#so it’s understandable that Obito fans go wild in your askbox at that month haha
Note
Hi again!!
Probably this time my questions would seem Silly because as a Kakashi fan, you might have faced this question a million times before and if so, please link your Arguments.
My questions are
1. What do you think about people saying "Kakashi is Over-Rated in real life as well as Narutoverse"?? Like that time Naruto right after Time Skip said, "Kakashi Sensei is inept at handling Sharingan than Sasuke, Cleverer than Shikamaru, Keener sense to smell than Kiba"... Like Rikkudou Sennin complimenting Kakashi as a good sensei when in reality he did nothing for them as a Sensei in that Battle.
2. How do you argue against people who say "Kakashi is not the person who is capable of understanding anyone because everytime he says something... The opposite happens" Like that time Kakashi said "Sakura is not the person to brag about her talents" but later she proved his own words wrong. He said he could bring back Old Team 7 days but again, he ended up being wrong.
The reason I am asking this to you is because, I get a lot of Kakashi and Obito asks these days (it's a season, kind of)... While for Obito, I am very well aware of the purpose he serves to the over arching theme of this series... Probably because of too much of my time spending to debunk Uchiha apologists... And because of that, I ignored Kakashi (a person with strong moral compass). Blame my complacency.
To me, Obito is a Character who was designed to be an Harbinger of Disaster for both Naruto and Sasuke's lives whereas Kakashi became a Sensei for them.
Another purpose is, Obito as an Uchiha had every chance to become an Hokage... He was encouraged to have such dreams by his very own sensei... But he was prevented from becoming one... Due to the manipulation of his life from his very own Clan Member... And he ended up doing the same to his other clan member (Sigh). Uchiha is the best example of Big Fish eats Small Fish...
Similarly
3. So, What purpose does Kakashi serves to the over arching theme of the story??
Sorry if it's too much... The reason I am asking you is because, I (as a casual viewer) might tend to miss something important which You, as a fan can always have more perspective about.
Heya! Thanks for the ask! Interestingly despite what you said, some points in your asks are things that I never think about it before. Many points that I have to give a consideration for the first time, and that’s fun.
So, sorry for the wait and please be prepared for a veeerryyyyy long answer.
What do you think about people saying "Kakashi is Over-Rated in real life as well as Narutoverse"??
For starter, I don’t care for power scaling. Fanboys can yap about Kakashi being the weakest Hokage or this person stomps him etc for all I care and I still celebrate the fact that Kakashi is the Hokage who led Konoha toward massive technological and infrastructure developments and there are no major crisis or stain in his reign (Orochimaru is a stain for me but at least he never harmed Konoha or the world on Kakashi’s reign). In fact, I can handle Kakashi being called the weakest Hokage more than Tsunade being called the weakest Hokage. Tsunade is the gal who receive Madara’s Susanoo’s sword point blank and swung it back at him, those misogynist bunch grrr. Looks like my gender bias is stronger than my love for Kakashi haha. I wander in Reddit sometimes and always ignore when there are posts about “vs battle”, especially something ridiculous like DMS (dual mangekyou sharingan) Kakashi vs Healthy Itachi, like what the heck? First, Kakashi has both Mangekyou with him just one time and at that time Itachi is already long gone, including his Edo Tensei version. Second, till this day we don’t know what is Itachi’s illness so from where they get ”healthy Itachi” to make comparison? That’s all simply pointless discussions for me.
Anyway, since I never interested in power battle, I have no clue how overrated Kakashi among casual Naruto viewers in general. I mean, sure, I’ve seen Kakashi fans in my circle talks about his strength, but I’ve never see statement like “Kakashi will defeat Madara” or something like that. In fact, when it comes to Kakashi, most Kakashi fans don’t think much about his strength. In Chinese Naruto community however, Kakashi is called “five-to-five” means that on the screen battle regardless the strength of Kakashi’s opponents (except Zabuza and Demon Brother), Kakashi faces them evenly, neither winning nor losing badly. This puts him in such an awkward place, but by logic it makes sense. Why?
Because Kakashi is an adult character in a kid show, so his role is mostly to stall the opponent before finally they were defeated by the true MC, a.k.a his students. His canon high reputation is also used to emphasis that the enemy of the day is indeed A Big Deal so when the MC finally defeats them, it will make them looks more impressive. So just like MC is destined to win, Sensei role like Kakashi is destined unable to take down MC’s enemies. I believe that in fiction literature world, this phenomenon is called “Worf Effect.”
I am not being overly pessimistic here. Kishimoto himself already made it clear what is Kakashi’s role in his world.
[long post ahead, like supeeerrr long. My longest post probably. You have been warned]
Because he acts as a link between the other main characters of the series, Kakashi is rarely featured prominently in promotional artwork, instead appearing in the background while his students are the focus
- Kishimoto, Masashi (2007). Uzumaki: the Art of Naruto
So yeah, Kishimoto saw him as a link between the other main characters, and in harsher word, he puts Kakashi on the background while his students (the MCs) are the focus. It’s indeed harsh to use Kakashi as a tool to uplifted MCs’ stories, but also makes total sense. All in all Naruto is a show about kids and mostly has kids as their demographic intended audiences. The 3 protagonists are being made that way to make the kids as viewers easily insert themselves into either one of protagonists. You can insert yourself in Naruto if you feel like the dumbest person among your peer but want to find hope that you were destined to do something great. You can insert yourself in Sasuke if you think that the world is unfair to you and interested on doing rebel scenario. You can insert yourself in Sakura if you are ordinary girl (I never find boys ever SI to Sakura, cmiiw) who seek romance but also has little confidence and wants to be strong. By his role design, Kakashi is not suitable to be used as self-insert at all, so developing his strength is not the priority in narrative standpoint. Heck, Kakashi doesn’t even have a dream or goal except perhaps protecting the people besides him, so he has no specific reason to “be strong”. Of course, fans are not forbidden to self-insert as Kakashi, but Kishimoto and the concept of the anime itself designed Naruto franchise with the kids are the focus.
(Humain note : I myself sees Naruto franchise in Kakashi’s P.O.V, because somehow I’ve never been fond of inserting myself in the MC. I like to see fictional worlds in neutral third party standpoint without the character’s emotion affecting my own feeling about the situations. So Kakashi character is ideal for me because he always presents on important situations but mostly he becomes an observer and there’s almost no focus on his emotion)
Although, in Kishimoto’s credit, while he gave Kakashi massive “Worf Effect” more than any other characters as the consequences of always stays and exists besides MCs, he still puts a quite effort to paint Kakashi’s strength on a bright light, plus although Pierrot is not always a good studio but I think they genuinely love to make Kakashi’s fights as cool as possible. That way audiences still can enjoy Kakashi’s fights and don’t see him as “jobber” despite his role as enemy’s punching bag before the MCs arrived. He made sure that the enemies Kakashi faced acknowledge his strength and admit that Kakashi does a good job on fighting them, from Itachi to Pain. Even Madara praised him once. It sends a message toward viewers that indeed Kakashi is losing, but he’s still a strong character. That’s why although his winning count is low, it’s totally understandable that general audiences still rate him highly. Why Kishimoto doesn’t do the same toward poor Konohamaru in Boruto, I have no idea. I only pity him so much now, he already became butt-monkey among fanboys. Well, that’s the fate of adult character especially teacher in kids show, even there are popular memes about Sasuke’s low chakra in Boruto community, ironically similar with Kishimoto’s way to nerf Kakashi.
(Humain note : I don’t follow Boruto and I don’t read Boruto manga so I just slightly know about its storyline and community from Reddit. I don’t hate Boruto like most Naruto fans I know, but I don’t like Boruto’s art style. Art style is, uh, kinda big deal for me, I don’t follow One Piece for the same reason. Plus there’s no side character in Boruto manages to hook me into the series, and as I say I have no interest in MC. So CMIIW about any of my Boruto statements)
On the other hand, the strength of Naruto’s enemies are wildly inconsistent, resulted in Kakashi having unbalanced power scale, hence why he gets the awkward “five-to-five” nickname. Personally I think that discussion about power scale of any fictional characters is pointless, after all how strong or how weak a character depends on plot demands and author’s writing. It’s not like if you defend Naruto or Sasuke or others as the strongest being till your neck turn red you will get their power or even a glimpse of it. For me it’s better to discuss about characterization like why and how they react to different difficult situations, what is character’s philosophy and standpoint, and gained life lessons from them, something that we can actually get.
As for in Narutoverse...
Kakashi is stated outright as an elite. An experienced veteran. Not as legendary as The Sannin trio but his famous too. it made him the only person in Narutoverse probably that was chosen to be Hokage not only by Konoha people, but by 4 Kages from different countries with their difference and disagreement.
So yeah, he was rated highly by people in Narutoverse. But since I’ve never see people in Naruto rated him high and be disappointed later, or thought that Kakashi is weaker than his reputation, I don’t think that Kakashi is overrated by Narutoverse standard. He always does his role well as Konoha defender and was mostly tasked with the strongest enemies that any other men can’t handle so dunno if Kakashi is ever getting overestimated.
Like that time Naruto right after Time Skip said, "Kakashi Sensei is inept at handling Sharingan than Sasuke, Cleverer than Shikamaru, Keener sense to smell than Kiba"...
If I remember correctly on Bell Test after Timeskip Naruto has not yet met Kiba, Shikamaru, or Sasuke in action, right? When we looked at the context, they’re in a hide and seek game to grab Kakashi’s bell, right?
Naruto and Sakura did that conversation to find out Kakashi’s weakness on their version of tag game. With that context, personally I think that the panel are purposed to tell the audience that Kakashi is all-rounder. Most characters have a specialty in one certain aspect like Shikamaru with his intelligence but weak at taijutsu and Rock Lee with his taijutsu but weak at strategizing, Kakashi looks like he excels all of them. His ninjutsu, taijutsu, strategizing, and sensing by smell are above average, making him apparently has no weakness especially since they want to sneak at him and grab his bells. Well, except low chakra. And novel spoiler apparently.
(Humain note : Funny thing is, when I first saw that scene, I immediately thought that Naruto will use his Sexy Jutsu because, well, Kakashi is a “pervert” character and all adults around Naruto are being taken down by that technique. Perhaps because I saw that scene on anime and the segment when Konohamaru used Sexy Jutsu in front of Kakashi, Tsunade, Naruto, Sakura, and Jiraiya are changed. In anime, only Naruto, Sakura, and Jiraiya who’ve seen Konohamaru’s sexy Jutsu so the scene of Kakashi is more interested in his novel that the real NSFW content in front of him are not shown in anime. You can look at this post to see the compilation of Kakashi’s reaction toward Sexy Jutsu.)
So yeah, in my understanding, Naruto just stated that Kakashi is “jack of all trades” while using his peers’ specialty to emphasis his point. Is it too hyperbolic of him, surely he doesn’t need to say that Kakashi is better than all of them, right? Perhaps, but in the end Naruto is Kakashi’s student and it’s not weird for a proud boy like him to say that his Sensei is better than his peers.
Is Naruto’s statement born from him putting Kakashi on a high pedestal? Most likely.
Is Naruto the only one who does it? Not really.
Behold, genin Sasuke with all of his cute naivety.
“his speed is above Kakashi... Is he human...!?”
Now I understand why Kakashi said that he missed his cute students. At a certain point on their life, Team 7 genuinely believe that their sensei is the strongest ninja in existence, the innocent assumption that is of course untrue and Kakashi never ever claimed himself as that anyway. I once babysat my nephew who genuinely thought that I am the smartest human being on Earth and that’s endearing. Unlike Kakashi I shamelessly indulged his assumption.
Now he knows better and yes, I miss the time when he was still my cute duckling XD
Like Rikkudou Sennin complimenting Kakashi as a good sensei when in reality he did nothing for them as a Sensei in that Battle.
I had to look at the manga again because I don’t remember Hagoromo ever praise Kakashi to be a good Sensei, and indeed Hagoromo praised Kakashi for doing well at leading the team to seal Kaguya.
Which is ya know, things that legit happens in reality. Kakashi is the one who devised strategy to seal Kaguya and led Naruto, Sasuke, and Sakura to their respective place in the role of sealing Kaguya. Since Naruto and Sasuke’s attempts are failed at that time, it’s not weird that Hagoromo crediting Kakashi with the plan to seal Kaguya.
Plus,
(sorry for the panel’s shitty quality, but I checked the raw and that translation is the most correct one. It still should be “Naruto and others’ teacher=Naruto-tachi no shi).
And here Hagoromo made his praise clear by pointing that although Kakashi is losing his way (mayoi, can be translated as confused, bewildered) he remains Team 7′s teacher and Obito’s friend. As Hagoromo said, that’s a big deal. Kakashi is someone who is certainly getting thrown in a fight that was way out of his league. Naruto, Sasuke, and Sakura surpass him on certain extend, Naruto and Sasuke overwhelmingly so. After what Obito did, forgive him is one thing but he saved his life from Kaguya’s lava and guard his body on goddess dimension. Just like Shinobi alliance when Edo Madara went rampage, he felt that the situation he faced in Kaguya dimension was overwhelmingly big for a tired un-godlike shinobi like him. Even Kakashi admitted that
Yet, he found his determination back after hearing Naruto’s declaration, He saw that his students and his friend are fighting so he must do his best too. That resulted in Kakashi tried to protect Sasuke from Kaguya’s Bone Ash, and then conveyed a plan to take down Kaguya just after seeing his friend’s death for a second time (and apparently receives his temporary eyes? I can’t even think straight after that bizarre event).
Kaguya’s take down is also partly happened because he didn’t lose his role as Team 7′s teacher and Obito’s friend. Yes, he passed his leadership to Sasuke and then the latter failed to seal Kaguya with Naruto, but when Kakashi said “he had a plan” all Team 7 members listened to him. Also he reconciled with Obito and was trusted by Obito to handle his Mangekyou + Rikudo power for a last time, and he used them efficiently.
That was admirable, at least for Hagoromo (and me).
How do you argue against people who say "Kakashi is not the person who is capable of understanding anyone because everytime he says something... The opposite happens"
I made this post when people said that Kakashi is “emotionally incompetent”. Yes, Kakashi was always calm, elusive, and somewhat distant downright looks emotionless. But most of time he was the one who can say the right thing when the opponent has emotional trouble. So despite his aloof personally, I never see him having problem with understanding emotion, although it’s a somewhat popular opinion even among Kakashi fans.
everytime he says something... The opposite happens
Ahaha now this is funny, because while misunderstanding and taking too light of serious situations is also a common trait of adult characters in kids media, that becomes hilariously bizarre when it comes from Kakashi. Why? Because looking at his whole life, that man is downright cursed XD
For example, this scene :
When I see this for the first time, my reaction is “ah this is just the usual adult character doesn’t think better than to put Harry Potter’s detention on Forbidden Forest.” Because as I stated above, this is a show with kids as prominent focus, meaning that as per plot rule the kids will actually experience some crisis with adults let it happen in one way or another. At least in Naruto Kishimoto had decency to make the adults actually busy to tend the kids.
But on my re-read, I wanna shake Kakashi hard like “dude, my man, the love of my life, remember when you fought desperately because there has to be another way to save Rin? Naruto’s birth with the risk of Kyuubi getting loose? First C-rank mission turned into A rank mission? Chuunin Exam with murderous Orochimaru gang and Suna gang? Your life is compiled by THE WORST POSSIBLE SCENARIOS HAPPEN WHY THE HECK ARE YOU SO CAREFREE DON’T LET YOUR GUARD DOWN!”
Seriously! In all the clusterfuck of his life, somehow he has a weirdly positive assumption about future matters. Even McGonagall knows better and has this resigned acceptance.
I start to think that Kakashi is in denial about how bad his luck is before finally he deduced that his hero for 18 years is the Harbinger of Disaster XD.
Like that time Kakashi said "Sakura is not the person to brag about her talents" but later she proved his own words wrong.
Although in my opinion Kakashi is capable at understanding emotion, I am not saying that Kakashi always right in his assessment. Kakashi’s role as mouth-piece made fandom sometimes treat his word as absolute truth, but in the end he’s still an independent character who has his own mindset. That mindset can be wrong, just like normal human being who has no telepathic or premonition power. Of course, Kakashi is not an exception, neither is the only one.
For example, let’s look at Hashirama. Unlike Itachi who knows founders era from legends, or Obito who narrates such a biased story about Madara to Sasuke, Hashirama as first-hand witness is more or less in same place as Kakashi regarding credibility of his words, at least about founders era, Konoha, and Madara. Of all Naruto character, only Hashirama who understand Madara emotionally, whereas from Tobirama to Itachi saw him as madman villain. So is that mean Hashirama never wrong about Madara?
Sadly, no, and the poor poor Sasuke paid dearly for it.
Our pure boy believed in Hashirama’s words and charged straight toward Madara, resulted in...
*facepalm* Hashirama...
That doesn’t mean what Hashirama said is utterly wrong. Madara was indeed originally a kind man. Madara indeed loved his brother dearly. And Sasuke indeed has uncanny resemblance with Izuna. It’s wholly understandable that by Hashirama logic Sasuke has a chance to sway Madara’s heart. But seconds later Madara does the opposite of what Hashirama said. Does that mean Hashirama is not capable at understanding Madara? While Hashirama is the only one who take a thought on Madara at emotional level?
My point is Kakashi’s assessment is not absolute. No one is, not even Naruto’s. Kakashi is right about Chiyo who indeed still has a thing to do. He directly pointed out Sai’s emotion when the latter is unable too. But there are some situation when conditionally he’s just incapable to understand or predict, something that Kakashi himself admitted later.
Btw, many people jokingly dubbed that scene as “Hashirama’s rose-tinted opinion of Madara led Sasuke to his death”. I am not exactly disagree with them. Many fans also think that Kakashi also has rose-tinted thought of Sakura, albeit those fans are mainly Sakura haters. I admit that Sakura is indeed Kakashi’s little princess and he adores Sakura like a teacher adores their kid student, so I will not deny that Kakashi maybe has a bias toward Sakura. But is it still count as bias when on other occasion he is “pro” toward his other students? Apparently so, since till this day we still can see opinions like “Kakashi is biased toward Sasuke, he praised Sasuke’s C rank jutsu Katon but not Naruto’s S rank jutsu Kagebunshin in bell test”, or “Kakashi is biased toward Naruto, he tolerated Naruto’s bratty tantrum everytime but immediately confined Sasuke when he rightly lashed out from trauma”. I’ve seen my fair share of Sasuke haters called Kakashi Sasuke wanker and Naruto haters called Kakashi Naruto wanker (-_-)
Well, as we can see, his assessments are either right or wrong depending on the situations (and mostly the plot). I personally think that Kakashi is right about Sakura at some conditions and is wrong about Sakura at another conditions, same case with his other students. I will not elaborate it on this post to avoid it getting longer, maybe another time.
(Humain note : another proof that Kakashi’s design is not suitable to be self insert. Of course there are so many other media MCs with kids in their care but mostly they’re low-maintenance kids who follow and sometimes downright worship the MC like little ducklings. Example, Konohamaru toward Naruto, that’s how you write kid characters for the MC. But Naruto, Sasuke, and Sakura are definitely not the type of kid characters that an author wants to saddle to their self-insert character. Even as Kakashi fan who sees Naruto’s world in Kakashi P.O.V, every time I see Naruto, Sasuke, or Sakura hard fans who can just demand and critic, only see their fav’s struggle, and completely ignoring everything else, it strengthen my resolve to never ever have children. Or at least multiple children at one time.
Oh right, just to clear my standing in case anyone wondering, I am neutral-pro about Sakura. I am also neutral-pro about Sasuke, Naruto, and characters that Kakashi cares about. Neutral period or straight don’t care with NaruHina, SaiIno and other romance in general except MinaKushi and ShikaTema. Anti Sasusaku, just thinking about them gave me headache. For me, Kakashi is a neutral character who assess both allies and enemies equally. It’s not like he is bias-free, but he seldom let his emotion affect his judgement.
Of all Naruto characters, I only hate Orochimaru, Danzo, and Kabuto in that exact particular order).
He said he could bring back Old Team 7 days but again, he ended up being wrong.
I believe he said that “soon things will go back to old days”. The “soon” he’s talking about is after Kakashi lectured Sasuke and Jiraiya did the same to Naruto. An assessment that was spoken first by Jiraiya and Kakashi agreed with him. They believed that they can fix the situation after they gave both Naruto and Sasuke a few lectures and that’s why Kakashi assured Sakura.
Suffice to say that they both underestimate the severity of Naruto and Sasuke’s feud, something that Kakashi himself admitted later.
I spoke about Kakashi’s possible thought about that scene in this post. Basically the summary of that post is :
I think before Kakashi quite based Naruto and Sasuke’s rivalry with his and Obito’s rivalry in the past, and despite how dysfunctional Team Minato has become, their past selves in Naruto and Sasuke’s age never ever think of pointing deadly weapon toward their own teammates. Jiraiya based Naruto and Sasuke’s rivalry with his rivalry with Orochimaru, but even they as far as I know never go all out because of rivalry. Also, in the end Kakashi and Obito’s ceased their argument and work together when Rin is in danger, whereas Naruto and Sasuke are incapable to stop themselves even when Sakura is at the tip of their attack. Perhaps for Kakashi the possibility of himself and Obito pointed deadly attack in front their teammate and actively tried to kill each other and is unthinkable so he unconsciously held the same standard toward Naruto and Sasuke’s fight.
The reason of that discrepancy is because the intense emotion and determination on Naruto and Sasuke’s feud is more serious than kid Kakashi vs Obito ever been, even when the latter is in the middle of 3rd Ninja War. I don’t think no one can perfectly understand them except Hashirama and Madara who are their predecessor.
So, What purpose does Kakashi serves to the over arching theme of the story??
Kakashi’s purpose on Naruto story is :
- As a Sensei.
You are right, Kakashi’s most prominent role since his early design is as Naruto and Team 7’s sensei.
(the order of character’s creation. The scan is blur so I can’t read the Chinese character. Perhaps someone has the clearer version?)
What is Kakashi’s role as Sensei? To teach the audience (in Naruto POV) about truth about ninja world. The gritty part, the sad part, the happy part, the fun part, Kakashi’s role was to teach and accompany MCs while they were learning all of that.
- Reasonable enabler adult
This role was shown ever since Land of Waves arc, but it truly shines in Kage Summit arc, when everything became so wild and everyone apparently lose their basic skill of self-control.
Minutes later he was orchestrating the whole plan so Naruto can safely meet Raikage.
This is also shown in Part 1 when Kakashi allowed Sasuke fought while having Cursed Seal on a certain condition.
I think that’s why although Kakashi is an adult character, he doesn’t feel like a “boomer” who disrupt the fun in fear of danger toward his kids, while still looks as a caring character who is certainly concerned about his students.
- As mouthpiece about Naruto and other connecting characters.
I don’t think I have to explain about this. From Land of Waves when he told Inari about Naruto’s condition till his last talk with Hagoromo, he spent his dialogue bubbles filled with his observation about his students.
- Emphasis the tragedy of Obito’s downfall.
Yes, Obito is the Harbinger of Disaster in Naruto franchise, but he’s also a very nice and bright boy in the past. The best way to feel the full extent of Obito’s tragic change of heart is by looking at Kakashi’s p.o.v, because Kakashi is the only one in Naruto world who ever saw Obito at his brightest. Naruto is absolutely clueless, Gai didn’t think much about Obito, I remember Shikaku was like “So the fake Madara is Uchiha Obito that was supposed to be dead, well that was surprising. Anyway the plan is..” and Minato mostly felt sadness and regret because he was failed at protecting his student, but Kakashi.... Kakashi is downright heartbroken. In front of his own eyes his hero turned into an unrecognizable monster who brought suffering toward his students. His promise to protect Rin? He killed her with his own hand, and that brought immense suffering to Obito, resulted in the horrendous chain of event. His promise to see the future as Obito’s eye? What’s the point of that, turns out Obito is alive the whole time and tried to destroy the said future.
The poignant sense when the source of determination and life lesson that the Sensei role tried to teach the MC is actually the Big Bad brought different interesting sides of the Big Bad plus the Sensei role. At the same time, the plot was also used to develop Kakashi’s character so he finally let go of his past and lived for himself. Those all make the Tobito plot twist as one of a masterpiece in Naruto, at least for me. Now, you can say that I am biased because it gave me more exploration of Kakashi, and I am not denying it. It’s the first time I’ve seen the always calm Kakashi completely thrown out and since I see Naruto in Kakashi’s p.o.v, the sudden exposure of his intense feeling caught me out of guard and I just can’t help but to be hearbroken as well. Not just me, apparently many authors saw the beauty of that plot twist and made their own version of “Obito” to their own version of “Kakashi” character.
Example no. 1. Gintoki and Shoyo.
(Gintama fans, Spoiler warning!)
Yes, Gintoki is an MC, but there are many similarity with Gintoki’s character with Kakashi’s character, like lazy eyes, aloof personally, in surface is a massive dork and troll, loves porn mags...
And of course, hard past.
Just as Shoyo’s supposedly last moment is so bright in Gintoki’s eyes, turns out he was alive and becomes Big Bad.
Resulted in Gintama fans having mixed feeling about him (I think, I haven’t pick up Gintama till the end because I was too saddened by the Shogun’s death).
Example no. 2, Aizawa, the Sensei of Class A and his late best friend Shirakumo
(BNHA fans, Spoiler warning!)
Well, turns out the “white cloud” (Shirakumo) turned into “black fog” (Kurogiri) although in Shirakumo’s case is by brainwashing.
(Anyway KakaGai and ObiKaka fans can check out about BNHA rooftop gang contents, it’s kinda similar with Gai/Kakashi/Obito dynamic)
For example no.3, I know that you watched Jujutsu Kaisen @captnjacksparrow so I will not spoiler anything other than Gojo-sensei has his own “Obito” as well.
Coincidence? Perhaps. But nice details nonetheless.
As for over-aching theme of the series for me...
Naruto part 1 theme : get stronger to protect important person
Naruto shippuden theme : Break the cycle of hatred
Naruto theme in general : mutual recognition and understanding
(This is strictly my interpretation so you guys can agree or disagree)
Those themes are things that Naruto as MC must learn through the length of anime. But adult characters like Kakashi? In surface, looks like he has learned all of them. He tried to get stronger to protect important people in his life and when his important people left him one by one he’s just stop...developing. But he still kept the lesson to protect precious comrades at all cost, something that becomes one of Naruto’s lesson in life as well.
Kakashi’s character as veteran shinobi plus his nature to not held a grudge made him well-known and accept the hard truth of shinobi’s life, so he bore no hatred toward anyone for his misfortune, as I already discussed in this post. He tried to break the hatred in Sasuke although didn’t succeed because of the little detail about Kakashi character that I will explain below.
For the last theme, mutual recognition and understanding...
This is when Kakashi’s getting tricky.
See, we know that mutual understanding is a big deal in Naruto. That’s how you form bond, that’s how you break the cycle of hatred, that’s how you get stronger in the process. In Pain arc, it pointed straight how can you achieve mutual understanding from this panel.
“I am in pain, so I understand your pain, You know my pain so let me hear yours”.
This mutual understanding are supposed to happen both way. Both sides let go their defenses, bare their souls open, and show each other pain while at the same time listen to each other. In Naruto world, and even in our real world, the act of mutual understanding is often failed because each individuals are more inclined to talk about their own pain while ignoring other party’s pain, or in the worst case, when they already hear it, they pulled a Pain and said “yes you are in pain, BUT MY PAIN IS GREATER THAN YOURS!”
(Humain note : considering my distaste toward Pain Olympic, plus the fact that scene is animated badly, I hate Pain for like a whole week and cheered for every blow he received, more than any villain I’ve ever seen. Yes, even Orochimaru)
Iruka, with his de facto role as person who acknowledge Naruto, fulfills his role and did it perfectly) since the first chapter.
Iruka admitted his own pain. He told Naruto about it, while making it clear how painful the loneliness is felt for Iruka himself. He empathized with Naruto, and at the same time, make Naruto can see Iruka’s pain as well and realizing that yes, he’s not alone.
Whereas Kakashi is...
As Kakashi fans, I will say that the conversation managed to sway Sasuke’s hard determination and making him reconsider his revenge mindset. But also as Kakashi fans I had to admit that it honestly sucks compared to the talk Iruka gave to Naruto. Yes, Kakashi told Sasuke a liittlllee about his pain, but just to say that he understands the pain from losing. He doesn’t elaborate about how painful the loss of precious people for himself, and behind that awkward smile he tried to hide his pain from Sasuke.
There’s no way Sasuke can empathize with that. I found a comment in Reddit that said Kakashi should talk more with Sasuke, should explain everything and elaborate his point in the conversation, and I somewhat agree (although they said it in a not nice manner and I just wonder since when Kakashi is a therapist). Just like in Naruto’s case, empathy is important so the recipient doesn’t feel alone in the “Hurt” land and achieve mutual understanding. Kakashi is absolutely justified to keep his painful past as private matter and doesn’t talk about it to his mere kid student, but still, that’s why Kakashi’s talk no jutsu toward Sasuke is always failed, also his talk to Obito in Kamui land. Also that’s why Naruto told Sasuke about his pain because of losing Jiraiya toward Sasuke in the Land of Iron.
That’s Kakashi’s problem. When usually the failure of mutual understanding is because of the person involved just want to talk about his own pain without hearing the other, Kakashi is content to hear the other’s pain and provide support, while completely clam up about his own pain. That was sometimes enough to emotionally help others, but with that he can’t unlock the hidden rare S rank jutsu, “talk no jutsu” XD.
As far as I know, there are only 2 time in the whole 700 chapters manga when Kakashi laid bare his soul and tell the other party that, yes, “I am hurting”. And no, his “the situation went shit because of me” lament doesn’t count, because it’s his self-deprecation, not acknowledgement of his suffering.
The said 2 times are when he conversed with Sakumo and Obito, his Heroes who have the highest place in Kakashi’s heart.
First is Sakumo. In a weird way, Kakashi’s death is the kindest thing Kishimoto did to him, because that’s his chance to reconcile with his father without any interruption. Kakashi is highly secretive person, so when Sakumo said “please tell me your tale” and Kakashi agreed, I know that Kakashi will do something that he will not do in other people’s presence.
In anime, they add a scene when Kakashi admits how painful Sakumo’s suicide to him, and it’s a nice touch. Regardless, he already told everything to Sakumo (sad that we didn’t see the storytime on screen, Kishimoto is too stingy T_T) and finally said that he understood his father just did everything he could have, just like him. And although it ended badly, he also understood the pain of already did your best but everything went to shit anyway, because he already told his tale and, considering him, complete with his failures to Sakumo. For some reason he wore mask in Purgatory, but still unlike with Sasuke he didn’t hide his emotion at all in front of Sakumo, solemnly said that he understood Sakumo and proud of him.
At that time, I, who saw Naruto in Kakashi’s P.O.V, felt a rare intense emotion from Kakashi for a long time after Kakashi Gaiden (damn that shit broke me good).
Then, Obito. Oh god, Obito. Not many Kakashi fans can’t handle Tobito reveal without going manic, I assure you that. Because in the dry land of Kakashi shipping so the most popular pairing is Kakashi with a guy whom he talks like 3 times in manga canon, Obito is undoubtedly a huge deal for Kakashi. And of course, his reveal managed to pull a glimpse of Kakashi’s plain emotion, something that I sadisticly appreciate XD. I love when character’s emotion affect me, but only rarely. I am weird like that.
Anyway, on their talk in Kamui land, Kakashi still tried to push the focus away from himself. Obito, you are this, Rin is this, Naruto is that. Even when Obito tried to talk about Kakashi’s guilt and suffering and how he doesn’t have to suffer anymore, he still didn’t talk about his own pain and just said that the Infinite Tsukuyomi plan can’t heal broken heart and how a heart can only be healed by people around you. And yes, saying that he was a trash is a form of self-deprecation so it doesn’t count.
Well, the talk was failed but thankfully Minato gave him a second chance. So Obito and Kakashi talk happened again with Obito started about how painful the loss of Rin for him and how bleak the world without Rin’s existence. Then, Kakashi did something that utterly surprised me.
“It might not have been a mistake, actually”
This is certified as the most illogical statement Kakashi even said in the whole franchise. Why? Because minutes before Obito practically tried to brainwash the whole world, killed people left and right while taunting that the world has no future, and whatever other hullaballo he caused toward Shinobi world. To say that Obito’s action might be right is as insensitive as Naruto declared that Sasuke’s action is understandable when minutes before he tried to kill Kakashi and Sakura. Thanks that only Minato can hear it, he was already dead anyway and surely he doesn’t mind that Obito’s action that resulted in his death might be not wrong in Kakashi’s opinion XD
But really, I bet that Minato understand. It’s not coincidence that he compared Obito and Kakashi with Naruto and Sasuke.
So Kakashi talks, properly this time. Kakashi opened up his soul and actually admit that, “you know, I understand your standpoint because damn, it hurts me so much so you must feel hurt like me too”. No sugar coating, no attempt to hide it with smile, Kakashi shows his plain sadness in front of Obito, to make Obito empathize with him. Thus, the mutual understanding is conveyed between Obito and Kakashi, and that’s probably one of the reason why Hagoromo praised Kakashi. Because in his attempt to stay as Obito’s friend, he got out from his comfort zone and did something that he has never done before, a.k.a, sigh, actually acknowledging his own emotion.
You have no idea how proud I am of him at that time. That’s also perhaps why he suddenly said “I love you” to Team 7 in Kaguya dimension. Still doesn’t mean that it didn’t shock me though, and considering the meltdown happened after that chapter, I am not the only one.
Tl:dr = I firmly believed that Kakashi is the example of how to write good adult character in kids media. Yes I am biased. Yes I don’t care, my point still stand.
#hatake kakashi#uzumaki naruto#haruno sakura#uchiha sasuke#uchiha obito#hatake sakumo#umino iruka#lazy to tag everything and everyone#Last month is Obito’s birth month#so it’s understandable that Obito fans go wild in your askbox at that month haha#Hope that this answer can help you a little#since I have a feeling that my thought getting too jumbled#again#meta answer#kakashi appreciation
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