#god of destruction toppo
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I found this old thing I never posted.
Let's be practical, people.
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ULTRA EGO EXPLAINED
"Wagamamma Gokui" A.K.A. "Ultra Ego." A form that Vegeta says isn't to be compared to Goku's Ultra Instinct, but ironically he still compares and gives it a similar name.
But, what are the abilities of Ultra Ego? Well, many fans say that it gives Vegeta...
The ability to use Hakai energy at a God of Destruction level.
The ability to get stronger from taking damage.
Even though the DBS manga illustrates that Vegeta gets stronger from taking damage when in his Ultra Ego transformation, Ultra Ego DOES NOT give Vegeta the ability to turn damage into fuel. How bold of me to disagree with what is said and shown to the reader!! Well... I have my reasons.
TLDR; Ultra Ego is actually the amplification of your natural abilities & personality along with the ability to use God of Destruction power to a higher degree.
To fully understand my reasoning, let's look at Vegeta's abilities & Ultra Ego's "abilities."
SAIYAN ABILITIES vs ULTRA EGO
VEGETA:
"SAIYAN-POWER": Vegeta gets stronger from taking damage due to the innate Saiyan ability to get stronger during battle. And the thrill of combat is what Saiyans live for.
ULTRA EGO:
"BATTLE SOUL": While taking damage in this transformed state, Vegeta grows stronger due to his so-called "battle soul" burning hot. And as a Saiyan, the thrill of combat is what he lives for.
VEGETA:
HAKAI TECHNIQUE: Vegeta learned how to use Hakai energy from Beerus.
ULTRA EGO:
HAKAI TECHNIQUE: While in this transformed state, Vegeta is granted greater power to create stronger Hakai attacks that he could not perform prior to this God of Destruction transformation.
VEGETA:
ATTITUDE: Arrogant.
ULTRA EGO:
ATTITUDE: Egomaniac.
Now, what I stated at the begining is making sense. Saiyans already get stronger from taking damage & Vegeta can use the Hakai technique in his base form. Ultra Ego is meant to greatly amplify what Vegeta can naturally do & has learned.
Furthermore, we can examine the traits of another mortal who used a God of Destruction transformation; Toppo from the DBS Anime Continuity.
THE POWER OF A GOD OF DESTRUCTION
TOPPO
VEGETA
Ultra Ego is simply a God of Destruction transformation that alters the appearance, greatly amplifies power & natural abilities, & allows the user to use GoD level Hakai attacks.
It's literally the same type of power as Toppo's Hakaishin form from the DBS Anime Continuity, except Anime Toppo & Manga Vegeta use Hakai abilities differently. The manga decides to shift focus soley on a single type of Hakai attack; the "explosive" Hakai. But there are other Hakai techniques performed in both the anime continuity & manga continuity; Explosive, Sand, Disenigration.
TO SUMMARIZE:
WHAT IS ULTRA EGO?
Obviously, Ultra Ego is simply God of Destruction power just as the title for DBS Chapter 75 informs us. Vegeta just makes up a name for the power on the fly.
WHAT DOES GOD OF DESTRUCTION POWER DO?
Beerus taught Vegeta that GoD power is unbounded. Meaning "Ultra Ego" is a type of limit-breaking power. Similarly, the limit-breaking power of SSBE is referred to as "boundless energy."
However, Ultra Ego allows you to push yourself beyond your limit until you completely exhaust yourself & fall out of the GoD transformation. SSBE doesn't let the body get pushed to such an extreme that leaves you completely vulnerable for the sake of power that will burn out.
We can conclude that what the limit-breaking power of "Ultra Ego" does is...
alter the appearance of a mortal using the GoD form
increase strength & durability
enhance the natural abilities & the strength of techniques
grant the user to use GoD level Hakai attacks
amplify the personality of the user
EXTRA:
By looking at context clues & using some deductive reasoning, it appears that ONLY when Vegeta is engaged in battle while using the Ultra Ego form, there is "no limit" for his God of Destruction power.
But, since Vegeta is not a true GoD like Beerus, once Vegeta runs out of "fuel" or when he powers down from his Ultra Ego form, the extra strength that he gained through taking damage during combat is gone because the power boosts leave when the Ultra Ego power leaves. Vegeta will have to restart his power progression all over again whenever he transforms back into Ultra Ego.
From my understanding, Ultra Ego appears to function something like this...
#Ultra Ego#God of Destruction Power#Vegeta#Toppo#DBS manga#DBS anime#DBS#DBZ#DB#Saiyans become more arrogant the stronger they get + GoD power amplifies the personality & gives a huge power boost = Ultra Egomaniac Veget#also the eyes of Toppo & Vegeta become a purple color when they use God of Destruction transformations#and both Vegeta & Toppo have bulging veins in while their GoD forms#sorry for being repetitive with some words 😅 i might edit it later
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Trash Deserves to be Tossed!
Toppo vs Frieza in Day 23 of Dragon Ball Madness
#dbz#dragon ball z#dragon ball super#db super#dbz fanart#fanart#toppo#golden frieza#frieza#dbz frieza#freeza#god of destruction
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Dragon Ball Super Manga ch. 27-29
“Welp, this tournament of power’s not gonna instigate itself!”
I’ve been impressed with Toyotaro’s leaner, meaner versions of the Universe 6 and Zamasu sagas, so I was hoping he would work the same magic on the build-up to the Tournament of Power. Unfortunately, I’m a bit disappointed. I think Episodes 68-96 anime took way too long to get there, but Chapters 27-32 of the manga seem to go too quickly. I guess that shouldn’t surprise me, as there’s a lot of middle ground between 29 anime episodes and six manga chapters.
So you know the drill. I’m going to highlight stuff that the manga did differently, starting with this Beerus/Vegeta rematch that happens right before Goku goes to Beerus’ planet and reminds Zeno of the tournament he promised.
This always struck me as a plot dangler from the anime, because we see Goku and Vegeta get a lot stronger over the course of DBS, and yet we never find out if they‘ve improved enough to match Beerus. Sure, Beerus clobbered them both in Battle of Gods, but now they know how to do Super Saiyan Blue. Well, in this chapter, Beerus scoffs at the idea that the Saiyans will ever be his rivals, and the Oracle Fish insists that it’s true, so he challenges Vegeta to see what progress he’s made.
And the answer is “not enough”, though Vegeta does a lot better than he did the last time he fought Beerus, so there’s no shame in it.
Of course, this doesn’t take into account Goku’s Super Saiyan Blue Kaio-ken level, but that doesn’t exist in the manga. Instead we have this “Completed” Super Saiyan Blue form, where Goku learned how to perfect the transformation. Vegeta reveals he can do the same thing in this chapter, but it’s still not enough.
We also get this scene in Grand Zenos’ Palace where they discuss the problem of too many universes before Goku arrives. The Zenos are playing some sort of game involving the universes, and they each note how there’s too many of them, and since the mortals aren’t developing much in most of the universes, there’s little point in observing them all. So they contemplate erasing eight universes, and that’s when Goku shows up to talk about the tournament.
So we get a bunch of scenes where the gods are summoned to Zeno’s palace for the announcement. In particular, I’m confused by this one of Sidra and Roh discussing the destruction of a planet. Unlike Beerus, Sidrah seems to take the job very seriously, and he carefully calculates the pros and cons of his decision before acting. Also, Roh seems very interested in the process. This would be weird enough, but in the anime, these two are shown to be a lot more craven and opportunistic. So I’m not sure what to take from this.
At the palace, the Grand Minister asks about the extra guy in the Universe 11 contingent, and Belmod introduces Toppo as his apprentice, as he plans to retire soon. In the anime, Toppo is introduced as Khai’s bodyguard, and I’m pretty sure the “Candidate God of Destruction” thing will get brought up later, but it’s strange that they didn’t explain it in his debut.
I guess I’ll talk about it here, since this seems to be the first time it gets brought up. Beerus and Whis have hinted at the idea of Goku or Vegeta training to take Beerus’ place someday, but the Saiyans don’t seem interested in the job, so it never goes anywhere. With Toppo, we have confirmation that mortals can be promoted to the rank of Hakaishin, which implies that Belmod and all the other Destroyers were once mortals themselves.
So the Grand Minister announces the Tournament, but the Zeno from the destroyed timeline doesn’t know what a martial arts match is like, so we get the Zeno Expo. But in this version, it’s a battle royale of all the Destroyers.
It starts out as an 11-on-1 fight against Beerus, partly because they blame him for Goku getting them into this mess, and also they’re still sore at him for the trouble he caused long ago. According to Whis, Zeno held a hide-and-seek tournament, and Beerus fell asleep during it and ruined the whole thing. The others managed to calm Zeno down, but they’ve resented Beerus for it ever since.
But Beerus does surprisingly well, and soon enough, the other Destroyers begin to turn on one another in an effort to win.
Oh, and here’s this bonus comic where Trunks decides to return to his own timeline, or at least an altered version of it. This doesn’t make a lot of sense, given how this was Whis’ idea, and Trunks wouldn’t have considered this on his own.
Back to the rumble, a bunch of stuff happens, and it’s hard to keep track of any of it, which is probably by design, since not even the Zenos can follow any of this.
So the Grand Minister calls off the match and disqualifies everyone. Zeno nearly abandons the Tournament idea altogether, when Goku asks him to give it another chance, since mortal battles won’t be anything like that.
Fortunately, there’s a mortal in the house who can face off with Goku, and this gives the Zenos a chance to road test some new rules. No weapons, no killing, and no flying. Apparently these are all for the sake of making the action more fun for the Zenos to watch. I don’t get the no-flying thing, but the Tournament of Power was a great time, so I guess the Zenos know what they’re doing. I mean, you don’t become the Kings of Everything without knowing a thing or two.
Goku transforms, which excites the Zenos, so they want to see all of Goku’s transformations. He goes to Super Saiyan 2, which is always a treat to see, but the Zenos aren’t thrilled with this one, so Goku has to go to Super Saiyan 3 right away. Look, Zenos, you may be all powerful, but Super Saiyan 2 Goku kicks ass. Maybe you’ll understand when you’re older.
Soon enough Goku ramps up to Super Saiyan God, and all the Destroyers are impressed to see him fighting at that level. Wait, if they’re fighting at the same level, then how is this any easier for the Zenos to follow?
Goku tries to polish Toppo off by turning Super Saiyan Blue, but Toppo takes him to Dick Kick City first, and wins the match by ring-out.
So yeah, Toppo wins clean. How about that?
#dragon ball#dragon ball super manga#2023dbapocryphaliveblog#goku#beerus#whis#vegeta#grand zeno#grand minister#supreme kai#top#toppo#trunks#goten#mai#bulma#i'm not tagging all the gods and angels#you do it i'm bitter
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Will the omniking or grand priest show up?
I'm not sure if this ask, also from 2019, was about my Broly AU or Zamai AU.
If it was about the Zamai AU, then YES!
One of my favorite things I never got around to was the Omniking and Grand Priest showing up.
Rough idea, as I only talked about it in conversations and never wrote it down completely:
Blahblahblah, Zamasu and the others kill Black and Zamasu ends up kinda-helping the earthlings rebuild. Zamasu considers himself the new god while Mai and Trunks are like 'sure bro' and then one day the Grand Priest shows up and Zamasu didn't even know he existed. So. That was a shock.... I might actually have something for that...
I DID??? Old art from 2019, woo!
But yeah, he showed up cause Omniking finally noticed everyone was like. Dead. My memory is a little fuzzy but I know all the empty universes are erased and Zamasu/Mai/Trunks manage to bullshit talk their way into their universe being spared.
That scenario ended with Zamasu being Supreme Kai, Toppo moving to their universe to be a God of Destruction, and Whis being brought back with Toppo.
The reasoning being Zamasu is the only Supreme Kai (in training) left. Toppo is the only GOD (in training) left and Whis is the Angel of Trunks/Mai's universe. So. Some variety there.
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I’m not sure why this is such a missed part about the manga version of the ToP.
During the exhibition match all of the Gods of destruction start letting loose and then they get to a point where Zeno stops seeing them. The match is stopped. Then after that Toppo verifies that Jiren is stronger than their GoD.
Later on, Goku fights Jiren in Ultra Instinct and suddenly it’s never brought up again that Zeno can’t see what’s happening despite these characters being around the same level of power.
It’s as if this entire part is completely glossed over. Why is that?
Probably for the same reason it's said that the GoDs struggle to learn Ultra Instinct only for Beerus to then say that's a technique for Angels and they don't bother with it in order to introduce "Ultra Ego".
Because Toyotaro wings it without skill.
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If Team BLCK Ever did Participate in the Tournament of Power and it Had An Announcer....
So I had some brainworms since I thought about Record of Ragnarok and Dragonball thanks to @divinityunleashed and @ancicntforged talkin' and such.
Sooo... heres something I kind of cooked up.
________________
A hooded man wearing some sort of mask with goggles included sat on top of a podium smiling a bit as he stood up. Grabbing what seemed to be some sort of microphone. "Well folks from across all universes!!! I hope you are getting hyped up because we are now entering Round Five of the Tournament of Power!!!! This time we have the most interesting match up for you! Starting with this man!!!!" The announcer said pointing towards one side of the arena with a large cloaked black figure walking out into the arena.
"It was said that Universe eleven a universe that shares itself with Universe two, suffered from a great wave of darkness therefore something was forged in order to combat the problems across their galaxies. That being the Pride Troopers!!! Many of them came in all shapes and sizes, different levels of strength alike and further more with one of them becoming a God of Destruction!!" They said with the Pride Troopers looking on with pride in their eyes especially Dyspo and Jiren.
"Yet, this man was someone who lives by the ideals of Justice! Willing to go as far as to help others when they cry out for help! Going as far as to place his own body and willpower against all odds! All of this alone was enough to make him into a candidate for the God of Destruction of Universe eleven!!!! Even so much so using that power against the Destructive Emperor Frieza of Universe Seven!!! The Leader of the Pride Troopers! The Man Who Brings Justice!!! The Bold Justice of the Pride Troopers!!! " The announcer continued as the cloaked figure took of their cloak revealing themselves in their red and black outfit and striking a pose.
PRIDE TROOPER CAPTAIN, TOPPO
"TOOOOOOOOPPOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
The announcer shouted revealing Toppo in his full glory while all of Universe Eleven with everyone cheering happily and children grabbing their toppo figures and showing it off in support for him. With the Pride Troopers saluting him as a means of wishing him luck.
"Now! on this side is this man!!!!!"
Another cloaked man would walk through the tunnel grinning while having a cigar in his mouth. "In the world of Remnant there are many warriors there who are forged by legends and myths. Such as the Great Susanoo, The Knights of Solitas, and The Silver Eyed Warriors! However amongst all there is one place where everyone is forged in and that is in the desert kingdom of-"
"VACUO!!!!!!"
A crowd of Vacuans shouted as the man in the tunnel heard their cheers. "Amongst all of them there is one who was forged by the fires there. Originally he was the weakest in Vacuo but then he was forged in the fires of Vacuo by training with the Atelier Paladins, Then trained with the prestigious hunter academies of Signal and Beacon Academy!!! However, when darkness would encroach the land of Remnant he and four others would march straight into it! Despite being given the order to not challenge the number one ranked Scion of Salem, he went ahead and fought him anyways and lived to tell the tale!!!!!"
The cloaked man would walk out of the tunnel and into the arena with a Spartans helmet over his head his eyes focused on his opponent as he shot a glare at Toppo.
"Therefore when he was told again to stand out of the way of the Schnee Dust Company which began to mine all of Vacuos precious dust resources. He would be the first to defy Atlas and unify all Hunters, Tribesmen, and Bandits underneath one banner to stand with him! This the leader of the Desertwalkers! The Man Who Defies Orders!!!!"
HIDEYOSHI PHALANX: 3RD STRONGEST S-RANK HUNTER IN REMNANT
"HIDEYOSHI PHALAAAAAAAAANX!!!!!!!!"
The announcer shouted with everyone on Remnants side all cheering for Hideyoshi with even the Desertwalkers all posed up with a look of determination their arms crossed glaring at the Pride Troopers.
"The Tournament of Power Round Five! The Bold Justice of the Pride Troopers, Toppo! Versus The Strongest Hunter Of Vacuo, Hideyoshi Phalanx! Ready FIGHT!!!!"
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Drawings of Dragon Balk Z/Super Characters:
Burter
Jeice
God Of Destruction Toppo
Kakunsa
Bergamo
Berserk Kale
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AU where Ox King literally lives up to his original myth: Great Sage who Pacifies the Heaven. He literally able to go toe-to-toe with the strongest God of Destruction and his strength was exposed thanks to the fact that Chichi had a light spar with Kale and Caulifla when they were drunk and Chichi easily handle Caulifla even after she was transformed into SSJ.
Following this post of mine:
Ok so, maybe not drunk but tipsy.
Chichi told the story about how she got married with Goku and Kale and Caulifla were like "wtf? you're a martial artist? can we spar?" and to everyone surprise, Chichi was able to flung Kale with ease. Then came Caulifla, Chichi was literally able to go toe-to-toe with her in her SSJ form.
And they were like "wtf? how did you do that despite not having much ki at all?" But the other Gods noticed that she was able to fight back by utilizing/manipulating the ki of her surroundings instead of using hers, which means her energy is pretty much limitless. Adding to the fact that Chichi counters Caulifla move is unusual in a way (I'm thinking Tai Chi here since everyone in Dragon Ball loves flashy hard moves), her win is pretty easy.
Beerus was like "why the fuck didn't you bring your wife to the ToP back then?" and Goku was like "Can't help it, she doesn't want to" and Gohan and Goten was like "Was mom ever that strong?" And Goku was like "What do you mean? you already know how strong your mom is." And Chichi was bragging and all and says "It's nothing, your grandpa is way stronger" and that reminded Goku on the day he first try to spar with the Ox King before he married Chichi, and the Ox King literally knocked him out cold with just a flick of his finger ending the match in less than a second. And Goku was like "yeah, that happened. How did I forget that?"
Toppo (or whatever character you want here) for some reason intrigued by this since they were drinking together and asked him if they could spar. And the Ox King was like, "Sure, but I'm already rusty." The moment before they spar, the whole Ox King nature changed. He oozed so much pressure that everyone, especially the Gods, felt the whole planet where they had a picnic in, tremble. Toppo was almost down on his knees at this point because of the said pressure.
Anyway, he won win with ease and yeah, I have a lot more continuation in my head but my fingers are tired of typing. But yeah, that's it.
#chichi#ox king#dbz goku#goku x chichi#dbs#dragon ball super#Post ToP arc#He has so much potential to his character I feel like I need to bring hi#him out to the table#Come on#I need to have thr myth to be real
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i still think toppo should have been hella fucking disqualified for becoming a god of destruction during the tournament of power. he had no way of knowing for sure that frieza would survive an attempt to Destroy him, and there's no fucking way successfully Destroying someone wouldn't count as killing them for the tournament rules. and besides, it was a tournament for fucking mortals, not gods >:/
#stfu blue#dragon ball super#fuck you belmod#like toppo even SAYS RIGHT AFTER THAT. 'i could easily destroy you but i would be disqualified'. BRO.
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Daishinkan loves your laughter, even as you wheeze and gasp in the process, making the sounds of a hyena laughing and a dying seagull screaming at the same time. He stands next to Zeno, the two assholes oblivious to your insanity, literally feigning indifference with their entire appearance, but they're definitely smiling and giggling quietly.
(Or they look boredly at you, at each other with a facial expression like "wow, that long, that's a record.")
I'm laughing wildly because of Belmond. Not only is he a real clown, but he's a god of destruction. Clown God of Destruction!!!
If Toppo from Team Pride is in Zeno's Temple, I can already imagine him seeing me for the first time, looking confused and waiting for me to finish laughing. Marcarita and Kayoshin are like "it's okay, it's normal. You'll get used to it"
I see the Pride team and ask Zeno and Daishinkan if they can hear the fucking theme song of those rangers or if I'm going crazy
Daishikan is use to it and it even got to the point where he would start laughing with you. The G.O.Ds, Kai’s, and angels would be confused but the angels wouldn’t mind it they would just be happy to see their father happy. They would be so wholesome while you and Daishikan are laughing like crazy hyena
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Beerus surrounds himself in an aura of his destruction god energy like God of Destruction Toppo. It will shield him from Flandre Scarlet's anti material apple projectiles she uses against Yuuma Toutetsu. Beerus has fought small targets like Gotenks the fusion of Trunks and Goten and casually held onto him like a ragdoll. Beerus's Hakai energy can kill ghosts it will work on Flandre Scarlet who scales to Remillia Scarlet in durability had most of her body destroyed from a rocket engines flames.
I said this before but, I haven't even played Ibun. She uses apples? Lmao.
Also, where the heck did you hear about Remilia losing most of her body from rocket engines? Are you taoking about Silent Sinner in Blue? That doesn't even happen.
She gets her hand burned to black by the magic Patchouli had on the rocket. Her hand. Unless there was another rocket at some point that didn't happen.
#touhou#ask#dragon ball#who are we arguing with here?#I havent seen anyone in my notes saying Flan wins I'm pretty sure we all think she loses
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DIFFERENT TYPES OF DESTRUCTION POWER
We are shown in the manga & anime there are multiple variations of Hakai attacks. This post is just to talk about what they are for fun & because it's interesting.
If I miss some Hakai attacks from either continuity, let me know.
Explosive Hakai: 💥
Sand Hakai: ⏳
Disenigration Hakai: ✨
Hakai Orbs: 🟣
GoD Beerus: Explosive Hakai orbs. 💣
GoD Sidra: Explosive Hakai orbs. 💣
GoD Mode Toppo: Disintegration Hakai orbs. ✨
Ultra Ego Vegeta: Explosive Hakai orb 💣
Hakai Aura: 🛡️
EXTRA:
In the DBS anime, the purple Hakai orbs with white energy around them that Beerus creates might imply that his Hakai power is more refined and stronger than Sidra's Hakai orbs that are purple with black energy around them. Could be a visual representative to relay to the viewer that Beerus is one of the strongest Destroyer Gods. Or the white energy could also represent how Beerus has been training to acquire Ultra Instinct and he is closer than most Destroyer Gods to the Angelic level of power. (White being a color associated with Angels & silver with Ultra Instinct when it comes to godly power.)
Mortals who take on GoD power will physically transform while actual Gods of Destruction do not need to transform in such a way. Similar to how a mortal using Ultra Instinct physically/spiritually transforms (Mastered Ultra Instinct) while an Angel does not need to.
DBS anime Toppo seems to only be familiar with using the disintegration type of Hakai. DBS manga Vegeta seems to only knows how to use the explosive type of Hakai. Meanwhile, Gods of Destruction like Beerus seem to be familiar with more types of Hakai attacks.
The Hakai orb that Vegeta throws at Gas appears to disintegrate, but I believe it to simply be that the pressure from the Hakai energy broke the shield Gas created and the pieces flew back. The ground is being broken & pushed away by the energy as well. I could be wrong about this, but I currently do not believe so.
#Hakai#Destruction#Hakai techniques#Destruction techniques#Beerus#Vegeta#Toppo#Sidra#Dragon Ball#Dragon Ball Super#DB#DBS#DBS manga
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Marshawn Lynch
Gohan Beast is nowhere near as powerful as everyone wants it to be. I’ve seen cats rejoicing as if this was Gohan’s grand return to the top of the power scales and i just don’t understand how that’s possible. Look, Dragon Ball Super: Superhero was a fun watch. I loved the Piccolo content. I love seeing the former Demon King becoming relevant again, gaining a new form or two in the process. I loved seeing him go from best dad, to best granddad in the series. Even Cell MAX has grown on me somewhat. Hell, I'm having a hard time not giving well deserved due to my least favorite character of the entire franchise, Gohan, because this motherf*cker straight up bodied his fights. I can’t lie, Beast LOOKS incredible but it’s not the “strongest” transformation in Super. It might have one helluva multiplier but Gohan is FOURTH best in Beast, at best.
Not even gonna touch on the mild racism of Black Freezer, but the three full-blooded Saiyans were conveniently removed from this entire scenario with that ol’ go-to; Training. That’s right, the Red Ribbon return was missed by Goku, Vegeta, AND the new addition, Broly. This is wildly interesting because any one of those cats would have ended this “threat” before it even started. Straight up base form, the strongest motherf*cker in the galaxy right now is probably Broly. This man, just in Ikari mode, bodied a God Ki Imbued Vegeta and Goku, forcing them to go SSG, then SSB, only to lose individually. That's just a pissed off Broly, not a transformed Broly. When he does transform, it's into the Legendary Super Saiyan form and that's a problem. In this form, he embarrassed both Blue Saiyans at the same f*cking time, Golden Freezer, and it took Whis toying with him for an hour so that Gogeta could show up to save the day. God Ki Gogeta was more than enough to wax this cat but the Fusions are dicks so OP Blue it is. Broly was able to do all of this, WITH NO TRAINING. This was Broly’s first real fight and he did ALL of that damage with no experience outside of whatever he could glean from his pitiable scraps with Paragus. Fast forward to Superhero and he has been training with Goku for years. Literal years. How much stronger is he now?
Now for the main course; Goku and Vegeta. Assuming that the events in the manga aren’t canon just yet and Vegeta hasn’t unlocked Ego, Goku is still WELL on his way to cracking Instinct. It wasn’t demonstrated in Superhero, but you can see little hints that the two of them have those forms in their back pockets but i'm just going to act like that’s not the case. At the end of Super, the ToP demonstrated that Vegeta has effectively unlocked SSB Full-Grade with Super Saiyan Blue Evolved. This was his answer to UI Sign and it was strong enough to defeat a God of Destruction mode Toppo. That means Vegeta is as strong, or stronger, than a good amount of the GoDs on hand to see this tournament. Nowhere near Beerus (pretty sure he’s the strongest of that lot) but probably stronger than a great many of those f*ckers. Then there’s Goku who cracked Ultra Instinct during that tournament. He was able to outright embarrass Jiren, the literal pinnacle of strength throughout the multiverse, rivaling even Beerus in power (again, Cat-daddy is probably the strongest of the GoDs), until the backlash ruined his body. Let’s not forget the Zenakai these cats would get after the ToP. Bro, are you kidding me? That, alone, should put both Son Wukong and Getes up there in strength. AND THEY BOTH FOUGHT BROLY AFTER THAT!
By the time Gohan achieves Beast, it’s been YEARS since this tourney and these assholes have been training ever since. With Broly. Are you really going to tell me, with a straight face, that Goku and Vegeta haven’t, at the very least, figured out how to achieve a perfected Ego and Instinct by this point? Never mind those two techniques, (they are techniques and not forms, similar to Gohan’s Potential Unleashed technique) just cannon SSB Evolved and UI Sign would be, head-and-shoulders, more powerful than their introductions at this point. Specifically Vegeta’s SSBE. Vegeta is a whole ass genius when it comes to training and developing techniques. He’s the one that unlocked becoming Super Saiyan God all on his own and then went a step further to be the first to achieved Super Saiyan Blue. Gete’s did that. You expect me to believe he’s rested on his laurels this entire time? Especially after Goku achieved UI that one time? Especially since Broly exists? Especially since he KNOWS Freezer is still out there? Get the f*ck outta here. Then there’s Goku who would die first before letting Vegeta leapfrog him in power for too long. If you actually think that Goku hasn’t kept pace with Getes, you aren’t a fan of Dragon Ball.
Based just on the fact that Vegeta has the power to be a mid tier God of Destruction and Goku has mastered Ultra Instinct Sign, Cell Max would be nothing to them. Not a f*cking thing. Factoring in that Broly waxed these cats in their Blue forms, with just an Ikari state, not counting the Legendary Super Saiyan form, Beast can’t possibly be that strong. Just from the eye test of these three cats being absolutely removed from the battle by the safest deus ex machina imaginable, that the big threat was a human created Android based on Cell, Gohan Beast can’t possibly be in the same power tier as the full-blood Saiyans. The math just doesn’t add up. That’s not to say that Beast doesn’t have potential. I imagine through training this thing can become a problem but that’s just going to fuel Vegeta and Goku to break even more ceilings. Ultimately, Gohan Beast is probably the most powerful MORTAL transformation. I imagine Beast would body base form Vegeta and Goku with God ki and absolutely embarrass Broly. However, beyond that? That one step beyond, be it just a regular SSJ form of SSG? I dunno.
Beast feels comparable to, like, a SSG 1.5 or 1.75 to me. Like, Cell Max can’t be as strong as Jiren, GoD Toppo, or LSSJ Broly; All of which were handled by Vegeta and Goku in lesser forms. I mean, LSSJ Broly needed a Fusion but that’s neither here not there. Years after that fight, Goku was handling bro pretty well in a spar, even after he started going Ikari, during the Superhero movie! That’s who they were training! That’s why they weren’t around! They have literally been fighting this dude, for years, at this point! Considering how much Broly learned during the one fight he had with Goku and Vegeta, WHILE HE WAS FIGHTING THEM, dude must be on an entirely different level after properly being trained by someone who can actually keep up with him. Then there’s the question of how strong MAX could possibly be considering he’s created from Gero’s original Cell plans. Just how far could Hedo have pushed his granddad's research? He wasn’t able to create a Perfect Cell MAX so how strong was this thing really, limited to the second, still imperfect form as a base? Now, i know authors and guidebooks have hyped up that a “complete” Cell Max would be a problem for even Broly but really? Using what is objectively hyperbole to get butts in theater seats as evidence by claims that Gohan is the “strongest”, comes across as a little desperate to me. There’s no way Cell MAX is stronger than the weakest of GoDs and all three full-blooded Saiyans are at least mid GoD level at this point, realistically high to top tier. That means, at the end of the day, Gohan Beast is still just the FOURTH most powerful cat in DBS. Fifth, if we’re counting Congelador Negro. Or I could be wrong and Super is just, like, “F*ck it” in terms of power scaling because Toei is greedy for merchandising loot. Gohan Beast would make a pretty dope looking toy, for sure.
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just gonna say that if I were to write Dragonball fic that blended canon and Abridged, then I would totally make Mr Popo a retired god of destruction
because something has to happen to them, and Belmod doesn’t strike me as the type to blissfully ride off into oblivion when Toppo takes over
I mean, not that any of them do, exactly
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I like to headcanon that Gods of Destruction have small scarring on their chest.
It fills the spot that Toppos G.O.D form has.
Not a bad idea actually. I could see that working.
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