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keyofjetwolf · 3 years

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No commentary, just enjoyment.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #i know the answer to any attempt to sort through a timeline must be 'forget it jack it's xena'#but i forgot how young ming tien is when xena first meets him and like #how the fuck old are you xena?

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docholligay · 3 years

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So wait, is this show like, Xena brand stupid, where history is all made up and the points don’t matter? Is Sookie a demi-goddess? Queen of vampires without actually being a vampire? Or like, their lawyer and go between? Are the vampires demi-gods? I kind of dig the dress that Apparently Claudine is wearing, can I get one of those when I get shipped off to Tree of Knowledge at the Forum Shops?

#Jet Wolf Labor Day Weekend #Doc watches True Blood #True Blood S4 E1 #Doc the Tree of Knowledge is a Jewish thing #Did I not say this was like Xena?

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keyofjetwolf · 3 years

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This whole scene is hyper-charged with sexual tension, which it simultaneously is suggesting is building between Borias and Lao Ma, and makes absolutely no effort to hide is REALLY building between Xena and Lao Ma. The whole thing concludes with the flirtations escalating, and Lao Ma reaching for more to eat. Xena can’t take it any more, and she flings a dagger that embeds in the table just in front of Lao Ma’s hand. “That’s my piece of meat you’re reaching for,” she says, the double entendre flowing.

Then Lao Ma’s pitch perfect “You’re wrong. I don’t eat meat.”, raising the double entendre to at least fourth or fifth level as she takes the bread she was actually reaching for.

I REMEMBERED NOTHING OF THIS SCENE AND I AM A FOOL FOR HAVING ALLOWED IT TO SLIP FROM ME

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #I AM HOWLING WITH LAUGHTER #HOW DID I EVER NOT SEE HOW FUCKING GAY IS THIS SHOW #POOR BABY JET WOLF TOO STRAIGHT TOO DUMB

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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Out of curiosity, I just Googled distance from Greece to China by sea, and it’s about 9000 nautical miles, so over 10,000 land miles. Google goes on to tell me this distance would take about 40 days to cover, and I’d assume it to be longer in Xena’s time, but we can stick with 40 days for discussion.

So over a month, Xena sits here marinating in all her choices that led her to this. Over a month, Gabby’s on her own, crumbling under the weight of all that’s happened, knowing Xena’s chosen someone and something else over her. We’ll get an episode later that fills in some of this gap, but I really want to carry this with me, this HUGE amount of time they both had without the other and all the wasted potential in it. They could have made SO MUCH PEACE with shit, if Gabby had just gotten on the fucking boat. Even if she’d gotten to the other end and decided to never set foot in Chin, to immediately go back to Greece, it would’ve changed EVERYTHING if she’d just boarded the boat.

It’s yet another perfect look at how fucked they both are right now, but particularly Gabrielle. Peel away all that she’s recently been through, and can you imagine our Gabby not seizing EVERY SINGLE OPPORTUNITY to talk Xena out of this? When have you known Gabrielle to step back from Xena -- from ANYONE -- and just shake her head sadly? This trip to Chin is an entire solid month of persuasion and badgering time, right there for the taking, but Gabby puts her hands up and backs away. It’s so preposterously unlike her, that we can whirl back around to Xena having her head so far up her own self-righteous self-recriminating ass. She should be all the fuck over this, this is the least Gabrielle-like Gabrielle has ever been, and Xena should at this point be shoving Gabby into her carry-on bag. Again, I want to point out, YOU’VE GOT OVER A MONTH AHEAD WITH FUCK ALL ELSE TO DO.

But neither of them do this. They can’t! Xena’s so happy to drown in her own hatred and Gabrielle’s rejection is a sweet wineskin to pour down her throat as she goes. Keeping Gabby in Greece, where she won’t actually see what happens and so maaaaybe maybe maybe will forgive Xena, is the only possible spark of a good thing she can see waiting for her after all this. It’s everything Xena could possibly, selfishly want, so of course she doesn’t take the two seconds to consider anything past that.

On Gabrielle’s end of things, this is all too much. She, too, is stuck in the bog of her own misery and selfishness. This isn’t about Past Xena and Lao Ma and Ming Tien, it’s about Current Xena and Gabby and Hope. The words to convince Xena won’t come, because for once, Gabrielle doesn’t have the power of her own conviction. She needs Xena to just AGREE, she needs the proof that Everything Turns Out Okay. It’s her last fucking thread and she’s desperately clinging to it, aware that every breeze could be the one that’s too strong and then she’ll be lost. Gabrielle is too wounded to fight anymore, and Xena leaves her there to bleed out alone.

I know I keep coming back to this, and apologize for being a broken record. I just HRRRN, I have SO MANY FEELINGS about how fucking beautifully this is all set up. The pillar they -- characters and creators -- spent YEARS building together, only to chip away and chip away and chip away until there’s this fragile thing, unbalanced and worn through. We’ve got two separate sets of extremely complicated emotions and motivations, working at opposite purposes, yet also perfectly in-tune to destroy everything. And it’s all exquisitely in-character.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #this is one of those posts that frustrate me #i feel everything SO STRONGLY #but don't think i'm finding the right words to convey it all #I WANT YOU ALL TO UNDERSTAND HOW I FEEL BUT I CAN'T JUST CARE BEAR STARE IT AT YOU WHICH IS BY THE WAY OPPRESSION

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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There it is. The first time Xena’s chosen someone over Gabrielle, and it goes about as well as you expect. My memories (which may be inaccurate, it’s been a loooong time) still assert that Gabby will claim jealousy as her motivator for what comes next, but I’m still calling bullshit on that until proven otherwise. I’m sticking with hurt and anger as her primary reasons, but I’m wiling to add a new one:

Fear.

This isn’t just the first time that Xena chooses someone and something over Gabrielle, it also marks the first time that Gabrielle hasn’t been able to convince Xena to pull back. She’s absolutely immutably set on this path, on murdering Ming Tien. Nothing and no one is swaying her, and I think that before this moment, Gabby would’ve laid every dinar she had that she’d always be able to persuade Xena to see things her way. Now she knows that’s not true, and her already shaky ground quakes again. If Xena can come this far and willingly fall so easily, what chance does Gabrielle have? Maybe even worse, failure to convince once opens the door to future failure. if Xena’s this steadfast in her course, what will she do if she sees through Gabrielle’s lies about Hope? Has she already?

I think there’s a lot that goes into the choices Gabby will make next, but not least among them is a desperation to MAKE Xena see that killing Ming Tien is wrong, the end, full stop. That’s the only guarantee of safety that matters, not just for Hope, but for Gabrielle herself.

But Xena -- beautiful, bull-headed Xena, still thinks this is the naïve girl from Potidea, too innocent and pure for the world, unable to grasp these moral complexities and whose rejection Xena was always, deep down, expecting one day.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #this could've been cleared up so easily if gabby had just been 'xena i'm really hurting right now and don't think i can be alone'#and xena had gotten to THE FUCKING POINT #'ming tien's killed countless people and sullied his mother's name directly because of my actions #also if it weren't for his mum i would've been beyond saving and there'd never have been a you and me at all #come with me on the ship and we'll keep talking in the oh i dunno month or so it'll take me to reach china by sea'#instead of what functionally became 'OKAY' 'OKAY' 'FINE' 'FINE' and then fucking off #BUT FAR LESS ENTERTAINING IT'S TRUE

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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OH HO HO I CACKLE IN DELIGHT. I’d completely forgotten this exchange, this additional example in a vast ocean of them, highlighting yet again how fucked Xena and Gabrielle already are. Gabby continues to make this about her, despite it FOR ONCE legit not being about her. Meanwhile, Xena’s so convinced of her own infallibility at knowing precisely what Gabrielle’s thinking and feeling and willing to do or not do that she brushes everything aside rather than hear the claxons going off all around her.

Remember that as far as Xena knows, GABRIELLE ALREADY WENT THERE, and it was as early as yesterday, not just killing *a* child, but HER child. For (allegedly) far more altruistic reasons than Past Xena needed, but not too far out of line with what’s facing Current Xena now, AND it’s worth pointing out that Ming Tien is far past childhood. Gabrielle still needing more information, no problem. Xena barely begun to scratch the surface of her motivations; she herself pointed out that Gabrielle would need the whole story, don’t forget. But Gabby’s already hit her stopping point in the story, completely unwilling to accept ANY rationalization for murder, because once again she’s turned this about HER.

Meanwhile Xena, busy right now being a) distracted and b) so far up her own ass about always being right, completely fails to see Gabrielle’s reaction in the light currently bathing them. Gabrielle reacting like this fits Xena’s version of Gabby as this pure, innocent ball of cookie dough, conveniently ignoring all her recent trauma. I think maybe if the Chin situation weren’t so pressing, or Gabrielle not putting quite so much work into hiding things, Xena might’ve questioned this more. But that said, I also think there’s a part of Xena so desperate for Gabrielle to be okay that it might well have convinced her to believe, regardless of all evidence and reason.

Also though, we can’t set aside that on some level, Xena not only prepares for but CRAVES Gabrielle’s condemnation. Xena isn’t proud of who she used to be, and all of *flails at room* THIS is a glaring neon sign of Xena at her shittiest. She failed Lao Ma all those years ago, she failed Gabrielle repeatedly over the past week, so isn’t she overdue for some scorn and derision?

That’s what I love so much about this conversation. Neither Xena nor Gabrielle are actually talking about the same thing, but they keep talking anyway, not listening and never hearing, and then we all have the nerve to be surprised when it degenerates into flinging each other off a cliff.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #the closer you watch all this #knowing what's to come and where it's heading #the more inevitable it all becomes #i remember back in the day fans were aghast at 'the rift'#which makes sense from an emotional standpoint i that reaction #giving yourself a little distance though and being willing to really think about it #and i want to pop back to 1997 message boards and just be like 'THE FUCK SHOW ARE YOU WATCHING WHERE THIS CAME OUT OF NOWHERE'

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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This is basically just a display of Lao Ma’s massive power and presence without her having to lift a finger. It’s not all that subtle and it’s not all that deep, and I fucking love it all the same. Especially when we cut to the fifth cap, this tableau, slightly skewed, with the feral dog on one side, feral Xena on the other, and Lao Ma the fulcrum between. The scale is already tipped toward the animal, and without intervention, that’s the side that will claim Xena. The animal is driven off however, the woman wins, and Xena is given yet another opportunity to become something better.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #which she'll once again ball up and toss into the fire #because xena has many skills #but not among them is the ability to learn a goddamn lesson the first five times around hahahah

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keyofjetwolf · 4 years

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Basically the entire premise of this show though.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena ep 2x14 #am i wrong?#no i am not wrong

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keyofjetwolf · 3 years

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Once again, the show firing all subtlety engines, but who gives a shit when it’s SO EFFECTIVE. Also though, there’s more going on here than might appear at first glance, so let’s poke around a bit, shall we?

Let’s start with the easy imagery: the toy soldier. Ming Tien is once again utterly captivated by Xena, and as she extends her hand to him, he slowly reaches out to take it. The toy, now forgotten, slips out of his grasp and tumbles to the carpet. Ming Tien’s impending loss of innocence is the immediate place to go. The toy is a thing for children, and his time with Xena will place him beyond such trivial things.

But consider Ming Tien’s disregard for the toy soldier alongside Xena’s disregard for the very real soldier she just killed. Ming Tien could’ve been playing with anything -- say carved turtles -- and the symbolism for his childhood would’ve worked fine. But it’s a soldier, a PERSON. More, it’s a person that Xena killed on time delay without regard, and Ming Tien watched it happen with precisely the same degree of concern. This is a guard he presumably knows. Certainly, he was around that particular guard today longer than he’s been around Xena, and it’s not outside the realm of possibility that Ming TIen has had that guard in his life for as long as he can remember. At absolute minimum, that guard is one of his people, who lies dying (not dead yet, DYING) mere feet away in service to Ming Tien, and Ming Tien doesn’t even look at him.

Then I want to take a second to consider how Xena extends her hand to Ming Tien and he takes it. Again, we have the more obvious imagery in her coaxing him to her, and what almost seems bewitchment on his part as he accepts the offer to learn her terrible lessons.

I’d argue though that the show is saying Ming Tien is more than just another of Xena’s tragic victims. She wanted to make Ming Tzu her creature, but it’s Ming Tien who volunteered. Even setting aside the entire lack of shits he gives about the guard, there’s how he was able to be captured AT ALL. Xena’s on a HORSE, for fuck’s sake, in a palace she doesn’t know, with innumerable places to run and hide that she might never discover. And that’s setting side how fucked up her leg is. With the barest of effort, Ming Tien could’ve run out the door, and even setting aside the likelihood that he could summon a dozen more guards in seconds, Xena can’t exactly hop off the horse and give chase. This situation is almost hilariously easy for him to escape, or to the very least try, but he doesn’t do that.

He doesn’t WANT TO.

A few posts ago, I wondered in tags what kind of person and leader Ming Tien might have been without Xena’s influence. While I hesitate to proclaim someone’s life path set at age eight, I think for Ming Tien, he stood a greater chance of heading down this road whether he crossed paths with a warrior princess or not. This isn’t an abduction so much as it’s a recruitment, and Ming TIen enthusiastically signs up.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #none of which I say to excuse xena’s role #nor do i think the narrative is trying to handwave it #as with much of the show’s examination of morality It’s Complicated

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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And just like that, Xena’s betrayed again. Don’t get me wrong, though, SHE HAD IT COMING. I can’t remember the finer details for how she takes this, but I think we can safely sum them up as “not well”. I’m particularly interested to see it in context of what happened with Caesar and will come to happen with Gabrielle. BUT WAIT THERE’S MORE

As Xena lies barely conscious on the ground, Ming Tien is transfixed by her.

It’s impossible to know exactly what he’s thinking and feeling, but let’s give it a stab. At minimum, he appears to take no particular satisfaction from seeing Xena brought low. There’s no anger toward her here, nor any relief at his father’s rescue. He’s without pity or remorse either, though. Things taking a bad turn for Xena is just another plot point, which Ming Tien notes but seems otherwise disconnected from, as though it’s happening in someone else’s story rather than his own.

And I think, in a way, that’s true for him. What happens to Xena now is ultimately irrelevant to him. Whether she lives or dies, he’s already taken everything he cares to from her. Xena’s taught him about strength and cruelty, but she’s also now taught him about weakness and compassion. Xena held all the cards, but by inviting Borias back to the table, she fucked herself over.

What we see in this moment, I think, is Ming Tien taking this all in and vowing that he won’t make the same mistake.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #xena doesn't make it with him again either #they all learned something important that day

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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We don’t yet know that this is her son, so it just feels a little sad for Lao Ma rather than, you know, devastating. Then even later, when we find out that Ming Tien KNEW this was his mother? Oh ho ho ho, IT’S SO TERRIBLE SORRY LAO MA.

Look how the episode frames the start of this interaction, though, through the bars and from Xena’s perspective. This moment that, to all appearances, has nothing at all to do with her, but which we’ll later learn consolidates so much of what’s vital to Xena’s past, present, and future.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #i love a good visual shorthand #and how this manages #in just that one simple camera shot #to tie xena into a personal moment that has nothing at all to do with her

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keyofjetwolf · 3 years

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So the crux of “The Debt”, our most significant take away from this pivotal two-parter, is that Xena and Gabrielle are PERILOUSLY close to imploding. See also: everything that is about to happen over the next few episodes. OH HO HO IT IS DELIGHTFUL.

What I think I may love best about The Debt (and I say this through the haze of years, and so reserve the right to find all new things to love as I revisit) is the way the mud slings EVERYWHERE. The final shot of the second part is and will remain *chef’s kiss*, but this is also Gabrielle slipping further and further into her own pit of despair and fury. I have no doubt we’ll be talking about this EXTENSIVELY as the liveblog progresses.

We don’t have to wait though, as we slam out the gate with this first exchange of the episode. GOD IT’S DELICIOUS. There’s the surface of course, where it’s Xena and Gabby squishy feels time, and I’m THERE. But when you look at it through the lens of what’s happened, of the things we know that Xena doesn’t, AND IT’S UNFETTERED BULLSHIT. (While also being completely true, which is one of the beautiful things about it all.)

What is the “everything” of which Gabrielle speaks? Well just over the last few weeks, its laundry list includes:

being completely manipulated by the ultimate evil

stabbing a bitch

impregnated by the aforementioned ultimate evil

giving birth to a supernaturally aging baby who may be the penultimate evil

who strangled a bitch

but in whom all (ahem) hope has been stashed so let’s not think about all that too hard

except when her wife didn’t agree and wanted to kill it

leading to the manipulated becoming the manipulator

dead ass lying to and betraying her wife

sending the possible penultimate evil down the river alone to fend for its supernaturally aging baby self

leaving Gabrielle with nothing to cling to but the faintest wisp of hope ABOUT her hope

which she may well never see or hear about ever again giving her neither comfort nor closure

AND SHE HAS TO JUST BE FINE ABOUT IT ON THE OUTSIDE BECAUSE IT’S ALL A LIE IT’S AN ONGOING TRAGEDY PERFORMED BEFORE XENA’S EYE AND SHE CAN NEVER KNOW GABRIELLE CAN NEVER SLIP IT’S JUST THIS FOR THE REST OF HER LIFE FOREVER

This is the “everything” Gabrielle is thanking Xena for. This is the everything she has to put every drop of energy into pretending either doesn’t exist or doesn’t matter.

Gabby’s keeping it together, but by the thinnest of threads. She can’t take much more.

So, of course, she’s about to have to.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #while i generally agree with what we finally have revealed in 'forget me not'#up to and including that the show takes pains to make sure we KNOW it was gabrielle's decision #that everything about to happen in 'the debt' is her deliberate choices #i absolutely don't buy jealousy as the driving factor #not that it has no place i think it does #particularly when we note it's not the first time xena does stuff like this #but what really drives gabrielle to make those choices?#RAGE #REVENGE #this is our glimpse at a gabrielle becoming that xena of the past #it looks different on gabby #as it should #but this is it this is gabrielle at her absolute worst #i'll give the show gold star after gold star for what it does and how it does it #but i think there is where it flinched #ANYWAY THAT'S FOR LIVEBLOGS FROM NOW SORRY #MY MIND'S WHIZZING ALL OVER THE PLACE #oh ps: that smile on xena's face in the last cap as gabby says that #xena you're so clever and yet also so incredibly stupid

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keyofjetwolf · 3 years

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These little interludes are a great way to keep both plots moving, and this one is a particularly lovely segue to next flashback, AND the “It’s not about hate, it’s about love” sets us up for the later reveal that Lao Ma is Ming Tien’s mother (and not Xena and Borias as you’re led to believe).

But also it’s fantastic as a way of reinforcing how bad Gabrielle is at truly seeing the Xena of the past. She’s barely scratched the surface and she’s considering noping out. This AFTER Xena’s said that to understand why she has to do this, Gabrielle needs to understand how she got there. Gabby’s insistent on getting answers, but simultaneously she can’t allow for those answers to be this complicated and unpleasant to chew through.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #which of course leads us back to xena always being right #they just keep feeding their own worst tendencies #even when they think they're doing the opposite #IT'S SO DEEPLY FUCKED AND I LOVE IT

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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“Capable of greatness,” Lao Ma concludes, before they dash off to the safety of the commercial break.

Thinking a bit on this though, what strikes me most interesting is how, at least right here right now, Lao Ma isn’t at all motivated by Xena. Would she be risking all this for just anyone, however badly the person needed her or however cruel these circumstances? I’m not sure! Lao Ma is “big picture” personified, caring little to nothing about the individual and personal in the face of the greater good. That has its moments of noble sacrifice, but it’s also practical to the edge of callous. It’s what makes her feelings toward Ming Tien so tragic, he’s the one place where she unravels.

For all of Lao Ma’s feelings for and toward Xena, none of which I doubt, Xena was her tool then, as much as Xena will become her tool later.

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #everything lao ma does is behind the scenes and i find that so fascinating #particularly when it comes to lao ma finally striking down ming tien from the grave #this woman is sheathed in red #but no drop of blood ever touches her

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keyofjetwolf · 2 years

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This is a note for possible later commentary, not sure yet, but Ming Tien is still curious about and studying Xena, but not scared of her. When she first snarled at him, he about jumped out of his skin and fled. Now, he calmly turns his back to her, nothing hurried or anxious. Is it because he’s now spent time with her and feels he knows her? Because he’s watched her be taken down so she feels less legend and more real? Because she’s in a cage right now and he’s not?

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #that xena's basically a caged animal is of course the low hanging fruit

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keyofjetwolf · 3 years

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Even the narrative is like “NO NO NO TAKE YOUR HETEROSEXUALITY ELSEWHERE FRIEND”

#jet wolf watches xena #xena 3x06 #AND YET STILL TINY BABY 90S JET WOLF #'gosh and golly these friendships! ♥♥♥'#part of which i blame on my desperate desire for friendship to be given the same intimacy and importance as romance #A BATTLE I STILL FIGHT TO THIS DAY #but that only goes so far #now it's just 'LOOK YOUNG ME THIS IS HILARIOUS BUT ALSO SAD YOU STOP THAT'

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