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chorus-the-mutate · 7 months

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This is an edited repost of the Erzsebet Bathory character analysis I wrote yesterday that I refuse to let go to waste. I tried doing the right thing and tagging all of the necessary trigger warnings only for this post to be completely hidden from the Castlevania Nocturne and Erzsebet Bathory tags. Since I can't afford to tag the proper trigger warnings without being punished please do not read this post if discussions of rape or sexual assault triggers or upsets you in any way. I don't take these topics lightly and they are vital to this analysis of Erzsebet Bathory.

This post also contains major spoilers for this first season of Castlevania Nocturne.

This may seem presumptive of me to say but this thought has been stuck in my head for several hours: Erzsebet Bathory is the most rapist adjacent villainess I've ever seen without her actually being a rapist.

The first and smallest point against her is how often she mentions virgins. I know that Erzsebet's initial mention of virgin sacrifices is supposed to tie into the origin of her alter ego and consumption of Sekhmet but it's super fucking weird that it played into why she wanted to sacrifice Maria.

Next point against her is the lawyer's daughter. I'm not sure if this lady was a virgin but when she's first brought to Erzsebet she's already terrified and too dazed to fight back. It's obvious that she doesn't want to be there and that even if she did that she can't really express that desire. But Erzsebet still takes this lady out of a literal gilded cage, sits down and sits this lady on her dress to admire her despair before drinking her blood. The next time we see the lady she's still dazed. The only differences are that she's dolled up and seems more suggestible. Even with hundreds of people in this ballroom scene the lady is literally ignored by everyone except for Erzsebet who dances with her and parades her around for her own amusement. Everyone else knows that Erzsebet likes to make her victims suffer and they still refuse to acknowledge the lady because Erzsebet has made it clear that she's her possession. Hell the only person who is unhappy enough with Erzsebet to go rogue at this point is Olrox and he STILL IGNORES THIS LADY. When the lady is dragged outside to be fed on again without anyone batting an eye it reminds me of a rapist roofying their target and proceeding to do everything in their power to seem interested in their victim's well-being in order to take them to a second location. And no one speaks up since Erzsebet is the Harvey Weinstein, Prince Andrew or Thomas Jefferson of the vampire world; the embodiment of people in power getting away with abuse until the damage has already been done.

The last and biggest point against Erzsebet is the entire scene where she turns Tera into a vampire. For me personally that is just an allegorical rape scene and it's executed very well. Erzsebet makes her entrance at the abbey as a lioness of a woman, a literal predator who wants to take Maria as a sacrifice and turn her into a vampire to ensure Emmanuel the Abbot's loyalty. Tera protests and offers herself to Erzsebet instead. This is such blatant coercion that Tera refers to herself as the ram Abraham sacrificed to God instead of Isaac. And the only question or concern Erzsebet has at this point is if her sacrifice should be a virgin. The only reasons she accepts the sacrifice are Emmanuel's genuine love for Tera and the fact that Tera is a powerful sorceress. Once Erzsebet settles for Tera and physically lifts her to her level no one can stop her. Maria gets knocked out for trying and Richter gets bodied immediately after. Their only option is to get the hell out of there once Annette makes an opening and Richter rightfully runs for his life. Even Maria, the only person that could look back and see Tera turn, is knocked out and that feels like an intentional writing choice to give Tera one last shred of dignity. Erzsebet holds Tera really close in this sort of hug as she feeds on her and once she's fed she literally sits Tera on her lap for her turn to feed. Then Erzsebet cuts herself and the blood starts dripping down on Tera, starting at her skirt, going to her blouse and reaching her face. At first Tera doesn't react but then her body responds to the blood and she feeds even though she doesn't want to. Even though no one wants this for her. And that is exactly what it's like when someone has an unwanted orgasm. Tera's body is protecting itself the same way a victim of assault would and that paired with the blood on her skirt being reminiscent of the blood on a woman's thigh in the aftermath of an assault hammers home the rape allegory. It's very sad and uncomfortable to think of Tera's turn to vampirism this way but the thought lingers hours after like a grimy film on my brain.

I 100,000% believe that Erzsebet would have been an actual rapist if Netflix Castlevania didn't romanticize Lenore raping Hector and ending their relationship on friendly terms. Not to mention Sumi and Taka's sudden shift from allies to sexually assaulting Alucard out of spite. Castlevania Nocturne seems to shy away from rape and sexual assault in favor of allegories or moments so brief that I missed them unlike its predecessor. So I'm blaming the gratuitous depictions of sexual assault in Castlevania on Warren Ellis, the creator of Netflix Castlevania, who doesn't work on this show for a very good reason.

Everything from her size as Sekhmet to her tendency to torture women and girls before killing them contributes to the allegory of Erzsebet being the vampire equivalent of a rapist. She exudes power and not only does she enjoy making others feel helpless she's also great at it. She is a sadist without honor, willing to parade her lady victim of choice around vampire high society or hang a young girl on hooks to drain dry rather than let any of them die a quick death. The dragged out, needless suffering Erzsebet inflicts along with her preference for women and virgins frames her feeding as something more sexual in nature than the other vampire nobles who simply indulge in their gluttony. Even Olrox feeding on his former boyfriend isn't framed sexually, it's framed as a desperate, romantic gesture to keep his lover alive. And every vampire I remember from Castlevania has their feeding framed as a tool for political power or sheer, simple gluttony. Even the vampire general Cho was shown to be more of a tyrant or a general sadist clinging to power in Japan than a deviant.

Erzsebet's sheer sadism actually contrasts quite well with Dracula's humanity and restraint. He understood humanity, only feeding to survive or strike down the merchants who slighted him. (He probably also used feeding as a tool for political power but I don't think we saw that directly.) Dracula ultimately came to understand humanity so well that he fell for Lisa Tepes, the exemplar of what it means to be human. And that love is why I believe he respected Lisa's wishes and let her keep that humanity instead of turning her into a vampire. And after Lisa's death Dracula stopped feeding entirely, hoping to extinguish his life and take out as many people as he could because he believed that humanity should've been better. He believed that the people who lived alongside Lisa would've stood up for her and they betrayed her out of a mix of fear, religious reverence and apathy. Meanwhile Erzsebet doesn't care about humanity, seeing people like the lawyer's daughter as possessions or people like Tera and Emmanuel the Abbot as pawns to further her own rule. She might be taken aback by Drolta's death once she learns of it but there's an equal chance that she wouldn't even bat an eye.

So what do these points of analysis mean for Erzsebet and Tera's future dynamic as master and pawn? The one thing that's certain is that Tera has been fundamentally changed, forced into an unprecedented nightmare scenario that will drag her down a dark path. But I'm an optimist and I believe that Tera will ultimately be redeemed. She may never be human again but her humanity, her love for her son and daughter will save her soul. Ultimately I hope that Tera lives and recovers from the trauma of Erzsebet turning her. I hope that she goes home to her children and is taken in with open arms. But if Tera dies she will die as Tera, not as a pawn, and that is because Erzsebet could never kill her humanity.

#castlevania nocturne #castlevania nocturne spoilers #please heed the preamble #this post still discusses dark subject matters so I want you guys to be careful #erzsebet bathory #tera #tera renard #tera castlevania #dracula vlad tepes #anti lenore #sumi castlevania #taka castlevania #I really want to know what you guys think #and please forgive me if I've read way too much into Erzsebet #I just can't stop thinking about her lack of regard for most anyone #this could contribute to the colonization allegory with Erzsebet but I don't have the background or education to contribute to that talk #long post #ash rambles

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holdharmonysacred · 11 months

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So, you wanna prep for Lostbelt 6 by reading a bunch of fairy lore for background information. Luckily for you, I’m a turbo nerd when it comes to this particular brand of folklore. In this post I’ll be compiling links to assorted text and audio sources of information and entertainment related to all the real-world fairy lore that pops up throughout the chapter. I’m gonna try to avoid just wikipedia links as much as possible, so some of the text sources are gonna be a little dense, but that’s ye olde texts for you. This will be semi-ongoing as things pop up, so you can keep an eye out if you want!

Note: I’ll try to keep the spoilers to a minimum, but there will be possible spoilers as to what’s in the chapter ahead, so watch out!

Without further ado, here’s the list under the cut:

HUGE MASSIVE CONTENT WARNING: Many of these texts are going to have adult themes and triggering content, particularly sexual assault, rape, and general non-consent in romantic or sexual relationships. I’m going to start including individual warnings for texts where I know it comes up, but even if I don’t note it, please proceed with caution and take care!

A Dictionary of Fairies: Hobgoblins, Brownies, Bogies, and Other Supernatural Creatures by Katharine Mary Briggs - Exactly what it sounds like on the tin. Here’s where you can read about all the different fairies and creatures that tend to be more in short folktales, from baobhan sith to barghests to Ainsel and beyond, all in alphabetical order. If you find a fairy name you want to look up, it’s probably going to be in here somewhere.

A Midsummer Night’s Dream by William Shakespeare - I mean c’mon man. C’mon. There could always be a first for someone though, so if you are that someone - this is the most famous work featuring Oberon the fairy king, and the big one that F/GO and basically all other post-Billy Shakes media works pulls from. If you’d rather watch a staging of the play instead of read a script, here are some performances by Rice University and the Palm Beach Shakespeare Festival, and if those two in particular aren’t your jam I guarantee you there’s going to be a staging somewhere you can watch. As a bonus, here’s an absolutely lovely musical arrangement of “Philomel, With Melody” (AKA the lullaby Titania’s fairy servants sing to her) by the band Caprice. It’s not the most relevant, I just want to share it because it’s nice. WARNING: The crux of the play revolves around a love potion plot, so there will be themes of manipulation, non-consent, and potential sexual assault played for laughs and romance. It’s arguably mild compared to some of the other texts on here, but I would still be careful!

Translations of Melusina (Melusine) stories by D. L. Ashliman - D. L. Ashliman’s got a massive online treasure trove of folktales and folktexts, it’s always a fun time to go on a rabbit hole through his(their?) site. If you want stuff specifically relevant to Melusine though, here’s the page for her.

Versions of the Tam Lin ballad compiled at Tam Lin Balladry - this one’s going to be relevant because of the extremely high likelihood that NA will follow the JP merch labels and localize the “Fairy Knight” title as Tam Lin. Because it’s a ballad, there’s plenty of audio versions put to song, the most textually accurate one I can currently find being by Bob Hay & The Jolly Beggars. Besides that however, there are also versions by Steeleye Span, Fairport Convention, Tricky Pixie, and my personal favorite, the one by Anaïs Mitchell of Hadestown fame and Jefferson Hamer. If you want a more standard audio adaptation, the Tales of Britain and Ireland podcast will have you covered. WARNING: The start of the ballad is explicitly about sexual assault, with Tam Lin having been a rapist prior to meeting Janet. Janet’s own encounter is usually portrayed as consensual, she’s apparently a weirdo who heard the warnings and went “So that means FREE SEX?”, but some later versions do change her encounter into rape as a bizarre way of censoring her having sex out of wedlock. In addition, the ballad deals with themes of abortion. Basically, if any of this stuff is a trigger for you, I would proceed with extreme caution if you choose to listen or read.

Habetrot and Scantlie Mab - an archived version of a fairy tale about Habetrot. For similar stories, search for stuff under the Aarne-Thompson-Uther index type 501, “The Three Spinning Old Women”.

Historia Regum Britanniae (The History of the Kings of Britain) by Geoffrey of Monmouth - Now this one may not seem immediately obvious in its relevance outside of “hey look, Arthuriana!”, but trust me, This Is A Surprise Tool That Will Help Us Later. The relevant parts are going to start at Book 6, with Vortigern’s shenanigans. There’s also a podcast audio adaptation by Myths & Legends, split into part A, part B, and part C, if you would prefer that.

Official website for Knocknarea, or Cnoc na Riabh - Knocknarea is a big ol’ hill in Ireland with a bunch of Neolithic cairns on it, the most famous of which is claimed to be Queen Medb’s tomb. For anything else related to Medb, go read the Tain.

The Wikipedia page for Cernunnos - this is the point where I have to give up on not linking wikipedia, alas, as the sources here are little too tiny and scattered. Cernunnos is a Celtic god from Gaul, he’s got horns, we’ve got his name and some archaeological depictions of him, and that’s basically it, because unfortunately no stories about him survived. If I can find a better source about him to link, I’ll drop it here.

Le Morte d’Arthur by Sir Thomas Mallory, Volume I and Volume II - Not including this initially was a huge oversight on my part, but this is pretty much The text for general Arthuriana and one of the really big ones that Fate takes influence from. You can read this for stuff about Morgause and Morgan, but it’s also just good to have on hand for anything with the Round Table in general.

I’ve also got a bunch of podcast episodes that don’t really fit in with any of the above that I’ll list here if anyone wants more dank audio content:

Robin Goodfellow: His Mad Pranks and Merry Jests by Tales of Britain and Ireland - Relevant if you want some alternative tales of Puck and Oberon. WARNING: The episode itself covers its warnings pretty good, but before you click - there’s a lot of adult content in this one, including the thumbnail image. Most of the stories adapted are going to get pretty bawdy even at best, and there’s one that explicitly involves an attempted rape that the titular character thwarts. Proceed with caution, and also maybe don’t listen in public.

Black Dogs and Englishmen: Black Shuck in English Folklore and The Barguest: Demon Dog, Silly Sprite or Spectral Hound?, both by Fabulous Folklore with Icy - Listen to these two if you want more info on barghests.

Scottish Halloween & Vampire Fairy Witches by Stories of Scotland - Listen to this if you want a retelling of a story involving the baobhan sith along with other Scottish traditions!

And that’s all I’ve got for right now! If I find any more relevant sources, or if someone directs me to said sources, I’ll be sure to add links to this post. Until then, happy reading and listening, and I hope everyone has fun with LB6!

#fate grand order #note: from what i've seen i'm like 90% sure katharine briggs is a perfectly respectable scholar of fairy lore #but if it turns out there's something wild i don't know then at the very least she's probably nasu's source #everything else is as legit as I can get right now #briggs is the most comprehensive of the bunch so if you only have time for one i'd recommend her book #but there's nothing wrong with dipping into a bunch of the others i've provided

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on-partiality · 2 months

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Okay, so I'm absolutely curious:

I don't know if you've been asked this already, but how would you rank the Founding Fathers (from the ones you like the most to the ones you really don't)?

Sorry for taking forever I got sick and then I had school camp but here's how I'd rank them:

1, Alexander Hamilton: I've studied him the most out of the main founding fathers so I've grown rather attached to him. I still acknowlege his flaws like the fact that the trading charter he worked for when he was younger also sold slaves, the fact that he was sexist just like the typical 18th century man and that he did cheat on his wife. But even with all of those, he's my favourite of the bunch.

2. James Madison: when creating this tier list type thing I realised that I really don't know much about Madison that's why he's higher in the list (because I've studied him so little compared to the others, I don't know as much about his flaws and problematic actions as I do the rest of the bunch) I've read a lot about him doing silly things and supposedly being a good husband but the fact that he got along so well with Jefferson throws me off because I really don't like Jefferson. So yeah, I'd say I'm pretty neutral with Madison.

3. John Adams: I haven't studied him as much as the other founders (still more than Madison though) so I find it difficult to have too strong an opinion on him. I like his stance on slavery and the fact that he never owned any, however, I don't like his thoughts on women and men without property (and just generally the requirements he wanted to make on who should and shouldn't be allowed to vote) and I don't believe he was a very good father from what I've read about how he treated his oldest son, I also don't like his personality.

4. Benjamin Franklin: I know that no one is going to agree with me on this one but something about him just grosses me out, probably because I'm semi-sex-repulsed and hearing about the way he was with so many women makes me want to gag. Additionally, the comment he made about old women being the same in the dark grossed me out heaps. I get that he technically wasn't that bad and he freed his slaves and invented so many things but his personal life throws m

5. George Washington: Look, he did some HORRIBLE things, he owned many slaves, his treatment of Native Americans was terrible and I completely disagree with most of his political views... But I really like him as a military commander and a soldier and I like his personality a lot and that's why he ranks higher than the next person on this tier list, I don't agree with most of his actions. I don't support racism or genocide. But also I have far more fun studying Washington than I do the next founding father on this list.

6. Thomas Jefferson: child rapist, owned more slaves than any of the other people on this list (I think) and was really weird with his pets. He advocated for religious freedom and he was smart, I'll give him that but I don't like his personality, I don't like his political views and he was very hypocritical. Really, with his views, he wouldn't have even liked himself and he didn't do enough to make me like him. He's still interesting to study but I find it far harder to empathise with him than I do the men listed above because I really just can't see him as anything but vile.

Bonus!: I would put Aaron Burr between Adams and Madison because while I agree with most of his views and he's really fun to study, I like Hamilton a little bit too much to rank the man that killed him higher than 3rd.

(note: I wrote this on like an hour of sleep, this may be the worst amrev take ever)

Edited, 24th of February: Got reminded of this post's existence thanks to a comment by @c0ckmuncher pointing out how inaccurate one of these takes was and checked it again and safe to say I'm never posting anything late night ever again, the rankings have now been changed to better suit what I actually think of these men

#amrev #founding fathers #liberty's kids #Alexander Hamilton #hamilton #historical hamilton #george washington #john adams #benjamin franklin #james madison #thomas jefferson #aaron burr

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shittysawtraps · 2 years

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Hello Thomas Jefferson, America’s most famous slave owning child rapist. Look at this post where you’re a black bisexual trans man drug dealer college student wearing a hatsune miku binder. Yes it’s cringey. Your task is to cosplay as this ten layers removed version of yourself and say “Meet God she’s black”. Come on Tommy, show the Hamilton fans that you’re a progressive blorbo to head canon and not an evil monster

#submission #saw franchise #jigsaw #shitty saw traps #hamilton

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fdrsamericanflagduckfloaty · 11 months

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Drop the Miku Binder TJ rant bestie

okay so like

i was just thinking about it, and, like, i think it's fucking nuts but also really weird how the hamilton fandom (which i'm in but i swear i'm not an uwu lams turtles shipper please) somehow took this CRUSTY, TERF-BANGED, UGLY, OLD, REDHEADED, RAPIST ASS MOTHERFUCKER,

and turned his ugly ass into this.

like damn what the hell- what- how???? okay like yeah, they're using daveed diggs as a base for this bullshit, which, okay, fine, but YOU DID NOT NEED TO ADD THE INFO. The idea itself is funny but also a bit weird, however im 99% sure Diggs himself wore that shirt. However, all of the extra info??? come on. Where'd the fandom get this istg y'all-

Also, also, they did something similar by making John Laurens (gay blonde dumbass) into an UWU turtles boy. ....why. Bi trash coffee gremlin tumblr over-worked sleep-deprived alexander hamilton. like yeah relatable but. why. small bean big sweater uwu innocent boy blushy short james madison. ...why. bro was stubborn and would pick a fight and was the 'fuck you' type of shy.

I just find it wild the fandom made this and it is the entirety of the fandom into one. There's the good sides, there's the bad, and there's this. Which encompasses the ENTIRE. FUCKING. FANDOM.

The fandom has its headcanons, it has its perks, but then you reach the side where everyone is just a wild fucking original character. They don't model the historical figures anymore- they're just OCs with the name 'Philip Hamilton' or 'John Laurens' or god forbid our third U.S president 'Thomas Jefferson' slapped onto it.

I'm also so confused as to how this is what the fandom is known for. We have some good fics, we have hella good art, we have a M U S I C A L , and then the first thought people have of the Ham fandom is Miku Binder Third President Founding Fucker Slaveowner Thomas Jefferson.

I also find it kind of offensive (almost put insluting oh my ufckjg-) that they made a founder become this but like he'd probably be really pissed so please keep fucking up his memory lmao he deserves it

But like... also why. What made them think of this.

Like yeah I write 20k word TR smut but you don't see me drawing it.

You don't see me making him an UWU e-boy.

...Eh I probably would for shits and giggles tbh

But like this is founding father Thomas Jefferson. Third Pres. Second VP. First Sec. of State. And he is a furry, ex-cocaine addict. Also btw do they mean John Laurens or John Adams as the former drug dealer part because neither are better but it'd really help

Also bro literally raped his 14 year old slave and had like 6 kids with her. He had her room DIRECTLY NEXT TO HIS. He RAPED HIS DEAD WIFE'S HALF-SISTER. AND HE'S A SAD UWU MAN WHO DID NOTHING WRONG?

Let's not forget this same person made a post saying Lizzie (the Queen) would be reincarnated as a horse when she died. I'm serious. Deadass.

However, it's also funny as fuck because this entire thing is a tarnish to Jefferson and I fucking HATE that bastard so like good job lol

At the same time though it's still super weird??? But insane??? Because how did this become one of the Tumblr exclusives??? like it's Tumblr history at this point. Twitter history. You cannot express any like for the Hamilton musical before you get the 'have you seen miku binder thomas jefferson' and it's like 'well shit'.

But also remember: THIS IS NOT AN OC TO FUCK AROUND WITH. Hamilton the Musical specifically gave you and presented you the founder. Thomas Jefferson. Played by Daveed Diggs. Just because it is played by a POC, but also modernized, and vastly different from the actual founder and President, does not mean that at its core it is NOT STILL THE SAME PERSON.

If you name it Thomas Jefferson, if you use the presentation of him given by Daveed Diggs, you are still using that white fucking slave-owning racist motherfucker, and that's the point of it all.

I find it stupid but funny but also insane, and I wouldn't care, unless I KNEW IT WAS SERIOUS. The artist made it seriously. They made John Laurens. They made Philip Hamilton. They did this seriously.

but like also look at this lmao

This meme of Thomas Jefferson in a Hatsune Miku binder really got trending on Twitter at one point

It's an infamous, hellish, classic meme of both Tumblr and the Hamilton fandom, and it deserves what attention it's got, but Jesus please never unironically make shit like this again, Hamilfans, we're stained by this we don't need another😭🔫

EDIT:

i have more

So like, I just remembered: it kinda romanticizes these guys??? The musical??? so like don't get me wrong i love the music but... it puts them into this light. This pink light. It paints Hamilton as an abolitionist who was outspoken about it. When, in reality, dude traded and sold slaves for his in-laws + wasn't all that outspoken about it + was against immigrants or migrants, WHEN DUDE WAS FROM THE ISLANDS. HE HAD SCOTTISH BLOOD. AND HE'S AGAINST IT? Hypocrisy at its finest.

Washington also owned slaves and ran his own plantation too, so he's not off the hook. Madison, the 'uwu small bean' of the fandom, also owned slaves and ran a plantation. So the main people of this entire fiasco are slave-owners. Perfect. But also I've heard Ron Chernow's book on Hamilton, the entire start of the musical, is a bit biased to Ham himself, so...

You could be saying 'but FDRsduckfloaty, Sally is mentioned!' yes. But however, not enough. Not more. It's not even implied more than potentially ONCE what he did, and I'm not sure it ever was! Cabinet battle 3 states it flat-out but it was cut. For your info, Ben Franklin and John Adams are the only two you can really like in the slavery aspect. Ben bought them but let them go for their freedom, and John detested slavery and was against it. Never owned one.

Jefferson did add a slavery clause to the declaration but it was discarded, and he didn't fight half as much as he could have. Maybe he did and since it was the 1700s he didn't have a lot of support, but surely he could've done something like, I don't know, call it out after his terms? Once you're done gaining your second term and out of office, they can't do shit to it or your presidency, since it's over.

So the musical itself has its own problem and the fandom is even worse. It blatantly disregards that a LOT. A hella lot of the amrev fandom + a small part of the ham fandom has called TJeffs out for it but I mean can we please not make shit like Miku Binder Jefferson and act like he wasn't an actual child rapist???

This video does pretty well at it. I will admit the tagline 'America then, told by America now' almost sends shivers down my spine for what it really means. But then again I find men not knowing they'd make it down into the history books for starting the world's global power and the world's economic powerhouse pretty interesting. Doing something big and knowing it's historical, but not that it's going to form a very, VERY large country, where you'll be honored down the road and called a Founding Father of an entire nation? Signing papers and not knowing they're the founding stones of a country and still looked up to today? Intriguing.

But like still fuck Thomas Jefferson lmao

youtube

there's a lot more videos on it that dig deep, but the point is, that Hamilton is a good musical with good songs but it's also very... complex, and a bit problematic, Thomas Jefferson is a little bitch, and you should stan 1776 before you ever stan Hamilton. 1776 does not do this. It is much more realistic. 1776 has Benjamin Franklin and that's an immediate win. Be more like a 1776, be less like a Hamilton.

#miku binder thomas jefferson #thomas jefferson #this is the rant that woulda stayed in drafts #rant post #hamilton fandom #not just hamilton no no the fandom itself

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yr-obedt-cicero · 1 year

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Why exactly do you think that Jefferson is not a good person personality-wise? We know of his actions, but what of just how he is?

Correction; I don't think he's a hero, or a villain. Due to my lack of interest of learning about him - which isn't deep or anything, he just genuinely does not interest me - I can come across as being harsher towards him than how I do with many of the other founders. The ideology someone could be a saint, or pure evil; is kind of a childish fairytale view. When judging historical figures, you need to see them as the people that they are, not statues of fictional heroes upon a pedestal. And in almost every case with a founder; they are just morally gray people. On one hand; Jefferson was the author of the Declaration Of Independence, a ballsy job not many were willing to commit to and do. And on the other; he was an asshole, manipulative politician, pedophile, etc. People often times seem conscripted to choose between seeing controversial historical figures as heroes, or villains. With the downfall being missing the reasonable answer that is the ambiguity and complexity of humanity. It's a common side affect to trying to objectify these real human people as saints, or sinister people to either only condone or condem. Because the end result is; the polarization. There isn't going to be a completely terrible or completely great person.

Anyway, in many cases; it's subjective wether someone's shortcomings outweigh their accomplishments. And I'm not here to personally countdown every misdeed in Jefferson's life to give an answer. But I will say that; from most of what I've heard, I am not fond of Jefferson in any aspect. I'll spare the details about his relationship with slavery and the Hemming's case — not out of the intent to dismiss those disgusting acts, but because I don't feel like repeating what has already be told repeatedly. And we are really judging on his “personality” here, so let's just take from the perspective of his own time.

He was a sexist, and supported rapists.

Jefferson believed that;

“More so than most founders, Thomas Jefferson dwelled on disorderly women. He noted that his good-hearted male assistant “loses all power over himself and becomes almost frenzied” when in the company of women. Jefferson was against imposing harsh penalties on rapists lest disorderly women use the rape charge as “an instrument of vengeance against an inconstant lover and of disappointment to a rival.” He condemned French women who engaged in public petitioning and protests for abandoning their families and nourishing “all our bad passions.” He blamed France's Queen Marie Antoinette for an “inflexible perverseness and dauntless spirit," manipulation of the king, and the violence of the French Revolution. He commented, “I should have shut the Queen in a convent, putting harm out of her power.” Jefferson's misogynist tendency to blame women for all public problems was simply an extreme example of the founders' deep distrust of public women.

Not surprisingly, many founders joined fraternal organizations where men could escape from women to enjoy male camaraderie. Social groups like the Freemasons, martial institutions such as the Society of the Cincinnati, and political clubs like Democratic Societies were male-only organizations that invited members to congregate, socialize, network, deliberate, plan, and make decisions regarding their families, businesses, communities, and nation without women's presence, intervention, or interference.”

(source — The Gendering of American Politics: Founding Mothers, Founding Fathers, and Political Patriarchy, by Mark E. Kann)

He was super racist, even for his day.

Granted, throughout Jefferson's life, he was always publicly disagreeing towards slavery, despite enslaving 600 people. Jefferson called slavery a “moral depravity”, and he believed that slavery was a great threat to their new nation. And he also thought that slavery was a terrible contradiction to the laws of nature, which was that everyone had a right to personal liberty.

But that is all severely less applauding when Jefferson's belief in the necessity of abolition was intertwined with his racist beliefs — as in, Jefferson didn't care if slaves were freed or not, he still thought they were inferior and didn't deserve to be in America with white folks. He thought that white Americans and enslaved black people constituted two separate nations, and that they could never live together peacefully, or even in the same country, abolishment or not.

Jefferson also believed that black people were racially inferior, and even had the capability of children;

“for, men, probably of any colour, but of this color we know, brought up from their infancy without necessity for thought or forecast, are by their habits rendered as incapable as children of taking care of themselves, and are extinguished promptly wherever industry is necessary for raising the young. in the mean time they are pests in society by their idleness, and the depredations to which this leads them. their amalgamation with the other colour produces a degradation to which no lover of his country, no lover of excellence in the human character can innocently consent.”

(source — from Thomas Jefferson to Edward Coles, [August 25, 1814])

And he was actually terrified what freed slaves might do to their previous owners, that he supported deporting black people out of the United States ( Freed or not ) in favor of protecting planation owners.

Which is the whole meaning behind Jefferson's well-known quote; “we have a wolf by the ear, and we can neither hold him, nor safely let him go”

All of which, was pretty racist even by his day-in-age. Trust me, there are plenty more admirable abolitionists that did not agree with this same sickening ideology.

He was a shitty person and friend.

So, I'm not going to bring up his rivalry with Adams because they were both petty and ridiculous.

Thaddeus - also known as Tadeusz - Kosciuszko ( 1746-1817 ), was a Polish engineer, and firm believer in liberty. Kosciuszko traveled to America during the American Revolution and even fought in the war, and later gained even greater recognition in defense of his native Poland. And he was also an abolitionist, and hated slavery.

Yet, he was also great friends with Jefferson. Who had called him; “as pure a son of liberty as I have ever known.” The major difference between Kosciuszko and Jefferson as abolitionists, was that Kosciuszko was actually willing to act on his word.

In 1798, Kodciuszko left the United States and returned to the Russian-controlled sector of the former Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth. Jefferson had helpfully provided him with a passport in a false name and arranged for his secret departure to France. But before leaving that same year, Kodciuszko wrote out a will and entrusted Jefferson to be the executor. In the document, Kosciuszko - long before the American Civil War - pleaded for the emancipation of America's black slaves. His plan was to leave his American estate to buy the freedom of the enslaved, including Jefferson's own, and to educate them for independent life and work as to help supply them after they would be freed from the planations.

“I Thaddeus Kosciuszko being just in my departure from America do hereby declare and direct that should I make no other testamentory disposition of my property in the United States I hereby authorise my friend Thomas Jefferson to employ the whole thereof in purchasing Negroes from among his own or any others and giving them Liberty in my name, in giving them en education in trades or othervise and in having them instructed for their new condition in the duties of morality which may make them good neigh bours good fathers or moders, husbands or vives and in their duties as citisens teeching them to be defenders of their Liberty and Country and of the good order of Society and in whatsoever may Make them happy and useful, and I make the said Thomas Jefferson my executor of this”

(source — Will of Tadeusz Kosciuszko, [May 5, 1798])

In October 1817, Kosciuszko passed. But even before such, in September, he wrote a letter to Jefferson reminding him of the deal; “—of which money, after my death, you know the fixed destination.” And yet, Jefferson waited until he was of age 77, to claim that he was too old to fill in the request, and that it was too complicated legally. After the case was passed around through a couple of other men who all refused to fullfil it; and I don't believe it was ever completed.

He was a manipulative politician.

He did that imperious, artificial sympathy shit of dressing poor to make himself appear more relatable and humanizing to people. Which in the end; is just insulting and arrogant, but even politicians ( And celebrities ) do things like that today and get away with objectifying others simply because of class differences.

And also, he was such a rich coward that half the rumors and slander he had spread around weren't even by himself — but he had instead just paid many journalists to do his dirty work for him, all while he could appear innocent and too sensible to get into the crossfire of political slander.

#amrev #american history #thomas jefferson #founding fathers #queries #sincerely anonymous #Cicero's history lessons #history

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lilja4ever · 2 days

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disorganized thoughts on life is strange under cut, warning for spoilers and mention of sexual assault. after this I have to write my essay so if you see my online just kill me

so I obviously haven't played lis in a really long time however it has held up way better than I expected. It fit really well into the 2010s online gay people culture so I was shocked to see it still have a pretty strong effect on me. like yeah the dialogue is ass and the game does not look so awesome now (that remaster looks cool though!) but it is a genuinely captivating story especially episodes 4 and 5.

I think Nathan is such a compelling character and I wish there was more about him that the player could interact with, I'm still thinking about his "Rachel in the dark room" drawing. obviously he has some strong issues with his parents that mr Jefferson used against him but the idea of him being at mr Jefferson's bidding for validation is so scary and so interesting. there is so much darkness in his character from the surface level we get and yet I find myself thinking about him still! I'm happy he survives when you choose to save the town. he reads as repressed homosexual as well but I'm also reading into it. Victoria too but I also want her

obviously mr Jefferson is the most interesting part of lis (in tandem with Rachel amber), his character exploration in the last two episodes was so scary and so well thought out. however I found it kind of funky that he only ever drugs and photographs women yet he's just not a rapist? when you look at the newspaper towards the end of the game it says something like "professor drugs women but doesn't sexually assault them" like you would think that would be a pretty big factor of his character? and the fact that it's implied that Kate is assaulted at the party (yet again the dialogue is something vague like "she was making out with a ton of people!") and Nathan buys GHB from the dealer guy... but only for photography reasons? idk how to actually articulate myself without sounding crazy but that seems like an obvious choice to make him more violent in that sense. even in the last of us David is fixated on Ellie as an object of sexual conquest and its made obvious that it's what he wants from her. like if you're going to do this big misogynistic villain maybe dont just be like "he's not THAT bad" lol

I also wish there were more allusions to twin peaks but the fire walk with me in the mirror at the diner made me smile so big. Kate marsh is my sweet angel

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icedsodapop · 4 months

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Josh Andres Rivera in a 2018 Google Interview for the US tour of Hamilton: Yeah, Thomas Jefferson wasn't historically a nice dude...

Me: yeah, describing a slaveowner and rapist as not being nice is a huge understatement.

#anti hamilton #liberalism #theatre #musicals

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is-the-owl-video-cute · 2 years

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Does Jefferson specifically make you mad because every other American idolizes him despite his being a child rapist who was in favor of slavery?

There are many reasons to hate the man, but that is certainly one of them.

#I’m not going to get into it in full about Jefferson #I think the only ‘American hero’ I hate more is Jackson #more like jackass

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wily-one24 · 7 months

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"Love Is" set to Alannah Myles, a bunch of movie clips that depict different versions of love. And apparently, when I made this ages ago, I was focused on one movie in particular that would surprise most in a video about love, but whatever. I watched it now and was kinda enchanted.

"Eat It" - Weird Al Yankovic. A bunch of Veronica Mars characters eating and interacting with food. Anyone who was ever on screen in the first two seasons is fair game in this vid. Also, this is the vid that Rob Thomas loved and showed the VM cast members.

"Hotel California", set to the Eagles. First two and a half seasons of Veronica Mars. Welcome to the Hotel California, you can check out any time you like, but you can never leave.

"Tale As Old As Time", set to the Australian Cast of the Broadway Musical Beauty and the Beast. Featuring Veronica Mars as Belle, Logan Echolls as the Beast, Duncan Kane as Gaston, Keith as Belle's Father, and many, many more!

"Immune" - Firefly, set to Del Amitri's "Immune to the Whole Affair". I do love me some Jayne/Kaylee.

"The Girl of my Dreams (Is Giving Me Nightmares" - set to Machine Gun Fellatio, Jayne/River. And while I was never a Jayne and River fan, this was a friend request and turned out to be one of my most popular vids. So... idek.

"Fine Bunch of Reubens" - Multi-song, character retrospective that has a song describing each of the eleven characters we know and love from Firely (that's right, I said ELEVEN, and I meant it). This is a long one, but I adore it so. And I still stand by my song choice for each character.

"Disarm" - set to the Smashing Pumpkins, Sam and Jack. Yep, a Skewed Believer from way back (and if you know what I'm talking about, pull up a fandom chair in the Fandom Old Folks' home and we can reminisce). This is my first video ever.

"Try Not to Remember" - set to Sheryl Crow, a Dollhouse general vid. As Echo/Caroline becomes aware. S1.

"Touched" - set to VAST. Simon and River. I... can't believe I almost forget this one.

Other vids that didn't make the poll, but are still there and I adore them:

The VM trilogy, Logan/Veronica/Duncan. Each character has their own video to explore the dynamic beween the three. Logan "She Says", Veronica "You Oughtta Know" and Duncan "White Wedding".

VM "Cry". If you think the men of VM cry a lot, you'd be right. (humour).

VM"Pretty When You Cry", Veronica Mars Vs Villians.

VM "Stupid Girl", Lilly Kane video.

VM "Tell On You (Letter to My Rapist)", a Veronica Mars "A Trip to the Dentist" video.

VM "Tramp", The men of VM are tramps, enough said (humour).

Firefly: "Gimme a Break", Mal Reynolds Vs all the people that shit him to tears.

Firefly: Kaylee. A Kaylee Frye vid set to "Can't Keep A Good Girl Down".

Glee: "Yo Mamma", Puck likes to fuck Moms. It's canon.

Heroes: "Vindicated", a Nikki video.

Once Upon a Time: "Bleeding Out", Swan Queen.

Once Upon a Time: "Temptation Waits", Emma and Jefferson.

BtVS: "Big Shot" , a Warren video.

BtVS: "Hero", an Andrew Video.

BtVS: "Pretty Fly for a White Guy", a Jonathon video.

BtVS: "Under Your Spell", a Tara video.

All BtVS videos were made for a Buffy con and shown at the con. Which is why they were these specific characters.

#jacqui used to vid once #which video do you want?#choose for me?#tell your friends

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