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singular-yike · 7 months

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Musing on Ancient Mugenri History

I've been thinking about this topic recently and there's a lot in my mind, so I thought to write it down before it starts fading lol.

To be clear, this is going to involve a lot of speculation, and not much is gonna be based on concrete proof, which is a rather great departure from what I usually prefer, but hey, speculation is fun every now then~

This is gonna be split into several parts, which I hope makes things neat enough. In any case, let's begin!

The People of Mugenri

Before we look into the general ancient history of Mugenri, let's take a quick look at what the residents of Mugenri could've been like in the distant past.

Canon Information

First, let's start with the history of its population. Here, we look at these this line from A World That Isn't Fantasy — To Mugenri:

Hoojiro "Another world….. A land of a race that broke off from mankind long, long ago."

Haru immediately recognises this as referencing the "Land of Non-humans", which Tsubakura had apparently been looking into prior to being spirited away.

This land is generally accepted to refer to Mugenri, and this is the assumption I will be going off of here as well.

Additionally, let's also take a look at this bit of information from the 2021 Interview with JynX.

Characters (BPoHC) — Question 242 Q: Considering that God is moreso a qualification rather than a species, are Yago and Souko's longevity thanks to their original species rather than their status as a god? Does becoming a god even grant you new abilities? A: They both gained their longevity after becoming gods and were originally human-like.

Interpretation

Putting these two together, I propose the following: Mugenri was initially inhabited by a "primordial race", the very human-like race that Yago and Souko belonged to prior to their ascension to godhood.

Somewhere a long the way, this original race split into "humans" and "non-humans", who once co-existed peacefully but had a fall-out of some sorts.

This lead to the event Hoojiro described, the non-humans "breaking off" from the humans and settling in Mugenri, creating the "Land of Non-humans"

Caveats

There are, I think, 2 major caveats to this idea:

I'm making an assumption that the non-humans "breaking off" from the humans applies to both their evolutionary path as well as the relationship between the two.

There's nothing explicitly connecting the "human-like" race and the modern humans and non-humans.

Mugenri's Ancient History

This is where we get really speculative, as all I really have to go on are these names from BotC Back Issue EE Yabusame's Route - Stage 1:

Gods' Tabooed Land

Garden of Eden

Lost Horizon

Oppressed Land of Exile

It should absolutely be noted NiLU suggests that not all of these names originally referred to Mugenri, but that they only got conflated with Mugenri later down the line.

Nevertheless, they're helpful for taking a glimpse into Mugenri's nature. So, let's try to piece a timeline together using these names.

Step 0. Gods' Tabooed Land

"Tabooed Land" is a concept from Shinto that refers to a location said to be reserved for the gods and within which humans are forbidden, often believed to be where the gods descended to and from earth.

Admittedly, I'm unsure whether this step would be placed here or further down, hence "step 0".

If we were to place this here, this would refer to when the gods first descended to earth and started their work, landing in what would become Mugenri and creating "human-like" beings to inhabit it.

Step 1. Garden of Eden

This of course refers to the biblical paradise mentioned in Abrahamic religions where the first humans Adam and Eve once lived before being exiled by God for eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

It's a rather safe bet to place as the first stage of Mugenri, as it is where humanity originated. Paralleling, in the case of Len'en, Mugenri being where the human-like primordial race came from.

It would also be during this period that Yago Ametsukana ascended to godhood, and perhaps Souko Shirami as well, though I'm have less proof for that one outside of the two gods' basis sharing a similar time period in the irl myths.

I would guess that somewhere along the way, whether they have already speciated into human and non-humans aside, the original inhabitants of Mugenri got themselves exiled from Mugenri.

Fondly remembering the paradisical life they used to lead in Mugenri, and lamenting its lost, the land eventually became known as, or equated with, the name "Garden of Eden".

Side Note — Yago's Ascension You might be curious as to why I'm so sure that Yago's ascension is so likely to have taken place in this stage, even specifically before the residents got exiled. This comes from a spell card of theirs, Sword Shot "The Cherubim and the Whirling Sword of Flame". This spell references what the Abrahamic God sent to guard the Garden of Eden after Adam and Eve's exile. Thus, Yago having this spell card quite heavily suggests that it was the Ametsukana who forged the "whirling sword of flame" and sent it with the cherubim to guard the garden.

Step 2A. Lost Horizon

Lost Horizon is a 1933 novel by English writer James Hilton, famous for being the origin of Shangri-La, a fictional utopian lamasery.

Having been banished from Mugenri, and as the time passed, it's not beyond belief that the people (especially the humans) would've forgotten where Mugenri was once located, rending a truly lost location from their perspective.

It is also during this phase, I would guess, that the two categories of humans and non-humans must have came to be, no later than this. Explanation to come later.

Step 2B. Gods' Tabooed Land

Yep, the "Gods' Tabooed Land" returns once again. For those who did not forget Mugenri, where it was and its history; or perhaps from the gods' own perspective, Mugenri isn't "lost" at all, it's right there!

Instead, these people would've understood Mugenri as a place now exclusively belonging to the gods, and where humans especially are not allowed to enter.

(After all, while the line between human and god is fairly clear, that between youkai and god is often less so.)

Step 3. Oppressed Land of Exile

Unlike the other names, this one doesn't seem to be a reference of any sort, but is just a simple description of the land.

It is during this time period that I propose the "breaking off" between humans and non-humans must've occurred. For whatever reason, the two races were no longer able to peacefully co-exist.

This lead to the non-humans returning to Mugenri (like I mentioned, it's a lot more likely for them to know where it is after all this time). There, they either locked themselves within to cut all possible contact with the humans or they got locked within by the humans.

Having been exiled from the outside world, the inhabitants of Mugenri started a new era of their lives, adopting the Ruri calendar. "Ruri" meaning "exile", further strengthening this idea.

Side Note I've been using "Mugenri" to refer to this location this entire time, but it only makes sense to assume that this name isn't always what it was called. In fact, I think it's rather likely that it was only used after the barrier was created and a separate world formed. Here, I'll use "Ruri Mugenri", named after its Ruri calendar, to denote specifically the Mugenri as we know it now, separated from the outside by the barrier.

The "exiled non-humans" theory does raise a curious question though: Why are there also humans in Ruri Mugenri?

Of course, this could be explained simply by the fact that humans occasionally wander into Mugenri, but I get the impression that humans have always been in the Ruri Mugenri from the very beginning.

There are, in my opinion, three ways we can explain this:

These early humans were sympathizers to the non-humans, and in solidarity joined them in their self-imposed exile.

These early humans were those who sacrificed their own freedom to forever trap the non-humans in Mugenri.

These early humans were not interested in the race conflict, but was simply hoping to start anew or escape the outside world.

Personally, I would imagine that all these cases could be found, though I'd like to focus on the 2nd option. Because this, I believe, is the origin of the Senri Shrine.

We know that the 1st Senri priest was among those who created the Mugenri Barrier, and considering their successor, Tsurubami Senri's, stance towards youkai, it's not hard to see how I came to this conclusion.

Additionally, this also answers the question of whether the non-humans willingly shut themselves in Mugenri or were trapped in there by the humans.

This idea is somewhat supported by this from the 2021 Interview with JynX:

Mugenri — Question 86 Q: Can you think of Mugenri as a trap or prison, maybe a birdcage? Why else would it be so easy to get in but extremely difficult to get out? A: Something like that. The details are secret~.

Unhelpful JynX aside (lol), they did agree, to some extent, that Mugenri is a trap or a prison, further strengthening the idea that the non-humans aren't exactly willing participants.

The Human/Non-human Conflict

Finally, let's take a quick look at what could've caused this conflict between the two sides in the first place. I have a few theories, so let's go into that here.

First off, there's always the good old human fear of the unknown and the different, the easiest and most typical explanation for these situations and plots.

Perhaps the humans gradually grew more and more intolerant of the non-humans, and eventually took to taking up arms against them, leading to this conflict.

Of course, it's frankly hard to believe that these primeval humans would've been able to fight against the myriad of youkai and other non-humans all by themselves.

Here I suggest that the humans weren't alone, but were instead supported by a certain subset of gods. To see where this idea comes from, let's revisit A World That Isn't Fantasy, this time looking at Alice Leaping Atop Lily Pad Ice.

Hoojiro "Have you ever heard of it? The story of the imperial family and the Earthly Gods buried by history's darkness."

This is, at first glance, seemingly just a throwaway line. Hoojiro brings it up out of nowhere, and Haru quickly brushes her aside.

But even ignoring why Hoojiro brought it up, from an out-of-universe perspective, this line is far too loaded to be nothing, especially from a writer like JynX.

From an in-universe perspective, Hoojiro then follows this up with the talk on the Land of Non-humans in the next section, To Mugenri. This, to me at least, seems to hint that these two must be related somehow.

After all, Tsubakura was looking into the Land of Non-humans, and Hoojiro would've certainly had a good idea of everything they looked into and found.

So! Let's try to figure out what this is about.

First off, I'll tell you right now that this is referring to the mythologised telling of how the Yamato dynasty of Japan came to rule over these islands.

See the imperial family of Japan, according to their mythology, is descendant from Amaterasu Ōmikami, a sun goddess. She is what is considered a "heavenly god" (天津神 amatsukami), gods belonging to or originating from the heavenly realm of Takamagahara.

The counterpart to these heavenly gods are thus the "earthly gods" (国津神 kunitsukami), the native gods of the earth. They were the original rulers of the land (Japan), and it was through both diplomacy and force that the heavenly gods got the earthly gods to relinquish control of the earth to them.

This, I am certain, is the "story of the imperial family and the Earthly Gods", Hoojiro refers to. And I have a feeling that this is what caused the relationship between the humans and non-humans to sour.

Basing it on the myths, it would appear that the heavenly gods chose, for whatever reason, to side with the humans in the conflict, allowing them claim the world as their own.

Having identified the heavenly gods with the humans, this would leave the earthly gods with the non-humans, neither of whom fared very well in this exchange, and were forced to submit before the heavenly gods and their humans.

Thus the losers of this conflict, the earthly gods and non-humans, were "exiled" from the known world, put into an almost mirror-dimension-like plane of existence, their only way back out into the greater world through the outside, the Land of the Humans.

Note — Too Harsh on the Humans? History is written by the victors, or in this case, the imprisoned losers. All the sources we have so far are fairly Ruri Mugenri-centric, even those from outside. There is every chance that the humans were somewhat justified in their attack on the non-humans at first, perhaps the non-humans first took over and oppressed them, much like how the earthly gods were the original rulers of Japan. If this were true, that it'd be rather easy to see why the heavenly gods sided with the humans, perhaps out of pity, or a desire to use them to eliminate a common enemy.

Ending

Phew! That was a lot, wasn't it?

But this indeed concludes my thoughts on what the hypothetical ancient history of the land of Mugenri might be like, from it's initial inception to the establishment of Ruri Mugenri.

Like I mentioned at the beginning, a lot more guesswork and speculation this time, so its canonicity is very doubtful. Still, I think it's at least plausible.

As usual, I hope you enjoyed it~! :)

#len'en project #len'en #len'en lore #len'en theory #mugenri #I considered putting adding how tsukuyomi could've possibly fit into this too #but that just seems a bit too much #some other time perhaps

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sarukahparullah · 2 years

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Happy Len'en 9th anniversary!!!!

#mugenri #my art #len'en #lenen project #lenen #9!?!?!? such an idiot number! >:(/j

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bladxbornx · 6 months

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Huh, there's a weird looking green fairy pulling a large cardboard box. Doing their best to pull it right on up to Aura's home. They make it up to the front door before falling down in apparent exhaustion.

Some last day preparations are interrupted by a new presence, prompting the magician to take a look out of the window. Spying the fairy(?), Aura makes his way over to and opening the front door.

"Huh. Weird looking fairy..."

#bladeborne sorcerer:aura #unrealworld-of-mugenri

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gensokyogarden · 23 days

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@unrealworld-of-mugenri

"Yabusame what does that even mean? Aren't we already both girls?"

Actually wait. Were they? This is the first time Tsuba had considered it but they don't actually know the gender of a single person in Mugenri. Well they knew they were a girl ... right? Did they?

"You know what? Never mind. My brain isn't prepared for that road of thought. Lets just solve an incident."

#unrealworld of mugenri #inky flowers ~ tsuba

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rcimu · 13 days

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@unrealworld-of-mugenri

[ x ]

"...still!"

Usually, aftermaths are made of people snoring, packing up, chatting tiredly about the party they just had. This is just eerie, no? Too quiet! It's as if the wind itself decided to take a break, for once.

...of course, what does she know? Considering how her latest parties ended thanks to the Oni sake, she may be starting to get a little bit paranoid.

"..."

...augh. She's overthinking it, no doubt.

"Well. Might as well drink and forget about it!"

That's the spirit!

#unrealworld of mugenri #[ ☯ interactions sign「 new incident 」☯ ]#q

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zaranthropy · 3 months

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Your pfp looks like sese's skull on their clothes

you fool, i AM sese's skull on their clothes. How do you think i understand the len'ens

#ask-a-thropy #mugenri will be real in 3 miles #len'en project

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incorrect-mugenri · 1 year

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After nearly 8 long weeks of running this competition, congrats to Suzumi for being Mugenri's most problematic character!

I honestly really should have seen this coming, they are—

Wait, what was that?

One final poll????

That's right buckaroos, this ain't quite over yet! Suzumi may have won, but we all know there's more to Suzumi than just the one personality!

I welcome you to the Secret Round!

NOW we shall finally determine... which one of these three is posting the stupidest discourse?

#I remembered I had this thought on Friday and Couldn't Resist #len'en project #len'en #mugenris most problematic #secret round

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imperishable-prayers · 22 days

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@unrealworld-of-mugenri

"P-Please, I hope you understand, Lady Himiko..!" She had already explained the situation to Himiko before even noticing that there were fairies arriving.

"Aww... Alright, fine, I guess I'll have to protect the castle by myself then..!"

"T-Thank you!!" Equipped with her gear, she rushed out the front doors... and was met with the sight of armed fairies rushing forward, trying to get in!

"Oh geez, here we go..." Quickly, a great barrage of blue bullets shot out from her, all moving like rapid water waves.

#oc muse: koyuki sakata #oc muse: himiko minamoto #reply #reblog #unrealworld-of-mugenri

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singular-yike · 1 year

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Gimme your theories about the Earthly Gods and Mugenri.

Alrighty then, it's not exactly a single, unified neat theory though, I must say. More of a disparaged collection of random ideas. In any case, here are some of my random thoughts(?)/theories(?) about Mugenri and the Earthly Gods.

Canonical Information #1

Hoojiro's Mysterious Line

This all started here, with this mysterious line said by Hoojiro which was not elaborated on at all:

AWTIF [Baclside] - Alice Leaping Atop Lily Pad Ice Hoojiro "Have you ever heard of it? The story of the imperial family and the Earthly Gods buried by history's darkness."

Analysis

In Japanese mythology, the Shinto gods are divided into two factions: The Heavenly Gods (天津神) who live on Takamagahara (高天原), the Shinto celestial realm, and the Earthly Gods (国津神) which reside on the earth.

The earth (Japan) used to be ruled by the earthly gods, but the leader of the heavenly gods, the sun goddess Amaterasu-Ōkami (天照大神), declared one day earth should be ruled by one of her descendants instead.

She sent three waves of messengers to negotiate the handover of the earth to the heavenly gods. While the first two waves defected, the last wave of messengers, through both diplomacy and violence, successfully negotiated the"Transfer of the land" (国譲り).

With the sovereignty of the earth successfully obtained, Amaterasu sent her own grandson, Ninigi-no-Mikoto (瓊瓊杵尊), down to rule over the earth. There, he wed Konohanasakuyahime (木花之佐久夜毘売) and sired the ancestor of the Japanese imperial family.

These events are likely what "story of the imperial family and the Earthly Gods" refers to, although what spins Len'en will make to yet, if any, is yet unknown.

Canonical Information #2

Mugenri's Origin

We don't know much about Mugenri's origins, only that it was once continuous with the outside world but had been completely separated from it by the Mugenri Barrier. Additionally, we also know that this was done by the first Senri priest along with several others.

Another potential source for Mugenri's origin comes from Hoojiro:

AWTIF [Backside] - To Mugenri Hoojiro "Another world..... A country of a race that split off from mankind long, long ago." Haru "...The 'Country of Non-Humans'. The one that Tsubakura Enraku looked into in the past."

Analysis

Although she never calls it Mugenri by name, Tsubakura was looking into it prior to their disappearance in EE, and the theme of "non-humans" certainly seems in line with Mugenri.

EE Prologue This country is a place where both humans and non-humans live together. [...] This is a story of humans and non-humans. [...] This is a land where limitless relations and illusionary laws are linked together. People call the land "Mugenri".

Canonical Information #3

Alternate Titles for Mugenri

In addition to the potential "Country of Non-humans", Tom also gives a number of other titles that Mugenri is known by in BotC:

BotC: EE Yabusame 1-1 - The Gods' Tabooed Land - The Garden of Eden - The Lost Horizon - The Oppressed Land of Exile

However, NiLU does add that it's likely not all of these names originally referred to Mugenri, but merely got conflated with it. Nevertheless, they may give us the clue as to Mugenri's nature.

Analysis

"Tabooed Land" (禁足地) is a concept in Shinto. Typically found within Shinto shrine grounds, they are sacred spaces that humans are prohibited from entering and are restricted to the gods only, said to be where they dwelled or descended from the heavens.

The Garden of Eden is a biblical paradise mentioned in Abrahamic religions, where the first humans Adam and Eve once lived before being exiled by God for eating the forbidden fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Lost Horizon is a 1933 novel by English writer James Hilton, famous for being the origin of Shangri-La, a fictional utopian lamasery.

Theories & Possibilities

Now that we have all the basics, we can go into some of the possibilities and theories that I have, keep in mind that most of these are pretty shaky, so definitely take them with a healthy pinch of salt.

Theory — On the origins of Mugenri

Considering Mugenri's titles as "The Gods' Tabooed Land" and "The Garden of Eden", it's possible that that's where a human-like original race (that Yago and Souko originally belonged to) first "emerged" or "descended".

It might have once used to be a fairly paradisiacal place, considering how it's the "Garden of Eden" and the "Lost Horizon".

As they continued to develop and spread across the world, this race split into humans and non-humans. Eventually, the non-humans returned to Mugenri, and eventually decided to isolate themself in this land using the Mugenri Barrier.

This would be how the Country of Non-Humans (which we're assuming is Mugenri) belongs to a race that split apart from humans long ago.

The reason they returned and secluded themselves in Mugenri could be potentially related to the heavenly gods wrestling control of the earth from the earthly gods.

Those who didn't wish to be subject to the heavenly gods' rule, and later the Japanese imperial family's, may have returned to Mugenri and finally separated the two locations entirely by putting Mugenri in a separate dimension.

Bonus Theory

In Shinto myth, rule over the world was divided among three children of the creator (although not primordial) god Izanagi (伊邪那岐).

The goddess Amaterasu got Takamagahara

The god Susanoo-no-Mikoto (須佐之男命) got the sea (although he would abandon his domain)

The genderless/male god Tsukuyomi-no-Mikoto (月読命) got the "Dominion of the Night"

Tsukuyomi, along with his domain, is poorly understood, in fact, they practically disappear from the myths after this. (Although one anecdote attributed to Susanoo is sometimes attributed to Tsukuyomi instead.)

In "Dominion of the Night", the word translated as "Dominion" is “osukuni” (食国), which is typically used to indicate the area which the Emperor has power over. It is suggested that it means that Tsukuyomi has dominion over the entire country of Japan during the night, and some believe it may even refer to the entire world.

I have absolutely no proof for this, but a mysterious genderless god whose realm is unknown seems almost perfect to be adopted into Len'en as Mugenri and the main god of the Senri Shrine.

Again, very likely nothing at all, but still fun to think about.

And that's all I have here, I give a 30% chance the main theory is true at all, and optimistically a 70% chance that some part of it is. In any case, I hope you enjoyed it :)

#len'en project #len'en #len'en theory #mugenri

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rabbit-of-mugenri · 1 year

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Hm... Mitorin thoughts? Also, feel free to spam my askbox too!

Mitorinrin~

To the people of Devanagara, Mitori is a good emperor. Much better than the last one.

They rule not with an iron fist, but rather as a guiding hand. The quality of living has gone up thanks to the laws that were passed under their name. Yet they are not so soft as to be a pushover; those who show aggression towards the betterment of Devanagara are met with swift resistance.

Yes, Mitori is adored by their people. Just how they want it. For the people would not stand for a childish, violent emperor.

It's funny. Mitori shows great wisdom, and in many wise they are quite wise. But dig deep, deep down, and you find a child throwing a tantrum over not getting first place.

It's a side that Mitori hates, a side that doesn't make for a good emperor. But it spills out sometimes, and they find blood on them that isn't theirs.

One day, they discovered a loophole to this. What if that person they killed was meant to die? What if, for the betterment of Devanagara, some people had to die?

And their subjects applauded, approving of their methods. The blood of those slain shall pave the way to the new empire!

Sometimes they have dreams, and in those dreams Iyozane is there. They tell them that it isn't their fault. They wake up in tears.

#len'en #lenen #ooama no ake no mitori #fujiwara no iyozane #essentially mitori is jacket #but like original hotline miami jacket #where he has regret #not payday 2 jacket who's just a psychopath #hotline mugenri #i mean hm2 has a level editor...

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bladxbornx · 1 month

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The sound of a coin dropping into an offering box, followed by dull ringing of the shrine's bells. A rare occurrence for the shrine. But this time it is not of Gensokyo's Hakurei Shrine, or Gensokyo at all. The one performing these acts, the magician known as Aura, has left one land of fantasy for another for the purpose of exploration and investigation.

Clap! Clap!

Though he's following through with the motions of prayer, Aura's mind is instead focused on the short journey from the mysterious shard on the banks of that strangely straight river to this shrine, the unusual difficulty he had trying to travel on the tori lined road and so had to travel along side it, how well armed the fairies of this land were, the seemingly missing sun.

And now here he was, at Mugenri's Senri Shrine, using the prayer ritual to possibly attract the attention of the shrine's staff. Aura figures that if Mugenri is anything like Gensokyo, then those who live in these sacred grounds are the best to ask for information. All for as little as 500 yen...

#bladeborne sorcerer:aura #unrealworld-of-mugenri #i think i got it #*queue additional blast doors closing*

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gensokyogarden · 16 days

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@unrealworld-of-mugenri

Tsuba landed not far away, feet splashing down in a puddle of ink. What a mess that they had made.

"You were close, the fairies just lined up for me at the right moment. If I hadn't gotten the head start, you probably would have gotten the opportunity first."

They chuckled and scooped up some treasure from the ground. It was an ornate bowl. They could feel the engravings upon its side but the ink all over it made it difficult to actually make out. Oh well, for later they supposed.

"Besides, I've already decided what I'm going to do with the treasure."

They held the bowl out towards Yabusame. A warm smile on their face as they did so.

"Share them with you."

Tsuba was too busy celebrating their victory to pay much mind to what fairies remained. Normally they would expect to face someone far stronger than the fairies right now, but avarice had blinded them to the possibility of such a thing. Maybe stuff just operated differently in Gensokyo.

#unrealworld of mugenri #Something weird was happening with my reblogs so I moved it here I hope you do not mind #inky flowers ~ tsuba

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