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ears-awake-eyes-opened · 4 years

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Haymitch, Effie, and Hayffie

(Musings, character analysis, my headcanons about their backstories and forward stories, especially about their relating and relationships. I felt like I needed to think through some of these ideas before writing more fics. These reflections got incredibly long, and I considered just keeping this in my drafts for myself, but maybe something here will resonate with someone else too, so here we go.)

I’ve been writing about Hayffie for a month, and I have some thoughts about their relationships/sexual histories both individually and together. It’s film-Hayffie that I’m into, so some of my ideas might conflict with what’s canon in the books, which I haven’t read in nearly a decade. When I eventually reread the books, I may feel differently, but these are my musings for now.

Haymitch:

We know Haymitch had a girlfriend when he won the second Quarter Quell at age 16. Snow had her murdered along with Haymitch’s mom and younger brother, so I’m guessing Haymitch loved her, otherwise Snow wouldn’t have bothered to have her killed since Snow always kills with intention.

Haymitch I imagine has probably always been good-looking-enough, but not extremely handsome. (I say this despite the big crush I have on Woody). I can see Haymitch as a kid having been witty, reasonably athletic, reasonably popular, a class clown and fairly obnoxious. As a teen without a father present/alive, home would have been a place of hard work, so school was likely Haymitch’s primary outlet for fun. I figure that particular girlfriend may have been his first serious love (and probably his only love).

I think he and she had some experience with sex but not a lot. They probably explored each other and discovered things together. They may have had sex only soon before the reaping, just in case the worst happened and one of their names was pulled. I’m remembering the guy I dated when I was 16. I loved him, but I didn’t want to have sex with him. However, if it had been the feeling of the end of the world, I probably would have slept with him. So, logic tells me they did.

Fast forward. Traumatized post-Games Haymitch wouldn’t have been with anyone else for a long time. I think it may be canon that he refused prostitution because he had no loved ones left to lose, but even if Snow did prostitute him, it would have been maybe once when Haymitch was still a minor, like Snow’s last nail in the coffin of crushing him. But Haymitch would have ultimately proven himself to be too much of a loose cannon/liability for Snow to use in that way.

So I imagine Haymitch has some history of sexual trauma. First in the intensity of sex with his beloved girlfriend within the feeling of coercion (let’s do it now or maybe never). Then with being prostituted to likely some wealthy middle aged woman. Rather than being the prostitute of a man, I think Haymitch would have killed the man or killed himself, depending on his trauma state at the time. So I don’t see sex with men, forced or otherwise, in his history.

It’s canon that Haymitch is basically a loner/shut-in who doesn’t like people in his house and sleeps holding a knife (when he’s able to sleep). I see him having the potential to be quite desirable to women and the potential for being a player. But trauma put a damper on those potentials. I think he could have sex whenever he feels like it, but for a couple of decades after his Games he just doesn’t very often (on average over those years once or occasionally twice a month maybe) because women are too much of a hassle, and they aren’t the love he lost. Alcohol is strongly his drug of choice over sex.

When he does have sex, I believe it’s one-night stands or casual sex with women who are players themselves and probably who he mildly dislikes. He steers clear of relationships that seem at all likely to become emotional. He firmly does not want to get attached to anyone again. Liking people is something he perceives as risky. Loving people is something he perceives as suicidal.

Haymitch is perceptive. Over the years, he’s learned some basics about what feels good to women physically. Pleasuring women has never been his first priority during sex, but I see him as the kind of guy who gets off on them getting off, so he would have made an effort to experiment a little and pay attention to the results. Unfortunately, alcohol often gets in the way of really focusing on women while he is with them. Which is one of the reasons Effie likes him better sober...

Effie:

I like to imagine Effie in early life, 0-9 maybe, with a very old great-grandmother in her 80s-90s. This great-grandma had memories of growing up in a free-er nation before the dictatorship gained in intensity, before the first revolution, before tyranny. I imagine she told Effie folktales that Effie remembers as bedtime stories. Those appeared to be fictional but were filled with archetypes and the roots of humanity. Her great-grandma was careful to protect the family, so she never spoke openly against the Capitol, but she understood and communicated deeper truths which shaped Effie’s heart/unconscious mind. I like to imagine Great-grandma offered Effie a reflection of the girl’s authentic self and offered her a small taste of empowerment. “Never forget you’re more than a pretty, well-mannered girl. Your wit is sharp. You have the capacity to be so much more than a face and a body bending to someone else’s will.”

To Effie’s controlling parents, and even to Effie herself in time, the great-grandma would seem eccentric. I envision her telling Effie that a woman doesn’t need a man to please her or to achieve greatness, and teaching her that she can please herself in all ways including financially and physically. Those lessons sunk in. I see Effie’s great-grandma having possibly been widowed young and surviving on her own awhile, with kids including Effie’s grandparent. In many ways Great-grandma was a self-made woman in her time.

Effie lost most of that connection to antiquity and to her authentic self when her great-grandma died, and she had nothing substantial to shield herself against the tight control and will of her family and Capitol life.

I imagine Effie mostly complied with that control but claimed autonomy in subtle ways. I think she had sex throughout the second half of her teens and throughout her 20’s, always being discerning, discrete, and selective about partners, rather than *sleeping around.* She had an intention behind each conquest. These conquests often had to do with aspects of self discovery, the desire for validation, and facilitating what she wanted in life, especially the ability to project a certain image in order to get where she wanted to go.

Did Effie fall in love with some of those young men? Probably, because underneath her thick facade, Effie has a tender heart which the facade protects like armor. Did she ever have her heart broken? Seldom. For the most part, she inherited and practiced ways of staying in control of her emotions within relationships. Most men thought of her as a desirable pain in the ass, but worth the high maintenance because she knows how to pleasure a man, she gives that focused attention during significant times including sex.

Did she ever experiment with sex with women? Possibly at some point out of curiosity and in seeking validation, but I don’t see women as her jam. Pretty and popular in childhood, she got along with girls in school. Later in her teens and adulthood, women mostly resented her natural beauty, fashion sense, drive to achieve, ability to attract attention, and her perfected facade. I see Effie feeling wistful at times for the quality of connections she had in youth, but her understanding of survival in Capitol society dictated that image and career-based connections were more important than purely emotional ones.

By age 30, during her years as an escort, Effie is quite singularly driven. She knows her body well, but there’s a veil over much of her inner self. The facade she’s built up is so thick that she doesn’t know much anymore about the vulnerable self beneath it. Haymitch can see the softness in her, whether he’s sober or drunk. She is both terrified and thrilled by his capacity to see the self she hides.

Hayffie:

I picture Haymitch as one of the first crushes Effie can remember having. I think of her as 8-9 years younger than him, so she would have been 7, nearly 8, when he was in the second Quarter Quell. She would have been quite taken with the way he held Maysilee’s hand as she died. Just as Effie was genuinely touched by Katniss caring for Rue as she died.

I see Effie having only been an escort since maybe the 72nd Hunger Games — long enough for the District 12 folks to know and mock her, but not too long. She had ambitions to move up in the districts, and she was on her way to proving herself as an effective tool of the Capitol: looking, sounding, and acting the part she was playing, and keeping herself veiled to the injustice of the Games and of tyranny in general. She was brainwashed by a lifetime of coercive propaganda, not because her mind is weak, but because the propaganda was so prevalent and multifaceted, including coming directly from her primary caregivers.

I think she probably expressed interest in Haymitch early on in their work together, seeing him as his idealized younger self. I think he turned her down then, in part because there was something about her that he enjoyed too much, even though he may not have been able to pinpoint what it was, because in the beginning he perceived her to be mostly ridiculous.

I see Hayffie playing cat and mouse for a few years — teasing, taunting, holding each other at bay and not doing much beyond tormenting one another during games 72-74, and learning each other’s nuances along the way. Effie would find Haymitch’s uncoothness off-putting and his wildness tantalizing. He would find her poshness annoying and the woman underneath all those layers a sensual curiosity.

The third Quarter Quell effected a personal transformation for each of them. Haymitch accepted the reality that he was caring about people; he couldn’t stop those emotions, even with alcohol, and he really didn’t want to. Effie’s eyes were opened to the injustice of the Games through her deep affection for her team of victors. Her armor came down enough to experience heartbreak — a related heartbreak to what Haymitch was experiencing as he lost old friends, like Chaff and Mags, and as he cared for Katniss and Peeta and helped launch a revolution.

I see this as the vulnerable time for Hayffie when their personal games of cat and mouse would pause, and intimacy would creep in and feel scary. They’d banter it away for a while but by then they’ve seen each other’s heartbreak, and the contents of a heart once seen, can’t be unseen.

In the absence of liquor for him and in the absence of facades for her (i.e. in District 13), hiding authenticity from each other would be tough. The taunting chase would continue in spirit, but physically they’d be ready to catch each other and play with that physicality if for no other reason to provide distraction.

“Let’s keep this casual,” they’d say. “No strings.” But the tapestry that had been weaving so long would take shape nonetheless. Strings would be everywhere, drawing them together faster than they could cut them.

Sex between them, after years of avoiding it with each other, would feel easy and alive, like breathing. Their bodies would fit well, so neither would have to work too hard to pleasure the other. I can see that sex between them has the potential to be very rough at times, though always with mutual consent. They both would be this interesting mix of selfish and giving. Their parting and coming together I see going on for years with feigned casualness. Cat and mouse again. The lightness would become more and more of a lie. Sex with other people would eventually whittle to nothing without much discussion about it.

They’d meet themselves in time as free individuals, and they’d realize they had fallen for each other all along, despite everything and because of everything. They would keep trying to stop it, and they’d keep failing miserably until finally moving into acceptance.

I don’t picture them ever married. Haymitch would want no government or religious bullshit in their personal business. But I see them eventually sharing their lives with increasing intimacy, how ever that might show up. I’m not sure yet how it would show up, though I like to think that several years down the road, Effie will move to District 12 “as the place becomes more civilized,” and when she perceives that there is meaningful work for her there. I also believe Effie’s perception of “meaningful work” will shift in time, initially out of necessity and then organically as she reconnects with her deep self and reclaims it.

I don’t picture Hayffie with kids. Okay, that’s a lie. I totally picture them with a kid and would have a blast writing the humor, affection, and angst inherent for them within that choice, but I don’t think that choice is in character for them. If they conceived a child, that would happen inadvertently. They’d both be terrified of parenthood, given their histories individually and together. Most likely Effie would terminate the pregnancy, but she’d be conflicted. And the more opportunity Haymitch would have to think about it, the more conflicted he would be as well.

The Hunger Games takes a toll in both ways. Kill a fetus to keep it from being born into a world where they’ve participated in and witnessed the killing of children? Or let the fetus become a baby with traumatized dysfunctional parents and hope for the best? I think they’d see it as a lose-lose, but also would feel so much tenderness about the possibility, especially if it happens years down the line in the feeling of “let’s do it now or maybe never.” Sound familiar? There’s some trauma reenactment there.

Trauma bonding and secure attachment:

I think that Hayffie could fall easily into reenacting trauma with each other. Here are some ways I see that playing out...

Haymitch experienced severe attachment trauma while still in early life, losing his parents and everyone he loved. This was on top of the trauma of being hunted and killing and witnessing death within the Games. This trauma was inflicted directly or indirectly by the Capitol. Haymitch has a lot of unresolved anger at the Capitol. Without integration there’s no healthy way for someone to cope with that severity of trauma. Hence, his addiction/alcoholism.

From the perspective of dysfunction, I can see him drawn to Effie because she’s a Capitol girl, controlled/controlling and emotionally abandoning. She doesn’t show up all warm and fuzzy and “talk to me, honey.” She shows up with open criticism and disdain for him. On the surface, she has those fundamental qualities in common with the primary abuser throughout his life (Snow). So through the lens of trauma reenactment, it makes perfect sense that he’d want to fuck her.

I imagine Effie experienced early life trauma that was more subtle but still impactful. She grew up in a place where one misstep could lead to her family’s ruin. She grew up with parents who likely demanded no missteps and were emotionally unavailable, being so focused on achievement over emotional health. To keep her parents’ approval Efffie needed to do everything precisely: appearance, manners, attitude, performance. When she didn’t exceed par, I imagine she was criticized and chastised. When she exceeded par she was praised. (Intermittent reinforcement.) Throughout her early life, she marinated in rigidity with constant reminders of what happened to people who were imperfect. Effie became an attention seeker and a people-pleaser. She sought validation from not just the masses, but also specifically from people who were the most critical of her and dependent in some way upon her *performance.*

From the perspective of dysfunction, I can see her drawn to Haymitch because he doesn’t offer her consistent validation. Even his *compliments* are teases, taunts, and mocking sarcasm. His alcoholism makes him emotionally unavailable and at times intermittently reinforcing. In moments, he’ll look right into her with unmistakable genuine attraction, and she’ll feel high when he does. The high comes because the attention is intermittent and unpredictable. In that state of emotional drugs flowing through her, it makes total sense that she’d want to fuck him.

Their potential for trauma bonding will make their relationship at times explosive and volatile, not overtly abusive but with sharp tongues and intense physicality that at times borders on punishing. Their desire for each other grows like wildfire, their bond tightens, and sex between them is compelling and delicious in a way that I don’t think either of them has experienced before.

I like to believe their potential for trauma bonding is only part of what draws them together.

I think Haymitch’s compassion in the second Quarter Quell touched young Effie’s heart very genuinely, and her young heart was also shaped by her great-grandmother’s unconditional love. With that heart, she in time grows deep affection for “her victors,” not just as validations of her self-worth, but as people who are truly deserving because of who they are, not what they do.

I think Haymitch has the capacity to see through Effie’s walls of makeup, clothing, and attitude to the heart of the girl who has watched him kill but doesn’t regard him as a murderer, rather she sees him still as the boy who held his friend’s hand in death. I like to think of him seeing that core aspect of himself through her eyes. Each time he sees it, he forgives himself a little more for the responsibility he feels for the death of his loved ones and everyone he ever killed in order to stay alive, and evey tribute who died under his mentorship. Haymitch carries impossibly heavy burdens on his shoulders, hence the alcoholism. Effie’s regard for him as a victor, a victor who showed compassion to Maysilee, to Katniss, to Peeta, and so on, lightens more and more over time the burden he carries.

I think their relationship is an interesting mix of dysfunction and healing. It’s raw and messy, and Effie desperately needs raw and messy, even though she fights against that a long time. Their relationship also has the capacity for deep tenderness and connection, and Haymitch desperately needs tenderness and connection, even though he fights against it a long time.

I so want to see Effie raw and messy. I so want to see Haymitch tender and connecting. That’s the unfolding I write for them together. It’s tough not to rush it, because it’s so interesting, and I want to see it all so badly.

After all these years, I am adoring Hayffie in this unexpected way. This ship is surprisingly intricate and beautiful.

P.S. If you made it this far, wow, and thanks for caring about the characters enough to read my extended ramblings. Comments welcome. I love to hear other people’s thoughts about Hayffie.

#hayffie #hayffie musings #effie x haymitch #haymitch x effie #effie trinket #haymitch abernathy #thg #hunger games musings #the hunger games #hunger games #character analysis #trauma reenactment #attachment trauma

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bondsmagii · 4 years

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5, 6, 10, 12, 23, 24, 30, 48 :)

thank you! 👌

5: what is something you’re proud of?

over the last few months especially, I’ve gotten a lot more self-disciplined and self-motivated, which has always been incredibly difficult considering I have what we referred to earlier as a diagnostically bad attention span. I’ve seen an increase in my productivity and an increase in my staying on top of things, and as a result I’m getting a lot more done that I want to get done and I’m not as stressed out or rushed by things. it’s something that I have to consciously commit to every day, because it never gets easier to just get up and do things, but the fact I can make myself do it now (and it is easier once I get started) and I can actively see the results of this discipline is something I’m very proud of.

6: name three books that changed your life.

how the fuck do I choose, honestly. the first three that come to mind are The Secret History by Donna Tartt (I would not be nearly as Like This as I am without reading that book); IT by Stephen King (as an example of How To Write, this book is second to none and my writing is all the better for it); and probably the whole Shades of Magic series by V. E. Schwab (just in terms of how enjoyable it is, and how much it’s made me realise I can really Go There in my own writing).

10: state an unpopular opinion that you have.

I’m well aware that this is a popular opinion in the real world, but it seems to be growing ever more unpopular on tumblr dot com, so: reading about things in fiction does not make you more likely to carry out those things in real life, and those who do have other mental issues going on that have stopped them from telling the difference between fiction and reality, or have otherwise convinced them through delusion or paranoia to act. reading and writing about nasty things in fanfic (or any media, really) will not make you go out there and commit those acts, and a vast, overwhelming majority of people engage in these things and live absolutely normal, non-murderous lives. like. it just doesn’t work like that, and I have seen no compelling evidence to say it does. the most popular thing I’ve seen thrown around on here is a study where one group learned to play a simple piano piece, and the other group simply visualised it, and yet both groups created the neural pathways in their brains that was needed to play the piece. this is stupid, because the people in the second group still didn’t play the damn piano. it’s the equivalent of one group beating someone up, and the other group visualising it. the reason the pathway is there is because the second group now possesses the knowledge of how to do it, and we all know how to hurt or torture or murder people. it doesn’t mean we’ll do it. like. people who sincerely believe that reading/writing about something will cause more people to go out and do it are simply thicker than a bowl of oatmeal and that’s that.

12: describe your ideal date?

I have no idea tbh. all our dates have kind of been pretty impulsive, and I don’t have anything necessary for an ideal date other than “spending time with someone I love, having fun and maybe spoiling ourselves a little”. I think we’ll be hard pushed to beat what I consider to be the best date we ever had, though, which was of course staying at the museum until 10pm, wandering around all the empty lowlit galleries, and then running around London until the early hours.

23: how are you feeling in this moment?

emotionally I’m feeling mostly content. I’m just taking it easy and will commit back to my full workload tomorrow, and I feel OK about that so I’m just having fun doing whatever I want. physically I am very achy and tired, which is a bit of a drag.

24: are you reading a book at the moment? what do you like about it?

I am! I’m reading The Foreign Correspondent by Alan Furst, who is of course a writer you recommended to me. I’m 100 pages in right now and I’m enjoying the fast pace it’s written at, and how the story doesn’t get lost in itself and simply paints a clear picture of everything you need to know. I also like the moments of humour and ridiculousness in it, and of course there’s a heavy sense of danger and espionage which is always fun. the book breathes a lot of life into Europe at a very specific and complex time, which is always cool to see.

30: name an experience in your life you wish you could do over?

university, without a doubt. I did the best with what I had, but my god. I’m so angry at the circumstances that led me there; I’m so upset that I had to suffer all the way through it, when I wasn’t ready for it and I couldn’t do my best at it, all because it was the only way to escape a life that was even more horrific. I’m proud of myself for escaping that life via whatever means possible, but I have no sincere good memories of university itself, and as someone who loves learning as much as I do, I feel dreadfully robbed.

48: do you typically look for a partner with the same traits as you or someone to complement yours?

honestly what do you think ya clown!! I mean, technically we didn’t look for one another in that way, it just kind of happened, but I think there’s something to be said for how it happened. you and I are creepishly alike in some respects (as in, I could not make it up and if someone wrote two characters with that much in common I would call it unrealistic) and generally we have at least one or two obsessions in common at the same time, but on the other hand we are sometimes so different that I can’t believe we manage to get along as well as we do. when I look at some of the differences we have in philosophy and interpretation and outlook, I have no idea how we don’t throttle one another, but I suppose it’s because of the rest of the qualities and traits that we do have in common – we’re both incredibly open-minded, and have a very you do you attitude. (even if I do have to take a deep breath every time you try and tell me salmon tastes good. like. it just does not but alright.) so I suppose in that respect we compliment one another; it’s different enough to keep things interesting, but we have enough in common that we’re not completely alien to one another. I suppose what I’m trying to say is that a combination of both seems to work best.

#about me #fill my inbox meme #karlacton #asks

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holden-norgorov · 6 years

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A seriously angry recap of all the things I hated in the finale.

Because I had to write down all the disappointment and outrage that I have inside, otherwise it will consume me until I die. I had to give vent to everything that disgusted me in a less-detatched, more personal way than the unemotional one my objective thoughts usually are expressed with. If you want to read highly pissed-off complaints for healing purposes, this is your post.

Implying that discovering that your mother is also your step-sister is a more validating reason to commit murder than being yourself a victim of physical and psychological abuses for years during your childhood. Offensive, short-sighted, self-erasing. By suggesting that Wolfgang killed his father and uncle out of this revelation, the writers nullified the character’s self-worth, depth and integrity.

“I’m not worth it”. “Wolfgang, you are!” It turned out he wasn’t worth it at all because things didn’t change. Nobody had any kind of conversation and the result was that Kala was portrayed as happy staying in the loveless, unhealthy marriage she was already in and that Wolfgang kept being the “lover” who wasn’t worth being chosen. Rajan became suddenly so important that an entire two-seasonal storyline of the most epic love story of all time had to be thrown out of the window just to please him? Who the fuck cared about him? He was selfish and sexist for two seasons, and a lame, uninteresting character with no personality beyond being a kiss-ass.

Capheus being a clown for all the episode irritated the fuck out of me. He had always been particularly joyful, but 1) not at this ridiculous, over-the-top level, and especially 2) not under these circumstances. This is war. They are all risking their lives and could be found and killed in any seconds. He is risking his whole political career and has left all his loved ones home alone. One of his clustermates is imprisoned in a BPO facility and likely being tortured. This is possibly the worst you could get: this episode was not meant to feature lighthearted, careless people joking around and being idiotic. His behavior is completely inappropriate and disrespectful of the situation. Someone with a brain, in those circumstances, would have slapped him in the face. What the fuck.

Nomanita getting an entire scene exclusively used to provide a last-minute backstory capable of justifying Lana’s selfish decision of taking Paris from Kalagang and giving it to them out of nowhere and with no apparent reason. I am so mad about this, it almost seems deliberate from Lana. Paris was a turning point for Kalagang, a pivotal moment that represented their first and only chance in all the show to be finally happy and together. Nomanita already had it all. Nomanita have always been the healthiest, happiest couple. They could have married literally anywhere else and it would have changed nothing in their relationship, because they had already had 24 episodes of domestic and happy moments. Why Paris of all cities? This was an intentional betrayal to Kalagang fans and storyline.

Lito’s freak-out about the carbs is beyond any fucking comment. It vividly looks like they all are on camping, or taking a funny, enjoyable trip. The writers should be ashamed of themselves for cheapening such a beautiful show and such wonderful characters with stupid moments like this and so many others (such as: Nomi’s coffee moment, Wolfgang jokingly pointing the rocket launcher on Capheus, Rajan asking Kala to teach him to use a gun as if they were not in a dangerous, life-or-death situation but just having fun, Puck with Sun’s hair and so on: there are a lot).

Sun and Mun being OOC as fuck and acting as if they were old acquaintances was just ridiculous and forced to an exponential level. This is entirely the writers’ fault and has nothing to do with time constraints, because the writing was just cheap and the characters unrecognizable. They had only met twice before this phone call (and both times by mistake). Sun here was weirdly intimate and emotively open despite having been closed and guarded of her interiority for two seasons sometimes even with her other selves. Mun was the very definition of cringe. “I think those two words might have made getting shot worth it.” Give me a fucking break. Who are these people? And don’t even get me started on the inconsistency with the line “I am not very good with words” that goes directly against the very reason why Sun was interested in him in the first place (i.e. the passionate way he talked about her to her teacher and the cautious but accurate analysis he provided of her psychology while fighting in the graveyard). Here they were odd and extremely cliché to the point of contrasting with their very essence.

Capheus greeting Rajan in that way was so wrong and insulting both to attentive viewers and to all the people in this world unable to obtain proper medications for themselves or their loved ones. It disregarded and destroyed everything about Capheus’ character and almost made me vomit. Rajan embodied all the socially powerful people directly responsible for Shiro’s improved sickness that almost caused her death in S1. Rajan’s unethical business was the very reason why Capheus had to be involved with Silas Kabaka in the first place, resulting in all his S1 storyline that almost led him to his death. Do any of you remember Capheus and Kala’s expressions when Rajan revealed this? Both of them had never been so hurt and incredulous during all the show. Capheus’ blind forgiveness of someone who was the ultimate reason of one entire season of his suffering and fighting for survival left me utterly speechless and offended. The writers turned all of this into a joke, especially considering Capheus storyline in S2: he had decided to politically represent his country, his own people, exactly because of the injustices they had to face on a daily basis because of poverty and unfair hierarchy. Welcoming Rajan, the symbol of this hierarchy that basically made his whole life a living hell, in that way was incredibly unbelievable. I was seriously shocked by this.

Kala’s behavior when Rajan arrives in Paris can be explained only in two ways: a) either she was on drugs all the time, which means she was capable of making them using her knowledge as chemist and then taking them because she was so desperate for Wolfgang that she wanted to be high, or b) she was just under a love spell. These are the only explanations to the way she behaves here; in both cases, she clearly wasn’t herself. Logic, continuity and coherence were all non-existent. The facts: Kala had made promises to Wolfgang both in 2x10 and 2x11 and the only reason why she hadn’t explained things to Rajan yet was that he had shut her off and sent her away without giving her the opportunity to do so. But her mind was crystal-clear and she was finally ready (in fact, her entire storyline had been built in order to make her brave enough to finally make this decision). But in here, she betrayed every promise she had made to Wolfgang and basically became a lying coward, erasing all the character development she had been through. She acted as a bitch. This confrontation was unavoidable at this point. She let Rajan believe that the real problem in their marriage was her nature as a sensate, which actually has never been a source of conflict at all (she didn’t want to marry Rajan even before realizing what she was). I wanted to slap her for how she acted in this whole episode. She also really felt under a love spell because for 23 episodes she had never spontaneously kissed Rajan before out of sincere will. In 1x02, Rajan kissed her and she didn’t even return the kiss (the only reason why she didn’t break it was that they were at their engagement party and it would have been highly inappropriate); in 2x01 she kissed him out of pity and guilt because she felt responsible for breaking his dick and ruining their honeymoon. And that was it. So, witnessing her starting a kiss to a man she spent two seasons being uncomfortable with (especially physically) and feeling objectified by felt really wrong and unexpected and utterly unreasonable. She seriously looked like she was on drugs, I was in disbelief.

Aunt Kirsty overtaking a whole team of BPO soldiers supposedly using her unknown superpower ninja abilities was so ridiculous and cheap that it was like the writers themselves wanted to prove us that they could do everything they wanted and ruin all the show’s credibility as they pleased. Seriously what the fuck was that. Sense8 became a cartoon for kids and we didn’t know? God.

The complete lack of Wolfgang’s PTSD was absolutely unforgivable and unrealistic. We are talking about a man who spent all of his life building several walls to protect himself from the outside, trying to keep everyone at distance exactly because of the traumas he experienced since childhood that he couldn’t recover from. He has always been emotionally secretive and unavailable to everyone except Kala (and she took two seasons of serious efforts to make him finally open up and expose himself). He was tortured daily several times when he was under BPO’s captivity: he had and needed to show both physical and psychological scars in the aftermath. PTSD was a natural response that inevitably had to happen and be shown both for credibility and for a matter of character’s coherence and integrity. Wolfgang being rescued from this severely traumatizing condition and not showing the slightest consequence of it was beyond idiotic. And worse: from that moment he actually started acting more carefree and behaving in the exact opposite way than the one that should logically be expected from someone with his personality going through an experience like that. He started joking around and taking everything lightly and in a more emotionally invested way than he had ever done even before this imprisonment. It was like watching a fairy tale of stupid bullshit. What a fucking mess.

Rajan’s evident privileged treatment from the writers was so obvious and cheap that it ended up being nausea-inducing. He was literally everywhere and for no reason at all since he had no abilities. In the club, he is the only sapiens being close to the physical exchange. Why on this planet should this be safe or acceptable or even convenient since he is incapable of doing anything? Every other non-sensate was far away, even members of the Cluster such as Lito who could have been useful through sharing. Instead Rajan was on the front. Ok. And the idea that Wolfgang, a taciturn man who spent two seasons being jealous of Rajan, would spontaneously approach him and thank him for doing absolutely nothing is hilarious. Rajan didn’t save Wolfgang. Kala was the one who intervened to prevent Lila from shooting him. Rajan stepped in only to save Kala and was able to steal Lila’s gun just because she was already being attacked. And as soon as that happened, she took the gun back because Rajan obviously didn’t have a clue on what he was doing (which is acceptable, because he just wasn’t suitable for that situation: the mistake was including him there in the first place). Daniela herself had been previously shown to be comfortable in using a gun. Why not exposing her to the physical place of the exchange instead of Rajan? I seriously don’t get it. Which advantage could Rajan provide to the situation? The writers were so transparent. The same can be said with the Napoli’s scene. Rajan is the only sapiens entering the camorra building without any reason or combat skill. WHY. Not only he is untrained and incapable, but he also doesn’t even know the plan (Kala has to explain it to him while already inside and targeted by enemies!). It’s like they did everything in their power to include Rajan everywhere and let him be some kind of saver or hero that he clearly is not. The writing was insulting. Rajan mistakes a taser for a gun but then uses that same taser to save Kala’s life? How stupid do the writers think we are, exactly? Not to mention that Wolfgang being unable to treat Kala’s stomach wound was completely OOC, but then again, Kala and Wolfgang were both RAPED as characters in every way possible in this episode. Wolfgang was able to canonically treat a much worse wound when Felix was almost killed despite being in evident pain. This was all ridiculous. And what about Lila shooting Kala in the stomach? In this very episode she was able to shoot dead five people at a great distance without even trying when stealing Whispers. She was a hired gun, and here Kala was literally in front of her. Nothing in this scene makes the slightest sense, I swear.

The scene where Will asked where Sun was, as if he wasn’t able to mentally connect with her was absurd. And Nomi actually taking five minutes to visit her was just a cheap way for the Sun x Mun exchange to happen and was incoherent. “I found Sun” doesn’t make sense because they are telepathically connected and Nomi shouldn’t need to find her. Cheapness for everyone.

Kala spontaneously kissing Rajan again when she finally has the occasion to physically be with the love of her life after he was tortured and nearly killed is probably the most absurd and embarrassing moment I have ever seen in television. It’s beyond any rational comment at this point. I was about to throw something at my screen. And Wolfgang accepting this despite probably believing that Kala and Rajan had already talked things through was incoherent, unthinkable and hysterical. WHO-ARE-THESE-CHARACTERS. This moment destroyed me more than I can convey with words. It was a betrayal to two seasons of marvelous Kalagang growth and development. I could ramble about how much I hate this moment for pages, but I already wrote a post about it and it would be better for me not to stop too much on this because it literally broke my heart and enraged me more than anything else ever did. Kala and Wolfgang were entirely different characters.

Jonas and the Mother talking like walking encyclopedias contrast so heavily with the cheap writing of the episode that their scenes end up being really laughable and impossible to be taken seriously.

The song sequence was completely useless, pure fanservice garbage that stole real usable time that was very much needed since many storylines were left entirely open without justifications. The “What’s Up” moment in 1x04 became iconic because it conveyed a precise message that was the core of all the show, was a set up for everything that came after and had also the purpose to show the ability of each character to connect all together for the first time. Instead, the song sequence in this episode was obviously insert only because the first one really gained a huge success in the fandom and they simply wanted to reply it for fanservice purposes. But this was entirely pointless and the very definition of a waste of time. The characters felt very much like the actors themselves goofing around, and there were also completely avoidable coherence mistakes (Felix and Rajan on the train) that cheapened the already-compromised credibility of it all. The editing of all the episode was bad, especially in this scene.

Other time gets wasted showing characters eating pizza without a tie to the plot or anything at all. Were the writers deliberately trying to make the worst choices possible? They basically did everything wrong and handled the time horribly.

I already talked about the bullet scene, but Kala being able to visit Wolfgang while unconscious was another cheap mistake. I’m particularly angry because for 23 episodes Sense8 was able to be almost flawless in coherence, but this episode is just a giant mess. This moment is OOC and simply wrong on every aspect, and who wrote it surely must have been a stranger to the show.

The last half-hour of the Special is so weird. It’s like the writers suddenly forgot that the main characters are sensates. Will asking Kala what she wants was another ridiculous moment that was so incoherent with their scene in 2x08 that I seriously considered this to be an intentional way for the writers to let us know that they willingly fucked up with Kalagang. The main peculiarity of their interaction in 2x08 was that Will was able to read Kala’s emotions without asking and state out loud what she was afraid to admit to herself: that she loved someone else. Their interaction in 2x08 was based on clarifying that Kala was not suffering from a feeling indecision but a morality struggle, and that Will exactly knew what she wanted. Their moment in 2x12 disregards everything about it. Will acts like he doesn’t already know what she feels and asks her questions as if he couldn’t read her emotions, and Kala is supposed to show signs of romantic indecisiveness despite her troubles were never feelings-related? In 2x08 Kala couldn’t stop talking haphazardly (as she always does when concerned about something) and here she just silently shrugs? This moment is beyond laughable and goes against everything established before, and the characters are frankly unrecognizable.

It’s unbelievable the idea that two whole seasons of perfect Kalagang development led to a conclusion where Kala holds hands with Rajan and Wolfgang sits behind them as a complete stranger. It feels like a nightmare. I am homicidal about this. They really destroyed them, both as a couple and individual characters.

Amanita clearly states in 1x07 that she is afraid of and hates fireworks because they symbolize war and are a failure. So why is she perfectly happy here when they are used during her own wedding? It wasn’t that hard not to be OOC. The writers really wanted to discredit the canon in every way, I’m incredulous.

The conclusive physical, actual orgy which includes also non-sensate characters sends a horrible message. First, it goes completely against the symbolical meaning of the previous orgies (which were meant to show the sensates’ ability to share sexual arousal every time someone in the Cluster was having actual sex; it was nothing physical or carnal but purely abstract and metaphorical). Second, it’s highly offensive to asexual people, because sex is conceived here as the highest expression of love and the only way to resolve untouched confrontations (instead of having actual conversations). Third, it provides sexual erasure to Lito (canonically gay), Nomi (canonically lesbian) and Kala (canonically demisexual). Fourth, it goes against the well-praised theme of inclusivity and diversity of the show because everyone at the end turns out to be the same (pansexual), thus erasing every single representation provided in the previous episodes. Fifth, it portrays an unfair and insulting view on how sexuality actually works. The idea of a man — whose entire storyline is built around the fact that he is completely, exclusively gay and couldn’t manage to even fake a relationship with a woman — willing to have sex out of the blue with someone of the opposite sex is gross and actually sick. Sexuality is highly intimate and personal: it’s not about open-mindedness, but about self-comfort. It’s disrespectful to think that a gay man would be okay to get laid with a woman, because he just is by nature not comfortable in that situation. I am a straight guy and I could never picture myself with another man, it would make me unhealthily uncomfortable with myself. This applies to everyone’s very own sexuality. The same can be said for Kala, who here is depicted as a promiscuous woman willing to share her body with the very same man who she couldn’t bring herself to feel comfortable with for two seasons. Kala was a very moral person described as demi-sexual and she could only be comfortable in a sexual scenario with Wolfgang because they are sensates and their level of trust and connection is unparalleled. If Wolfgang and Kala hadn’t been sensates inside each other’s heads and feelings, Kala would have never slept with him: she needed that kind of intimacy and closeness to open up sexually. The Kala who pulls Rajan down and gets almost hungry of being used as a sex object here is not the usual Kala from the first 23 episodes, it’s another character entirely who sends a conservative and sexist unacceptable message.

Wolfgang’s sudden bisexuality is not representation, nor something to be proud of: it’s just an offensive, out-of-nowhere twist created only for shock value. One of the first traits that we understand about him in the show is that in order to avoid opening up emotionally, he constantly sleeps around with women only. This is canonically confirmed in two occasions: first, in 1x04, when he and Felix talk about their teenager adventures, nothing is mentioned about them being open to relationships with other boys (and if Wolfgang had been bisexual, it would have surely been pointed out in this moment); second, in 2x01, we canonically see him picking up girls using a date-app which features women only. This highly indicates that he is not into men, because if he was, he wouldn’t hide it at all. Also, if he had really been sexually attracted to men, he would have surely fallen for Felix because of how close they are, and this didn’t happen. This is not to say that sexuality is permanent or unaffected by change. But if Wolfgang’s character arc had really been about a sexuality struggle, an appropriate path of self-discovery should have been shown and developed carefully. People just don’t wake up and decide to change sexual orientation out of the blue. These things require internal process and self-questioning. This sudden twist is a joke to people who really have to face a complex self-examination in order to understand whether their sexuality is changing or evolving.

Wolfgang touching Rajan’s lips before kissing him is a slap on the face of Kalagang’s fans because that was THEIR intimate gesture, and theirs alone.

Wolfgang and Rajan barely know each other. Wolfgang would NEVER perform that private gesture with anyone but Kala, and the idea that he would make love to her with her husband included is pure nuts. This was the ultimate bullshit from the writers who managed to annihilate everything about Kalagang. It’s almost as if Lana had personal reasons to sabotage them in every way possible, because the result is just too heavy-handed and transparent not to be intentional. I seriously hope that she didn’t feel the need to ruin them just because they are a straight couple, because that would make her discriminatory and petty as fuck. This moment was seriously unwatchable and unbearable. I don’t have the proper words to describe the utter disgust I really experienced.

#sense8 #sense8 special #amor vincit omnia #i needed to give vent to my hurt feelings #and to expell some rage that is consuming me since june 8 #i'm grossed out #lana fucked up so hard I lost the respect I had towards her as a writer #this is beyond insanity #kalagang #anti rajalagang

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say-duhnelle · 7 years

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ok I gotta know what the fuck happened in Sherlock bc people are FREAKING OUT

so um i don’t know how caught up you are but (spoilers ahead, obviously)

this whole season has seemed off- the characterization, the storytelling, the very jumpy, hole-ridden plot that has not matched up AT ALL with what was foreshadowed previously or really any sort of linear narrative at all, it’s all been a mess. So a lot of people were theorizing there was deliberate alteration going on this season - either we were presented a lie, being told to protect someone’s innocence (alibi theory), or Sherlock had never woken up from the gunshot in HLV/drug trip in TAB and everything was occurring in his mind (EMP theory). This was also backed up by other Fucky Stuff ™ such as really glaring obvious continuity errors that would have required actual effort to create (like walls turning different colors and a painting in 221B being lit up differently at random) and John ignoring his child 99% of the time and Sherlock’s birthday being at the wrong time of year and pretty much every character reusing lines that had previously been Moriarty’s.

theeeeeen, on thursday, the preview of TFP at the BFI was held. no one was required to sign an NDA (Fucky Stuff ™), so spoilers got out, and based on details a lot of BNF started to theorize that the version shown at the screening was incomplete, altered, or even completely fake. this theory was partially based on s4 sharing a tagline (It’s Not Just A Game Anymore) with the Clue movie, which infamously had multiple endings. another theory, based on a line in the show last week (”people always give up after 3″) was that a secret 4th episode would be announced when TFP ended.

yesterday, the episode as shown at the BFI leaked on the site of the Russian channel that airs Sherlock - complete and in HD. earlier today, the Turkish affiliate released it (in English with subtitles this time). and like… the BBC did nothing about it. The showrunners and the official show Twitter tweeted something like “the episode has leaked, please keep the secrets”, but the leaked episodes were not taken down (I literally watched the Turkish one on their site as the TV version was airing in the UK lol) and there was no action taken by a legal team that is normally extraordinarily tight fisted re. this show (according to people who were in the fandom in previous seasons, leaking spoilers could get your blog taken down). So naturally, large portions of the fandom are now convinced it has to be fake, otherwise they would at least act like they care, right?

Well, the show aired and turns out this wasn’t the case. And despite the entire marketing cycle (until this very morning) having been all about how this episode would be GROUNDBREAKING and TELEVISION HISTORY and INSANE WISH FULFILLMENT and TYING UP LOOSE ENDS and CLIMAX OF 7 YEARS OF BUILDUP and so on… it was terrible. I’m not even talking about no Johnlock:

the whole thing started with just writing off last week’s cliffhanger in one majorly underwhelming sentence

the entire plot was a reach; any “buildup” we got for it occurred exclusively in s4, not over the whole series arc

it also involved playing the “mental illness = danger to society” trope for shits and giggles so there’s that

there were multiple gaping, obvious plotholes in the same vein as the earlier s4 episodes (and none of those holes were stitched up including but not limited to:

the main characters surviving an explosion that resulted in a fall from an upstairs window with NO injury whatsoever

John being chained up in a well and then the chains magically disappearing one transition later

Sherlock’s villain!sister being able to control people’s minds, apparently

and Sherlock being able to apparently enter HER mind/the whole airplane thing just doesn’t add up)

there was a lot of ridiculous, over-the-top pastiche of horror movies like saw and ring

3 Garridebs, perhaps the most emotional climax in the ACD canon, was completely squandered - played for laughs with nothing of the original plot retained beyond names

Victor Trevor, another story fans have been expecting would be a Big Moment if it was adapted, was almost an afterthought despite being the point of the whole episode - we got no real info on who he was, his relationship to Sherlock, or really even why Euros killed him

all the buildup about Moriarty went nowhere meaningful either

the love confession from the trailer was coerced and actually ruined Sherlock’s relationship with the person he said it to (Molly)

the cinematography and visual style characteristic of the show were almost completely absent

there was little to no variety of location, the sets used in the lion’s share of the episode looked cheap, and there were almost no special or practical effects (unlike every other episode) and what was there was cheap and terrible looking

despite being promised “loads of new music, every note composed with love” by the composers themselves, there was maybe one cue that was not an exact copy of music from earlier episodes

at the end of the episode, a voiceover from Mary (who died two episodes ago I might add) says that “it’s not who you really are that matters, it’s the story, the legend” as the series’ Big Ending Moment when literally every episode up to this point has been about the exact opposite of that so yeah that felt cheap af

there was a lot of other just over-the-top stuff like Sherlock commandeering a boat in the most ridiculous manner ever and creepy clowns and portraits crying blood and umbrellaswordgun and Elephant Glass and Uncle Rudy and and and and

and the “seems fake but ok” nature of the last two episodes continued to be the case in this one

and yeah okay after last week when J&S finally got back together as friends with dead!Mary imploring John to be the man he wants to be and John telling Sherlock that romance would complete him as a person and The Hug, yeah, not getting Johnlock was pretty surprising considering that these writers have been outspokenly pro-textual gays and anti-queerbaiting in many panels and interviews they’ve given

We got no real answers for any of the existing questions, opened up a lot more, and the whole thing felt cheap and poorly thought out. so yeah even though my life doesn’t hinge on canon johnlock like a lot of fans, I still feel ripped off because this thing was a hot goddamn mess. TAB + S4 have also included what at least seemed to be some really obvious shoutouts to TJLC theories, and of course they noticed, so they’re feeling REALLY led on. And since it was strongly implied during publicity that this was either the last season ever, or at least the last one for a realllllllllllllly long time (i’d guess 5+ years) they are going stark raving mad thinking this is all they’re going to get, that this mess is where Moftiss really intend to end this. (There were no extra scenes, nor has there been any announcement thus far about a secret/bonus episode.)

Moffatt actually said in an interview earlier this year that TFP was the single piece of his writing that he was most proud of and like if that’s true… then every negative opinion people have of him is totally, completely, and absolutely justified because this episode was unequivocally trash.

#personal #sherlock #spoilers

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themastercylinder · 6 years

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SUMMARY Sam Phillips and his child Tony are playing outside their farm. The father is abducted by a strong light. Three years later, the light returns, and plants a seed. A half-human, half-alien creature grows up, and when it moves it is run over by a car. Ben is attacked and killed when he looks for the crash victim. Jane, his companion, is also killed by the hybrid creature. The monster then moves to a cottage nearby and attacks and impregnates a woman living there, before dissolving and dying. When she returns to consciousness, her belly rapidly and painfully grows to a gargantuan size that it even tears through her dress, showing movement inside her belly, and she gives birth, vaginally, to a fully formed and bloody Sam, who is connected to her by an umbilical cord like a baby is to its mother, before dying. Sam washes the blood off, steals Ben’s clothes and drives his car without bothering to get rid of Jane’s corpse, which will be found by a lorry driver.

Sam seeks Tony, who lives in an apartment building in London, with his mother Rachael, her new boyfriend Joe Daniels, and a French au-pair Analise Mercier. Rachel and Joe are professional photographers and share a studio in town. Many nights, Tony has nightmares where he wakes up soaked in blood, but it’s not his, as the family doctor discovers. Sam picks Tony up from school, until Rachel finds them. Although Joe doesn’t like it, as he intends to marry Rachel, Sam goes to live with them, saying he can’t remember anything. Tony sees him eating his pet snake’s eggs and runs from him. Sam goes after him, talking to him smoothly, and drinks his blood.

Rachel finds Jane’s photo in Sam’s clothes, but he can’t remember her either. Tony discovers he has certain powers now, so he sends a human-sized toy soldier to kill their nasty neighbour Mrs Goodman, in revenge for killing his pet snake, and a toy clown becomes a human-like clown.

Sam and Rachel both decide to visit their former residence, the farm, while leaving Tony in Analise’s care. However, she brings Michael, her boyfriend, and they make love. Tony demands to play hide-and-seek with her. She does so, only to be knocked out by the clown and used as a womb for the alien eggs; Tony sends a toy tank to kill Michael. He discovers Analise and runs away, but a black panther kills him. The building keeper, Mr. Knight, is also killed when Rachel asks him to watch Tony, as nobody answers the phone at home. Sam and Rachel make love at the abandoned farm, but she gets afraid because his skin starts to bleed and decompose. Joe has taken Tony there. Sam and Tony go up a hill towards the alien light. Sam has now taken the form of an alien, and his scream kills Joe. Along with Tony, Sam enters the light and returns to the alien world. Rachel sits down in the field where Tony and Sam left, and the next day returns to her apartment, only to be seen full of eggs. She picks up an egg, only to be killed by the same creature that impregnated the woman in the cottage as her apartment door slams shut behind her.

DEVELOPMENT XTRO marks the feature debut of 32-year-old Harry Bromley Davenport. In 1974, on the advice of a mutual friend, Forstater saw Davenport’s short horror film, WHISPERS OF FEAR, and liked it very much. Davenport, who has an interest in the horror genre, had an idea for a film titled THE HORRIFIC MOVIE HOUSE MASSACRE. Forstater attempted to secure financial backing for the movie, and it was announced several times, but the project ultimately collapsed. Then Davenport and well known anthologist & author Michel Parry came to Forstater with the idea for XTRO.

The original story of XTRO was devised by its director, Harry Davenport in collaboration with Michel Parry, the latter a leading figure on the British fantasy scene, the editor of many short fiction anthologies in the genre. The final script was written by Robert Smith and lan Cassie, with the close participation of New Line Producer Robert Shaye in the script’s development. The resulting film shows a truly bizarre mixture of elements, influences ranging from I Married a Monster from Outer Space to ALIEN to Close Encounters. While the cast, particularly Philip Sayer as the Earthling turned-alien, do much to shore up the film’s believability, it’s a safe guess that many SF purists will be gnashing their teeth with indignation upon the picture’s release.

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“The thing that attracted us to it,” says Shaye, “when we saw Davenport’s first treatment, was his intention to include in the film several jaw-slackening moments, where you’d see things that might make you doubt for a moment that you were seeing things correctly. To me, the film is ‘science fiction’ in the same sense that Phantasm is science fiction. It’s really more of a horror fantasy picture; the science fiction element often gets integrated into this kind of story because, when you want people to accept a premise, characters and action that are very far out, the quickest way to do that is to bring in a creature from another planet. People expect something weird from another planet, not from down the block.

“The story really takes off from the end of CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND,” says producer Mark Forstater “It’s about a guy who returns to Earth after having been away on another planet for three years.” But here turmsaltered into a life-form which terrorizes an isolated rural community. He impregnates a woman via a tentacle that emerges from his chest and she gives birth to the man as he was before he went on his intergalactic journey. The man returns to his family and converts his son, who carries on the father’s alien ways like infecting the maid by injecting eggs into her stomach and making his toys come to life. All these unearthly events unsettle the man’s wife and she chooses to fight back, too late to affect the hopelessness of the situation. Forstater was quick to point out that XTRO is not an exploitation genre piece like INSEMINOID, with which it shares some superficial plot similarities.

Philadelphia-born Forstater is no newcomer to unusual fantasy projects; he has also produced MONTY PYTHON AND THE HOLY GRAIL and THE GLITTERBALL. He got involved with XTRO when co-writer director Harry Bromely Davenport came to him with a script written with Michel Parry. Forstater brought in two other writers, Robert Smith and lain Cassie. “The plot was kept intact,” he said, “but the new writers went off into weird and wonderful tangents. It’s a synthesis of ALIEN and a lot of recent ideas, but it’s really how you put them together, and the style with which you approach the material, that is important.”

Forstater met Davenport, who wrote the first draft of Peter Straub’s THE HAUNTING OF JULIA, during a screening of WHISPERS OF FEAR, Davenport’s directorial debut. “I was impressed with it,” said Forstater, “It is the hardest exercise of all to make a film for $10,000 and limit yourself to one set and one actress, but Harry pulled it off.”

XTRO is being financed by Ashley Productions Ltd. a subsidiary of a British investment group based in Manchester. “The company had dealings with the leisure industry before,” said Forstater. “When I introduced them to this project they liked it, found they could afford it, and that it gave them a chance to break into production.”

Harry Bromley Davenport on the Development and Making of Xtro How did the initial idea for Xtro come about? HARRY BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: Since I have no imagination, I tend to steal ideas from others as frequently as possible. Do you remember the ending of Close Encounters of the Third Kind all those airplane pilots and whatnot emerging from the big UFO? I wondered what happened to them afterward. That seemed like a good jumping-off point for a movie.

Describe the initial development process. BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: Michel Parry and I wrote the first draft together, but Michel is a far better writer than me, so he managed to impose a structure. Then Mark Forstater, the producer, sent me to New York, where I messed around with Bob Shaye at New Line for a couple of months, rewriting a load of old nonsense. Then Robert Smith and Iain Cassie came on. Jesus, this thing was rewritten about 40 times!

Tell us about the progression of the script. BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: The more we worked on it, the more bizarre it became That was not the intended result. It occurred because none of us had much of all idea what we were doing. But we wanted to be unpredictable and shocking. So if anyone had a wacky idea, into the script it went without further ado. And I think that’s why the film has stayed alive and available in one form or another for 30 years. It’s such arrant nonsense that viewers are constantly kept on their toes by this onslaught of drivel that passes for imagination. Mark Forstater and I would occasionally look at each other and say. This is just too ridiculous; we can’t do that, but Bob Shaye always encouraged us to go to the extreme.

How did you get the cast and crew on board? BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: We were fortunate that we were scheduled to shoot it February and March, which were not periods of heavy employment in the movie business, so we scored loads of really good technicians and actors who might otherwise not have wished to work on a little monster movie. But economic reality won out and we got Barry Richardson, who did the hair on Quest for Fire, and Robin Grantham, who did a lot of the transformation makeup on American Werewolf in London. Gallons of good people worked on that show.

Were there any obstacles to overcome during the shoot? BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: The damn panther. There’s no real reason for it to be there that I can recall, except that it was a whim that emanated from the imagination of Bob Shaye. Panthers are untrainable, you know, but Bob absolutely insisted that we somehow shoehorn in a scene where one jumps out and kills somebody. He said it would be “off the wall”. Well, he got that right. We had to get a shot of this damn panther jumping over the camera for the attack. So the crew and I were imprisoned in a cage while a trainer stood above us and waved a chicken at the panther. Now, I don’t know if you have ever seen a panther cat a chicken, but it’s a pretty ruthless operation, and afterward the panther gets lazy and spends an hour or so digesting and snoozing. And we were still locked in this cage, peeing into empty beer cans, Ghastly business. That poor animal cost us $6,000, and I doubt if it’s on screen for more than 12 seconds. But any scene with a live animal is hell to shoot, because even if the trainer Swears up and down that the creature is ready to Tock and roll, it never does it right. Never. And you spend hours rolling camera on bad takes.

Tell us a bit about the killer toys. BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: I always disliked that part because it was dated, even then. And that wretched clown. God, I hated him-personally, I mean, I remember that we all got a lecture about how we could not refer to him as a *midget.” He was to be called the clown.” Nasty little bugger, he was. He was the only midget in the UK who was not employed on Return of the Jedi playing an Ewok, and so he was horrid. I think he stole those clown shoes at the end of the shoot, too. They cost $120 and were custom-made. You don’t just tatter down the road and buy a pair of clown shoes, you see.

How about the incredibly gory birth scene? BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: That is the only truly original death in the movie. I am told that it has been imitated since on multiple occasions. It was a terribly messy business. Rehearsal is unheard of in low budget films, but we actually did a full rehearsal of that scene on a stage and shot film it so that the cast and crew could see how to improve it.

What can you say about the FX, which are pretty impressive? BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: There were some very entertaining people working in the special effects department. In those days, there was no digital manipulation possible, and opticals were too expensive for bottom-feeders like us, so all the effects were done live on the set. We went for quantity, and had very little money left over to spend on the quality.

What do you credit Xtro’s initial success to? BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: New Line promoted the shit out of it. They did TV commercials, and it played all over the world. The relative success of the film is entirely proportionate to the advertising budget. The actual movie has little merit. I wish we could take another shot at it, but thank goodness that’s not in the cards.

Xtro is obviously a cult favorite, what do you owe that following to? BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: That’s because there had not been a movie like it released for quite some time, and apparently, there was an audience out there who wanted to be shocked. “The more we worked on the script, the more bizarre it became… none of us had much of an idea what we were doing.’ pleased that Siskel and Ebert absolutely panned it. It was their lead-off review, and Ebert said it was “mean-spirited” and a bunch of stuff about how horrid the whole film was. That was immensely helpful to our box office, and caused lines around the block. When it was finished, I was far from proud of the film, because it should have been much better. But the older and more geriatric I become, the more forgiving of my weaknesses I am. I was angry with the movie, because I still don’t think I did a good piece of work. It should have been terrifying, and it became sort of campy. But what are you going to do when you’re dealing with rubber monsters and clowns and panthers?

Preproduction sketches from XTRO show how the actor’s head (upper right) fits inside the mask. Marginal notes indicate that “lower part of the alien face is a prosthetic mask” which will tear if the mouth is opened.

SPECIAL EFFECTS The bulk of the effects sequences, executed by NEEFX with makeup effects by Robin Grantham, seem designed to emulate illusions seen in films budgeted on a much grander scale. Because the effects are the primary focal point of the finished film, the plot takes some strange right angle turns in order to include some of the sequences devised.

The talented special effects team of Tom Harris & Francis Coates have both had wide television experience. With science fiction & horror subjects leading the state of the art in this area, it’s not surprising that even a low-budget film such as XTRO is filled with effects sequences. Forstater explained that the movie will contain “at least 3 or 4 major ‘buzz’ sequences” which would excite & awe an audience, and he had only praise for the team handling these often difficult scenes. Almost 40% of the effects work was completed during live-action filming because of the budget restrictions. This ranged from the radio-controlled toys to special Latex makeup effects & difficult multi-image opticals attempted directly inside the camera.

XTRO also offers 2 alien monster designs, which resemble H.R. Giger’s full-grown creature in ALIEN. Davenport & Forstater discussed these designs with artist Chris Hobbs, who is the film’s visual consultant. Hobbs came up with a number of effective ideas-not only for just the aliens but also for Forstater’s aforementioned “buzz” sequences: these include the impregnation of alien eggs under the skin of a young au pair, the decomposition of the creatures’ human bodies revealing the hidden alien forms within and, perhaps most startling of all, a woman giving birth to a fully-grown man! Hobbs’ pre-production artwork has a strong EC Comics quality.

Harry Bromley Davenport prepping the “Pregnancy Scene”

“Our six week shooting schedule meant we had to be incredibly precise about the effects we wanted,” said Forstater. “Francis came up with designs that we have had to stick to. Everything had to work the first time as couldn’t afford delay. Every time we shot an effect, three others had to be lined up in case something went wrong. If the prosthetic on the maid’s stomach didn’t work the first time, off it went and another one went on immediately.”

Chris Hobbs, a sketch artist, helped sort out the visual concepts for the production. Originally, a man in a faceless rubber suit was suggested for the creature, but was scrapped when Hobbs came up with a clever and original idea. “I hope the audience doesn’t realize this, but our creature is a man on his back, on all fours,” said Forstater. “He will have to arch himself as much as he can so this won’t be too obvious. We hired a trained mime artist, who perfected a strange scuttle. You only set the creature at night, so I think we’ll get away with it.”

Other special effects sequences involve a giant cocoon, the father infecting his son by implanting his lips into his shoulder, a scream exploding a man’s eardrums, and the father deteriorating so badly that he literally falls apart. Acording to Forstater, these ambitious effects will be dealt with in an elegant way. “We’ve gone for the dry, clean look,” he said. “There’s no gone or slime to invoke an uneasy physical response’. I know that audiences are now so sophisticated that they want to see it all, but we’ll get gross only as a last resort: if we decide that the effects aren’t working. We’ll do whatever is necessary to make them work and I won’t apologize for it if that’s what we have to do.”

FX artist Christopher Hobbs working the Xtro puppet

Xtro-Alternate Ending(1982)

Director Harry Bromley Davenport originally intended the film to end with Rachel coming home to find the apartment filled with clones of Tony, having apparently come from the alien eggs which the real Tony had been left in the refrigerator. But executive producer Robert Shaye, not thinking the scenes special effects were convincing enough, edited it out and released it for its New York debut with the film ending when Rachel sits down in the field after Sam and Tony have left. Davenport, however, not wanting to have it end on such an abrupt note, created another one which had Rachel going back to the apartment, picking up one of the eggs and being attacked by a face-grabbing creature similar to the one that attacked the woman in the cottage, and ultimately the film was released with this ending.

Xtro – Missing scenes (These scenes are missing from all current DVD releases of the film, yet were in the old VHS releases and also in the version screened by the UK sci-fi channel in 2005.)

DISTRIBUTION-RELEASE Xtro came under fire in the United Kingdom during the 1980s due to several graphic sequences; most notably the pregnancy scene. Were you shocked at this reaction and do you feel the censors overreacted?

BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: I was greatly surprised – and pleased. When the film came under the scrutiny of the censorship brigade, sales roared. I wish I could get that kind of attention today. Now it’s impossible to shock people. We’ve seen everything.

The first film mainly focused on abandonment issues, both of the child losing his father and the man losing both his family and his own identity. Was this something you intended on exploring in the next film?

BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: Wow! Abandonment? I guess so. I never thought of that. You’re right. Maybe I should ask Daryl to do yet another re-write of the current script to emphasise this abandonment issue. Does that ring true for you? Now that you force me to think about it, you may have tapped into something that helped the film to hold the viewer’s attention. Wow! Don’t ask perceptive questions like that.

In his review of Xtro, film critic Roger Ebert described it as ‘a completely depressing, nihilistic film, an exercise in sadness.’ How does this make you feel and would you say this is in any way accurate?

BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: I’ve seen that review on YouTube. And Siskel and Ebert look like a couple of nannies telling their children not to go near the swamp. It’s a statement of enormous self-importance. It is cruel too – designed to make him sound like the savior of mankind. I refute that observation. I find that real critics – not ‘reviewers’ like fat Ebert – take tenable positions about the films I have directed when they don’t like them. This dope just aimed at an easy target – a low budget independent exploitation film – and let rip.

I would like to remind your readers that the script for Beyond the Valley of the Dolls flowed from the pen of Mr. Ebert. I’m glad that I didn’t see that Xtro review until recently. Had I seen it when I was younger, it would have cut me to the quick. I hope that he gets eaten alive by an army of big black spiders.

CONCLUSION Upon its fairly successful 1983 U.S. theatrical release, Xtro was trashed by critics who dismissed it as a cheap, over sexualized variation on E.T. To add to the film’s notoriety, Xtro was labeled a “video nasty by the British Board of Film Censorship. It spawned two very unofficial direct-to video sequels, none having anything to do with the others beyond being directed by Bromley-Davenport—1991’s Xtro II: The Second Encounter and 1995’s Xtro : Watch the Skies.

With Michel Parry having written the original script, did you ever discuss collaborating together again on the subsequent sequels and how did you come to work with Daryl Haney?

BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: Michel, who is an accomplished writer, does not live in L.A., and for me to mete out sufficient psychic trauma on the writer, I need the victim to live here where I can maximize the misery I inflict. I am also very fond of Michel and would not wish to subject him to my hideous method of work. I met Daryl Haney through a remote connection with Roger Corman when we were putting together the third Xtro. Daryl talks a lot and has a fresh idea every thirteen seconds, which means that I don’t really have to do any work. Our method is to spend several months having lunch at Taix Restaurant on Sunset Boulevard, where he expounds and I take notes. After sufficient money has been spent on these three-hour lunch marathons, Daryl disappears for a few weeks and then sends me a first draft screenplay which has no connection with anything we have previously discussed. But we have managed to actually make seven movies together and that probably means something – perhaps what idiots we both are.

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Promotional Art

New Line Cinema are known for exploiting their products as much as possible, yet they chose not to take part in the sequels. Why was that?

BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: Because I own the rights to the title Xtro and they do not. But I do not own the rights to the original story. This is caused by some quirk of the original production contracts. Strangely enough, they did call me a couple of years ago to discuss doing a ‘re-boot’, but Bob Shaye, the CEO of New Line, who co-produced the original film along with Mark Forstater, had been shown the ejector seat button and I didn’t care to deal with anyone there but Bob. He’s a wacky individual who is far more cultured than most film executives. However, Bob was in a bad mood for the entire shooting period of Xtro and that somewhat curtailed his desire to be nice to me. He was in ‘I-am-the-dark-demon-boss-Bob’ mode for some inexplicable reason. But he sure as hell promoted the shit out of the film in the States and for that I am grateful, although it is a mixed blessing to be associated with a film that, at the time, was considered somewhat shocking.

It seems inevitable that every cult movie is eventually remade; has this ever been discussed with Xtro or would you rather continue the series with further sequels?

BROMLEY-DAVENPORT: I was approached by New Line, which owns the original story – but I would rather shoot another sequel far from the interfering hands of the conventional Hollywood executive phone-monkeys. The fun part about having directed a movie which was, at the time, infamous, is that I frequently receive emails from people all over the world which tell me of how they first saw it when they were kids and how it terrified them. Or else it was a film which they couldn’t shake off.

Xtro Xposed Harry Bromley-Davenport Interview

Pure Destructive Records is proud to announce, an official licensed reissue of XTRO. The original score composed by the director, Harry Bromley Davenport.

Available @ Amazon

Xtro – Original Filmsoundtrack 1982

REFERENCES and SOURCES http://love-it-loud.co.uk/interview-with-harry-bromley-davenport-xtro/ Twilight Zone#10 1982 Fangoria#324 Fangoria#024 Famous Monsters of Filmland 191 Cinefantastique#05

Xtro (1982) Retrospective SUMMARY Sam Phillips and his child Tony are playing outside their farm. The father is abducted by a strong light.

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