#not anti fob i used to be way more involved in the fandom it’s just so glaring | Explore Tumblr Posts and Blogs

a-faggot-with-opinions · 9 months

Note

I just wanted to drop in with some links to some now-deleted but still very good articles on Transmasc Comphet (which is a term I think needs to be spread around more when discussing Transmlm social pressures)

"Transmasc Comphet (and the road to faggotry)" the original article - web (dot) archive (dot) org/web/20210109231028/https:// medium (dot ) com/@neilklein/transmasc-comphet-and-the-road-to-faggotry-62ed750f391f

"Transmasc Comphet — the Followup" - web (dot) archive (dot) org/web/20210124071417/https://medium (dot) com/@neilklein/transmasc-comphet-the-followup-46fddbda7c4

I think a lot of it is stuff you and others who discuss anti-transmasculinity already touch on but I think it's another piece of language we really should be using (even though I know someone is going to find some reason to hate us more over it). Thanks so much for everything you do on the blog my guy

Every gay trans man on the planet needs to read this.

In all my many years of being alive, there has not ever been one other article that I have read that has resonated with me even close to the way that these two have. I used to think I was either a lesbian or a bi woman and would pretend to myself that I'm attracted to women when I am now, and also was at the time, repulsed by the idea of being romantically involved with women. I remember for a while I called myself a butch lesbian because it felt like the closest thing to what I thought I was (a masculine woman).

But something still wasn't right, because I'm not a masculine woman, and it didn't feel correct even at the time. I brushed it off and kept going on with my life as one does. For a long time after that, I thought I just had a fetish of myself as a man. But I think that accepting myself as a gay trans man was inevitable after I got really invested in the FOB fandom. Now, I am a gay trans man, and I feel so much better than when I identified as bi or a lesbian because this is who I really am.

Talking to a lot of other transmasc MLM has made me realize that my story is not unique. So many baby trans men identify as bi or straight for this reason before realizing that they are actually gay. And that's not to invalidate straight trans men—they exist—but I am saying that so many of us are convinced that we're straight because as men, that's what society pushes onto us. And even before we know that we're men, we subconsciously know that we are in some sort of societal role where we should love women, which is why, I think, so many gay transmascs identify as lesbian or bi before even realizing that we're trans.

One other thing that I resonate with that Klein brought up is the fact that it's impossible to separate my homosexuality from my transness because sexuality and gender don't exist in a void separate from each other. This is the main reason that I identify as nonbinary and am uncomfortable describing my gender as a man unless I'm making it clear that I'm oversimplifying my actual experience. By saying that my gender is male without elaborating, what I'm saying is that I'm like other men in some way, and that my experience of gender is similar to other men.

But that just isn't the case for me. I tend to think of myself internally as a third gender, separate from male and female, largely due to my experiences with being gay. In the framework of maleness, I'm GNC, femme, or whatever else you want to call me that basically means the same thing. The simplest way to describe my gender identity, and in my opinion the most accurate, is that I'm gay. I am like others who are gay, and I fit into that community. My expression, then, is built around a framework of being gay.

Often when cis people talk about people like me, they tend to put our transness first, and think of our homosexuality as being something that exists because of our transness while in my experience transness and homosexuality are equally important parts of my identity that can't be separated. I am not me if I am not trans and gay. To put it in simpler terms, there might be an alternate universe where I am female due to my transness being something innate to my being that I feel would still exist even if I was amab, but there is no universe in which I am not exclusively attracted to men.

#asks #transmasc comphet #transgender #ftm #trans man #transmasc #gay #long post #transandrophobia #transmlm separatism

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starry-eyed-fag · 10 months

Note

Sorry fellow petekey shipper here but I am curious about how anti petekey shipping is rooted in ableism and transphobia? (Obviously you don't need to answer if you don't want to but I am curious, I'm also not super involved in the fandom so that might be why)

I've received two asks about this same thing with very similar wording so I'll just answer this one, hope other anon isn't too offended lol. I've spoken a bit about this before, but I'm too lazy to go find the post, and I have free time. The transphobic and ableist roots of the vocal group of anti-Petekeys that exist (and other anti-RPF people that go to a very far extreme in general) are very different so I'll address both of those separately.

(Also there will be very brief mentions of SA in my answer, addressing a common anti-RPF argument.) (Also also I'm not a Petekey shipper to clarify but I do welcome them on my blog.) (Also also also there is a TLDR at the end but please don't raise your pitchforks until you've read the whole post.) (Also also also also it's okay if you disagree with me, we can still be friends as long as you're civil.)

I also want to provide a disclaimer: it is okay to dislike any ship (or even RPF in general) for any reason. I'm not trying to claim that it's inherently transphobic and/or ableist to dislike or be personally uncomfortable with RPF. The problem comes in when people use their personal dislike of RPF and extend that to harassing RPF readers and writers (who I will henceforth call RPF enjoyers so I don't have to write that out) and trying to demonize us.

Part One: The Ableism

Many people who hate RPF to the extent that they shame RPF enjoyers do so because of ableism. In the process, they demonize us neurodivergent folk, whether we are RPF enjoyers or not. Often they will say "please just be normal about [person]" or "you're so obsessed and parasocial" when someone's just writing fic or making jokes about the ship being real.

Parasocial relationships, while real, are often used as leverage to further ostracize and discriminate against neurodivergent people, especially autistic people like myself. In RPF discourse, often visibly autistic people are accused of "breaking [person]'s boundaries" or, in some cases, even having our hyperfixations or special interests be compared to literal sexual assault.

As an actual survivor of SA, comparing a neurodivergent person's mostly harmless interests to SA is not only extremely disrespectful but also ableist. Often it is more visibly autistic or higher support needs autistic people that get this argument used against us, but any autistic or neurodivergent person can be targeted.

All of this is very weird and suspicious. Often, more moderate Petekey antis will say things like "you can ship Petekey, just be normal about it". This basically translates to "you can ship Petekey as long as you're a neurotypical". And this proves that a lot of what people are calling "just respect people's boundaries!!!!" is just ableism covered up with therapy speak and progressive language.

Part Two: The Transphobia

There is a lot to get into with the transphobia of the FOB fandom, and if I were to talk about this fandom's transphobia and all of my thoughts on it we would be here for several hours and a few hundred thousand words, but I do want to state a few facts to get us on the same page.

Trans people are targeted, harassed, and called out in this fandom far more often than cis people are.

Trans people in general society are often viewed as predators simply for existing, and when this intersects with a mental disorder or neurodivergence, we are even more likely to be ostracized or called out for things that really aren't that big a deal.

Our sexualities are seen as inherently predatory, no matter whether we're straight, gay, bi, or any other thing. In the eyes of society, there is no "good" sexuality that you can be when you are trans in the same way that you can be straight when you are cis.

When we are called out or targeted, we face the consequences of that worse than cis people do.

Many of these forms of discrimination are passive and not done on purpose, but good intentions aren't enough. Harm is still done to trans people while cis people look the other way.

So, how does all of this tie into Petekey?

WELL

Have you ever been on the Petekey side of Tumblr? Of course you have, you're a Petekey shipper. You may not have counted how many trans people you saw there, but you definitely noticed us. We were there. While we are about 1% of the general population, I would estimate that we are about 50%-70% of Petekey (and general bandom RPF) Tumblr.

All of this being said, the counter argument from the antis would be "we're not doing this because you're trans, it's because you're shitty and do [x thing they claim RPF is]". Unfortunately for them, this is no excuse to use transphobic stereotypes in order to "call us out" for the horrible crime of... writing fiction. And isn't it suspicious how these people very rarely come after m/f ships (exclusing x reader, because that's attacked a lot)?

HMMMMMMMMM

Trans people expressing our sexualities through this community, this ship, this form of media, are demonized and called predators. We are compared to people who commit SA, and legitimate abusers, for writing fiction. We are harassed and called out for being RPF enjoyers far more than cis people are.

Addressing the Bad Ones

Before an angry anon comes into my inbox talking about this, yes, I am aware that some Petekey shippers are racist, and I don't support that at all. Racists aren't welcome on my blog. Because I am white, I don't really have much to say about the vocal minority of Petekey shippers who are racist, but I do think that they are a problem and that it's important for the Petekey community to fight racism alongside the rest of the FOB fandom.

For those unaware, it has been brought to many in this fandom's attention that it is racist to reduce every FOB song written by a black man, Pete Wentz, to be about one white man, Mikey Way. This is indeed very racist. I don't know what the consensus among black fans is about how far you have to go about overanalyzing FOB songs in that perspective before it becomes racist, but I have never once seen a black fan, even one that doesn't personally like RPF, claim that it's racist to ship Petekey at all.

This vocal minority of racists is absolutely no excuse to harass anyone, especially those belonging to other minority groups that already have hate and harassment targeted at them for the most minor fuck-ups. Your (justified) anger with a few racists isn't an excuse to be ableist and transphobic because transphobia and ableism, even towards bad people, harms all trans and ND/disabled people who aren't racist.

I also want to state again that if this is your reason for disliking or being uncomfortable with Petekey in general, that is entirely valid! It's your job to curate your own online experiences and I have no interest in policing what you do with your own blog. Please just don't harass enjoyers of RPF or use transphobic and ableist language or stereotypes in your discourse.

This goes both ways. Even if you are an RPF enjoyer you should familiarize yourself with all types of bigotry to avoid accidentally repeating it, and if you do fuck up, own up to it, apologize, and don't do it again.

Conclusion/TLDR

Dislike of or personal discomfort with RPF is totally fine and normal, and so is thinking that RPF is bad, as long as you recognize that the negative aspects of RPF are a symptom, not the main problem here. The main problem is the commodification of human beings under capitalism.

However, RPF has been very important to queer and trans culture, especially bandom RPF in the 2000s. There is a vocal group of people who believe that writing RPF is literally the same as SA or that it is justified to harass RPF enjoyers. Neither of those beliefs are okay and they are rooted in ableism and transphobia for reasons I stated above.

Some Petekey shippers are racist, and unironically claiming that every FOB song is about Mikey is racist because you are reducing a black man to his feelings for a white person. This is still no excuse to go after the non-racist Petekey shippers.

I don't think that everyone who hates RPF to that extreme is trying to be ableist or transphobic, but the more you look at it, the more it becomes increasingly clear where their rhetoric comes from. This is still where they are getting their rhetoric from. They've likely internalized a lot of radfem and/or TEHM talking points as well, which is what I've seen for a lot of these types of people.

Also, mutuals: none of this is directed at you! If you were that anti-RPF to the point I would consider you transphobic or ableist, I wouldn have probably blocked you by now.

Also also, if I got something wrong, especially about the racism, feel free to correct me! I'm always open to good faith disagreement.

Also also also, I'm going to reblog this on my discourse sideblog because this post is more on the discoursey side.

#ask and ye shall receive #petekey #rpf discourse #shipping discourse #long post #discourse #shipcourse

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