters were to kill Satine or just to take her away from Jedi (the oppressors).
Nevertheless, we learn that Civil War killed most of Satine's people - what once again is pretty ambiguous, because did Obi-Wan mean Satine’s family and/or people from homeworld or did he mean Mandalorians as a whole? Because if the letter, that presents Satine as a hereditary ruler. Especially with the line “When she returned, she took rebuilding her world alone”. BHC mentioned that her father died during Civil War and if she was the oldest child, should inherit the throne. Since there is no info if she needed to fight for the title of Duchess of Mandalore (she returned and started rebuilding her world without asking anyone about opinion apparently), for me it seems Satine was born not only in aristocratic (wealthy) family but was designed to rule Mandalore sometime in future. Frankly, the same can be said for her nephew, Korkie, who is already in Royal Academy that is to educate future government leaders.
We may not know much about Satine Kryze’s past, but The Clone Wars animated series and tie-in sources present her as wealthy nobility with royal-like power over Mandalore (and maybe Kalevala). She wears rich clothes that emphasize her high status, has own palace with Throne Room and uses luxury spaceliner. She is the person that made decision to turn New Mandalorians into extreme(?) pacifists due to her personal childhood trauma & aversion to violence. Maybe it’s just me, but I can’t see her as someone who was democratically elected leader.
In short, Satine Kryze had a high social rank and political position for majority of TCW storyline.
Pre Vizsla’s history is no less covered by mystery.
We know he held the office of governor on Concordia while some members of the Vizsla clan were known to be part of Death Watch. Including Tor Vizsla, a previous leader of said group who spent some years fighting against Mereel’s (and later, Jango Fett’s) True Mandalorians. For all we know, Tor and Pre may actively working at the same time for a few years (albeit not for too long, since Tor died two years after Battle of Galidraan / Mandalore Civil War and +/- two decades before Clone Wars)
Satine have seen Pre as a close ally and maybe even a friend, who the same as her choose pacifistic ideology over violent past. Who was supposed to help her hunt down the remnants of Death Watch / the opposition of her reign. We know it never was a case.
But there is more questionable matters to talk. The Mandalore’s Moon was described as “Province with its own governor” and starwars.com added that Concordia is independent of Mandalore’s government:
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In other words, Pre as governor of Concordia was NOT under the authority of the Duchess. What makes them more or less equal on political ground. BUT! TCW Character Encyclopedia and Visual Guide: New Battlefronts both stated that Pre was born on Mandalore. Which raises a question, how he ended as a leader of independent from Mandalore province? Duchess Satine couldn’t nominate him as her representative nor force Concordian people to vote for / accept Pre, could she? I’m not be specialist of such matters, but shouldn’t governor actually have a citizenship to be even elected to office?
Of course, Pre may simple moved to Concordia at some point, but frankly, wouldn’t be that a bit suspicious? Almec said once “All of our warriors were exiled to our moon, Concordia. They died out years ago”  and with that statement it’s easy to imagine that from the perspective of the pacifist society, the Mandalore’s Moon is marked as a bad place (natural prison and/or graveyard full of angry, bitter “barbarians”) and with Pre’s family connection to Tor & Death Watch, I think a sudden desire to move there could arouse unwanted interest in him and thus undermine the whole infiltration mission.
There is a different option:
BHC too mentioned that “some of [DW] warriors were exiled to the moon Concordia”. Some slipped away, but I don’t think that happened to Pre, per se. Basing on Legends sources, Mandalore Civil War started in the same year as Battle of Galidraan (44 BBY). From my calculation  it seems Obi-Wan would be 13 years old at that time. There is no information about age of Satine & Pre, but we know Duchess couldn’t be that older than Kenobi. Similar, Pre as the successor of Tor most likely is around the same age as Satine & Obi-Wan. Maybe a bit older, maybe a bit younger, but enough close to be seen as ‘innocent” in the conflict.
If young Pre took part in the fight and were imprisoned, it’s easy to blame Vizsla clan for forcing a child into war zone. If Pre was exiled on Concordia, he could pass later as converted man who after years understood the error of his youth & madness of Death Watch’s ideology.
If Pre did not participate in war (due to young age), but his family did and get caught, he most likely was exiled to Concordia with them. Because what else New Mandalorians could do in such situation? Keep a child from parents (clan) and try reeducated him into pacifist society? Put in orphanage for difficult youth? How many of other kids could be in similar situation? How much more Death Watch / exiled warriors would fight harder to get back their children, to tear them out of New Mandalorian hands? The society under Satine’s new rule may not mean any harm to the children forcibly taken away from their family, but if there is one thing that mandalorian warriors hate, really hate, is when someone dare to threaten their kids. This is like asking for absolute war like nothing else.
There is also one more major factor why I think this scenario is plausible, regardless of whether Pre was exiled for a fight or not. It gives him a good “tragic story” that create a common ground between him and Satine and explain why a man born on Mandalore ended as governor of independent province (though I still not sure how New Mandalorians could exile warriors from Mandalore to Concordia, if they seem to not have jurisdiction over the Moon. Unless Concordia is a really new province, built by exiled there people?)
The “tragic story” most likely include things that Satine can relate to, like childhood trauma, growing up in dangerous times (uncertainty of tomorrow), the loss of family & the pressure to rebuild things anew. The similar experiences of how senseless violence destroyed life, how much one suffered because of war for sure could bring Satine & Pre closer to each other. Or more precisely: makes Satine to trust a “converted man” like Pre Vizsla whose ambition was to clean the name of his clan - just not in the way Satine’s imagined.
There is also one more aspect to think about exiled Mandalorians. If only warriors were sent there, I think Satine’s government could have worse relationship with Concordia. The anger at taking away their children would last for long. But if after Civil War the population sent there also included children (and disabled and elderly people), for their own sake alone some family members would be forced to change their lifestyle. After all, children need to be fed, provide with medical care, access to education and safety to grown up. Maybe at some point exiled people managed to either build their own city and establish commercial and political relations with Mandalore or get involved with indigenous people (farmers and miners?) and adopted to their (less violent) customs.
Of course, this is just one of possible explanations. We aren’t told how and when Satine met Pre or why she had him in so high esteem for so long - beside that he was helping her in catching remnants of Death Watch (the opposition of her rule). We only know that both were leaders of their respectively governments that worked independently, albeit thanks to their (supposed) friendship, Mandalore and Concordia seemed to cooperate with each other over the years.
At the same time, only Satine holds aristocratic title and most likely inherited the right to rule of Mandalore either from father or mother; what may explain why Jedi were sent to protect her in the first place. While according to TCW Visual Guide: New Battlefronts, Pre somehow earned his position.
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Frankly, as a member of Vizsla clan, Pre probably met with some resistance or suspicion from both sides. From pacifists due to what Tor Vizsla did over the years and from Mandalorians adhering to the old rules (who at the earliest stages of rebuilding DW could not know what Pre’s true intention really is) for betraying them. Thinking about it, one of Jango Fett’s (in-universe) commentary written on DW Manifesto actually makes clear that Jango not only was aware of Pre Vizsla’s existence but also knew or maybe even heard some of his (political?) speeches:
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From picture: I wonder if Vizsla really wrote this. He was a thug. Sounds more like Priest or Reau. Maybe the younger Vizsla. That one likes speeches. [Jango]
(In all fairness, I agree with Jango, the Death Watch Manifesto doesn’t sound like something Tor Vizsla would write. It fits more Pre, really. But it is interesting that Jango had access at some point of time to DW secret book yet did not act against Pre as far as we know. And Jango had a long list of reasons to hate Death Watch. Then again, Priest and Reau were recruited by Fett to train clone troopers yet they share similar ideology to DW… so maybe Jango just get to the point he didn’t care anymore about Mandalore and its politics?)
Sorry, I digress.
Backing to the main topic, Satine and Pre both have high position in Mandalorian society. Both are burdened with responsibilities for their people (and ideology). The main difference is that, Pre most likely was forced to earn his leader position - the political and in Death Watch while Satine presumably was meant from the birth to be either ruler of Mandalore (or Kalevala) or one of its influential leaders (similar like Korkie is destined to grow up as one of future leaders by Royal Academy teaching program). The other more visible difference is that Duchess’ politics affect hundreds of worlds that also want to remain neutral in current military conflict while Pre’s political activities are focused primarily on internal affairs of Mandalore system (“hunting down Satine’s opposition / DW”, bringing Mandalorian back to their warrior roots). Also, I dare to say Satine’s political position was more certain due to having powerful allies & friends in Republic Senate (Padme Amidala, most likely Bail Organa)  and Jedi Order (Obi-Wan Kenobi who actually is one of Council members), while the current leader of Death Watch by long time couldn’t openly act, and later his cooperation with Dooku/Separatist turned out to be one big fiasco.
And yet, the more time passed, Satine’s political & social position was undermined by widespread corruption on Mandalore while society’s perception of Pre and his Death Watch changed for better at the same time.
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