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anxresi · 3 years

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I could line my wall with all the posts Thomas has made about Chloe tonight. (around 50, by my count)

If you wanna read them, don’t bother.

I certainly won’t be sharing any of them

What would be the point?

Because basically, they amount to one thing...

Chloe is bad, and we’re bad people for liking her.

That’s it.

And for anyone thinking that he kids around a lot with his comments...

I’m pretty sure this is something he feels VERY strongly about.

Or he wouldn’t expand so much energy in constantly talking her down.

So no, I don’t think we’re going to get a Chloe redemption.

No, I don’t think she’ll be Queen Bee again.

No, I can’t see any real change in her behavior.

She’ll just remain the same ol’ hatable Chloe, the ‘evil’ girl that young kids apparently ‘get’ that adults don’t understand...

Yep, apparently we’re ‘dumb’ for wanting her to improve and develop!

To provide a good example for bullies out there that they can be more than just abusers all their lives!

Children couldn’t possibly grasp the delicate subtleties of self-improvement as you grow up!

It’s all so clear now!

Stupid us!

Also, her merchandise doesn’t sell very well.

Another good case for her staying as a villain, I guess.

And she’s compared to a monster and a domestic abuser.

This damaged teenage girl.

Yeah, sounds about right.

And all those tender moments where she showed empathy and love were just ‘fake outs’ all along.

Makes total sense!

And anyone who wanted more from her is just ‘delusional’ and is ‘writing the show in their head’.

Exactly!

Except...

That’s not the way it seemed on screen at all.

When she hugged Miss Bustier

Or had a heart-to-heart with Ladybug

When she risked her life as Queen Bee

Showed genuine concern for Adrien

When she finally appreciated Jean-something

And shared moments of friendship with Sabrina

These did NOT come across as part of an elaborate plot twist

From a show which isn’t exactly known for its complex writing.

They seemed to form part of a ladder...

Which would inevitably climb to a true character shift.

Where this flawed teenage girl could take a long, hard look at her life.

And realize she didn’t HAVE to be like her awful mother.

Or as power-hungry as her father.

She could learn lessons from her favorite superhero Ladybug...

Become a better person...

And an even greater superhero.

She could still keep her sassy attitude.

Just be a bit kinder and selfless, that’s all.

But, nope.

EVERY bit of niceness we witnessed on screen...

None of it was real.

It was all influenced by ‘class’.

Even her childhood friendship with Adrien was nothing.

If he was as poor as the rest of his classmates, she would’ve bullied him too.

Straight from Thomas’s own mouth.

One of the best relationships in the show, gone just. Like. THAT.

He also said to ‘redeem’ her at this stage would be too ‘unconvincing’?

ORLY?

I hate to return to critical mode...

But the show ain’t exactly known for its consistent writing.

One minute Marinette is confident around Adrien...

Next she’s a nervous jumble of words.

It sets up two new ships for Mari and Adrien with great fanfare...

Only to ditch them both two eps later.

(Also, what the **** did they plan to do with Lila?!)

In other words, this isn’t a show that plays the long game

Whether this is to satisfy the networks’ demand to air the eps out of order idk.

The point is that trying to tell us that Chloe’s ‘arc’ was some grand scheme...

Where she’d have a few sympathetic moments only to emerge worst than ever afterwards....

I simply don’t believe it.

Either this is terrible, amateurish writing of the worst kind...

Or Thomas flexed his influence behind the scenes...

And put an abrupt end to Chloe’s development before it really got started.

It doesn’t really matter which reason I guess.

What DOES matter is this petty and spiteful man sees fit to bash her in around 70% of his online interactions right now.

He could just ignore the posts but nope, he goes right in there, full throttle.

You can just tell how smart he is with his intimate psychological breakdowns of why Chloe is the way she is...

When we all know the actual reason... he just couldn’t be bothered.

Far better to create a whole new character, give her none of the depths that could make a developed Chloe such a pain to write...

And then 'reward’ her with the position of Queen Bee, for being super-sweet and as shallow as a puddle.

And oops, make her Chloe’s half-sister or whatever to further rub salt in Chloe stans’ wounds.

Is the show even gonna tackle the angst that would arise from Mayor Andre discovering his beloved wife had an affair?

Or Chloe discovering her much-loved mother is in fact a cheat?

What about coping with the SHOCK revelation that she... GASP... has a long-lost sister?

Forget it. All that rich potential for human emotions sounds B O R I N G.

Don’t forget that if there’s a major event in this show that doesn’t include the words ‘Love Square’, the makers just don’t care.

Let’s cut straight to a giant golden Zoe (who now looks like a giant golden Chloe) trying to smoosh her now much smaller sister...

While Chloe pushes Marinette and her parents towards the beast to save herself.

Because of course she does.

Never misses a trick to make Chloe look bad, does Thomas.

It’s a skill you can tell he’s very proud of.

Anyway, back to Zoe...

Despite my harsh words above, I harbor no ill-will towards you.

Your design is decent and you seem like a stand-up gal.

But I hate to say this...

You shouldn’t exist.

It was completely unnecessary from a storytelling POV to create a sibling for Chloe, and your mere presence will diminish the show.

I can say this with utmost confidence after looking at the situation from every conceivable angle...

Without even needing to watch your eps or know why you were created.

(Although, I have a pretty good idea)

Some people might say WELL GIVE HER A CHANCE!!!!

Hmm... no.

Everything the show needs to be successful with Chloe’s character...

It’s already right there.

She does not need a secret sibling

She does not require a sweeter counterpart

And she definitely DOESN’T need Thomas constantly bashing her to impressionable fans online like she’s the Antichrist personified!

Seriously dude, if you hate her so much why bother creating her?

And if you hate her so much... why spend so long talking about her?

Despite his repeated denials, I think something another user here said is very true...

She DOES live ‘rent free’ in his head.

It sickens him that, despite his best efforts, she still has so many fans.

Not to worry, Thomas.

From what I see, there are still plenty of sycophants who agree with everything you say (even if they actually don’t)

After all, it’s enough for some to get a reply from the ‘great man’ himself

Why jeopardize that by trying to engage with him in a meaningful debate?

Especially when we know how handsy he is with the ‘block’ button.

Anyway, this went on for about a thousand more words than I meant it to.

I guess me and Thomas have just ONE thing in common (Thank God)

This is a topic which we both feel VERY strongly about.

The differently is of course, I have far less power in the process, and preach to a much smaller audience.

Still, I won’t let that stop me ranting away like a loon.

Hey, if it’s good enough for him... ;)

#miraculous ladybug #chloe bourgeois #Marinette Dupain-Cheng #adrien agreste #ml salt #ml rants #lila rossi

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angelofthequeers · 4 years

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How is Zoe's comic racist? (sorry don't mean to question you, genuinely curious) Also, I admit I was also sucked into the salt fic whirlpool, but quickly left after I realized how toxic it was being. Could you also elaborate on GalahadWilder, if it isn't too uncomfortable for you? I'm sorry, I don't mean to be rude, or ask uncomfortable questions.

I can’t point out everything off the top of my head but the racism (along with everything else but that’s not the focus) is a large part of what made me throw my hands up and write this. And I won’t be answering any more asks about any of this because I just want to get it out there so people know (because of how many people genuinely don’t see it) and then go back to trying to forget that this shit ever existed, rather than dragging out some new fandom drama. Also keep in mind that while I’m West Asian/Arab, I’m also white-passing so if I get anything wrong, I appreciate call-outs. (Also I finally got my laptop charger today so I can snip my posts again 😭)

Her treatment of Max in ‘Gamer’.

It’s not unique to her; it’s a very common salter thing to utterly tear into Max for being a “sexist jerk” and daring to underestimate princess Marinette because she’s a girl. Never mind that they canonically aren’t close friends because of Chloé’s bullying, so Max probably had no idea that Marinette’s liked video games all this time, where Adrien is the new boy so it’s just one more thing to learn about him.

It’s especially heinous compared to how the other classmates are treated far more leniently for their own mistakes - they still get salted on but Max, aka the Black boy, always seems to get singled out and held to higher standards. Just look at ‘Chameleon’ and how the other classmates are mildly to moderately attacked by salters but Max gets utterly ripped to shreds because he “should know better”. (Never mind that just because he’s smart doesn’t mean he’s good at human interaction. They just want to attack him).

It also angers me because people like Nathaniel and Ivan are absolved of what they do as akumas (like kidnapping others and literally forcing someone to go on a date with them) because they couldn’t help it, yet Max is literally held responsible for what he did when akumatised (because he dared to go after Princess Marinette) and even for daring to get akumatised in the first place. Both these things just make him a sore loser, apparently.

So SL ‘Gamer’ was the final straw for me, especially with how she characterised Max as a smug arsehole, and it made me so angry that I just exploded to my friends, but I didn’t know how to directly call it out without looking like a petty bitch.

Here’s a post I made about salters and ‘Gamer’ if you’re interested in a more coherent and in-depth thing about it.

Alya’s treatment throughout the whole thing.

In canon, she’s an enthusiastic and passionate girl who sometimes gets carried away and goes too far and who idolises Ladybug because Ladybug stands against evil. Here? She’s treated as the butt of the joke for being so starry-eyed over superheroes that she idolises Scarlet Lady while Marinette mocks her behind her back. Never mind her iconic line of “all that is needed for the triumph of evil is that good people do nothing” and this is why she loves Majestia in the first place. Never mind that she loves Ladybug because Ladybug is kind and passionate and strong and creative. Canon Alya wouldn’t want a bar of Scarlet Lady, who just sits around complaining, and yet SL!Alya worships her because...why? Running joke? The only Black girl in the series is treated as a gag to be made fun of by someone who’s supposed to be her best friend, just for the audience’s amusement. Marinette’s probably meant to look funny and relatable here, but she just looks like a major bitch to her new friend. Alya’s flaws are basically blown up and exaggerated for comedic effect, while Marinette in contrast is airbrushed to perfection, with no flaws and no anxiety that was only alleviated in canon by - guess what - being Ladybug.

It’s like Zoe wants to stick to canon while adding her own little “fun” twists for humour, like making Marinette snarky and perfect (which just makes her look like an utter bitch) and in the case of Alya, it does her so dirty that even Lila is more sympathetic. LILA. After SL humiliates Lila, Alya looks doubtful but buys some bullshit excuse so that she can continue to be the Scar-worshipping idiot. And then in the aftermath, her concern isn’t for Lila, the girl who was humiliated and bullied by a literal superhero and then ended up sick. No, she’s angry because...Lila lied on her blog. The blog that doesn’t have nearly as much recognition as in canon because SL would never validate her, unlike Ladybug. So her passion for her blog is exaggerated to imply that she’d say that a girl deserves to be bullied and sick because she told a few lies (since at this point, Alya doesn’t know about any possible malice on Lila’s part, just as in canon. All that’s known is the lying for attention).

It’s horrible hypocrisy, where Alya is held to higher standards than the other (white) characters and when she fails to meet those standards, she’s torn into. She’s not afforded any sympathy for being hurt that Lila lied to her; in fact, she’s demonised for feeling hurt, especially because of the running joke that her blog is focused on someone so horrible and she doesn’t see that. Lila is presented as the sympathetic one here. LILA. Just because Alya dared to believe her in canon.

Also, how she’s constantly trying to either tease Marinette for having a crush or insist that Marinette’s only doing what she does because of a crush...even though according to this ‘verse’s canon, Marinette is too good to make mistakes and do obsessive stuff over a crush, which is why canon Alya thinks this about her in the first place. That didn’t just come out of nowhere in the show purely for “woe is Marinette, her best friend doubts her”.

Like in the first part of ‘Gamer’, where she’s accusing Marinette of only entering the tournament to flirt with Adrien while Marinette so “coolly and calmly” rebuts her...why? By the ‘verse’s own logic, Marinette isn’t a flustered mess around Adrien. The only purpose of this scene is to glorify Marinette and her amazing calmness while making Alya look like a nosy idiot who dares to doubt her best friend. The logic of the ‘verse and of canon clash really jarringly in moments like this, and it becomes clear that the only purpose of these moments is to make Marinette look better at the expense of others. Most often her best friend, who’s an utter idiot for not seeing Scarlet Lady’s true nature and just can’t keep her nose out of Marinette’s business and so comes to wrong conclusions. Why are Marinette and Alya even friends in this ‘verse? SL!Marinette’s been nothing but condescending towards Alya most of the time.

Uh, and also the way she occasionally whitewashes Alya. Just look at the SL headers. She literally made Alya, aka a Black girl who’s one of the good guys, lighter than Lila, aka a white girl who’s one of the bad guys and not even that tanned in canon. Why do people make one of the villains darker and often whitewash one of the heroes? It’s not that hard to figure out.

(Also the way she really played into the aggressive Black girl stereotype in ‘Horrificator’ over a minor argument, even physically threatening Nino. Why? Literally why did she have to go full-on aggressive instead of just looking angry and scolding him or something?)

This all might not be conscious on Zoe’s part but the way Alya is treated is still disgusting, especially if you’re operating on internalised salt from other aspects of the salty fandom. I’ve seen her claims that she’s trying to help Alya improve and she’s not being salty but...even if she’s not being consciously salty, her salt is definitely still leaking over it and part of that salt includes racism. I also don’t see how making Alya a joke and exaggerating her flaws is helping her to improve when there was plenty to go off in canon but, well, that might just be me.

Even Marinette, who’s pretty much treated as white for 99% of it.

Marinette, aka the girl who’s only made visibly “Asian/Other” in SL ‘Reflekta’ with her Chinese-inspired Black Cat suit and name which is a one-off, while her permanent Bee outfit is just the bland tight suit that salters criticise Ladybug for having and her name is just Marigold. It comes across as using “Asianness” as a costume and it really didn’t sit right with me at first, but it took me a while to tease out why exactly this made me feel ick.

There’s nothing wrong with touching more on Marinette’s heritage and expanding on it in ways that the show doesn’t, especially because this is a big sticking point for salters, but again...it’s only a one-off. A costume. There aren’t casual hints sprinkled throughout the comic that just normally establish Marinette as half-Chinese, aside from like a page or two in ‘Timebreaker’ showing Sabine’s outfit. It’s another ‘Kung Food’ where it’s slammed into one episode and shoved into our faces that Marinette Is Chinese and it’s really jarring and unpleasant.

It just comes across as fetishising, is all. I don’t think it’s something most people would pick up on unless they’re used to being able to see this kind of thing.

Master Fu. Oh, Master Fu.

From an old man who made mistakes but tried as best as he could with the limited knowledge he had, he’s now a bumbling idiot who...put the earrings in Marinette’s bag instead of her room for some reason? To kickstart the plot? Especially because the ring was still in Adrien’s room. It’s very, very contrived.

And then in one of the most recent updates, Zoe has Adrien - a white boy - physically threaten Fu, aka an elderly Asian man. It’s disgusting. I was gobsmacked when I first saw it. And that’s the thing with salters: they tear into Adrien for being a white boy so they can look Enlightened when he hasn’t actually done anything racist, yet they then turn around and perpetuate actual racism in trying to “fix” him

There’s probably more but those are the examples that jump out at me of the racism in SL. There are plenty more problems but...whatever. I’ll be here all day if I try and cover those.

As for the Galahad thing...it’s personal. That original post was as much as I was comfortable revealing.

#ask #aotq babbles #miraculous ladybug #ml fandom salt #yeah there’s a lot here lmao #cw racism #antiblackness #ml analysis

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whenimgoodandready · 4 years

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You ever lost something in your life? Like a prized possession? Or a great opportunity that would’ve changed your life forever? Or even a loved one? I know I did, I lost all three of those! (mostly the third option). I had some nice treasures of mine that might’ve been misplaced, a lot of situations where I could’ve come out victorious and happy and even met some really nice people throughout my life only to lose them and never see them again. It’s sad. (sigh) That’s life, you love, you lost and it repeats. We must enjoy it while we can and if we do end up losing it, we still have our memories to look back on it and learn from our mistakes. Besides, we can still look forward to the new joys we’ll experience in life and if we’re lucky, we can keep it! Have our heroes learned to do that? Check it out!

Battle of the Miraculous

*Part 1:Heart Hunter-For the longest time, this was titled as “Loveater”, but now it’s just Heart Hunter....I don’t know why, maybe cuz of the copyright, I was just naming what was accurate. Anyways, it’s the Bourgeois’s anniversary and Gabe deliberately upsets the two by getting them into an argument over his present which is a type of “Get-Along sweater” and them becoming a giant Pac Man akuma that shoots/eats love cuz they seem to lack it between each other. They looked pretty stupid, I had a better image in my mind. I mean, it was built up to be this badass like villain that could destroy love and that got us all concerned for the love square and yet, w-we got a two-faced video game parody baddie! It’s a juvenile show, whattaya gonna do? Another thing is why the f*ck was Mayura in this! I thought Hawk Moth deliberately made it clear in “Ladybug”, which came after this, that she had to stop cuz it was worsening Nats health! (throws hands in the air) He doesn’t care, I give up with this guy, why the f*ck would I believe him!? HE’S MAD AND DESPERATE! F*ck Gabe/Hawk Moth! During that time, we see some nice moments of Lukanette, Adrigami and some Adrigaminette! We also see things we were dying for such as Marinette with her hair down (spoiled by “Cat Blanc” unfortunately) and Master Fu as Jade F*cking Turtle! Hallelujah! So they were savin’ that up for this finale huh, well, it’s about f*cking time! :P. This also marked as the death of the love square since Adrien/Cat Noir has finally learned to move on from Ladybug and pursue Kagami/Ryuko and Marinette/Ladybug considering the same for Adrien. Now you would think that since it’s the Bourgeois family akumatized, it would be the appropriate opportunity for Chloe to be given back her miraculous already, but she’s ignored yet again and this was the last straw for her. This can go about two ways: A.Ladybug refused to have Queen Bee cuz either she was exposed or she couldn’t stand her nagging her about giving her a miraculous or B.She chose Ryuko instead, despite her being exposed as well, either cuz she really needed her power to stop the villain or cuz she was trying to c*ckblock Adrigami (possibly the latter). The end I could relate to on Marinette breaking down over her full plate of responsibilities (and accidentally letting Hawk Moth know that Master Fu was the guardian when she forgot to detransform to meet up with him cuz she had a lot on her mind) cuz I’ve been through the same thing where I had to put up a tough front after making a huge mistake only to be unable to bottle it up for long and just burst into tears and have to be comforted by a loved one. It’s not easy and it doesn’t feel so good and you’re gonna need support to let it all out and let people know how you really feel.

—————————————

*Part 2:Miracle Queen-I had an entirely different look for Miracle Queen in my head, but the canon look for her was basically what you can call as “Malibu Stacy with new hat”....yeah....just like that....Lame. Hawk Moth manipulates her anger at being constantly denied the bee miraculous and it’s what akumatizes her willingly as her third villainess form. Since she was forced to give up her superhero duties, she went with the idea of “If I can’t be a superhero, then there will be no superheroes!” and uses her hornet army to brainwash everyone in Paris and have all the members of Team Miraculous (minus the dynamic duo and Bunnyx) to expose themselves. (sigh) Well, guess we won’t be seeing them anymore in the show.......I think. The thing about it is, we need to remember that Chloe having a miraculous didn’t make her a better person like Marinette/Ladybug hoped, it made her worse! Everything she did as Queen Bee was mostly to help benefit herself. Unless she starts learning to think of others before herself, she’s banished from Team Miraculous! At last, we saw Dragonbug and Snake Noir in their combined Kwamies and I gotta say, Snake Noir was an improvement from Aspik, least in this case he had his own power to help save the day with the snake miraculous instead of just the snake. Much better! Now in the end, Master Fu passed on his guardianship to Ladybug and by doing so erased his memory of the miraculous duties to keep them a secret and what made Hawk Moth give up when it got too much for him to handle. Ha! Ha! Loser! Farewell, Fu! You will be missed, Thank you! It’s implied in the end that Adrigami and Lukanette just might be canon now that the heroes have moved on, but it’s probably for their future character developements until the true ship becomes endgame *cough*theicecreamstheclue*cough*.

My final thoughts on this ep before the whole season here, after what Cat Noir learned in the previous ep, “Ladybug”, he finally got the hint that there was no future between him and his lady (which he also stopped calling her!) and that he should settle for what he can get. Marinette however, was reluctant to move on from Adrien as she’s still insecure about herself, but did so so she won’t interfere between Adrigami and make herself look bad for trying to seperate them (Pssst, it’s not permanent so you can calm down). It might be good for them though, they did a good job saving the day without all that love distracting them. Maybe they’ll be more competent than ever! Ryuko had come back! My friend was right! Lol! Here I thought she wasn’t gonna return! But is it serious now along with every other hero that’s been exposed!? (they’re on the poster for Season 4! (shrugs)). What we learned from Master Fu was when you pass on your guardianship, you lose your memories of what was related to it for safety reasons! Whoa! Now that it’s passed onto Marinette/Ladybug, does this mean she’s gonna suffer the same thing when she passes it on! That’s tearjerker worthy! :’(. Oh boy! As if balancing her social/love/school life and her superhero duties weren’t bad enough, she’s now the new guardian of the Miracule Box! Poor thing. Here come the headaches! Kinda feel bad for Chloe. Sure she was manipulated by Hawk Moth over her ignored hero duties by her own idol constantly, but she still willingly took the bait, after she refused the other time!, and now she renounced her worship of Ladybug and hates her as much as Lila does! How will this go next season? Well, rumor has it she’s getting akumatized yet again! (is this a seasonal running gag for her?). We are getting a new Queen Bee and I know damn well Chloes gonna hate that. However, maybe that means she’ll finally get that redemption arc the fans have been praying for? Fingers crossed. Gabe fixed the peacock miraculous though cuz he now has the deciphered notes Nat stole from Master Fu! Now he’ll be stronger than ever with Mayura! Don! Don! Don! This has been yet another “interesting” season. We got some answers, we got some questions still left answered and we got some new questions we need answers to! Let’s recap on went on:Lila is back and is finally a reoccurring character (only when we need the plot to be drivin’) and she’s gone to the dark side working both for Gabriel and Hawk Moth, we saw Thomas Astruc in animated form and the original concept work of “What-Could’ve-Been” for the show which is now a show-within-a-show using the “Ladybug PV”, we saw new villains and the new beings, sentimonsters, by Mayura and how they’re created/destroyed and some returning villains that came back stronger, new heroes from the miraculouses the fans predicted, Chloe was forced to retire as Queen Bee cuz her identity was exposed and now she too went to the dark side, we almost got the love square complete a few times before the reset button was pushed, we learned the history of Master Fu’s big mistake, Marinette and Kagami became friends, there’s gonna be a new Hawk Moth in the future! We finally saw the long awaited Cat Blanc that was major! and even (disappointedly) Felix (sadly no “Bridgette”) and much more. News from the next season, Luka and Kagami will be akumatized again, we’ll get new heroes, Kwamies, outfits and powers, we might still get the Halloween and Chinese Legend specials (Oh God! Please do!), there will be an episode with the the “OMG” factor as “Cat Blanc” and a new location called Swan Island! Sweet! Can’t wait! See you guys in the Fall when Season 4 comes out! I’ll be back with new ladybug frames for the reviews and gifs! Good-bye for now dear Miraculers!

#miraculous ladybug #battle of the miraculous #heart hunter #miracle queen

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