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hey! i'm curious what your take on verosie is? I had a hard time liking the ship after the way veronica treated josie in S2. anyway, if you feel like talking about it :)
i have my problems with the way they treated each other in s2 (Veronica and the pussycats + the poster) but Veronica and Josie are very similar to me i mean s1 starts with Veronica trying to redefine herself and s2 has Josie trying to figure out who she is on her own in the time jump they end up in toxic relationships with men who are a carbon copy of their father they both even have the “are you getting a divorce” conversation with their moms and unlike Veronica's other relationships (ie beronica) we see them both doing favors for each other instead of Veronica doing all the leg work plus they just bond so easily and i don't think josie has a lot of people she can talk to for me it's just the understanding they have
#moretvforyou#ask me stuff#sorry for the late reply but i hope it answers your question#otp: bittersweet symphony
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Been thinking abt this ask for a bit, what is your take on Penelope's sexuality?
whew, okay, this is something feel very strongly about so i apologize for the length in advance.
there tend to be two camps of people in this fandom when it comes to interpreting penelope’s sexuality and they are: (1) antis/cheryl stans who consider her to be heterosexual because they refuse to entertain the idea that she might be gay since they hate her; (2) people who have never given her character a second thought but listened to her red dahlia monologue and missed the entire point of it decided it somehow made her a lesbian.
then there are the handful of people in the parentdale fandom who know neither of those interpretations have any merit. because here’s the thing: penelope has canonically been shown to be attracted to men, and at the very least it has been implied that she’s attracted to women.
so let’s start with the former: her attraction to men.
if we think about her timeline in chronological order, the first thing we have to take into consideration is the fact that she slept around quite a bit in high school. see: “oh, it’s not that different from when i was younger and i had my pick of gentleman callers lining up every evening”. it’s important to note she says this very fondly, to the point where she does that whole looking-up-dreamily bit that one does when reminiscing about the past. keep in mind that at the time she was already aware that she was promised to clifford, and that the blossoms surely wouldn’t have approved of her going around with other boys.
there is no reason to believe she was hooking up with these guys for any reason other than she enjoyed it. she obviously wasn’t encouraged to date by her parents, she didn’t have anyone to impress considering the fact wasn’t popular, and it’s not like she could have gone around advertising these encounters anyway since she would have had to have kept them a secret from the blossoms. so that throws out any “she was pressured into it”/“she was trying to convince other people that she was attracted to boys” possibilities. the fact that she happily recalled these memories to cheryl alone casts serious doubt on them.
why excitedly bring up the memories at all if they were just reminders of a time when she was suffering as a result of heteronormativity? it’s not like cheryl encouraged her to share, or gave any indication that she would be impressed by such a revelation. penelope has nothing to prove to cheryl, anyway. the most logical conclusion is the one you get when you take her words at face value: she experiences attraction to the opposite sex and had fun exploring her sexuality in her youth. we’ll circle back to this later when we get to the subject of how comfortable she feels with sex.
so after high school she marries clifford. it’s a forced marriage, and one neither she nor clifford consented to-- but it’s what their parents groomed them for since they were children and something they’ve known was inevitably coming for years. now, for the purposes of keeping this as short as possible and not veering off topic, i won’t get into a whole analysis of their dynamic. all i will say is this: they were depicted as being entirely comfortable with one another in season one. they may not have come across as passionate or romantic, but you could tell they were partners (always on the same page, experts at nonverbal communication, trusting of each other, etc.). and what’s more than that, is they were constantly initiating affectionate gestures with each other: linking arms, putting their hands on each other, standing close together, hugging, etc.
their marriage may have been forced, but penelope genuinely cared for and felt safe with clifford. even after he died, there was a lingering attachment to him. nevertheless, that doesn’t make their situation any less traumatic. no matter how comfortable they felt emotionally with one another, the fact that they were groomed to be life companions and eventually forced to have sex with one another and raise children together, remains a very traumatic experience regardless. and we know penelope is still traumatized by it because she’s talked about it time and time again. if she was only attracted to women, that would add a whole other layer of trauma to the situation.
because if she was only attracted to women, she wouldn’t want clifford anywhere near here irrespective of the fact that they were raised together. hell, she couldn’t even close her eyes and pretend he was someone else while they were having sex. and she certainly couldn’t attempt to get to a place where the sex wasn't so awkward and uncomfortable. every encounter would be an unpleasant, pained, and traumatic experience. to the point where i can’t imagine she would want to be the recipient of any physical contact from clifford, much less frequently initiate it. in this scenario, it wouldn’t just be clifford’s relation to her that she would have to cope with, it would also be the fact that he was a man. even just going through the motions of being his wife would make her feel isolated and miserable.
which brings us to her job in s2 and probably the most solid indication of her attraction to men. in s2, we learn that the blossoms are broke and penelope is faced with the reality that she needs to get a job. let’s start with what she does to pay for the christmas tree cheryl bought: sleep with vic. was it necessary for her to do this? was it the only avenue she could have possibly taken to come up with some money in those circumstances? of course not. christmas trees aren’t that expensive-- she could have easily pawned any number of valuables in thistle house to come up with the money. hell, she could have chosen some cheryl owned to teach her a lesson. or something nana owned. or she could have simply...returned the tree. there was absolutely no reason for her to decide to sleep with vic if it wasn't something she was perfectly comfortable doing. why would this be her go-to solution if she was only attracted to women? her options were plenty.
then after this, what does she do? gets a job as a courtesan. which she delightedly describes as “providing comfort and companionship to the lonely men of riverdale”. and, as cheryl notes in that scene, she seems quite proud of herself for it. i have a very hard time reconciling how any of this would make sense if she wasn’t attracted to men. you can’t argue she was solely in it for the money, because when cheryl offers her an out via the second nick st. clair check, penelope declines to quit. in her own words, “oh, but cheryl, why would i stop, when i’m having such a good time?”. what, pray tell, would be the good time she was having if she didn’t enjoy the sex she was having with these men? keep in mind that, at this point, she wasn’t even doing any dominatrix work. at this point it was very much implied that she was focused on providing the “girlfriend experience”. so you can’t even argue that her enjoyment came from feeling empowered by dominating these men or whatever.
furthermore, not only did she hand-pick this very specific job herself and refuse to quit it when strongly encouraged and given the chance to, but she also had other options, same as she did in the situation with the christmas tree. she could have turned to hiram like cheryl suggested, she could have worked at pop’s like hermione did in s1, talked to weatherbee about a position like alice, looked at the listings in the register, or asked around about any job opportunities at highsmith, you know, the very prestigious college she graduated from and donated tons of money to and apparently sat on the board of?? the point is, penelope didn’t have to turn to sex work to pay her bills if she didn’t want to. and even if she had, she could have stoped the second cheryl handed her that check and begged her to. penelope went into sex work because she wanted to. and she's vehemently voiced how much she enjoys her work continuously and consistently since then.
then there’s her relationship with hal. this is the second strongest indication of her attraction to men. why? because she genuinely had feelings for him. when cheryl approaches her about the affair, assuming it to be a transactional encounter, penelope explains that, “it’s different, with hal. he’s not a client. it’s real”. if you pay attention to her facial expressions in that scene, you can see that there’s a certain softness and vulnerability to them. the way she delivers the line is especially vulnerable-- and penelope so rarely shows vulnerability in front of cheryl, so that alone says a lot. she then asks cheryl to “please stay out of it”. now, we don’t get to see much if any of penelope’s relationship with hal, but the bits we do see let us know that it’s not just some salacious affair. at least, not on penelope’s end. after cheryl drives hal away penelope is visibly upset and accuses cheryl of driving away her “one decent chance at a better life”.
we don’t need to unpack all of that, because penelope feeling like she can’t be happy without a man is an entirely separate issue, but the point is: she sincerely cared for hal and saw herself being happy with him. when cheryl dismissively fires back with “if that’s your idea of love”, penelope defensively snaps, “what would you know about it?”. that’s not the reaction she would have had if she had simply pursued hal because she was bored or wanted to cause some drama or was merely trying to mess with alice or something. you can’t say she was with him for money either, because: (1) she already had money at this point, (2) hal isn’t wealthy, and (3) she wasn’t getting any money out of him anyway since he wasn't a client. and if she was just looking to get hitched and settle down with a man for money, she certainly wouldn’t have gone after a married, middle class one with kids. that would not be a sensible strategy.
it’s also worth noting that nat stated in several interviews back in s2, while the affair plot was airing, that she believed penelope had real feelings for hal. she explained that penelope was lonely and, thus, “looking for a bit of warmth from somewhere”. so that’s how she was playing it.
then there's the maple club. just in case it hadn’t been established enough how much she adores her job, she had to go ahead and open a kink club. there really isn’t any need to drive the ‘she actively enjoys sex work’ point further, as i feel it’s been made explicitly clear already, but i do want to make one note, and that is that penelope was still taking clients while she was a madame. we saw her holding props in like, every other scene, and she was shown wearing nightgowns. so if anyone, for whatever weird reason, assumed she only opened the maple club so she wouldn't have to participate in the sexual encounters herself, i am here to burst your bubble.
and finally, we come to the scene that launched a thousand bad takes: the scene of the red dahlia monologue. in that scene, penelope utters the infamous words, “not people betty, men. they are the true poison”. in context, it is very clear that she is speaking from her many personal experiences with shitty men, seeing as before she delivers that quote she categorically details some of the traumas she has endured at their hands-- the murder of her son by her husband being one of them. that’s all that quote is about! the pain and betrayal she’s experienced from shitty, morally reprehensible men! it has nothing to do with her sexuality, and to make it so is to ignore and take away from the seriousness of her trauma. nothing frustrates me more than to see people misinterpret that scene and reduce it to some man-hating lesbian narrative bullshit. y’all can save that nonsense for cheryl.
also, the fact people were so quick to ignore penelope’s attraction to men in favor of calling her a lesbian feels very biphobic to me, and i will not have it. rip to everyone who thinks being bisexual is just Gay Lite™ and refuses to even consider the possibility when a character is indicated to be attracted to the same sex, but i’m different. not that that scene was any indication that penelope is attracted to women-- it was not. mistrusting men and being disgusted by their actions does not a lesbian make. that is literally just being a woman. but anyway.
the last thing i want to say before i get into penelope’s attraction to women is that there is no way she would be so comfortable with sex, or so confident expressing her sexuality, if she was a lesbian whose sole experiences with sex had consisted of meaningless high school hookups and over two decades of forced marriage to her brother. that just doesn’t add up. if she were a lesbian, s2 would have gone very differently. clifford’s death would have been liberating in more ways than one, and the last thing she would have done after finally being free of having to endure a heterosexual relationship is sleep with a random man to pay for a christmas tree, get into sex work, and pursue a relationship with a man. and go on to open a kink club. that just doesn't make sense.
so onto her attraction to women. this doesn’t require as much of an explanation, so i’ll try to keep it short and sweet since i’ve already written an obscene amount of words trying to answer this ask. i honestly can’t remember when i first started headcanoning penelope as bisexual, but i know i had been entertaining the idea of her being attracted to women long before the flashback episode aired. i’m not sure what it was, the ~vibe was just there. when i first got into the fandom i followed several people who shipped penelope and alice, and, while i didn’t care for the ship at the time (embarrassing, i know), the idea of penelope being interested in women felt very natural to me. maybe it was the violently sapphic schoolteacher/librarian aesthetic she had going on in s1, maybe it was the fact that her whole energy screamed ‘repressed’ to me. actually, i do think the latter is what initially got me wondering.
and then nat starting theorizing that penelope was attracted to women and that was very validating. i was briefly hopeful they would go in that direction in s2, but of course it never happened.
but then the flashback episode aired and bitch ?????? that one scene with sierra was gay as hell. i’m still very confused about why they played up penelope’s crush on sierra only to never go anywhere with it in present time, but i’ll take my crumbs. all of the looks penelope gave sierra in that episode, the way she ignored her vandalizing the bathroom mirror while she grilled alice and hermione for their hall passes, the way she set up a quest just to get everyone out of the room so she could be alone with sierra, the subtle scoot towards her and “looks like it’s just you and me for a little bit, sierra” line with that dorky ass grin, the linking arms and smiling at her in the hallway??? there was nothing heterosexual about that.
and then there was the random, low-key coding in 3x12 where we learned that penelope graduated from a college named after patricia highsmith, referenced the price of salt, and used the word sapphic.....i still have questions about all of this. are we just supposed to believe she reads lesbian novels for science? and casually references them in conversation? where did she learn the word sapphic? if i asked my mom what the word sapphic meant she would have no idea what is was talking about. some food for thought.
also....her scenes with alice. that’s all i have to say.
i’m probably missing some things here, but that’s the bulk of it. i apologize for letting this get away from me...i just have a lot of thoughts lmao. anyway, i hope this was at least somewhat insightful and coherent. i appreciate the ask!
#the way i nearly wrote 3k words about this...#my one shots aren't even this long#ask#message#fandom ask#riverdale ask#moretvforyou#penelope blossom#riverparents#riverdale headcanons#riverdale meta
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hey, here’s a friendly reminder that your original content is incredible!!! let’s spread some support by sharing this message to 10 other blogs whose creations you love, and don’t break the chain❤️✨ have a great day/night and remember that you’re loved!!!
this is so sweet, thank you so much angel!! 💘
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hey, here’s a friendly reminder that your original content is incredible!!! let’s spread some support by sharing this message to 10 other blogs whose creations you love, and don’t break the chain❤️✨ have a great day/night and remember that you’re loved!!!
this is so sweet, thank you so much!!! 🥰
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hey, here’s a friendly reminder that your original content is incredible!!! let’s spread some support by sharing this message to 10 other blogs whose creations you love, and don’t break the chain❤️✨ have a great day/night and remember that you’re loved!!!
This is so nice of you, thank you! ❤️️
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It's me again, thoughts on archosie?
hey again! hm... i think it was nice Archie was there for Josie when she barely had anyone and I appreciate that it was nice to see Josie in a relationship but i don't think it should've went past the musical the chemistry was good and the plot/foundation was solid but i still don't see Josie breaking her no commitment thing for him and it's even worse considering he almost cheated on her
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moretvforyou replied to your photoset “I would pay money to watch them play two truths and a lie with their...”
that third to last one should be "my supposed best friend tortured and stalked me, then framed a moc for it and then started dating a woc she also mistreats. yay. drinking games in college are fun"
You know, you’re absolutely right, so I’ve changed the set.
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moretvforyou replied to your post: moretvforyou replied to your photoset: ...
hi! know this post is from a while back, but never saw this reply: I mistakenly thought that midge was a woc, soon found I was wrong. Sorry about that!
no worries. we were all bamboozled at some point. that reply was blunt, but like, even i thought she was the first time i saw her
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OK: your version of Season 2, where there's a McMantle storyline (plus obvs jatp and josie and reggie's individual storylines).
okay my version of s2.
Reggie's arc would be about what's he's willing to do for the people he cares about and Josie's would be realizing that she can have fun and it doesn't have to be more than that and that it's okay to rely on people
Josie starts noticing something is up with her mom during 204 before the town council thing
We know that Reggie agrees to start the red circle with Archie is because of what happened to Fred, Moose, and Midge
Josie feels a bit overwhelmed with school, Vixens, and the Pussycats
She goes to Reggie for some jingle jangle (god i hate that name) just to take the edge off for awhile
Marty's business isn't doing so great so Reggie is selling drugs to help where he can
Melinda finds the drugs and flushes them down the toilet
Reggie ends up getting jumped one night and Marty basically tells him to suck it up when he comes home bruised
Josie starts lying to Melody and Val so she can hang out with the cheerleaders and starts canceling practice
The drama comes with them being upset at Josie for basically pushing them to the side and not valuing them
Which Josie has problems with because like I'm sure Sierra has said a dozen times everyone else is disposable
Reggie still has to pay back the money he owes the Ghoulies so Josie lends him some money if he agrees to be her running mate
Football season is over so she's not cheering and she's taking a break from the Cats so she's looking for a new endeavor
Marty takes a deal with Hiram and Reggie is basically in charge of handling stuff with Penny and the ghoulies
Josie finds out her parents are getting a divorce and that her mom is seeing Sheriff Keller
They have a small moment at the bijou while they're both sulking in their misery
When Josie finds out about Sierra's entanglement with the lodges, Sierra warns her not to do anything
Josie makes that Veronica poster because she's pissed at all of them
Reggie and Josie almost kiss while they're doing sketches for their posters
Archie is still Hiram's capo but he doesn't know Reggie is involved and Reggie doesn't completely know how involved Archie is
Josie is spiraling a little (her family wasn't perfect by any means but they were still a family and she feels like she's losing that and her sisters (Mel and Val)
Reggie gets a little jealous when he sees Sweet Pea flirting with Josie
Things come to fruition during the riot night
Midge doesn't die but maybe Ethel or some other side character does idc and Reggie still almost ends up shooting Fangs
Josie has a big fight with Sierra and storms out
She's on her way to thornhill when she sees a bunch of cars with Ghoulies in them and calls Reggie to warn him
“Be careful.” “I always am.”
Thornhill is too far away and she doesn't want to be caught outside so she goes to Chuck's house
He's there having bible study and they have a small bonding moment over art boom brotp born
Reggie rushes to see her as soon as he can and he kisses her out of relief
The next day he tells his dad that he's done doing him favors and tells his mom everything
Josie also has a conversation with her mom but she's not ready to accept these changes
She apologizes to Melody and Valerie but they don't reunite the band immediately
Reggie and Josie don't see each other until the next school day because a lot has happened and they needed time to think
But they haven't talked about the kiss so it's a little awkward
Josie kisses him right before they announce who won student council prez
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Hi! Random question: been wondering if the blog name is just a cool title or if you ship Vixenvibe as in Amaya/Cisco? :)
Originally I made this my URL because Amaya and Cisco are two of my favorite characters and so I was like “Hmm, I’ll mesh their superhero names together. That’d be cool, right?” not even realizing it was the name of their ship until a while after! They would make a super cute pairing too, though, so I’m definitely all for it meaning either of them!
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Why do you think Penelope killed Hal?
because ras wanted her to kill him for shock value and so he could write more torture porn for lili to act out lmao.
as much as i would love to be able to provide a well thought-out analysis of penelope’s motives here, let’s be honest...they don’t exist. none of 3x22 added up on either a canon, feasibility, or in-character basis and so to pretend otherwise would just be a waste of time.
it would be one thing if roberto had actually planned to make penelope the gk all along, but, by his own admission, he didn’t. he just chose her at the last minute because he wanted the villain of that season to be a blossom. that’s it lmao. he may as well have picked her name out of a hat. who knows, maybe he did. in that same interview he said they had also entertained the idea of revealing the gk to be nana rose.
the point is, whoever he would have chosen would have shot hal. penelope was not the focus here-- she was just the vessel for roberto to carry out his nonsensical plot wishes. which, to be fair...is what pretty much all of the characters have been reduced to at this point.
could he have written penelope killing hal in a way that made sense? sure. hal tried to kill her daughter back in s2. that would’ve been a solid motive. but ras didn’t do that. hell, we don’t even know if penelope ever found out about hal going after cheryl. (and don’t even get me started on the black hood storyline because that was also bullshit and not planned in advance which is why it made absolutely no sense in the end)
i guess if you want to pretend 3x22 made a lick of sense, you could assume that he and penelope had a plan. i mean, hal was trying to get betty to kill him in that scene so i guess he was just down to die all of a sudden? idk. maybe he and penelope discussed what they would do in that scenario beforehand. he was an escaped criminal with (1) hook hand and then betty shot the other one so like...lmao. death was probably the better option at that point. does any of this make sense? is it convincing? of course not. it’s a load of nonsense. but that’s all ras writes anymore, is nonsense.
#i'm sorry this is so underwhelming but there really is no making sense of anything that happened in that episode#i wrote so many posts after it aired pointing out all of the flaws and canon contradictions#the episode didn't make sense then and never will#that's just where we're at#ask#message#fandom ask#riverdale ask#moretvforyou#penelope blossom#hal cooper#riverparents#riverdale questions
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moretvforyou replied to your photoset: #phil you SHOULDN’T HAVE
why is this out of focus CW
phil hates me!
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Brenda: Ooh, it's kinda cold
Dylan: Here, take my jacket
Donna: I'm cold too
David: Well, damn, Donna, I can't control the weather!
#submitted by moretvforyou#I love this lmaooo#david silver#brylan#davonna#donna martin#dylan mckay#brenda walsh#bh90210#beverly hills 90210#luke perry#shannen doherty#tori spelling#brian austin green#incorrect quotes#incorrect quote#source: that 70s show#submission
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hi can you guys recommend any barchie blogs?? I want to be able to reblog more barchie stuff but can't find any really good blogs lol
sure! some of these might be multifandom!! i also included myself and the admins on this blog 😌
@fyeahbarchie, @barchie-daily, @tabithatate, @oliviasrodrigo, @lucyychens, @timlucys, @spookys, @cherylblossom, @redmiller, @betty-coopers, @falices, @jabithas, @littlebarchie07, @marinhanna, @shelly-johnson, @rvdregister, @moretvforyou, @jessicahambys, @irisswest, @catherinepeter, @barchiefangirl, @brchies, @sleepingwxves, @miriammaisel, @alicesmiths
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and so, we, the barchie nation, bestow upon you this thank you for your barchie gif services of utmost beauty and valor.
PS: feel like I should mention my ask wasn't a piss take, it's just really late where I live and was being goofy as a way of saying we all really appreciate your gifs, they're really good! :)
Haha, no worries! I got what you meant :)
It was an awesome message to log on to (and it motivates me to keep at it!), so thank you for that ❤️
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thoughts on chosie? :)
im gonna be honest that ship is on par with swosie for me (above archosie though) i think it's nice to see the black characters interact but im not really invested in the ship the ending of 2x07 was disrespectful and i think everyone knows that it gave us more insight into Chuck which was great but that just seemed it it was to give insight into Chuck and it didn't really serve a purpose for Josie. I'd like to see that friendship tho. Plus, mcmantle will always be THE josie ship for me
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