Oh no, I feel like sometimes I am not explaining myself in your ask! I’m sorry. I don’t mean that Alysmond shippers will hate her as a character, I think many people across the board are excited to see what they do with her because there are lots of possibilities. I meant more that a subset of the people who currently call themselves Alys stans, yet don’t engage with her character beyond explaining why Alysmond is the correct ship and anything else is unholy, will be complaining about her being “ruined” no matter what happens. But you are definitely right, even if she is painted very differently from the tame, sweet peasant girl vibe, as many people will also claim they love her and always wanted this story for her.

it's no problem, friend, you don't need to apologise. 🤗 i feel like we're trying to say similar things here - in my reply i meant that the evolution of this ship within fandom has been driven not so much by the character of alys as she appears in FB and TWOIAF but by this latest internet phenomenon of morality policing

alys rivers has never been a staple within the asoiaf community or a fan favourite - and that's absolutely fine & normal, as she is an episodic character in a background historical plot that's only tangentially relevant to the main series - it's more thematically-relevant, that is. sure, there were a few people who liked her after reading FB, but she only became A Thing and gained stans after the end of HOTD when fans of aemond went online and found out he has a canonical love interest.

so, because a lot of these people were mainly anti-helaemonds, they latched onto her for dear life as an instrument to bully and harass degenerate incest shippers or what-have-you. there are definitely shippers for whom alys could have had absolutely any personality and they still would have liked this pairing. if aemond had canonically become involved with any other girl from any other noble house or social class, they still would have acted in the same way.

because it's not the fictional character that needs defending from evil cheating enthusiasts. no one is making them be so nasty to other fans other than their own hang-ups and insecurities that they project in order to feel better about themselves

Anonymous asked: I think what confuses me about the reaction to a ship like helaemond is that noncanon ships have always existed in ASOIAF. They’re everywhere! So many characters, and usually someone has thought about them fucking at some point. So the singular anger towards this one ship is baffling to me. Is it just because they have canon partners? Is it because of the incest specifically (yk, in the incest family?) The cheating aspect? I don’t know. It’s a mystery for the ages. This one singular ship with a relatively small following keeps some people up at night. Sorry to send you yet another ship ask, thank you for taking the time to answer everyone 🤗 I love to read your thoughts and analysis, we are grateful you share!

perhaps it's a combination of all those things, but then again aegond doesn't seem to garner the same caustic reaction. i don't know if it's because it's a smaller ship but i have seen people admit that a reason they don't like helaemond is because they're afraid it has a fair shot of becoming canon.

which i find, again, ludicrous, bc 1) if the writers have that on their bullet list of objectives, acting like a miserable person online isn't going to influence that in any way. 2) if the writers were swayed by the popularity of one ship, then helaemond should have breached containment by now and taken a hold of the collective consciousness. and if the general public loved it to such a significant level, there's not a damn thing a handful of antis on the internet could do about it. 3) as it stands, it has a niche following. the normies have long moved on because they lead regular lives and don't talk about the same fixation daily. the idea that ryan condal is scouring twitter and tumblr to see what his fave helaemond blogs are writing (ergo it's the antis' job to silence them via ostracisation) is, again, goofy.

and now for some old related asks under the cut

[🎵 i'm sorry mama i never meant to make you cry but tonight i'm cleaning out my closet 🎵]

Anonymous asked: "I'm not an anti" either but the statement that Alys, who also gets a cloudy handful of lines in a shoddy confusing storyline that grrm wrote for his least favorite character is a "very important" character seems just a tad biased to me. You can love her and want more for her story in the show and see her role expanded (I know I do!) but to act like grrm himself wrote her as anything other than a plot device for aemond's "downfall" arc seems a bit silly. I wish she was a fully-fledged character too! Alas, her and Helaena are both not. And both hold similar levels of non-significance to the bigger picture. Hopefully we'll see the show change that.

I’m putting this old ask first up, because it’s sort of related to the one I answered above already. 

Anonymous asked: JUST LOOK I'm interested in something that not many people think about in the fandom, BUT since you started talking about possible scenes with Daemon and Alys, I REALLY want to know how she will interact with Criston hahaha Given how he is shown in the series (don't say incel, don't say that), because again, according to rumors, he felt something for her (yes, Mushroom did his job). And the fact that, for example, in Alicent he can see some kind of saint / immaculate woman / martyr, what will happen when he directly starts interacting with Alys? (no, I'm not talking about sex, but such a light flirtation, maybe?) I'm rather curious if he's going to have some sort of internal struggle to give in to temptation or not? (gods help him) And just when Criston finds out about Alys's relationship with Aemond, knowing what he experienced in a brothel at age 13 and knowing that he is engaged to Baratheon's daughter... OH BOYYY I'm just imagining a similar scene like with Sansa where she heard Lisa and Littlefinger having sex...help

Criston/Alys could honestly go in many different ways. We know from Criston’s own mouth that he engaged in a fair share of dalliances before becoming a Kingsguard, so he would know how to charm the ladies. There’s also the implications of what being forcefully celibate for such a long time would do to you – forcefully in the sense that he is obliged to abide by it becaue he wanted to be a Kingsguard first and foremost for the prestige of the position, not in the sense that he willingly wanted to give up sex. It’s fair to say that he could have easily found himself a girlfriend if celibacy weren’t a requirement for his job. So, in that sense, there could be some tension going on there if Alys starts flirting with him, just like there was with Rhaenyra. As to whether or not he gives into it, well, the books tell us he does not, but that could very well just mean that no one found out if he did. He did break his vows before with Rhaenyra. Basically, I think you could make a compelling argument for both; the writers can go with either option here.

But I don’t think he’d be very happy if Aemond were to flaunt his relationship with Alys when it jeopardizes their political and military alliance with the Baratheons, so I expect there to be tension in that regard.

Anonymous asked: I don’t know how many helaemond shippers said they did not want Alys in the show, but I find it funny that this is the ship always being accused of things over and over. It’s the same people who said helaemond fans would harass Alys’s actress, and here we are; it is the self proclaimed aemond wives making videos about how wrong Gayle Rankin is for the part. I can’t even call them alysmond shippers of course because I don’t think they care about her as a character at all. I know you have covered your own issues with casting and it’s not a one size fits all, everyone will have opinions. But when the entire video and post and tweets are about how she doesn’t look like Alys, how it should have been JBF or Eva Green or whoever, it feels redundant. I’m not surprised it’s the hardcore Aemond girlies who are coming after her, but it’s frustrating to still see this stuff blamed on people who enjoy a random crackship 🙄

Anonymous asked: The thing about all these Alys actresses, fancasts or otherwise, is that not even Emily or Katie McGrath (who seems to be the most popular fancast for her) for example would've looked old and mature enough next to Ewan (in the sense that there could've been an obvious difference regarding their characters' age based on appearance alone). He himself doesn't look like a 18 years old teenager but people tend to mainly complain about the women instead which is not very fair. I mean, if they'd wanted to highlight Alys' age in the show then they would've needed to go for a 45+ years old actress, someone who could actually look old enough to be his mother, aunt, etc. if you get what I mean. But most late 30s-early 40s years old actresses already look very youthful (younger than a medieval 40 years old) and this alone makes most of the complaints void as there wouldn't be much of a difference between them and Ewan/Aemond in order for the general audience to notice and say "ooooh the age gap is too big, that's a problem". However most of the ridiculous complaints about Gayle are simply based on her not having a conventional type of beauty like the actresses mentioned above and like most of the fan arts that have been depicting Alys as (classically beautiful face like a supermodel, big breasts, fancy dresses that a lowborn wouldn't wear or have access to and so on) making it harder for the Aemondwives and Ewanwives to self-insert into her. They've created a totally different character their minds and when the reality contradicts them, they lash out. Next time they will complain about her characterization in the show being different because it will be different than the fanon one they've been creating (and sadly a lot of antis who are team green have been contributing to this misunderstandings thanks to the ship wars they've been engaging in, pretending Alys is this or that when there's no confirmation in the text just to make their ship look better).

It's true that most late 30s – mid 40s actresses tend to look better than the average woman of the same age anyway because of beauty treatments and the like, but they face ageism in the film industry even so. Which is why casting an older actress still translates into a 45+ woman getting airtime in one of the most viewed shows, getting exposure in front of the general public, where previously maybe she found it challenging to get jobs. Especially as a romantic interest.

Now I know the public and TV executives are allergic to seeing older women in that kind of storyline, so the chances of that happening were slim, but, at the same time, I would like to point out the existence and popularity of ROMANGERRI on the same network, on air in the same year and on a well-to-do, expensive, critically acclaimed show, no less (J. Smith-Cameron is 65, btw). So it IS possible. Sometimes you have to educate your own public, not just give into demands all the time.

Anyway, I want to touch on an additional point, because I remember people in my inbox trying to convince me that Gayle looks older than her years anyway so it’s fitting she was cast (she doesn’t look old at all, she looks absolutely normal). I don’t know, either these commentators are very young and, thus, kind of divorced from what a 30-year-old looks like or people have lost touch with how regular people look like and they expect everyone to be airbrushed or something.

Anonymous asked: I never thought I'd be obsessed with prophecy in HOTD and etc, but I'm very interested in it in the series and how the writers will develop it further. I love digging into these kinds of puzzles. And very excited about what else Helaena will predict. And Alys too! Because the series shows the importance of prophecies, for example, like the same Viserys and Rhaenyra, who believe, or vice versa, Daemon, who denies it. Most likely I'm the only one, but I would really like to see some parallels between Helaena and Alys in terms of their abilities. Because in F&B, only Alys was featured as a "magic figure" with the ability to foresee. And since we now have two such figures, I would like to think that this was done for a reason. For example: we know that when Helaena speaks a prophecy, it literally comes true in the next episode, but no one believes her words and ignores her. Also, I think that it is Helaena who may predict that Aemond will die (which of course may not be true). Will it also be with Alys? In the Deadline article, she is only designated as a "healer" so far (while all her magical abilities seem to have been only rumored) I'm wondering what powers they will give her, will there be the ability to see visions? Will she also speak in riddles like Helaena or will the predictions be more clear? Will they believe her, unlike Helaena? Because I keep thinking about that moment where Alys saw WHERE Daemon but she didn't see Aemond's death and it's quite intriguing because she really didn't see EVERYTHING or there was some intent... So many questions, so few answers. All in all, I'm looking forward to how they'll tackle the subject of prophecy in 2s.

Not much to add here, it’ll be interesting to see the type of magic they decide to use with Alys. It has to be a balance between real ability but not something that makes her overpowered, otherwise they’ll only end up creating plot holes if they turn her into Dr. Manhattan. The decision to also give Helaena prophetic visions when there already was a character that could have fulfilled that niche is not something that we know how to explain with certainty before the show ends. We don’t know what their plans were or still are with Helaena and how her powers are going to interact with the plot – whether she’s just meant to be a tragic Cassandra figure or more.

A tangent about Helaena and her being a dragon dreamer here:

Anonymous asked: re: other anon: I think people overestimate Helaemond as a ship. i’m sure you’re right and at some point, someone suggested that alys might not be in the show. but i doubt it was indicative of many shippers, as that’s a large leap to take and wouldn’t make much sense story wise. i know some helaemond fans are very vocal about it, but the fandom itself is quite small. there were some gen audience fans who latched onto the idea back in the fall, but they’re long gone now. Compared even to other ships in this fandom, it’s teeny tiny. ofc we are all welcome to like and dislike whatever characters and ships we choose, but i think it’s hard to pass a judgement on a minor character who gets very little time. saying helaena does not care for her kids or her family, that she would not try to help them? as you pointed out, she doesn’t seem to understand her dreams for what they are. this could be explored in the future, or it could be left as is. who knows what they’ll choose for her.

Anonymous asked: I know you're tired of all of these but I would like to address that last anon basically implying that Helaena should just be a victim and not have a bigger role. These people do not like her at all to wish that. The show has her as the first dreamer on screen, do they think that would not be explored at all? And so what if she does take over that arc from a certain character? Are they also going to complain that Helaena, a character who by all means should rightfully have an arc and not just be fridged after a tragedy, be explored in this matter? If she is paired with Aemond, it brings her into the centre of the story. So if they really like Helaena, why do they want to see less of her? They also keep on bringing up the book when it is barebones and the accounts are hearsay. Helaena could arguably not be the beloved by smallfolk figure they think, not with how the maesters' accounts are biased. I'll never understand people complaining about Helaena's character in the show, but completely ignore the other characters being whitewashed. Sometimes I feel like these people just want Helaena to be a victim because they have to use her tragedy as a sympathy card and argument for team wars. We all know how these people react when god forbid a woman shows agency, is flawed, and has motivations.

Anonymous asked: That ask you got saying that anon can't respect and empathize with Helaena because she won't do anything to save her family despite having visions of the future reminds me of this one person from team black saying that Helaemond can't be a thing, especially on Helaena's part, because if she had truly cared about Aemond she would've told him he was going to lose an eye, so how can shippers claim she cares about him when she let that happen? It was such an insane thing to say lmao, you can't even say anything against it because it's so ridiculous. I swear this ship gets the most insane comments against it, it's sad but also funny at this point. And also the comments regarding Helaena herself keep getting more and more deranged.

The thing to keep in mind is that she is not portrayed as a prophet in the books. Nor does anyone suggest that she was via hearsay or rumours mentioned by the maesters. That was a clear addition from the writers’ side. Whether it’s clumsy or well-executed – we have to wait and see because we just don’t have enough information yet. It has to be done in some way that doesn’t modify the plot too much because a lot of things are set in stone – so to complain that she is an ineffectual prophet or that she’s useless because she doesn’t /save/ anyone… she literally CAN’T save them because the authors won’t allow it. Now I have to ask: why are people directing their ire at a fictional female character though, instead of criticising the quality of the writing? If someone doesn’t believe this is a productive writing choice or a believable adaptation change, then say so, instead of wording this complaint in a misogynistic way and using it as a vehicle to irritate her fans.

Of course, Helaena is not a real person, so her feelings will not be hurt by people excoriating her, but it’s telling how some fans are incapable of mounting a meta-textual critique, and so easily confuse the Doylist and Watsonian perspectives of analysis: Helaena doesn’t save Aemond or her children even though she has prophetic visions => she must be a bad, unfeeling, selfish person, those are her character traits (Watsonian) vs Helaena can’t save anyone because the plot points and endings are set in stone (Doylist). I’m highlighting this point because there are fans like this who will literally go to war and fight in the trenches, making fandom spaces inhospitable, because they are 100% convinced they are the depositaries of the one true text interpretation, when their own critical thinking skills are fundamentally lacking.

Anonymous asked: Hi, love your blog, especially your analysis of HotD characters. I wanted to ask your opinion about one aspect of Aemond's (and by extension, Alicent's) character that some people in the fandom love to bring up. They claim that he is a character deprived of love and that his "mommy issues" are the main reason he falls for someone like Alys. Some of them even believe that he actually has romantic feelings for his mother and that's why he chooses an older woman with a similar name??? to be his lover. And after Gayle Rankin's casting some people on Tumblr were saying that she was cast thanks to her physical resemblance to Olivia Cooke (I don't see it at all) which, according to them, was intentional because of the reason above. Personally, I disagree. First of all, Aemond's relationship with Alicent is probably the only somewhat healthy relationship in his life. Alicent is not a perfect mother, far from it, but she obviously loves and cares for him (the Driftmark incident being the strongest example and Aemond himself acknowledges this in Storm's End). Therefore, it's definitely wrong to claim that he is deprived of motherly love and that his "mommy issues" will seal his fate. Moreover, we still don't know for sure what is going on between him and Helaena, but regardless of the nature of their feelings, I do believe, based on what we've seen so far in the show, that they care about each other. Idk, I just don't buy this explanation that Alys was his replacement for Alicent and a source of an unconditional love and acceptance he never received from his family members. Also, after the scene with the brothel madam I'm not really looking forward to this relationship because of all the implications. If there is something that could at least partially explain the nature of Alysmond (and even then a lot of it remains mysterious) it should be that scene from episode 9, and not the lack of love from his mother, sister or even brother(s). I only hope we will get to see more scenes between Alicent and her children in the next season, especially before Aemond leaves KL. I'm really interested in his interactions with Alicent and Aegon after the Storm's End incident and his relationship with Helaena in general, romantic (I'm actually starting to root for Helaemond after witnessing shipper wars on SM lol) or not. Sorry if this was too long:). Thanks for your time.

Thank you for your kind words & sorry for taking so long to reply, but life happens, you know. :)) and better late than never. Now, what you’re describing in the first part is definitely alimond (aemond/alicent), which can appeal to you (or not) depending on how freudian you like your ships. Alys and Alicent are basically the same name (it’s the same root), both are brunettes (though Alicent is more of a red-head in HOTD), both MILFs. There’s material to work with. One can make it happen if one is dedicated enough of a writer. I don’t think Gayle looks like Olivia either – I think they picked her because she seems to be a versatile actress, not because of physical similarity.

That being said, I never bought the Aemond-is-not-loved interpretation. I think there was something wacky going on backstage that got translated via a pervasive lack of communication. I’ve said it before but not allowing or discouraging the child actors / young adults to keep from exchanging notes on their character with the adult actors is not good showrunning or directing. Sorry to Miguel Sapochnik, but I’m just built different. And I think that’s kind of what happened with Leo and Ewan – something just got lost in the handover. Little!Aemond is bullied by Aegon but seems very close to his mother – he confesses to her his reason for being upset and accepts being comforted by her. Alicent spends the rest of the episode trying to fix his bullying issue: she is unsuccessful with Viserys, mildly successful with Aegon (who is a scatterbrain, but seems to at least stop for a moment and consider what she has to say) and very successful with Criston, who takes it upon himself to indirectly reveal Jace and Luke’s bastardy in a public setting and to break up Aegon’s alliance with the Strong boys by siccing him on them. Not to mention the lengths Alicent goes to in Driftmark to get justice for her son – these are not the actions of a mother who couldn’t care less. So, you know. I think Ewan is a talented actor but this unconditional love line must be because the showrunners were inconsistent in the briefs they gave to the actors. Like, you would not be hearing incongruent, looney-tunes-type shit like this in Succession, where characters change their life story and personality from week to week.