#filoni has always had this problem
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Lots to say about Ahsoka but for now, I wanna talk about Thrawn. After Andor I knew this would be a problem, because it was a problem back in Rebels too.
Thrawn isn't built for these stories. During Rebels, they just put a mask of competency on him while still handing him L after L. "These losses are all part of my plan" "The rebels escaped but I meant for that to happen" ect ect. Just thwarted by the scooby doo gang. Cause let's be honest the rebels crew aren't exactly strategists.
Then in Andor, we get competence. Not brilliance mind you like Syril was still a buffoon. But the ISB came of as so threatening just because they were able to do their jobs without slipping on banana peels. We've now seen how dangerous the empire can be when they crack down and try.
But we're talking Thrawn. Whatever the ISB are? He should be playing in a different league. Competency vs sheer genius. I mean after all this entire season was about how dire things would be if Thrawn made it back to the galaxy.
And what do we get? "Oh these are acceptable losses, oh they won this round but that showed me their flaws. Oh we don't want to waste our precious resources now do we" Proceeds to throw away a few dozen troopers and a bunch of tie fighters. It's the same as it was in rebels. A mask of false threat over just another imperial.
If I'm a normal person watching this show, and have no concept of rebels, much less the heir to the empire trilogy, I can't imagine they get the sense that Thrawn is a big deal at all.
#ahsoka#ahsoka spoilers#thrawn#andor#filoni has always had this problem#if the villains constantly fail upwards then it doesn't really feel like there's much danger for our characters#remember when grevious used to be a wildly competent general/jedi killer?#i remember#remember when thrawn could defeat entire armadas with only a small fleet of his own?#i do#villains used to be where star wars shined#now they're an anchor holding everything down
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Had a thought, I think what's bothering a lot of people about recent Force stuff is that Filoni/new shows are treating the Force like a "soft magic" system. As in it's flexible to whatever the plot is and the few rules can change. Vs the more solid "hard magic" system the original stuff operates on. Only certain people have it, there's established things it can do, and it's main point of flexibility is that if you don't think you can do a thing with the Force, you can't.
Like movies/clone wars/even Rebels establishes that having the Force is an innate thing and while non Force users can "hear" the Force (various other practices we see like Chirrut) they can't utilize it. That there's certain abilities are things everyone has and more rare abilities exist but don't seem to be learned (at least not easily). I'm even willing to say Force Healing works in the og system set up in that it's a rare ability and it takes energy. You can't bring someone back from the brink of death without killing yourself or someone else.
But things like Sabine suddenly able to use the Force or Ahsoka able to use abilities out of nowhere and established to be innate and rare basically throws the hard rules out and gives it a confusing inconsistency that just makes it unenjoyable.
I think the problem is, in part, that canon itself treats the Force as both soft AND hard, depending on what aspect you're talking about, because Star Wars runs on Rule of Cool sort-of above and beyond anything else sometimes. For example, the Force Ghosts. Even within the original trilogy, the implications about how the Ghosts work seems to change from ANH to ROTJ, and then you get into the prequels and TCW and the sequels and now the Mandoverse and the Ghosts are just... wackier and wackier every time. There are NO RULES for the Force Ghosts beyond that the person ghosting should be definitively dead, not a Sith when they died, and they should look bluish. Like that's... really it. Beyond that, everyone seems to do whatever the fuck they want with it and they always have, even Lucas himself.
And then you have other things that seem to have remained fairly static this entire time even if they went unsaid, like who is capable of wielding the Force and who isn't, whether it's something you're born with or just something some people can learn easier than others. Up until the Ahsoka show, everybody seemed to agree on this one, so even though it's never been outright stated in canon that you HAVE to be born with the ability to wield the Force or you'll never be able to, it's just a generally accepted part of the worldbuilding and one that a LOT of the character narratives sort-of rely on. BUT, because it's never been outright stated and OTHER elements of the Force and how it's used can be pretty "soft magic", I suppose it's not shocking that eventually someone would try to switch this one up. It's infuriating and it's bad writing just because what little we DO know about it is so important to how these storylines go, but it's not shocking.
It's not like I hate "soft magic" systems in general, but in a lot of those stories, how the magic WORKS isn't actually important to the story being told most of the time. Like in Lord of the Rings, how Gandalf can do magic is completely irrelevant to the themes and messages sent through the story of Frodo and the Ring and the Fellowship. It doesn't MATTER.
But in Star Wars, the way the Force works is baked into the themes and messages of the whole ass story. What darkness is, where it comes from, what balance means and how it can be achieved, all of this is VITAL to the story being told throughout the first six films. And so a lot of the little stuff that gets added to the overall "how the Force works" stuff (psychometry, midichlorians, etc) should all sort-of work within those overall themes already set up. Midichlorians are important because Anakin is DEMONSTRABLY super powerful, more than anybody else in history, and it DOESN'T MATTER. He's literally MEASURABLY more powerful than anybody else and he still fails to do anything he actually wants to do. His power makes it so that his choices change the fate of an entire galaxy, but they're also completely useless in any way that actually matters to him. The fact that they can measure his power helps that message get across. Psychometry takes a lot of the stuff about how the Force allows you to dial into the emotions of other people and just takes it up an extra notch to really hammer home some of those themes about control over your own power and being connected to the world around you.
So Star Wars, in many ways, DOES have a "soft" magic system, it always has, but the things that are changed or added to it SHOULD generally still fit within the overall themes and messages that Star Wars has set up prior to this. Sabine being Force sensitive randomly very explicitly goes AGAINST all of these themes and messages and that's why it sucks. Changing the system so that literally ANYBODY could have the Force if they just worked hard enough at it (and having Sabine gain her ability to wield it only when she FEELS the most emotions as opposed to when she CONTROLS her emotions the best) completely fucks up a lot of the narratives for other characters. What makes Luke so special if literally ANYBODY could have just learned to do what he did, but apparently they just weren't trying hard enough? If Ahsoka felt this way this entire time why wasn't she training up TONS of people in the Rebellion to utilize the Force, why was she HOBBLING the Rebellion by keeping this from them? It's just... SO so stupid in so many ways. Why does Filoni seem to think that fans want the space wizards to be LESS special? It's ridiculous and it's insulting.
I think that at this point we're also just VERY tired of Filoni's blatant favoritism for his own characters and the ways he very intentionally will bash other characters in order to lift up his own faves, and quite honestly THAT'S what pisses me off the most about the Ahsoka show. Sabine and Ahsoka can't be special on their own, they HAVE to call the prequels Jedi failures because they were elitist in order to make Sabine and Ahsoka seem like they're so much better and more enlightened than those OTHER Jedi. And that honestly just stinks of a lack of imagination on Filoni's part. If he can't figure out how to make these characters feel special without tearing down other characters in this franchise to do it, then maybe he's just not that good of a fucking writer to begin with.
So while I'm not PERSONALLY a fan of the way the Force is often very "soft" in the way it's written, that doesn't make it bad in and of itself, but Filoni (and the Mandoverse in general, but mostly Filoni) feels like he's actively flipping the bird at prior accepted assumptions about the worldbuilding and the way those things really helped build the NARRATIVE just because he wants to insist that HIS characters are NOT IRRELEVANT and are in fact more important and cooler than everybody else. When I consume a Star Wars story, I'm EXPECTING something about how it's better to accept and acknowledge your own darkness so you can let it go and control it rather than letting it control you. I'm EXPECTING something about being selfless and compassionate over being selfish and greedy. I'm EXPECTING something about how destiny exists but it isn't everything and your choices still MATTER (both good and bad). And that's just... not what Filoni gave me. The things he changed DON'T suit the narrative of Star Wars, regardless of whether the Force is a soft magic system or not.
#star wars#dave filoni critical#filoni critical#mandoverse critical#ahsoka show critical#anti ahsoka show#ahsoka tano#jedi#pro jedi#sabine wren critical#sabine critical#so for example: sabine being force sensitive COULD'VE been... fine#it still would've been STUPID to retcon her into a force user but it's not any stupider than bringing maul back in tcw#BUT#sabine being force sensitive SHOULD'VE still worked the same way it always works#she should've been born with it but for whatever reason just had been weak enough in it that no one noticed it or something#she should've had to learn to control her own emotions#she should've had CONSEQUENCES for her selfish choices#ahsoka should've been RIGHT about letting go of ezra the first time and sabine should've let AHSOKA go later#like making sabine force sensitive was (no pun intended) forced and always would've been so#but it still could've been done RIGHT without violating some of the primary themes that make star wars what it is
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Sabine x Ezra/Anakin x Padme:
It's Like Poetry, It Rhymes
I'm already falling
I couldn't help it, didn't think of the risk
I got a problem, problem when I look in your eyes
You're mine and you know it
I'd still do it even if we were cursed
Won't you be my problem? It's okay with me if it hurts
- BANKS, Under the Table
George Lucas has a phrase that I always come back to regarding his work: "It's like poetry, it rhymes."
He said this in reference to Luke's battle with Vader in the Emperor's Throne Room aboard the second Death Star. During the climax of the duel, Luke faces the same choice his father did so many years ago.
And Luke chooses differently. Instead of killing Vader, he tosses aside his weapon and chooses to stop fighting. He wins the battle without violence and claims the mantle of Jedi Knight, which helps Anakin return to himself fully and turn on the Emperor.
For this post, I'm using this phrase to another interesting similarity within Star Wars: the relationship between Sabine Wren and Ezra Bridger having echoes of the doomed romance of Anakin Skywalker and Padme Amidala.
There's no way that Filoni is not aware how he's setting these two up.
Sabine, clearly, has resemblances to Ahsoka's former master; it doesn't surprise me that Ahsoka immediately cut Sabine's training short after the Purge of Mandalore.
Sabine is messy, angry, reckless, impulsive, and obviously depressed after experiencing so much trauma in her life. Despite her efforts to keep up appearances that everything's fine with her, we can tell in the Ahoska premiere that she still keenly feels the loss of Ezra and her family.
Anakin was the same way. We know his story; I won't re-hash it here.
Because of Sabine's inability to reflect on her problems - much like Anakin - they tend to influence her decisions. She can't focus on what needs to be done, versus what she wants to be done.
Love versus duty. The age old conundrum.
She should have destroyed the map to Thrawn. She didn't. She could not face returning to a galaxy without Ezra Bridger in it.
Anakin prevented Jedi Master Mace Windu from finishing Palpatine because he wanted the knowledge to save Padme from death.
Anakin's decision, I also want to remind, led to Padme's death being realized. In doing what he did to prevent it, he ended up causing it to come true.
Sabine's decision to save Ezra . . . well, we've yet to see how Filoni plays this out. But I think there might be a similar outcome here; some sort of consequence for Ezra due to Sabine's actions.
The galaxy - both times - shifted on its axis and began to spiral towards darkness. The Empire rose. Thrawn returned.
The seeds of darkness have already been planted in Sabine. Her decision to hand over the map to Baylon was a failure of temptation. And once you go down the path of the dark side, it's incredibly hard to turn away. Yoda told this to Luke and he failed to heed his advice until it was almost too late.
Lucas, with Luke and Vader, had them face the same dilemma in their respective journeys to show how different their choices would be and how their characters, despite being so much alike, were ultimately different.
So Filoni, with Sabine and Ezra, is - at least in my point of view - doing the same. He's going to have these two reckon with what Sabine did only for them to choose differently than what happened with Anakin and Padme.
We never really saw Anakin and Padme reconcile after his fall. That's the tragedy of their relationship.
But with Sabine and Ezra, there's still hope. They can choose better and not end up cursed like their predecessors.
For one, Ahsoka is literally right there. I'm uncertain as to how much she knows about the reason for Anakin's downfall but if she does know (or Anakin's Force ghost reveals it to her) then she's perfectly armed with the knowledge to make sure Sabine doesn't follow the same path.
Sabine and Ezra also have much more of a personal history with each other. Their foundation is built on stronger material than Anakin and Padme's. There's a lot of trust and respect and love already built into it.
But, admittedly, Sabine's actions threaten to unmake that relationship. I've talked about it before in a previous post; that she could end up losing Ezra due to her selfishness.
And that's not even mentioning the reactions from Hera. Hera, thinking of her son, Jacen, and her desire to raise him in a galaxy not at war. Now it's being threatened by Thrawn's return.
All because of Sabine's need to save Ezra.
I really don't know how, but I'm excited to see Sabine and Ezra work it out. Because we've never seen a proper redemption arc in Star Wars. Anakin was redeemed, yes, but he died shortly afterwards.
Sabine has to put in the work to make up for what she did. She's already started on the path by staying behind with Ahsoka instead of going home with Ezra, but being open to the Force now means that there's only more trials and temptations ahead.
I can't overstate how worried we should be for Sabine. She messed up so badly before being able to tap into the Force. And now she has it.
I know she's on the path to set things right but that temptation will never go away. It will only be amplified, going forward, and I'm sure that there will be more opportunities for abuse considering the inevitable conflict between Thrawn and the New Republic.
And then there's Ezra, of course. Her desire to keep him safe.
Because he wouldn't sit on the sidelines, even if he wanted to. Sabine's actions, like it or not, have involved him in ways that he cannot understand. He'll be at the center of this fight.
I expect Sabine is going to experience some troubling visions soon. I'm thinking similar to what Luke faced in the cave on Dagobah, or even what Anakin saw during his encounter with the Mortis gods.
There's nowhere to hide anymore now that she's stuck on Peridea.
The Force, I'm sure, is going to have a lot to show Sabine about herself that's been hidden away. I hope she's ready.
Much as I want to see these two together and living happily, it can't happen until Sabine and Ezra work through these issues together.
Because if they can't, well . . . we've seen how that story ends.
#ezra bridger#sabine wren#ezrabine#sabezra#ahsoka show#ahsoka#star wars#star wars rebels#eman esfandi#natasha liu bordizzo#anakin skywalker#padme amidala#sabine x ezra#anakin x padme
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BONUS AHSOKA SHOW REACTION EPISODE: GET FUCKED, YOU FILTHY CASUALS
We watched the Ahsoka show and have a LOT to say! Welcome to what is probably our most explicit episode so far, where we chat about visuals, costumes, lightsaber battles, casting and characters, the problems that arise when you try to stack too many shows together, and things you should avoid while worldbuilding. Angela liked how pretty it was. Natalie liked the side characters. Sugar liked that it ended.
Content warning: brief mentions of antisemitism and racism. Our intro and outro music is Mos Eisley Cantina by Spiedkiks on Free Music Archive (CC BY-SA).
Note from Mod Sugar: There were several things we ran out of time to discuss, so here is a quick overview of a few things we want to make sure we acknowledge:
The late Ray Stevenson was a hit for all of us. While, like Hayden, he ended up with some pretty limited material to work with, his performance was arguably the most compelling on the entire show and whoever comes in to take over the role has some big shoes to fill.
Fan reactions to Shin Hati (and actress Ivanna Sakhno) in comparison to the fan reactions to Reva Sevander and Moses Ingram are INCREDIBLY telling. Liking Shin is perfectly valid, liking Shin more than Reva is perfectly valid (although Mod Sugar disagrees with your taste). But it's impossible to deny the racism involved in the way Shin and Ivanna are being greeted with immense amounts of love even though Reva and Moses got so much hate from fans that multiple members of the cast and creative team had to go online to defend her and ask it to stop.
The New Republic storyline and Hera's part in it. This honestly feels like it should've been a storyline for Luke and Leia but is being tossed onto Hera because Disney's too scared to recast either character in order to do more stories with them (Mod Fae: even though much of this storyline is based on a series of novels that centered Luke and Leia). Hera's out of character behavior and the vilification of the New Republic (something that began in The Mandalorian) is immensely frustrating. It's always nice to see Carson Teva (and Paul Sun-Hyung Lee) again, though.
The Jedi criticism was entirely expected from Filoni, but it doesn't make it any less upsetting to see, especially given how positive the show was about Anakin, the man who betrayed the Jedi and committed their genocide. The lack of any acknowledgement of Ahsoka's relationships to other Jedi who weren't Anakin doesn't help the issue.
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8 : Oh so boring
The horrifying MCU-ification of the Star Wars universe is in horrific display as 8 episodes lead nowhere but setup.
Before I get to everything else, I do want to say, Ray Stevenson's passing is a true tragedy, and I appreciate the love and care he clearly put into his character. He was the only compelling one, and I shudder to think of how Disney will probably heartlessly recast.
Now, on to the episode
Well, all the leaks that said it was zombies were right, to the surprise of no one. This is the MCU now, we need something more than just a fuck ton of stormtroopers to blow through, we need an undead CGI army.
First off : The Jedi, The Witch, and The Warlord...FUCK OFF FILONI. YOU ARE NOT CUTE.
The show opens with the attempt to lull Legends fans back into a Sion reference for no reason. Also, Thrawn's super baggy pants seem unnecessary, especially since the design in Rebels always has him in perfectly tailored clothes. Nothing during his decade abroad that would have cause the pants to change that drastically, so it just feels like an unnecessary change that is not an attractive look :(
Morgan's power ups make no sense, and as soon as she got them she was going to die. Her eyes had me making a half dozen Supernatural jokes for obvious reasons. The whole "Blade of Talzin" thing is also very dumb given the fact that I assume Mother Talzin would have used every weapon in her arsenal to stop Grievous, and I would think a lightsaber proof sword is on that list.
The entire "Ezra makes himself a new lightsaber" scene filled me rage for a few reasons.
A) Ezra literally just turned down Sabine's offer of the lightsaber for the martial arts force powers which we never see him use again.
B) Huyang knowing about Caleb and Kanan being the same person feels kinda weird to me to be perfectly honest.
C) Ezra's new lightsaber is boring. Full stop. This is the kid who built a gun into his first one, it makes no sense that he'd make one that looks this mediocre.
D) All of Sabine's family dying horrible deaths on Mandalore has always struck me as a cop out. It's just lazy writing to isolate Sabine.
The Stakes
Spoiler alert : THERE ARE NONE
We knew this was going to end in a cliffhanger for a while now, which means none of the main cast was going to die. Morgan has always been a means to an end for Thrawn, not that her loyalty was ever explain...But none of our heroes were gonna bite it (regardless of how I hoped for Huyang to explode) so there were no stakes. Thrawn had to escape, despite the fact that he is weirdly shaken, so he does. Ezra had to get home, so he does. Sabine and Ahsoka are now trapped on some stupid Mortis world??? Okay, pause, I'm getting ahead of myself here...because before that...
Sabine has the Force now
My deepest condolences to anyone who is finding this out from me, but Sabine is offically confirmed and shown to be Force sensitive. Yes it is dumb. Yes it makes no sense. Yes this is something we all saw being foreshadowed from day one, unfortunately. Especially with the playing down of her Mandalorian-ness (she's constantly losing her helmet, her gun accuracy has utterly gone, she barely uses her gauntlets, etc etc) it was obvious that Filoni wanted to do with her, what he was too cowardly to do with Grogu.
Other miscellaneous shit
It turns out that Ahsoka's shuttle is Jedi era...which makes no fucking sense.
The nightsisters being totally on board with the Empire feels like their ability to tell what's going on in the main universe might be a bit sketchy do to the fact that they missed that the guy in charge of the Empire is the one who ordered Dathomir razzed.
100% of the problems that the gang run into would have been solved if Sabine had a fucking jetpack
They pull the "Thrawn knew Anakin" card out of nowhere in the dumbest possible way, which really just goes to show how much FIloni hates the new canon Thrawn books.
Chopper recognizes Ezra (which was rather cute) before Hera does, because he decides to show up on a New Republic cruiser in full Thrawn stormtrooper garb. Also we don't even get a hug between Hera and Ezra.
Shin (because she exists, remember?) who is also stranded now, goes and appears to be taking over the bandit camp we saw earlier. Have no idea where they are taking that...but honestly, good for Shin doing something for her, this seems like a selfcare move.
Now, the ending...Fucking Mortis
So, the final shot we get of Baylan, he is standing on a giant statue of The Father (there is a statue of The Son, and a destroyed statue of The Daughter) pointing out towards something on the horizon.
Back at the hermit crab people camp, Ahsoka and Sabine (and fucking Anakin's ghost, because that's right people, instead of hanging out with his son, Anakin has been just hovering over Ahsoka this whole time apparently) here this chirping, and it's a fucking creepy hyper realistic CGI Morai.
So yeah, that's clearly how all of the trapped characters are going to get off this planet...the World between Worlds. Now, this brings up a fuck ton more questions...Chief of all being how did Ezra not use this to escape years ago???
And I get that Mortis is not everybody's favorite Clone Wars arc. Which is fair. I don't hate it, but I never loved it, and Filoni dragging in the dumbest piece of Force lore that he created is infuriating. ESPECIALLY with this being so obviously aimed at those who've not watched Clone Wars or Rebels. I'm curious to see how much he immediately recons about it, given that it's been his go-to move since before even Mando s3...
I fear they're going to do something like "Bayan is The Father, Ahsoka is The Daughter, and Shin and Sabine have to fight over being The Son" or some stupid bullshit like that.
I'm glad this is the last Filoni property we're getting for a while, since I'm pretty sure he's not involved with Skeleton Crew at all writing-wise.
I am just so happy it's over!
In the meantime, if you are as annoyed at Filoni as I am, spite him by reading the new canon Thrawn books!!! They are really fantastic and give Thrawn a lot of facinating depth, along with having an incredible cast of side characters.
For those of you who are new or just finding me because of my Ahsoka rants, please stick around!!! I'm sure I will be having other annoyed Ahsoka thoughts in the weeks to come as I think back about the full series and about just everything that it's fucked up. Feel free to pop into my ask box if you're curious about my other Star Wars related opinions, I'm more than happy to answer, though know that for the majority of the recent shows, I do not look fondly.
But if you are looking for some vindication on not enjoying recent Star Wars things, then this is the blog for you!!!
#dave filoni critical#ahsoka critical#ahsoka series#ahsoka spoilers#rambles#thrawn#nightsisters#ezra bridger#sabine wren#star wars#where the fuck is everbody?#anti filoni
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I have a problem with the Ahsoka series...
As someone who didn't watch Rebels and just getting back to Star Wars after being out of the fandom, episode 5 left me kinda flat...
WARNING: SPOILERS TO JEDI FALLEN ORDER AND AHSOKA EPISODE 5
Anyone who plays Jedi Fallen Order will immediately realize that the scene is a mirror of Cal and Jaro's 2nd vision duel. In fact, there were major Fallen Order vibes all throughout this episode and other episodes including all that psychometry (which Ahsoka has never demonstrated before this series but hey... the power of retcon compelled Dave Filoni).
But why did Ahsoka vs Anakin feel so flat for me? What should have been an emotional scene didn't hit me with the same feels that Fallen Order did.
And I got to thinking...
In Fallen Order, we first meet Cal and from the get-go we understand that this is a kid who's had to live on his own for a long time. He doesn't really think that much of himself--as evident by his "Trash, just not approved trash" comment.
Fallen Order and Survivor have been brilliant, character-driven games that really delved into issues of trauma, survivor's guilt, PTSD, insecurity, and loss of self-worth.
We learn that Cal survived Order 66 when he was just 13.
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And that his master sacrificed his life to save him. And we soon realize that Cal has remained trapped--emotionally and psychologically--that day he escaped clutching his fallen master's lightsaber in fear and helplessness. The fear became a means to survive--a coping mechanism.
When Cal first meets a vision of his master, Jaro Tapal, it's on Dathomir. The vault is booby trapped to test anyone who dare enter. He's faced with a vision of his fallen master and is overwhelmed with his own failures and breaks his lightsaber.
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Through Cere's urging and guidance, Cal travels to Ilum to retrieve his crystal and rebuild his lightsaber.
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There, he is tested and he faces his failures and shortcomings. He learns to forgive himself and face the past head on. He returns to Dathomir and back to face his master.
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What was the lesson in Cal facing Jaro?
The lesson was forgiving himself of what happened. Of learning to trust that 13-yr-old child within. Jaro's sacrifice will always be a part of him but he also needs to move forward with the lessons he's learned. As long as Cal is alive, he has a choice to keep fighting--"Hold the line, and trust only in the Force."
It's a classic heroes journey.
The Anakin vs Ahsoka scene is similar in a lot of ways. But I found myself not having the same reaction.
If I watch that Fallen Order scene, I'm always moved to tears because in the hours I spent playing as him, I lived all of his failures, his fears, his emotions--I was Cal Kestis. I was that 13-yr old boy who emotionally shut down to the point that he lost his connection to the Force.
Fallen Order took the time to establish that Cal had been dealing with the guilt of not doing enough to save his master for the last 5 years. It took the time to lay the groundwork so the emotional beats really hit you in the feels in moments when they should.
My problem with the Ahsoka series is it breaks a fundamental rule in storytelling--Don't assume anything about your audience.
A good chunk of that audience never saw Rebels. So, a good chunk of us were asking ourselves, "huh, so what exactly was the lesson here?"
In Ahsoka, we're never shown what her attachments to Anakin are. Is she a Padawan feeling abandoned by her master? Does she feel betrayed? What exactly is that baggage that she needs to move on from?
We get none of that because the series doesn't do enough character work to make her struggles known to the audience beforehand. Unless you watched Rebels, you'd have no clue nor feel the significance of the scene. What we get is her looking forlorn at any mention of Anakin. They just expect us to understand that she has unfinished business with him. What that is... it's never clear in the dialogue. So when we have a vision of her facing her master, it doesn't have the same emotional punch in the feels that Fallen Order has (unless you saw the animated series).
So her lesson was to live? Did we see her struggling with her purpose before this scene? No. Did we see her doubt herself and her place in the Order (in or out of it)? No. Do we see her still yearn for the past and what would have been her place in the Order but struggle with their betrayal? No. The message is jumbled, the lesson is vague because the show didn't do the work it needed to to earn that emotional payoff.
The one thing I loved was the visuals. Cinematography in this episode was breathtaking but it sacrifices storytelling over fan service and nostalgia.
Collider put it bluntly, "Ahsoka’s “training” stands in the place of actual storytelling. By driving Ahsoka and Anakin straight into a duel, we’re robbed of dialogue and character moments that could heighten the story that Filoni is attempting to tell. Filoni mistakenly believes that what audiences have been longing for is another poorly lit lightsaber duel — only this time between Anakin and Ahsoka — but that isn’t what anyone has been pining for. Especially not casual fans who know who Anakin is, but have no concept of why this duel with Ahsoka should matter to them... Star Wars is more than just lightsaber duels and resurrecting the Skywalkers for drama. It’s about the connections forged between the characters who are thrown into situations, cast against the backdrop of a galaxy at war, both seen and unseen. Those connections feel hollow when left to molder in the shadow of nostalgia."
Jedi Fallen Order and Survivor work from a storytelling perspective because they made us care about these characters. They built connections to Cere, to Jaro, to BD-1 and the rest of the Mantis crew and how they play a significant part in Cal's growth as a person and Jedi. And likewise, how Cal plays a part in each character's journey to self-actualization.
The more I think about the episode 5 scene the more pointless it felt (for lack of a better word) because this happens 5 years after Return of the Jedi... the part where Anakin was saved by Luke. She's also met and spoken to Luke so would know that Anakin was saved in the end.
So unless this is just Ahsoka sorting out her own issues of abandonment or whatever inside her head... it doesn't make sense for Anakin or the overall story. He was already saved. He went back to the light side after defeating Palpatine. Luke was able to do what no one else did. Or did she resent that or hate herself that it wasn't her that brought him back to the light? The problem is the show doesn't make it clear what her attachments to Anakin are. If it had spared a few episodes looking back at her training, Anakin's betrayal and her feelings of abandonment, it would have felt like a more full circle moment. If the show had taken the time to portray her going about her life without reason or purpose, the lesson would have meant something.
The dialogue doesn't do the visuals justice. It's purposely vague and cryptic because the show doesn't know what Ahsoka ought to be struggling with. She has baggage but what that is they don't even know. So the visuals try to cover for the lack of any compelling dialogue.
We didn't need a duel or callbacks to Vader or Rebels. What we needed was to see was the same Anakin at the end of Return of the Jedi-- the same Anakin that was saved and made whole. We needed a conversation, not cryptic lessons--a conversation about why he lost himself, Luke and Leia's place in his life and salvation, and a reassurance to Ahsoka that she couldn't have prevented his fall from grace because he made the choice to fall to the Dark Side. Anakin alone made the choice and paid for his sins. That conversation would have brought more closure than "I choose to live."
It felt like the writers went "This would be such a cool scene to have" and "What would happen to get there?" Rather than have everything matter and happen organically to the overall story. By doing that, Ahsoka suffers the same problems as the sequels.
Fan service should serve as a purpose to further enrich your story. And your story should be clear to everyone not just a niche of your audience. A good story, no matter how simple it is, should stand on its own merit. Good character work and set up matters.
Just my 2 cents.
#ahsoka tano#ahsoka tv#ahsoka#anakin skywalker#jedi fallen order#cal kestis#dave filoni#ahsoka episode 5#Youtube#fan service should serve a purpose to further the story not mask inadequacies#jaro tapal#nostalgia is not enough to replace actual story
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Ahsoka "Dreams and Madness" Liveblog
Heeeeeeeeee.
My week has sucked, let's get into this already, this is some of the only true joy I'm deriving from life right now.
(I'm okay but legitimately, my week has sucked, lemme have this.)
HELLO CORUSCANT YOU'RE LOOKING PRETTY.
Ho daaaaayum, Hera bringing the fire to this meeting.
I am... annoyed by the emphasis on Hera as a maverick though, she was the Rebels character MOST beholden to the protocol and procedure of the hierarchy, the time she saved Kanan was the only time she ever really defied orders and dammit I have just patchworked myself my own answer okay so obviously she's normally very rule-abiding EXCEPT for times when her family and the people she cares about most need her help and no one else will give aid to her.
Curses upon my ability to iron out plot wrinkles I don't like.
Filoni must REALLY not like Xiono, he's giving him all the skeptic lines.
Course this is also one of the times the writing has to be hampered by trying to patchwork and salvage the Sequel Trilogy by explaining why the New Republic ignored the problem of the First Order until it was too late.
HI THREEPIO.
Man I am gonna cry ugly tears when we lose Antony Daniels, he loves playing Threepio so much, he's always up for it, never once complained that no one knows him from anything else.
Right so I get why they had Threepio deliver a message instead of trying to CGI frankenstein Leia into this but also Disney are cowards JUST RECAST THE MAIN TRIO I PROMISE NO ONE ACTUALLY HOLDS IT AGAINST ALDEN, TLJ JUST SUCKED AND SOLO WAS THE NEXT PRODUCT WE HAD TO TAKE THINGS OUT ON.
Seriously, the de-aging and CGI puppetry is starting to get uncomfortable and weird.
Chopper bout to throw hands in this courthouse lol.
I'm sorry, the emphasis on just how LONG this hyperspace trip is is absolutely making me reel with adoration for Ezra, he held the air inside the bridge of the Chimaera and the door closed and Thrawn in place ALL THE WAY TO PERIDEA IN ANOTHER FREAKING GALAXY.
YOUR FAVE COULD NEVER.
Loosen up a bit Rosario, you're stiff.
Oof that little bow between Ahsoka and Holo!Anakin.
Huyang begrudgingly having to remember to trust the Force lol.
Ohhhhh bastard, he put explosives in orbit to stop the purrgil!
.....Making the ring against the planet like that was supposed to be a visual reminder of the Death Star right?
The look of subtle but dawning horror in Thrawn's face when he realizes Ahsoka was Anakin's padawan lololol.
Like, "Ffffffffffffff--"
"Jedi are very good at hiding. They've been practicing that for years." Ah yes, excellent, another moment/quote I can add to my collection of "Thrawn barely containing his seething loathing of Ezra" bits lol.
*perks* Oh? Are we at the interesting parts now?
Ahhhh yes the minivan convoy with mom and dad Sabezra at the front.
There should have been waaaaaay more infodumping in this conversation, I need Ezra to boggle over everything.
Sabine still avoiding the question, but lol at Ezra's "The usual level [of complicated] or worse?" that's so cute.
THEIR BANTER IS ADORABLE I AM PILLOWING MYSELF IN IT AND MAKING A BLANKET FORT.
FRICK THIS IS PERFECT.
Ugh and he doesn't push her to talk about it, he's still so considerate of her armor and walls.
Someone, maybe multiple someones commented that they could see serious Two Towers aesthetics in this and... yeah no this is super LOTR-esque.
Lars Mikkelson continuing to kill it with his performance, as basic as it is.
[SIGHS HEAVILY AT THE CONTINUING INSISTENCE ON MAKING SABINE FORCE SENSITIVE] Okay, Filoni, whatever.
I'm ignoring this, I'm pretending she reached out to Ezra instead.
"Took me in when I really needed help." Ohhhhh do not do that, do not plant hurt/comfort ideas in my head ghgkasuhfkauhf.
He is so softly concerned about her aaaaahhhhhh.
I saw a few people confused by Baylan basically abandoning Shin to things here when he was acting so fond of her last episode so let me maybe shed some light on that situation. Ahem:
THE DARK SIDE DESIRE FOR POWER SLOWLY CONSUMES YOU UNTIL IT IS OVERWHELMING, UNTIL WHAT YOU WANTED THE POWER FOR NO LONGER MATTERS. THAT'S ITS NATURE THAT'S WHAT IT DOES. BECOMES MORE AND MORE OF AN OBSESSION UNTIL IT'S ALL YOU CARE ABOUT.
So yes, Baylan chucking Shin out to find her destiny or whatever because whatever it is that he's trying to seize power from is making him completely overlook her feelings.
"If Lord Baylan proves capable..." LOLOLOL BAYLAN DECIDED TO SCREW THAT NOISE HE'S IN IT FOR HIMSELF MY MAN.
GUNSHIPS! GUUUUUNSHIIIIIIIPS!
:D
Ezra can't leave the one crashed one, awwwwww.
Frick, him being the Noti's protector is just so frigging cute. I need fluff fics.
I'M GONNA DIE FROM THIS BANTER, IT'S ADORABLE.
Battle Couple Sabezra now? Y/Y?
Baylan's whole demeanor is changing, it's like he's soaking up the Dark Side energy of this place. Once again, awed by Ray Stevenson's sheer presence. The man feels massive and he's just standing there.
LOLOL THIS WHOLE ARGUMENT OVER THE "OUR" LIGHTSABER.
I'm grinning.
But also I wanna see Ezra hold his lightsaber again, pretty please?
Ahsoka doing much better now that she has both her blades this time.
*pillows hands* Can I watch Ezra forever please. I missed you son. Never leave me again.
HUYAAAAAAAAANG! :D
Oh man, how much dread and chagrin do you think Ezra had when he saw the stormtroopers?
Ho ho Thrawn looks eager for this.
SQUEEEEEEEEEEE.
(They are this close to holding hands you guys.)
This is probably giving Ezra flashblacks.
Oh sue me I want some angst and whump and pain to have happened in the interim.
Ahsoooooookkaaaaaaaaaaa! :D
Oh for, please stop using the beskar as literal plot armor. It sucks a lot of danger out of the fight.
Thrawn being all Xanatos Gambit like the pro he is.
Shin looking like she might cry, oh wow actual emotions.
FRRRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIIICCCCKKK THAT ADORABLE LITTLE LAUGH.
Oh gosh, don't jinx it don't jinx it don't jinx it...
Wheeeeeeeeee that was... fun, actually!
The Sabezra bits were adorable. I have quibbles here and there but I'm just so happy being Sabine being happy and content and seeing Ezra being... Ezra.
Nervous for the last ep though. Hhhgnghhhhh I am very much stressed and I do not wish to be.
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I come with every intention of writing and spoilers: this requires a lot of text but, sorry… it's an interesting read.
I've seen a lot of people complain about SW and their way of doing things; I've seen people complain about The Mandalorian and say;
At what point did it become children's content?
Well, as I tell you, since season 1 this content has always turned out to be family content.
Now the people who say this; It is because it is alienated that SW does not vary; when practically the SW material is pure fantasy and there is material for everyone, of all colors and flavors.
The Mandalorian cannot be pigeonholed solely into violence; friend, then you have not understood anything about this universe.
See Star Wars and everything Geroge, Filoni and Jon have been working on with a whole creative team, etc, etc.
is to enter that world to which they took you "the never ending story", "the labyrinth", "Dragon Heart", "Merlin" and I can continue… magical worlds, where hope resides everywhere, where love It is an important point because despite not being able to see it, it becomes part of this environment and expresses itself in mysterious ways (yes, like strength).
That is why pigeonholing SW solely in violence is taking away a vital part of its narrative, it is as if the conflicts in its different aspects were not shown; or wanting to remove something very substantial that although species from other worlds are shown; They have something that unites them with everything.
"The feelings, the emotions, the humanity that exists in these aspects"
Friend, believe me, when you only get stuck in violence and don't want to look at something else; The problem is you and maybe SW is not the content you need.
And hey; I'm not saying that you have to accept everything, but definitely criticizing just to criticize, hating just to hate is ridiculous and pathetic.
Taking SW or the Mandalorian as entertainment after a difficult day is not bad at all.
But now you want to take this as a personal vent, project yourself, harass and be an infernal hater, sorry but that's disgusting.
And believe me; That violence that you ask for so much is desensitizing you, it makes you someone who loses the notion of how you can harm others and there are people like me; who lives in violent countries, where your life is at stake every 5 minutes, that the only thing we want is to stop experiencing this violence and live fantasy and hope.
So stop messing around, okay.
At the end of the day your requests are like: "You want a good development for Din Djarin, but you don't want him to associate with anyone, you want to pigeonhole him into a life in the countryside with a secondary character, You want him to continue in a dangerous profession that "no It leaves nothing good for him or his green boy, you complain about everything and it doesn't seem like anything to you.”
Please; It's very obvious that you didn't watch the series and don't understand Din's development.
stop fucking around.
A few days ago I was watching episode 3 and I'm going to say this; Anakin is a great character, he is a villain through and through, but all this grew like a snowball.
They lost Anakin and he was already lost, Palpatine knew how to play his pieces.
In the entire world of SW it is difficult to pigeonhole the characters because; The decisions are the ones that weigh the most.
All SW characters have an Anakin within them, they all carry a complex and a mourning of their being; a good being or a bad being.
Doing what is right or wrong is a struggle of ethics and morals.
Anakin was an enslaved child and grew up with this complex, remaining a slave due to his attachments until his death.
Their actions do not have to be justified, but they do need to be understood and exposed.
At the end of the day in this universe
Who has not stained their hands with mud or blood to fight for something?
Who hasn't had to ignore innocent people to preserve an idea or a fight?
Who hasn't had to give in to the bad orders of others to save their people?
When I see people judging Bo Katan, for example; for being a terrorist in her past or for her wrong actions and them using this as a reason for Din not to be around her; I say to you..
How low and dirty do they have to be to use a person's past, in this case a character, and judge them and not allow them to redeem themselves?
Si Din let Bo Katan redeem himself this season 3
Who do you think you are to not allow it?
It hurts me a lot to see Anakin get lost and to see that here they showed us what love is.
but they also show us
"it's the right person at the wrong time"
Padme could fight hard but her own worries and Anakin's attitudes were driving them apart.
When Anakin is tempted to turn to the dark side to gain power and knowledge, he gives in to his attachment to Padme, his fear, and gives in to the temptation.
And for example in the mandalorian
from season 1
We can see how temptation tried to envelop Din Djarin so that he would leave the creed.
Many people believe that this scene with Omera was "romantic" which
it was not so; This series was representative of that TEMPTATION that Din could have fallen into.
It's a symbolic scene of how Din was able to abandon the creed, stop being a Mandalorian, settle down and live in a remote place.
EVEN when he mentions to Omera that his main goal was to honor Mandalorian culture, which saved him from the droids. SHE tries to take off his helmet if he allows it, invasively, as a temptation.
THE CLEAR THING was that he NEVER fell into temptation.
Din clearly tells him "I don't belong here."
Because many say “I wanted a quiet life with her.”
I say; Since he did not agree to stay and preferred the creed and remain Mandalorian, develop his character, surround himself with other people, adopt Grogu and recover his planet together with Bo Katan, I tell you
HE preferred a Mandalorian life and his lifestyle and culture may be anything but "a quiet lifestyle."
Now when they say "Bo katan is a liar, a villain" it's because they didn't understand any point I mentioned.
All SW characters have had to make difficult decisions, Bo Katan has been more oriented towards being an Anti-hero.
And I don't justify her but it is understood and her points of view are expressed, about why she acted that way.
Since season 2 he could have killed or betrayed Din and taken his saber, in season 3 he had all the time and opportunities to do so.
AND IT NEVER HAPPENS…
And it is more than clear that she had a very peculiar interest in him, that she protected him in some way.
Always saving him, even in chapter Plazir 15, she saves him from the separatist droids just when he shows rejection towards politicians.
A clear nod to the fact that she does not fall for opulence or power, she simply wants to right her wrongs and bring glory to Mandalore, so that her people have their home.
Saying that Bo Katan "didn't redeem himself because he didn't do anything"
Sorry, but living with a tormented conscience, with memory and constant regret.
This season 3
Brendan Wayne himself says it in a podcast where he is a guest:
"Din wanted to get Bo Katan out of that depression of that cloudy cloud of thoughts and knock her out with his own feelings, it was like he was talking to my wife"
I uploaded that interview and you can find it on my wall, I don't lie like SCREENRANT, they love to lie.
I don't want to go into more detail but I'm going to close this post with this.
Let's assume Din and Bo don't want anything romantic, okay.
then at least allow them to be comrades in arms; It doesn't take anything away from them, on the contrary it gives them both a lot. Both Din with his own qualities can support Bo and vice versa.
So why separate them if in the end, they are just friends?
And if it turns out that there are feelings and love between the two
IT ALSO doesn't take anything away from them and yes, it contributes to them.
Star Wars is a galactic opera and I repeat; Taking away love just because you are a bitter person is taking away one of its main foundations.
The Mandalorians would be another very peculiar, interesting and unique perspective on love, if they let this union flow.
Because it wouldn't be the typical cliché
We would see Din and Bo fighting together, sharing moments, weapons, tactics, in the middle of a battle, a show of affection, a hug, something very human, holding hands, fighting together, sharing plans, exchanging ideas and even
A Keldabe kiss..
I and many see potential, at least in this shipment there is a lot of material to refute this couple; and I'm completely in the group that wants to keep them together.
This is the way.
#the mandalorian#star wars#lucasfilm#dinbo#bo katan kryze#din djarin#bo katan x din#bokadin#this is the way#din x bo#clandetres#enemies to lovers#loveislove#clan of three#family
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A couple of quick notes about Star Wars, as a spin-off from your recent Star Trek conversation.
1) Star Wars has ALWAYS had 300 pages of backstory on every character you have seen in the background of any given establishing shot. This has helped sell a LOT of toys since 1977.
2) Dave Filoni has a policy of not retreading classic star wars into newer stories. This is great, until you realize that you're watching his 3rd version of "7 Samurai, but make it Star Wars".
for me the core example of the failure of storytelling in the star wars universe is the old expanded universe, where characters like han solo had ten lifetimes' worth of events in their biography because the people responsible for licensing star wars games and books and comics seemed to think that if they didn't include a major character from the movies in them they wouldn't sell. i think this produces the same problem that a lot of long-running comics characters have, which is that there's little reason to care about any individual story involving the character, and there's no legible, self-contained entry point into the setting
you could contrast that against, say, the Culture series by Iain Banks, where each book is part of a shared setting with common motifs, but each character only appears in one or two books max, and has a pretty complete and self-contained arc. (that might be cheating because a book series is way smaller than All of Star Wars, but i wanted an illustrative example that wasn't Star Trek. i am sure the reader of this post can come up with their own examples to round out the comparison)
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Sabine Wren’s problem in Star Wars Ahsoka.
Sabine has been ruined.
And yes, I do just wanna state right away that OF COURSE I understand that Filoni is borrowing ESB’s interpretation of The Force. Resides in all being, you must open your mind, etc The Midichlorians thing established in TPM served little more than to provide needless scientific edge to The Force and made it more exclusionary, I’m glad it seems to go unused nowadays
My issue is that regardless of how feasible it is, Sabine really DID NOT need to take upon this whole arc of becoming a Jedi. While I do understand that this show isn’t supposed to be about The Mandalorians and we already have a show for this, it is bizarre how Sabine’s arc has taken such a radical change off course after Rebels. Her Mandalorian roots look like they have been utterly buried in favour of this new arc of her learning to become a Jedi, something that wasn’t remotely insinuated towards at any point in Rebels. I think we could agree that seldom anyone felt this is the course her character was going after Rebels, where the character’s arc was largely defined by her shamed past and building up to confronting past mistakes and fixing broken bonds with her people.
Sabine doesn’t really FEEL like the same character anymore. Out of everyone in the show, she has the most radically different course for her arc. You might seldom have even thought it was Sabine if it wasn’t for the armour she wore, pretty much the only reminder of what the character resembles from Rebels left.
Sabine was already a questionably convoluted character, by adding The Force and Jedism to her I believe Filoni has made this character a big red target for Mary Sue debates, which is something I was always afraid of for Sabine and something she was a target enough for as it is during the course of Rebels.
And furthermore, if Filoni wanted to have the classic “learning to be a Jedi” trope, I especially don’t see why he had to make Sabine the subject of this when Jacen is RIGHT THERE, practically BEGGING for it.
Throw in some general issues like the actors/material not being the best, and the problems just get a little more blatant. So even if one were to find this both a feasible and logical arc for Sabine, I think anyone can seldom say it was compelling. There was more gripping storytelling to Sabine in Trials Of The Darksaber, a single episode of Rebels, than there was to the entirety of this show.
Remember when Sabine was an explosives expert who liked graffiti and art? I did, I missed her for years. She’s been my favourite Star Wars character for years now, even back during the earlier Rebels years.
I was really disappointed to not find her again in Ahsoka.
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The Bad Batch Series Finale (SPOILERS!)
Okay, I finally got around to watching TBB series finale (after dodging spoilers on day) now that I'm done with finals. Spoilers below.
I will preface this with that I am prone to having initially positive reactions and then later souring on a work after I've had time to stew over it, but I have really been liking TBB Seasons 2 and 3 (Season 1 was neat ig but it had a distracting amount of cameos and was a bit goofy). I think the writing has generally been good and the character work pretty nice. While Filoni has an Abrams problem of throwing vague ideas out there and hiding behind "show don't tell" most of the vagueness in TBB isn't an issue.
The big thing everyone on Tumblr is upset about is that Tech is dead-dead and that CX-2 was nobody we knew. To that I say: good. Tech's sacrifice in Plan 99 was meaningful and directly allowed everyone to survive, and they all did. I saw somebody else post about it (I dunno who, it's hard to search Tumblr) but CX-2 is a narrative foil to Crosshair, a sort of shadow-version of him. Making that Tech would be utterly nonsensical. Additionally, media in general--and Star Wars in particular--has a problem with killing off characters and then just, letting them be dead. Tech died. Period. End of story. Sometimes, heroes die. Sacrifices are made. There's no secret reveal, there's no "somehow, [so-and-so] returned!" they're just gone. Tech's death was a gut punch but it works because of how it upped the stakes and made Hunter and Wrecker waaaay more desperate.
Also, all of the interactions between Omega, Hunter, Wrecker, Echo, and Crosshair and the way they discuss one another were perfect. Crosshair asking who released the Zillo Beast and Hunter & Wrecker immediately knowing it was Omega. Omega comforting the green alien kid (I do not at all remember their names lol) with discussing Wrecker's fear of heights, a fear previously played mostly for laughs. The way Omega hugged Crosshair first, then Crosshair and Hunter because she understood how awful it was for Crosshair to return and the narrative needed to prove Crosshair wrong and that Omega needed all of her brothers. Plus, Crosshair DESPERATELY wanted his brothers to stay the hell away from Tantiss and not go inside.
Additionally, I love the expansion of canon in that Hemlock's research is probably the origin of Dark Troopers and that Project Necromancer was cut short, leaving the Imperial Remnant that would eventually become the First Order to pick up the pieces and salvage whatever the hell they could (Not that I like any of the way the Imperial Remnant and Palpatine's Return were handled in the sequels but whatever).
Also, Helmock getting stabbed, shot sevenish times, and then falling off a mountain will never not be fucking hilarious oh my god.
Finally, Omega joining the Rebellion is perfect. If we ever get a show exploring that it better A) not be another Ahsoka and B) be animated. And if we don't? Well, I can always write another star wars one-shot that's basically "these two characters must have met at some point, right?" About her time in the Rebellion. Rex was there! So were Luke and Ahsoka, and Omega should have reunited with Rex and seeing her interact with the Rogues and any of Rex's jedi friends would be lovely.
#the bad batch#star wars#tbb omega#I just realized why we have to specify “tbb” with “omega”#I still want to know why the hell the Kaminoans made a bunch of female clones to be research assistants#were they just sexist?#was it a detail-oriented thing?#some kinda eugenics project?#Omega being afab could make sense if they were offering Jango a daughter or viable M-count transfer was a sex-linked genetic trait#but emery and all of her sisters make it way more confusing#did they sometimes accidentally get female clones in the cloning process?#and just like#send them there!?#Are they all trans!?#Do trans clones get sent to research facilities!?!?#Oh shit I just realized there's gotta be a bunch of trans!omega tbb fics. I don't read many star wars fics but like#that has to exist#we're eating good tonight#Wendy's Posts
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Minor spoilers for “Faster” and “Entombed”
The main problem I have with The Bad Batch right now, writing-wise, is the treatment of side and background characters. I don’t just mean characters that are side characters and background characters in relation to The Bad Batch as a whole. I mean characters that are side characters and background characters in relation to the plot of a particular episode.
Dave Filoni tends to place his characters in a kind of spiral set up, or maybe even in concentric circles. The main protagonist of the entire series is in the middle circle. The rest of the side and background characters spiral out from the center in order of relevance to the plot.  Dave Filoni is very good at keeping the main protagonist of the series in the center of things, but he’s not great at utilizing his side and background characters.
This makes sense for a show like The Clone Wars where the main characters are Rex and Ahsoka, and there are literally close to 2 million side and background characters. That’s a lot of characters to juggle, and they can’t all always be relevant. It makes more sense to chop the cast up into bite-sized pieces.
However, the bad batch has a much smaller cast, but is being treated as if the cast is the same size as The Clone Wars. Omega is the only main protagonist (as season two goes on Hunter is looking more and more like a deuteragonist). Other than Omega there are not a lot of deuteragonist, and even fewer recurring side characters thus far. The story is ultimately about Omega, and Filoni is very good at keeping her front and center. Even when she is not this week’s main character, plot-wise, she still has her role to play. 
Take TBB s2 e4, for example. “Faster” was a Tech-centric episode.  Cid had her part to play, because she had some plot relevance. Omega acted as a sort of catalyst for Tech to be pushed into his part as the main character.  however, Wrecker was just sort of… There.  he didn’t serve any real purpose other than to give Omega a companion while Tech was racing.
This was the problem I had with this week’s episode, “Entombed”. The main character of the week was Phee. Of course, as the main protagonist, Omega had her part. Hunter had some relevance in going from disliking Phee to tolerating her (I really hope this has some relevance later in the season). Tech, Wrecker, and Echo, being irrelevant, were cut off from this weeks main crew and were totally under utilized.
I hypothesize that this is why we haven’t seen much of Echo in these last episodes. We’ve seen more of Tech, because he has been relevant to the plot of some episodes. I reckon we will be seeing much more of Echo, and much less of Tech in certain episodes where Echo becomes relevant. Especially because it was stated that, while last season was Hunter and Wrecker centric, this season will be more focused on Tech and Echo’s relationship with Omega.
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@theneutralmime
That's incredibly subjective at this point, since we've got at LEAST 3-4 different "canons" depending on how you look at it right now.
The first is Lucas's personal canon, which I imagine is what you're remembering having read somewhere as being just the films and TCW, although this would just be the first SIX films and the first SIX seasons of TCW and nothing else (this includes the sequel trilogy and season 7 of TCW, as well as films like Solo and Rogue One).
Anything beyond those things but that was created prior to the Disney buyout in 2014 is considered "Legends" canon (previously known as the Extended Universe before the buyout). This includes things like the original Thrawn trilogy, the Jedi Apprentice/Quest novels, the 2003 Clone Wars show, etc. Lucas did not consider them part of HIS Star Wars story and had no problem with ignoring anything introduced in Legends material if he didn't like it (nor did he have an issue with USING things he DID like from Legends material, but he often warped it to fit into his own story). Disney doesn't consider any of it as canon, but different creators have been slowly "re-canonizing" some of it in recent media (like Jango/Boba Fett being Mandalorians, or Siri Tachi's existence).
Anything created AFTER the 2014 buyout is considered "Disney canon." Unlike Lucas, Disney doesn't seem to be really separating their films/TV shows from their other content like books/comics/games in terms of continuity, but not everyone is actually consuming everything so sometimes shit doesn't match anyway. Generally the films and Disney+ TV shows (which for this purpose will include things like Rebels even though that show was created prior to Disney+ existing) are probably considered "higher" canon than things like the books, comics, and games, but it isn't as clear cut as it used to be under Lucas. While I think many of the things created under Disney canon, especially the films and Disney+ shows, are TRYING to be considered part of the same continuity as Lucas's canon, they're also definitely still doing their own thing and Lucas himself has no influence on them.
Rebels would be considered DISNEY canon since it was created after the buyout. Same goes for The Bad Batch as well as the Obi-Wan Kenobi show.
Tales of the Jedi is weird because it technically is within Disney canon, but I believe Filoni has claimed that audiences should see it less as actual canon events and more as like... "fables" or something like that. So basically the dude in charge said we can disregard anything in this show as canon if you want to, I guess. That being said, there's nothing in it that completely contradicts the more accepted canon (Lucas's stuff and the Disney films and TV shows), so I think that most people generally consider this show as "canon" no matter what Filoni said.
And of course, there's always your personal canon, which is just whatever you decide to SEE as canon regardless of anything "official." I personally dislike Tales of the Jedi and the Ahsoka show and am fully willing to just... pretend they're not canon. Neither of them has any real bearing on the larger narrative Lucas wrote anyway and you can obviously understand and enjoy the original six films without them.
I mostly use these distinctions when I'm having a discussion with someone about something like, say, the intentions behind the story. Because that can obviously change WILDLY depending on who is writing the story. Lucas and Filoni are not the same person, much as Filoni might like to believe otherwise, and so they have radically different approaches to Star Wars, its messages, and its worldbuilding. Something Filoni writes in a Disney canon show does NOT have any relevance to a discussion about what Lucas was trying to say about the Prequels Jedi, for example. Same goes for anything written in a Legends novel or comic book.
Star Wars is relatively easy to cherry pick from depending on what you enjoy. Especially these days, with how much content is being cycled out all the time. So if you just don't care for Disney canon at all, you can just... ignore it and focus on Lucas's canon and Legends material if you want. If you happen to be one of the people who just doesn't vibe with Lucas's messages, you can focus more on Legends canon and Filoni's more recent work. Or you can exclusively enjoy Lucas's canon and absolutely nothing else. Or you can pick and choose from within each "canon" depending on what vibes with you. The galaxy far far away is your oyster!
#star wars#legends#george lucas#disney#star wars original trilogy#star wars prequel trilogy#star wars sequel trilogy
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CAST AND CREW ON… (#137, NOV 2012)
AS SEASON FIVE TAKES THE CLONE WARSTO ALL NEW HEIGHTS. THE TALENT BEHIND THE HIT SERIES GIVE THEIR THOUGHTS ON THE SHOW!
...”Revenge” being an Insider award-winning episode!
Sam Witwer [the voice of Darth Maul]: Darth Maul’s got the Boba Fett factor going for him. He looks cool, and has an attitude that was established in The Phantom Menace.
The big thing for “Revenge” was to describe the cost of what had happened to him—not just physically, but mentally. We also showed the unadulterated dark side of the Force. It isn’t just cool leather suits and red lightsabers. It’s madness, despair, and pain. He’ll get funnier as he goes along, trust me [laughs]
...the darker aspects of the show.
Dave Filoni [supervising director]: There’s stuff that we shoot that does not make it into the show at all. There’s a level where I say, “That’s kind of enough.” I try not to do stuff that goes beyond what you see in the movies. I fully realize that a lot of kids have not seen Revenge of the Sith, nor would you expect them to: It’s a very intense movie.
That clearly illustrates my problem: I’ve got Attack of the Clones on one side, which is the beginning of a downfall, and I’ve got Revenge of the Sith where it’s a complete downfall of the good guys. The Clone Wars is a hard place to be.
We’ve made the villains very powerful and very dangerous, but people are always hungry for the heroes to win. So I want to make sure that we show that they had a lot of victories, but the Jedi didn’t understand that Palpatine was controlling the whole thing. They just missed the one critical thing that could have brought them to victory. I think this season you’ll see that Palpatine’s plan is more perilous than even he thought possible. He has tried to control many futures to make it all happen, but it’s just not that easy to do, and there are many obstacles that could get in his way.
...34 percent of the audience being female.
Ashley Eckstein [the voice of Ahsoka Tano]: I credit Dave and his team for including so many strong female characters. It’s something I hoped would happen. We’ve talked about it all along: In the very beginning, I remember asking, ‘Was Ahsoka created to increase the female audience?”
Filoni: I felt very strongly that if we did another young boy character, it would just be repeating Anakin and Luke. I had a young cousin at the time, and watching her grow up was a big influence on me. I thought it’d be great to get a girl with a lightsaber out there. I think it’s worked out great. Ashley has been a great ambassador for fans. She’s a tiny powerhouse.
...Mark Hamill guest-starring on the show?
Filoni: I wouldn’t ask Mark to do anything on the show until I had something for him that’s really awesome and unique. There have been times when I’ve thought, Well, maybe this could be it, but than I’ve thought, Nah, it’s just not going to have the impact. I want to be able to cast Mark in a way that’s meaningful for him. It’s on my list of things to do. It won’t happen in Season Five, but, hopefully before the show ends, I will be able to get Mark Hamill back into the Star Wars franchise. It will be in a way that is unexpected.
...how the fate of these characters resonates with a new audience
Filoni: All these kids that watch The Clone Wars know Anakin Skywalker really well. When I was a kid and I watched A New Hope, I had no clue. So when Obi-Wan says, “Vader betrayed and murdered your father.” I said, “Oh, wow. That sucks for Luke.”
But if you play A New Hope for kids now, they’re watching our show, and that’s how they find out that their hero Anakin Skywalker dies—it’s that Darth Vader kills him.
...the look of the show
Joel Aron [CG and lighting supervisor]: We don’t light it like animation. Dave Filoni said to me many years ago, “Get it like Frank Miller; get it very graphic, do something different.” Then George came in and had us push it even further. Because of that, I’ve tried to push it even more. The Star Wars films are an influence, but other movies are, too. I’ll see Drive and then I have to use that look.
We see Anakin’s bedroom in Season Five, and I wanted it to be like Elliott’s room from E.T. because Anakin’s room should haw the feeling of a little boy’s room.
We used some of the Mustafar matte paintings from Revenge of the Sith, but we retained that animated edge because George Lucas was very clear with that early on. The shapes have to be hard; the paintwork always has to look like it’s been raked with a fork. Sometimes, when I go through the still frames, I forget which one was a lighting concept and which one was an actual rendering. That’s what we really wanted to achieve.
...what the show means
Filoni: you think of A New Hope and Obi-Wan saying, “For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the keepers of peace and justice in the universe.” I think of that quote and I hear Alec Guinness. Then I look at our show and see these Jedi Knights, these guardians of peace and justice. I never would have imagined when I was a boy that I would be privileged to be a part of telling that story and working with George Lucas. That’s when it connects for me. That’s when I know that I’m playing with heroes who are giants and villains who are treacherous. We’re continuing a storytelling tradition that goes far beyond our show. That’s when you connect to what George was doing in A New Hope, and that’s when you connect to what Joseph Campbell [author of The Hero with a Thousand Faces] always talked about.
...George Lucas’ retirement
Dave Filoni: To us, his retirement means that he has more free time to come and watch the show! I always tell him that I don’t believe he is going to retire. When he stops showing up, then I’ll believe him.
But he’s taught me to make all these decisions without him. He told me when we started that one of the reasons that I’m here is to make sure that when he’s not around, things go the way he wants. And so I think it’s a compliment to myself, my crew, and to the different divisions of Lucasfilm. He feels confident in all of us to say that he can retire. He’s done a great thing for on as a company by bringing in Kathleen Kennedy to take over the reins.
...the future of the show
Filoni: I’ve always said that we’ll keep making the show as long as people are watching. Because of the demands of our production schedule to deliver this high-quality product, we work very far in advance. We have all of Season Five finished, and we’ve been working on the scripts and designs for a sixth season.
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Y'all, I loved season 3 of The Mandalorian. Loved it for honest and sincere reasons as well as my own petty and spiteful reasons. I loved the space-opera pulpiness, especially of the first few episodes. (Trolls! Underground ruins! Creepy spider droid thingy!) I like that they finally gave some sort of resolution to Bo-Katan's character, and they actually did it through a semi-decent arc - rare thing for female leads in Star Wars!
And now for my selfish petty reasons: I love the Jedi. I don't think there's anything that needs to be changed the way they've already been presented in the OT and prequels. I don't want a fucking "grey Jedi," I don't care about the darksaber in general, and I don't think Mandalorians should be the new main focus of Star Wars.
Watching the past 2 seasons of The Mandalorian has been an experience almost of creeping dread, as it just seemed to feed more and more into these dudebro anti-Jedi arguments, building up the idea that this storyline was going to get rid of the necessity of those pesky Jedi at last. And that, despite all the central Mandalorian leadership figures so far being women (Satine, Bo, Sabine and her mom) that the Ideal Leader of New Mandalore was going to be this badass manly bounty hunter guy from the Real Warrior Cult.
They let that crash and burn in s3 and I am CACKLING.
And look, I do actually like Din Djarin as a character. Problem is, him getting the leadership of Mandalore and the Darksaber and, and, and.... none of this shit ever felt earned. Especially not if you've watched Clone Wars and Rebels. The Mandalorian should always have focused on Din as a character (and by extension his relationship with his son), not on trying to make him into some epic predestined leader figure.
And don't get me wrong, I am sad that apparently with Bo's arc there was no space for Din's arc this season. And they could have had a really solid arc for him, even with the retaking Mandalore plot. They could have examined his feelings about Grogu's return, could have had him deciding all season whether he wanted to actually adopt him or not! (since apparently this was not already resolved like all the fans thought!? Hello?!!)
Anyway it seems that the season 2 story was literally just Filoni's buildup to his live-action Rebels show (AKA Ahsoka) and.... as hilarious as it is to see some fans' reactions to Din not being Epic Leader and Bo-Katan not being put down for good..... I am a lot more excited for the Ahsoka show now. This feels more earned. The bigger story came from Rebels to start with, Ahsoka has been a major part of Rebels. If this is Filoni finally getting to finish the story they started with Ahsoka's characters and Rebels, I'm on board.
And you know what, I'm also on board with the inevitable next 5 seasons of The Mandalorian chronicling the adventures of a bounty hunter and his son. Now that Grogu's backstory is told and his cloning storyline has been resolved, there's no Big Connection between these two and the larger plot. Let them have their own plot at last, Disney pls. Give us a more episodic show that has lower stakes and fun adventures. Something like s1, but the mystery of Grogu will no longer press on the narrative. This is the reason I'm not a big fan of s1 - it wants to be a lower-stakes, episodic show, but the very presence of Grogu opens up so many questions that it becomes maddening when the show never answers any of them. Now it can finally be that show.
#star wars#the mandalorian#star wars rant#this season pretty much felt like a hard reset#like the storyline was getting way out of hand and they needed to simplify it#and you know what? mando as a fun episodic series doesn't even have to have a set ending#similar episodic series in the 90s never did#so that gives me a bit more optimism about the writers obviously having no set plan for the show#now they can just take it season by season#anyway now bring on the rebels live-action sequel!!!#we know it's what you wanted all along filoni so don't disappoint us
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*rubs temples* How is it that for all Filoni’s critique of the Jedi’s philosophies, SO MUCH of his work is basically a PSA for why Jedi practicing non-attachment is Good, Actually?
Maybe, if Sabine had learned the value of letting go, not allowing her emotions to rule her -
It just. I know they’re not going to use this! And they could! They could make it about how Ahsoka was afraid of the wrong things, by refusing to teach people because of their anger risks a self-fulfilling prophecy or *something* substantial! Not what this light show of a holding pattern was.
*also rubs temple trying to figure out how the fuck to phrase this*
Because here's the problem...Filoni doesn't think attachments are bad (not exactly at least) but ends up creating "critique" that are all so disjointed that none of them tie together well enough to make any fucking sense. So the natural response is to go, maybe the thing he's trying to critique is actually right because he is being so incompetent about how he is critiquing it.
If that makes sense...?
Like, lets even just looking at the Ahsoka show in a vacuum of the interior rules that the show have given us.
Ahsoka is a jedi, Sabine is a padawan, Anakin was Ahsoka's master and the only one who ever actually cared about her.
Filoni really enjoys kissing Anakin's ass, something that we saw a ton during the lead up and the advertising with the whole "Anakin was the coolest and awesomest and the bestest Jedi to ever exist" shit.
And so it's fucking hard to actually critique the Jedi and their flaws (of which there are many) when Filoni is out with logical fallacies galore! And writing Mortis as a way to justify his own personal headcanons about how The Force with a capital F effects good and evil, and how attachments tie into the equation.
Again, Filoni is knocking down canon left and right, regardless of if he created it.
The Jedi have a no-attachments rule.
REGARDLESS of the moral or ethical or Anakin related consequences of this...It still exists, and Filoni shouldn't just get to have his cake (Ahsoka being a Jedi) and eat it too (her being totally okay with attachments and everything that comes with them)!
It's like I've brought up in previous posts about this, the example I always go it is that midichlorians exist in the Star Wars universe, regardless of if we think they are stupid or not, they are there. The Prequels firmly established them, and many other properties since then have cemented them. And I'm not saying George Lucas's word is law (the man has a lot of WEIRD ideas) but I am saying that Filoni clearly doesn't give a shit as he runs free with the keys of the castle and no one in the writers room but himself.
I hope that made sense. This show was unique in its way of pissing off the pro jedi folks, the anti jedi folks, and the jedi neutral folks all in one fell swoop due to its inconsistency.
#dave filoni critical#ahsoka critical#ahsoka series#ahsoka spoilers#star wars#rambles#prime responds#anti filoni
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