the anger and hatred i feel for the "robin wouldn't date nancy cause of steve" rhetoric is literally unmatched by any other force on planet earth

It is tiring to be regarded as a 'homophobe' when you claim to not like a queer ship or say you do not think a queer ship is going to be canon & should not go canon. ST fandom has this type of fans especially Bylers and recently Ronancers. Sorry that I do not think Byler has a chance of being wrapped up in a nice way when the writers actively refused to even breakup Mileven in this season and intentionally added a confession scene on the show from Mike to El. We literally have 1 season left with everything else going on in a limited time frame but I am expected to be okay with the possible resolution of this whole thing, and should expect a nice wrap up where we supposedly will see Mileven break up, Mike and El moving on from each other, there will be a time for them to adjust to that, for Mike to consider dating Will HECK even for Will to consider confessing and dating Mike, for the writers to make that all believable to the audience in a nice way within the narrative.... and I am expected to like Ronance when Stobin is one of the most important platonic relationships on the show and we canonically know Nancy and Steve's break up was bad, and that Steve still has feelings for Nancy. I want to see representation, I really do but it feels like the fandom itself is bending any logic and sensibility to make a ship seem reasonable and make sense within the narrative... when it really does not.

God. Yeah. Like sure queer people can have internalized homophobia or intra community basis (like bi/a/trans phobia) etc but to say someone's a bigot just because they don't like the a fictional ship, or even that they just don't think it will be canon, is just silly and causing problems on purpose.

The intense blr shippers have really turned me off the ship, honestly. I have a few asks from them saved as drafts just to get them out of my inbox, and they're saying the same as others "we're fighting homophobia" "you're just as bad as people saying why don't we shut up about blr and ship mlvn if you don't think this has been part of a grand and epic master plan for the greatest romance ever" as well as just not understanding what the very specific phenomena of queerbaiting is, all telling me I don't belong in the ship because I don't ship it correctly. So. Makes me feel bad and really disappointed. People who ship mlvn (which my original post was also tagged, because it discusses them too) DIDNT come to my inbox and call me names or a fake shipper when I said I thought they should break up. Make of that what you will.

As much as Will and Mike getting together would mean to people, putting that much emotional weight and expectation and emphasis on a single aspect of a show, a single ship, is not healthy. It also, if it does happen, will not be the epic romance planned from the start they think it is. (We remember tjlc, right?? RIGHT??) If it happens it will possibly be slap dash and rushed, because you're right. There's a lot happening, the show struggles with ending/starting romances, and they are NOT the only characters that matter. The breathing room required for both Mike and El AND the audience to make the breakup feel real and that enough time has passed to not make Mike look like an asshole for immediately dating his ex's brother (and for Will not to look like an ass for dating his sister's ex?!?) Is now insufficient given how short the seasons are, and as you said, they should've broken up in S4 to pull that off.

And then the fandom would likely feel a bit cheated after building it up so much in their heads, only for it to be a bit of a flop. But I guess a lot of people don't mind how Nancy and Jonathan got together, so with the way some of the people in my inbox were talking about El then it could be like that too. Just. Not giving a shit if someone, a character I personally love, was really hurt and betrayed by her recently ex boyfriend and her BROTHER.

Pretending it was all fine because romantic love is the most important thing ever to them I guess. When it's not, especially in the show! Non romantic bonds are so important to these characters! It would just ruin it for me, because what I was originally saying was that Will, Mike, and El all mean so much to each other and actively try to not hurt one another (even if the do accidentally or end up hurting themselves) and that, because Will and El are siblings now, Will might think twice about dating Mike so soon after he broke up with El. It would make them look cold hearted and selfish tbh. That's why a good ending would be Will feeling comfortable enough to come out, and being accepted by his friends. (All of them not just Mike) and that final emphasis on the Party as a whole rather than individual Romo relationships.

It's actually very important to consider other people's feelings in everyday life, I think. Sure, ultimately they shouldn't dictate all your actions, but there will be consequences for some of them. They can lose friendships, or other relationships. It can also make a character look REALLY BAD.

For rnce, people go on about how Robin absolutely does not need to consider Steve's feelings in pursuing a girl. (Ignoring other issues people have with the ship that have nothing to do with Steve, lol) And sure. Okay. For every girl but the one that broke his heart, cheated on him, and who he still has feelings for that Robin herself encouraged. People are out here saying they could be endgame without completely ruining stobin's friendship like huh??? Do they understand Robin "what if we just combined" Buckley? Do they not care about the most important relationship in her life? Do they not care about her beyond how she can hype up Nancy instead of one of those icky boys?

A problem I have with rnce is that a lot of the writing saying it could be canon (which, lbr, it won't be. While I think blr may be canon just in a kind of disappointing way, I don't think there's any chance of rnce happening, especially with Vickie right there blushing and flirting with Robin) only focuses on how it would be good for Nancy, or if it's trying to make it seem good for Robin ignores their personalities and other relationships. Like Nancy isn't annoyed by Robin until Robin's speech gets them into Penherst, or that Nancy wasn't dismissive of Robin's ideas, and Robin wasn't clearly nervous and apologizing for being annoying in order to get Nancy to like her (tbh I think Nancy should have been the one pursuing a friendship with Robin instead of the other way around but alas). Tbh I could go on about how Nancy and her relationships and her needs/wants inside those are often misdirected? Misidentified? By fandom, and how that feeds into Robin being reduced to someone who supports Nancy (which, if people complain about Robin considering her bffs feelings about her dating someone, shouldn't they complain about her becoming a glorified cheerleader for Nancy...oh. it's because it's romantic. And some parts of this fandom value that most.) In rnce, which strips Robin of her personality and makes it boring. But this is already long haha (Not to mention it'd be super weird for Nancy to be dating her ex she cheated on and never actually told she cheated on him's best friend. Awkward!!)

I used to not mind rnce that much, tbh. I didn't get it and did think it was weird but the art was cute! And now it's sort of an alarm bells for people being weird about stobin.

Steve and Robin's relationship, like so many platonic relationships but more glaring with just how obsessed with each other they are, is often devalued by the fandom by virtue of the idea that a romantic partner needs/should be someone's number 1. Even though those two want to combine, and are seen taking active roles in trying to get them a romantic relationship, and are really the first person the other felt they could be completely themself around. They're the most important person to the other, regardless of their romantic relationship status.

ok so i’ve always had this plot in my head, born out of spite where post-season 4 after they’ve defeated vecna, everyone’s fine-ish, nancy, and jonathan break up but like steve doesn’t know that they’ve broken up all he knows is that they are having issues and he notices ronance getting closer and because steve knows what nancy’s like when she has a crush he immediately clocks her and he just like, he gets really really pissed off because as far as he knows she’s still with jonathan and he thinks that history is repeating itself. so he just gets really really passive-aggressive towards nancy, i’m talking about the season 1 scene in the alley except with no homophobia and he’s constantly in bitch mode and just incredibly standoffish to nancy. everybody clocks his behavior and they’re like, “what’s wrong with steve?” and they think he’s doing it because he either has a crush on nancy and is jealous of robin or he has a crush on robin and is jealous of nancy. (and it’s up to the writer if robin is aware that it’s his protective streak and she just doesn’t understand why he’s being extra hostile to nancy or if she also thinks that he’s jealous). but either way, steve is just being completely brutal to nancy, and it’s just like any form of like friendship between them just evaporated overnight. and i want a scene where it all comes to a head and literally, anybody can be there but the spicy six, all six of them have to be there. and let’s say he sees ronance having an intimate moment or maybe they’re planning a road trip and steve knows what happened the last time nancy went on a road trip with someone while she was on the outs with her boyfriend, so he just gets incredibly pissed at them. maybe he walks away or he says something snippy and nancy can’t take it anymore like it has been days, weeks, months of this and she’s just tired and she just like calls him out, and she’s like “what do you want? what is your problem? why are you acting like this towards me?” and steve is just like incredulous like, “are you seriously asking me what the problem is when you know very well that you are the problem?” and he just goes off on her and he’s like “this is the second time you will be pulling this shit with your partner where you guys argue and instead of maybe i don’t know sitting down and talking about shit you run off with the next available person and the next thing you know that’s your new partner. how am i supposed to trust you with robin when you have done the same thing to me and now jonathan? because this is your thing now and if you think i’m going to let you do this to robin, you must have inhaled too much of the upside down because clearly, you are delusional.” steve realizes that he’s probably being unfair to nancy but he legit doesn’t care are in that moment because he is so filled with rage at nancy’s audacity to pull this shit again and with his fucking platonic soulmate at that. and he just unloads all the anger that’s been festering from 1984 on her and that’s when everybody but mostly her and jonathan realize that oh shit the breakup fucked him up more than they realized and robin, who was under the impression that steve was mad at her for dating his ex realizes that he wasn’t mad at her he was mad for her and steve also realizes that nancy wasn’t cheating and he feels a little sorry, but he also feels so much better after his rant so he’s not that sorry. and then, in the end, everybody goes to therapy, and everybody deals with their stuff, and ronance get together, and jargyle get together, and steddie get together and everybody’s happy and in love, and they all become besties. this isn’t to like bash nancy, i’m just tired of seeing people having steve move on like that from the whole “bullshit” thing with little to no apologies, and i wish people would stop having him be okay with ronance right from the jump. but most of all, i just want steve to be petty with nancy and jonathan as a treat.

I don't know what it is about this ask but every time I try to read it it's like it goes in one eye and out my ears. Sorry, I think it's the wall of text that's just making my brain shut down.

It's just- to your last point; YES. I do love ronance but I specifically love the fanon version. Like, the Nancy that takes care of Robin or the Nancy that finds her rambling cute. It's very lovely and their personalities would vibe very well.... if only we didn't know what Nancy is canonically like with Robin... Or Steve... Or Jonathan.

I love Nancy, that's my girl and I do indeed support womens wrongs... but she should not be in a relationship asdfdsasd. Jonathan maybe but even they need couples counselling.

There's also like literally no way that Robin would even think about Nancy at all without having a very long, very drunk, bathroom talk with Steve. And even then, if she sees that Steve is still hurt by the bullshit thing? Or actually hears the real and full story? Bro code trumps all, she would drop Nancy without hesitation. Not even friends. They're enemies now.

Steve is her soulmate, they're ride or die.

Sorry for going off topic probably but like... as much as I do adore ronance, I do have to ignore Steve to ship them. If I start thinking about how Nancy is in canon, with Steve and Robin? I just cannot ship them at all. It's either completely fantasy fanon fluff or nothing. Robin deserves to have a girlfriend who would canonically treat her the way she deserves (like VICKIE, her CANON GIRLIE? (but also chrissy bc she's a sweetheart))