#don't bother
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On how Crowley and Aziraphale felt during the kiss (but mainly Crowley here):
Ok so first, the main idea for this huge meta is that a LOT of us noticed how the music from the kiss scene is similar to the nebula one, right?
Second, a lot of us also correctly noticed the parallels between the kiss and how it was to taste food for the first time for Aziraphale: bc of his reactions, the hand on lips, the similar way MS acted both scenes, the little inhale etc. So how was it for Crowley?
Aziraphale's reaction to the kiss is practically a puzzle to solve on its own, so it's fun to analyse it, but basically, in a few words, Aziraphale kissed Crowley and he discovered he was physically starving for him, longing for him, yearning for him, for his kiss, and he had no idea. Just like with the ox. And now he needs to gorge himself in him but he can't. Great amazing heartbreaking chef's kiss someone give MS an Emmy.
But there's already so much amazing meta out there about Aziraphale x Ox ribs x The Kiss that I want to focus on Crowley here, and on the music.
So back to the music. The song in "Before the Beginning" and the song that plays during The Kiss (I Forgive You + Don't Bother) are so similar. They're not *exactly* the same, but they're totally reminiscent of each other. The viewer is immediately reminded of those chords that played in the opening scene. It's no coincidence that the fandom was talking about this fact only minutes after first watching those final fifteen minutes. This is an obvious intentional choice for storytelling reasons (David Arnold is a genius).
I have no expertise whatsoever when it comes to music, so I asked our friend @otsanda to see if that made sense and not only it does and she explained it, but she also uncovered so much more hidden meaning in all of it (musicians are amazing), so check out her meta about the music that not only serves as evidence to what I'm proposing here but it also has so much more juicy information in it 💖.
Back to the point: WHY thought? Why choose a similar song? Why intentionally COMPOSE a similar song for that moment?
Hear me out. WHAT IF, by reminding the audience of the creation of the nebula, they meant to convey to us that, for Crowley, kissing Aziraphale gave him the same feeling that creating his stars did?
THAT'S what the music is telling us. THAT'S why it makes us remember "Before the Beginning". It may sound cheesy, but Crowley may have literally seen stars when he kissed Aziraphale. He couldn't react accordingly (just like Aziraphale couldn't), bc it was an overwhelming and extremely sad moment (the music is also telling us that) for both of them. They knew it was ending . They were both having a moment of huge revelation that was fated to not come to completion. Crowley was right, it was too late.
It makes sense to show Crowley's feelings through the music, bc he was the one who started the kiss, and also he was wearing sunglasses in that scene, it's different from a character like Aziraphale that has all his million expressions for everyone to see at all times. And they've been doing this ever since s1 with the Queen songs that play in his car or in the background.
So my point is: the same song being used there makes me wonder if kissing Aziraphale finally gave him what he lost. His purpose. What Aziraphale was trying to give back to him by taking him back to heaven. There's no need for Heaven. Just kiss him, Aziraphale, and there he'll find the stars you want to give back to him. There you will one day see that smile on his face you saw Before The Beginning. Neil Gaiman and David Arnold I am in your walls ��
This is what may lead us to see this happiness in Crowley again (not the action of kissing itself, of course, but what it represents to their relationship, them being together, them being an Us).
As @otsanda said: from the music we can interpret that that moment was a Revelation for them. Almost a religious experience. Crowley found his purpose again. What he'd been missing the whole season (or even his whole life since the Fall, but we've seen him especially depressed this season).
I'm not even getting into the poetry of how one can interpret the parallel to the angel's reaction to the kiss as carnal, and the demon's as religious; that would be another whole essay but let's just agree that it's incredibly beautiful. (Let me be clear that I mean here Aziraphale's reaction is carnal specifically for Crowley, and Crowley's is religious specifically for Aziraphale, not religious as in "worshipping god")
"Do you ever wonder what's the point?" Crowley asked in s2e1. The point, for him, is Aziraphale (if you've seen The Good Place you know what I mean). I hope he figured this out with that kiss, even as heartbreaking as it was. Even if it was a (temporary) separation kiss. (I hope Aziraphale figures this out with time too, that he's more than enough to make Crowley happy, that Crowley doesn't need Heaven, or stars, that Crowley needs him.)
Maybe that's why Crowley didn't leave and kept waiting outside until the very last moment.
Aziraphale and Crowley both bit the apple at the end of s2. There's no turning back from that Knowledge now.
Edit: I just have to add here this brilliant colour analysis of the nebula scene by @halemerry. And it's pointed out that during the nebula formation there's a moment when it looks like two people embracing. And the fact that a similar song is used in the actual Kiss scene I just... I have no words
#good omens 2#good omens#ineffable husbands#good omens kiss#my meta#good omens meta#before the beginning#i forgive you#don't bother#crowley#purpose#knowledge#music#david arnold#reactions to the kiss#the angel's carnal reaction vs the demon's religious experience
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these two tragic little gay men will be the death of me (art creds to @/hausmakes)
#good omens#good omens season 2#good omens brainrot#crowley#aziraphale#i forgive you#don't bother#crying and screaming#and throwing up#loosing it#this is fun#not really#everyday#gets#a little#closer#going faster than a rollercoaster#is this enough tags
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I have a love hate relationship with these parallels
And when you think about it, the plot of both end episodes is pretty similar.
*They need to improvise through a tough situation
*David needs to have a conversation with a woman to open the door to be open to new ideas
*David doesn't want to move on from what they have just like Crowley
*Michael wants to change something just like Aziraphale
We can't really compare the two relationships, because one of them is strictly platonic, but I see the similarities
#knock knock#good omens#staged#aziraphale#crowley#david tennant#michael sheen#i forgive you#don't bother
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I forgive you
I feel like this one line has gotten SO MUCH attention (for good and valid reasons)
But I haven't seen anyone contrast it to what Aziraphale says to Maggie in Episode 1:
"I'm very good at forgiveness, it's one of my favourite things"
And, for the most part, yeah. He genuinely forgives Crowley without holding a grudge on other occasions, he forgives the rent…all without actually saying “I forgive you.”
And… the finale "I forgive you" is…not genuine? Its not the instant forgiveness trope. It's angry, and hurt, and a facade and 100 other deep *Feelings* that he's not ready to say out loud.
Hypothesis: KNOWING that we'd all lose our collective minds about the finale, Neil wrote the E1 line to flag for the audience that "I forgive you" isn't what Aziraphale wanted or meant to say.
It's not "what is Aziraphale forgiving Crowley for"?
It's "what is Aziraphale actually saying in this moment of unprecedented overwhelm"?
#good omens#ineffible#ineffible husbands#crowley#good omens 2 finale#good omens 2#good omens theories#good omens theory#metatron#I forgive you#don't bother#no nightengales
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and specifically the season two endings too
#hannibal#hannibal lecter#will graham#hannigram#good omens season two#good omens season 2#good omens s2#good omens two#good omens 2#good omens#i forgive you#don't bother#nbc hannibal#nbc hannigram#nbc will graham#dr hannibal lecter#dr lecter#hannibal will#hannibal will graham
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Forgiveness
"I'm very good at forgiveness. It's one of my favorite things."
I just had an interesting thought. Aziraphale really doesn't like the system heaven has in place where you can do one bad thing and be punished for all eternity, so what if he figured out a low key way to forgive people's sins on the down low? He distributes blessings to anyone who does him a favor, so why not absolve his human friends when they gossip to him about their minor misdeeds?
"Now this is just between us, right?"
Aziraphale: Of course! (This officially counts as confession now, I've decided.)
*sordid story*
Aziraphale: Are you sorry you did it?
"A little bit."
Aziraphale: (That's close enough. You're forgiven. ) "I won't say a word."
It kind of adds a new dimension to all the times he says I forgive you or May you be forgiven to Crowley. It comes across as snarky, but maybe it's literal. He's actually trying to absolve the demon and it pisses him off that he can't.
#good omens#aziraphale#crowley#ineffable husbands#aziracrow#aziraphale my beloved#crowley good omens#good omens meta#I forgive you#Don't bother
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"Men wouldn't last a week if they were treated like women under the taliban" men are usually the ones expected to be conscripted in case of war and are biggest soldier related casualties in any conflict. They're the ones expected to die for their country. Scratching that, what about the men under slavery in America and forced to work under British, French, Belgian, Dutch, etc. colonialism? Even now, when it comes to hard work, men are the ones expected do it.
That's not to say that women aren't hard-working because they're and they can be. That's not to say that feminism isn't important, because, once again, it is. But radfems sound much more like femcels than feminists. They're more worried about seeing men suffering than seeing women winning. Much like an incel doesn't care about other man; they just hate women and will hate any men that advocates for women rights. But that's just how I feel about it. Do you agree with me?
You're trying to find logic in the random ramblings of a radfem trying to talk about everything except the actual point, which was that they are awful and would die within a week if treated like they treat men. It's a fool's errand. It was just a wall of cope to deflect from the fact she, like all radfem, is weak and only survived to adulthood because lived a problem free privilegied life.
I agree with you obviously, even if generalising feminism as important and incels as against women's rights is kind of an oversimplification.
Thanks for the ask ^^
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Just gonna leave this here.
#doctor who#tenth doctor#10th doctor#crowley#good omens#good omens crowley#tenth doctor doctor who#doctor who spoilers#doctor who season 3#i forgive you#don't bother#david tennant#no beta we die like David Tennant
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hey asmi I was listening to a song and it said “I forgive you” and I stared into the void with tears in my eyes for a solid two minutes
That seems like a very valid reaction. I approve.
I get tears in my eyes the second I hear any mention of stars, so.
#good omens mascot#weirdly specific but ok#asmi#maggots#good omens#good omens brainrot#THE BRAINROT IS REAL#final fifteen#i forgive you#don't bother
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I genuinely feel bad for people who are in both in the DW and GO fandom...
#good omens#good omens 2#ineffable husbands#ineffable divorce#crowley#aziraphale#aziracrow#season 2#doctor who#doctor who x master#10th doctor#12th doctor#david tennant#peter capaldi#i forgive you#don't bother#heartbreak#FUCK YOU WRITERS#I love them#Sigh#Sad#good omens crowley#good omens aziraphale#aziraphale x crowley
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Long time no see! Have you heard of this book?
Nope, never heard of it. But from the blurb, and the improbable name of the French character, I can see that the author, who was decidedly British, knew nothing about French history and the Revolution. The association with Madame de Stael does not bode well.
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the "i forgive you" could mean so many things
it could mean, "i forgive you for choosing to leave me"
"i forgive you for kissing me" (which would be heartwrenching)
"i forgive you for not coming with me"
and the "don't bother" could mean so many things as well
"don't bother forgiving me"
because: "you pushed me away"
"you made it sound like i wasn't good enough for heaven" (when in reality he was saying heaven wasn't good enough for him *I'M SOBBING*)
"you didn't let me finish, you interrupted me in something that was very difficult for me to say"
oh lord someone needs to stop me before i actually lose my mind
#good omens#ineffable husbands#aziraphale#good omens s2#crowley#aziracrow#asdfghjhgfdsdfgh#holy shit#spoiler#the kiss#i forgive you#ineffable divorce#don't bother#i am foaming at the mouth#neil gaiman count your days
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!!!SPOILERS FOR S2 OF GOOD OMENS!!!!
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I just realized that God is trying to milk that Pining and 6000 year Slow Burn tag and trying to earn that Angst tag. I don't mind as long as it's Angst with a Happy Ending
#good omens#good omens 2#good omens s2#gos2#good omens spoilers#good omens s2 spoilers#i'm just hurting so much#oh lord heal this fandom#david tennant#michael sheen#neil gaiman#i just wanted them to be happy#season 3 will be the only thing to give me peace after this#nothing lasts forever#i forgive you#don't bother#HELP#IT HURTS
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Okay but have you ever considered that maybe Crowley responded with a "Don't bother" after Aziraphale forgave him because by not doing so, it means that there is still something that could connect them both? Unforgiveness. Aziraphale not forgiving Crowley. If it means that he'd still feel "something" towards him– even if it doesn't equate to love, just something, anything. Even just a little bit, even if it's raging, as long as Aziraphale feels something for him. Crowley tried every means possible to make him stay, to keep him in the bookshop, including the kiss that he did oh so desperately. After that, he waited– maybe Aziraphale changed his mind? And then we got it: "I forgive you". There was no hope, Crowley knew it was the end of it, Aziraphale chose Heaven over him. Crowley now thinks that Aziraphale doesn't love him back as much as he do, as deep as he does. Don't bother forgiving him, Aziraphale. It's the only thing you can leave behind. Let Crowley sin and be unforgiven.
#good omens#aziraphale#crowley#aziracrow#good omens season 2#good omens spoilers#please#no nightingales#i forgive you#don't bother#Where are the fucking nightingales#go season 2#good omens 2
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Looks like my last post was like 7 months ago. I can really only remember back to July but I broke my foot in July at a birthday party. Once that healed I have just been playing volleyball, dating, and working.
I'd really like to do something was music but that's been a struggle. Also wow, saving money is fucking hard. Life is okay but it could be better - feeling grateful overall. Pretty wild to think where I was about 2 years ago vs. today.
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