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gracestone · 3 years

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Tim Federle Interviews & Portwell

Since Tim's interviews keep floating around in the fandom, I figured I'd do a deep dive into them and analyse his Portwell-related answers. I don't claim to know exactly what he's thinking or what the exact meaning of his words is, but I've seen a lot of people spread around interpretations that sounded off to me, so I wanted to give my take. Below the cut are my interpretations of his answers as well as some speculation on what he may be teasing for Portwell in season 3. Clicking on the questions will take you to the article the question came from.

About EJ and Gina being together in S3:

First things first: Tim's answers on Portwell getting together. A lot of people claim that this answer doesn't bode well for Portwell:

Decider: I first want to talk about EJ and Gina, because once that relationship started happening, I was fully on board. When did you want them to start being a couple?

Tim Federle: Oh, my goodness, I’m not even sure if they are a couple yet. But I think that all the way back in Episode 10 when EJ flew Gina in. As performers, they have extraordinary chemistry, period, and are both really good actors. They’re really fun with one another. We wanted Gina to go on a journey of figuring out if she belongs in one place, in East High, figuring out if there’s anything still left with Ricky [Joshua Bassett], which I personally think is still not really a full story yet. And ultimately, realizing that EJ is really reforming himself and deciding to be a good guy. He literally shows up for people he cares about. Around the spring break episode, we really wanted to lean into EJ as the kind of friend who shows up.

More specifically, people claim that Tim saying that he doesn't know if Portwell is a couple yet means they won't be a couple in season 3. But that's not what Tim's saying. He's saying he's not sure if they're a couple yet. It's clear Portwell will be together. They may just need a little arc to get there. But before I go into that, let's look at another article that provides more proof Portwell will be a couple in S3:

While Ricky and Nini (Olivia Rodrigo) appeared to really say goodbye as she called Gina's music producer brother, Gina (Sofia Wylie) and EJ (Matt Cornett) finally got together...with an unseen kiss. After an unfortunate miscommunication over whether she saw him as a brother or a boyfriend, she asked if she could kiss him, and that's where the finale ended. And no, we're not mad, but we might be a little disappointed.

"I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. You always have to leave something for the imagination and for the future. I didn't mean to hurt you, " Federle jokes. "But still, they got together. That's something!"

So what could Tim have meant by "I'm not sure if they're a couple yet", if he's also saying they got together? I think what he means is that he's considering giving them a similar short arc as Redlyn had in 2x01. Just like Redlyn, EJ and/or Gina may be wondering if their kiss meant that they're together now, or if they have to still determine the relationship. Given that this is Gina's first relationship ever, I could see her struggling with that. It could also be related to Tim's answer here:

So what you’re saying is if we get to season 3, we’ll see a full-fledged Gina and EJ relationship?

Tim Federle: I think you’ll see full-fledged Gina everything. She’s still in high school, and there’s a lot that Gina needs to discover about herself and other people. I think certainly the end of season 2 sets up the fact that I think there’s a lot she needs to figure out about EJ.

EJ will be her first boyfriend, so of course there's a lot she needs to figure out about him! She's never been on a date before. This was her first kiss. Does that mean they're together now? Or do they go on a date first? What's next for them? What does it mean to be in a relationship? There's a lot she's gonna have to figure out.

One thing she's gonna have to figure out about him, and that EJ will have to figure out too, is mentioned in this part of another interview of his:

Gina and E.J.'s relationship has gradually blossomed into something more, and in the finale, we don't see them kiss but I assume they have their first kiss. Can you confirm?

Yeah, we can definitely confirm that.

Their connection was hinted at in season 1, but what was your thought process in putting these two characters together romantically?

The actors themselves have such chemistry with each other and are such close friends, and Sofia [Wylie] contains such depth and Gina obviously pines for Ricky and has unrequited feelings for somebody who is maybe not yet ready to show it back because he's still clinging to the past with Nini. I think for E.J., who went on such a season of self-discovery when he got rejected from [Duke and later accepted] and realized, "Oh, maybe life is not going to go exactly as I planned," I think he really opened himself up to the strength and bravery that Gina has that he hasn't seen in other people. They were just really fun to write for. And I think as actors, they embraced it and it was fun to watch come together.

How will their romance be received by their friends and by family?

I think the family and friend group mostly wants to see them happy. Jamie would be really defensive and protective. And I think that there's also a reality -- E.J.'s a senior and he's going to graduate. What's going to happen next? As with so many things, just when you get it right where you want it, it changes. There's definitely a lot of stories we're hoping to tell there. I hope we get to. I hope we get a season 3.

Gina is so used to things around her changing just as she's getting used to them or gets things right where she wants them. It's what happened to her every time she had to move and we saw it happen to her in season 1. So once the reality that EJ is graduating and doesn't yet know where he wants to go (or at least as far as she knows) sets in, that fear of things changing again will come back. Because she doesn't want things to change now that she finally got what she wanted. Tim's answer here doesn't tell us how this story will play out. But it does seem to indicate that Portwell will deal with the uncertainty that EJ graduating will bring for their relationship.

I'm not worried about EJ leaving, though, as I've stated many times before. Just read Tim's answer here about keeping Matt on the show:

Hopefully, there will be a future in which we get to see Gina and EJ actually be together, but that future is currently uncertain. The show hasn't been renewed for a season three yet, but Federle has his hopes up, and he's also got thoughts about what the future might look like. EJ, for example, is about to graduate, and while we might not expect the show to pull a Glee or a Riverdale and give him a job at the school, Federle hopes to keep him around.

"What I am sure of is that I would hate to make the show without Matt Cornett, because he's so kind," he says. "And I know that sounds like maybe a dumb reason to keep somebody around, but the older I get, the more it's like, 'Who are you surrounded by? Who is your cast of people in your life' And Matt is somebody you never want to go too far away, because he's too good."

Compare the answer above to what Tim said about Gina in S1 and whether she'd leave:

It's hinted that Gina may be moving back to Salt Lake City via a "crazy" idea Ashlyn hints at in the finale. Any teases as to what that could be?

The only thing I'll say about that is it's hard for me to imagine doing season two without Sofia Wylie, so that's as much as I'll say on that topic.

Sounds pretty similar, if you ask me. Yeah, he talks a little more confidently about Sofia staying than Matt, because that was already set up in the S1 finale. Whereas EJ's fate is a little more vague in the show by the end of S2. But still, I think this bodes well for Matt staying on the show.

Anyways, back to storylines for Portwell in S3 that Tim may be hinting at in his interviews.

There were a lot of loose threads at the end of the season, teeing up a potential season 3 -- one of which is the possible return of Gina's older brother, music producer Jamie, played by Jordan Fisher. Gina floats the idea that Nini needs to meet him as she begins her next musical chapter. Is that the plan?

Yeah. Jordan's so easy and fun to write for. He's just such an interesting performer. Anytime you introduce a new character that's really going to have legs, you want it to impact more than one character. Even though there's a direct connection between Jamie as a music producer and some of Nini's songwriting dreams coming to the surface, I'd also really like to see how Jamie and E.J. interact, and how Jamie impacts his little sister, Gina, now that they've been away from each other for so many years and they're back in each other's lives. I definitely think new characters offer a dynamic shift, which is what's exciting about Jamie as a character. And then Jordan as an actor, he's such an incredible singer and dancer. That gives us ample opportunity to explore that if we get a season 3.

The question wasn't about EJ or Portwell at all, but Tim did bring up EJ and Jamie interacting in season 3. In another answer that I already posted up above, he said "Jamie would be really defensive and protective" about Gina's relationship with EJ. Clearly, Tim has been thinking about Jamie in relation to Portwell. So it's likely we'll see the result of that on screen. And if EJ is interacting more with Gina's family in S3, that's just more evidence that he's Gina's endgame love interest.

If after all of that you're still feeling insecure about Portwell, just read how Tim described Gina's feelings for EJ in response to a question about Second Chance:

How do you see those four characters embodying that idea specifically?

Gina is a character the audience loves — this is what I hear — because she started out as a sort of one-dimensional mean girl, but of course, all mean girls have something else happening underneath the surface. So for Gina, who has finally allowed herself to take down some walls and try to let people in, she is now questioning that because of a miscommunication about this guy who she has a huge crush on. She’s asking herself, “Should I actually have stayed harder? Should I have kept those walls up?” For E.J., he has tried so hard as this prototypical privileged, perfect-on-paper, high school all-star to try something new this year. To ask other people how they’re doing and get out of his own head and recognize that if you want something, you have to go after it rather than protect yourself with bluster. So he’s questioning that, “Did I get this wrong?”

Gina and Ricky related questions

Since Tim's interviews get used a lot to undermine Portwell shippers' confidence, I figured I'd also delve into his Ricky and Gina related answers and give you my take on them. Some of these are from post-S2 interviews, others from post-S1. I just wanted to cover all the answers I've seen quoted a lot.

Let's start with two answers from different interviews that get brought up a lot:

This season’s musical was Beauty and the Beast. If there’s a season 3, would you want to have another set musical or touch on different ones. If you picked up where you left off, it’s still just after the spring production.

Tim Federle: I know. Choosing the musical for the show is hard because there are so many possibilities. You can go way, way off, you can go High School Musical 3, you can create a new musical. I think at the end of the day, the music is a really cool storytelling component of the show, but I really think it’s about the character dynamics. It’s like Gina and Ricky, Nini and Ricky, and it’s Big Red and Ashlyn that I think the audience really tunes in for. That’s a big decision we weigh in heavily when choosing the next show.

Gina and Ricky had sprinkles of looks and glances in season 2, and they did have that one flashback confession. What are your thoughts on the R*na fandom?

Tim Federle: Sofia has chemistry with like a lamp. She’s just that kind of actor. That’s an incredible fandom. Man, they are passionate, and I really respect the passion that they have for that couple. I guess what I would say about R*na is, I think the reason people go to their high school reunions, even 50 years later, is because you never really graduate from high school. I do think there’s a lot between those two characters that is very much still on the table, even if they’re not quite ready to see what that actually means.

Firstly, note how in both answers, he barely says anything concrete about R*na in regards to the story. It's mostly about the fandom. And it makes sense that he would mention them. They're loud and passionate! Why not give them a shout out? It's likely the only way they'll feel heard, cause the show isn't listening to them or giving them what they want.

As for the bit about high school reunions, I interpreted that as Tim saying that people in high school can have a big impact on you and that you will still remember them years later. Gina and Ricky did impact each other. He was her first crush. That's not something she's gonna forget, even though she's moved on from any romantic feelings for him.

Now, the only part that actually says something about where Gina and Ricky's story could go next. What is there still on the table for Ricky and Gina that they're not quite ready to talk about yet? From what I can tell, it's the fact that Ricky hurt Gina by not being honest about not feeling the same way about her. They can't move past that until they talk about it. Because right now, they're not really friends anymore. Or at least, not beyond the surface level. They have to address what happened between them before they can move on and truly be friends again.

I think that conversation is also why Tim said that her "figuring out if there's anything still with Ricky [...] is still not really a full story yet" (see the first answer in this post). By now, Gina has realised that there's nothing left with Ricky romantically. She has moved on. But she never got proper closure with Ricky. They never talked through it. So I think that will happen in S3.

If you're still worried about whether or not Ricky has feelings for Gina, just read this answer carefully:

We had a few romantic cliffhangers by the end of the finale. Where are those relationships heading if we get a third season?

Gina is ready for something sweet and normal and reciprocal, and EJ is there for her in a way that's really real. For EJ, who's been on this journey to try to be a better person, it was nice to see that pay off with somebody really accepting him and clearing up confusion. Nini was on a season-long arc we've been talking about for a year and a half in the writers' room where she really, truly, and finally chooses herself over a boy, prioritizing her own dreams but also just her own self-worth that is not refracted through the light or darkness of a partner. And I think Ricky is a dumb, clueless boy who has the best of intentions but grew up in an environment where change is scary for him, so he's trying on different identities. He's really afraid to be alone. So we'll see where that leads.

Tim specifically mentions that Gina is ready for something reciprocal and that she has that with EJ. Which means that what she had with Ricky ultimately wasn't reciprocal.

Tim also says that Ricky is afraid to be alone. Twice now, we've seen Ricky try to move on from Nini by putting himself out there romantically and flirting with another girl. But him being scared to be alone means that his arc will ultimately lead to him having to confront that fear. It means he'll have to be alone for a while and learn that it's okay to be alone. That you can be single and happy. Any relationship that he has before he learns that is automatically doomed, because it stands in the way of Ricky's character growth.

Their connection was hinted at in season 1, but what was your thought process in putting these two characters together romantically?

I covered this one in the Portwell section, but this also says something about Ricky and Gina. But before I go into that, note how Tim specifically talked about Matt and Sofia's chemistry here, while two answers above he said "Sofia has chemistry with like a lamp" in response to Gina's chemistry with Ricky. Big difference.

Circling back to the interview answer herre, Tim again confirms that Gina's feelings for Ricky were unrequited in season 2. But what their shippers like to focus on is the part where Tim says that Ricky is "maybe not yet ready to show it back". Their interpretation of it is that this means Ricky will eventually be ready to show feelings back. And that's a valid interpretation. I just don't think that's what Tim is saying.

First of all, he's saying that Gina's feelings are unrequited. That means Ricky doesn't have any feelings to show back at this point in time. I think what Tim is talking about is that Ricky wasn't ready in season 1 to really commit to someone who wasn't Nini. He did have feelings for Gina after homecoming and then in 1x06 figured out that Gina had feelings too (I always read their thing as them knowing they were mutually flirting), but all of that happened when Ricky was thinking that he had no shot at being with Nini again. He wasn't ready to give up on Nini, but he was respecting her rejection in 1x04. He was trying to move on. But he wasn't yet ready to let go. Not like he may be doing at the end of season 2, after he and Nini broke up again. This time, it was a mutual break up, and Ricky actually realised why they weren't working. I think that Ricky ends season 2 ready to actually give another relationship a more serious effort than what he gave his brief flirtation with Gina. But Gina isn't on his mind for the second chance he wants at getting a relationship right. He's thinking about Lily. So based on that and everything else we've seen in the show, I don't think Tim meant that Ricky will eventually be ready to show his feelings back to Gina. I think it's more about Ricky being ready (or getting to that point) to give moving on a real shot in general. Which Tim essentially confirmed in another interview:

How do you see those four characters embodying that idea specifically?

[...] I think for Ricky, who is so sentimental and so afraid of change, he’s asking himself if he has opportunities and horizons and new people he’s kept himself closed off to because change is scary.

One of the biggest cliffhangers coming out of the finale is Ricky getting lured in by Lily. What do you think about their dynamic and where do you see it going in a potential third season?

You know, Gina sort of started as a mean girl, but Sophia [Wylie, the actress who plays Gina] is so extraordinary that we really wanted to push that and surprise people and show her backstory. With Lily, I wanted a full-on Sharpay. She’s like a chaos agent, which, Lord knows, I grew up with those kids in high school too. You know, my show plays in a fairly small sandbox, which is, at the end of the day, on the Disney platform, so we’re going to be a show about basically good people who go through hard times but ultimately make good decisions. So Lily provided an opportunity for our version of a chaos agent. … Ricky, I think, is a very lost soul. He’s sometimes like a moth to a flame and gets attracted to the brightest thing around him. And I think Lily is somebody who sets things on fire to watch them burn, but doesn’t necessarily have a plan for how she’s going to put it out. So I think something is going to spark there if we get to Season 3. My hope for Ricky is that cooler heads prevail and that he gets some treatment and starts to make better decisions. I think that’s the journey Ricky needs to go on.

Tim compares Gina and Lily here in terms of their (initial) role on the show and their relationships with Ricky. Ricky's attraction to the brightest thing around him (Gina and Lily) is something that he has to grow out of, based on Tim's comment that cooler heads should prevail and that Ricky should start making better decisions.

Tim also said this about Rini:

Are they over for good, or is that something we're going to see continue in a third season?

If I get to season 3 or beyond, there are a lot of stories I would still like to tell. For now, Nini is definitely on her own journey, and I think Ricky reads the room well enough to finally understand that this is not the moment to keep trying to explore that.

Not only does he want to explore more stories with Rini, it also confirms that Ricky would like to keep trying to make their relationship work. He still loves her, but he's read the room and he knows that they need to go their own way for now, because their relationship wasn't working for the time being. Him still being in love with Nini doesn't bode well for any relationships he starts now, though. In order for any of his future relationships with anyone other than Nini to last, he'd have to get over Nini first.

D23: When you create a TV series, you write, cast, and shoot a pilot—but then as you go on to make 10 episodes you discover new things about your characters and your story takes new twists that you might not have originally expected. What changed for you over the course of the season?

TF: The first thing that changed for me was recognizing that some of the most gifted storytellers on the show were standing five feet away from me—and they happened to be kids. [I also discovered] that Joshua and Olivia are both very accomplished young songwriters on their own. I recognized pretty early on that with talent like that, one of my jobs as a gatekeeper was to try to lower as many gates as possible and give them an opportunity to write a song—or multiple songs—for us. Another thing that changed is the “R*na” coupling of Ricky and Gina. That was never intended to be something that took much of a spotlight in the show. Frankly, by dint of the extraordinary gifts of these actors I can kind of pair any of them in any way—whether that’s platonic or romantic—and something interesting happens. For Dara Reneé and Joe Serafini, who play Kourtney and Seb, I put them in a stairwell scene for half a page in episode 108 (the tech rehearsal), and all of a sudden I’m going, “Oh my gosh, I want to write more for these two. What a magical combination I didn’t see coming!”

I know R*na shippers like to claim that R*na wasn't planned and that Tim changed his plans for the story for them. But what he's saying here isn't that the ship didn't exist before the Homecoming scene, as some shippers like to claim. What he's saying is that the ship wasn't meant to get as much of a spotlight as it does now. What does that mean, you ask? I think we can find our answer in another answer of his:

The Ricky and Gina pairing really surprised a lot of people. It certainly surprised me. When did you get the initial thought that it'd be fun to see these two characters together?

We started the show with this traditional love triangle with Nini and these two boys [Ricky and E.J.] and I think that one of the techniques of trying to keep an audience on their toes is simply to surprise them by introducing somebody new. In this case it was Gina. To me, the real surprise of it was Sofia Wylie, and the depth and range and access she has in her life as an actor is phenomenal. When she shot that first scene with Joshua in the car outside her house at homecoming, I saw such a tenderness but also so much going on behind Sofia's eyes that made me say, "Oh my gosh, we have to keep writing. We have keep writing toward this. Something as simple as Ricky singing her a song in episode 6 can mean so much. And that is another thing musicals give you, which is the power of song, which is so inherently emotional and can tell so many stories that the script never could. I know we've got some Rina stans out there, and I'm hoping this show has five or seven seasons so we'll see where they all end up.

It always sounded off to me when shippers would say that the Homecoming scene made Tim decide to make R*na canon. Because when they filmed that, most (if not all) of S1 had already been written. They wouldn't just spend even more money on rewriting those scripts just to add a whole new ship. That's way too expensive, time consuming, and would delay the production of the show. Their S1 arc was already very much set in stone by the time they filmed 1x05.

What made Tim change his plans wasn't the chemistry between Joshua and Sofia. It was Sofia's performance that blew him away. Tim isn't saying he wanted to write towards R*na. He's saying he wanted to write towards Sofia's incredible range as an actor. She brought a tenderness and depth to Gina that surprised Tim, and that's what he's writing towards now. Just look at how much focus Gina got in season 2. Heck, just look at 2x09 alone. I think because Tim wanted to write more towards the depth and tenderness that Sofia brought to Gina, he gave the aftermath of R*na's flirtation (for lack of better word) in season 1 a bigger spotlight in season 2 than he originally intended to. We got to see how it affected Gina and saw her really work through that unspoken rejection.

The last part of this question once again has Tim talking about the R*na fandom, without saying anything concrete about where R*na is going. "We'll see where they all end up" in five or seven seasons is vague as hell. It doesn't tell us anything. At most, he's just giving people (false) hope and making them tune in to the show just to see if their ship will happen again.

To end this, I wanna leave you with one more answer from Tim. I've already posted this one before, but it's still a good answer from Tim to keep in mind going forward, especially if you're worried about him catering to fans:

You're very active on Twitter and Instagram. Do you take nuggets from fan responses or reactions on social media, or do they sometimes shift how you perceive how certain characters are being embraced?

That's such a good question because especially in today's times, we all live a lot of our lives online, more than ever, right? The real answer is my job, the writer's job, the actor's job, our job is to make the show. And the fans' "job" is to react, and I respect that and I respect that space. I don't feel like that's my space to step into. If Twitter had been around when I was a teenager, you would have gotten some very hot takes on Dawson's Creek. I say that because while I respect very much and I appreciate the passion that I know a lot of people have for these characters and these actors, ultimately that response feels, in a weird way, like it's not really my business. That's sort of their world to debate and talk about, and hopefully bond over. By the way, television production takes so long that by the time the season airs, you're a little bit like, "Oh, wow, they're reacting to this thing that I know is going to change so much, so just you wait." It doesn't change our mind, but we appreciate the passion.

#hsmtmts #ej caswell #gina porter #portwell #tim federle #my post #this took so long to write #but i felt it was important to get out there #since antis have twisted his answers so much and have such a bad faith take on them #and too many people just take those antis at their word #instead of thinking critically about what tim is actually saying #should probably also tag this with #hsmtmts speculation #anyways i hope this helps ease some of you guys' minds #also note how in the last answer tim says he appreciates the passion from fans but that it won't change the writers' minds #and earlier he called r*na shippers passionate #anouk rambles

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lunequireves · 3 years

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Second Chances Costuming Notes

So we knew that when EJ, Nini, Gina and Ricky were on stage, they were in their audition clothes from the pilot. But what’s really interesting are the costumes from the hallway scenes - which was really reminding me of When There was Me and You truth be told. EJ, Nini, and Ricky are in the same outfits they were in when we were first introduced to them in the pilot and Gina is in her last outfit from season 1 (which is also what she wore when she returned for opening night and was swamped in a hug and when Ashlyn asked her to live with her).

These are when they wore the outfits from the hallway and their lines.

EJ: “I thought I knew what I want”

Of which, take note of the pink coat Nini’s wearing in the scene because, well…

You’ve got to love parallels and callbacks…

Anyways, moving on to Nini: “I’m finding who I am”

Ricky: (I’m missing what he says because it’s cut off.)

And then there’s Gina: “I’m safer when I’m on the run”

These are the same outfits everyone wore for the auditions.

While wearing those outfits, they say:

Nini: I got a second chance to fly.

EJ: I got a second chance to fall.

Gina: What can make the tide turn?

Ricky: What can make the fire burn?

Which is particularly interesting when you think about where the characters are going into episode 12. Because the two who were together in the pilot, EJ and Nini, have full stop statements whereas Gina and Ricky, who weren’t in any sort of relationship with anyone, have questions. It can be argued that all of the characters have gone through some sort of growth arc, some more than others, but their lines definitely correlate with their story arcs.

On that note, there have been quite a few great posts about how their lines correlate with their story arcs, so I won’t rehash any of that, but I just wanted to throw this in and just add that the costuming for this scene and song is really quite on point.

#HSMTMTS #In which I fall completely off the deep end of costume analysis #HSMTMTS S2 E12 #Ricky Bowen #Nini Salazar Roberts #EJ Caswell #Gina Porter #Portwell #Costume Analysis #Costume Theory #HSMTMTS Second Chances #Second Chances #LOL… I had been wondering about the pink that Gina was wearing for a while and now it just hit me why it stood out…#At least this time it wasn't during a thesis… I managed to avoid that by 3 months so I'm grateful for that #I always appreciate great costuming which has some symbolism and meaning #Because clothing is not random and is often a choice when it comes to shows and scenes #Will this actually post and show up? I guess we're going to find out lol.

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keeneschoices · 3 years

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EJ: Hey, have you seen my girlfriend? *shows a photo of Gina*

Big Red: Not since yesterday. Why, is she missing?

EJ: Oh no, she's fine. I just want people to look at her.

Big Red:

EJ: isn't she perfect?

#based on that post of teamwonderstudies that points out EJ would definitely gush abt Gina to random ppl at random moments #and i agree 100%#let us have this on the show #he appreciates and loves her too much not to talk abt her all the time #what can he say he's a simp #ej caswell #gina porter #portwell #hsmtmts

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redlyncentral · 3 years

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EJ and Ashlyn talk about Big Red! (pre s2)

#oh my god i have not posted anything in a good while #it's just a little thing i dribbled out #as usual kudos comments and reblogs are incredibly appreciated!#caswell cousins #redlyn #big red x ashlyn #EJ and Ashlyn caswell #Ej Caswell #Ashlyn Caswell #ashlyn moon #ashlyn moon caswell #big red redonovich #hsmtmts #hsm the series #high school musical the musical the series

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augustgf · 3 years

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ej caswell

#weekly ej caswell appreciation post bc im watching hsmtms #jiya.txt #it's kinda boring ..

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forbiddenship · 2 years

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he was the one all along: part 2

i’m really emotional about portwell today, so why not continue this? LMAO.

here’s part 1, btw.

https://forbiddenship.tumblr.com/post/670127606035857408/he-was-the-one-all-along-part-1

disclaimer: i am not liable if anyone cries. read at your own risk. i love you all <3

it’s actually crazy to me how literally every episode had some sort of connection or reference to or foreshadowing to ej and portwell. every day i’m more and more impressed with these writers and their storytelling.

in 2x04, ricky tells gina, “i go big. you know that.”

but the thing is, gina doesn’t know that. all she knows is the ricky that started hanging out with her after homecoming and flirting with her once he decided he wanted to move on from his ex and put himself back out there. the ricky that has always been very proactive in preserving the family the wildcats have created together, including doing his best to make sure miss jenn got to keep her job, but easily accepted that gina was moving away and resigned himself to this fact. she knows the ricky who, after she moved away, realized he still loved nini, and got back together with her even after she came back into his life. and lastly, the ricky who put their friendship on the back burner and as good as forgot about her as soon as he was in a relationship again.

gina doesn’t know that ricky is capable of “going big” - for her, at least. she’s seen him do it for nini, right from the first time she saw him and he sang “i think i kinda, you know” all the way to when he wrote a song to play for nini on valentine’s day. and even in the context they’re talking about - which is the chocolates (“i can only assume it’s your latest valentine to me”) - even that is an example of something ricky didn’t do for gina. a time that he didn’t “go big.” so when he says she must “know” that he can do that, even though it’s unintentional, for her it really translates to “you’ve seen me do this before for nini.”

in the next episode, we see gina finally confront ricky about all of his bullshit - for lack of a better term - and set her boundaries firmly. it was very satisfying to watch, after two straight episodes of him being a bad friend and making jokes about something that she was genuinely humiliated by. after the way he delivered that “obviously” so casually (but cruelly in the name of being honest. sorry i had to) when she said “we’re not dating.” it was nice to see her tell him straight up where her boundaries were.

and while that was the main takeaway from the scene, i can’t help but also notice the reason that he came to her for advice in the first place. ricky wanted to ask if gina would appreciate if he went behind her back for a good reason. basically he’s asking if she’s okay with being surprised by some sort of gesture. something that was planned without her knowing, but at the end of the day, was done for her own good. and what do you know, she says yes. that she would be flattered.

ofc ricky would never do something like this for gina. he knows it, she knows it, we know it. it’s part of why she gets so (rightfully) pissed when he comes to her asking this question. he turns it into a hypothetical between the two of them, but the truth is that he wouldn’t give her a sweet gesture, he wouldn’t go big for her, and he certainly wouldn’t do something behind her back for a good reason.

but guess who does go big for gina? who does things for her when she least expects them but most needs them? who shows up without ever having to be pushed and gives his 110%? who looks at her with the stars shining in his eyes?

ej caswell. who proves time and time again, without even trying, without even meaning to, that he can do all of the things that gina and ricky talked about, but obviously, ricky never could - even on a friendship level. all of the sweet gestures and the going big and - something i recently thought about - the “going behind her back for a good reason.”

in the fake dating scene in 2x07, we see gina having a convo with the north high guy, looking uncomfortable and unsure what to say, and in literally the next second, we see ej walk up behind her and put his arm around her. “hey babe.”

that was not something the two of them planned together. they fake dated before for homecoming, but that was a completely different situation. there was never a conversation where they sat down and established “if one of us ever needs rescuing, we will pretend to be boyfriend and girlfriend to get each other out of a difficult situation.” i mean, that would be cute, but i don’t think it happened, judging by the way gina was very surprised to see ej with his arm around her and ej kinda panicked and went “risotto!! let’s do that!!”

which means that in that split second that he saw gina standing there looking uncomfortable, ej came up with the fake dating as an idea to help her out. on his own. he didn’t ask if she was okay with it, so you could say he “went behind her back” - but for a good reason. it’s even in a literal sense, because the way they shot the scene is with ej walking up from behind gina, which is presumably where he came up with this idea.

and while we know from the fallout that ricky and nini had at slices that she didn’t appreciate him going behind her back, we know that gina, on the other hand, would be flattered by that. she’s not the same person as nini, and she doesn’t have the same love languages. to her, someone who spent the majority of her life looking out for herself, the prospect of someone looking out for her - the very idea of being “saved” - is indeed flattering. and that’s exactly what ej does for her.

i just think that’s neat.

moving to episode 2x06 now - sorry i’m going out of order - where we had the big confession scene in flashback form. even that scene had a small reference to ej. right before gina tells ashlyn about what she did on opening night, ashlyn brings up the secret understudy plan with ej. in the same episode where gina says “team wonderstudy. i got you.” the first time the wonderstudy plan was mentioned all season, actually.

it’s so personal to me how gina is basically sad and regretful and hurting in this entire scene, but the one mention of her plan with ej from last semester is enough to make her smile softly. to take her mind off ricky. much in the same way that she smiles and looks extremely relieved in the “may i have this exercise?” scene, when moments ago she was feeling flustered and slightly panicked. it’s the little things.

last, i just wanna talk about the two confession scenes. with ricky, gina knew that she was moving away, and some part of her also knew that he didn’t reciprocate her feelings - but she was okay with doing it anyways because she knew “the plane was going down.” she’s not really looking for an answer from him though. she tells him her confession, and then tells him she’s gonna hug him and walk away and that’s that. whereas with ej, she genuinely puts her heart out there by asking instead of just confessing and giving him a chance to respond.

i wanna focus on both of these boys’ responses, to these confessions though. because, even though gina phrases them very differently, the confessions do have some similarities.

with both ricky and ej, gina hesitates for a moment before making the confession. “i guess i just wanna say that- i’m sorry, this is so stupid, i don’t know why i’m crying.” to which ricky responds with “say it.” and “can i -??” to which ej responds with “can you what?”

of course, ricky looks her in the eye while ej looks away. ej was afraid of getting rejected and had no idea that she was actually going to confess, whereas ricky probably knew what was coming and, well, had just gotten back together with nini. nevertheless, i thought both of these setups for a confession were interestingly similar. until they weren’t. because after they ask her to keep going and she makes the confession, gina pauses for a second to see if they understood. and when i looked at their reactions side by side, it was like night and day.

ricky’s expression after she confesses stays basically the exact same as it was before, and he just nods. ej, however, is very confused, which is written all over his face. so gina clarifies her confession (which she never did with ricky because she wasn’t looking for him to give her a concrete answer) and again, ej’s expression changes. this time, he breaks out into a wide smile as he finally understands.

with ricky, she tells him that she’s going to hug him, and then takes the first step forward for the actual hug. but with ej, she asks if she can kiss him, and he drops his bag and takes the first step towards her. i just think it’s so cool how similar but also remarkably different the two scenes are. and how ricky’s face remains practically neutral the entire time - i can barely tell which shots are pre confession and post confession - while ej goes through a mini journey of emotions that play across his face, before he finally takes that big step forward.

i honestly don’t know what this post ended up being. i just started thinking about all the little references to ej and the foreshadowing in so many rina scenes, especially from 2A. how those scenes are not only examples of what’s wrong with rina, but also what’s right with portwell. it’s genuinely so beautiful to me. the writers knew what they were doing.

#sorry this is so freaking long #i definitely got carried away #i just love how this show gives us these little hints that portwell was meant to happen all along #maybe i’ll do something with season 1 scenes later #portwell #ej x gina #ej caswell #gina porter #hsmtmts

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organic-guacamole · 3 years

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Alright here's the real post of ep206

as usual, spoiler alert.

I'm literally so late today omg😭

I watched it with @sunshine-julie-molina and another friend so it was worth the wait✋

North high's video i-

I still don't think it should be "legal" in terms of the competition rules but whatever. Antoine is adorable though, as expected.

AW SEBBY

He's not wrong, they probably will win because of ✨ friendship✨

Ok but... imagine a seb and EJ friendship 🥲

GINAAAAAA

That exit sign thing shouldn't have been as funny as it was✋

Ashlyn babyyyy

I'm just gonna say it, I'm glad the writers picked up the Ashlyn insecurity thing, but I really really hope they execute it properly.

I don't like how they're not just explicitly saying it. Like it's not a bad word, why can't you just say that she feels that because she's not skinny and fitting into society's typical image of "the perfect princess", that she can't be Belle.

She thinks she's too fat to be Belle.

There, was that so hard to say Disney?

As someone that's insecure about their weight and body image, I don't appreciate how they're constantly hinting at it instead of outright saying it. I think if they play it out right, showing how Ashlyn compares herself to Lily more, it could work.

INFINITY PLUS ONE VIBES WITH THAT BALL EXERCISE.

Seb hula hooping omg don't touch me

Why is he so adorable all the time

Not them getting me all excited about a seblos improv scene, just for them to cut away✋

Finally Ashlyn stops trying so hard to get through to Gina, I mean yeah you offered up your home, friendship, support and love to her, and Gina's just been brushing you off but come on hear her out.

If you can't tell, that is complete sarcasm. Good for you Ashlyn for knowing your worth /gen.

EEEEE MIKE BOWEN HAS ARRIVEDDDDDD

They're so sweet, I swear if they aren't endgame...I'm perfectly fine with jennzzara. It's a cool subplot but I couldn't care less who she gets with, they both like her a lot so I'd be happy either way.

Please I felt like I was intruding on that kiss uhhh.

🥰😍❤️✨EJ✨❤️😍🥰

I want that grey sweatshirt, it looks so soft ahhhhh.

YES EJ, WE'RE MOVING ON FROM NINI WOOHOOO

"watch your tone"

damn-

Ngl Ms Jenn would be a scary step-mother.

Right here we go, Gina and Ashlyn, take 2.

PLEASE NOW I SEE THE SIMILARITY BETWEEN EJ AND ASH-

It's a Caswell thing😌

That flashback scene was really good wow, I honestly thought we'd have to wait longer to see what the secret was but I guess not👀.

Gina handled that so well, she stated what she needed to say, acknowledged that he's with Nini, and got her closure. That's nothing for her to be embarrassed about.

I guess she thought she'd leave and not have to address it or see him again but either way, she did well and I'm proud of her.

Ricky. That's it. That's all I'm gonna say.

ANTOINE MY BELOVED. THANK YOU FOR ADDRESSING THE FACT THAT NO ONE EATS ALL THEIR FOOD IN SHOWS AND MOVIES-

That always confused me, you're paying to eat at a restaurant, at least eat it?????

Julia/Ashlyn's vocals>>>>>>>

Let's applaud Kaden for grabbing that guitar and doing what needed to be done.

And because we love him.

YES KOURT

Good on you for fully committing and owning your feelings, despite this "relationship" with Howie being extremely rushed and not making much sense considering what you've said for the entirety of season 1 and like 5 times in this episode alone about not needing a guy, but YES IM STILL HAPPY.

Although I'm not gonna lie, I half-expected Howie to say that he's gay at the end there-

Wow take notes Ricky. Your dad and teacher just sacrificed something important for them, to help you. Think you can try to do that for Nini, Gina or like, the entire theatre department?

THE ROSE SONG.

THE ROSE SONG.🌹

I can't be the only one that's pissed that Carlos is gonna post the video of this.

Like let North High think they got East High beat, then shock them on opening night with the song, this'll just cause them to try to come up with something to one up East High.

DAMNIT CARLOS.

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pluviophile-bookworm · 3 years

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High School Musical: The Musical: The Series: The Rewatch pt. 5

Technically, I shouldn't be doing this right now. But who are we kidding? I miss my Wildcats and this seems like the only thing I can do to see them again right now. So here goes

1x8: The contractually obligated emotional rollercoaster

This episode sure is a lot... I don't know if I'm ready. But it makes no sense to skip this one. I never skip through stuff I love, even when some parts are borderline traumatising. Plus I remember this episode having a bunch of hilarious moments that are definitely worth it.

'I'm really not sure what to say' — Me neither, Miss Jenn, me neither. I'm just sitting here watching this and I know I'm supposed to comment, but I just can't think of what to say. Sometimes the silence just speaks for itself.

'The Lucky Ducky Puppet Pavilion' — I can never overlook that line. Not when I know how much it took for Matt to deliver it. Fun fact: one of my cats is called Lucky, so when his siblings were about to be born, I briefly considered naming them Ducky, Puppet and Pavilion as a joke.

Ah, the El Rey. The place where Miss Jenn totally did not suffer a professional heartbreak. Things are about to get real here. And by real I mean... real dramatic.

I've got to say, I love the duality of Big Red (well, I do love everything about him so that was a no-brainer, but still): doesn't know how to hang a light, but sure does know how to light up a room; amazing with power tools, but took three weeks to make a paper-mache basketball because he kept gluing his fingers together (that last part is far more relatable than I care to admit). I just love him, ok?

The way Carlos acts about Miss Jenn's box of production notes... honestly, I totally get it. I feel like if there's one person at that point who cares about the show much more than anyone else, it's him. And I fully understand why that is. That poor boy has been lonely for too long, and this show is giving him the chance to be part of an accepting community for what feels like the first time in a long time. Just... give my boy Carlito all the hugs.

For a place that allegedly hasn't been used in so long, the El Rey is not nearly dusty enough. I mean, you should see my room if I forget to hoover for longer than a week. And we're talking about years here. There's allegedly mould in that place, but I don't even see dust. Oh well, maybe I would, if it weren't for that lighting — or lack thereof, more like.

'Whatever it says in Miss Jenn's audition file, I am me, and that is the only me I need to be.' — A beautiful sentiment, my dearest EJ. Now maybe hold on to it for a while... just a suggestion.

'Lacks emotional connection to the material' — well, I do have to agree. My first impression of EJ when I was watching the first couple of episodes for the first time was that he was 'too polished to be Troy'. Too much Technician, too little Performer. And I do love my Performers over my Technicians.

Wait, is that a Redlyn background moment I see? I mean, everything is super chaotic and fast-paced, and my two ginger babies are just sitting together on the side of it all. Bonding, I assume. Good for them.

Seb being the only one to know why Natalie is absent, along with the two of them sitting together in 1x1, makes me think... Natalie and Seb are totally besties! I mean, he's basically besties with everyone he ever talks to, so... what can I say, that boy is sunshine incarnate. He deserves all the love and appreciation.

'I know how to hang... out' — gosh, I love this one. And I can only hope everyone was laughing with him, not at him. Because there's nothing to laugh at. My boy got dragged into this whole crew stuff, it's not his fault he doesn't know everything. He's more of an on-stage person than a backstage person anyway. Maybe put him in the spotlight next time and prepare to get your socks knocked off.

No, Ash, your baking club is not at all irrelevant! Honestly, I have nothing but immense admiration for how Ashlyn manages to be in the top two students most dedicated to theatre and do all those other extracurriculars. And she probably has a 4.-something GPA, too. I don't know what the Caswells are feeding their children, but I need it this instant.

'I just don't know how to make things light up' — 'You walk into a room?' — I just... this is one of my favourite Redlyn moments in the history of Redlyn. See, the thing about Ashlyn's line here is the tone in which she says it. She doesn't mean it as a compliment, but as a statement of the absolute truth. You can hear that in her voice. And with good reason, too, because she isn't lying at all. My boy Reddy sure does light up a room by walking into it. Both of them do, really. They're soulmates, you know.

'This place is not creepy at all...' — Yeah, and things between Ricky and Nini are not totally awkward at all, either. I'm living for this.

'I can do Troy!' — Sure you can, Eej. Sure you can. Emotional connection to the material and all.

Ok, but this entire scene... Carlos marking Gabriella's lines completely flatly, EJ emoting like he's in a freaking telenovela and also chopping onions... Carlos' reaction to the latter... I'm living for all of this.

Big Red just suddenly appearing next to Miss Jenn has me rolling... and also kind of wishing he could appear like that next to me too. I mean, it's not like I've visualised that so many times... certainly not every time I have to pass by a stray dog, or give a blood sample, or talk to people, or whatever... why do you ask?

'I never really loved the name Nina anyway' — listen, I relate to the sentiment of not being super fond of your given name, but... what was that stuff in s2 about, then? I mean, I do understand that too, but the two just seem to clash a bit, I reckon. That's all.

Also, can we talk about Rini's chemistry and how it's sometimes there and sometimes nowhere to be found? I think I've figured it out. Every time the chemistry is there, they're talking about or doing things that are not necessarily inherently romantic. Reminiscing about kindergarten, how they gave each other their nicknames, 'the ribbon in your hair, the secrets that we shared, the way that you would stare at me across the room' (yeah, I went there, and for a good reason)... see, Ricky and Nini have that kind of thing going on where, however hard you try, you just can't be indifferent to the other person. It's obvious that they love each other so much, but whenever they try to make it romantic, something goes south. What I'm saying is, when you're really good friends with somebody and you try to force it into something 'more', or better said, something else (because romance is not inherently 'more' than friendship and you can pry that out of my cold dead aro hands), and the operating word here is 'force', things are bound to go wrong and even reach toxic territory. And Rini are living proof of that. Some people are just better as friends, and sometimes the entire 'I don't want to ruin our friendship' trope is very valid. I just want them to be best buddies, is that too much to ask?

Bless Steph for pushing Kourtney forward when Miss Jenn needed someone to sing! Honestly, it's moments like these that make me feel like the background characters are criminally underrated. I realise not every character can be equally central to the plot, but with this cast, I kind of want them to be. I have the feeling that most, if not all of the one-line characters in this show are people with just as much talent and potential as the main cast. They deserve recognition, you know.

Going off of the above, Dara Reneé is living proof of the point I just made. You know how Kourtney was supposed to be a one-scene wonder with two lines? And then Dara showed up and hiding her in the background was instantly out of the question. I wonder how many more hidden gems there are in the show, just sitting in the background, delivering their single line and waiting their turn in the semi-metaphorical wings.

'I just need a minute, or a vacation, it's not clear' — Me, all the time. Especially after I read chapter 11 of @redlyncentral's Let It Go. That ending broke me. And this line by Miss Jenn just reminded me of that feeling, even if what she's feeling right now might not be the exact same thing I went through with that chapter the other day. That being said, everyone go check out my lovely friend's writing right now, I promise you it's worth every second.

'We're going to take a... long five' — What, no 'thank you, five'? I was expecting that. But I guess everyone is a little bit too distraught for that now.

I have to hand it to Carlos — even when he's very obviously uncomfortable and lowkey scared of some people, he just goes up to them and calls them out. I wish I could ever be bold enough to do that.

Wow, not EJ thrashing Carlos' 'forest of boys' idea. Again. I don't get why everyone dislikes it so much, I think it's brilliant visual poetry and should have been given a chance. I said what I said.

You know, everyone has been calling the show out for saying HSM premiered in the cinema, not on telly like it did in real life; and I have been agreeing with that sentiment. But notice how Miss Jenn said 'the Utah premiere' and how there were family and friends in the audience? What if that was some sort of semi-private screening for cast, crew and their family members? It would make sense. And of course, it was held in Utah because that was where the show was filmed and where the majority of background actors, dancers and extras are from. Idk, but it makes sense to me. Note that I have very limited knowledge of how the period between post-production and the release of a movie works.

Isn't Ashlyn the best, though, always noticing when someone is not ok, hearing them out, helping them... I wish I could be half as good a friend as she is. She and Big Red are totally soulmates in that, too. And they deserve each other more than anyone else deserves them, honestly. I just love both of them so much, both as individuals and as a couple, and I cannot be made to shut up about that just yet.

I've got to say, the entire 'me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me' - 'you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you' thing was super funny. And it makes me love Rini — strictly as friends — even more. You know, I think I used to ship them during s1 because the script wanted me to. Exactly like I didn't notice Big Red until midway through the season because the script didn't want me to. Sometimes the script, the acting, the directing and other stuff has immense power over viewers' perception of a show's plot and characters. And that is, as I always point out, what rewatches are for — noticing things that may have escaped you the first time over.

Yeah, so Nini was Ricky's first crush. So what? Many people have had crushes on their best friend at some point or another. That doesn't necessarily mean they're better off as a couple than they are as friends. The opposite idea is just amatonormativity speaking. I mean, sometimes it's nice and it works out; I love me some well-written best-friends-to-lovers, but that's just not always the case and the media should stop pushing the idea that platonic relationships are in any way inferior to romantic ones.

I've got to say I really don't like it when someone interrupts two people's romantic moment (and Big Red is not exempt from my frustration in such cases even though I love him so much — just think of the In a Heartbeat scene), but honestly, bless Reddy for not letting Ricky and Nini kiss. I mean, I know full well they do kiss later on (and how!), but it's just nice to have semi-platonic Rini for a while. If and when we get season 3 (manifesting!), I really hope we get more of them putting some stuff behind them and just being best buddies.

Kourtney and Seb's friendship is honestly goals and I really wish we'd got some more of it. Just another thing to add to my season 3 wishlist. Along with, you know, an actual season 3.

EJ saying all those nice (and very true) things to Carlos has my heart (or, well, he's renting it temporarily from Redlyn and Seblos, but you know). And Carlos really was like 'A for effort, C for execution', and I adore him for that. But EJ is seriously growing. He's pretty much reached EJ 1.8 at this point, and I love to see it.

Say what you want about the Lucas Grabeel dream sequence, but I love, love, love it. Completely unironically. I mean, he's kind of my favourite OG cast member. And the 'I'm more of a Glinda' comment referencing Kate Reinders actually being one of the BWay Glindas? Here's a note from when I first watched 1x1: The drama teacher won’t stop spilling her coffee and I love her. Also, her actress was Glinda on Broadway, so I stan. See, I didn't even know Miss Jenn's name yet and I already loved her. But then she went and did some stuff in s2 and ruined all of that. Add 'proper Miss Jenn redemption' to my s3 wishlist, I guess. But I'm getting off-track (when am I not?)

I only just noticed that all of the iconic BWay leads mentioned in the song (sans Glinda, of course, but that wasn't even a proper part of the song) start with an E. I wonder if that was on purpose or a lucky accident...

'And you never know when you'll get a cameo...' — If anyone in the HSM franchise knows anything about making the most of a cameo, it's Lucas. I'm referring to his post-credits scene in Sharpay's Fabulous Adventure, of course. That is one of my absolute favourite scenes in the entire movie. Well, that and The Rest of My Life. I very unironically love that number.

Another thing on the list of things I very unironically love — the transitions both into and out of this scene. I just think they're neat.

Have I mentioned before how much I love it that Carlos' response every time someone asks where he has to be is 'Broadway'... it just reminds me a lot of Seb's 'Friendship!' — that's some soulmate stuff right there, if you ask me.

'I just... almost did something really stupid' — Yes, Nini, yes it was very stupid. And you're going to do it anyway. You wouldn't if I had any say in this, but I don't and so here we are. In a world where Rini are a romantic thing, Redlyn get 5 minutes of screentime in s1 and two major moments demoted to post-credits scenes, Seblos haven't even properly discussed their issues, and Portwell didn't even kiss on screen. I lowkey hate it here. Still, I feel like things are going in the right direction. If we get a season 3, that is — and we better be getting it, or I will riot and I know I won't be the only one.

No but... just imagine if Kourtney hadn't called YAC for Nini, but for herself. There's so much potential there... and I think Kourtney and Ashlyn deserved that spot every bit as much as Nini did, and then some. I said what I said.

Well, this was 1x8. This post is already way too long, plus I want to do a double feature of the last two whenever I get to rewatching them, so I'm ending this here. It was just as much of a journey as I remembered it being, and not nearly as negative as I had the feeling it would be. I absolutely loved it, you know. And with good reason too.

#hsmtmts #hsmtmts: the rewatch #ricky bowen #nini salazar-roberts #ej caswell #ashlyn moon caswell #big red redonovich #carlos rodriguez #seb matthew-smith #kourtney greene #hsmtmts miss jenn #redlyn

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