The HOTD AND MAGNIFICENT CENTURY CHARACTER COMPARISONS ARE NOT PASSING THE VIBE CHECK (in my opinion)

(Mostly talking about the shows. Not delving too much into books because I have not read the books yet. It’s on my TBR. And I know certain details that happen in the books because of videos that talk about A song of ice and fire universe. And I am not delving too deep into the Ottoman Empire history)

Okay....Wow.

Like....wow. Where do I even begin?

Point 1: A quick one to get it out of the way. Viserys I and Suleiman being similar is the best one in regards to that they are so oblivious when it comes to their family and it goes straight over their heads.

They don't understand why their families can't get along even though it so fucking obvious why, and they had the power to put a stop to the infighting if they did the obvious thing. For Suleiman put a stop to the fratricide law to prevent his sons from being forced into killing each and stop their mothers from plotting against each other to save them. And for Viserys not getting married a second time or abdicated the throne while he was alive and give it to Rhaenyra.

They love their wives to death and when Hurrem and Aemma died Suleiman and Viserys souls died with them. They have complicated relationships with their children; they have obvious favorites that caused conflict within the family. Suleiman with Mehmed and Mihrimah. Viserys with Rhaenyra.

I get this comparison. I accept.

But give my man Suleiman more credit because he was a better leader, commanded respect, and always stood on business on every aspect. While Viserys was a little flaky and kind of wishy-washy especially with politics and governance; despite being a decent enough guy he was not a good ruler. While Suleiman is considered the greatest rulers of all time both in the show and in real life because he was decisive, smart, and ambitious.

In a fight/war Suleiman would have fucking obliterated Viserys (without the use of dragons of course). But if not pitted against each other I think they would have been good enough friends. (though I think they would have secretly thought each other was a little weird).

Point 2: The main ones that burned my biscuits.

Hurrem is more like Rhaenyra and I am willing to die on this hill.

People have the uptmost gall and audacity to say that Hurrem is Alicent Highttower coded.....DID WE WATCH THE SAME SHOWS?

Hurrem is so Targaryen coded. At the very least Martell or a little bit Baratheon coded.

Like people are getting caught up on the ONE aspect of Hurrem's character which is that she is a bad stepmom ( i love her but it is the truth) like Alicent since they are both trying to kill their step children to make way for their own biological children...but Hurrem is more than that. And reducing her to just that is a disservice to the core of her character.

Yes Rhaenyra and Mustafa were robbed of their thrones but they are so different with their values and morals. And their gender plays a huge part in that also.

Mustafa did not have to prove himself to anyone or was questioned of his capability of ruling because he is a man. If history played out in his favor, there would not have been huge shift in history. It would have been more of the same because like I said he is a man. Mustafa is not much of an underdog because he has all of the privileges that Rhaenerya does not have access to.

She is constantly having to prove herself and her worth because she is a woman. She is constantly doubted and her honor is always called into question because she does exactly what every man does.

Rhaenyra is willing to do things (blood and cheese) that honestly I don't think Mustafa would have done. And if they met they would have not liked each other.

Because Rhaenyra probably would have reminded him too much of Hurrem.

Hurrem and Rhaenyra are rebels that dance to the beat of their own drum. They are the ones that broke the mold of what is acceptable for women. They were the first to achieve a level that was thought impossible for a woman.

Rhaenyra is the first woman to be named rightful heir to the Iron Throne and first sole ruling Queen (even though sadly it was for a short time). As a character Rhaenyra was balling the fuck out (as she should!). She was arrogant, was not afraid to put someone in their place, larger than life, and she wanted power. She fought in a literal war! Under the right circumstances she would have been a great ruler. She did what thought was best for her and lived life on her terms. Which is something even real women can barely do.

Hurrem was the first slave to become a legal wife of a Sultan and helped create an entirely new title, Haseki Sultan, which is the chief consort of the emperor. Which is the second most power position for a woman underneath Valide sultan (Mother of the Sultan). Haseki Sultan had immense power and influence of the empire! That is a huge step! She began an entire era called the Sultante of Women! She trailblazed for other women to rise up and gain power. All because she stuck her neck out, stood her ground and refused to be walked all over. Hurrem was all or nothing and did not asked but demanded respect. She dared to reached for more despite the heavy risk. She's fiery, charismatic, brave, intelligent, vicious, altruistic, headstrong, complicated, and plays by her own rules not anyone else's. She fought tooth and nail for she wanted.

Sounds very Targaryen to me. Show version Hurrem even have prophetic dreams and has fire and dragon motifs for christ sake!

Rhaenyra and Hurrem were both betrayed, abandoned, and had to move mountains to get what they want while losing a great deal in the process. They don't follow rules that don't serve them and are unabashedly upfront. These two would have been great friends! Hurrem, Rhaenyra, Laena Velaryon and Daemon would have been the best group on fucking earth. They would probably taken over the world in style.

Alicent would not have liked Hurrem. Maybe would not be so hostile toward Hurrem, but still would not like Hurrem's rule-breaking ways and her confidence.

As the saying goes good girls barely make history.

Point 3: The "good girls" in question

Mahidveran is the one who's soooooo damn Alicent Hightower coded. Like they are pretty much the same except Mahidveran is more outwardly viscous.

This is team "I blindly follow rules that don't serve me then get mad when said rules don't serve me." They allow others to control their lives and understandably they became resentful for it, and rest in their victimhood mentality.

They hide behind other people because they cannot stand on their own two feet. They are so self-righteous and refuse to take accountability for the wrong they have done.

I will give Mahidveran props for standing up for herself and her son to Suleiman from time to time. While Alicent waited until the last possible moment to stand up to her father (which resulted in absolutely noting). And I will give Mahidhveran major points for being a more involved parent and did not raise a rapist, drunk, and pedo.

While Hurrem and Rhaenyra went against the staus quo, Mahidveran and Alicent IS the status quo. If there was no Hurrem, Mahidveran would have been just another Vahide Sultan we would not have known or cared about. Or if Mustafa died before becoming a Sultan she would have been just another concubine pushed to the side because she did not break the mold. Which is understandable because it is dangerous for a woman to act out if she does not have protection or leverage. I understand that not everyone has it in them go against the grain and that's okay. Same for Alicent, if Rhaenyra never existed and Alicent married Viserys and carried on having sons she probably would not made much of a impact because again she complies with the restrictive patriarchal view of femininity and cannot fathom living another way because the risk of societal backlash is too great and scary. And again not everyone is strong enough to not give a fuck what societal expectations.

However, my problem with women/female characters like this is that they do absolutely nothing for the progress of other women and do everything for the progress of men. Even for men who don't deserve it (cough Alicent). They help continue the cycle of men dominating over everyone and maintaining a status quo that keeps women disempowered and treated as property and pawns.

I am not saying Hurrem and Rhaeynera are perfect feminists or perfect women or even perfect people. I am not saying everything they did was for the betterment of women because let's be real it was probably not. But women who take hold of their agency and personhood, shows other women that there are alternative ways to live and you do not have stand for a society or system that mistreatments you. Being selfish is the most radical thing a woman can do, because selfish "wild" women shows the gaping cracks of patriarchy, if more women choose to be themselves and live on their own terms then the system would eventually fall completely apart.

Alicent and Mahidveran would have been great superficial friends. They hang and out exchange niceties. Mahidveran would tell Alicent everything she want to hear because that's the kind of friend Mahidveran is (look at Hattice, Shah and Fatma.) And I totally see Mahidveran trying to worm her way into a marriage alliance between Helaena and Mustafa...Which I wouldn't be mad at cus my sweet baby Helaena deserved someone who wouldn't hurt her and keep her safe.

Thank you for reading my Ted Talk. Sorry if its long and got way to philsophical I might make more posts on this because it is very interesting and obviously I have thoughts on this. I love these shows so much.

Magnificent Century: Mahidevran

(MC’s) Haseki Hürrem Sultan + text posts and stuff

Mahidevran Sultan (Nur Fettahoğlu) — Magnificent Century

10 most Influential women in the Ottoman Empire (plus five non- sultans)

I must say in advance, this is purely my opinion and it doesn't include legal power,but general influence. For example if one woman had more legal power but still was limited to some actions, that another woman could get away with, I will rank her higher. Let's start with non sultans.

Part I: Non-Sultans

Number 5: Çevri kalfa

Çevri kalfa was a woman of Georgian origin and previously loyal servant to Nakşidili Sultan (also Georgian). She became mistress head treasurer( Baş hazindar usta) after accession of Mahmud II, who she saved from executioners by throwing them hot coals and sneaking the prince out. After becoming Head treasurer, she attained so much wealth that she could afford expensive clothes not even sultans wore. A girls school, built in her name, is one of the first schools for girls and the biggest primary school in Istanbul. She remained in her office until her death and was Sultan's trusted and favoured advisor.

Number 4: Meleki Kalfa

Meleki kalfa was a servant of Kösem and Ibrahim, however following the deposition of the sultan, she secretly switched sides as an agent of Turhan. Meleki played an important role in Turhan's rebellion by giving her information about Kösem's plan to dethrone Mehmed. After Kösem's death and Turhan's accession, she became an important person in Valide Sultan's court, was freed and married to Şaban Khalife. The couple built a residence in Istanbul, where Meleki not only conditioned her line of information to Turhan, but also acted as a negotiator in the palace on behalf of people. The political influence of her and her husband grew so much and they were murdered in 1656 for abuse of power.

Number 3: Gulfem Hatun

I have spoken about her in my previous posts

Number 2: Mahidevran Hatun

I have thought a lot about where to put her. People would expect her to be Number 1,mostly because they are used to her being sultan. That is what I first thought,for other reasons,but here we are. She has several significant influences that not many other women had:

1. She was popular with janissaries and people

2. Had a spy network, allowing her to hear major events happening in the capital.

3. She had strong allies. Ibrahim Paşa supported her and Mustafa later in his life, Hatice and her husband were supporting her openly or indirectly.

4. She was a considerable rival to the first and one of the most powerful women in the ottoman empire.

5. She had powerful characteristics: Was an intelligent, educated woman. Could mask her resentment towards Hürrem and act calmly around him.

6. She was a trusted advisor to her son. Actually, she supported the idea of Mustafa revolting against Suleiman,but only after she received information about his imminent execution, through her spy network.

Number 1: Çanfeda Kalfa

Çanfeda was the woman of Circassian origin, who served as second in command of Nurbanu for 18 years and the ruler of harem for another 11, so we can say she was de-facto Valide sultan.

In her almost three decades of service, she acquired wealth, so great that it attracted negative attention of Janissaries and even the grand Vizier. Although she collected such affluence through her salary(that was extraordinarily high consisting of 200 akches a day, it was the average salary of an imperial princess) and bribery, she used it for selfless purposes. She built three mosques, fountains, hamams, two schools, irrigation systems and fixed the roads, costing her several million akches, still she remained as one of the wealthiest people in the empire. In 1595, when Safiye exiled her, she needed dozens of carriages to carry her holdings, which apparently did not consist of much of the furniture, because she bought it from Venice the next year. It's also considerable that as an exiled person, she had to give up some of her wealth to imperial treasury.

Apart from her vital involvements in harem management in which she dominated Safiye, she had considerable influence over state matters as well. Çanfeda used her connections to install her not so bright brothers as paşas and after the series of mistakes,they were imprisoned, Çanfeda not only defied Grand viziers orders and had them set free,but restored them to their offices as well. Her power, wealth and influence came to the attention of Janissaries, who demanded her dead, but she got away with this as well. Another indication of her power, was her attempt to free the second son of sultan Murad. Even though she was caught red handed, the power it would take to infiltrate the prison is still considerable.

P.S. I did not list Halime and Handan,because after becoming Valide Sultans and regents they reached a whole different level, leagues above almost every single woman in ottoman history, however their power and influence was immense even when they were Hatuns.

As there is only 10 images/Gif limit. I will speak about 10 most powerful women in second posts.

“But can we trust Navagero’s story? It matters because Venice’s ambassadorial reports were read and valued in European capitals. They functioned as an index of intelligence as well as local public opinion that contributed, for better or worse, to Roxelana’s reputation. Tension between the two royal consorts was not unexpected, although the story of the brawl had perhaps been embroidered over time. Whether Mahidevran had an irascible personality or was prone to violence is hard to say; all other references to her in Venetian reports are exemplary. But the tale is not preposterous, and her self-defense to the sultan—the assault on her rank as senior concubine—is wholly plausible.”– Peirce, Leslie. Empress of the East: How a European Slave Girl Became Queen of the Ottoman Empire 

mahidevran was so done here lol

I repeat one of my comments posted on Youtube

If I had my say on the way Suleiman's children were portrayed, because like a lot of people, I didn't like the way it was written in Magnificent Century, that's what I would do. ( In my eyes, Mustafa was seen as a pure white sehzade, which therefore made him in my eyes more stupid and less interesting than he actually was. Mehmed was practically erased of his personality and seen as a pure Gary Stu like his half brother. Cihangir, who I adore, yet in the series was too naive. Selim is seen as evil, etc...)

I would respect the historical point of view more. I propose an alternative version, I would have added Suleiman's children he had when he was sehzade with his other concubines before he became Sultan and met Hurrem and then had them die of the plague as it was historically.

Sehzade Mustafa - I would keep his childlike personality, except he is not close to his siblings (because of the fratricidal law), and I wouldn't put him close to Ibrahim at least until he becomes an adult and allies himself with him. I would let his mother take care exclusively of his education. A young man who craves recognition and attention from his father, who often neglects him in return over his other children due to the fact that Mahidevran is the Sultan's least beloved concubine. The more he becomes an adult, and especially a father, the more he resents his father because of the way he treats his mother and him. He does not really understand his father and therefore his fears due to the fact that he did not grow up close to him. I would keep his efficient heir personality because he performs very well despite his father never teaching him well because of his mother who is a very good advisor. Instead of doing something for his military glory or showing off his harem too much, I would focus on how he improves the lives of common people exhausted by too much conquest. I would make his guilt very ambiguous, at the start it is clear that he wants to wait for his father to die to have the throne and restore his mother's honor, however, he realizes that his father lets his vizier lead his life impossible to see even encourages him, does not hide that he preferred to have a son of Hurrem on the throne no matter what Mustafa will do. Following this, the sehzade wants to have a second plan like his grandfather in case Suleiman wants to abdicate in favor of another of his sons which would put him in danger (which could explain the Venetian correspondence, others say that it was a plan to prevent his brothers from escaping if one day he became Sultan) but hesitates to actually carry it out, then after some hesitation goes to his father's tent and gets strangled. Instead of doing Atmaca, I would focus on Mustafa's son-in-law, Nergissah's husband who started as Rustem's ally and becomes his most loyal supporter ( it seems that it is more a legend than truth, but I didn't remeber well as I didn't have on me my books of historian like Halil Inalcık) . So I would avoid making a treacherous Sehzade, his mistakes would be understandable, but he wouldn't be a pure white Sehzade.

Sehzade Mehmed: it's more complicated for him because he died without having proven himself in a complicated province like Amasya, so it's quite difficult to make a comparison with Mustafa. But I would make sure to give him a real personality: initially close to some of his brothers like Selim and Bayezid, he becomes, despite his mother, more distant towards them because of the fratricide (Mehmed II had therefore legalized it there is not much way to escape from it at the time unlike MCK) although he is very close to Cihangir and his sister. Unlike Mustafa, his father trained him in the regency of the palace and he did very well by dint of advice and practice. When he is sent to the provinces, he often listens to his mother's advice when she visits him. Knowing that he has the support of the statesmen against Mustafa he realizes knowing his father better than his half brother that he will have to play the role of the obedient sehzade not interested in politics although deep down he prepare for it. He has the happiness of being a father but dies immediately afterwards.

Mihrimah Sultan- I would make sure to respect the historical Hurrem who wants her daughter to have a marriage of love and happiness. However Suleiman prefers Rustem, and she accepts him immediately because she will do everything to save her brothers and convince her mother to accept this marriage. I would rather show her as a politician as well as her diplomatic relations. However, I would underline the unjust side of Suleiman, he had Mustafa executed and condemned Mahidevran to poverty but refuses to punish Mihrimah by banishing her because she would have helped Bayezid financially during his rebellion. Their relationship would be cold for a time before reconciling. She will be reconciled with her brother Selim because basically they only remain and will be an ally of Nurbanu.

Sehzade Abdullah- I would have included him even if he died very young.

Sehzade Selim- Initially a cultured young man very focused on charity work like his mother and sister and very sober. Nevertheless it is often sad due to the law of fratricide. When Mustafa dies, he realizes he has a chance to escape it and he will fight in a wicked way especially for his son Murad because he knows that Bayezid's temper will put him in danger besides fratricide. He knew how to recruit powerful and efficient state members. He is on the whole an obedient sehzade but who is disgusted with his father's treatment of Mahidevran (after all she is no longer a threat to him she no longer has a son) and who will take risks to her by helping her financially. As the hardships go on, his depression increases he drinks more and more especially after his sister takes the part of Bayezid, that his brother Bayezid dies, and the fact that he is obliged to make other sons in the case where Murad dies without an heir which means that he knows that his other sons will be condemned to death. He has become a broken leader although he makes sure there is effective governance.

As a Sultan he must face his father's mistakes, including the way he led the Empire, including too many wars and unnecessary conquests in Europe. ​

Sehzade Bayezid- Him complicated. Due to his explosive temper he is the black sheep of his siblings (Mustafa does not count since he is a half brother, they do not even know each other) and the most incompetent of Suleiman's sons and Suleiman is worried because he has inherited the worst faults of Selim Yavuz like being angry easily (without having had his qualities). Yet deep down he wants affection and that's why he has several children even if it's irresponsible, his mother favors him because she's afraid for him because he has too impulsive nature . Mihrimah comes to his aid only in memory of his mother, because deep down she prefers Selim, Bayezid knows this, which means that he hardly listens to her. She only helps him financially as a last resort because she couldn't convince him to call off the rebellion. Suleiman was more lenient to his mistakes that Mustafa (we could once again underline the unfair side of Suleiman again with this) until the point that he took refuge to the Shah.

Sehzade Cihangir- A cultured young man very close to his parents and very sick. I would make him a supporter of Selim because although he is close to him, he also knows that he is his only chance of survival because he is not close to Bayezid at all. He often sends information from the Palace to Selim to better aid him in managing his province and at times advises him to be more ruthless in his quest for the throne while remaining an obedient sehzade. It would therefore be a good adviser for Selim (and it would give him more personality). He cannot therefore be limited to the role of a simple supporter but also of a valuable advisor.

And that's how I would portray them if I were in the place of the screenwriters. They are all very nuanced (we avoid all white or all black), we can freely pick a favorite without trying to favor another sehzade at all costs, and I try to be consistent with what we know about them and try to explain why they did mistakes or make sucess.

"⚔️The warlord of the North and his spring rose🌹"

Mahidevran Drees 1/??

Magnificent Century + text posts

☾ Mahidevran Sultan (Nur Fettahoğlu) — Magnificent Century

Some concubines of Sultan Suleiman I

Gülfem Hatun

Mahidevran Hatun

Ayse Hatun

Haseki Hürrem Sultan

Sadika Hatun

Gulnihal Hatun

Firuze Hatun

Nazenin Hatun

Princess Isabel

—Peirce, Leslie. Empress of the East: How a European Slave Girl Became Queen of the Ottoman Empire

i'm reminded of the line from the manga yume no shizuku, kin no torikago's version of mahidevran - "you may have the sultan's love all you want, but you cannot have his children" - right after she has a concubine who became pregnant with suleiman's child killed. and wow i think it's a damn shame that mc doesn't have a character with that sort of attitude. to be fair the show's writing is too sexist for something that realistic, every major woman in the harem has to be in love with her literal slaveowner apparently, but i can dream