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#ofc this doesnt mean that john wasnt in the wrong here. he was. but its more complex than just that
ro-rogue · 23 days
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i have very mixed feelings about the new bostin confrontation that got john expelled.
it is portrayed as the worst of john's actions in new bostin, his lowest, most violent moment. and while that last part is not untrue, i feel like the confrontation is a lot more complicated than just john going insane.
by that point, john had already been king for a little while, and he was absolutely terrible at it. (i've written before on why i think that is, and even his objectively horrible actions here were not excusable but understandable.) claire decided he needed to be stopped, and she gathered a bunch of their schoolmates to confront him, as her vision had shown. then, instead of trying to talk it out, zirian (one of the people she had gathered, for some reason) immediately attacked john, and everything devolved from there.
now, a few things stick out to me here:
first of all, claire took zirian with her to confront john. the question is: why? john and zirian had already fought on multiple occassions, and last time they fought, john had beaten zirian. did claire think seeing someone john defeated in a fair fight would make him realize he was a horrible person? did she think that if people saw zirian, they too would be willing to confront john? but wouldn't those people then think they were going to beat john up? did she not realize that if people believed her lie enough to follow her, they would be prepared to act on it too? i really struggle with her thought process here.
next, zirian thought that they could beat john if they all worked together. this supports my theory that the kids in new bostin had absolutely no idea how powerful a god-tier was. the wellston kids would never try to gang up like that on pre-ability loss seraphina - they knew she was too strong.
however, they did gang up on john at least sixteen-to-one (in episode 185, the shot with the most classmates shows sixteen people). when claire was telling the story to seraphina, she made it sound like it was completely unreasonable that john assumed that a group of people who all hated him, at least some of whom he had fought before, including the former king, would want to attack and overthrow him. "he refused to listen" is true, and something john has struggled with a lot both before and after the ambush, but to be honest, in his shoes, i also wouldn't have believed claire.
moreover, he is criticized for going too far in beating them up, but imo that mostly applies to claire and adrion, who weren't actually attacking him. the other fifteen kids were very clearly willing to hurt him just as much as he ended up hurting them. besides, they were attacking him fifteen-to-one, with claire standing to the side - what was john supposed to do? hold back?
the answer, of course, is yes: he should've. it was absolutely not right for him to go that far. but we must understand that john was sixteen, stressed, hurt, and facing people who were likely his former bullies, in the sense that everyone used to bully him.
(plus claire, who gathered everyone there, and how was he supposed to know that she didn't mean for it to turn out like that? and plus adrion, who called the authorities on him, which was objectively a good decision, but it can be hard to see it that way when you're the one who the cops are being called on)
in addition to that, if seraphina or even arlo had been ganged up on like that, no one would be surprised if they, too, fucked up their opponents. (remember that turf war back in episode 17/18/something? where arlo clearly wasn't just going to stop hurting rein, not until seraphina physically stopped him?) john was out of control and very much Not Okay, but his handling of the ambush actually seems to be quite typical for a god-tier.
so to conclude, the new bostin ambush/confrontation was more complex than simply john going crazy, and while both he and claire definitely think that he is the only one at fault there and he acted completely irrationally, that isn't actually the case, and uno readers should be aware that we are viewing the story from the perspectives of biased and thus unreliable narrators.
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A list of my favourite fictional grey characters (not in order) SPOILER ALERT!
Regina Mills (Once Upon A Time)
There is a reason why Regina is called «The Evil Queen» She was pure evil. A murderer, a kidnapper, a rapist, how could I like her? Well it wasnt before season 3 I started to like her. It took a lot of time. And I suppose I will never fully love her after she raped Graham for...years... and murdered people - children when she was a tiny bit frustrated. I would even say that she is irredeemable. And I thought her redemtion arc was unrealistic in the beginning, and for God’s sake, she should not have been crowned The Good Queen in season 7. But she tried to change so hard for Henry, she tried to redeem herself. Tried to be a good mother for a change. She saved multiple lives and souls. She didnt completely redeem herself, I must admit it. But she tried so hard and I feel like she deserves something from that. She eventually became a very good mother, even though it was a little late since Henry was already 12 when she became one. She was still a bitter bitch and blamed innocent people for unfortunate things that happened to her (Zelena, Mary Margaret, Emma) but by season 7, she became something more than that. She became half good. Grey. And even though she didnt completely redeem herself, she came close. Also, I love her sassy personality, she should be crowned The Sassy Queen, not The Good Queen.
Rumplestiltskin (Once Upon A Time)
The Dark One who after 7 seasons became one of the greatest heroes in OUAT. The man who was known as the village coward because he ran away from the Ogre War and was too afraid to fight for his wife became one of the bravest men. Like Regina, he was a murderer. He was super manipulative with all his deals and the «all magic comes with a price, dearie» thing. He manipulated people into getting themselves killed. Before he became The Dark One, he was a good man with a pure heart. But the power of the dagger took over him and his heart was all black. He was power sick. He always wanted power, but not for selfish reasons. He felt like he needed power to protect his son Bealfire/Neal and his wife Milah, but when he took that power, the darkness came over him and he, after time, became evil. It wasn’t before he met Belle French his heart showed a little bit of light. As he said, she was his light in an ocean of darkness. Their relationship was problematic and selfish in the beginning. He manipulated her into thinking he changed (which you know i detest *cough* James Potter) Rumple loved power more than he loved her, at least in season 4. He too often chose it over her, until season 6 when he started to properly redeem himself. His redemtion arc took over 300 years but it came in the end. His love for her changed A LOT. In the other seasons, his love was unhealthy and selfish. But in season 6 and 7, he changed a lot. This time it wasnt only for Belle, but Gideon too. They helped him let go of power and in season 7, he tried so hard to get rid of the dagger and the power so that he could live a normal life with his family. And after Belle died, he didn’t return to the dagger or the dark side. He helped the good side to defeat Drizella and the other villians in that season. He even became a father figure to Alice. And in the end he sacrificed himself to save Killian’s (Nook) life. And he got reunited with Belle. He is the most interesting character in OUAT, no doubt there.
Sawyer/James Ford (LOST)
Sawyer is without a doubt one of my fave characters from LOST (after Charlie and John) in his background, he was a thief and manipulated woman to believe he loved them, just to take all their money. (Maybe except Cassidy, since he fell in love with her later, but he still manipulated her AND got her pregnant) He’s a real asshole. Buuut - then he became an entirely different (and better) man. He meets Kate Austen and I feel like his love for her changes his character. In the beginning he was a bit of a perve with her (i mean, walking straight towards her completely naked...) he doesnt develope much in the 1 season, but later (beginning in the 3 season) he becomes quite selfless and protective. In season (was it 4? I dont quite remember) he falls in love again with Juliet Burke, and heeeeell, she was good for him. He also developes a nice relationship with Claire Littleton (platonic) he becomes protective of her. He attemts to comfort Hurley after Charlie’s death. In the rest of the seasons he is the born leader. He puts the team before himself (like when he sacrificed his chance to escape the Island) and in the paralell universe he is absolutely the best.
Heathcliff (Wuthering Heights)
Okay, no he’s not exactly a grey character since he’s a lot more dark than light, but I love him too much to not put him here. Differently from the other character I’ve mentioned above, Heathcliff doesnt have a redemtion. He died an awful person. He abused and manipulated a lot of people. Before he became this asshole, he was a much better person. He was an ass to those who deserved it (Hindley, That bitch deserved to die so young. Edward was a kind man, but I don’t like him, sooo... nevermind) The way he treated Isabella was sickening and awful, she had every right to leave him and take Linton away and hate him. I Don’t like Isabella, but she never deserved to be treated that way. His love for Cathy was unhealthy, but it was true and he would do so much for her. (They kinda remind me of Snily, so ofc I ship it) Heathcliff went through so much trauma in his life and never recovered. After Cathy died, he was practically dead too, then he killed himself years later. His life made me cry for days, especially the ending. He is such an interesting character with so many layers.
Ulrich Nielsen (Dark)
(Before I say anything, I haven’t finished the entire show yet, so this is gonna be short and probably not 100% correct)
To be honest, I don’t like Ulrich at all as a person. I look at him and I see a fully grown up man with no remorse for what he did to Regina as a teen. He cheated on his wife with a woman he didnt even love. He tried to murder a CHILD who hadnt done anything wrong (yet) because he thought he was going to kill his brother and son in the future (okay, i get why he did it. He was desperate to get Mikkel back and the whole time-tarvelig thing was extremely stressfull) BUT HE COULD HAVE DONE SOMETHING A LOT LESS HARMFULL TO PREVENT EVERYTHING TO HAPPEN. Despite this, i love him as a character. He is so interesting and there are times were I have to remind myself why i dont like him. He is brave and intelligent and... so fucking hot as a teen.
Hannah Kahnwald (Dark)
(Again, havent watched the whole show yet)
This girl is MESSED UP. When she was fourteen, she accused Ulrich of being a rapist, which is a very serious accusation and then blamed it on Regina who she knew was a victim of Ulrich and Katharina’s bullying. She is a home-wrecker, and when Katharina found out about Ulrich cheating on her with Hannah and confronted her, Hannah blamed it on Ulrich and said he pressed her and that she wanted it to end, but he refused or whatever, i dont 100% remember the conversation. But she was also a very good mother to Jonas and she was so sweet to Mikkel/Michael. She is a bitch, so much that its impossible to not like her.
Severus Snape (Harry Potter)
Saved the best one to last. The guy my whole account is about, ofc he’s on this list, and ofc this is gonna be the longest text.
This guy is a complete asshole. Always has been, always will be. He bullied Harry and Co (mostly Harry and Neville) he was a bitter and sarcastic bitch. He used to be a follower of Voldemort. Even in his youth he had a lot of flaws. We all know he became the bastard he was due to childhood trauma, mental illnesses and manipulation. I believe he had depression, grief and PTSD. At least in his 20’s he was suicidal, and I believe it remained like that til the day he died, because he had no one to help him or give him support. He turned to the dark side in an attemt to make his life better (as many members of gangs do) but he only stayed like that for two years, which is extremely impressive if you know what kind of person Voldemort is. As a 21 year old, Snape was a very different person from what he was as a 38 year old. If he was the way he was as a 38 yr old when Lily, James and Harry was in danger. First of all, he wouldnt start to try to save Lily by asking Voldemort, he would have went straight to Dumbledore, probably with his own brilliant plan on how to save them. Second, he wouldnt hesitate for a second to save James and Harry to. In canon, he needed to have a personal reason to save them, which was Lily’s feelings I believe. As a 38 yr old, he risked his life to save people he hated (Lupin) This is a great character developement. He went from being a selfish bitch, to become a selfless asshole. He was that kind of person who did anything in his power to protect someone, even if that person had nothing to do with winning the war and had nothing to gain himself.
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