#Jess Mariano deserves all the success
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Tag Game: Pick your top two favorite characters from five of your fandoms and explain why. Bonus points if the two characters have some sort of relationship (romantic, platonic, etc).
I was tagged by @talesofruby01. Thanks for the tag!
I did six fandoms, because at first I could only think of three and then I thought of six. Oh well.
Gilmore Girls - Jess Mariano and Paris Geller
Gossip Girl - Serena van der Woodsen and Jenny Humphrey (sorry Blair!)
Yellowjackets - Jackie Taylor and Shauna Sadecki née Shipman
The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel (TMMM) - Luke Kirby's Lenny Bruce and Astrid Weissman (sorry Imogene!)
The Vampire Diaries - Elena Gilbert and Katerina/Katherine Petrova/Peirce (Nina Dobrev supremacy!)
The Hunger Games (THG) - Katniss Everdeen and Peeta Mellark
Tagging: @dayenurose, @stellaluna33, @strideofpride, @hydesjackiespuddinpop
Explanations on my choices under the cut! You're about to find out way too much about me via the blorbos :)
Gilmore Girls - Jess Mariano and Paris Geller
Criminally robbed of the besties bonus points I deserve...
Jess Mariano is my character of all time. I'll fight you. The highlights: Jess comes from an abusive, loveless family situation and is a bit prickly from the ordeal (both to himself and others), but is just such a goodhearted and hardworking person that he gets out the other side with both loving relationships (with himself and others) and a good, safe life that he’s built for himself. Character of all time!!! Who does it for us like Jess Mariano?
Paris is incredibly ambitious and a little bit of a bitch (in a cool, sexy way), and therefore I love her. Also, your honor she’s a repressed lesbian. These things happen. And I will never get over how quickly she comes to understand Marxist theory when working her first job. She was never a snob; she literally was just never exposed to anything outside the upper-class.
My man Jess would have helped her with that and it would have been amazing. And he would have been comfortable living in that scary apartment with her (and Doyle) and Rory.
Gossip Girl - Serena van der Woodsen and Jenny Humphrey
When I have to shorthand my self, I say "I'm a Serena van der Woodsen type". The only reason I relate more to her than Jess in terms of self is because Serena and I shared the incredible lows of teenage girldom (plus we’re both exceptionally beautiful). Also, Jess never did drugs (cigarettes count, but they don't, also I don't think they were really a habit). Good for him! Don't do drugs! Serena definitely did drugs, and she started them (and boys, who don’t love her but sure do think she’s pretty!) very young. The incredible lows of teenage girldom... and how they stick to you into womanhood... She tries so hard to “change” when really she needs to change her situation, but that’s the struggle... How do you leave everyone and everything you’ve ever loved? And even if you could, is there really anywhere on earth you can escape the incredible lows of girldom/womanhood?
Which brings me to Jenny Humphrey. I’m not even gonna start on the incredible lows of teenage girldom because just watch the show, my poor girl... ANYWAY! Did I mention that I love seeing ambition in girls and women? She’s the living embodiment of going after what you want, *and she’s earned it*. She becomes Queen, not once, not twice, but THREE TIMES, and it was only sort of on purpose once!! And do not get me started on her high school fashion career. It kills me that her family wasn’t more supportive, but I know she’ll be successful because literally no one and nothing could ever stop her. And, I know this one is probably a hot take, but I honestly think she’s a really good person. She fights against the corrupting force of the UES better than most, and she is a really sweet and earnest person when she feels safe enough to just be herself.
Yellowjackets - Jackie Taylor and Shauna Sadecki née Shipman
Bonus points: They're in love! (Yes, present tense.)
Talking about teenage girldom and how it sticks to you into womanhood... I could write essays, but I'll just say this. Jackie is my favorite. She's most of us (I say assuming my experiences are universal). She is the metaphor for what happens when you devote yourself to the role assigned at teenage girlhood (it makes you repressed, i.e. the death of the self).
Shauna is a metaphor for all the fight it takes to survive teenage girldom into womanhood, and how it's a never-ending fight (she's the friend/lover, she's the mother/daughter, she's the hater/butcher/killer).
Teenage girldom is traumatic experience and it colors your adulthood, and that's the show, but also these two characters are the clearest metaphors on that main theme. Everything is a metaphor!!! Also, they're both sides of the repressed sapphic romantic-friendship. Hard relate, my girls!
TMMM - Luke Kirby's Lenny Bruce and Astrid Weissman
Some of you may be asking, Why not Midge? Why not Susie? Well, this is my list and I do what I want.
Luke Kirby's Lenny Bruce needs no explanation. He is the dream man. He's earnest and exceptionally romantic, and there's something about him you can't help find admirable to the point of inspirational. Maybe it's that he's brave and honest. Maybe it's that he's ambitious in that way that's hard to be as a woman. Maybe he's just really charming, because he's that for sure. But, of course, he's a mess too. Who isn't?
Astrid Weissman! She's so so so funny. She's not trying to be funny. She's not making jokes. She's just delightful! Also, all of us out there swimming in cultures that are not those in-which we were raised. Astrid Weissman has got you with her over-correcting, overcompensating, and just sheer enthusiasm. You go, Astrid!
The Vampire Diaries - Elena Gilbert and Katerina/Katherine Petrova/Peirce
Bonus points: They're related/doppelgangers!
UGH! If they aren’t the dichotomy of self, idk what is!!!
Elena is *such* a good person. She is literally the martyr she is such a good person. She loves and she will die for that love. That’s Elena. But it’s all about circumstances. Elena is an orphan (she had a beautiful, loving family before they died) suffering from survivor’s guilt, and she’s mostly keeping herself together with her love for her loved ones. If she isn’t living for them, she’s just gonna disappear.
Now, Katerina/Katherine, she’s got kind of the opposite thing going on. She had her newborn baby she loved very much ripped from her arms before being disowned by her family and banished from her hometown. She has no one who loves her and no one to love. She holds herself together with love of self or she’s just gonna disappear. And that she does. She is a ruthless pragmatist, because she has to be to survive. Because the world is harsh and cruel (and frankly really sexist), but she’s clever and strong, and she survives. That’s what she does. Elena dies for you. Katerina/Katherine survives despite you. Everything is a metaphor!!! My favorite thing about Katerina/Katherine is that she doesn’t *just* survive. No, she *loves* life. She’ll literally be being held captive by a vampire who has been hunting her relentlessly for hundreds of years, and she’ll take a moment alone in the house to drink and dance, because what’s a spare moment if it’s not being lived? Life is not just about survival.
THG - Katniss Everdeen and Peeta Mellark
Bonus points: They're basically soulmates!
Here's the thing. Katniss is a survivor/pragmatist with zero social skills, but an endless and earnest pit of love and enough passion to literally fuel a revolution.
Peeta is a child abuse victim who has learned to wield social manipulation (the charm offensive! plus literally lying!), but hasn't met an honest expression of emotion in his life (until he figures he's about to die so he might as well tell Katniss she's pretty) and doesn't know how to receive love.
They literally just fit each other. Peeta is charming when Katniss literally cannot. Katniss helps him survive when he's literally dying in a river camouflaged in mud and plants. But most importantly, Peeta teaches Katniss how to live in more than just survival mode, and Katniss reaches into her deep well of love and teaches Peeta how to be loved. Everything is a metaphor, but your honor, they are the couple of all time!!!
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So can you see Klaus ever becoming genuinely good, or at least good enough to be with Caroline?! Like maybe if he were human??? Because I like that he's got some darkness to him and can be so untense and even ruthless but I need to think that someone I love as much as Caroline would be with someone who could be a fundamentally good and decent man. I'm thinking about this stuff because a lot of what you've talked about with Cole and Phoebe reminds me of Klaroline too!
I think Klaus would always fall into morally gray territory.
He’s damaged. Self-destructive. Manipulative. Has Daddy issues up to his eyeballs. 😂 There’s also a ruthlessness, a darkness about him, that is central to his character that I don’t think could be swept away entirely were he a human, and to be honest, I wouldn’t want it to be. That’s part of what makes him such an absorbing and enigmatic character. I like that he has baggage, that he’s constantly warring against his intrusive paranoid thoughts. He is a lot like Cole in that way.
It’s also what makes him so interesting to watch alongside Caroline because she holds him accountable for all his flaws, she forces him to look in the mirror so he faces himself and his mistakes.
In that same vein, she influences him to be a better man. And he tries for her. Over and over. He sacrifices things he wants in order to make her happy, to give her the things he believes she deserves. In my opinion, that already makes him good enough for Caroline, shows that his heart can be touched and that he is capable of genuine goodness, humanity, and growth for her, and that’d still translate to him in a human scenario. It’d just look different. Less murder-y and more lost, hurt, and broody, probably. (Think: Dark!Jess Mariano vibes with some Succession family drama thrown into the mix.)
Regardless of the universe, though, Klaus and Caroline would always challenge each other to be the best versions of themselves. That’s just what they do!
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Can we just talk about how cringe worthy and condescending Lorelai's talk with Jess is in Nick&Nora? Like they actually have her comparing her upbringing of being 'coddled' by rich parents who provided her with everything and sure, stifled her alot, to Jess.' Where he had to grow up with a mother who was addicted to substances, couldn't provide for his basic needs, and essentially gave up on him because she was too caught up with boyfriends. There is no way you can compare that level of trauma to what Lorelai experienced and to make light of that and paint Jess as the bad person is so disheartening. I get that ASP created a show that really downplayed a lot of topics to maintain the light heartedness. But the way they compare and contrast different characters just screams of privelige. I will never not fight for Jess. Thanks for coming to my Ted talk.
#Honestly#the amount of wrong that this show has done to this charactee#ive never gotten over it#despite his later successes#those were also so throw away#everything hes done#from everything hes overcome#jess is brilliant and deserves all the love#jess mariano#gg#mine#gilmore girls
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Fandom Rant Sessions:
Gilmore Girls - AYITL - Jess Mariano
Normally, I'd be dissecting S2 but instead we're gonna go from Present Day back to the start.
Early-thirties Jess is an accomplished author, co-owner of a successful publishing house, has a stable home life, has a good relationship with Luke and his mother, and is still friends with his ex girlfriend of over a decade.
We don't see any of the "bad boy" tendencies that shaped his late-teens. We see him bonding with Luke, laughing over the craziness that is Liz and TJ and talking about his relationship with Lorelai. He gives Rory direction again, the idea to write a book and tell a story only she could tell.
It rubs me the wrong way how Lorelai reacts to Jess giving her the idea, like after all these years she still has disdain for him? I chalk it up to her being upset about the book and forgetting momentarily that Jess isn't that 17-year old kid anymore.
My first reaction to Jess' last scene was something like...HOW DARE YOU DANGLE LITERATI IN MY FACE LIKE THAT?! Then I decided that it was just meant to highlight that Jess will always love Rory. I don't think he's pining over her, because outside that little scene there's no evidence that he desires more than friendship from her now.
Why was Jess not there for the secret LL wedding? That makes absolutely NO sense!
Finally, after watching AYITL I have concluded this: Jess deserves better than Rory. In my mind after the revival Jess finally finds love and happiness, with someone who isn't Rory. If they ever decided to make AYITL 2, the only way I'd ship Rory&Jess is if Rory's character was fixed (whole other rant) and became someone worthy of the amazing man that Jess grew into.
Jess Mariano was never perfect. A controversial character from the moment he arrived in Stars Hollow, he gave us plenty to debate. His journey was a gradual one; navigating early adulthood made more difficult by his choices. He had to grow up.
I can't think of even ONE negative to be said about Jess Mariano in AYITL.
I'm morbidly curious though: the anti-jess folks, or Team Logan, or dedicated Narco fans... Can you name something bad about Jess Mariano in AYITL?
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Ask box: JUSTICE FOR LANE KIM, a breakdown.
Anonymous asked: Do you know why Lane disappeared from the show as Rory's best friend over time? She appeared every now and then, yeah, but it has always bothered me that she slowly faded from being Rory's best friend to nobody... am I remembering things wrong?
I do not know! The Palladinos make decisions that sometimes are simply beyond my comprehension.
It’s been awhile since I watched Gilmore Girls in its entirety (and I kind of selectively ignore a lot in the last two, three seasons) but I don’t think you’re remembering things wrong. I will say, though, that the show faced a challenge with all of the Stars Hollow supporting ensemble when Rory went off to college. It’s these kind of problem-making focus shifts that I find really interesting, and they are UBIQUITOUS across teen/high school shows when a character or ensemble graduates.
Most of them that I can think of are done poorly, maybe with the exception of Friday Night Lights. But in defense of these shows, it’s HARD. How do you embrace a fundamental shift in the entire premise of your show? How do you deal with the new geographies of this shift, and the way they ripple into beloved character dynamics? How do you evolve a character through an engaging and meaningful arc without abandoning the foundation on which they were built? And how do you still capture your audience’s attention when there’s a risk that you’re leaving behind the magic that captivated them in the first place? IT’S HARD.
So in the case of Gilmore Girls, Rory at Yale is the shift that moves the show into a new paradigm, and it’s a big one. She’s separated from Stars Hollow and slowly beginning her emancipation from Lorelai, which is, on principle, painful for the audience because it’s directly against the show’s premise. (It’s no coincidence that the Palladinos starts seriously building the Luke-and-Lorelai-of-it-all once Rory’s away at college. Give that empty-nester some new story!)
Of course, Lane is right behind Lorelai in the list of People in Stars Hollow that Rory is Leaving Behind. How is Lane supposed to stay a part of Rory’s story when Rory is in a new context, and Lane is not? But, truth be told, Lane was ALREADY in this role. In seasons 1-3, LANE, not Lorelai, was #1 on the list of People in Stars Hollow that Rory is Leaving Behind. Ultimately Gilmore Girls is a story of two worlds, and Rory going to Chilton begins her passage across the into the New (Old, with Baggage) World. Lane is already being left behind, to some degree, and in seasons 1-3, there’s still room in the show’s universe to address those issues and give Lane some good storylines of her own, especially in conjunction with Rory.
So it’s possible that the issue is not necessarily one of screentime or setting. Whenever I hear the rebel cry of JUSTICE FOR LANE KIM resound in my heart chambers, I mostly think of the kinds of storylines that befell her in the later seasons, not simply in their detachment from Rory. Heeding her mom’s insistence that she attend Seventh Day Adventist college. Fracturing her relationship with her mom in order to pursue her dreams. Getting kicked out of her home. Living with her two boy bandmates who are very stupid and very messy. Never really getting the band off the ground. Her first sexual experience being terrible. Her first sexual experience being terrible AND yielding a pregnancy with TWINS. Why do the Palladinos hate Lane Kim!!! The only thing I wholeheartedly love about Lane’s later storylines is Luke hiring her to work at the diner and then being completely overwhelmed by her sheer competence.
It’s probably important to note that the mere construction of Lane Kim’s character is a bit tragic. The Palladinos are VERY good at building conflict and tension into what seems like simple character descriptions. Here’s this girl that loves rock music to an obsessive, encyclopedic level, wants to play drums in a band, and she’s from a strict religious household where she can’t express any of that. The description itself inherently means that things are going to blow up for Lane at some point. That’s okay, to some degree - that’s conflict, that’s drama, that’s good story.
So if we look at Lane’s arc pre-blow-up, and post-blow-up, the satisfying thing would be for Lane to experience some kind of happiness or success living unstifled in her dreams, to offset the trauma that her family relationships are ruined (at least for the time being). But the Palladinos don’t even do that! It’s encapsulated in the incident that tears apart Lane’s relationship with her mom: she goes to play at CBGB, her mom finds out and kicks her out, and the band doesn’t even get to go on!! The Palladinos love PAIN.
And okay, fine, there’s still some defense that that is well-designed drama and story. (And Lane and her mom do reconcile eventually, and it was at least very affecting, from my memory.) I guess you could argue that Lane IS happy with how things turned out after the lifelong lie she’s lived completely unravels and she’s able to just exist, unguarded. But also... the Palladinos wrote her that way??? And regardless, for me, the issues arise more down the line with Lane essentially staying in Stars Hollow. Wouldn’t unshackling herself from the yoke of her mother mean that she’s free to pursue her dreams? And wouldn’t pursuing her dreams necessitate her to ALSO leave Stars Hollow, like Rory herself? Would she not try to scrape together money to move with the band to New York City and hit the big time? (Bear in mind, I have no idea how the music industry works.)
Ultimately, Lane’s story in the later seasons puts the writers in a Catch-22. If she leaves Stars Hollow and goes somewhere else to pursue her dreams, she’s almost certainly written off the show. She’s a supporting character, and they can’t open up a new world beyond Stars Hollow and New Haven, just for her. On the other hand, if she stays in Stars Hollow, in keeping with the geographies of the universe, she stays on the show, and just... gets really disappointing storylines. I’d be inclined to keep giving Keiko Agena a paycheck.
(Now, the fact that WB threw money at a backdoor pilot for Jess Mariano to go to California and open up a new world for a weakly-premised spin-off, and did no such thing for Lane Kim, is some bullshit. Literally “moving to the big city to live a dream” is SUCH a well-worn trope that all the storylines are essentially handed to them, and it’s almost inherently refreshed because Lane is a Korean-American woman and not a brooding white guy or a quirky white lady. You FOOLS, you could’ve made that show with your EYES CLOSED.)
Anyways.
I’m going to meander my way further off the main point for a moment to kick up some dust on JUSTICE FOR RORY GILMORE as well. When you write ten paragraphs lamenting Lane Kim’s eternal relegation to supporting role, it’s hard not to be cranky about affording world-opening and story-building for a main character instead. (Spin-off Jess very much deserves the crank, though.) But, frankly, the unyielding walls that the Palladinos built to construct their very effective Two-World Universe don’t do a lot of favors for Rory Gilmore either, in the end.
Basically, this construct of Stars Hollow ensemble and New Haven future means that Rory is the only one who will “get out” of Stars Hollow, because she is structurally decreed to do so. It’s the massive conflict that the Palladinos smartly built into their little generational premise: Lorelai fled her parents’ world, and Rory will slowly be lured back into it. Pain ensues. This is good drama. This is good story. This is story that will last seven seasons and six-hour revival.
But it also inadvertently makes Rory the Chosen One, in a story that doesn’t need one. This is not Joseph Campbell’s Hero with a Thousand Faces, and I’d like to believe that even Paris and Rory wouldn’t want it to be, much as they love the Power of Myth. Lorelai divests her entire life into Rory’s success; the town of Stars Hollow wants Rory to spirit out of their small town and Be Great; Rory’s grandparents expect her to follow in Richard’s footsteps and also carry out their orphaned dreams for Lorelai. And then the Palladinos choose little things that further this: Lane doesn’t ever leave Stars Hollow; Paris doesn’t get into Harvard but Rory does; Luke interrogates any boy that comes near Rory because no one is good enough. (I confess, I’m charmed into forgiving the last one.)
It’s much too much to put onto one character and leave unaddressed!!! It’s also why some audience members just really hate Rory, in a really unfortunate knife-twist on an otherwise-winsome main character. They hate the unwillingness of the narrative to acknowledge this very obvious dark and specific underside to Rory’s specialness, and the unwillingness of people within the narrative to name this very obvious dark and specific underside about Rory. But to paraphrase Jessica Rabbit: she’s just DRAWN THAT WAY!
Rory’s storylines never really confront the idea that she has had FAR too many unrealistic expectations put on her by literally everyone that’s ever existed in her life, and what it might mean if she doesn’t live up to them. What does it mean if she’s not Christiane Amanpour? What does it mean if she’s scared of disappointing people? What does it mean if she’s trying to live up to other people’s standards rather than examining what she really wants?
The Palladinos completely ignore this, and simultaneously give Rory multiple meltdowns (cheating with Dean, being cowed by Mitchum Huntzberger, stealing a boat, quitting Yale, an aimless/struggling career) and they never QUITE dig into the complete dark and specific issue at the core of Rory’s character construction... which just exacerbates the Rory hate. Rory has no self-awareness; the writers give her no self-awareness; we go in circles, and every few years there’s a slew of thinkpieces about how selfish and awful Rory is.
What makes it worse is that those questions outlined above are essentially applicable for two other women on the show: Lane Kim, and Lorelai Gilmore II, herself. Lane, like Rory, doesn’t quite bust through and answer them wholly. Lorelai, however, comes into the show having already answered them, years before, when she was a headstrong and tenacious teenager. The idea that neither Rory, her actual daughter, nor Lane, her spiritual inheritor of Parental Disapproval, are ever able to grapple with those concepts in a real way, and blossom into self-defined adulthood the way that Lorelai did is maybe the bottom line on where Gilmore Girls went “wrong.” Lorelai’s legacy is not that she’s hyperverbal, loves junk food, and got pregnant young. It’s that she rejected the expectations of her forebearers and carved out a place in the world for herself by her own definition, for better or for worse. It’s why Lorelai comes out of the narrative like a Super Mom, when in fact she’s still just as deeply flawed as Emily or Rory, and why Stars Hollow is overall magical and cherished despite it serving as a small-town hometown for Rory to leave behind. And it’s why A Year in the Life was SO satisfying for Emily Gilmore, because she proved it’s never too late to answer those questions and break through to the other side. Perhaps we’ll get enough revivals to see the same happen for Rory, and for Lane.
But enough dust about Rory. I think, after all this nitpicking, there were two options for the best way to have handled Lane Kim after Rory went off to college:
1. Give her a backdoor pilot and spinoff to Band Dreams NYC. Which, of course, was not in the Palladinos’ control, so, y’know, fine.
2. Keep Lane in Stars Hollow and give her a chance to answer those questions about self-definition and live out a few years of Lorelai-like hard-but-happy independence (and better sex) before saddling her with Zach and two babies (if you MUST). Bonus points if she moves in with Lorelai and they bond over being fundamentally disappointing to your parents and also missing Rory. A very good obvious choice.
Secret option 3. Just let Lane move to New Haven and live with Rory and Paris off-campus, and give me the goddamn roommate comedy of my dreams. Honestly this is what they should’ve done. Forget everything I said. This is my answer.
Tiny footnote: I cannot BELIEVE, that after twenty years, I am just now realizing how on-the-nose it is that Lorelai escaped from the clutches of New Haven and started a new life for herself at a place called INDEPENDENCE INN. Truly, it was right there in front of me and I didn’t even notice. This oversight might weaken the integrity of the thousand-paragraph essay I rattled off above...
#long post#ask box#JUSTICE FOR LANE KIM#there's also justice for Rory Gilmore in here too#I haven't done this in ages and it's... long.#I am watching approximately zero new television but I'd love to relitigate TV from the early 00s and 10s#Gilmore Girls
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gilmore girls!!
my all-time ultimate fave character: i love rory so much bc 98% of the time she’s such a precious angel that needs to be protected from the world and i 100% think that i should protect her, but i also really love lorelai so much bc she’s such an inspiration and has a great taste in music and i want her to be my mommy. and jess mariano will always hold a special place in my heart bc this rebellious little dingus turned his who,e life around and wROTE A BOOK
a character I didn’t used to like but now do: deadass richard gilmore. he used to be such a wank but he ended up being the sweetest man on so many occasions and i just feel love for him
a character I used to like but now don’t: christopher. but i only liked him because he had nice hair and rode a motorcycle. then he got a haircut and a volvo and i really just couldn’t w/ him
a character I’m indifferent about: logan was always the character i could go either way with, i never hated him, never loved him
a character who deserved better: jESS MARIANO, THR LOVE OG MY LIFE
a ship I’ve never been able to get into: lmao dean and rory. but also christopher and lorelai
a ship I’ve never been able to get over: my parents™ luke and lorelai and um, obviously rory and jess. my heart still aches in the middle of the night
a cute, low-key ship: more of a brotp but rory and finn????? they were v low key and i really loved their dynamic
an unpopular ship but I still enjoyed it: rory gilmore and actual success (did i say that put loud….? forgot she wasn’t allowed to properly progress in life) max and lorelai
a ship that was totally wrong and never should have happened: dEAN AND RORY. but also lorelai and christopher???????? like??????? they only got together for the sake of biological parents being togetger ?!?!???
my favourite storyline/moment: my favourite moment of this entire show was rory gilmore’s valedictorian speech. that was the best one ever and i’ll fight you. my favourite story line was rory getting her life back together after jess paid her a visit.
a storyline that never should have been written: rory sleeping with dean. lorelai and christopher getting married. rory and jess not going to prom. RORY DROPPING PUT OF YALE
my first thoughts on the show: at first, i thought it moved slowly and i was lowkey bored with it and then BAM! it wasn't
my thoughts now: this show owns my ass and i shouldn’t rewatch it for the ninth time
#thank you v much for asking#i enjoyed this#v much#and please excuse the fact that i cannot type#ask games
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WELCOME.
